WS Seasonally Adds YYC-HNL/OGG

ua2162 · Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:33 pm

http://www.bizjournals.com/pacific/b...anadas-westjet-plans-seasonal.html

Fair use excerpt:

"WestJet said it has leased two Boeing 737-200 aircraft from Thomas Cook Airlines for the flights, which are scheduled to start Dec. 13 and run through April 26, 2014.

Pending regulatory approval, the flights between Calgary and Honolulu International Airport will operate twice a week, while the flights between Calgary and Maui will operate four times a week. The flights between Edmonton and Maui will operate three times a week."

It's gonna be really hard serving these markets with the equipment their leasing from Thomas Cook

Viscount724 · Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:40 pm

Quoting UA2162 (Thread starter):
WestJet said it has leased two Boeing 737-200 aircraft from Thomas Cook Airlines for the flights, which are scheduled to start Dec. 13 and run through April 26, 2014.

Assume you mean 757-200, not 737-200. This is nothing new. WS has done this in previous years.

steex · Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:46 pm

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 1):
Assume you mean 757-200, not 737-200. This is nothing new. WS has done this in previous years.

That would certainly have to be the case, though the mistake belongs to the Pacific Business News rather than the OP.

drgmobile · Fri Jul 26, 2013 3:03 pm

This must be an arrangement that works well for them, but you gotta think once the rollout of Encore is further a long they will consider a more permanent approach. After all, the aircraft could be deployed to some European routes for the summer.

rikkus67 · Fri Jul 26, 2013 5:09 pm

It'd be great to see a 752 in full WS lvery...

Whiteguy · Fri Jul 26, 2013 5:35 pm

Quoting rikkus67 (Reply 4):
It'd be great to see a 752 in full WS lvery...

They'll probably stay in full Thomas Cook colors.

What would be great is if they got they're own aircraft to do these routes instead of bringing foreign aircraft and pilots. Ironic since they've complained about Sunwing doing this.

c172akula · Fri Jul 26, 2013 6:19 pm

Quoting rikkus67 (Reply 4):
It'd be great to see a 752 in full WS lvery...

I think the first year they did this one of the tails at least had WestJet painted on it (that may have been when they first leased from North American). However last year it was just the Thomas Cook livery on both.

saloman · Fri Jul 26, 2013 6:53 pm

Quoting C172Akula (Reply 6):
I think the first year they did this one of the tails at least had WestJet painted on it (that may have been when they first leased from North American). However last year it was just the Thomas Cook livery on both.

That was the North American bird. Pic here:
https://www.airliners.net/photo/WestJ...d=145028940cbde5471e1209ea2c3292b8

Hawaiian763 · Sat Jul 27, 2013 3:44 am

Quoting drgmobile (Reply 3):

The 757's work pretty good for Hawaii flights, not so sure it would be good for Europe flights, they would need to have something larger leased out to them. Leisure flights to Europe out of YYC are already well covered by TS so not sure WestJet wants to jump into that market quite yet.

WS does need a more permanent solution to their Alberta-Hawaii flights, maybe investing in something that has more range. Could the 739ER or the new 737MAX be the solution to that dilemma?

IndianicWorld · Sat Jul 27, 2013 9:35 am

Is HNL a less popular destination from those 2 cities?

Maui has higher frequencies which raised that question, unless there's another reason for that.

Whiteguy · Sat Jul 27, 2013 1:58 pm

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 9):

Is HNL a less popular destination from those 2 cities?

Maui has higher frequencies which raised that question, unless there's another reason for that.

Yields are lot lower to HNL.

So far it looks like AC may only be operating to OGG the winter, 4x per week. No HNL at all this winter. Last winter they operated about 5 flights to HNL around Xmas. Also one of the daily flights from YVR has been dropped, only 6x per week now.

Hawaiian763 · Sat Jul 27, 2013 2:31 pm

Quoting whiteguy (Reply 10):

I'm not surprised to see the reduction in the flights to Hawaii with AC. In the past it was one of the only options Canadians had other than connecting through the US mainland. But now we have way more options, especially with WS now flying to all the major Hawaiian Islands (sometimes twice a day from YVR) and with much better flight times. Why should I fly on a red eye flight home and pay $25 for my first bag when I can fly on the same day with WS in both directions, get my first bag free and get great service from the flight attendants? I foresee Hawaii service with AC disappearing completely soon and WS overtaking all Canada-Hawaii service.

Whiteguy · Sat Jul 27, 2013 2:59 pm

Quoting hawaiian763 (Reply 11):
I'm not surprised to see the reduction in the flights to Hawaii with AC. In the past it was one of the only options Canadians had other than connecting through the US mainland. But now we have way more options, especially with WS now flying to all the major Hawaiian Islands (sometimes twice a day from YVR) and with much better flight times. Why should I fly on a red eye flight home and pay $25 for my first bag when I can fly on the same day with WS in both directions, get my first bag free and get great service from the flight attendants? I foresee Hawaii service with AC disappearing completely soon and WS overtaking all Canada-Hawaii service.

I'm guessing if you don't want to pay the $25 bag fee you wouldn't pay the extra $50 it cost to fly home during the day on WJ.....

I like the red eye flights, gives you a whole extra day on the beach.

We flew AC last winter to Hawaii and back, paid the $25 baggage fee and still paid about $500 less than what WJ was offering at the time. Service was great and the FAs were awesome.

I think the Hawaii service will be around for a long time and may increase in the future. Rumor is that Rouge will take over in the winter of 2014. We'll see I guess.

c172akula · Sat Jul 27, 2013 3:36 pm

Quoting whiteguy (Reply 12):
I like the red eye flights, gives you a whole extra day on the beach.

This x1000.

Also as a traveler with 2 young children I will continue to choose AC for my YYC-OGG flights just for the extra space on the 763's to walk around with the kids. Those galley spaces are a lifesaver to let them roam a little when they are cranky.

Until WS has their own fleet operating YYC-OGG I'm not booking them for the non-stop, don't want to risk the bird going mechanical and losing time on my vacation. Knowing my luck I wouldn't be one of the lucky ones getting stuck in Maui waiting to come home.

Booking with AC gives me many more options should that non-stop bird go tech to get there pretty quick.

Viscount724 · Sat Jul 27, 2013 8:25 pm

Quoting hawaiian763 (Reply 11):
Why should I fly on a red eye flight home

Many people like the redeye flights home as it gives them another day on the beach. It also maximizes connectivity to the rest of your network.

[Edited 2013-07-27 13:26:26]

CO764 · Sat Jul 27, 2013 9:17 pm

Just for fun :

Could a 732 with a light load come close to YYC-Hawaii? Using Wikipedia and Great Circle Mapper, I've determined that fully loaded, the Advanced version would be about 500 miles short, and the "normal" version 900 miles short. Say there were 50 passengers aboard, could an 732 Advanced make it?

Viscount724 · Sat Jul 27, 2013 10:06 pm

Quoting CO764 (Reply 15):
Just for fun :

Could a 732 with a light load come close to YYC-Hawaii? Using Wikipedia and Great Circle Mapper, I've determined that fully loaded, the Advanced version would be about 500 miles short, and the "normal" version 900 miles short. Say there were 50 passengers aboard, could an 732 Advanced make it?

YYC-HNL is well beyond 732 capability even with a light load. Also have to consider that YYC is 3,557 ft. above sea level.

CP operated the 732 Adv YUL-YVR nonstop and the aircraft normally used on those flights were several 732s modified with an extra fuel tank in the cargo compartment (known as 732ER). YYC-HNL is over 700 nm further than YUL-YVR. The standard 732Adv without the extra tanks could handle YYZ-YVR most of the time unless winds were very strong.

YYZ-YVR 1811 nm
YUL-YVR 1994 nm
YYC-HNL 2716 nm

Whiteguy · Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:00 am

Quoting CO764 (Reply 15):
Just for fun :

Could a 732 with a light load come close to YYC-Hawaii? Using Wikipedia and Great Circle Mapper, I've determined that fully loaded, the Advanced version would be about 500 miles short, and the "normal" version 900 miles short. Say there were 50 passengers aboard, could an 732 Advanced make it?

Also for fun, why does a B732 have anything to do with this? No one operates them anymore.

WJ actually started this route using the B73W. The flights were capped at around 100 pax depending on the winds. The funny thing WJ did was charge pax a fee to gaurentee an empty seat beside them. Great, right? What they didn't tell them was the seat went empty anyway due to weight reatrictions. Ingenious!

A346Dude · Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:11 am

Quoting whiteguy (Reply 17):
Also for fun, why does a B732 have anything to do with this? No one operates them anymore.

Because the original article erroneously quotes 732s being used for this route. Also multiple operators in Canada operate 732s in scheduled pax service.

opethfan · Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:19 am

If these 757s are anything like the one I took from JTR-LGW a few months back, you'd have to pay me to step onboard.

IndianicWorld · Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:44 am

Quoting whiteguy (Reply 10):
Yields are lot lower to HNL.

Thanks for that info. Makes sense.

Viscount724 · Sun Jul 28, 2013 11:35 pm

Quoting whiteguy (Reply 17):
WJ actually started this route using the B73W. The flights were capped at around 100 pax depending on the winds.

Didn't WS originally use the 73G for YYC-HNL due to its longer range?

Quoting A346Dude (Reply 18):
Quoting whiteguy (Reply 17):
Also for fun, why does a B732 have anything to do with this? No one operates them anymore.

Because the original article erroneously quotes 732s being used for this route. Also multiple operators in Canada operate 732s in scheduled pax service.

There are currently at least 25 732s (including 17 732 combis) registered in Canada with 6 operators, including 4 scheduled carriers (Canadian North, First Air, Air North, Air Inuit), 1 charter carrier (Nolinor), and 1 mining company (Xstrata Canada).

Whiteguy · Mon Jul 29, 2013 1:47 am

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 21):
Quoting whiteguy (Reply 17):
WJ actually started this route using the B73W. The flights were capped at around 100 pax depending on the winds.

Didn't WS originally use the 73G for YYC-HNL due to its longer range?

As far as I know it was B737-700 that operated to start, are those the 73G or 73W?

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 21):
Quoting A346Dude (Reply 18):
Quoting whiteguy (Reply 17):
Also for fun, why does a B732 have anything to do with this? No one operates them anymore.

Because the original article erroneously quotes 732s being used for this route. Also multiple operators in Canada operate 732s in scheduled pax service.

There are currently at least 25 732s (including 17 732 combis) registered in Canada with 6 operators, including 4 scheduled carriers (Canadian North, First Air, Air North, Air Inuit), 1 charter carrier (Nolinor), and 1 mining company (Xstrata Canada).

Yeah sorry, there are still operators of the B732. Not quite sure what I was thinking when I wrote that.

Viscount724 · Mon Jul 29, 2013 7:13 pm

Quoting whiteguy (Reply 22):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 21):
Quoting whiteguy (Reply 17):
WJ actually started this route using the B73W. The flights were capped at around 100 pax depending on the winds.

Didn't WS originally use the 73G for YYC-HNL due to its longer range?

As far as I know it was B737-700 that operated to start, are those the 73G or 73W?

73G = 737-700.

WS Seasonally Adds YYC-HNL/OGG

WS Seasonally Adds YYC-HNL/OGG

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