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I know there are other threads discussing landing fees, but they seem outdated. Does anyone have a list of the most expensive landing fees in North America or for the US?

I know #1 is YYZ... most expensive airport to fly into in North America.

My guess would be any carrier, could run a small country for the small number of movements they serve.

Figures will need to be provided, e.g. price per tonne and per passenger. Airport websites, or annual reports, normally have them somewhere. Without it, it's pretty much meaningless.

[Edited 2013-02-28 01:19:10]

KSHV is in the top 7 or so!

And because of that, it has literally killed this market, passenger-wise. The cost of flying in and out of KSHV is pathetic and its been a major issues with Ark-La-Tex passengers and local government officials for years, but as usual, nothing ever gets done or resolved. KSHV airport authority and the crooks that serve on it, are a joke!

Braniff722

I think bigger the airport is higher the cost is

IAD has some of the most expensive real estate in the U.S.

Quoting braniff722 (Reply 4): Figures will need to be provided, e.g. price per tonne and per passenger. Airport websites, or annual reports, normally have them somewhere. Without it, it's pretty much meaningless.

Arguments do benefit from verifiable information.

I would think that given the size of the airport, and the traffic that flies in, that Catalina Island (AVX) would be pretty expensive.

We only fly cargo in C208/B's but if you go by price per pound some of the fee's we have to pay are awful MRY AND SBA come to mind but I will have our top ten for California tomorrow  

Quoting jethawk (Thread starter): I know there are other threads discussing landing fees, but they seem outdated. Does anyone have a list of the most expensive landing fees in North America or for the US?

I don't know if you will find a cross comparison that can answer this question. Some of the smaller airports may charge more per 1000lb of MTOW/MLW simply because of the size of the aircraft that land there. If you were to extrapolate that cost to the MTOW/MLW of a 747-8i, per say, it would appear to be the most expensive airport in the world.

I remember reading that YYZ was the 2nd most airport in the world to land a 747 after NRT. I also know that YYZ has revised their landing fee and terminal fee schedule.

Also, how landing fees are calculated is different from country to country and airport to airport. For example I know many airports charge a fee based on Maximum Take off Weight, and others based on Maximum Landing Weight. Another significant change is gate rent. I think for many airports in the USA, an airline leases a gate and pays per square foot of gate space. I think this is how Southwest determines that a minimum of 8 flights per day per station to be cost-effective. Many, if not all, of the airports in Canada pay a gate fee per use depending on the number of seats on the aircraft. For example, all of the gates at YWG are common use, and charged this way.

A long story short, what may appear to be a high landing fee can be offset by lower gate rent charges, and vice versa. You have to look at the whole picture.

Well here some specific landing fees for MIA & FLL.

MIA - Average Cost per Passenger (FY 2013) - $20.56, plus $1.75 per 1K pounds of landed weight.

FLL - A.C.P. - $5.34, plus $2.11 (currently) per 1K pounds of landed weight. (Expected to drop to $1.24 once new south runway is completed)

No wonder a majority of the LCC's call on FLL.

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 8): I would think that given the size of the airport, and the traffic that flies in, that Catalina Island (AVX) would be pretty expensive.

KAVX costs $25.

My question about landing fees is this? Are the types of fee’s charged by airports standard (so we can compare apples to apples), or do some airports landing fees include things that other airports would have a separate fee for? I seem to remember reading something (sorry can’t recall where or if it was even correct) but the landing fees at YYZ included things that other airports would charge additional fees to the airline.

Quoting Lemmy (Reply 12): KAVX costs $25.

Which doesn't seem like a lot, but is a lot for a 172 (especially considering that they could land on the mainland for free.)

Quoting b777erj145 (Reply 5): I think bigger the airport is higher the cost is

I do not know how all Canadian, Mexican and Central American airports are funded but most are self funding. All in the USA that accept federal funds are self funding, which is every scheduled commercial airport except for I think BKG. The management of the airport (usually municipalities) can add funds to the airport but cannot take revenue from it. Funds generated by the airport have to be used for the airport.

The result is that landing fees are usually balanced between airport capital expenses and the amount of traffic. Some airports have high capital expenses but have moderate fees because of large amounts traffic. Some airports with more moderate expenses have high fees because traffic declined or they overbuilt too far ahead of future flights. Some GA airports have extremely low fees because they have not built anything in years.

Some overcrowded airports get worse because their lack of investment led to lower fees, making them more attractive. Others that overspent go into death spirals, driving away traffic through higher fees which leads to even higher fees due to the diminished traffic.

The fees for YYZ are:
General terminal for international arrivals - $6.34/seat
Landing fee for aircraft in excess of 19,000kg - $25.00
Gate charge (jetbridge) - $100/operation
Variable gate charge (jetbridge) - $2.80/seat
Gate occupancy fee (jetbridge) - $100/15 minutes
Landing fees for fixed wing aircraft of 19,000kg or less during peak hours - $145.00
Non-peak hours - $82.50

For YUL:
Jet or turboprop: $9.09/1000kg (based on MTOW); minimum charge of $54.50
Transborder terminal charge: $20.79/enplaned passenger
International terminal charge: $17.99/enplaned passenger

For YVR:
Jet: $3.65/kg under 21,000 kg MTOW
$4.63/kg between 21,001-45,000 kg MTOW
$5.47/kg above 45,001 kg
Landing fees (excl. 0730-1030 Sat and Sun): $35.10
Terminal fees vary depending on the number of seats on the aircraft. $437.36 for international flight on an aircraft with 46-60 seats, $699.92 between 61-89, $3,018.75 for between 301-400 seats.

Texan

Quoting canadianpylon (Reply 10): I remember reading that YYZ was the 2nd most airport in the world to land a 747 after NRT.

Wonder how much it costs EK to land the whale, gate, deplane pax at YYZ? Probably more money than I made last year in total.

Further, I was reading the published airport fees for YYZ on their website (http://www.torontopearson.com/uploadedFiles/B2B/Content/Business_Opportunities/Aeronautical%20Fees.pdf) and I have a few questions:
1) I am having a hard time actually navigating this page, not surprisingly. For example, how much would it cost to land a non-rev twin on a Friday afternoon, park at the Esso FBO and then depart again on Sunday.

2) Why don't they have a more streamlined fee schedule? Like a single landing/gate fee for aircraft?

Regards,
IBO

I guess I don't have an appreciation for how high landing fees can get. For example, I pay a mere 10$ (and only if the controller is in a bad mood) when I land a Cessna at YWG. Now obviously this is a cessna and not a Boeing but still, it seems that landing a Cessna in YYZ would cost upwards of 100$.  

Regards,
IBO

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 15): The management of the airport (usually municipalities) can add funds to the airport but cannot take revenue from it. Funds generated by the airport have to be used for the airport.

If they run an airport system, instead of just a single airport (a la Houston or Las Vegas), can the funds be transferred from one airport to another or do they have to be spent at the airport where they were collected?

There was an article a few years ago in the Chicago Tribune, showing how the increases by the City of Chicago had made ORD one of the most expensive airports in the U.S. I seem to recall that the three most expensive, and not in any particular order, were EWR, ORD, and SFO.

At ORD, it was a bit of a vicious circle. Since passenger traffic was down, UA and AA switched a lot of mainline flights to RJs. Because of fewer people in the terminals, concession revenue was down. Because of the RJs, landing fees were down.

So, landing fees went up. Needless to say, AA was increasing the size of the DFW hub (among the cheapest landing fees of the larger airports), and UA was standing pat.

Quoting zeke (Reply 2): My guess would be any carrier, could run a small country for the small number of movements they serve.

I don't qiite follow that statement.

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 15): The result is that landing fees are usually balanced between airport capital expenses and the amount of traffic.

yes

Quoting Lemmy (Reply 12): Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 8): I would think that given the size of the airport, and the traffic that flies in, that Catalina Island (AVX) would be pretty expensive. KAVX costs $25.

Quoting b777erj145 (Reply 5): I think bigger the airport is higher the cost is

Not at all. Depends on operating costs divided by operation level...essentially. A small airport could be expensive or cheap. Same for a large. It would be fairer to say that airports with newer facilities cost more than airports with older facilities. "New" is more expensive.

Quoting novak500 (Reply 13): My question about landing fees is this? Are the types of fee’s charged by airports standard (so we can compare apples to apples), or do some airports landing fees include things that other airports would have a separate fee for? I seem to remember reading something (sorry can’t recall where or if it was even correct) but the landing fees at YYZ included things that other airports would charge additional fees to the airline.

Landing fees are apples to apples, but airports also collect fees to use the terminal. The balance between these two fee types varies wildly and follows no particular convention.

Quoting ckfred (Reply 20): There was an article a few years ago in the Chicago Tribune, showing how the increases by the City of Chicago had made ORD one of the most expensive airports in the U.S. I seem to recall that the three most expensive, and not in any particular order, were EWR, ORD, and SFO. At ORD, it was a bit of a vicious circle. Since passenger traffic was down, UA and AA switched a lot of mainline flights to RJs. Because of fewer people in the terminals, concession revenue was down. Because of the RJs, landing fees were down. So, landing fees went up. Needless to say, AA was increasing the size of the DFW hub (among the cheapest landing fees of the larger airports), and UA was standing pat.

Makes you wonder how NK can make ORD work with their super-cheap fares. If that's true, I think NK would be better off at RFD and/or GYY than ORD.

Quoting IBOAviator (Reply 18): seems that landing a Cessna in YYZ would cost upwards of 100$

YYZ keeps the fees for small Cessna's and General Aviation aircraft high as more of a "you're not welcome" signal to deter them from flying into the airport. It disrupts the flow of traffic and you have airports at Burlington, Brampton, Guelph and Kitchener close by that don't charge landing fees for small planes. Buttonville has a $15 landing fee and I think its about $12 for city center airport. So bottom line is YYZ would rather keep the slower aircrafts away from there

CVG comes to mind. I know in the past, it was one of the most expensive airports to fly into and out of in the USA. Not sure if it still is ranked that high or not.

Quoting braniff722 (Reply 4):

Quoting WhiteWasp (Reply 25):

no idea what the landing fees are at these airports, but it's not twice as expensive to fly to these cities than nearby alternatives because the landing fees are twice as much. The prices are based on supply and demand, and competition. I used to work at KSYR, and the landing fees were competitive with ALB and ROC, but fares are higher because SYR is a smaller catchment area and their is only one LCC flying to the airport. Look for some fares to drop at CVG with F9. I used to live in Huntsville, so sad to say, HSV is on its own. GOVT flying will ensure prices stay high there.

How do they collect these fees? The only fees I've even been aware of have been ramp fees, which have been waived each time with fuel purchases.

IIRC, after the new terminal opened, IND went from one of the cheapest major airports in the Midwest to operate from into one of the most expensive.

However, it was not because of the landing fees. Those stayed low because of the FedEx hub. But terminal fees and associated passenger airline fees all skyrocketed to the point where a cost per enplanement at IND's new terminal was almost 3x that of their old terminal. IND's cost per enplanement after the new terminal opened went up to a level that was higher than other surrounding large airports like CVG, STL, and CMH along with surrounding smaller/midsize airports like DAY and FWA. And as we all know, IND has had a tough time adding new flights since, much less keep existing ones (DL's cutbacks and WN canceling MDW both come to mind).

Granted, IND has gradually reduced their fees since the new terminal opened, but it is still an extremely expensive airport for airlines.

[Edited 2013-02-28 13:26:45]

Quoting spudsmac (Reply 27):

at SYR they sent a monthly invoice, and the airlines send a check. Just like you paying your utility bill. SYR was pretty quiet, so the Commissioner's assistant opens the envelopes and takes them down to accounting. I would guess at bigger airports they wire the money, so they're not sending hundreds of thousands in a check that could get lost in the mail.

Just doing some quick googling on this, well..... I think that it is very difficult to find a single source (at least after a few pages, I haven't found one yet) that lists/ranks/combines airport landing fees in one place. But I've run across just about every single airport with information as to how much landing fees are at that individual airport. So if its a single list of this that your looking for, well....

Now, as for expenses to an airline, and comparing commercial airports, the CPE is probably as good as can be. There are often published lists of these, as well as info from each individual airport (usually found in the airport's financials) as well as a government site.....

http://cats.airports.faa.gov/Reports/rpt127.cfm

***somehow the link stopped working and don't know how to reconnect to it. But it is the Compliance Activity Tracking System (CATS) - Airport Financial Reports page if googled with a couple of clicks.

On the above link..... one needs to select the airport, and the year, and then hit View Form 127 "Screen" and all sorts of numbers pop up as to runway fees, CPE, etc. on that individual airport, and I think that this is probably as comprehensive and organized with consistency on a site along the lines of individual airport's operational/financial data as there is. After all, it is run by our own Uncle Sam.

And just for a bit of explanation on the CPE, I found this online pamphlet (?) that gives a good, simple explanation I think. And even though this is published in 2003, and uses 2001-02 info, I also think that what is explained is relevant today. But speaking of the 2001-02 numbers..... quite a shock to see one of their lists of airport CPEs with ATL at $1.93, then others like BWI, DWF, SLC, STL in the $4-$5 range, then ORD at $8.70 the second highest amount listed here, and then finally DEN --- $16.23!

How DEN survived from that has to be pretty amazing. Now, about 10 years later, after a lot has happened as DEN CPE has actually decreased, and others, after renovations, etc.... have increased and quite a few have surpassed DEN.

 

[Edited 2013-02-28 14:50:15]

Quoting IBOAviator (Reply 17): Wonder how much it costs EK to land the whale, gate, deplane pax at YYZ? Probably more money than I made last year in total.

I wondered that too and am too lazy to calculate it. Anyone want to do the landing fee for EK?

Quoting YYZAMS (Reply 31): Quoting IBOAviator (Reply 17): Wonder how much it costs EK to land the whale, gate, deplane pax at EK?

For one flight, $7194.46. For an entire year, $160,333.68

Assuming no delays and every seat filled. That is the total from wheels down to wheels up. That also assumes the current 3x weekly schedule with the A388

As a side note, I think that IND and ONT are up there but not nearly as high as YYZ.

[Edited 2013-02-28 19:27:33-My calculator didn't agree with me.]

[Edited 2013-02-28 19:29:32]

Quoting Alasizon (Reply 32):

That's the total landing and terminal fees, there is still the fuel+tax and security fees (do they have the similar per passenger TSA security fee in Canada?) and I imagine there must be some amount for desk space.

Quoting web500sjc (Reply 33): That's the total landing and terminal fees, there is still the fuel+tax and security fees (do they have the similar per passenger TSA security fee in Canada?) and I imagine there must be some amount for desk space.

I hadn't even factored that into it. I don't have the figures handy but I know I had some of the terminal costs (including the cost per square foot of departure lounge) on my other computer and I will see if I can find them.

Quoting Alasizon (Reply 34):

Wow....I didn't really expect anyone to have those, I was just putting those extra charges out before someone comes on and says running the whale must be cheap.

I do find it really funny that if you weigh over so many KG MTOW, it's only 25$, but if you weight under that same number it jumps up to 145$...the only place in the world where weight means you pay less.

Quoting Alasizon (Reply 32):

Are you sure? According to schedule posted by Texan and IBOaviator it should look like this (assuming charges based on MTOW, MTOW of 560 t and 496 seats):

General terminal for international arrivals - $6.34/seat: $3144.64
Landing fee for aircraft in excess of 19,000kg - $25.00/t: $14000
Gate charge (jetbridge) - $100/operation $100
Variable gate charge (jetbridge) - $2.80/seat $1388.80
Gate occupancy fee (jetbridge) - $100/15 minutes $2700

That all gives us a grand total of $21333.44 and doesn't contain check-in counter fees. The gate occupancy fee could be lower, but honestly, I've only seen the A380 parked at the gate.

Quoting web500sjc (Reply 35): I do find it really funny that if you weigh over so many KG MTOW, it's only 25$, but if you weight under that same number it jumps up to 145$...the only place in the world where weight means you pay less.

It's not. The landing fee is $25 per 1000kg.

Quoting WildcatYXU (Reply 37):

Sorry I just say a straight 25$

Quoting texan (Reply 16):

My bad.

YYZ fees are outrages , for sure the most expensive airport in North america for no reason . still I dont understant why its so expensive ????

Quoting danimarroquin (Reply 39): YYZ fees are outrages , for sure the most expensive airport in North america for no reason . still I dont understant why its so expensive ????

Socialized Healthcare

Quoting WildcatYXU (Reply 36): Quoting Alasizon (Reply 32): Are you sure? According to schedule posted by Texan and IBOaviator it should look like this (assuming charges based on MTOW, MTOW of 560 t and 496 seats): General terminal for international arrivals - $6.34/seat: $3144.64 Landing fee for aircraft in excess of 19,000kg - $25.00/t: $14000 Gate charge (jetbridge) - $100/operation $100 Variable gate charge (jetbridge) - $2.80/seat $1388.80 Gate occupancy fee (jetbridge) - $100/15 minutes $2700 That all gives us a grand total of $21333.44 and doesn't contain check-in counter fees. The gate occupancy fee could be lower, but honestly, I've only seen the A380 parked at the gate.

I ran the numbers and came up with the same $$$ amount as Alasizon, minus the Gate Occupancy fee. I interpretted the statement about the Gate Occupancy Fee from the link:

'A gate occupancy fee is only charged where an aircraft remains at a gate in excess of its allotted turn time plus a one hour grace period'

to be that it is charged if the aircraft is still in gate beyond it's allocated time. Ie: Late departure. Ie: Here is a financial incentive to get out of the way for the next plane.

Not included in these costs is the cost of the Check in counters. For EK, I think it would be cheaper to pay hourly as opposed to a monthly license. It depends on how long the counter is open before flight, and when it closes. The monthly license fee work out to about 360 hours of counter space per month. Doing some maritime math at 3 flights per week for the year, the break even point would be about 27 hours of check-in counter per flight. Yep, hourly counter charges per flight is more cost effective.

Interesting, enough. I did a comparison between YYZ and YHM landing fees. If I used the same methodology as Alasizon (which I believe to be fairly accurate), the cost for a 737-700 landing at both airports is:

YYZ: $2,922.32 per landing ($21.49/pax)
YHM: $1,242.52 per landing ($9.14/pax)

One could argue that the savings are significant, being that is 57% cheaper. Another could argue, as a passenger, is it worth $12 to save to fly out of YHM instead of YYZ? If you are taking a cab from downtown Toronto to YYZ vs YHM, I think you'll spend a lot more the $12 in cab fare.

Quoting bobnwa (Reply 21): I don't qiite follow that statement.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_much_d..._the_nimitz_class_aircraft_carrier

"That means each carrier launch costs $80,600."

Reading this thread, I tried to think of an airport where the landing fees entitle you to land with the gear up....


David

Here is the entire breakdown of all fees for 2013 at PIT:



PIT had some of the highest fees in the country, which was the main reason US left their hub at PIT.

http://www.pitairport.com/PIT_rates_2013

[Edited 2013-03-02 23:43:38]

Quoting SkyTeamTriStar (Reply 6): IAD has some of the most expensive real estate in the U.S.

For WN, IAD does not have the most expensive landing fees however when you factor is all the other fees, rents and taxes that come with bringing in aircraft to IAD it is the most expensive airport that WN operates out of.

FLY

Quoting flyiguy (Reply 45): For WN, IAD does not have the most expensive landing fees however when you factor is all the other fees, rents and taxes that come with bringing in aircraft to IAD it is the most expensive airport that WN operates out of.

Sounds a lot like what I said about IND, which happens to be another WN station: cheap landing fees, expensive everything else.

I have noticed that WN flies into quite a few high-cost airports despite being an LCC: in addition to the aforementioned IAD and IND, I can think of SMF, SJC, SEA (remember the WN @ BFI controversy), and

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