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tlecam
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DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 3:05 pm

http://www.gainesville.com/article/20131202/ARTICLES/131209942?tc=cr

The synopsis of the article is that Delta was scheduled to charter the University of Florida men's hoops team to Connecticutt for a game against UConn.

The original plane scheduled for the charter had mechanical issues. Delta then cancelled another commercial flight to ATL, telling the passengers that there were mechanical issues. Passengers saw the hoops team boarding their plane. Passengers were offered vouchers and so forth.

I've read elsewhere on a.net that airlines do cancel commercial flights from time to time to accomodate charters, and this would be an example of that practice, if true.

My purpose in posting this isn't to slam DL. I'm curious as to the rules that allow this practice. Airlines need the ability to swap aircraft due to mechanical issues. Is cancelling a commercial flight for a charter any different than cancelling a commercial flight to serve another commercial flight when there are mechanical issues at play?

I can see where DL will receive some PR backlash from this - looks like they're giving the UF hoops team special treatment. There probably isn't a great way to handle this situation from a PR standpoint.
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deltalaw
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DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 3:15 pm

Sports charters are big $$$ for airlines, plus there could have been stiff penalties for failing to get the team to Storrs, CT for the game.
 
glbltrvlr
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DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 3:16 pm

America West pulled a similar stunt some years ago on a flight I was on. We stopped in PHX on a direct flight to another city and were told "due to mechanical issues" that we had to get off the plane and take a later flight. Everyone of course assumed that meant the issues were with the plane we were on. As we left the gate area, a PA announcement in the terminal was telling people wanting to go to Tucson should report to our gate immediately.

I'm sure it made sense from AW's perspective to do this, but it was annoying as all get out.
 
SJCMSP
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DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 3:25 pm

I'm just trying to picture a basketball player trying to fit into the window seat of a CRJ.
 
DeltaRules
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DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 5:38 pm

Quoting SJCMSP (Reply 3):
I'm just trying to picture a basketball player trying to fit into the window seat of a CRJ.

I was on a PSA CR7 last Friday and was asked to give up the exit seat to a basketball player. Needless to say, there were quite a few guys cramped on THAT plane. I bet it'd be miserable for them on a 50-seat CRJ.
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Josh32121
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DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 6:17 pm

Strictly speaking, it's not untrue that the flight cancellation was attributable to mechanical issues. It just happened that the mechanical issues didn't affect the aircraft originally assigned to the scheduled flight. But aircraft get swapped all the time. If the passengers were compensated (as they presumably were) for the inconvenience, why is this such a big deal? DL made a business decision to maintain its charter agreement SLA at the expense of a scheduled flight.

Airlines can basically cancel whatever flights they want for any reason as long as they follow any rules/laws related to refunding the fare paid or other denied boarding compensation and are willing to deal with any PR or customer goodwill backlash.
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richardw
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 6:46 pm

Hallelujah! for EU regulation EC261/2004 which would mean a cash payment of compensation if this happened in the EU.

[Edited 2013-12-03 10:47:20]
 
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enilria
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 6:48 pm

Quoting tlecam (Thread starter):
I've read elsewhere on a.net that airlines do cancel commercial flights from time to time to accomodate charters, and this would be an example of that practice, if true.

Most of the time the passenger flight is cancelled 40+ days in advance, but in these cases a team playing a game is given priority over the commoners on a regular flight.

Quoting tlecam (Thread starter):
Is cancelling a commercial flight for a charter any different than cancelling a commercial flight to serve another commercial flight when there are mechanical issues at play?

The only issue is that the charterer probably had a lot more power in the negotiation of the terms of their transportation than the regular passengers...

Quoting deltalaw (Reply 1):

Sports charters are big $$$ for airlines, plus there could have been stiff penalties for failing to get the team to Storrs, CT for the game.

...and yes there are probably penalties if they miss the game, although I'm sure the airline has some general language in their to protect them from "acts of god" and it's very hard to prove the difference between an "act of god" and just a normal flight cancellation. It probably says they must make "best efforts" to get the team there and that probably includes cancelling other flights.

Quoting Josh32121 (Reply 5):
and are willing to deal with any PR or customer goodwill backlash.

Realistically sports fans are more likely to be upset by blaming Delta for a defaulted game than people caring about you getting bumped for that team. So, really PR is on their side in most cases.
 
Birdwatching
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 6:51 pm

Kind of off-topic, but I've always wondered about this:

On a charter flight, would the passengers earn miles?

Soren   
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max999
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 7:01 pm

Quoting Josh32121 (Reply 5):
Airlines can basically cancel whatever flights they want for any reason as long as they follow any rules/laws related to refunding the fare paid or other denied boarding compensation and are willing to deal with any PR or customer goodwill backlash.

The crappy thing is that airlines won't compensate you for lost wages and productivity. So if there isn't an available flight/seat to your destination for a long time...you could potentially get screwed out of your wages.

And if all airlines acted like Ryanair, they would have cancelled the flight and left everyone stranded because a cancellation does not guarantee the customer an alternate flight.
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ytib
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 7:06 pm

Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 8):
On a charter flight, would the passengers earn miles?

Depends on the airline, PMUA did give miles on their charters but I am not sure if that practice is still in place after the merger.
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Josh32121
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 7:14 pm

Quoting max999 (Reply 9):
The crappy thing is that airlines won't compensate you for lost wages and productivity. So if there isn't an available flight/seat to your destination for a long time...you could potentially get screwed out of your wages.

...which is why this happens relatively infrequently. If it happened all the time, no one would fly them because they would be unreliable. That's the intangible cost of cancelling a scheduled flight to use the aircraft for a paid charter flight: the risk of lost trust.

All you should ever really expect to receive is a refund of what you paid for something originally if that thing can't be delivered on the original terms--be it goods or services. Anything more than that is icing on the cake.

Every airline passenger is taking a calculated risk by flying hundreds or thousands of miles away from home and expecting to return home at a precise date and time in the future. There is always a chance (however small) that the return ticket will turn out to be worthless when he/she expects to return home because the airline cannot or will not fly the passenger home when it originally said it would.
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Maverick623
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 7:16 pm

Quoting tlecam (Thread starter):

Is cancelling a commercial flight for a charter any different than cancelling a commercial flight to serve another commercial flight when there are mechanical issues at play?

Nope. The decision process is the same, and the outcome is the same: one flight gets an airplane while the other doesn't.

Quoting max999 (Reply 9):
The crappy thing is that airlines won't compensate you for lost wages and productivity.

Neither will the railways, bus lines, or auto manufacturers (when your car breaks down). Why should airlines be any different?

When you travel, you take the risk of not getting to where you are going on time.
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SANFan
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 7:57 pm

Quoting tlecam (Thread starter):
My purpose in posting this isn't to slam DL.

Why not? I think they deserve it.

bb
 
Markam
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 8:44 pm

Quoting Josh32121 (Reply 11):
All you should ever really expect to receive is a refund of what you paid for something originally if that thing can't be delivered on the original terms--be it goods or services. Anything more than that is icing on the cake.

I don't think I can agree with you, many contracts in many industries include compensation clauses if one of the parties fails to fulfill it, so I do not think that expecting compensation for a last minute cancellation is really over the top. As mentioned before by someone else, the passenger may incur many costs which will not be covered by simply getting a refund for the original ticket. Also, airlines themselves are pretty picky when it comes to passengers' punctuality (try arriving a few hours late for your flight at the airport arguing that your car had "mechanical issues"), so I have never understood why they want to be exempt from any punctuality expectations on their side. Finally, mechanical issues are not "acts of god", they are highly dependent on fleet age, maintenance, etc., which are very much under the control of the airlines... that they can get away with it so often in most countries is beyond me. For example, "mechanical issues" is not a valid exemption from regulation EC261/2004 under EU law... which I guess is probably the reason why "weather issues" is the preferred excuse by airlines subject to it.   
 
FlyASAGuy2005
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:02 pm

Quoting max999 (Reply 9):
And if all airlines acted like Ryanair, they would have cancelled the flight and left everyone stranded because a cancellation does not guarantee the customer an alternate flight.

But a cancellation doesn't guarantee an alternate flight. Not just Ryanair. I mean it's terribel service and almost unheard of for such things to happen now-a-days but it isn't outside the realm of possibility. All the airplne is obligated to do is refund the unflown portion multiplied by x amount depending on when you'd be getting to your final (arragned by Delta or left to the wolves). So if it's within 2 hours its multiplied by x and if it's over 2 hours its multiplied by y up to a certain amount.

Quoting SANFan (Reply 13):
Why not? I think they deserve it.

bb

HAd it not been the charter it would have been another scheduled fligth so again, what's the point. The airplane was broke. Something had to cancel. If the charter didn't get the airplane another scheduled flight would have and someone would have still be screwed.
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tlecam
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:10 pm

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 12):
Nope. The decision process is the same, and the outcome is the same: one flight gets an airplane while the other doesn't.

Thanks, this is what I was trying to understand.

Quoting SANFan (Reply 13):
Why not? I think they deserve it.

bb

A few reasons, not the least of which is that in the short time I've been a member on A.NET, slamming this airline or that airline or this manufacturer or that manufacturer just provokes a lot of arguing and is never resolved. One of the first conversations I ever read on this site was about the 764.

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 15):
HAd it not been the charter it would have been another scheduled fligth so again, what's the point. The airplane was broke. Something had to cancel. If the charter didn't get the airplane another scheduled flight would have and someone would have still be screwed.

This is another reason why I wasn't slamming DL; I was just trying to understand the decision process and the ops impact.
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TonyBurr
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:27 pm

Well thank goodness airlines NEVER LIE to the passengers.
 
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barney captain
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:45 pm

Quoting richardw (Reply 6):
Hallelujah! for EU regulation EC261/2004 which would mean a cash payment of compensation if this happened in the EU.

Yea, that's what airlines need - more financial "penalties".   

In one article I read, the decision to cnxl the flight was made after the charter had left. They thought they would have the aircraft fixed and simply wanted the charter to depart ontime - smart choice. It was only later that it became apparent that the "fix" would be a much more involved process - at which time, the flight was cnxld.
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ca2ohHP
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:50 pm

There are so many variables in play when a flight is cancelled. Anything from booking loads, re-route options to regular overnight MX checks, aircraft MEL lists, crew availability and on and on. The full depth of the story will probably never be revealed, but 99% of the time it is not as simple as the media portrays it.
 
wjcandee
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:58 pm

The story isn't right.

First of all, no flight "owns" an aircraft.

DL had a charter flight and a commercial flight to get out of the station. The earlier-departing flight had been assigned Aircraft A and that a/c went tech. DL therefore used Aircraft B for that flight, assuming that Aircraft A would be ready for the later flight, perhaps with a short delay. When they realized they couldn't fix the aircraft now assigned to that flight, they rescheduled it and accomodated the pax on other flights.

Like they do every day when aircraft go tech.

Second, even if DL did make the decision of which group to accommodate with the one working aircraft, it's their decision to make. And it's much easier to reaccommodate individual passengers with individual itineraries than it is to do a whole group. And like other posters had mentioned, there are myriad other factors (crew legality, etc.) that go into a dispatching decision.

It was a holiday weekend. Lots of people weren't able to follow their reserved itineraries.

Like happens every day.

Move along. Nothing to see here.

[Edited 2013-12-03 14:00:05]
 
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kann123air
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:06 pm

For an ending like the UConn-Florida game had, I'd be more than willing to accept a cancellation of my flight, haha 
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slider
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:11 pm

Quoting SANFan (Reply 13):
Why not? I think they deserve it.

So what's the difference between this event and the hundreds of times a day throughout the airspace system that airlines have to make cxl decisions?

Just because it was a charter?

Quoting ca2ohHP (Reply 19):
There are so many variables in play when a flight is cancelled. Anything from booking loads, re-route options to regular overnight MX checks, aircraft MEL lists, crew availability and on and on. The full depth of the story will probably never be revealed, but 99% of the time it is not as simple as the media portrays it.

Good points. There's FAR more in this than people realize. Obviously, protecting a charter is important. You can't reprotect a team going to a specific destination as easy as you might be able to rebook revenue pax on later flights to all various destinations. It's a business decision.

And now we crucify DL for making what could be, based on the info known, a smart business decision. had they stranded the team, the same "Delta sucks" chanting would still be as loud.
 
MSPNWA
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:35 pm

Quoting SANFan (Reply 13):
Why not? I think they deserve it.

No kidding. They deserve some criticism for this one. It's not uncommon for charters to be delayed when problems arise. The Gators weren't scheduled to play until the evening of the next day. DL went for the home run and swung and missed.

Another factor is that EV was carrying both flights, and regionals are stretched very thin these days thanks to the legacies. They don't have the volume of reserves when problems arise. So it's part EV and part DL to blame.

Quoting wjcandee (Reply 20):
And it's much easier to reaccommodate individual passengers with individual itineraries than it is to do a whole group.

I'd argue that it's much easier to re-accommodate the charter, especially on a weekend as crazy as Thanksgiving. The sports team is all going to one location and will be sticking together until a plane is ready. And in this case, they weren't playing the day off the flight either. The passengers stranded are going all over the earth and probably don't have the luxury of free time to spare without consequences like missing funerals. So in the end it was probably about who was more important ($), sadly.
 
bcoz
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:54 pm

Quoting Slider (Reply 22):
So what's the difference between this event and the hundreds of times a day throughout the airspace system that airlines have to make cxl decisions?

Just because it was a charter?

As folks have pointed out before (and rightfully so), stuff like this happens every day of the year at airports all over the world.

The issue here, at least in my estimation, is purely one of public relations and not, for lack of a better term, policy.

You are in a small market company town in GNV. College athletes/coaches are already often suspected of getting preferential treatment both in an academic community and by the general public. I would have been upset, too.... and I love college sports and work in higher education.

I'm not sure of the EXACT logistical issues (or how the UF team actually boarded), but what I might have done if I were the GNV station manager is take the charter to a remote stand for processing. I've only ridden an athletic charter once some I am not sure of the specifics, but the processing is not the same as the TSA. My ID was checked, I went through a metal detector and my bag was hand searched, but it was not by a TSA agent.

To me, the issue is less WHAT happened and more HOW it appeared to happen.

bcoz
 
dlramp4life
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:57 pm

Quoting tlecam (Reply 16):
A few reasons, not the least of which is that in the short time I've been a member on A.NET, slamming this airline or that airline or this manufacturer or that manufacturer just provokes a lot of arguing and is never resolved.

AMEN!

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 23):
No kidding. They deserve some criticism for this one. It's not uncommon for charters to be delayed when problems arise. The Gators weren't scheduled to play until the evening of the next day. DL went for the home run and swung and missed.

Here we go again. If DL does something wrong you are the first to slam them. The team getting the charter and DL have an agreement and part of that agreement is that they HAVE a plane AVALIABLE on the DATE they need to leave. Teams usually charter out one or two days BEFORE their game. Not the day of the event.
 
MSPNWA
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 11:22 pm

Quoting dlramp4life (Reply 25):

Here we go again. If DL does something wrong you are the first to slam them. The team getting the charter and DL have an agreement and part of that agreement is that they HAVE a plane AVALIABLE on the DATE they need to leave. Teams usually charter out one or two days BEFORE their game. Not the day of the event.

And here come the excuses again. In this case I'm sure Florida wanted to get to BDL that day. They were scheduled to leave about 3PM and left about 4PM. They arrived just after 6PM. Not bad. There was a lot of day left. If DL can't take the warranted criticism for the poor service, get the heck out of the service industry.
 
prosa
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 11:37 pm

Delta's CEO should be fired and have all his pension benefited forfeited.
It was only a basketball game, totally meaningless.
"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"
 
gigneil
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 11:47 pm

Quoting tlecam (Reply 16):
One of the first conversations I ever read on this site was about the 764.

Which is a silly argument, since its unquestionably the worst aircraft ever built.

NS
 
kevin752
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Tue Dec 03, 2013 11:54 pm

So this is based off an article for the news it seems like. Everyone is just making accusations from the article. How accurate is the article. I work for an airline and half of the time we are never completly sure why a flight is not opperating or delayed. I mean when there is a mechanical or other cancelation or delay no one can be sure why the flight was impacted. Or why the flight suddenly showed a mechanical swap and so on and so forth. I just feel I should put my 2 cents in to the conversation. We all know how the media does not always know what they are talking about when it comes to certain topics. Aviation seems to be one of them they are not well versed in.
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barney captain
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:22 am

Quoting PROSA (Reply 27):
Delta's CEO should be fired and have all his pension benefited forfeited.
It was only a basketball game, totally meaningless.

Well that certainly seems like a rational reaction.  
Southeast Of Disorder
 
skymiler
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:31 am

Was this really DL or a connection carrier, such as Expressjet/ASA? I understand that DL is the front facing carrier/name.

I am sure the CRJ operator took a hit -- a year or so ago when a connection carrier failed to provide a crew for a flight and stranded me, DL took care of me and sent the bill to their contracted carrier!

I wonder what really transpired between DL and the CRJ operator and who really made the decision.
I love to fly, and it shows!
 
SkyTeamTriStar
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:31 am

Read the fine print: "Flights Are Subject To Change Without Notice"

Doesn't every airline have this stated in their "rules"?
 
A346Dude
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:37 am

Good for DL, I'm sure every other airline would do the same thing. Charterers spend big bucks and are usually repeat customers. Most passengers fly maybe once a year and will pick a different airline next year if it means saving $5.

No flight owns a particular aircraft, and any business looks after its best customers first.
You know the gear is up and locked when it takes full throttle to taxi to the terminal.
 
prosa
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:42 am

Yes, by all means fire the CEO. While it's very unlikely he was personally involved with this decision, as the head of the organization he's responsible for huge screw-ups. Interfering with peoples' post-holiday travel plans for something as silly as a basketball game is unacceptable. You can always play the game some other time.
"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"
 
gigneil
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:47 am

Quoting PROSA (Reply 34):
Yes, by all means fire the CEO. While it's very unlikely he was personally involved with this decision, as the head of the organization he's responsible for huge screw-ups. Interfering with peoples' post-holiday travel plans for something as silly as a basketball game is unacceptable. You can always play the game some other time.

That's utter crap, and you know it. This is a minor screwup, hardly even worth the amount of discussion its gotten here.


NS
 
anplatinum
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:50 am

Forget about the $, look at the numbers.

40 people were bumped of which half would be happy to take the compensation and wait for the next flight verses 40 in the basketball group all of which would be upset if they missed the game.
 
prosa
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 1:02 am

It wasn't a "minor screwup" if you had been trying to get back home after traveling for the holiday. At least some of the people probably missed a day of work, as not everyone was able to be accommodated on the same day.
"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"
 
shamrock137
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 1:04 am

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 23):
So in the end it was probably about who was more important ($), sadly.

Yes, this was absolutely about money, but I don't see why its a huge issue. As someone who has worked for all charter airlines and charter/scheduled passenger airlines, when it comes to the schedule, charters always come first. These customers are paying a large amount of money to have a specific aircraft fly a specific route within a tight time frame. Charters are an extremely lucrative business for airlines with large amounts of money to be made. As it has been mentioned, built into many of these contracts are severe penalties for the airline when a change has to be made.

Its much easier to reroute 50 people who are going to different destinations with different time frames. Some may be flexible and be able to spend the night, others can be re-accommodated on different flights or airlines. It is massively more complicated to re-accommodate a charter on a different day. From an operations, financial and customer service point of view Delta did the right thing, and any other airline would make the same choice.
Time to spare? Go by air!
 
FlyASAGuy2005
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 1:13 am

Quoting PROSA (Reply 37):
It wasn't a "minor screwup" if you had been trying to get back home after traveling for the holiday. At least some of the people probably missed a day of work, as not everyone was able to be accommodated on the same day.

Again, Mr. Fire the CEO, what made this different from any other flight that cancels due to an MTC issue. Well then every single CEO or executive around teh globe with airlines should have been fired a very long time ago because I can promise you that there are tons of pissed off people every single day for this very reason.

And I took a look at the flight history and it seems like

Quoting wjcandee (Reply 20):

has it right. It was just bad luck for that flight. The charter was scheduled out before 5059. They used an airplane that was eventually to turn 5059 for the charter but the other a/c continued into a creeping delay then cancelled. There was an MRT for about 20 minutes prior to when 5059 was to depart but it never happened.

I've seen this done before on other flights and it usually works out.
What gets measured gets done.
 
hoons90
Posts: 3799
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2001 10:15 pm

RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 1:34 am

Although I'm not arguing that the airline doesn't have the right to do what they did, I can understand how a lot of controversy can arise form a situation like this. Perhaps the affected passengers are wondering why it is their problem that someone else's plane went tech. I wouldn't blame the passengers if they were upset.
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Maverick623
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 1:35 am

Quoting HOONS90 (Reply 40):
Perhaps the affected passengers are wondering why it is their problem that someone else's plane went tech.

The problem with that is the assumption that they, or their flight number, don't "own" an airplane.
"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
 
hoons90
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 1:47 am

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 41):
The problem with that is the assumption that they, or their flight number, don't "own" an airplane.

You're right, and as I said, the airline has every right to do what they did. However, I wonder if it was possible for Delta to be a bit more straightforward to the passengers as the situation was happening at the gate, as the article above seems to suggest that passengers were told that it was their specific plane that had the mechanical difficulty. It seems a bit misleading to me. Sorry if that wasn't actually the case though, I'm just going by what the article says.

If it's a perfectly acceptable industry practice, I don't see why DL would be skittish to tell the customers the complete truth. I think it would help mitigate some misunderstandings.
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CWAFlyer
Posts: 536
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:33 am

RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:00 am

Quoting enilria (Reply 7):
Most of the time the passenger flight is cancelled 40+ days in advance, but in these cases a team playing a game is given priority over the commoners on a regular flight.

False. They don't know 40 days ahead of time that a plane is going to be broken or otherwise unavailable and a cancel will need to be done to run the charter.
 
CWAFlyer
Posts: 536
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:33 am

RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:02 am

Quoting PROSA (Reply 27):
Delta's CEO should be fired and have all his pension benefited forfeited.
It was only a basketball game, totally meaningless.

Why? It wasn't a Delta flight and it wasn't Richard Anderson's decsion to cancel the flight.
 
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DeltaMD90
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:03 am

It's not uncommon for airlines to take aircraft from one flight and give it to another. Delta has a responsibility to get both set of passengers to their destination... it's not like that airplane had the passengers' name on it. Delta had to weigh what would be worse and from a business sense, I think it was the right decision (from a business standpoint.) The passengers will be mad but I can imagine more outrage had the team not made the flight. One set of passengers got screwed over but think of it this way, how many people would be inconvenienced if the team didn't make the flight?

Of course I'm biased towards DL but I'd like to think I'd think the same way if UA did the same thing

Edit: Had they not done this, we'd have a thread with everyone bashing DL for not getting the team up for the game. Damned if they do, damned if they don't

[Edited 2013-12-03 18:04:49]
 
CWAFlyer
Posts: 536
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:33 am

RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:05 am

Quoting kevin752 (Reply 29):
I work for an airline and half of the time we are never completly sure why a flight is not opperating or delayed.

Call the SOC. I'm fairly certain they would know
 
hoons90
Posts: 3799
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2001 10:15 pm

RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:13 am

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 45):
It's not uncommon for airlines to take aircraft from one flight and give it to another. Delta has a responsibility to get both set of passengers to their destination... it's not like that airplane had the passengers' name on it. Delta had to weigh what would be worse and from a business sense, I think it was the right decision (from a business standpoint.) The passengers will be mad but I can imagine more outrage had the team not made the flight. One set of passengers got screwed over but think of it this way, how many people would be inconvenienced if the team didn't make the flight?

Of course I'm biased towards DL but I'd like to think I'd think the same way if UA did the same thing

Valid points there, but I still think DL staff could handled it a bit better. Of course, aircraft assignments are at the sole discretion of the airline. And of course, just because an aircraft is positioned at a certain gate doesn't mean or imply any sort of ownership between the flight and airframe. However, the average Joe passenger that is not well versed in airline operations can easily (and understandably) assume otherwise, and I think if DL staff actually mentioned in the first place that it was actually a swap with another aircraft that went tech, at least the customers would not feel perplexed as they see people for the other flight board the aircraft at the gate.
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DeltaMD90
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RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:25 am

Quoting HOONS90 (Reply 47):
Valid points there, but I still think DL staff could handled it a bit better.

Probably. We gotta remember, the people interacting with passengers aren't CEOs with MBAs. Most are great people but few often lack tact or just make wrong decisions even they disagree with in retrospect.

I'll admit, I was pretty upset at DL when I read the title, but when I thought about it, I see it as choosing the lesser of two evils and maybe it could have been handled better. No airline, no matter how well run, can avoid incidents like this. It's when they start piling up do we have a big problem
 
prosa
Posts: 5389
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2001 3:24 am

RE: DL Cancels Flight To Accommodate Basketball Charter

Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:27 am

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 45):
think of it this way, how many people would be inconvenienced if the team didn't make the flight

It's just a game. Entertainment. Nothing more.
"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"

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