Lao Airlines Crash In Mekong River

Buyantukhaa · Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:14 pm

Just in:

Dozens of fatalities when Lao Airlines crashes in Mekong River.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...s-laos-crash-idUSBRE99F0GH20131016

RIP to the victims

[Edited 2013-10-16 06:25:18]

Buyantukhaa · Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:21 pm

Now with link in English:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...s-laos-crash-idUSBRE99F0GH20131016

Quote:
A Lao Airlines plane on an internal flight from the capital, Vientiane, to the south of the country, crashed into the Mekong in the late afternoon[...]

A television station in neighboring Thailand said 39 people had been killed.

starbucks · Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:22 pm

English: http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...s-laos-crash-idUSBRE99F0GH20131016

TurkishWings · Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:30 pm

It sounds like an ATR or an MA-6

Thomas_Jaeger · Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:32 pm

There were two flights scheduled from Vientiane today, QV515 arriving at 07.45 or QV301 arriving at 12.15. Would have taken a long time for the reports to emerge or the flight was delayed?

The picture here (if from today's crash) somehow looks more like a MA-60 than an ATR72 (can anyone identify it):
http://www.bangkokbiznews.com/home/d...B3%E0%B9%82%E0%B8%82%E0%B8%87.html

The green color of the engines somehow also confuses me, does not look like Lao Airlines.

babaero · Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:37 pm

think that picture in the previous post is the russian Antonev which crashed in Siberia ( Angara Airlines July 11 2011

http://www.examiner.com/article/russian-plane-crash-kills-6-siberia

[Edited 2013-10-16 06:37:47]

[Edited 2013-10-16 06:38:28]

Thomas_Jaeger · Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:39 pm

Great journalism then

.

KarelXWB · Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:43 pm

The aircraft is an ATR 72, the picture is wrong.

Buyantukhaa · Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:49 pm

Death toll adjusted to 44, no survivors

http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/loca...-crash-in-pakse-kills-all-on-board

ATR 72-600 crashed on approach.

[Edited 2013-10-16 06:50:09]

KarelXWB · Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:51 pm

Second crash this month. On October 3, an Embraer Brasilia had crashed at Lagos, Nigeria after takeoff.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/...-11e3-b141-298f46539716_story.html

[Edited 2013-10-16 06:53:14]

boeingbus · Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:59 pm

This is horrible news.... RIP to the victims.

nicode · Wed Oct 16, 2013 2:21 pm

Apparently 44 people had been killed, included 5 crews....

RubberJungle · Wed Oct 16, 2013 2:22 pm

Unconfirmed but looking like RDPL-34233, ATR 72-600

AY-MD11 · Wed Oct 16, 2013 2:30 pm

Here is passenger list of the crash.. http://jclao.com/lao-plane-crashes-in-pakse/ RIP to the victims.

Buyantukhaa · Wed Oct 16, 2013 2:30 pm

Quoting RubberJungle (Reply 12):
Unconfirmed but looking like RDPL-34233, ATR 72-600

Delivered new on March 29 this year.

readytotaxi · Wed Oct 16, 2013 2:58 pm

How sad. Not happy with the passenger list being out there so soon.
RIP

starbucks · Wed Oct 16, 2013 3:03 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 9):
Second crash this month. On October 3, an Embraer Brasilia had crashed at Lagos, Nigeria after takeoff.

Don't forget the MASWings Twin Otter in Malaysia

frigatebird · Wed Oct 16, 2013 3:11 pm

Quoting readytotaxi (Reply 15):
How sad. Not happy with the passenger list being out there so soon.
RIP

Can't imagine all next of kin already informed.

Quoting BuyantUkhaa (Reply 14):
Quoting RubberJungle (Reply 12):Unconfirmed but looking like RDPL-34233, ATR 72-600
Delivered new on March 29 this year.

First accident with this type? (-600?)

ZKCIF · Wed Oct 16, 2013 3:47 pm

Five crew? A training flight?
RIP

Spacepope · Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:03 pm

Quoting ZKCIF (Reply 18):
Five crew? A training flight?

I don't see what's extraordinary about that tally. 2 pilots, 3 cabin crew?

ZKCIF · Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:08 pm

Quoting Spacepope (Reply 19):
I don't see what's extraordinary about that tally. 2 pilots, 3 cabin crew?

Have You ever seen three cabin crew on ATR 72? I flew ATR 72 on six different airlines, and there always were two. Although in Laos it would not be too surprising if they are trying to make the best impression on their clients.

B747forever · Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:10 pm

May they all rest in peace.

Quoting AY-MD11 (Reply 13):
Here is passenger list of the crash.. http://jclao.com/lao-plane-crashes-in-pakse/ RIP to the victims.

What is the point of releasing the passenger list?

icna05e · Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:13 pm

7 of the deceased are French.
Maybe people from ATR? Is it common for airlines to have instructors from the manufacturer help the in-service process?

Thoughts to all the victims. I hope the reasons will be found and that this disaster will eventually make the industry safer.

ZKCIF · Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:18 pm

Quoting icna05e (Reply 22):
Maybe people from ATR? Is it common for airlines to have instructors from the manufacturer help the in-service process?

There are tens of thousands of French tourists there. At the beginning of August I saw a Lao flight boarding somewhere in SE Asia. French was being heard all around.

(Edited for a skipped word)

[Edited 2013-10-16 09:46:12]

ushermittwoch · Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:48 pm

It's a former French colony and there are a LOT of French people in SE Asia.

Superfly · Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:55 pm

This really hits close to home for me. I was going to take a flight earlier this year that crashed in Laos.
I've been wanting to do some intra-Laos flights since it's right next door. I'm really surprised to read about one of their brand new ATR-72s.

This is the flight I missed because I overslept.
Avoiding Crash On Twin Otter; Thai 737-400 To Laos (by Superfly Jun 11 2013 in Trip Reports)

nethkt · Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:11 pm

Laos is a very popular destination for tourists from Europe who have had enough of Thailand and want something more peaceful and exotic.
Sad that's it's a very new ATR, may all deaths rest in peace.
Still wonder, with the typhoon warning, they still operate the flight.

Superfly · Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:16 pm

Quoting nethkt (Reply 26):
Still wonder, with the typhoon warning, they still operate the flight.

I just flew in from Singapore an hour ago on TG410.
This crash happened while I was in flight. I've been reading about the storms but we had a very smooth flight. I was expecting a very turbulent flight.

817Dreamliiner · Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:20 pm

Quoting RubberJungle (Reply 12):
Unconfirmed but looking like RDPL-34233, ATR 72-600

Planespotters now lists the frame as written off:

http://www.planespotters.net/Product...2/1071,RDPL-34233-Lao-Airlines.php

Its really sad to see such a fairly new aircraft written off. RIP to those who lost their lives in this accident.

EL-AL · Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:28 pm

I flew this exact flight (Lao airlines 515) in 2011, also on a new ATR 72-600. Everyone knows that Laos strong side isn't safety, but I believed that with those new ATRs at least aviation is safe. Very sad.

Indochina Trip 3/9: Lao Airlines VTE-PKZ+LPQ & LXG (by EL-AL May 9 2011 in Trip Reports)

JHwk · Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:30 pm

Sad. Flew Lao Air once back in 2000 to Xieng Khouang ; I think I was one of four other people who had ridden in an airplane before. The crowd was terrified, cleared the mountains by about 100'.

Will never forget the airport security in Vientienne-- an old, unmanned, unplugged metal detector with a sign on it saying "No guns." Sure things have changed a bit since then.

copenhagenboy · Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:35 pm

Sad to read that, some years ago I was on a flight Chiang Mai-Luang Prabang on Lao Airlines, and it was a really pleasant and nice flight.

AR385 · Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:43 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 9):
Second crash this month. On October 3, an Embraer Brasilia had crashed at Lagos, Nigeria after takeoff.

Third. A Cessna Caravan with 15 people on board, all dead, crashed in Baja Peninsula three days ago. They just found the wreckage this morning.

A388 · Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:49 pm

Quoting EL-AL (Reply 29):
I flew this exact flight (Lao airlines 515) in 2011, also on a new ATR 72-600.

I went through your trip report real quick, nice report!!! The aircraft you apparently flew in is not the aircraft that crashed here. As per your report your aircraft was an ATR72-500 and not the ATR72-600. In any case, I would love to visit Asia some day to see all those ancient cities and buildings, just nice indeed.

RIP to the fatalities and my condolences to the families and friends of the ones who passed away.

A388

AY-MD11 · Wed Oct 16, 2013 6:12 pm

Quoting B747forever (Reply 21):
What is the point of releasing the passenger list?

Don't ask me,im not the one who leaked it online. But around that area it's normal that everything goes out public,not much sensorial compare to the west.

Aesma · Wed Oct 16, 2013 6:13 pm

TV is saying that the weather is the cause, when will they learn that it's never the cause, you're not supposed to fly/take off/land in dangerous weather !

Quoting ushermittwoch (Reply 24):
It's a former French colony and there are a LOT of French people in SE Asia.

Yep, one of my grandfathers was born and lived in Indochina until his 20s (fought there too), his parents are buried there, I'd love to visit.

817Dreamliiner · Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:10 pm

Statement from ATR:

http://www.atraircraft.com/newsroom/...ress-releases-details-1233-en.html

zeke · Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:13 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 27):

Quoting Aesma (Reply 35):

I belive this is due in part to what was left of typhoon Nari that also killed so many in the Philippines and Vietnam. The airport only has non precision approaches to runway 15, the VOR is located off airport (4nm 330 bearing). The NDB is located on the airport. The forecasts at the time are not fantastic, the minima is around 900' with a vis required of 1200m for the NDB.

201310151100 TAF VLPS 151100Z 1512/1606 VRB10KT 2000 RA BKN010 SCT050
TEMPO 1600/1603 32010KT 4000 RA SCT013 SCT050=
201310150500 TAF VLPS 150500Z 1506/1524 32014 3000 RA BKN015 SCT050
TEMPO 1512/1520 VRB12KT 2000 RA BKN010 SCT050=
201310142300 TAF VLPS 142300Z 1500/1518 36004KT 5000 SCT020 SCT050
TEMPO 1511/1518 VRB02KT 2000 BR SCT020 SCT050=

The runway is slightly elevated, around 400', the approach takes them over land, the missed approach is a right turn over the river.

I hope they were not flying visually low level along the river and crashed into the river bank as they climbed up to the runway.

A388 · Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:20 pm

I would like to know the cause and explanation of that cause of this accident. So far the bad weather is blamed but what happened that caused the crash? Seeing that the ATR72-600 is the most advanced turboprop in its class using the latest technologies, what could have caused this fatal crash? Extreme turbulence, lightning strike (not likely I would assume), icing on the wings (I also can't imagine this but such an accident happened to my knowledge with an American Eagle ATR72) or what else? I can't imagine extreme heavy rain can be a factor as the pilots should be able to fly under those circumstances using the advanced cockpit systems, right?

A388

Aesma · Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:47 pm

Like zeke is suggesting, pilots flying in low visibility weather, without precision equipment on the ground, flying into the terrain, will probably be the culprit.

A388 · Wed Oct 16, 2013 8:03 pm

Quoting Aesma (Reply 39):
Like zeke is suggesting, pilots flying in low visibility weather, without precision equipment on the ground, flying into the terrain, will probably be the culprit.

Okay thanks. I overlooked that reply, sounds plausible yes.

A388

B777LRF · Wed Oct 16, 2013 8:20 pm

Quoting A388 (Reply 38):
I would like to know the cause and explanation of that cause of this accident.

The wreckage hasn't even been salvaged yet, and here is the first cry from the internet for instant gratification. To answer your question, consider this: In the best of circumstances, when crew survive the accident, the airframe and powerplants are readily available, when recorders are quickly retrieved having survived the crash and if the crash took place in a 1st world country with a world class investigative authority, it still take months for a preliminary finding to be issued, and years before the report is all done and dusted.

Viscount724 · Wed Oct 16, 2013 8:27 pm

Quoting nicode (Reply 11):
Apparently 44 people had been killed, included 5 crews....

Later reports say 49 fatalities, including 5 crew.

According to the ATR press release, the aircraft was only 7 months old, delivered last March.

A388 · Wed Oct 16, 2013 8:36 pm

Quoting B777LRF (Reply 41):
The wreckage hasn't even been salvaged yet, and here is the first cry from the internet for instant gratification.

Did I say anywhere that I want to know the cause NOW? NO I didn't. I clearly ask what could have happened and whether I see this right or not so please stop talking about "first cry or internet instant gratification"!!!

A388

[Edited 2013-10-16 13:39:00]

alfa164 · Wed Oct 16, 2013 9:22 pm

I saw thelist of pasengers had been released, but I haven't seen if the names of the crew have been announced yet.

I have a very good friend who flies for Lao Airlines, and I am obviously concerned. Has anyone seen the crew list yet?

Viscount724 · Wed Oct 16, 2013 9:27 pm

Quoting AY-MD11 (Reply 13):
Here is passenger list of the crash.. http://jclao.com/lao-plane-crashes-in-pakse/

Where do you see the passenger list in that link? I can't see anything.

817Dreamliiner · Wed Oct 16, 2013 9:30 pm

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 45):
Where do you see the passenger list in that link? I can't see anything.

It seems the photo was removed. There was a photo with a list earlier.

ImperialEagle · Wed Oct 16, 2013 9:31 pm

Quoting Superfly (Reply 25):
really hits close to home for me.

Maybe an omen. Beware of bad angels! Best stay away!

maxpower1954 · Wed Oct 16, 2013 10:39 pm

Quoting A388 (Reply 38):
I would like to know the cause and explanation of that cause of this accident. So far the bad weather is blamed but what happened that caused the crash? Seeing that the ATR72-600 is the most advanced turboprop in its class using the latest technologies, what could have caused this fatal crash? Extreme turbulence, lightning strike (not likely I would assume), icing on the wings (I also can't imagine this but such an accident happened to my knowledge with an American Eagle ATR72) or what else? I can't imagine extreme heavy rain can be a factor as the pilots should be able to fly under those circumstances using the advanced cockpit systems, right?

A388

The tone and context of your message suggested you would like to know the cause immediately, without actually using the word "now". Thanks for clarifying what you actually intended to say.

Aesma · Wed Oct 16, 2013 11:57 pm

CFIT is the most frequent kind of accident (fatal or not, a botched landing like OZ at SFO is also a CFIT), so supposing a CFIT is not speculating wildly, of course with the final report we can expect many details into the aligned cheese holes that led to this, and hope measures are taken to avoid future occurrences.

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