DL A330 Mods

audidudi · Fri Sep 06, 2013 4:33 pm

INTERIOR MODS:

A332 34J/32EC/168E
All Ships: 3351-3361 (11 Aircraft)
Completed or in mod: 3351, 3352*, 3353* = 3/11

A333 34J/32EC/227E
All Ships: 3301-3321 (21 Aircraft)
Completed or in mod: 3301, 3319* = 2/21

Total complete (2). In mod (3) indicated with *

[Edited 2013-09-06 10:27:40]

timf · Fri Sep 06, 2013 5:16 pm

3319 is in mods as well.

GSPSPOT · Fri Sep 06, 2013 7:05 pm

Forgive my asking, but what are the mods? From what I can remember, the NW/DL A330s already have at least competitive Economy accommodations and of course the old angled lie-flat seats up front. I would imagine they'll bump the BE seating up to current true lie-flat standards, but what else is being done/changed?

FlyASAGuy2005 · Fri Sep 06, 2013 7:10 pm

Quoting GSPSPOT (Reply 2):
Forgive my asking, but what are the mods? From what I can remember, the NW/DL A330s already have at least competitive Economy accommodations and of course the old angled lie-flat seats up front. I would imagine they'll bump the BE seating up to current true lie-flat standards, but what else is being done/changed?

The coach cabin is also getting a complete gutting to Delta spec. New carpets, new seats, sidewalls, reconfigured galley, updated AVOD system, etc.

Prost · Fri Sep 06, 2013 7:18 pm

Just about everything but the overhead bins and the lavatories is new.

PHX787 · Fri Sep 06, 2013 7:21 pm

Are they also completing D-Check on these frames as well (skin, avionics inspections, etc)

CRJ900 · Fri Sep 06, 2013 8:30 pm

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 3):
reconfigured galley

As in making them smaller or bigger? I find galley logistics fascinating and notice that galleys are becoming even smaller and more tightly packed on many aircraft even if the number of seats increase. Not much ergonomical consideration. Or is DL different?

Prost · Fri Sep 06, 2013 8:44 pm

Nope. No flight attendant was a fan of the A330 galleys in the original condition. There were doors that covered the carts, so that the carts were in a 'chiller'. The problem is, you'd have to open the chiller door, amd depending on where the cart was in that chiller, take the cart out a few inches to open the door and pull out a drawer. A complete hassle.

So most of us Flight Attendants thought "Anything would be better than what we have." And then we saw what wewere getting. *sigh*

My opinion is whoever designs galley on airplanes must have a flight attendant as an ex-wife/ex-husband/spurned lover.

DTWPurserBoy · Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:02 pm

Quoting GSPSPOT (Reply 2):
and of course the old angled lie-flat seats up front. I would imagine they'll bump the BE seating up to current true lie-flat standards, but what else is being done/changed?

They were never "angled" seats--they were the plastic pod-type BC seat.

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 6):
As in making them smaller or bigger? I find galley logistics fascinating and notice that galleys are becoming even smaller and more tightly packed on many aircraft even if the number of seats increase. Not much ergonomical consideration. Or is DL different?

The original forward galley was a terrible design with no counter workspace and by door 1R there was a unit that is as described above. It house one full length cart and 4 half carts and you were forever having to juggle things around to get what you needed.

Probably the dumbest thing was that this one unit houses not only a heavy duty chiller unit, but a bun warmer and coffeemaker that give off tremendous amounts of heat. It also holds the main computer that controls the AVOD system. Now anyone with even a basic knowledge of computers knows that they do not like to be subjected to huge swings in temperature. That poor system was constantly fighting to stay working with blasts of hot and cold air constantly dumped on it.

Now all BC food service is done from the #2 galley and the front is used for storage and beverages. The aft galley services the main cabin.

For some reason all of the liquid drains were located directly under the coffeemaker hot plates which mean that in order to dump a liquid you had to move the coffeepot,, close the unit (which has a terrible tendency to grab your knuckles), dump the liquid, then pull the drawer out with the hotplate.

Depending on the aircraft type, there are some good and some not so good galley designs. Most f/a's like the forward 767 galley very well. The MD88/90 are terrible, especially since they removed the aft galley totally and put in more seats. Eventually you just learn to work around the dysfunctional aspects to get the job done. We all develop little tricks and shortcuts to make life easier and then pass them on.

PITingres · Sat Sep 07, 2013 2:10 pm

Does this mod do away with the horrendous blockage underneath the window seats? I assume that it's some sort of IFE box? I've been trying to avoid the DL A330's because of that dratted thing, and it would be wonderful if the blockage is going away.

DTWPurserBoy · Sat Sep 07, 2013 11:52 pm

Quoting PITingres (Reply 9):
Does this mod do away with the horrendous blockage underneath the window seats? I assume that it's some sort of IFE box? I've been trying to avoid the DL A330's because of that dratted thing, and it would be wonderful if the blockage is going away.

It is indeed the brains of the IFE and no, it is not going away nor will it on other airlines. Ya gotta give a little to get a little. One problem we have always had is when people shove stuff under the seat and knock out the canon plugs disabling every seat behind them.

PITingres · Sun Sep 08, 2013 1:11 am

Bummer. It's remarkable how other types (e.g. the 757 that I occasionally fly to CDG) manage to do without it. I guess I'll just have to continue staying away from the DL A330's then.

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 10):
One problem we have always had is when people shove stuff under the seat and knock out the canon plugs disabling every seat behind them.

My response would be "well don't put the stupid things down there where they piss off passengers who are trying to fit their feet under the seat" but whatever.

rwy04lga · Sun Sep 08, 2013 1:31 am

Quoting PITingres (Reply 11):
My response would be "well don't put the stupid things down there where they piss off passengers who are trying to fit their feet under the seat" but whatever.

Are you sure that Delta is the only airline that places them there? Where else do you suggest they place them? There's not too many options.

FYI...they're machines...machines aren't stupid.

PITingres · Sun Sep 08, 2013 3:43 am

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 12):
Are you sure that Delta is the only airline that places them there? Where else do you suggest they place them?

I know that Delta isn't the only one; they are the only airline on which I'm likely to find myself on an A330, though, with my current travel patterns.

As to where else to put them, maybe wherever they are on the 757/767, which don't seem to have the same space intrusion, at least not under the window seats where I sit?

SXDFC · Sun Sep 08, 2013 5:16 am

Anyone have any pictures of the finished product of these mods on the A330?

CONTACREW · Sun Sep 08, 2013 6:00 am

Quoting SXDFC (Reply 14):
Anyone have any pictures of the finished product of these mods on the A330?

Courtesy of a poster over on flyertalk.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/20614530-post88.html

I believe someone here also has pics of the Y cabin but don't know what thread it would be in.

DTWPurserBoy · Sun Sep 08, 2013 1:51 pm

Quoting PITingres (Reply 11):
My response would be "well don't put the stupid things down there where they piss off passengers who are trying to fit their feet under the seat" but whatever.

The "stupid thing" needs air to stay cool. Matsushita decided that was the best place to put the equipment. Take up your complaint with them.

Good news is that we are rapidly moving to a totally wireless system. Then, I guess, we'll start to hear complaints about there not being a wired backup when the system goes down.

Frankly, I have never had a complaint about it once you explain why it is there and that there is ample overhead bin space. If your legs are long opt for the coach plus service with 34" of leg room.

PITingres · Sun Sep 08, 2013 2:10 pm

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 16):
Frankly, I have never had a complaint about it once you explain why it is there and that there is ample overhead bin space.

I guess you can count this as your first then.

I prefer to keep my stuff with me, so that I don't have to wake up my seat-mates so that I can get and stow stuff from my laptop bag during the flight.

And it's easy to suggest the Y+ when you aren't the one paying for it.

Anyway, I appreciate the info. I'll just stay away.

FlyASAGuy2005 · Sun Sep 08, 2013 3:38 pm

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 8):
They were never "angled" seats--they were the plastic pod-type BC seat.

NW's WBC seats were anled lie-flat beds.

------------------------------------------

Here's a vid for those wanting to see pictures, etc.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWTb3eWxXGo

questions · Sun Sep 08, 2013 9:54 pm

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 18):
Here's a vid for those wanting to see pictures, etc.

Even though I still think DL's premium cabin looks cold and sterile, the whole aircraft interior looks really nice!

rwy04lga · Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:20 pm

Quoting questions (Reply 19):
Even though I still think DL's premium cabin looks cold and sterile

You would prefer hot and filthy? What changes would you suggest?

sankaps · Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:28 pm

The galleys on the A330 (as on most modern aircraft) are selected by the airline. IIRC, NWA selected Driessen galleys when they bought the A330s . It is possible that the design issues are peculiar to Driessen, and not to B/E Aerospace and other galley makers who make galleys for the A330, perhaps someone closer to the galley design business can comment?

Alitalia744 · Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:59 pm

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 20):
You would prefer hot and filthy? What changes would you suggest?

Why get so defensive?

The interior is cold and sterile. Even Delta Fanboys (myself included) can admit that.

They would have benefited from some softer colors, more detailing on the seats versus the off the shelf option. Given their capex budget, they spent what they could, but that doesn't mean the cabin is warm and inviting...

DTWPurserBoy · Mon Sep 09, 2013 12:36 am

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 18):
NW's WBC seats were anled lie-flat beds.

Those pictures you showed were the new DL seats. The original NW seats were not angled. I worked on the first A330 and the 747's after they were modified and they were NOT repeat NOT angled. The had a plastic pod that slid forward and reclined. No angling was required. They were set 2-2 in A zone on the 747 and 2-3-2 on the A330 and 747 B zone. 747 upper deck was 2-2.

Having spent thousands of hours on those airplanes I know what I am talking about. I also had my fingers crushed trying to manually return them upright after the electrical system failed.

rwy04lga · Mon Sep 09, 2013 1:05 am

Quoting alitalia744 (Reply 22):
Why get so defensive?

Defensive...not too much, sarcastic...absolutely!

To me, the colors and design exude modernity, cleanliness, and neatness.

Excepting the tail, Delta's colors are mostly blue, and that's not a 'warm' color.

questions · Mon Sep 09, 2013 1:08 am

Isn't this considered lie-flat (angled)... vs flat-bed (parallel to the floor)?

http://www.flightbliss.com/tips/hawa...ly_first_class_to_Hawaii_91-1.html

questions · Mon Sep 09, 2013 3:05 am

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 20):
You would prefer hot and filthy?

Why the harsh comment to someone simply offering their opinion? There's no need to be a jackass.

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 20):
What changes would you suggest?

I'm not an interior designer. However I am quite sure there are a lot of ways Delta could have made the cabin look and feel sophisticated, modern, inviting, upscale, and warm through the use of high quality materials and a different color palette... while at the same time holding true to the Delta brand.

Delta's BusinessElite inflight product is competitive -- the cabin staff are usually great, the Westin Heavenly products are comfortable, the Tumi amenity kit is nice. The cabin however looks cold (not the opposite of "hot"), sterile (not the opposite of "filthy"), and cheap.

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 24):
Excepting the tail, Delta's colors are mostly blue...

So what. It's doesn't mean Delta has to use their signature blue for the seat covers in all cabins.

1337Delta764 · Mon Sep 09, 2013 3:30 am

Quoting questions (Reply 26):
So what. It's doesn't mean Delta has to use their signature blue for the seat covers in all cabins.

Perhaps red leather would look more beautiful for the BusinessElite cabin. Also, for Blossom the Pink 767-400ER (Ship 1821, N845MH), pink leather would look very nice.

I definitely don't see DL going back to cloth, that is for sure.

[Edited 2013-09-08 20:32:41]

questions · Mon Sep 09, 2013 3:40 am

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 27):
Perhaps red leather would look more beautiful for the BusinessElite cabin.

Now we're thinking outside the box... mirrors on the ceiling... boarding music by Donna Summer... whistles in the amenity kits... foam parties mid-flight... move over Virgin... Toot Toot Beep Beep!

deltaflyertoo · Mon Sep 09, 2013 3:56 am

Will DL bring the A330 back to LAX -->HND when all the mods are done?

sankaps · Mon Sep 09, 2013 7:49 am

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 23):
They were set 2-2 in A zone on the 747 and 2-3-2 on the A330 and 747 B zone. 747 upper deck was 2-2.

I could have sworn the plastic shell NWA WBC seats are/were 2-2-2 on the A330.

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 23):
The original NW seats were not angled. I worked on the first A330 and the 747's after they were modified and they were NOT repeat NOT angled. The had a plastic pod that slid forward and reclined. No angling was required.

The plastic shell WBC seats were what is called "lie flat" and not "full flat". They would recline flat but at a slope of 170 degrees or so, like other lie flat seats when fully reclined. The shell reclined backwards too, therefore they were not considered "pod" seats where the external shell does not recline.

KaiGywer · Mon Sep 09, 2013 11:01 am

Quoting sankaps (Reply 30):
I could have sworn the plastic shell NWA WBC seats are/were 2-2-2 on the A330.

They were

FlyASAGuy2005 · Mon Sep 09, 2013 11:57 am

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 23):
Those pictures you showed were the new DL seats. The original NW seats were not angled. I worked on the first A330 and the 747's after they were modified and they were NOT repeat NOT angled. The had a plastic pod that slid forward and reclined. No angling was required. They were set 2-2 in A zone on the 747 and 2-3-2 on the A330 and 747 B zone. 747 upper deck was 2-2.

Yes, my link posted was to show the new interior which was the intent. hence the -------------------- to separate the top part talking about the WBC seats.

Quoting questions (Reply 25):

Isn't this considered lie-flat (angled)... vs flat-bed (parallel to the floor)?

http://www.flightbliss.com/tips/hawa....html

Exactly. IDK if he thought I meanted the seat itself being angled which is not what I mean. The pic you've posted shows what I mean which is the defination of lie-flat angled.

Please reference this link as well...

http://www.farecompare.com/travel-ad...em-and-whose-are-most-comfortable/

[Edited 2013-09-09 05:02:47]

Starlionblue · Mon Sep 09, 2013 1:31 pm

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 10):
Quoting PITingres (Reply 9):
Does this mod do away with the horrendous blockage underneath the window seats? I assume that it's some sort of IFE box? I've been trying to avoid the DL A330's because of that dratted thing, and it would be wonderful if the blockage is going away.

It is indeed the brains of the IFE and no, it is not going away nor will it on other airlines. Ya gotta give a little to get a little. One problem we have always had is when people shove stuff under the seat and knock out the canon plugs disabling every seat behind them.

They are going away, in the sense that they are shrinking to the point that they aren't noticeable anymore. In CX planes with new interiors they're not in the way under the seat at all, plus the IFE menus fly compared to earlier models.

DTWPurserBoy · Mon Sep 09, 2013 1:33 pm

Quoting sankaps (Reply 30):

The plastic shell WBC seats were what is called "lie flat" and not "full flat". They would recline flat but at a slope of 170 degrees or so, like other lie flat seats when fully reclined. The shell reclined backwards too, therefore they were not considered "pod" seats where the external shell does not recline.

That is correct. I have picked many a small woman up off the floor as they slid down the angle. And the seats were NOT comfortable--very hard but DL inherited them with the merger. They immediately committed to their replacement. They were also notoriously unreliable electrically. In theory, they could be reset at the AVOD panel but I don't think I ever got that to work. invariably your had to go through a multistep process to manually raise the back shell and lower the footrest. That is where you would get your fingers crushed. Terrible design.

b727fa · Mon Sep 09, 2013 4:00 pm

I think there are two definitions of "angled" being used...angle in recline and angle in mounting on the floor.

GSPSPOT · Mon Sep 09, 2013 4:34 pm

Quoting questions (Reply 26):
I'm not an interior designer. However I am quite sure there are a lot of ways Delta could have made the cabin look and feel sophisticated, modern, inviting, upscale, and warm through the use of high quality materials and a different color palette... while at the same time holding true to the Delta brand.

Delta's BusinessElite inflight product is competitive -- the cabin staff are usually great, the Westin Heavenly products are comfortable, the Tumi amenity kit is nice. The cabin however looks cold (not the opposite of "hot"), sterile (not the opposite of "filthy"), and cheap.

I agree - why don't airlines at least do something to the bulkheads like they (including DL) used to? You know, company logo or colors (even in a kind of faded effect). That would provide a great deal of visual interest while not costing much over & above the bulkheads themselves.

Prost · Mon Sep 09, 2013 5:37 pm

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 34):
That is correct. I have picked many a small woman up off the floor as they slid down the angle. And the seats were NOT comfortable--very hard but DL inherited them with the merger.

Delta didn't do themselves any favors by covering the horrible pod seats in leather. At least the fabric 'gripped' you in place.

The NW pod seats had a sweet spot for people who were between 5'6"-5-10" tall (168-178 cm). Outside of that narrow window, you were out of luck.

airtechy · Mon Sep 09, 2013 8:50 pm

Those "pod" seats were not only torture for the person who was in them but also for the person seated behind them who wanted to get from the window to the aisle. The reclining "shell" essentially trapped you.

The new flat-beds with direct aisle access are wonderful. I think any airline that does not have these type seats will be non-competitive in business soon.

AT

klkla · Mon Sep 09, 2013 10:03 pm

Quoting alitalia744 (Reply 22):
The interior is cold and sterile. Even Delta Fanboys (myself included) can admit that.

In person the shades of blue and gray work and create a soothing atmosphere. It does not photograph as well as it looks in person.

Quoting Prost (Reply 37):
Delta didn't do themselves any favors by covering the horrible pod seats in leather. At least the fabric 'gripped' you in place.

Some people (myself included) do not like cloth seats because they absorb smells and are harder to clean. I don't really need to be gripped in my seat. I've never slipped of a leather seat.

dtw2hyd · Mon Sep 09, 2013 10:42 pm

Quoting klkla (Reply 39):
In person the shades of blue and gray work and create a soothing atmosphere. It does not photograph as well as it looks in person.

Red appears to be favorite color for few,but it is not allowed in many office interiors as it creates a agitated atmosphere.

netjetandy · Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:36 am

I was on one of the newly configured planes on 8/31 from ATL-HNL. The plane looked and smelled brand new! looked like nothing was untouched. No wifi though because it was in international configuration.

FlyASAGuy2005 · Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:41 am

Quoting b727fa (Reply 35):

I think there are two definitions of "angled" being used...angle in recline and angle in mounting on the floor.

Quoting GSPSPOT (Reply 36):
I agree - why don't airlines at least do something to the bulkheads like they (including DL) used to? You know, company logo or colors (even in a kind of faded effect). That would provide a great deal of visual interest while not costing much over & above the bulkheads themselves.

DL is going with the widget diamond pattern on the bulkheads.

This was taken a couple months ago as I was getting off my fight from MSP. If you look at the video I posted, D E L T A and the widget is on the bulkheads as you walk from front to rear.

Polot · Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:47 am

Quoting DTW2HYD (Reply 40):
Red appears to be favorite color for few,but it is not allowed in many office interiors as it creates a agitated atmosphere.

Using too much red is intense and tacky, but the cabin could really use some red accents here and there. That would help it look less cold and sterile.

coronado · Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:55 am

I have to assume the 10 new 333 on order will be configured with exact same seat count and arrangement as the modified existing 333's?
A333 34J/32EC/227E
If there has been an announcement on the seating configurations for the new ones I may have missed it, or are these 10 new a/c with their enhanced range being set up in a more premium heavy layout? Any intelligence on this?

FlyASAGuy2005 · Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:58 am

I think the cold and sterile bit is a tad overblown I was in EC just the other day on a 75X seated in the exit

Quoting Coronado (Reply 44):

Nothing official as yet, we're several years away but anything's possible.

trex8 · Tue Sep 10, 2013 1:11 am

Quoting Coronado (Reply 44):
I have to assume the 10 new 333 on order will be configured with exact same seat count and arrangement as the modified existing 333's?
A333 34J/32EC/227E
If there has been an announcement on the seating configurations for the new ones I may have missed it, or are these 10 new a/c with their enhanced range being set up in a more premium heavy layout? Any intelligence on this?

No change
http://news.delta.com/index.php?s=43&item=2095

coronado · Tue Sep 10, 2013 1:13 am

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 45):
Nothing official as yet, we're several years away but anything's possible.

From the press release the first of the new A333 will be delivered in the spring of 2015, which any way you cut it is only 18 months from now.

Probably the new birds will be arriving just as the final group of existing A330's get upgraded.

I can see 15-16 getting done between now and next April- May 2014 when typically mods are suspended for the summer travel season, and then the final dozen or so getting upgraded during the (northern) winter of 2014-2015.

I suspect the JV between Virgin and Delta will see some premium configuration 'heavy, new' Delta A333's deployed on routes such as LAX-LHR and SFO-LHR to permit Virgin to accelerate retirement of some of its older aircraft that are probably coming up on heavy maintenance.

MIflyer12 · Tue Sep 10, 2013 1:19 am

Quoting Coronado (Reply 47):
I can see 15-16 getting done between now and next April- May 2014 when typically mods are suspended for the summer travel season, and then the final dozen or so getting upgraded during the (northern) winter of 2014-2015.

IIRC, the plan has been to get all DL A330s reconfigured before Summer 2014 flying.

questions · Tue Sep 10, 2013 2:10 am

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 45):
I think the cold and sterile bit is a tad overblown I was in EC

Can't speak for others, but my point was intended for the BusinessElite cabin. The Economy cabin, including EC, looks fine, especially when it's full of passengers.

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