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2travel2know2
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:34 pm

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 97):
We have previously commented about how CM PTY-LIR 2x weekly and CM PTY-REC 4x weekly are not demonstrating progress lately. Thus, the airline must be cautious with the opening of new stations.

Rumour is: add IQT to those new CM under-performing destinations.
I'm not on CM's payroll.
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Tue Apr 30, 2013 10:03 pm

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 100):
Rumour is: add IQT to those new CM under-performing destinations.

I have heard that REC, LIR and IQT are all underperforming...with LIR and REC running a close race for Stinker.


Here is tropic's latest updated route map (out today) from their website.


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
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juanchito
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Thu May 02, 2013 2:04 am

I remember correctly that in June 2013 AviancaTaca will receive the first ATR72.

Are those plane still on schedule to arrive in that date.
Who will receive them first Avianca or Taca.

Juanchito
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2travel2know2
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Mon May 06, 2013 2:06 pm

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 101):
I have heard that REC, LIR and IQT are all underperforming...with LIR and REC running a close race for Stinker.

IMHO, winner hands down: LIR.
I don't know of an Star Alliance airline flying LIR-MIA, so if CM wants to try something daring, how about twice weekly PTY-LIR-MIA and see what happens.
What CM REC needs is some kind of cooperation with G3 on REC-FOR/SSA like CM has w/G3 on GRU-GIG.
At least, it's what is still shown on CM magazine.
Since CM is already allowed to fly to SSA, not sure how the passengers (not to mention CM crews) would take a possible PTY-REC-SSA-PTY or PTY-SSA-REC-PTY.
I'm not on CM's payroll.
 
SJOtoLIR
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Wed May 08, 2013 3:04 am

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 99):
Apples to Oranges. TGU and SAP do not have near the tourism market that BZE does

The tourism market is centralized from the USA and it wouldn't magically come from South America and the Caribbean through PTY. Ask it to CM PTY-LIR 2x weekly.
In my view, the dimension of the whole market named CM PTY-TGU and CM PTY-SAP could be comparable to the fictitious CM PTY-BZE.




.

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 99):
Its not the business case holding CM back on this route....it is something else.

I don't get this statement.
Please, explain.




.

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 99):
for example. N. Americans want to go to LIR, S. American's want to go to the white sandy beach.

The average of the Deep South Americans travelers are not even thinking in both Liberia and Belize City.
They're rather considering Punta Cana, Havana, Santo Domingo, Aruba, Cancun, St. Maarten and so forth which are available through PTY.




.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 100):
Rumour is: add IQT to those new CM under-performing destinations.

Give it some time. Based on the amount of weekly frequencies, CM PTY-REC, CM PTY-IQT and CM PTY-LIR are even low density routes. All these routes were inaugurated last year.
I can almost remember when CM PTY-PUJ started in 2007 as the shy 2x weekly service. Today, it's 21x weekly !
Perhaps Copa Airlines is not considering the massive opening of new destination in 2013 and it's not far away the day when the airline may double their daily flights heading to Port of Spain, Valencia, Maracaibo, Chicago, Las Vegas, Cordoba, Brasilia and Belo Horizonte, among others.
On the other hand, the US destinations seems to fit perfectly within its business model analyzing how CM PTY-ORD, CM PTY-LAS and even the upcoming CM PTY-BOS started flying solidly there on a daily basis. My hypothesis is that the wealthier new candidates on CM may be focused in the United States.

Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
2travel2know2
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Wed May 08, 2013 4:19 pm

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 104):
Perhaps Copa Airlines is not considering the massive opening of new destination in 2013 and it's not far away the day when the airline may double their daily flights heading to Port of Spain, Valencia, Maracaibo, Chicago, Las Vegas, Cordoba, Brasilia and Belo Horizonte, among others.

POS is almost twice daily right-now.
We won't see a frequency increase on PTY-MAR/VLN. Only chances for CM increasing frequencies to MAR/VLN would be if P5 is to fly from BOG, on the other side, CM could try to apply for twice/thrice weekly PTY-PMV/PZO and see how the Venezuelan authorities react.
Both ORD and LAS could go double-daily, LAS probably this same year may get extra flights some days.
Chances for increased frequencies to Argentina or starting ROS, MDZ or SLA, very remote. IMHO, only SLA may stand a greater chance of getting a PTY flight soon given its distance away from EZE and regional pressure for better international connectivity.
BSB, CNF, POA I'd guess could get and support an extra flight a couple of days per week in the meantime before going full double-daily.
I'm not on CM's payroll.
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Wed May 08, 2013 4:39 pm

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 104):
The average of the Deep South Americans travelers are not even thinking in both Liberia and Belize City.

Doesn't need the average ...only about 100 a day need to buy a ticket.

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 104):
I don't get this statement.

I wish I could explain. There a few lurkers around her that know exactly what I am talking about.
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
SJOtoLIR
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Thu May 09, 2013 2:11 am

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 105):
Chances for increased frequencies to Argentina or starting ROS, MDZ or SLA, very remote. IMHO, only SLA may stand a greater chance of getting a PTY flight soon given its distance away from EZE and regional pressure for better international connectivity.

The civil aviation authorities from Argentina have pursued the protectionism of its own market and I highly doubt about the opening of new stations.
Just remember what happened with TA LIM-MDZ 3x weekly in 2011. They never launched the first flight !
Venezuela is experiencing a similar behavior that could work against the commercial interests of the Panamanian airline.




.

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 106):
only about 100 a day need to buy a ticket.

I'm still skeptical about this behavior in the short-term.
CM for years served both San Pedro Sula and Tegucigalpa via San Jose and it wasn't easy for these Honduran stations.
This is the allocate schedule nowadays:

Tegucigalpa
CM PTY-SJO-TGU: 7x weekly
CM PTY-TGU: 7x weekly

San Pedro Sula
CM PTY-SJO-SAP: 7x weekly
CM PTY-SAP: 5x weekly

In my view, Belize City has the potential to become a new station for Copa Airlines in the future. Same with BGI, PVR, SJD or PMV. BZE is not alone on this purpose.
All the mentioned stations might have a similar dimension related to the demand of passengers through PTY.

Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
avi8
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Thu May 09, 2013 3:25 am

I wonder when CM will expand in other places that is not PTY. PTY can only grow so much and they can't and shouldn't put all of their eggs in one basket. I know the have Copa Colombia put right now I'm referring more to the Central American Copa. What are y'all's thoughts?
avi8
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Thu May 09, 2013 1:32 pm

Quoting avi8 (Reply 108):
I wonder when CM will expand in other places that is not PTY. PTY can only grow so much and they can't and shouldn't put all of their eggs in one basket. I know the have Copa Colombia put right now I'm referring more to the Central American Copa. What are y'all's thoughts?

a) buy BW and open a second hub there at POS
b) open a second hub at GUA
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
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carmenlu15
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Thu May 09, 2013 2:22 pm

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 109):
b) open a second hub at GUA

   I am totally on board with that idea!
Don't expect to see me around that much (if at all) -- the contact link should still work, though.
 
2travel2know2
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Thu May 09, 2013 4:21 pm

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 109):
a) buy BW and open a second hub there at POS

There's fleet commonality between BW and CM but other than that just need to remember how Jamaica reacted to the Trini take-over of Air Jamaica to see what would happen on Trinidad (and on Jamaica for whatever BW has left overthere) if the Panamanians are to take-over BW. And that was Caribbean to "fellow Caribbean", CM getting into BW would be Latinamerican to Caribbean as Panama most of the time isn't perceived as "Caribbean" by many West Indians.

Quote:
b) open a second hub at GUA

More than a hub, I'd guess a focus operation @ GUA and MGA, since both Guatemala and Nicaragua may allow CM non-stop 5th freedom to some of its major markets no question asked.
I'm not on CM's payroll.
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Thu May 09, 2013 5:25 pm

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 111):
There's fleet commonality between BW and CM but other than that just need to remember how Jamaica reacted to the Trini take-over of Air Jamaica to see what would happen on Trinidad (and on Jamaica for whatever BW has left overthere) if the Panamanians are to take-over BW. And that was Caribbean to "fellow Caribbean", CM getting into BW would be Latinamerican to Caribbean as Panama most of the time isn't perceived as "Caribbean" by many West Indians.

I perceive the Trini's to be a bit more pragmatic on investments subjects than the Jamaicans.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 111):
since both Guatemala and Nicaragua may allow CM non-stop 5th freedom to some of its major markets no question asked.

BZE already offers 5th freedoms....hell CM should just open the hub there! BZE could be the next DXB. From dust to boom town in 20years. Guatemala would really want to invade them then!      
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
SJOtoLIR
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Fri May 10, 2013 2:30 am

Quoting avi8 (Reply 108):
Copa Colombia put right now I'm referring more to the Central American Copa. What are y'all's thoughts?

Copa Airlines has already built a focus city in San Jose:

Guatemala City: 1x CM + 1x Copa Colombia
San Pedro Sula: 1x
Tegucigalpa: 1x
Managua: 2x
Panama City: 6x CM + 1x Copa Colombia
Bogota: 1x Copa Colombia, via PTY

SJO doesn't have the official status of focus city on CM, but you can find at least one plane parked there at all times.
The airline recently inaugurated its newest Copa Club in Latin America, located in the Juan Santamaria International Airport.
The attached press releases states that the airline may move their maintenance services from SJO in the mid-term:

http://www.nacion.com/2013-05-06/Mov...lleres-de-costa-rica-a-panama.aspx




.

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 109):
open a second hub at GUA

  
GUA has te potential: it was recently expanded, a nice environment, the VIP lounge and so on.
However, CM doesn't seem to follow the multi-hub concept like LAN or Avianca.
For example, the international operations supplied by Copa Airlines Colombia cannot be fairly compared with the flights offered by the mainline: [CM PTY-HAV 42x weekly against CM BOG-HAV 2x weekly] or [CM PTY-CUN 35x weekly against CM BOG-CUN 1x weekly].

Regards.

[Edited 2013-05-09 19:31:59]
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
aer
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Fri May 10, 2013 5:48 am

I posted this question in another thread, but I also wanted to post it here.

I'm wondering is how are AV gonna manage the flags on the new livery; will all aircraft be painted with the Colombian flag, or will some keep the other flags?
nice and spacious airports in need of new airlines and flights... GUA or FRS anyone?... anyone at all?
 
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 11, 2013 3:40 pm

Quoting aer (Reply 114):
I'm wondering is how are AV gonna manage the flags on the new livery; will all aircraft be painted with the Colombian flag, or will some keep the other flags?

It's a good question.
The different national flags painted into the fuselage has been a practice followed by GRUPO TACA.
One more point: GRUPO TACA has promoted the "Centroamerica" logo in their engines. I've seen a stylized condor instead, speaking about the new color-scheme adopted by AV.
No more parrots -guaras- as well.

Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
aer
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 11, 2013 4:57 pm

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 115):

And the thing about the flags is that not all the countries give all the freedoms to foreign carriers, so that's where my question comes from; because of this I started wondering about it.

Nationality is sometimes a big thing when it comes to aircraft because of open sky agreements that have designated carriers (i.e. Canada and (fill in the blank) or internal workings of a country that are picky with foreign carriers that are not part of a nation group or so.
nice and spacious airports in need of new airlines and flights... GUA or FRS anyone?... anyone at all?
 
SJOtoLIR
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 11, 2013 8:40 pm

Quoting aer (Reply 116):
the thing about the flags is that not all the countries give all the freedoms to foreign carriers

AV didn't purchase TA.
The merger AV-TA is being unified into the AV brand solely where the former Avianca is getting the 2/3 of the capital.
The traffic rights are considered part of the assets of one airline and they can be sold or transferred in the future.
Analyzing the case of the planes involved within GRUPO TACA, some of them belong to say LACSA and they clearly bear the Costa Rican flag for the meantime. I ignore further details about how will AV manage this situation later.
For example, the planes involved with LAN Argentina bear the LV-designator and they're featuring the Argentinean flag as well. I cannot find another difference analyzing the paint-scheme belonging to the Chilean division: LAN.
Same with Copa Airlines Colombia and Copa Airlines mainline.




.
One more sample about the unification process on AV-TA:


Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
aer
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 11, 2013 10:07 pm

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 117):

Thanks for the explanation, I get it now, the brand is changing, not the a/c reg or nationality.
nice and spacious airports in need of new airlines and flights... GUA or FRS anyone?... anyone at all?
 
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carmenlu15
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sun May 12, 2013 12:48 am

Quoting aer (Reply 118):
Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 117):

Thanks for the explanation, I get it now, the brand is changing, not the a/c reg or nationality.

I guess it's much like the TG- or HR- registered ATRs both bearing the TACA Regional titles (but having their respective flags painted).

Gonna miss 'em guacamayas, have to say...   
Don't expect to see me around that much (if at all) -- the contact link should still work, though.
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Wed May 15, 2013 8:40 pm

Multiple Dickie birds are chirping loudly about some surprise announcements for our Central American fans in a few weeks.
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
2travel2know2
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Fri May 17, 2013 2:20 pm

Airlines interested in MPRH Rio Hato Airport from www.prensa.com in Spanish
According to Panama Civil Aviation Authority boss, 4 airlines (all Canadian and for charters) follow the developments of MPRH Rio Hato Scarlett Martínez Airport.
Seems like there'll be charters from Canada to MPRH this coming season.
I'm not on CM's payroll.
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Fri May 17, 2013 9:26 pm

Are there even 4 Canadian charter companies....I know of Sunwing, Air Transat.....
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
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juanchito
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 2:32 am

According to this article Avianca-Taca will discontinue the following flights from SJO

SJO-LAX
SJO-HAV
SJO-JFK
SJO-UIO
SJO-GYE

http://www.nacion.com/2013-05-17/ElP...los-directos-desde-Costa-Rica.aspx

Juanchito
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mingocr83
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 3:26 am

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 120):

Well 261 people were axed from the SJO base today. Feel sorry for those folks...38 pilots, the rest was a split between cabin crew, counter and ops. Also some routes were axed today, mostly Airbus routes...JFK LAX HAV GYE are no longer operated friom SJO...massive changes it seems...
A380, A321, A320, A319, 757-200, 737-800WL, 737-700WL, E190
 
avi8
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 12:16 pm

Sad to see so many routes being axed. What does this mean for SJO? Will AV/TA focus on having one hub at Central America rather than two?
avi8
 
Summa767
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 12:26 pm

Quoting juanchito (Reply 123):
According to this article Avianca-Taca will discontinue the following flights from SJO

SJO-LAX
SJO-HAV
SJO-JFK
SJO-UIO
SJO-GYE

Also SJO-PTY and SJO PTY-MDE

Quoting mingocr83 (Reply 124):
Well 261 people were axed from the SJO base today. Feel sorry for those folks...38 pilots, the rest was a split between cabin crew, counter and ops. Also some routes were axed today, mostly Airbus routes...JFK LAX HAV GYE are no longer operated friom SJO...massive changes it seems...

Bad news indeed for the staff who have lost their jobs.
As for the way that Avianca-Taca handled the cancelation of these routes, only announced on the same day of the event is absolutely appalling.
Shame on Avianca.
 
avi8
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 12:56 pm

Quoting summa767 (Reply 126):

Those routes were not mentioned in the article. Heck, SJO is now only slightly larger than GUA before these cuts were made. GUA serves SAP, TGU, ORD, MIA, LAX, FRS, SAL, and SJO. The only routes not served that SJO does are MGA, BOG and Mexico City.
avi8
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 1:22 pm

Quoting mingocr83 (Reply 124):
mostly Airbus routes...JFK LAX HAV GYE are no longer operated friom SJO...massive changes it seems...

Well DL will pick up the LAX slack at SJO.

Quoting mingocr83 (Reply 124):
Well 261 people were axed from the SJO base today. Feel sorry for those folks...38 pilots, the rest was a split between cabin crew, counter and ops. Also some routes were axed today, mostly Airbus routes...JFK LAX HAV GYE are no longer operated friom SJO...massive changes it seems...

That was not the announcment(s) I was referring to. A few more days before it is made.
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 1:29 pm

Quoting avi8 (Reply 125):

Sad to see so many routes being axed. What does this mean for SJO? Will AV/TA focus on having one hub at Central America rather than two?

I believe this is only the first tranche. we probably will see some more P2P dissappear in the coming months.IMHO
CM will benefit from these cuts more than AV.
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
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copa330200
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 2:19 pm

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 129):
IMHO
CM will benefit from these cuts more than AV.

100% aligned,

Quoting summa767 (Reply 126):
Bad news indeed for the staff who have lost their jobs.

hope CM expands it's operation so they can hire them  
On the run !!!
 
Summa767
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 2:26 pm

Quoting avi8 (Reply 127):
The only routes not served that SJO does are MGA, BOG and Mexico City.

MGA gets the chop too!
And next month SJO-LIM, as well as TGU-MIA

Full statement here, which only came late in the day yesterday, the day that the cuts were implemented.
http://www.taca.com/gnss/app/esp/promwp.asp?id=35&idpro=5437

Some things don't make sense, such as they state that flights to LIM, PTY among others remain, but are then listed in the discontinued lists. In the case of PTY there are only 2 daily flights (both chopped), one of which used to continue to MDE. In the case of LIM it looks like it goes from 13 to 7 weekly.

It really strikes of haphazardness in their communications, and general unprofessionalism.
Really quite disgustingly handled.
 
avi8
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 3:13 pm

So is SJO still a hub or is it a focus city like GUA now? Also, what are the service increases from SAL? Where are all these extra planes going? I never thought this would happen. I'm astonished.
avi8
 
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juanchito
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 4:17 pm

Does it have to do with Jetblue plans in FLL?

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 128):
That was not the announcment(s) I was referring to. A few more days before it is made.

Juanchito
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aer
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 6:10 pm

Quoting avi8 (Reply 125):
Sad to see so many routes being axed. What does this mean for SJO? Will AV/TA focus on having one hub at Central America rather than two?

Wow so they are really GUA-ing SJO, but how are they gonna supplement it if AV doesn't fly to all of CentAm from BOG?
nice and spacious airports in need of new airlines and flights... GUA or FRS anyone?... anyone at all?
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sat May 18, 2013 6:37 pm

Quoting summa767 (Reply 126):
Also SJO-PTY and

No more lechero BZE-SAL-SJO-PTY for me I guess.


Dear CM, we are desperate in BZE now!
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
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carmenlu15
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sun May 19, 2013 1:30 am

Seriously?! What in the world is AV/TA thinking?!   

A little advance notice wouldn't have hurt -- I have a couple of passengers coming from PTY on Monday.   

Quoting summa767 (Reply 126):
Also SJO-PTY and SJO PTY-MDE

Yet CM is able to sustain 7 daily flights on the SJO-PTY route...

Quoting summa767 (Reply 131):
And next month SJO-LIM

Apparently it's only one of the frequencies, the other daily flight remains (for now at least).
Don't expect to see me around that much (if at all) -- the contact link should still work, though.
 
CRFLY
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sun May 19, 2013 3:39 am

This is one of the most horrendous HR move I've seen in LACSA since the pilot strike back in the 90s. Most of my friends at LR are gone now, and the situation was handled in the most unprofessional way they say. According to one of my ex Fight Attendant's friend, today they continue to fire people during the day, and the total workforce fired is now over 300. She said in the meeting the person in charge explained the SJO hub was posting losses on most of its flights, so they have decided to cancel the unprofitable flights and that means an important reduction in the workforce!

A really sad day for the aviation industry in Costa Rica and another hard hit for what its left from LACSA.

On a separate note, it seems like this news also took by surprise the people working on the call centers, as most of the operators today we shocking and experiencing high calls volume, and still don't know what to do or where to rebook these passengers, as many of the remaining flights were full, especially the ones to JFK, LAX and PTY! Sad sad day...
AA, AB, AC, AM, AR, AV, BA, B6, CM, CO, CX, CZ, DL, EA, ET, GU, HX, IB, JJ, LA, LH, LP, LR, LX, MU, MX, PA, PT, QF, RG, SA, TA, TP, TZ, UA, VW, VX, VY, WS, Z8, 2K, 4O, 4Z
 
mingocr83
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sun May 19, 2013 5:18 am

Oficial List of Axed routes

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/268815_10200607672986562_250453604_n.jpg
A380, A321, A320, A319, 757-200, 737-800WL, 737-700WL, E190
 
2travel2know2
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RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Sun May 19, 2013 11:00 pm

One could have expected a bit flight cancellations advance notice, but how AV/TA has behaved with SJO and those flights passengers is unprofessional and unacceptable.

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 135):
Dear CM, we are desperate in BZE now!

Now you really are.
In the meanwhile, a talk with Cayman Airways could get BZE linked with both GCM and PTY w/ twice weekly CM code-share GCM-BZE-PTY.

Quoting carmenlu15 (Reply 136):
Yet CM is able to sustain 7 daily flights on the SJO-PTY route...

Thanks to PTY CM Hub of the Americas, without the hub frequencies will be down to 2 or 3 per day (among the airlines flying the route).
Hope that CM is able to think on the PTY-SJO O/D market and offer an early morning PTY-SJO (0530h PTY departure) and late evening SJO-PTY (2230 PTY arrival) - both times off the PTY hub bank hours.
I'm not on CM's payroll.
 
aer
Posts: 699
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 1:10 pm

RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Mon May 20, 2013 12:45 am

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 139):

One could have expected a bit flight cancellations advance notice, but how AV/TA has behaved with SJO and those flights passengers is unprofessional and unacceptable.

Seriously I would've expected this from an airline like NK but AV/TA just threw their brand down the drain.

I guess the playing field may become friendly for new local entrants finally.
nice and spacious airports in need of new airlines and flights... GUA or FRS anyone?... anyone at all?
 
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carmenlu15
Posts: 4518
Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2004 1:24 am

RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Mon May 20, 2013 1:00 am

Quoting CRFLY (Reply 137):
On a separate note, it seems like this news also took by surprise the people working on the call centers,

Why am I not that surprised? They had a knack for sending cancellation notices late on a Sunday afternoon -- not an easy task to try to contact passengers out of business hours...

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 139):
Thanks to PTY CM Hub of the Americas, without the hub frequencies will be down to 2 or 3 per day (among the airlines flying the route).

Yeah, figured most of it would be connecting traffic, but there has to be some O/D...

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 139):
Hope that CM is able to think on the PTY-SJO O/D market and offer an early morning PTY-SJO (0530h PTY departure) and late evening SJO-PTY (2230 PTY arrival) - both times off the PTY hub bank hours.

I wish they would do the same with GUA (early morning PTY-GUA / evening GUA-PTY), but I guess there's not that much demand for that...
Don't expect to see me around that much (if at all) -- the contact link should still work, though.
 
MGASJO
Posts: 357
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 9:37 am

RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Mon May 20, 2013 1:13 am

It seems CM is not wasting any time. They are in big need of pilots and will go to SJO to do some recruiting. Monday and Tuesday!
Great move!
Endless Reserve
 
mt99
Posts: 6166
Joined: Wed May 26, 1999 5:41 am

RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Mon May 20, 2013 1:28 am

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 139):
One could have expected a bit flight cancellations advance notice, but how AV/TA has behaved with SJO and those flights passengers is unprofessional and unacceptable.

Agreed. TA/AV needed to cut their losses with SJO - but there are proper ways to do things and this is not one of them. Shame indeed

So what happening with all the extra airplanes?
Step into my office, baby
 
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copa330200
Posts: 199
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:59 am

RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Mon May 20, 2013 4:15 am

Quoting MGASJO (Reply 142):
It seems CM is not wasting any time. They are in big need of pilots and will go to SJO to do some recruiting. Monday and Tuesday!

that's great news for the people who lost their jobs   

now, there is clearly an opportunity for the Embraer pilots however I'm not sure how it works for the ex AV/TA pilots who are qualified in Airbus since CM has 73x /embraer... how "easy" and costly is to "migrate " from 319/320 to 737 /738 ??
On the run !!!
 
mingocr83
Posts: 76
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 6:06 am

RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Mon May 20, 2013 5:40 am

Not only that, even Skymark has sent job offers to several pilots for A330 with several benefits.. QR sent a hiring crew for both pilots and cabin crew from DOH. Also LAN has offered the chance to hire ALL the pilots fired for their base in LIM. And last but not least...there is a rumor that CM will get an open skies agreement to poke AV in the nuts and is pushing for a base in SJO...with local pilots...let's see how it goes, certainly is gonna be a busy week for these folks.

The advantage of the majority of old pilots in LR is that they flew 737 as well...so they just need recurrent and they will be ready to go...

Also the situation is going to be worse in a few months, these layoffs are the start. SJO will stop being a hub for AV...I guess that Kriete was grabbed on the nuts by the Salvadorian government to not sacrifice SAL as as hub...Pilots that are currently working are also getting job offers...CM is including E90 pilots for their recruitment process.

[Edited 2013-05-19 22:42:37]
A380, A321, A320, A319, 757-200, 737-800WL, 737-700WL, E190
 
SCL767
Posts: 2812
Joined: Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:25 am

RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Mon May 20, 2013 5:57 am

Quoting mingocr83 (Reply 145):
Also LAN has offered the chance to hire ALL the pilots fired for their base in LIM.

Indeed, LAN wants to hire all the redundant TACA pilots on contract for both the LIM and BOG bases. LAN is also offering contracts to TACA A320 pilots that have not been dismissed by AV as yet...
 
CRFLY
Posts: 176
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2004 12:06 pm

RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Mon May 20, 2013 9:30 am

What a big mess! According to my friends that were fired, and some others who stayed in AV/TA, they continue to fire people Saturday and Sunday! And the SJO Airport has been a total mess these days, and we are just starting the business week today, and because this happened Friday, I guess our Monday and Tuesday is going to be like Hell... I called the Call Center as one of my passengers was on the LR661 from JFK to SJO who was canceled, and after 1 hour waiting on the phone, they said "sorry we are very busy right now, can't protect your passenger at this time as he is flying until June. We haven't been able to protect all passengers for this week and we are still dealing with them, so we suggest you call in the next weeks..." Really unprofessional management... Now everything can be expected from AV... Just remembering ACES and the end of its history out lound...
AA, AB, AC, AM, AR, AV, BA, B6, CM, CO, CX, CZ, DL, EA, ET, GU, HX, IB, JJ, LA, LH, LP, LR, LX, MU, MX, PA, PT, QF, RG, SA, TA, TP, TZ, UA, VW, VX, VY, WS, Z8, 2K, 4O, 4Z
 
2travel2know2
Posts: 2997
Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2010 3:01 pm

RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Mon May 20, 2013 2:09 pm

Quoting carmenlu15 (Reply 141):
Yeah, figured most of it would be connecting traffic, but there has to be some O/D...

2-4 daily bus runs between Panama and San José may be a proof of that.   

Quote:
I wish they would do the same with GUA (early morning PTY-GUA / evening GUA-PTY),but I guess there's not that much demand for that...

IMHO, the only routes which may support CM off-hub banks departures/arrivals are for daily flights: SJO, MIA, MGA, CCS and LIM; for less than daily frequencies: MEX, JFK, GRU, GUA, HAV and SDQ. Off-hub times flights to/from BOG have the advantage of connections @ BOG w/P5 so they can't be classified the same as others.

Quoting MGASJO (Reply 142):
It seems CM is not wasting any time. They are in big need of pilots and will go to SJO to do some recruiting. Monday and Tuesday!
Great move!

Good news for Tico pilots. CM still has some lack on how many foreign pilots it could hire without breaking Panamanian laws re: number of Panamanian pilots flying for CM.

Quoting copa330200 (Reply 144):
now, there is clearly an opportunity for the Embraer pilots however I'm not sure how it works for the ex AV/TA pilots who are qualified in Airbus since CM has 73x /embraer... how "easy" and costly is to "migrate " from 319/320 to 737 /738 ??

Be reminded that there might be Airbus pilots who were B737-300 pilots when Lacsa (TA) were flying those. The migration from B737-300 to B737-700/800 may be a very swift and quick one.

Quoting mingocr83 (Reply 145):
And last but not least...there is a rumor that CM will get an open skies agreement to poke AV in the nuts and is pushing for a base in SJO...with local pilots...let's see how it goes, certainly is gonna be a busy week for these folks.

Right now, Panama bilateral w/Costa Rica is a very unrestricted one.
I believe CM could already offer flights between SJO (or LIR for that matter) and most major SJO destinations but there's just a minor issue for CM if they would want to fly DAV-SJO as the current operator of the route is 7P Air Panama.

Quoting mingocr83 (Reply 145):
Also the situation is going to be worse in a few months, these lay-offs are the start. SJO will stop being a hub for AV...I guess that Kriete was grabbed on the nuts by the Salvadorian government to not sacrifice SAL as as hub...

I don't doubt the Salvadoran government hand in all of this but SAL does have a point on their favour over SJO. SAL wins over SAL when it comes to climate conditions and land available for expansion.
Talking about why AV de-hubbed SJO,
I'd like now to take an opportunity to throw some blame to Costa Rica's Coopesa for their stubbornness to remain @ SJO not moving to LIR and using so precious land for a hub airport expansion, thus making it less attractive for AV to remain there.
I'm not on CM's payroll.
 
User avatar
carmenlu15
Posts: 4518
Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2004 1:24 am

RE: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52

Mon May 20, 2013 3:01 pm

Quoting CRFLY (Reply 147):
I called the Call Center as one of my passengers was on the LR661 from JFK to SJO who was canceled, and after 1 hour waiting on the phone, they said "sorry we are very busy right now, can't protect your passenger at this time as he is flying until June. We haven't been able to protect all passengers for this week and we are still dealing with them, so we suggest you call in the next weeks..."

I feel for them. Been there, done that, not fun at all. Though in my case, the airport (and the whole city) was covered by volcanic ash and airspace was closed... at least the cancellations were not the airline's fault.

Quoting CRFLY (Reply 147):
Really unprofessional management...

   Disappointing, to say the least.
Don't expect to see me around that much (if at all) -- the contact link should still work, though.

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