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NDiesel
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43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:45 am

Hi everyone,


I know there are a couple of 741s that are still flying, notably the GE testbed aircraft and the Iran Air Force 741s. However it seems a freighter, S2-AFA, is still hauling cargo around the world with Logistic Air. This aircraft was delivered to Pan Am in 1970 and according to airfleets.net and the company website, it's still in active service. With good maintenance and a somewhat low amount of cycles/hours, planes can fly for several decades, but at what point does flying a 43 year old 747 become either A) unprofitable or B) unsafe? Insights?
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peterinlisbon
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:41 pm

I guess what would make a plane unsafe would be poor maintenance or metal fatigue due to a high number of cycles. If a piece of machinery hasn't been used much and it's been well looked after, then that's not the same as something that might be quite new but it's been used heavily and worn out. Whether it's profitable to use an old aircraft depends a lot on how heavily they are used. New aircraft use less fuel, but have higher lease rates. So if a plane is flying 20 hours per day, burning an extra few tons of fuel every hour is a big deal. But if it spends most of its time on the ground and just makes the occasional short flight every few weeks, then you don't want to be spending the extra thousands of dollars every day on the lease just to save fuel. That's why cargo operators use older aircraft as these planes generally spend more time on the ground and less in the air.
 
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exFWAOONW
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:48 pm

I don't understand the irrational concern over replacing older jet aircraft with shiny new ones. For crying out loud no one is demanding DC3s be parked are they?
As long as they are maintained properly and not abused, aircraft will conceivably outlive their owners every time.
Is just me, or is flying not as much fun anymore?
 
rwy04lga
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 3:44 pm

Quoting exFWAOONW (Reply 2):
no one is demanding DC3s be parked are they?

DC-3s are not pressurized and don't have to worry about metal fatigue as much as pressurized aircraft.
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tortugamon
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 4:20 pm

Quoting exFWAOONW (Reply 2):

I don't think many people have a concern with replacing older aircraft it is the not replacing older aircraft that is thought provoking.  

Good to see these old birds are still on the air.

tortugamon
 
sovietjet
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 4:41 pm

Quoting exFWAOONW (Reply 2):
I don't understand the irrational concern over replacing older jet aircraft with shiny new ones.

Tell this to SQ and EK  
 
n729pa
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 4:45 pm

It's also one of the PA 747s that had a CRAF conversion too, so that's probably going to help prolong her life span a bit too.
 
Rdh3e
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 4:46 pm

Quoting exFWAOONW (Reply 2):
I don't understand the irrational concern over replacing older jet aircraft with shiny new ones.

Well for passenger aircraft, a current gen aircraft is 15-20% more fuel efficient that a 1980's equivalent (often in the same family).

It's all a question of utilization, you can look at DL as a case study. They have older less fuel efficient aircraft, but they fly lower utilization. They also have brand new aircraft that they are flying the wings off of because they are much more fuel efficient.
 
f4phantom
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 5:09 pm

Wondering how old Air Force One will be until it is retired from presidential service. What might happen to the airframe? One careful owner, a few modifications.
 
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United_fan
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 5:58 pm

Quoting f4phantom (Reply 8):
Wondering how old Air Force One will be until it is retired from presidential service. What might happen to the airframe? One careful owner, a few modifications.

Well,there are 2 'Air Force Ones' . I'm sure they will go to museums . The 707's did.
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CO953
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:08 pm

Quoting f4phantom (Reply 8):

Wondering how old Air Force One will be until it is retired from presidential service. What might happen to the airframe? One careful owner, a few modifications.

A bit off-topic, I know, but I also wonder what will replace them... I would suspect that due to the ultra-security needs of the president, they would still want to use a 4-holer, I would think. Wouldn't be surprised if a couple 748s are requisitioned soon for conversion while the production lines are still open, just to plan ahead. Not sure I can see the A380 becoming AF One, though it sure would carry more staff, political donors & cronies, etc.
 
Kuja
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:48 pm

Quoting NDiesel (Thread starter):
at what point does flying a 43 year old 747 become either A) unprofitable or B) unsafe?

A) It becomes unprofitable when the costs of running it get very close to or surpass the revenue it can generate. This is true of any aircraft in any service.
B) It will remain safe as long as it is properly maintained, professionally crewed and properly loaded and for as long as it is within its design limits in terms of cycles and time, as with any aircraft of any age.

Age in itself does not automatically make an aircraft feasible or infeasible to operate apart from a few specific situations (if it has spent many years stored in a corrosive environment, for example).
 
bohica
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:52 pm

Quoting CO953 (Reply 10):
A bit off-topic, I know, but I also wonder what will replace them...

There is an active thread in the Military forum about that right now:

Usaf Looking To Replace Air Force One (by 747megatop Sep 10 2013 in Military Aviation & Space Flight)
 
ely747
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:08 pm

Quoting CO953 (Reply 10):

Can't bring myself to think of the A380 becoming the Air Force One. Not even for a second. Just name one good reason. If the current jumbo can accomodate all the needs the executive office of the president involves , why wouldn't 747-8? It's the right and only fit for the job in my opinion. For one it's American, it's iconic, looks a way better than ugly fatty Airbus and above all it has proven itself to be itled the queen of the skies.
 
ely747
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:18 pm

Quoting bohica (Reply 12):

Thanks for the heads up.
 
airtechy
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:26 pm

That brings up an interesting question. What is the oldest commercial passenger jet aircraft still carrying paying passengers? It would probably be one of the Delta DC-9's.   

Jim
 
hrc773
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:27 pm

Quoting exFWAOONW (Reply 2):
I don't understand the irrational concern over replacing older jet aircraft with shiny new ones. For crying out loud no one is demanding DC3s be parked are they?
As long as they are maintained properly and not abused, aircraft will conceivably outlive their owners every time.

Airlines love advertising how modern their fleets are; that's because it is what customers want to hear. Would you imagine any airline advertising their "well maintained aging fleet"?
 
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Revelation
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:38 pm

Quoting hrc773 (Reply 16):
Airlines except Delta love advertising how modern their fleets are; that's because it is what customers want to hear.

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Max Q
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:02 pm

The Queen of the skies rules !


Wonder how many 43 year old A380's will be flying around..
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


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soon7x7
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:05 pm

Quoting Kuja (Reply 11):
(if it has spent many years stored in a corrosive environment, for example).

Like Bermuda?...  Ironically the first 747 I was in was to Bermuda from JFK. Was N741PA w/ the sucker doors on her P&W's. The "Pan Am" titles on the side of the upper lobe section 41 were like 24" high. The didn't even have scaled up artwork for the logos at the time. I hope your enjoying the forums here from your lap top while sunning @ Elbow Beach!
 
DTWPurserBoy
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:26 pm

Quoting sovietjet (Reply 5):
Tell this to SQ and EK

When NW bought two 742's from SQ they were riddled with corrosion from a lack of proper maintenance. It took months to rebuild these two aircraft and get them in service and they were only about 7-8 years old. Could it be that they would rather replace them when they still command a good resale price rather than perform expensive maintenance?
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apfpilot
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:48 pm

There is also the consideration of certification basis. Aircraft certified under CAR 3 didn't have to have an airframe life limit. Aircraft certified to part 23 do have to have a airframe life limit, for part 25 aircraft don't have a hard limit but have intervals that are required to be complied with for inspection and these can include specific life limited parts.
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soon7x7
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:50 pm

Quoting Max Q (Reply 18):
Wonder how many 43 year old A380's will be flying around

None...Heck,I'm 58 and I'm still flying...What's the problem ...   
 
SpaceshipDC10
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:52 pm

Quoting Max Q (Reply 18):
Wonder how many 43 year old A380's will be flying around..

Seeing how much younger aircraft are parked and scrapped, I'm not sure we'll see one reaching that age.
 
airbuske
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:57 pm

Quoting airtechy (Reply 15):

That brings up an interesting question. What is the oldest commercial passenger jet aircraft still carrying paying passengers? It would probably be one of the Delta DC-9's.   

I think it's this 5Y-XXA, DC-9-14 in service with Fly540 in Kenya.
 
cornishsimon
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 11:07 pm

Do the buffalo DC3 scheduled services count ?


cs
 
L0VE2FLY
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Fri Oct 18, 2013 11:12 pm

Quoting NDiesel (Thread starter):
43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Meanwhile in GYR, this ex-SQ bird less than third her age is being slaughtered!   


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flyingclrs727
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 12:26 am

Quoting CO953 (Reply 10):
A bit off-topic, I know, but I also wonder what will replace them... I would suspect that due to the ultra-security needs of the president, they would still want to use a 4-holer, I would think. Wouldn't be surprised if a couple 748s are requisitioned soon for conversion while the production lines are still open, just to plan ahead. Not sure I can see the A380 becoming AF One, though it sure would carry more staff, political donors & cronies, etc.

The backup Air Force One normally flies behind Air Force One. Even in the unlikely event of a diversion, the President could quickly be transferred to the backup. The VIP transports flown by the USAF are maintained to even higher standards than ETOPS and have very low utilization. I really don't see why a future Air Force One needs to be a quad, especially as commercial support for 747's dries up around the world. A 787 or 777X based Air Force One could take advantage of Boeing spare parts and maintenance services around the world in case it needed to be serviced while overseas.
 
ltbewr
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 1:33 am

Quoting United_fan (Reply 9):
Quoting f4phantom (Reply 8):
Wondering how old Air Force One will be until it is retired from presidential service. What might happen to the airframe? One careful owner, a few modifications.

Well,there are 2 'Air Force Ones' . I'm sure they will go to museums . The 707's did.

Most likely they will remain in service for many more years, and if not scrapped, most likely at the IAD part of the Smithsonian Air & Space museum.

There are some 747-100's in Museums already.
 
loveofflying
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 2:20 am

Quoting flyingclrs727 (Reply 27):
A 787 or 777X based Air Force One could take advantage of Boeing spare parts and maintenance services around the world in case it needed to be serviced while overseas.

Bet they wouldn't wanna get a 787...  
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falstaff
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 2:21 am

Quoting NDiesel (Thread starter):
Iran Air Force 741s

They have number the number 5 741, delivered to TW in 1969 (just barely 1969), so she is 44 years old.
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Max Q
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 2:45 am

Quoting flyingclrs727 (Reply 27):
I really don't see why a future Air Force One needs to be a quad,

I do, simply, it provides the maximum redundancy and maximum safety.


As good as modern twins are they can't match that.
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


GGg
 
Max Q
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:12 am

As a taxpayer I want my President flying on a Boeing 747.


Unless it's a Republican of course..
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


GGg
 
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flyingclrs727
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:17 am

Quoting skywaymanaz (Reply 32):
The justification for the bigger plane is usually the press pool in tow but I don't think the press fills the cabin on Hawaii trips or previously to the Crawford ranch.

Well it would have given away President Bush's 2003 Thanksgiving trip to Iraq if the VC-25's weren't flown regularly to Waco for his trips to the Crawford, TX ranch. The ability to take the President just about anywhere in the world from any any place he visits is useful. The pilots also need to fly at least a minimum number of hours just to keep their skills up.
 
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gunsontheroof
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:25 am

Quoting Max Q (Reply 18):
Wonder how many 43 year old A380's will be flying around..

Probably not many, but that's not necessarily a knock against it. For one thing, most (if not all) 747s even close to that old have been converted to freighters. There are very real questions as to whether or not there will ever be an A380F, let alone an A380 pax to freighter conversion program. The other thing I'd note is that the 747 got to enjoy the golden years of the VLA, something that I think most of us can agree is long gone without even getting into the currently questionable-looking future prospects for VLAs in the international market. There are also considerably fewer frames available to last that long.
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tortugamon
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:38 am

Quoting skywaymanaz (Reply 32):
The justification for the bigger plane is usually the press pool in tow

It might have something to do with the fact that the President travels with many dozens of aids and support staff, while the majority of the aircraft is not equipped with seats rather it has to be equipped with a suite for the first family, conference rooms, a full medical unit include a full time doctor that travels with the President so they can address medical emergencies on board, room to house a technology suite that allows for full secure communication as well fix the aircraft with counter measures and resistance to electro magnetic pulse, enough payload/range to carry all of the equipment for Presidential visits and the fuel to be able to take off and not have to land including air refueling equipment....etc. But yeah, I guess the press corp is important as well  . The President needs to be able to conduct a full fledged attack from in the air. I am glad they don't do it on a 757.

4 engines represents extra redundancies, however small, that are easy decisions when protecting the President.

tortugamon
 
ha763
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 6:17 am

Quoting f4phantom (Reply 8):
Wondering how old Air Force One will be until it is retired from presidential service. What might happen to the airframe? One careful owner, a few modifications.

If the reported 2017 entry into service for the first VC-25A replacement happens, it would be 27 years of service as the primary presidential aircraft. They likely will keep the VC-25As as back ups since the 2nd and 3rd aircraft are not due to be in service until 2019 and 2021.
 
skywaymanaz
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:23 am

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 36):
The President needs to be able to conduct a full fledged attack from in the air. I am glad they don't do it on a 757.

That's what the NAOC doomsday 747 was built for. One of the real ones was filmed on the ramp for the film "The Sum of All Fears" when the President nearly takes us to nuclear war. They are based out of Offutt and I remember seeing one operate only about 5,000' over my little Skyhawk one day near St. Joseph, MO when the VP was in Topeka, KS. The planes officially have a primary role with FEMA now but they usually have one shadow the President on his overseas trips. That seems to indicate their continued contingency support in their original role.

Quoting flyingclrs727 (Reply 34):
Well it would have given away President Bush's 2003 Thanksgiving trip to Iraq if the VC-25's weren't flown regularly to Waco for his trips to the Crawford, TX ranch.

I was actually surprised they were able to pull that stunt off under the nose of the press. I also suspect a few of them knew something was up but were asked to keep quiet and did so to maintain their access to the White House. Recently when the modified 757 operating as Air Force Two injested FOD in Flagstaff I'm sure the press knew what was up. If not shortly after it happened they noticed for sure when Biden rode home in the plane that flew his limos. The story wasn't aired until a day or two after he was back in DC. Back in the 90's when Clinton was stuck in the mud after the 747 took a wrong turn I believe there was a similar press blackout on the story until he was rescued by the backup 707 and back in DC. In Germany recently when Merkel's plane was trashed the story only broke after the plane was back in service so probably not a situation unique to American Presidential security even if it is harder these days to keep quiet.
 
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kl5147
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:52 am

Quoting airbuske (Reply 24):
That brings up an interesting question. What is the oldest commercial passenger jet aircraft still carrying paying passengers? It would probably be one of the Delta DC-9's.   

I think it's this 5Y-XXA, DC-9-14 in service with Fly540 in Kenya.

I guess this is a possible candidate too


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DTWPurserBoy
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 1:02 pm

As others have said the age of the airplane is irrelevant if it has been consistently and properly maintained with traceable records. The RC-135's that I flew on from 1971-1973 while having been re-engined are still active in different parts of the world. They were delivered to the Air Force in 1964-65.
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exFWAOONW
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 4:32 pm

Quoting sovietjet (Reply 5):
Tell this to SQ and EK

As long as they can justify those payments to their respective stockholders, more power to them.

Quoting RDH3E (Reply 7):
Well for passenger aircraft, a current gen aircraft is 15-20% more fuel efficient that a 1980's equivalent (often in the same family).

And just how does that extra fuel cost compare to the payment on a new plane?

Quoting Kuja (Reply 11):
Age in itself does not automatically make an aircraft feasible or infeasible to operate apart from a few specific situations (if it has spent many years stored in a corrosive environment, for example).

Exactly.
Is just me, or is flying not as much fun anymore?
 
bennett123
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:09 pm

Does anyone know how many hours/cycles this aircraft has on the clock?.
 
fanofjets
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sun Oct 20, 2013 2:56 am

Quoting NDiesel (Thread starter):
However it seems a freighter, S2-AFA, is still hauling cargo around the world with Logistic Air. This aircraft was delivered to Pan Am in 1970 and according to airfleets.net and the company website, it's still in active service.

That particular aircraft was delivered to Pan Am as N743PA, "Clipper Derby," later renamed "Clipper Black Sea."

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That particular airplane is very special to me, as she was the first 747 I flew on, back in 1971, when she still had that "new plane" smell and had to be boarded via air stairs because the JFK terminal was not yet complete. I'll never forget how huge that plane seemed to me, all lit up at night! I heard the aircraft is stored, possibly at Sharjah - I keep hoping she will take to the air once more. She survived two airlines, Pan Am and Tower Air. Quite a lady.

Glad to see KLM DC-9 PH-DNA is still around. I may well have flown on her, as well. (The Gemini 200 model of that aircraft is a gem.)

Honorable mention to old jetliners with long lives: Finnair DC-9 OH-LYC (MSN 4) flew with East African Safari Express, along with OH-LYC (5Y-XXA and 5Y-XXB, respectively). I believe these venerable ships have been recently retired.

Aerocontinente flew a Fokker F-28, mfd 1969, originally delivered to LTU, OB-1779-P for many years, through 2008.

Douglas DC-8 OY-KTE was only recently retired from ATI and has been preserved in Hawaii, sitll with a passenger cabin in the rear section. I believe she was the last DC-8 to carry PAX in revenue service.

Of course, there's Iran Air, with its mid-1970s vintage 747s and -SPs, all still kept in great condition.
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Max Q
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:28 am

Quoting Gunsontheroof (Reply 34):
Quoting Max Q (Reply 18):
Wonder how many 43 year old A380's will be flying around..

Probably not many, but that's not necessarily a knock against it. For one thing, most (if not all) 747s even close to that old have been converted to freighters.

Wadrs you are missing the point. The B747 was so superbly well built it's durability is unquestioned, a 30 year old airframe with over 100,000 hours is not uncommon.


The Airbus product's just don't come close.
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


GGg
 
bralo20
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sun Oct 20, 2013 11:17 am

Quoting Max Q (Reply 43):
The B747 was so superbly well built it's durability is unquestioned, a 30 year old airframe with over 100,000 hours is not uncommon.

A 20 yo example with over 100k hours isn't also uncommon (think LH as a couple 744's with over 100k hours)

Quote:
The Airbus product's just don't come close.

Well, it's hard to find such an old Airbus since the first A300 (and being the first Airbus in general) in commercial service was delivered in 1974... However, the 3th build A300 is still in service. And then there are some more example from '77, '78, ... still active.

So yes, they don't come close but maybe that's also because Airbus was founded decades after Boeing, Douglas, etc... were building commercial aircraft.
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sun Oct 20, 2013 2:05 pm

Quoting United_fan (Reply 9):
Well,there are 2 'Air Force Ones' . I'm sure they will go to museums.

Hmmm... Probably correct.

Quoting Max Q (Reply 18):

Wonder how many 43 year old A380's will be flying around..

A bunch, I'm sure. What's not commonly appreciated about that plane is that it is actually one of the first (as in before the 787) designed with the ability to upgrade/rate powerplants in mind. Given that, their super-high capital costs and the likelihood that not very many will be made, it really doesn't make much sense to just "throw away" these planes when there's so much that can be done with them over a lifetime.

I'll wager a case of your favorite brew that the crew flying the last 787 to VCV (well, not an NG variant at any rate) will fly on a 380 sometime after. They have a lot of longevity built in.

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 28):

There are some 747-100's in Museums already.

There are some 200s even. I think the best "stuffed" 747 I've seen has to be that LH example at Speyer. Absolutely fantastic exhibit! And that's saying a lot considering she's in a museum that also has a Buran, an AN22, a Dassault Mercure and some kind of Coast Guard ship. ...Even if that's not her real tail  
Quoting Max Q (Reply 31):

As good as modern twins are they can't match that.

Sure they can. Reliability favors twins greatly. Well, some of them anyway,  
Quoting Max Q (Reply 32):
Unless it's a Republican of course..

In that case, a CR2!  
Well, you know what they say. Whatever doesn't kill you...
... Must not be an MD-11.
 
tymnbalewne
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Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:06 am

RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:41 pm

Quoting soon7x7 (Reply 19):
Like Bermuda?... Ironically the first 747 I was in was to Bermuda from JFK. Was N741PA w/ the sucker doors on her P&W's. The "Pan Am" titles on the side of the upper lobe section 41 were like 24" high. The didn't even have scaled up artwork for the logos at the time. I hope your enjoying the forums here from your lap top while sunning @ Elbow Beach!

Mine was on an EAL 747, also to BDA...stayed at the Hamilton Princess. 40 years later I still stay at the Hamilton Princess!
Dewmanair...begins with Dew
 
apfpilot
Posts: 742
Joined: Wed Jun 05, 2013 4:19 pm

RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:36 pm

Quoting United_fan (Reply 9):
Well,there are 2 'Air Force Ones' . I'm sure they will go to museums . The 707's did

actually there are a couple of thousand possible Air Force Once, there are however 2 VC-25A's.

Quoting Max Q (Reply 31):
I do, simply, it provides the maximum redundancy and maximum safety.


As good as modern twins are they can't match that.

Quads are more likely to have an engine failure than a twin.
Opinions are my own and do not reflect an endorsement or position of my employer.
 
Max Q
Posts: 8995
Joined: Wed May 09, 2001 12:40 pm

RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Mon Oct 21, 2013 3:38 am

Quoting apfpilot (Reply 47):
Quads are more likely to have an engine failure than a twin.

And if they do they still have THREE engines left.


More redundancy than a twin has when it leaves the gate !
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


GGg
 
User avatar
747classic
Posts: 3850
Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:13 am

RE: 43 Year Old 747s Still Flying

Mon Oct 21, 2013 5:49 am

Quoting Max Q (Reply 48):
And if they do they still have THREE engines left.

I fully agree, look for my signature below.
Operating a twin over the ocean, you're always one engine failure from a total emergency.

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