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BoeingGuy
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:25 pm

Quoting dxBrian (Reply 88):
Why would you use LAX as an alternate for OAK? There are better choices, particularly SJC. but you also have SMF, SAC, STS and SFO (though I wouldn't use it for an operational alternate).

STS isn't suitable due to very short runway and lack of facilities. FAT is also sometimes used as an alternate for the Bay Area airports, like AA's DFW-SJC/SFO flights have diverted there. SAC is probably a poor choice too, again due to lack of facilities.

LAX is an alternate for SNA; and for SFO for overseas flights.
 
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LAXintl
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:46 pm

I hope Mr. Vallas is planning on becoming a centenarian.

Frankly shame on these guys. In April it will be 3-years since they started their formal application process and they have managed to let the clock run out twice at the DOT, and now at the FAA also.

In the mean time a shiny E170 sits on the ramp and burning a $200,000 hole in the budget.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
ouboy79
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:47 pm

Quoting jmc1975 (Reply 96):
Is that some kind of joke? It has no indication that it's CalPac, but the livery is somewhat indicative of it.

Huh? The entire article is about them. Not sure what article you were reading.
 
F9Animal
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:05 pm

The fact they are seeking extensions clearly shows ambition. Vallas is determined, and he will see to it that the airline does get airborne. The positions necessary have been filled, and the leadership continues to push forward. As for rushing through the process? Not gonna happen. Startups are no easy task anymore, and the FAA is very strict regarding the process. While they nay sayers are strong.... The believers remain supportive!  
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LAXintl
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:27 pm

No one is saying these guys don't have ambition. However seemingly they are not very organized in meeting DOT and FAA requirements in a timely matter.

Anyhow - for me the big question is - where is the launch financing?

Seemingly they have been trying drum up the $32mil in equity for ages now as ongoing expenses continue to pile up making the hurdle likely even higher.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
coreyrust
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:45 pm

What is the FAA's biggest reservation in granting them the sought after approval? Is it the management team, Carlsbad as the airport, other?
 
PSA727
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:24 am

I'm not shocked about this at all. Their E170 has been parked at CLD for about half a year now. I'm more shocked that they ever intended one of those birds to make it off the ground there with 70 passengers and cargo on board. Can a CRJ or ERJ 50-seater take-off from there without any type of weight restrictions? BTW, I was looking at the USAirways website regarding the merger. And they had a map showing the routes flown by the combined carriers (US/AA). And it had CLD on it. But as a city served by AA not US. It's been over a decade since AA left there, and a few years since US did. But does anyone know if CLD is coming back? I can't find anything on the AA website that would suggest this.
fly high, pay low...Germanwings!
 
Goldenshield
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:40 am

Quoting PSA727 (Reply 106):
Can a CRJ or ERJ 50-seater take-off from there without any type of weight restrictions?

Assuming optimal conditions taking off on runway 6, the performance king or the series, the CRJ-700, could maybe get to DFW without bumping in the dead of winter. In the dead of summer, though, it'd be lucky to get to LAS.

The CRJ-200, on the other hand, would be lucky to get to LAS in the dead of winter, and it goes downhill from there...
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
 
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usxguy
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 5:37 pm

Mesa flew 4-5 Dash 8-Q200s a day to CLD from Phoenix.... maybe something else is going on....
xx
 
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Boeing717200
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 6:05 pm

Quoting usxguy (Reply 108):
Mesa flew 4-5 Dash 8-Q200s a day to CLD from Phoenix.... maybe something else is going on....

You can't compare the airfield performance of a turboprop with an RJ. Its apples to oranges. Its like saying a 747 should be able to launch off of an aircraft carrier because an F-18 can.

[Edited 2013-03-15 11:06:51]
240 years and the top two candidates are named Dumb and Dumber. Stay classy!
 
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ual747den
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 7:21 pm

Quoting F9animal (Reply 103):
The fact they are seeking extensions clearly shows ambition. Vallas is determined, and he will see to it that the airline does get airborne. The positions necessary have been filled, and the leadership continues to push forward. As for rushing through the process? Not gonna happen. Startups are no easy task anymore, and the FAA is very strict regarding the process. While they nay sayers are strong.... The believers remain supportive!  

I have been saying this from day one but I'll say it again, what exactly do the "believers" believe in?
Nothing about this airline is viable, NOTHING! If this kind of network would have ever worked it would have been done with the ExpressJet branded airline but they couldn't even get this kind of flying done with all the capital they needed. This airline is just someones expensive dream and will never work even if it does get off of the ground one day which I am 99% sure won't even happen.
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lightsaber
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 7:28 pm

California Pacific gains a new CEO:

http://carlsbad.patch.com/articles/c...esident-flights-hopeful-mid-summer




I'm enjoying following the airline partially as so many here want it to fail... Note: I won't invest a penny in them, but they are amusing to follow. Now where is that Popcorn smilie...  

Lightsaber
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mariner
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 7:38 pm

Quoting UAL747DEN (Reply 110):
This airline is just someones expensive dream and will never work even if it does get off of the ground one day which I am 99% sure won't even happen.

So it is someone's dream - let's call it Vanity Airlines. Many on a.net dream of starting an airline.

If he's got the money, if he can afford it, or persuade others to back him, go for it. If his dream comes crashing down - life sucks, sometimes.

Ryanair was someone's dream - their money - and was close to bankruptcy - until they brought Michael O'Leary on board.

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 111):
I'm enjoying following the airline partially as so many here want it to fail... Note: I won't invest a penny in them, but they are amusing to follow.

  

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
0newair0
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 7:42 pm

Quoting F9animal (Reply 103):
The positions necessary have been filled, and the leadership continues to push forward.

Are you sure about that? I think all they have now is a DoM and a Chief Inspector. If that's true, they still need a new DO, a new Director of Safety, and a Chief Pilot.
That's not how this works! That's not how any of this works!
 
PlymSpotter
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 7:43 pm

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 107):
Assuming optimal conditions taking off on runway 6, the performance king or the series, the CRJ-700, could maybe get to DFW without bumping in the dead of winter. In the dead of summer, though, it'd be lucky to get to LAS.

The CRJ-200, on the other hand, would be lucky to get to LAS in the dead of winter, and it goes downhill from there...


The CRJs and EMBs do not handle heat or short runway well - even a EMB135 would struggle come summer. They've got the right aircraft in the ERJ170, they just need to get it past the hurdles and get it flying.


Dan  
...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
 
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usxguy
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:52 pm

Quoting boeing717200 (Reply 109):
You can't compare the airfield performance of a turboprop with an RJ. Its apples to oranges. Its like saying a 747 should be able to launch off of an aircraft carrier because an F-18 can.

Where do you get that I'm comparing aircraft performance? I didn't see the previous post and was referring to the USAirways route map regarding the merger....
xx
 
rlwynn
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:38 pm

CLD does not get very hot in the summer. The August average high temp is 73° F.
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Boeing717200
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:40 pm

Quoting usxguy (Reply 115):
Where do you get that I'm comparing aircraft performance? I didn't see the previous post and was referring to the USAirways route map regarding the merger....

This thread isn't about either company.
240 years and the top two candidates are named Dumb and Dumber. Stay classy!
 
Goldenshield
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:41 pm

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 114):
The CRJs and EMBs do not handle heat or short runway well - even a EMB135 would struggle come summer. They've got the right aircraft in the ERJ170, they just need to get it past the hurdles and get it flying.

Conversely, how does the ERJ-170 handle hot and high from a 8,000 foot runway at 8,000 feet with a 10 knot tailwind, in a tight mountain valley, while trying to maintain FAR 121 climb requirements?
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
 
PlymSpotter
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:41 pm

Quoting rlwynn (Reply 116):
CLD does not get very hot in the summer. The August average high temp is 73° F.

You surprise me, I mistakenly thought it was much hotter.


Dan  
...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
 
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LAXintl
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:29 am

They probably hope John Selvaggio lends a little credibility to CP Air.

However I'm not sure the guys the upstart entrepreneur type. He's been more of a corporate baby sitter.
Delta placed him to watch Song, then after that Comair and its fiascos. Since leaving airlines seems he's been with a medical technology firm.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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sunking737
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sat Mar 16, 2013 1:53 am

"Don't believe it unless its parked on the ramp, or printed in the schedule...SUBJECT TO CHANGE"

I'm a SUNDUCK......Worked for RC & SY @ MSP
 
usctrojan18
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sat Mar 16, 2013 3:36 am

This thread about whether CP will take off or not never seems to go away. I would love for CP to get off the ground, because it's always great to have more service to the San Diego Area. I'm flying out of CLD this summer (on UA), so I will finally be able to check out the new terminal. I really hope that CP Air gets off the ground, because CLD is a great little airport in between 2 major areas that could really do well. And even if CP does fail, hopefully another carrier will rival UA in CLD, maybe US to PHX (again), AA to LAX or even UA service to SFO. Either way good luck to CLD and good luck to CP Air.
 
thebyte
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sat Mar 16, 2013 4:24 am

Personally, I think they are banking on the hope that Palomar Airport will expand their runway. to 6000 feet. It's been planned for years now. Maybe they are banking on the runway expansion to happen?
 
PSA727
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sat Mar 16, 2013 5:48 am

Quoting thebyte (Reply 123):
Personally, I think they are banking on the hope that Palomar Airport will expand their runway. to 6000 feet. It's been planned for years now. Maybe they are banking on the runway expansion to happen?

Well, it sort of looks like there is some type of construction going on between the start of the runway and El Camino Real. That whole area has now been planed even, with some mounds of moved dirt to the sides of it. I don't know if that's simply a landscaping issue though. It's quite noticeable when you are heading toward the airport from the east on Palomar Airport road.
fly high, pay low...Germanwings!
 
SurfandSnow
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sat Mar 16, 2013 6:29 am

Quoting thebyte (Reply 123):

The current 4,897 ft runway at CLD is fine. CP never has to worry about sending its relatively low density E-170s westbound into prevailing headwinds, they'll all be headed north, south, or riding with the winds east.

For comparison's sake, EYW has an even shorter 4,801 ft runway; not to mention an even hotter, wetter environment. US is getting E-170s out of there to CLT (a route which also sees the larger and less capable E-175) and now DCA. DL is getting mainline aircraft off that runway to ATL and now all the way to LGA! WN's high density all-Y 737s are now flying west against the winds to MSY. Given that DL, US, and WN continue to expand from EYW, I can only assume these flights are taking profitable payloads!

LCY's 4,948 ft runway handles E-jets (including the E-190) all the time. Even Rio's SDU, with it's longest runway at a mere 4,341 feet, is successfully accommodating the E-175.

Of course, a longer runway can certainly help - they can always take on more pax and/or cargo, and of course they'd fare better on CLD's hottest days. They can also take on more fuel to fly farther. I'm merely pointing out that the runway today is not a particularly difficult challenge for the CP E-170, though.
Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
 
PlymSpotter
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sat Mar 16, 2013 1:01 pm

Quoting SurfandSnow (Reply 125):
LCY's 4,948 ft runway handles E-jets (including the E-190) all the time.

In fact it's 3,934ft for take off. The landing and accelerate stop distance is 4,327ft.

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 118):
Conversely, how does the ERJ-170 handle hot and high from a 8,000 foot runway at 8,000 feet with a 10 knot tailwind, in a tight mountain valley, while trying to maintain FAR 121 climb requirements?

That's not something I'm able to answer I'm afraid. I'm interested though, is this a hypothetical situation, or an actual airport?


Dan  
...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
 
Goldenshield
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:18 pm

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 126):
That's not something I'm able to answer I'm afraid. I'm interested though, is this a hypothetical situation, or an actual airport?

It's an actual airport.

Quoting SurfandSnow (Reply 125):
LCY's 4,948 ft runway handles E-jets (including the E-190) all the time

CLD's main issue is meeting the climb gradient requirement, as the airport is (essentially) on a rising ridge, and the prevailing wind and traffic requires departing uphill.
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
 
PlymSpotter
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sun Mar 17, 2013 2:23 pm

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 127):
It's an actual airport.

I should imagine it's a fun ride in and out.


Dan  
...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
 
EMBQA
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sun Mar 17, 2013 2:38 pm

They'll need to send their plane back into maintenance before they ever fly it for revenue. It would need to be made current again on all the checks that are due
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
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diverdave
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sun Mar 17, 2013 4:10 pm

Quoting thebyte (Reply 123):
Personally, I think they are banking on the hope that Palomar Airport will expand their runway. to 6000 feet. It's been planned for years now. Maybe they are banking on the runway expansion to happen?

There is an old landfill on the east end of the runway, which would pose some interesting challenges:

http://www.kpbs.org/news/2011/dec/14...problem-expanding-palomar-airport/

David
 
rampart
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sun Mar 17, 2013 4:21 pm

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 127):
Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 126):
That's not something I'm able to answer I'm afraid. I'm interested though, is this a hypothetical situation, or an actual airport?

It's an actual airport.

Why are we being so oblique? It's Aspen, Colorado, unless you are thinking of something in Asia or South America. There was some discussion of certifying the E-170 or E-190 there, not sure where it left off.

-Rampart
 
SurfandSnow
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Sun Mar 17, 2013 5:18 pm

Quoting rampart (Reply 131):
Why are we being so oblique? It's Aspen, Colorado, unless you are thinking of something in Asia or South America. There was some discussion of certifying the E-170 or E-190 there, not sure where it left off.

-Rampart

Yes, back when F9 announced that it would be removing all Q400s from service, everyone's attention immediately turned to ASE. I believe even then it was clear that the E-170s would also all be leaving the F9 fleet. Although the E-190 was slightly over the ASE maximum aircraft specs, it was said to be the favored aircraft choice, and that ASE probably would have granted them a waiver or even changed their rules to accommodate it. However, the E-jet simply couldn't meet the necessary requirements, IIRC a one engine go-around, on the simulators. As was the case when NW retired the Avro fleet, F9 had no choice but to drop all service to ASE when it got rid of the only aircraft type it had that could serve the airport. With regard to NW, I believe it was said that they did look at continuing MSP-ASE on the E-175, but that they would only be able to take 30-some pax from ASE. Perhaps the E-jets could get in and out of ASE, but not with any kind of profitable payload.
Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
 
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LAXintl
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Mon Mar 18, 2013 4:08 pm

Quoting sunking737 (Reply 121):
Another news story out this afternoon....

Thanks for the link

This comment by Vallas struck me talking about the certification and start-up process.

“We used to fly by the seat of our pants many years ago. Today you’ve got to be very sophisticated in every part of the new industry.”

Is there some naivety here? Did Vallas and his team think the FAA was not going to require them to cross their T's and dot their I's?

Also the article provided insight as to the financial picture - they are still very much trying collect cash - having raised only $10mil so far.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
concordegboad
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:04 pm

This was posted on their FB today:

Quote:
John Selvaggio, our new president and CEO, is taking us to the next level for FAA certification. To paraphrase Mark Twain, "Rumors of our demise are greatly exaggerated." We’re in business to stay; we’re proceeding with the certification process, and we plan on being able to start carrying passengers to our destinations by early fall. Over the past couple of years we’ve been on a roller-coaster, but for those who have dealt with the Federal government, little explanation is necessary.

1) Key points to know: the Palomar’s runway is more than sufficient to handle the Embraer 170; the proposed runway extension is not needed for our operations; and, once we begin service, we’ll be adding more than 100 new jobs to North County community.
2) We’ve signed a short-term contract with Honeywell to test equipment for Embraer, so our plane flying in and out of Palomar.
3) Going forward, we’ll release periodic reports on our website and Facebook. In the meantime, we’ll not be responding to Facebook posts while concentrating on the all-important certification process. Onward and upward.


https://www.facebook.com/FlyCPAir
 
rsmith6621a
Posts: 1508
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 2:21 pm

RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:09 pm

Quoting concordegboad (Reply 134):
This was posted on their FB today:

So they read airliners.net aye????
Did You Ever Think Freedom Could Be this Bad
 
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csturdiv
Posts: 1991
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:17 pm

Quoting rsmith6621a (Reply 135):
So they read airliners.net aye????

Yes, https://www.airliners.net/profile/flycpair
An American expat from the ORD area living and working in SYD
 
usctrojan18
Posts: 98
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:40 pm

It's always great when the airline has an airliners.net page to help silence the rumors.
 
BMI727
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Wed Mar 27, 2013 8:18 pm

Quoting concordegboad (Reply 134):
John Selvaggio, our new president and CEO, is taking us to the next level for FAA certification. To paraphrase Mark Twain, "Rumors of our demise are greatly exaggerated." We’re in business to stay; we’re proceeding with the certification process, and we plan on being able to start carrying passengers to our destinations by early fall.

Or to paraphrase John Paul Jones, "We have not yet begun to lose money!"

Nothing against CP Air, and I really hope they succeed, but it's awfully hard to be optimistic about any airline startup.
Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
 
Wingtips56
Posts: 1291
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 1:26 am

RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Wed Mar 27, 2013 8:50 pm

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 138):
Nothing against CP Air, and I really hope they succeed, but it's awfully hard to be optimistic about any airline startup.

And one focusing on a home airport that most people out of the area have never heard of. SAN is where most visitors want to end up, so I see most of CPA's traffic as Palomar-originating.
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 181 airports, 92 airlines, 78 a/c types, 403 routes, 58 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,119,414 passenger miles.

Home airport : CEC
 
PSAjet17
Posts: 375
Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2003 5:50 am

RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:05 pm

Quoting csturdiv (Reply 136):
Yes, https://www.airliners.net/profile/flycpair

This is the profile for a person named Randy Brown. According to his LinkedIn profile he was Dir of Marketing at California Pacific Airlines but shows an end date of January 2013.

Quoting concordegboad (Reply 134):
3) Going forward, we’ll release periodic reports on our website and Facebook. In the meantime, we’ll not be responding to Facebook posts while concentrating on the all-important certification process. Onward and upward.

The VP of Communications did post on Facebook but now you say he will not respond to posts of Facebook. What else does he have to do? It took more than 2 weeks to formally announce the new CEO coming aboard.
It also looks like they went through their Facebook page and deleted many of the comments from others regarding their startup. (posts about the E-170 being the wrong airplane, CLD runway too short, many of the startup people leaving.)
 
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hawaiian717
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RE: California Pacific Closed Before Start UP (Rumor)

Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:49 am

The January departure date for Mr. Brown makes sense, as they've been pretty quiet on Facebook and Twitter since late December. Likely he left and with no replacement the accounts were ignored. It seems their new communications guy isn't as interested in cultivating a fan base via social media.

Cleaning up their Facebook page, removing the negative comments proclaiming the airline to be dead, does make sense.

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