Yahoo states that this plane plummeted in mid air before making an emergency landing at RDU? The pilot said on the loud speaker, "We're going down!"... Anyone have more information? Seems a little strange.

http://news.yahoo.com/video/rdu-boun...-plane-plummets-mid-225119594.html

Sounds like a poor choice of words or phraseology by the pilot for a pressurization problem that was misinterpreted by the "expert frequent flyer"
No mention of the masks dropping so it looks like the pilot handled the problem perfectly, so the cabin never gained to 14K feet.
They missed crashing into the school and orphanage and landed at the destination airport to boot.

Okie

Yea, no way she misheard the PA.   

"We're going down........to a lower altitude due to a pressurization issue"

Wow! What an amazing interview - I think we are witnessing the birth of a lawsuit!  

Incredible. This, folks, is what the airline industry is up against. A media that will not stop short of sensationalizing anything commercial aviation related that they can get their hands on.
It's really nauseating, unfair and completely uncalled for. Maybe next time it will be something more interesting, like an exploding toilet or a beverage cart gone wild.

Sensational news and sex sells ads
Ads sell Discontent
Discontent sells things you didn't know you needed or wanted

Welcome to our brave new world. We're all acting for the common good of humanity of course.

I killed my televisión 11 years ago.

It's amazing anyone is brave enough to fly on an airplane at all.

Some of the characterizations made in the story are very over the top. Also --- I don't really buy the "they fixed the plane in 1 hour and it flew on to Baltimore. Looks to me like they canceled the leg of that flight Tuesday night.

That being said, FlightAware does indicate that they did indeed experience a 9,900 FPM rate of decent from 32,500 to 17,000. Even as an experienced flier, that sure as hell would be enough to scare the crap out of me... regardless of what was said over the PA.

bcoz

Quoting ODwyerPW (Reply 5): It's amazing anyone is brave enough to fly on an airplane at all.

You forget that stupid and uninformed people are not brave - just stupid or uninformed. You have to understand the real dangers to be brave....

Thus, I think your statement should be along the line of: It's amazing so many stupid and uninformed people are willing to fly on an airplane at all.

Which is OK, as I fly on jet aircraft....  


Have a great day,

WOW, I agree I can see the lawsuit coming.

I also like that hard hitting news about all of the trouble with WN's 700's

Bird Strike - Yeah, Dang WN for hitting the poor birdy with their big bad airplane

Hard Landing - Pilot Error

Quoting barney captain (Reply 2): Yea, no way she misheard the PA. "We're going down........to a lower altitude due to a pressurization issue"

My thoughts EXACTLY. First thing I said to my wife when we were watching this lady on the news is yeah im sure the pilot keyed up on the mic and shouted nothing more than "Were going down". This lady is full of crap and looking to get nothing more than money out of the experience. Cant wait to find out what the pilot REALLY said!

The Media always wants to hear Dramatic Aviation news & when they dont get it, they create it  

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 10): The Media always wants to hear Dramatic Aviation news & when they dont get it, they create it

Sad, yet true.

If they don't have video, they try to find someone who does. And when there's no video at all, the either create it or simulate it.

And the big news agencies wonder why their users or viewer numbers are going down.

Quoting aviatorcraig (Reply 3): Wow! What an amazing interview - I think we are witnessing the birth of a lawsuit!

It's a beautiful thing, really. One of the under-appreciated wonders of life. I used to think that they came from a stork.

[Edited 2013-11-14 08:30:15]

I do appreciate that the local ABC station stated that the 737 is one of the safest A/C in the skies...Check the last paragraph of the story.

http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?section=news/local&id=9324572

Quoting bcoz (Reply 6): That being said, FlightAware does indicate that they did indeed experience a 9,900 FPM rate

Could that be a FlightAware glitch. Even for an emergency descent that FPM rate seems too high, specially since they were not going down all the way to 10,000 ft.

Quoting stackhouse007 (Thread starter): Anyone have more information? Seems a little strange.

Courtesy: Fox News

Passenger Recounts Midair 'Nosedive' Aboard Southwest Airlines Flight

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/11/14...airlines-flight/?intcmp=latestnews

Quoting AR385 (Reply 14): Could that be a FlightAware glitch. Even for an emergency descent that FPM rate seems too high, specially since they were not going down all the way to 10,000 ft.

Suppose it could be. Here is that data:

Time: Lat Long Crs Direction KTS MPH ALT RATE Facility
05:32PM 33.4733 -80.9678 29° Northeast 497 572 41,000 -60 Level Jacksonville Center
05:33PM 33.5950 -80.8853 29° Northeast 497 572 40,900 -600 Descending Jacksonville Center
05:34PM 33.7189 -80.8025 29° Northeast 497 572 39,900 -2,100 Descending Jacksonville Center
05:35PM 33.8447 -80.7197 29° Northeast 497 572 36,700 -3,720 Descending Jacksonville Center
05:36PM 33.9747 -80.6361 28° Northeast 504 580 32,500 -9,900 Descending Jacksonville Center
05:37PM 34.0919 -80.5356 35° Northeast 509 586 17,000 -4,980 Descending Jacksonville Center
05:38PM 34.2086 -80.4219 39° Northeast 522 601 22,600 1,320 Climbing Jacksonville Center
05:39PM 34.3111 -80.3283 37° Northeast 505 581 19,700 -3,300 Descending Jacksonville Center

So according to that, in one minute they went from 32,500 to 17000 feet?

Ah yea, I call it inaccurate.

That's an impressive decent, must have been quite a ride.

Quoting ozark1 (Reply 4): Incredible. This, folks, is what the airline industry is up against. A media that will not stop short of sensationalizing anything commercial aviation related that they can get their hands on. It's really nauseating, unfair and completely uncalled for.

Well, not to stick up for the news companies, but all it seems they did here was to report what a witness said. It was also reported on CNN, with some comments on what 'might' have actually been said, but she sticks by what she says she heard over the PA.

Yes, they are going to report it - that's their business. Sensationalism sells, but I don't see that they made anything up here ....yet!

Jimbo

Quoting barney captain (Reply 2): We're going down........to a lower altitude due to a pressurization issue

Could the pilot have actually said something along the lines of 'we're starting down' or 'we're heading down?'. I'm wondering if in her panic, she misheard. Either way, if the plane was truly going down, I don't think a pilot would announce it to the entire aircraft?

Quoting bond007 (Reply 19): Well, not to stick up for the news companies, but all it seems they did here was to report what a witness said. It was also reported on CNN, with some comments on what 'might' have actually been said, but she sticks by what she says she heard over the PA.

Quoting bond007 (Reply 19): Yes, they are going to report it - that's their business.

The question is why are they reporting it in the first place? It's not a newsworthy story. Their business is to report newsworthy stories...

[Edited 2013-11-14 11:32:27]

In my experience, sometimes PA announcements are very hard to hear, either because of engine noise, people talking loudly, or just low volume on the PA system. That might be why she didn't hear the whole thing.

Bob Bradley

Quoting Arcrftlvr (Reply 20): The question is why are they reporting it. It's not a newsworthy story. Their business is to report newsworthy stories...

Sure it's newsworthy ....by definition - it's on the news. Most emergency landings make the local news, and many national news, especially when a witness apparently hears "we're going down".

The news media defines what's 'newsworthy' and we define who the news media is ... by watching and buying their product.

Jimbo

Quoting Arcrftlvr (Reply 20): Their business is to report newsworthy stories...

Unfortunately, you're wrong. Their business SHOULD be to report newsworthy stories. In reality, their business is to report sensational stories--so they can literally scare up customers for advertisers.

I'm married to a pilot, and I've experienced emergency descents. A pilot simply wouldn't make a PA stating "We're going down." The passenger in this video is certainly emotional and seeking attention.

[Edited 2013-11-14 11:44:49]

Has anyone tried to find the liveatc.net feed? Although it wouldn't record what he said to the cabin, it would give us a sense of tone and of nomenclature.

Also, for all the talk about people clawing at the overheads to get the masks to deploy (?!!), it seems like perhaps this was a false alarm and that's why they didn't. Should have been easy enough for the FO to look up and see what the cabin altitude actually showed, regardless of the "maintenance warning". Also, can't they manually deploy the masks from the flight deck on the 737 if that was necessary. I would be curious as to what the warning actually was -- I seriously doubt it was the cabin altitude horn. (I say "horn", but have they changed it to a different warning since the Helios nincompoops missed it?

[Edited 2013-11-14 12:10:10]

[Edited 2013-11-14 12:15:49]

Quoting Arcrftlvr (Reply 20): I don't think a pilot would announce it to the entire aircraft?

He simply wouldn´t have time, or even remember to make such an announcement.

Could it be (IF there was in fact this descent and blah-blah-blah) that he was saying something to alert the FAs since they would still be up and about at this point? (Of course if the pilot had said nothing at all the story could have been "Passengers terrified by sudden drop in altitude... According to one passenger, "The pilot didn't even say anything to warn us, we were terrified! We had a right to know what was going on!!!!")

Quoting Reply 23): Their business SHOULD be to report newsworthy stories.

I think you're confusing 'newsworthy' with relevant important events around the world  

The BBC about 40 years ago might have been the only news agency concerned with the latter - now it's whatever they think the public will watch - and they are more interested apparently in sensationalism and celebrities.

Jimbo

Quoting BIZJETTECH (Reply 18): That's an impressive decent, must have been quite a ride.

I would have been if it were structurally possible.

Should this women seek compensation for her "emotional torment", is this something they would turn to the CVR to settle?

Quoting SouthernDC9 (Reply 26): Could it be (IF there was in fact this descent and blah-blah-blah) that he was saying something to alert the FAs since they would still be up and about at this point?

THAT is exactly what I was thinking...

I read another pax account that the FA's couldn't get ahold of the FD (or something along those lines) so it's possible that the FD simply made a PA instead of calling the FA's just in case they were in the cabin tending to pax vs near there jumpseats.

Quoting Arcrftlvr (Reply 20): The question is why are they reporting it in the first place? It's not a newsworthy story. Their business is to report newsworthy stories...

It's a slow news day...

Quoting WNCrew (Reply 30): I read another pax account that the FA's couldn't get ahold of the FD (or something along those lines) so it's possible that the FD simply made a PA instead of calling the FA's just in case they were in the cabin tending to pax vs near there jumpseats.

My humble opinion... some kind of Alert, QRH says descend to FLxxx, Crew calls ATC to declare emergency and inform them of intent. Then switches to cabin PA to make announcement. Before announcement can be made, ATC asks if they have started descent. Pilot keys mic and states "we're going down" thinking he's on COM1 but unintentionally broadcasts it over the PA. Ooops. No one has ever accidentally answered an ATC call on the Cabin PA before.

I also believe there was probably a later announcement with some explanations.... but that's not nearly as sensational to report.

I could be wrong though...

In that the flight deck received a pressurization alarm. I would think protocol mandates the the pilot and first officer don oxygen masks which could easily muffle communication.

Quoting bcoz (Reply 16): Time: Lat Long Crs Direction KTS MPH ALT RATE Facility 05:32PM 33.4733 -80.9678 29° Northeast 497 572 41,000 -60 Level Jacksonville Center 05:33PM 33.5950 -80.8853 29° Northeast 497 572 40,900 -600 Descending Jacksonville Center 05:34PM 33.7189 -80.8025 29° Northeast 497 572 39,900 -2,100 Descending Jacksonville Center 05:35PM 33.8447 -80.7197 29° Northeast 497 572 36,700 -3,720 Descending Jacksonville Center 05:36PM 33.9747 -80.6361 28° Northeast 504 580 32,500 -9,900 Descending Jacksonville Center 05:37PM 34.0919 -80.5356 35° Northeast 509 586 17,000 -4,980 Descending Jacksonville Center 05:38PM 34.2086 -80.4219 39° Northeast 522 601 22,600 1,320 Climbing Jacksonville Center 05:39PM 34.3111 -80.3283 37° Northeast 505 581 19,700 -3,300 Descending Jacksonville Center

Quoting barney captain (Reply 17): So according to that, in one minute they went from 32,500 to 17000 feet? Ah yea, I call it inaccurate.

Seems to me the 17000 ft at 5:37pm should be a 27000. That would make the rate numbers make sense and would get rid of the high decent rate and then the climb afterwards.

Quoting dragon6172 (Reply 33): Seems to me the 17000 ft at 5:37pm should be a 27000. That would make the rate numbers make sense and would get rid of the high decent rate and then the climb afterwards.

Asking from a position of ignorance here... What would the maximum rate of decent be in terms of maintaining structural integrity and recoverable aerodynamics?

Quoting fxra (Reply 31): My humble opinion... some kind of Alert, QRH says descend to FLxxx, Crew calls ATC to declare emergency and inform them of intent. Then switches to cabin PA to make announcement. Before announcement can be made, ATC asks if they have started descent. Pilot keys mic and states "we're going down" thinking he's on COM1 but unintentionally broadcasts it over the PA. Ooops. No one has ever accidentally answered an ATC call on the Cabin PA before.

New story kinda close.

http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?section=news/local&id=9326090

Southwest told ABC11 Flight 3426 was headed from Tampa to Raleigh when the crew of the Boeing 737 got a warning that there was a cabin pressure problem.

In a statement, the airline said: "As part of the procedure to resolve the issue, the Captain notified the cabin using the public address system that he was going down to a lower altitude just before an unplanned but controlled descent. The maintenance issue was resolved before the flight safely landed at Raleigh-Durham."

In an email to passengers, the airline said as the captain was communicating his plan with the flight attendants, he inadvertently activated the public address system in the cabin.

Quoting ozark1 (Reply 4):

I'm waiting for the one that will be about a passenger's Chihuahua getting loose midflight and going postal.   
As many have said if it bleads, it leads. In the Twitterverse with our peabrained attention spans it has to be sensationalized.

Quoting dragon6172 (Reply 33): Seems to me the 17000 ft at 5:37pm should be a 27000. That would make the rate numbers make sense and would get rid of the high decent rate and then the climb afterwards.

Great catch Dragon! - I agree completely.

That made for one interesting night at RDU. From what I gathered from people I know that work there is the Captain meant to call the FA and let them know they would be making a rapid decent due to a cabin depressurization indication in the cockpit. Instead the Captain accidentally hit the PA button and said we're going down. It was just a mix up but at no time did the PIC lose control of the aircraft. Still pretty scary for the pax onboard i'm sure!

Quoting bcoz (Reply 6): Some of the characterizations made in the story are very over the top. Also --- I don't really buy the "they fixed the plane in 1 hour and it flew on to Baltimore. Looks to me like they canceled the leg of that flight Tuesday night.

Nope, it took about an hour delay and continued on with a replacement aircraft.

So it does appear that even though it was only a mistake the announcement that went out over the PA was "Were going down" which if the right button would have been pressed would have informed the FA's that they were about to make a rapid decent so that they would be prepared for it and could then while the pilots worked on the problem inform the cabin what had happened and if the masks deployed let them know why and that the aircraft had to descend to an altitude as quickly as possible for the air to be breathable without the use of masks in the cabin.

Now looking at this from a passenger point of view they know none of this and all they know is that they hear a PA announcement from the cockpit that says "Were going down" and all of the sudden their plane is dropping out of the sky. I can completely understand why they would have been terrified in those few minuets until the pilots of FA's could make a followup announcement informing the passengers as to what was really going on and calm them down and let them know that the situation is now under control and has been/is being dealt with.

So no I don't blame the passengers for freaking out and I don't blame the media for reporting it. The last part of that report talking about the "problems" WN is having with their 737's and the incident at LGA was completely unrelated however its the media and that is just what they do. They need to put out a product that sells and Im sure that this story got a lot of hits on their website and as in any other business that's exactly what they are looking for. You have to remember that we don't have state run news agencies here in the US so its all a business rather than just a way to get only hard hitting factual information to the citizens. News stations have to run reports that interest people and grab their attention and balance that with the "real" news that needs to be reported.

Quoting Reply 23): Unfortunately, you're wrong. Their business SHOULD be to report newsworthy stories. In reality, their business is to report sensational stories--so they can literally scare up customers for advertisers. I'm married to a pilot, and I've experienced emergency descents. A pilot simply wouldn't make a PA stating "We're going down." The passenger in this video is certainly emotional and seeking attention.

It seems that you are wrong and that announcement was actually made so does that change your opinion about the matter? As I explained before although you think that their business SHOULD be to report what you think are "newsworthy stories" the reality is that these are businesses that put out a product and their real job is to put out a product that people will consume therefore they can make a profit and stay in business. You have to realize that when you watch the news it takes up a time slot just like any other show you watch on TV and if that slot doesn't make money then they cannot stay in business and therefore on the air to bring you any news. Even though you don't believe that this story was "newsworthy" I disagree and I do see it as something that was newsworthy and was fine to see it being reported on. If nothing else the attention this story got will make pilots think twice about the choice of words they use in these sort of situations and maybe be more careful that they are actually talking on the right channel!

Quoting ual747den (Reply 40): does that change your opinion about the matter?

No.

As per my original posting:

Quoting Reply 23): A pilot simply wouldn't make a PA stating "We're going down."

As I understand the newer information, the pilot did not make a PA stating "We're going down." Rather, the passengers heard a small part of a communication indicating that the aircraft was descending to a lower altitude. That is not the same as making a PA stating "We're going down."

Quoting ual747den (Reply 40): we don't have state run news agencies here in the US so its all a business rather than just a way to get only hard hitting factual information to the citizens.

State run news agencies seldom "get only hard hitting factual information to the citizens." The news business in this country is the same.

Quoting ual747den (Reply 40): News stations have to run reports that interest people and grab their attention

So true. Trance-inducing graphics, overly emotive delivery, and victims--especially emotional victims-- definitely grab attention and interest, to the point that:

"...balance...with the 'real' news that needs to be reported" is as rare as joy on a Southwest Airlines plane these days.

Thanks. BTW, I noticed your Airliners.net I.D. My partner flies for UAL. Do you? Interesting times there. But that's for another day. Take care.