rwy04lga
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Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:19 pm

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...crawl-plane-wearing-best-suit.html

I sure hope this really didn't happen the way they say it did.
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SonomaFlyer
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:37 pm

We'll need to confirm the size of the a/c at ACK. Per the DL website booking process, it looks like an ERJ 145 with 50 seats which means there must be access to/from the a/c for persons with disabilities. If that is correct, DL has some 'splaining to do.
 
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mayor
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:51 pm

Interesting how one of the commenters states that they saw a video of him in 2009, dancing and walking around, when it's stated that he was paralyzed in 2000. Do I detect the smell of old fish, here?


The sad part is, that we will probably never hear the other side of the story. I certainly hope there is one.
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b727fa
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:59 pm

I don't buy it for a second.
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A346Dude
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 5:07 pm

I can pretty confidently claim this would never happen as stated at any airport in North America.
You know the gear is up and locked when it takes full throttle to taxi to the terminal.
 
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mayor
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 5:11 pm

Maybe it's time for DL's legal department to go after the Daily Mail.

Quoting A346Dude (Reply 4):
I can pretty confidently claim this would never happen as stated at any airport in North America.

I agree. I can't imagine something like this happening, anywhere, under any circumstances.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
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speedbored
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 5:19 pm

I'm pretty sure that this is a true story ...

... as far as "Paralysed man sues Delta Airlines".

As for the rest of the headline - can't see it being anywhere near the truth. I have seen quite a few unhelpful airline employees, all over the world, but I can't believe that everyone in the area at the time would have just left a severely disabled person to get off the aircraft on their own. Surely things haven't got THAT bad yet?
 
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 5:27 pm

Quoting Speedbored (Reply 6):
Surely things haven't got THAT bad yet?

I'd sure hope not. I'm guessing DL would release a statement shortly if this whole thing is bogus.
 
ghifty
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 6:47 pm

Isn't the Daily Mail known for sensationalism/bad journalism?

Quoting Speedbored (Reply 6):
Surely things haven't got THAT bad yet?

Pardon my ignorance, but have things been getting bad at DL, or something?  
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brilondon
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 6:53 pm

I smell lawyer here and the stench is really bad.
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usflyer msp
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 6:54 pm

Until an independent witness comes forward that can verify this incident, I call BS on this....
 
thekennady
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:04 pm

Find this extremely hard to beleive, if so his best suit got the worst of it though. Lol.
 
shufflemoomin
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:09 pm

If you hear of a story that's almost unbelievable and you see that it comes from the Daily Mail, ignore it and move on. That's almost ALWAYS the best course of action. I'm not even going to bother giving them the traffic by clicking the link to the obviously bogus story.
 
Maverick623
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:09 pm

If this were reported anywhere but the Daily Mail, I'd think it could have happened.


Not a chance. I smell a libel suit coming their way.
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mjoelnir
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:09 pm

 
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speedbored
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:14 pm

Quoting ghifty (Reply 8):
Pardon my ignorance, but have things been getting bad at DL, or something?

I haven't the faintest idea, having not flown with Delta for at least 5 years.

If you read what I've actually written, instead of inferring some sinister hidden meaning, you'll see that I am not referring specifically to Delta but to "unhelpful airline employees, all over the world" in general.

Every airline has some. Fortunately, not that many, especially if you treat them like human beings (which too many passengers seem to be unable to do these days).
 
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Tigerguy
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:20 pm

http://www.courthousenews.com/2013/07/25/59679.htm

Here's a link with a few more details. Even so, I have trouble believing that this happened exactly as the man says...

Also, regarding the fight number, would that have been Pinnacle or Expressjet/ASA?
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mjoelnir
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:36 pm

Quoting Tigerguy (Reply 16):

http://www.courthousenews.com/2013/07/25/59679.htm

Here's a link with a few more details. Even so, I have trouble believing that this happened exactly as the man says...

Also, regarding the fight number, would that have been Pinnacle or Expressjet/ASA?

Everybody putting this down as "daily mail story" can stop and start to take this seriously.
It is all over the news now.
And regarding not having heard the other side, some of the papers state that Delta declined to comment.
 
XFSUgimpLB41X
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:53 pm

Quoting Tigerguy (Reply 16):
http://www.courthousenews.com/2013/07/25/59679.htm

Here's a link with a few more details. Even so, I have trouble believing that this happened exactly as the man says...

Also, regarding the fight number, would that have been Pinnacle or Expressjet/ASA?

That article states that "Delta's slogan is 'Delta is ready when you are.'"

What?? How long ago was that?
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johns624
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 8:32 pm

The last video in the Daily Mail link shows him standing and walking with a cane.
 
usflyer msp
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 8:37 pm

Quoting johns624 (Reply 19):
The last video in the Daily Mail link shows him standing and walking with a cane.

When I google this guy's name I cannot find one picture of him in a wheelchair or any other indication that he is disabled? I would think after 13 years, there would be something. Hmm....


(On a side note, who names themselves DreamingBear?)
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 8:44 pm

Quoting A346Dude (Reply 4):
I can pretty confidently claim this would never happen as stated at any airport in North America.

Except in the U.S. where some states have a disproportianal number of "Ambulance Chasing" lawyers, where the "Tort Lottery" is another get rich quick scheme advertised on daytime TV.

[Edited 2013-07-28 13:59:10]
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RussianJet
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 8:56 pm

Quoting ghifty (Reply 8):
Isn't the Daily Mail known for sensationalism/bad journalism?

Yes, on a grotesquely huge scale. Some stories have a kernel of truth to them, but this one sounds like bilge water.
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727LOVER
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 9:14 pm

I'm curious....why does the headline say this:
Paralysed man sues Delta Airlines after he was forced to CRAWL down the stairs and across tarmac while crew did NOTHING

instead of this:
Paralysed man sues Delta Airlines after he claims he was forced to CRAWL down the stairs and across tarmac while crew did NOTHING


I think the UK media is even worse than the garbage here in the US
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kgaiflyer
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 9:27 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 22):
Quoting ghifty (Reply 8):Isn't the Daily Mail known for sensationalism/bad journalism?

Yes, on a grotesquely huge scale. Some stories have a kernel of truth to them, but this one sounds like bilge water.

So much so that that it's become to butt of jokes and the subject of parodies.

Quoting usflyer msp (Reply 10):
Until an independent witness comes forward that can verify this incident, I call BS on this....

Huffington wouldn't touch it with a ten-foot-pole if there wasn't a kernel of truth somewhere.

The Daily Mail article looks as slick as a theatrical presentation. OTOH, it's unusual for someone with five books in publication to have such a small publicity footprint as this person.

Otherwise, what institution gave him a professorship with only a Master's?

[Edited 2013-07-28 14:35:26]
 
Motorhussy
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 10:35 pm

Quoting mayor (Reply 5):
Maybe it's time for DL's legal department to go after the Daily Mail.
Quoting ghifty (Reply 8):
Isn't the Daily Mail known for sensationalism/bad journalism?

I work for a reputable media outlet and we look to the DailyMail (online) for light entertainment. Always useful to see what spurious spin they put on real stories. While sensational, this story is not credible (in full).
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crj200faguy
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 10:41 pm

If it were ATL I would totally believe it. Where would the flight attendant have gotten cardboard to offer him?
 
brilondon
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 10:42 pm

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 14):
http://consumerist.com/2008/07/29/de...uscular-dystrophy-crawl-off-plane/

That is another case from 2008.
Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 17):
Everybody putting this down as "daily mail story" can stop and start to take this seriously.
It is all over the news now.
And regarding not having heard the other side, some of the papers state that Delta declined to comment.

And we can all thank the Daily Mirror for our Elvis updates. Obviously DL will not comment if they are being sued. That is just following their lawyers advice. Only an idiot would start talking to the media when they are being sued.

The consumerist is a litigators mouthpiece and should also be taken with a grain of salt. I would like to see something from a respected publication not just blogs or websites with an agenda.
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nws2002
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 11:00 pm

I bet he was told to sit and wait while the aisle chair and staff were found. If this was an ERJ, there was only one flight attendant and they would need ground staff to help move him from the seat to the aisle chair. If there was going to be a delay the crew may have asked him is he would prefer to walk with his cane instead of waiting.
 
mjoelnir
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Sun Jul 28, 2013 11:03 pm

Quoting brilondon (Reply 27):
The consumerist is a litigators mouthpiece and should also be taken with a grain of salt. I would like to see something from a respected publication not just blogs or websites with an agenda.

The Huffington Post, Houston Chronicle, The Australian, do I need to go on?
 
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KGRB
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 3:12 am

Quoting Tigerguy (Reply 16):
Also, regarding the fight number, would that have been Pinnacle or Expressjet/ASA?

The article does not state the flight number for the outbound trip, but 4245 is a Pinnacle flight number.
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cornutt
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 3:29 am

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 29):
The Huffington Post

Every bit as bad as the Daily Mail, if not worse.
 
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mayor
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:34 am

Quoting XFSUgimpLB41X (Reply 18):

That article states that "Delta's slogan is 'Delta is ready when you are.'"

Long before I retired in '05.

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 17):

Everybody putting this down as "daily mail story" can stop and start to take this seriously.
It is all over the news now.

But consider what they're using for their original source......the "Daily Mail". Considering the sorry state of journalism these days, you can bet they didn't do any backchecking, especially when it comes to airlines.
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737tdi
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:15 am

Quoting XFSUgimpLB41X (Reply 18):
That article states that "Delta's slogan is 'Delta is ready when you are.'"

What?? How long ago was that?




I don't know when it stopped but it was their slogan when I was a kid living in Dallas and that was around 1970. It actually was "Delta is ready when you are, Delta is ready to fly". I guess the only reason I remember it is it was kinda catchy the way it was sung.
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 6:43 am

Quoting sonomaflyer (Reply 7):
I'm guessing DL would release a statement shortly if this whole thing is bogus.

No, because...

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 17):
some of the papers state that Delta declined to comment

....it's standard for businesses to have policies where they do not comment on pending litigation.

Having said that, I highly doubt this story is true; or at very least, we're not getting the whole truth from the customer's side. Under the Air Carrier Access Act (14 CFR 382) every air carrier, at every station, is required to provide ramps and/or lifts to enable customers with disability access to the aircraft. If DL's were somehow unavailable, they would and could easily borrow from another carrier at that airport.

Also, if this happened, where was the CRO - both times?

Sorry, but this doesn't pass the smell test at all.
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Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
mjoelnir
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:45 am

It is again a typical a.net discussion when there is a passenger on one side and an airline on the other side.

OK some non reputable news papers carry this news, but that is no proof that is untrue.
But also some reputable news papers carry this news, that is ignored.

If the main point of this news is right, a handicapped person traveling, a wheelchair and lift was ordered on the way out and on the way home, the wheelchair and lift was not supplied, keep all the embellishment out, that is enough to be bad news for Delta.

No law forbids Delta to comment on this case, you often read statements of both the accuser as well as the defendant in court cases, that defendants in civil court have to keep quiet is a myth.

But when you make a deal, you can go for non disclosure, so the embarrassment stops there because you never have to comment.
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:14 am

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 35):
It is again a typical a.net discussion when there is a passenger on one side and an airline on the other side.

And once again, your comments seem to indicate you're ready to be judge, jury and executioner against the airline without having all the facts.

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 35):
If the main point of this news is right, a handicapped person traveling, a wheelchair and lift was ordered on the way out and on the way home, the wheelchair and lift was not supplied, keep all the embellishment out, that is enough to be bad news for Delta.

While I have no inside knowledge of this situation, the likely explanation is that there was a delay in getting the lift to the customer, he was advised of it, and chose not to wait. It happens occasionally; equipment sometimes doesn't cooperate, etc.

Yet in many of those "Forget it, I'll be fine" situations the customer later writes and complains that they were "not helped."

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 35):
No law forbids Delta to comment on this case

And yet common sense demands they not comment.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
mjoelnir
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 11:53 am

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 36):
And once again, your comments seem to indicate you're ready to be judge, jury and executioner against the airline without having all the facts.

It is always easy to call for all the facts knowing that the airline will not comment.

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 36):
While I have no inside knowledge of this situation, the likely explanation is that there was a delay in getting the lift to the customer, he was advised of it, and chose not to wait. It happens occasionally; equipment sometimes doesn't cooperate, etc.

Yet in many of those "Forget it, I'll be fine" situations the customer later writes and complains that they were "not helped."

I know the airline is always right, the pax is always wrong.
If the pax should realy be right, he is still wrong and a.net needs more information.

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 36):
And yet common sense demands they not comment.

Why? Usually the no comment helps in a sticky situation, and for me it is a sure sign that there is some trouble.
 
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RyanairGuru
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 12:07 pm

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 37):
Usually the no comment helps in a sticky situation, and for me it is a sure sign that there is some trouble

Sorry mjoelnr, in the USA, indeed most Western countries, "no comment" is basically the only thing you can say to the media unless you planted the story yourself. Anything else can be twisted against you.

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 29):
The Australian, do I need to go on

Out of interest, are you able to link The Australian article? I have an online subscription and can't find it. Either I'm being stupid, or it has been removed.

[Edited 2013-07-29 05:07:46]
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mjoelnir
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 1:05 pm

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 38):
Sorry mjoelnr, in the USA, indeed most Western countries, "no comment" is basically the only thing you can say to the media unless you planted the story yourself. Anything else can be twisted against you

You need of course the no comment when you want to make a deal with a non disclosure agreement.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 38):
Out of interest, are you able to link The Australian article? I have an online subscription and can't find it. Either I'm being stupid, or it has been removed.

Yesterday the australian came up in a search on google I can not find it today, and a search on the australien does not give a result.

but here it is from the history of the browser

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/trav...light/story-e6frg8ro-1226687204623

Some other

Houston Chronicle
http://www.chron.com/news/houston-te...paralyzed-man-to-crawl-4689616.php

News.Com.AU
http://www.news.com.au/travel/news/d...light/story-e6frfq80-1226687204623
 
ferengi80
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:07 pm

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 23):
I think the UK media is even worse than the garbage here in the US

That's a bit of a generic quote, 727Lover. Yes, the Daily Mail is the worst of the worst as far as UK media is concerned and I personally wouldn't use it as toilet paper, however the UK media as a whole is considerably better than this, far more balanced and nowhere near as far-right and xenophobic as the Daily Mail. Funnily enough, a quick Google search shows the Daily Mail to be the only UK media outlet reporting this - which makes me think the rest of the British media have looked this through and realised there is probably more to this than is being reported. My first question would be why the hell did he do it? If if were me and I were unable to get off the plane without assistance, I would have stayed put until the airline sorted something. This is certainly very one sided and I would love to hear Delta's side of this.
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clickhappy
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:16 pm

I am surprised there is no video or still pictures of this (alleged) event. Given the proliferation of camera phones and other recording devices I am sure the other passengers, the ones mentioned in the article who watched but did not offer to help, would have filmed the event in disbelief. Same with the passengers inside the terminal.

[Edited 2013-07-29 14:16:41]
 
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mayor
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Tue Jul 30, 2013 4:50 am

Makes me wonder why we never heard of this last fall, when it allegedly happened? Why did we not hear about it until the lawsuit was filed? All this makes me think the whole thing is a bunch of crap and the fact that Delta has "no comment" is probably because they'd like to do some research on it before they say something, if anything. Also, it's normal for a corporation to keep mum on something, especially when it's in court.
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LoneStarMike
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Tue Jul 30, 2013 5:09 am

If the Daily Mail article is true, then why this?

Quote:
Once he returned home, Mr. Kanaan says Delta offered him 25,000 'sky miles' and a $100 voucher.

LoneStarMike
 
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mayor
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Tue Jul 30, 2013 5:12 am

Quoting LoneStarMike (Reply 43):
If the Daily Mail article is true, then why this?

Quote:
Once he returned home, Mr. Kanaan says Delta offered him 25,000 'sky miles' and a $100 voucher.

Which makes me think that IF anything did occur, it wasn't nearly as bad as we're hearing.......25K miles and a $100 voucher really isn't all that much, especially considering what is supposed to have happened.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
GUYAIR707
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Tue Jul 30, 2013 5:16 am

My brother is in a wheelchair and NEVER had to crawl out of an aircraft, in North or South America or the Caribbean. He is lifted off if the a/c chair cannot be accessed.

GUYAIR707
 
Maverick623
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:03 am

Quoting LoneStarMike (Reply 43):
If the Daily Mail article is true, then why this?

Quote:
Once he returned home, Mr. Kanaan says Delta offered him 25,000 'sky miles' and a $100 voucher.

LoneStarMike

That's pretty typical anytime a Part 182 complaint is filed, regardless of the merits of the complaint.
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cornutt
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Tue Jul 30, 2013 5:40 pm

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 35):
No law forbids Delta to comment on this case, you often read statements of both the accuser as well as the defendant in court cases, that defendants in civil court have to keep quiet is a myth.

In the U.S., it's absolutely essential. Absolutely anything you say prior to trial, up to an including "nice day, isn't it?" can and will be used against you in court. If you deny that the incident occurred the way it happened, a plaintiff lawyer will say in court, "see, this proves how heartless the big bad corporation is!" and the jackpot jury feels even more justified in awarding hundreds of millions of dollars. Or worse yet, you will face criminal charges for "obstruction of justice". Civil lawsuits in the U.S. are essentially a legalized form of piracy. The only thing you can do is try to minimize the possibility of the pirates noticing you.

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 35):
OK some non reputable news papers carry this news, but that is no proof that is untrue.
But also some reputable news papers carry this news, that is ignored

I can guarantee you that the "reputable" outlets are simply repeating the Daily Mail story, not doing their own research. I just today went through some Bing news results on a story of local interest here, and of five results, every single article was word-for-word identical.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:00 pm

Quoting GUYAIR707 (Reply 45):
My brother is in a wheelchair and NEVER had to crawl out of an aircraft, in North or South America or the Caribbean. He is lifted off if the a/c chair cannot be accessed.

I also have a wheelchair-bound family member, and our experiences (on a variety of carriers--including off the top of my head AA, DL, US and WN) have been nothing but positive. Numerous employees at all of these carriers have gone out of their way to help us out, even at some really tiny stations (e.g. LYH).

Quoting cornutt (Reply 47):
If you deny that the incident occurred the way it happened, a plaintiff lawyer will say in court, "see, this proves how heartless the big bad corporation is!" and the jackpot jury feels even more justified in awarding hundreds of millions of dollars.

What in the world are you talking about? In most lawsuits, the defendant denies liability. There's nothing untoward about it.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
737tdi
Posts: 1116
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 10:05 am

RE: Delta Makes Disabled Man Crawl Off Plane?

Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:05 pm

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 48):
I also have a wheelchair-bound family member, and our experiences (on a variety of carriers--including off the top of my head AA, DL, US and WN) have been nothing but positive




As an airline mech. I know that I assist even though it is not my job. I have assisted many times, even when non-revving. I just can't imagine not having the use of my legs so I try to be as helpful as possible to folks who don't. By the way, Rangers rock.

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