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MaverickM11
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Sun Oct 13, 2013 9:08 pm

Quoting sweair (Reply 39):
It´s a joke compared to the 752 on the routes its put on sometimes.

I know anet will never accept it, but the 757 performance is rarely needed, as evidenced by most carriers getting rid of them ASAP, as well as the nearly nonexistent interest for a replacement.
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srbmod
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Sun Oct 13, 2013 10:48 pm

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 20):
Yeah I'm confused as to how popular it should be with a replacement/refresher already coming down the road

Delta's order was made about a week prior to the 737MAX being officially launched (The A319/320/321neo was already on offer and had already garnered a number of orders.). Let's not forget that DL recently placed an order for 30 A321s, which is a competing a/c to the 739ER and both types are replacing some of the 752 fleet. In both cases, DL has opted for the current generation of those types and not the upcoming updated versions of those a/c. DL is sticking with a known product in case there are issues with the 737MAX or A319/320/321neo, in particular, the engines since they are the biggest leap in technology between the generations of those a/c families. As long as Boeing and Airbus continue to offer the current generation for sale, airlines will still order them. Boeing was still building 737 Classics the first few years they were building 737NGs and delivered the last 737 Classics in 2000.
 
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lightsaber
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:20 am

Quoting waly777 (Reply 10):
It has however sold ok in recent times and the Max-9 will do much better.

Agreed. The -9MAX will sell much better than the 739ER. It will have a place in the market. However, I believe shortfield and hot/high performance will make the -8MAX the best seller of the MAX line. But that's fine. The -8 is a little bigger than the A320 so it will fill enough of the niche.

And that is part of the -9's problem. The 738 is that good and that versatile while the A320 is a little short to compete for some operators with the 738, but the A321 is that good of an option.

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 25):
I assume this applies to the 737 Max as well. The MAX 9 represents 12% of the backlog versus 20% for the A321neo, which could be explained by your summary.

   But some of this will be due to the 738MAX being such a fine option. I think longterm both the -9MAX and A321 will represent a higher fraction of the re-engine sales. But that will require either increased thrust options, new flaps, or other kits to improve short-field and hot/high.

Lightsaber
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phatfarmlines
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:30 am

Quoting FlyHossD (Reply 42):
I sure see plenty of 737-900ERs in DEN these days.

And perhaps some of those 739ER flights get to take advantage of that 16,000 ft. runways to avoid weight penalties.
 
FlyHossD
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:35 am

Quoting phatfarmlines (Reply 54):
And perhaps some of those 739ER flights get to take advantage of that 16,000 ft. runways to avoid weight penalties.

After over a decade of flying 737s into and out of DEN, I can't remember ever needing 34R/16L for take off, not even in a -300 or a straight (non ER) -900. In other words, the 12,000 runways are plenty (yes, even for that "doggy" -900).
My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
 
gigneil
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:00 am

Quoting CO777DAL (Reply 40):
How many actually flew on one? Well one of the steepest take-off I ever had in my life was on a 737-900.

So?

Quoting FlyHossD (Reply 42):
I sure see plenty of 737-900ERs in DEN these days.

Again, it doesn't necessarily matter what we all think or feel. We have no idea what they're loaded with, and we also can't say for sure how far they're going. DEN is pretty much central to everywhere in the US - and as a result, its never leaving from there loaded down for a long haul.


Bottom line is - mathematically speaking this plane is less capable.

NS
 
MSPNWA
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:42 am

I believe the simplest reason is that the 739 is a little too much airplane for the vast majority of routes. Sure the economics look good, but that's only if the plane is full, and 180+ seats is not easy to fill at a high fare. If you've been able to fill 752s, then the 739 is a good match. If the 752 was too much for you, the 739 will be as well. It's why the order books are filled with 738s.
 
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1337Delta764
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:51 am

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 56):
I believe the simplest reason is that the 739 is a little too much airplane for the vast majority of routes. Sure the economics look good, but that's only if the plane is full, and 180+ seats is not easy to fill at a high fare. If you've been able to fill 752s, then the 739 is a good match. If the 752 was too much for you, the 739 will be as well. It's why the order books are filled with 738s.

Note that this is the reason why most airlines did not replace their 727s with 757s despite Boeing marketing it as such. The 738 was a near exact replacement for the 727-200 in terms of capacity, and was introduced at a time that most airlines were beginning to retire their 722s. In addition to replacing the 722 for many airlines, it has also become a replacement for the MD-80 in recent years. Considering that so many 722s and MD-80s were sold in the past, the 738 size category seems like the ideal size for most airlines.
 
gigneil
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Mon Oct 14, 2013 5:28 am

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 57):
Note that this is the reason why most airlines did not replace their 727s with 757s despite Boeing marketing it as such.

Yes they did. Why do you think United, Delta and American have over 500 combined?
 
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1337Delta764
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Mon Oct 14, 2013 5:55 am

Quoting gigneil (Reply 58):
Yes they did. Why do you think United, Delta and American have over 500 combined?

The 757 was not ordered by them as a 727 replacement, as most of these airlines operated the 727 into the late 1990s and early 2000s. In fact, on domestic routes the 757 was used to replace the 707 and DC-8, since the 757 has a similar capacity to both. For UA, US, and NW, the 727 replacement was the A320, while for AA and CO the 738 was the 727 replacement. For DL, the MD-90 was originally intended to be their 727 replacement, however, the 738 ended up being their 727 replacement instead.

[Edited 2013-10-13 22:58:51]
 
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AA777223
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Mon Oct 14, 2013 12:28 pm

Quoting phatfarmlines (Reply 41):
I counted ~47 seconds the roll lasted in that video, when the typical 737-700/800 flights I have been on lasted less than 30 seconds, assuming the airport is not hot and high.

Assuming the airport is NOT hot and high? Have you ever been to Houston? High no; hot YES!
A318/19/20/21, A300, A332/3, A343/6, A388, L1011, DC-9, DC-10, MD-11, MD-80, B722, B732/3/4/5/7/8/9, B743/4/4M, B752/3, B762/3/4, B772/E/W, B788/9, F-100, CRJ-200/700/900, ERJ-135/145/175/190, DH-8, ATR-72, DO-328, BAE-146
 
FlyHossD
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:20 pm

Quoting gigneil (Reply 55):
Again, it doesn't necessarily matter what we all think or feel. We have no idea what they're loaded with, and we also can't say for sure how far they're going. DEN is pretty much central to everywhere in the US - and as a result, its never leaving from there loaded down for a long haul.


Bottom line is - mathematically speaking this plane is less capable.

Less capable how? Less capable compared to what?

Mind you, I agree to some extent - the 739s do need more runway than a 738 or 752.

On the other hand, for most missions, the 739s carry 20 additional passengers than a 738 - that's more capability, not less.

The seat mile costs for a 739 are less than a 752 and that's the biggest reason they're replacing the 757s. For most flights - say DEN to SEA - you just don't need the capabilities and cost of a 752.
My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
 
MaverickM11
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RE: Why Isn't The B737-900ER More Popular?

Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:41 pm

Honestly people, the plane can go just about anywhere a 738 can go, whether it's HNLLAX, BOSSFO, CUNEWR, just about anything with a few limitations over the 738. That's why it has 500 orders. I'm not sure how popular it should be??

Quoting FlyHossD (Reply 61):
Less capable how? Less capable compared to what?

You didn't know Boeing built an aircraft that can only takeoff from the longest runway at Edwards AFB and has to drive everywhere else? 
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