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Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:22 pm
by VC10er
Wow thanks! I just marked 134” on my living room floor and imagined it’s full circumference! BIG!

Is that the fattest the engine is? Or is it even wider at the outer most edges of the nacelle?

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:59 pm
by QXAS
Something I just noticed, I don’t know if it’s been discussed so my apologies if it has been is in the renderings of the new LH J class, the bins have a concave shape to them, following the shape of the fuselage. The current sky interior has a convex shape. What’s the reason for the change?

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 1:01 am
by iamlucky13
VC10er wrote:
Wow thanks! I just marked 134” on my living room floor and imagined it’s full circumference! BIG!

Is that the fattest the engine is? Or is it even wider at the outer most edges of the nacelle?


134" is the fan diameter. The nacelle is 174", according to Aviation Week.

I had a chance at an airshow a couple years ago to stand arms length away from a GE90-115, and it's one of those experiences that pictures just don't do justice to.

At 155 inches for GE90-115B, the slightly over 10% difference doesn't sound like much, but I expect it will seem a lot more significant when a 77X is first seen parked next to a 77W. Here's an only slightly more significant (~12%) difference to visualize:
https://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap161113.html

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 2:58 pm
by VC10er
Well, I shall never forget my first 777 flight in the 1990's. She was brand new and I was flying it from EWR to LHR on United. Back then UA used one of the old satellites at EWR and the 777 filled the entire window...it was SO much bigger than the 767 that was usually there it was astounding. I gazed at the engine for what seemed like an hour in total awe of her maul. So, I can only barely imagine what the GE90-115 will look like...and cantilevered in front of the wing. I think 10% or 12% bigger of a circle that big already will be even more awe inspiring.

Thanks

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 9:19 pm
by TranscendZac
Here is a shot of the ‘standard’ GE90, not the larger GE90-115B, next to a 737 fuselage, so imagine what a GE9X will look like? :o

Image

I wonder if the thrust rating will be bumped even further? Also, pardon the ignorance, but is the MLG on the 777X the same as the 77W/L? Can the plane theoretically grow in MTOW or is the 351,000kg the max for the aircraft?

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:06 pm
by VC10er
That would be a very fast 737 if it had 2 of those engines!

Awesome photograph.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:16 pm
by Bricktop
That is one crazy photo!

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:19 pm
by Slug71
TranscendZac wrote:
Here is a shot of the ‘standard’ GE90, not the larger GE90-115B, next to a 737 fuselage, so imagine what a GE9X will look like? :o

Image

I wonder if the thrust rating will be bumped even further? Also, pardon the ignorance, but is the MLG on the 777X the same as the 77W/L? Can the plane theoretically grow in MTOW or is the 351,000kg the max for the aircraft?


Impressive photo!

Not sure on the thrust, but unlikely unless it gets a MTOW bump. I would also think the MLG is at it's max without getting another bogie.
The MLG on the 777X will be different though,

Boeing is relying on Héroux-Devtek to move smoothly from its initial experience of building the gear for the current 777-300ER passenger jet and the 777F freighter models to doing the same for its forthcoming new 777X version.

The landing gear for the new bigger jet will have a few significant differences, Smith said.

The truck beam will be forged from a different titanium alloy. And a couple of components at the top of today’s landing gear for the 777X will be machined as a single piece.

The first 777X will be assembled in 2018 and flown the following year. Before then, Héroux-Devtek needs to have its manufacturing process ironed out, perfected and ramped up.


https://www.seattletimes.com/business/b ... ding-gear/

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:20 pm
by Boeing778X
VC10er wrote:
That would be a very fast 737 if it had 2 of those engines!

Awesome photograph.


Very fast and very short ranged, at that XD

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:15 pm
by TranscendZac
The crazy thing is the fan diameter of the GE90 in the picture above is a 123" fan vs the new 134" fan in the GE9X. Nearly a foot larger still...staggering really.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:22 pm
by KarelXWB
TranscendZac wrote:
The crazy thing is the fan diameter of the GE90 in the picture above is a 123" fan vs the new 134" fan in the GE9X. Nearly a foot larger still...staggering really.


The larger GE90-115B that powers the 77W is 128" BTW.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:37 pm
by TranscendZac
KarelXWB wrote:
TranscendZac wrote:
The crazy thing is the fan diameter of the GE90 in the picture above is a 123" fan vs the new 134" fan in the GE9X. Nearly a foot larger still...staggering really.


The larger GE90-115B that powers the 77W is 128" BTW.

Oh I know, but the picture above is not a GE90-115B. It's the 123" GE90 found on 772/ER and 773. The 5" fan diameter between the GE90 and GE90-115B was definitely noticeable, so I can only imagine what the GE9X will look like being 6" larger still than the GE90-115B, and 11" larger than the GE90 :boggled:

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:48 pm
by KarelXWB
And of course, we also have this photo:

Image

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 5:26 pm
by raggi
TranscendZac wrote:
Here is a shot of the ‘standard’ GE90, not the larger GE90-115B, next to a 737 fuselage, so imagine what a GE9X will look like? :o

Image

I wonder if the thrust rating will be bumped even further? Also, pardon the ignorance, but is the MLG on the 777X the same as the 77W/L? Can the plane theoretically grow in MTOW or is the 351,000kg the max for the aircraft?


I believe that's actually a PW engine, most likely a PW4077 or PW4090.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:57 pm
by edibletomb
I still think that the -9X will bring range/payload reduction compared to the -300ER. Even with a full pax and fuel payload the -300er will still have room/weight to spare. The -9X won't. The higher pax+paylaod count+ 50,000 lbs heavier base OEW will no doubt eat into the range... question is by how much. While I think that this wouldn't be a problem for ~90% of all routes operated by the -300ER, we can never know fully until the results are out. But for now, from an amateur enthusiast/ passenger perspective, I'm going with the A350-1000. Wider seats, quieter engine, less passenger, more range (purportedly up to 8000nm).

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 10:11 pm
by Polot
edibletomb wrote:
The higher pax+paylaod count+ 50,000 lbs heavier base OEW will no doubt eat into the range... question is by how much.

You're not really taking into account that the -9X has a larger fuel capacity (~7,000 US gal larger) while having more fuel efficient engines. The max weight of the 777-9 is the same as the 77W since they share the same MTOW. Yes, the 779 will seat more and be heavier, but it will also need less fuel (and thus fuel weight) to fly the same distance as the 77W.

edibletomb wrote:
Wider seats

The 777-9 and A350 have the same seat width when they are both equipped with 1.5" armrests (standard for A350, who knows with 777X as 2" has traditionally been standard for the 777).

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:24 pm
by Slug71
edibletomb wrote:
I still think that the -9X will bring range/payload reduction compared to the -300ER. Even with a full pax and fuel payload the -300er will still have room/weight to spare. The -9X won't. The higher pax+paylaod count+ 50,000 lbs heavier base OEW will no doubt eat into the range... question is by how much. While I think that this wouldn't be a problem for ~90% of all routes operated by the -300ER, we can never know fully until the results are out. But for now, from an amateur enthusiast/ passenger perspective, I'm going with the A350-1000. Wider seats, quieter engine, less passenger, more range (purportedly up to 8000nm).


And the -9X costs a fair bit more than the 77W too.

Polot wrote:
edibletomb wrote:
The higher pax+paylaod count+ 50,000 lbs heavier base OEW will no doubt eat into the range... question is by how much.

You're not really taking into account that the -9X has a larger fuel capacity (~7,000 US gal larger) while having more fuel efficient engines. The max weight of the 777-9 is the same as the 77W since they share the same MTOW. Yes, the 779 will seat more and be heavier, but it will also need less fuel (and thus fuel weight) to fly the same distance as the 77W.


They have the same MTOW, but they are definitely not the same weight. Look that the OEW and MZFW, they are both higher than the 77W's. The 777X has weight in the extra length of the fuselage and wing extension + folding mechanics. All that and the extra fuel, is most likely why they sacrificed capacity. Exit limit now 475 instead of 550 from the 77W. Now the engines appear to be slightly heavier too.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2017 12:34 am
by Polot
Slug71 wrote:
edibletomb wrote:
I still think that the -9X will bring range/payload reduction compared to the -300ER. Even with a full pax and fuel payload the -300er will still have room/weight to spare. The -9X won't. The higher pax+paylaod count+ 50,000 lbs heavier base OEW will no doubt eat into the range... question is by how much. While I think that this wouldn't be a problem for ~90% of all routes operated by the -300ER, we can never know fully until the results are out. But for now, from an amateur enthusiast/ passenger perspective, I'm going with the A350-1000. Wider seats, quieter engine, less passenger, more range (purportedly up to 8000nm).


And the -9X costs a fair bit more than the 77W too.

Polot wrote:
edibletomb wrote:
The higher pax+paylaod count+ 50,000 lbs heavier base OEW will no doubt eat into the range... question is by how much.

You're not really taking into account that the -9X has a larger fuel capacity (~7,000 US gal larger) while having more fuel efficient engines. The max weight of the 777-9 is the same as the 77W since they share the same MTOW. Yes, the 779 will seat more and be heavier, but it will also need less fuel (and thus fuel weight) to fly the same distance as the 77W.


They have the same MTOW, but they are definitely not the same weight. Look that the OEW and MZFW, they are both higher than the 77W's. The 777X has weight in the extra length of the fuselage and wing extension + folding mechanics. All that and the extra fuel, is most likely why they sacrificed capacity. Exit limit now 475 instead of 550 from the 77W. Now the engines appear to be slightly heavier too.


The max capacity was sacrificed because very few operators operate the 777 with seat capacities that high (just the Japanese carriers with their domestic 773s) and eliminating the overwing exits saves weight and provides more usable interior room.

I never said the 779 and 77W weigh the same, I said they have the same max weight. A 779 at MTOW weighs the same as a 77W at MTOW. Because of the 779’s better fuel efficiency you need less fuel for the same distance therefore more weight is available for the increased OEW and payload.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2017 6:27 am
by seabosdca
The 787-10 eliminates any reason to bring the 779 up to 550 pax max capacity (with the extra door weight that would imply). The 787-10 will be more efficient on any mission where a purchaser of new 777s would use that sort of capacity. And the MZFW of the 77W is really overkill except if you are carrying a whole lot of passengers together with cargo.

So I wouldn't be shocked if max structural payload of the 779 is a bit lower than that of the 77W. And I don't think it will matter. The much better fuel consumption will mean that the 779 will have equal or greater range with the sort of payloads it will really be carrying for the sort of operators that will buy it.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2017 8:05 am
by N14AZ
KarelXWB wrote:
And of course, we also have this photo:
Image

I really hope some airline will do such a picture again with the 779 and a 737.

That being said, I just realised the wheels of the 737’s nose gear are missing.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2017 8:17 am
by WIederling
N14AZ wrote:
That being said, I just realised the wheels of the 737’s nose gear are missing.


See the legs?
There is someone standing in the wheel well holding the nose up atlas style.:-)

( afaics the nose wheel is just of the image border?)

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:17 pm
by ADrum23
Forgive me if this has already been asked, but what are the chances any of the US3 order the 777-8 of 777-9?

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:30 pm
by MileHFL400
edibletomb wrote:
I still think that the -9X will bring range/payload reduction compared to the -300ER. Even with a full pax and fuel payload the -300er will still have room/weight to spare. The -9X won't. The higher pax+paylaod count+ 50,000 lbs heavier base OEW will no doubt eat into the range... question is by how much. While I think that this wouldn't be a problem for ~90% of all routes operated by the -300ER, we can never know fully until the results are out. But for now, from an amateur enthusiast/ passenger perspective, I'm going with the A350-1000. Wider seats, quieter engine, less passenger, more range (purportedly up to 8000nm).


The 9x is supposed to be a fair bit quieter than the 300ER

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:25 pm
by Boeing778X
ADrum23 wrote:
Forgive me if this has already been asked, but what are the chances any of the US3 order the 777-8 of 777-9?


Maybe AA, in the next decade, could get the 777-9. DL, no, and I'm not convinced UA would themselves.

No 777-8 for the US3s.

I'd also add AC as a potential customer.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:42 pm
by Stitch
ADrum23 wrote:
Forgive me if this has already been asked, but what are the chances any of the US3 order the 777-8 of 777-9?


Depends on how traffic growth works out. The 777-9 on a capacity basis pencils out better for UA and AA as a 777-300ER replacement as they are both 10-abreast Economy on the frames, but the A350-1000's lower seat count could improve RASM through higher average fares (less seats can mean less discounting to fill them).

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 2:35 am
by ADrum23
Stitch wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:
Forgive me if this has already been asked, but what are the chances any of the US3 order the 777-8 of 777-9?


Depends on how traffic growth works out. The 777-9 on a capacity basis pencils out better for UA and AA as a 777-300ER replacement as they are both 10-abreast Economy on the frames, but the A350-1000's lower seat count could improve RASM through higher average fares (less seats can mean less discounting to fill them).


AA and UA’s 777-300ERs are not that old though, so it will be a while before they need to be replaced. I definently could see the 777-9 replacing the aging 777-200ERs on both AA and UA though.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 2:42 am
by ADrum23
Boeing778X wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:
Forgive me if this has already been asked, but what are the chances any of the US3 order the 777-8 of 777-9?


Maybe AA, in the next decade, could get the 777-9. DL, no, and I'm not convinced UA would themselves.

No 777-8 for the US3s.

I'd also add AC as a potential customer.


Agree about DL since they seem to be anti-Boeing right now. But I do think at least the 777-9 has a future at both AA and UA. They will need to replace their aging 777-200ERs soon.

And dare I say it, I could even see UA getting a few 777-8’s for some of those ultra long-haul flights like HOU-SYD. Heck, they could even do EWR-SYD with a 777-8. Not saying it’s likely, but it’s possible.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 3:08 am
by Stitch
ADrum23 wrote:
AA and UA’s 777-300ERs are not that old though, so it will be a while before they need to be replaced. I definently could see the 777-9 replacing the aging 777-200ERs on both AA and UA though.


The 777-9 is a significant upgauge for a 777-200ER. Those replacements will be A350-900s and 787-9/787-10 IMO.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:02 am
by seabosdca
I agree that there is no need for 777-8 for any U.S. airline. (The ULH routes that U.S. airlines fly will be handled fine by some combination of A350-900 and 787-9.)

Any order for 777-9 will be a long way in the future. It's a VLA by historic standards, and the immediate unfilled replacement needs are for smaller widebodies. DL's most urgent fleet issue is replacing 767 capacity (partly but not fully done by the upcoming 339 order), and I think the next widebody order will be a contest between 787s and more 339s. UA is also studying 763 replacement right now, and I'd expect some combination of the 787 and any Boeing MOM to have the edge. For AA, the most urgent need will be 772 replacement. Either a recommitment to the 359 order or a further order for 789 seems most likely. Closer to the 777-9's sandbox, UA and AA both just bought new, shiny 777-300ER fleets that won't need replacement until the 2030s.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 2:04 pm
by Balerit
Looks like a CF6 on steroids. :)

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:53 pm
by KarelXWB
According to https://twitter.com/lufthansaNews/statu ... 6269845504 the first 777-9 test plane will eventually be delivered to Lufthansa in 2021.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:10 pm
by N14AZ
WIederling wrote:
N14AZ wrote:
That being said, I just realised the wheels of the 737’s nose gear are missing.

See the legs?
There is someone standing in the wheel well holding the nose up atlas style.:-)

( afaics the nose wheel is just of the image border?)

OMG, I should have known better. Thanks for the explanation (someone standing in the gear well (obviously not a 777-fan...), NLG outside the picture...

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:36 pm
by trijetsonly
KarelXWB wrote:
According to https://twitter.com/lufthansaNews/statu ... 6269845504 the first 777-9 test plane will eventually be delivered to Lufthansa in 2021.


We all know what happened to the last Boeing test plane that was supposed to be delivered to Lufthansa...
Let's hope that it is going to be better this time.
At least we may have a test frame in LH colours flying around before the actual first delivery.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:53 pm
by Jayafe
KarelXWB wrote:
According to https://twitter.com/lufthansaNews/statu ... 6269845504 the first 777-9 test plane will eventually be delivered to Lufthansa in 2021.


I bet +50% discount over the already 50% discounted price. And still sounds like a scam carrying on with a terrible (or potentially worse) teen.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:57 pm
by mjoelnir
trijetsonly wrote:
KarelXWB wrote:
According to https://twitter.com/lufthansaNews/statu ... 6269845504 the first 777-9 test plane will eventually be delivered to Lufthansa in 2021.


We all know what happened to the last Boeing test plane that was supposed to be delivered to Lufthansa...
Let's hope that it is going to be better this time.
At least we may have a test frame in LH colours flying around before the actual first delivery.


The last test frame, the 747-8i, did not meet the contracted specifications according to LH.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 3:07 pm
by Polot
Jayafe wrote:
KarelXWB wrote:
According to https://twitter.com/lufthansaNews/statu ... 6269845504 the first 777-9 test plane will eventually be delivered to Lufthansa in 2021.


I bet +50% discount over the already 50% discounted price. And still sounds like a scam carrying on with a terrible (or potentially worse) teen.

How exactly is selling the first aircraft to a customer instead of keeping it a scam? There is zero logic or thought in your statement.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 11:08 pm
by WIederling
Polot wrote:
Jayafe wrote:
KarelXWB wrote:
According to https://twitter.com/lufthansaNews/statu ... 6269845504 the first 777-9 test plane will eventually be delivered to Lufthansa in 2021.


I bet +50% discount over the already 50% discounted price. And still sounds like a scam carrying on with a terrible (or potentially worse) teen.

How exactly is selling the first aircraft to a customer instead of keeping it a scam? There is zero logic or thought in your statement.


program accounting _is_ a kind of ( locally legal ) scam.
Selling a testframe moves it from R&D&T to Line Production.

Ever thought about why Boeing has spent vast amounts of money and energy ( and binding man power to no end )
to turn the terrible teens from expensive lawndarts into merchandise ( peddled real cheap) ?
.. instead of scrapping them for parts and and putting that "released" energy into improving production and then producing "better" frames with much less effort early on? Lots of problems that Boeing festering early on where to a part caused by the imperatives of program accounting.
( they also were sure to sell all intial testing frames and thus move the related outlay into deferred cost.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:20 am
by Polot
WIederling wrote:
Polot wrote:
Jayafe wrote:

I bet +50% discount over the already 50% discounted price. And still sounds like a scam carrying on with a terrible (or potentially worse) teen.

How exactly is selling the first aircraft to a customer instead of keeping it a scam? There is zero logic or thought in your statement.


program accounting _is_ a kind of ( locally legal ) scam.
Selling a testframe moves it from R&D&T to Line Production.

Ever thought about why Boeing has spent vast amounts of money and energy ( and binding man power to no end )
to turn the terrible teens from expensive lawndarts into merchandise ( peddled real cheap) ?
.. instead of scrapping them for parts and and putting that "released" energy into improving production and then producing "better" frames with much less effort early on? Lots of problems that Boeing festering early on where to a part caused by the imperatives of program accounting.
( they also were sure to sell all intial testing frames and thus move the related outlay into deferred cost.


That doesn't make it a scam. It is very hard to label something a "scam" when the company is being completely honest and upfront about what they are doing. You and others may not agree with program accounting but it does not hide the costs at all to anyone putting in the effort to look (which is why we are able to talk about it so much here on A.net, while we, for example, know nothing about what the actual A380 program costs are). Boeing selling prototypes is not new, and did not start with the 787. May I remind you that the very first 777 built is currently flying around for CX.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 4:34 am
by par13del
WIederling wrote:

.. instead of scrapping them for parts and and putting that "released" energy into improving production and then producing "better" frames with much less effort early on?

I guess you never noticed that Boeing essentially abandoned those frames and had them sitting for years while they worked to resolve their production and design issues, once they had a good handle on those they went back at them spent time and resources making them customer ready versus just using them just for scrap.
We get that Program Accounting is straight from hell, but really, now selling test frames is a scam...

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:24 am
by travelhound
par13del wrote:
WIederling wrote:

.. instead of scrapping them for parts and and putting that "released" energy into improving production and then producing "better" frames with much less effort early on?

I guess you never noticed that Boeing essentially abandoned those frames and had them sitting for years while they worked to resolve their production and design issues, once they had a good handle on those they went back at them spent time and resources making them customer ready versus just using them just for scrap.
We get that Program Accounting is straight from hell, but really, now selling test frames is a scam...


Considering Boeing is all things evil, it's a logical conclusion.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 10:01 am
by neutrino
par13del wrote:
We get that Program Accounting is straight from hell, but really, now selling test frames is a scam...


travelhound wrote:
Considering Boeing is all things evil, it's a logical conclusion.


From "a certain point of view", ie that poster's point of view.
Be kind and at least humor him by giving him the benefit of the doubt.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 4:20 pm
by KarelXWB
First flight of the GE9X engine is delayed after discovering a minor design issue. GE has yet to determine when flight tests will begin.

Boeing 777X Engine Flight Test Facing Delay

General Electric Aviation has been forced to delay first flight of the GE9X engine for Boeing’s 777X flagship program after the late discovery of a minor design issue with the new turbofan as well as maintenance-related problems with the CF6 engines powering the company’s 747-400 flying testbed.

However, GE says the slip does not jeopardize the schedule for the overall engine certification program or the first flight of the 777X, which is targeted for around February 2019. “We are working with Boeing to protect the schedule,” says the engine-maker. GE, which originally hoped to fly the GE9X for the first time at the end of December, still aims to clinch certification in early 2019 but says it has yet to determine exactly when flight tests will begin.


For people with a more technical background, this is the issue:

The GE9X issue is related to the lever arms that actuate the rows of variable stator vanes (VSV) that modulate flow through the 11-stage high-pressure compressor (HPC). “The GE9X team had a test finding in the HPC during a demonstrator engine test late last year,” says the engine-maker. “After analyzing the engine data, the team determined that the lever arms for the VSVs need to be changed.” The company adds that while the configuration will be changed for the production engine, a decision is still pending on whether flight tests can at least get underway with the existing VSVs arrangement on the test engine, which was delivered late last year to GE’s test site in Victorville, California.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 5:59 pm
by estorilm
WIederling wrote:
KarelXWB wrote:
First flight of the GE9X engine is delayed after ....
General Electric Aviation has been forced to delay first flight of the GE9X engine for Boeing’s 777X flagship program after the late discovery of a minor design issue with the new turbofan as well as maintenance-related problems with the CF6 engines powering the company’s 747-400 flying testbed.

However, GE says the slip does not jeopardize ................


For people with a more technical background, this is the issue:

The GE9X issue...................


The second quote is about as unconducive as the initial news bite. ( Not your doing KarelXWB ... )

Is it a functional issue ( like too much play in the system, ... ) or a certification issue ( unsave failure mode ) .


Does anyone else find this slightly frustrating (perhaps even alarming) considering this engine was first run almost two years ago?!

I wouldn't usually say this (and I'm familiar with the massive / constant modifications engines undergo, especially new designs) however something like the VSV levers would seem rather straight-forward. I mean I know the people working on these things are literally rocket scientists, but I always thought the design of the -9X was VERY mature. Didn't really see something like this coming.

If it doesn't jeopardize any significant dates or certifications I'm sure it's a non-issue, but still an observation nonetheless.

In any event, this seems to be a spectacular engine and in general, it seems GE is up to the task of delivering on some really impressive numbers (from SFC to fan diameter, pressure ratios, etc - even development times).

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 6:43 pm
by par13del
estorilm wrote:

Does anyone else find this slightly frustrating (perhaps even alarming) considering this engine was first run almost two years ago?!

....at least they have identified an issue before deployment, it will be more important to see what if any issues arise after deployment onto the test and certification a/c ie. the 777X

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 7:26 pm
by Sooner787
How in the world are they going to hang that massive engine on a 747 for flight tests?

Seems they would want a C-17 just to address ground clearance issues?

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 7:54 pm
by OldAeroGuy
Sooner787 wrote:
How in the world are they going to hang that massive engine on a 747 for flight tests?

Seems they would want a C-17 just to address ground clearance issues?


There's a picture of the GE9 mounted on a 747 in this article.

http://airsoc.com/articles/view/id/5a1d ... 47-testbed

It's obvious they missed the first flight date though. I was wondering why.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 8:27 pm
by Stitch
estorilm wrote:
Does anyone else find this slightly frustrating (perhaps even alarming) considering this engine was first run almost two years ago?!


The GE-9X pressure ratio is over 45% higher than that on the GE90 so it sounds like it is something more fatigue-based that occurred over time rather than an immediate failure.


OldAeroGuy wrote:
It's obvious they missed the first flight date though. I was wondering why.


It was noted a few replies up-thread. Issue with the design of the variable stator vanes in the HPC.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 8:33 am
by Miquel787
What i really like to hear is the sound of the GE9X..GE posted some video.s testrunning the engine but always with stupid music under it..I want enginesound! I bet it won.t be that different from the 115B..Still hope for that deep massive sound like the 115B..One of the finest enginesounds in my opinion..

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 9:56 am
by LoganTheBogan
Miquel787 wrote:
What i really like to hear is the sound of the GE9X..GE posted some video.s testrunning the engine but always with stupid music under it..I want enginesound! I bet it won.t be that different from the 115B..Still hope for that deep massive sound like the 115B..One of the finest enginesounds in my opinion..


I reckon it will sound like a GEnx but a tad louder and perhaps with a bit of a groan.

Re: Boeing 777X - Updated Information And Developments

Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 3:04 pm
by b777900
When will the b777900 start flying?