CBRboy
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 1:53 pm

Quoting 345tas (Reply 147):
the 9/11 hijackers would have been happy to have crashed 4 Namibian Dash 8s into the rainforest.

Ummmn, I agree with your rhetorical point, but Air Namibia doesn't have any Dash 8s, and even if they did, there probably isn't any rainforest within range of where they would be based...  
 
B747forever
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 1:53 pm

Quoting solarflyer22 (Reply 151):
Having said that, this plane had a low number of passengers like the 9/11 flights. That makes me a little suspicious but I still think its some type of acciden

A 80% load factor (227/282) is not low. The flight was pretty busy.
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SKAirbus
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 1:56 pm

Quoting polnebmit (Reply 152):
Is there a possibility that the aircraft went down on the South China Sea side of the Vietnamese pennisula and the rescue operations may be focusing on the wrong location? It could be that the aircraft still continued on its own power for a certain period of time before it went down. Loss of communications doesn't mean that everything went downhill at that moment. Or am I wrong?

If you look at reply 131, you will see that a large field of debris has been spotted off Ho Chi Minh City, which is on that side of Vietnam. I think ships are being sent their now... looking at the photo, it seems like it could be the wreckage.
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gosimeon
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 1:56 pm

Reports another flight has seen the wreckage:

Picture on Twitter: https://twitter.com/Bruciebabe/status/443002497498509313/photo/1

Location: N9.72 E107.42

Unconfirmed so far.
 
vfw614
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 1:57 pm

Quoting SEPilot (Reply 136):
I am thinking that the stolen passports are red herrings. Why would a terrorist need a stolen passport? While it may be the case if he is unable to obtain a legitimate one, but most people can. I believe all of the 9/11 hijackers had legitimate passports. If it is a suicide mission then it will not matter.

To get on an international flight to a destination for which you need a visa, but not the person you arepretending to be.

Quoting 345tas (Reply 147):
To the poster who said terrorists don't care so much what flights they are on, that is demonstrably not the case. By that logic, the 9/11 hijackers would have been happy to have crashed 4 Namibian Dash 8s into the rainforest.

That was me and it depends who your enemy is. The 9/11 terrorists did not blow up airplanes in flight as an act of terror, they flew airplanes into US hallmarks. How about, for example, UTA flight 772 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UTA_Flight_772) or the shoe bomber? If we are looking at terrorists who have some beef with Malaysia or China, it is probably more important to target a flight that takes off from KUL or goes to PEK and is related to those states in some way. Given that, it could even be an explanation why the flights by EY and QR were not used. If you try to book a KUL-AMS oneway flight at short notice, the cheapest options at the moment usually are EY via AUH or MH via PEK, so the chances that you are getting it offered MH/CZ without explicitly asking for a specific, unusual routing - like a terrorist (or spotter...) - but for a cheap ticket like the average traveller are good.

I am not saying that it points at terrorists, but it does not rule them out either.

[Edited 2014-03-10 07:00:59]

[Edited 2014-03-10 07:02:08]
 
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flyingturtle
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 1:58 pm

Quoting fotoflyer71 (Reply 150):
Without going through all those AF447 posts all over again, can anyone remember what the radar situation was like? I seem to remember that, in fairly short order, radar position data was published showing a signficant turn - is that correct? I don't think there was any altitude data though right? So in that instance, we had ACARS data showing that something crazy happened and radar data showing at least some positional information. Here we have absolutely nada after the flightradar24 plot ends.

MH370: Yes, there are reports about the airplane turning (back). For this moment of disappearance, we also have altitude information about MH370.

AF447: No radar, no ADS-B - the only information we had was the flight plan and the ACARS messages.

David
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SKAirbus
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 1:58 pm

Quoting gosimeon (Reply 156):
Reports another flight has seen the wreckage:

In the same area as the other flight? Is this the same debris?
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CBRboy
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 1:59 pm

Quoting fotoflyer71 (Reply 150):
Without going through all those AF447 posts all over again, can anyone remember what the radar situation was like? I seem to remember that, in fairly short order, radar position data was published showing a signficant turn - is that correct? I don't think there was any altitude data though right? So in that instance, we had ACARS data showing that something crazy happened and radar data showing at least some positional information. Here we have absolutely nada after the flightradar24 plot ends.

AF447 went down in mid-Atlantic where there was no radar coverage. The only information available was from their position reports to Brazilian ATC and from the aircraft via ACARS.
 
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flyingturtle
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:00 pm

Quoting gosimeon (Reply 156):

...this is already reported on the avherald.com site. See my reply #107 in this thread, I've pasted a map of the last known position and the newly discovered debris (?) field.


David
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windshear
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:00 pm

Quoting cbrboy (Reply 122):
If correct, this information seems to end the terrorism theory

Why does it end the terrorism theory? the 9/11 terrorists also bought their tickets, and on J class even
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ASA
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:01 pm

Quoting capri (Reply 143):

if they turned off all communication and transporders, they could all be in pacific and people are looking in wrong places

can they avoid all military and civilian radars along the way?

or does South China Sea offers enough uncovered area for an aircraft to get away undetected? they would have fuel to fly 7-8 hours probably ... could some remote island in western Pacific or the Indonesian archipelago be reachable?
 
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:01 pm

Quoting SKAirbus (Reply 159):
In the same area as the other flight? Is this the same debris?

I don't think so. From the Av Herald:

Hong Kong’s Air Traffic Control Center reported on Mar 10th 2014 around 17:30L (09:30Z) that an airliner enroute on airway L642 reported via HF radio that they saw a large field of debris at position N9.72 E107.42 about 80nm southeast of Ho Chi Minh City, about 50nm off the south-eastern coast of Vietnam in the South China Sea and about 281nm northeast of the last known radar position. Ships have been dispatched to the reported debris field.
 
B747forever
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:02 pm

Quoting cbrboy (Reply 160):
AF447 went down in mid-Atlantic where there was no radar coverage. The only information available was from their position reports to Brazilian ATC and from the aircraft via ACARS.

And yet debris was found within a day or two.
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rj777
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:03 pm

A comment on that Twitter link said that it just looks like water. However, I hope he's wrong. I know, I know hundreds of people have said the same thing whenever something that possibly resembles wreckage has been "found."
 
theaviator380
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:04 pm

Good from China, deploying Satellite.

Quoting gosimeon (Reply 156):

Yes, this was discussed while ago.
 
vfw614
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:05 pm

Quoting SKAirbus (Reply 155):
If you look at reply 131, you will see that a large field of debris has been spotted off Ho Chi Minh City, which is on that side of Vietnam. I think ships are being sent their now... looking at the photo, it seems like it could be the wreckage.

Then MH2370 must have flown even further north as the currents in that part of the South China Sea are north > southwest. Guess we are talking then about more than 300nm past the last contact and also past airports such as SGN. Not very likely IMHO.

[Edited 2014-03-10 07:37:36]
 
michi
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:05 pm

Quoting gosimeon (Reply 164):
I don't think so.

Well, your position and the avherald position are about 1000m apart.

Looks the same to me.
 
gosimeon
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:06 pm

Quoting theaviator380 (Reply 167):
Yes, this was discussed while ago.
Quoting flyingturtle (Reply 161):
...this is already reported on the avherald.com site. See my reply #107 in this thread, I've pasted a map of the last known position and the newly discovered debris (?) field.

Sorry folks - so much new content on this thread it's hard to keep track.
 
spacecadet
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:06 pm

Quoting BuyantUkhaa (Reply 131):
Again, let's see if it really is debris, but that photo posted on avherald looks more convincing than anything we've seen so far:

What am I looking at at the very top of that photo? It looks like part of the wing of the plane taking the *photo* is damaged, but that can't be right. That's definitely not a piece of debris sitting on the water, though.
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wjcandee
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:07 pm

Quoting wingz (Reply 114):
What about the possibility of a fuel tank explosion, as happened to TWA800.

One hundred percent impossible.

Look, the only reason that the fuel in TWA800's tanks could explode is that a portion was concentrated, explosive vapor.

The only reason there was vapor in the tanks is that the a/c packs were running on the ground for an extended period of time under a mostly-empty center wing tank, which wasn't and wouldn't be filled for a quick hop to Paris. The ability of the a/c on the ground to heat the tank fuel wasn't well-understood at the time. Indeed, it wasn't perceived as possible that the vapor would be as significant as it was.

Once TWA 800 took off and started climbing into the much-much-colder atmosphere, the tank fuel started cooling by convection from the metal airframe. As the tank cooled, the vapor condensed into liquid. The source of ignition has never been proved, but it is assumed to be a spark from the fuel tank pump (which had been expressly-designed so such a spark wasn't possible). Somewhere in the report on the accident, there's a calculation of how much longer the a/c would have had to have been climbing before a spark would have been totally-ineffective in causing an explosion. It was a matter of a couple more minutes.

At altitude, where the outside temperature is between -50 to -60 degrees C (-58 to -76 degrees F), you're not going to have the same ability for the fuel to be in a concentrated vapor form such that it could be ignited by a small spark in the manner assumed to be the mechanism by which the TWA 800 fuel was ignited.
 
s5daw
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:08 pm

Quoting spacecadet (Reply 171):
What am I looking at at the very top of that photo? It looks like part of the wing of the plane taking the *photo* is damaged, but that can't be right. That's definitely not a piece of debris sitting on the water, though.

No no, look closer... it's probably aileron / flap actuator or sth. similar.
 
SKAirbus
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:10 pm

Quoting rj777 (Reply 166):
A comment on that Twitter link said that it just looks like water. However, I hope he's wrong. I know, I know hundreds of people have said the same thing whenever something that possibly resembles wreckage has been "found."

I'm sure people in the aircraft had a much clearer view than what is seen in the picture, which is slightly pixelated.. and if an airliner saw the wreckage from high up, maybe they are on to something?
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michi
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:11 pm

Quoting gosimeon (Reply 164):
can they avoid all military and civilian radars along the way?


As I was asking before: Is there a map available showing the primary radar coverage of this area?

Until not knowing anything about the primary radar coverage in this area, speculation regarding not being seen on radar is a bit pointless, isn't it?

Secondary radar is pointless as well, as there are many reasons not being visible on them.
 
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BoeingVista
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:12 pm

Quoting flyingturtle (Reply 158):
AF447: No radar, no ADS-B - the only information we had was the flight plan and the ACARS messages.

I think that the ACARS had some location data though..

Quoting SKAirbus (Reply 155):
f you look at reply 131, you will see that a large field of debris has been spotted off Ho Chi Minh City, which is on that side of Vietnam. I think ships are being sent their now... looking at the photo, it seems like it could be the wreckage.

That looks more like a debris field but could be something else of course.
BV
 
CBRboy
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:14 pm

Quoting windshear (Reply 162):
Why does it end the terrorism theory? the 9/11 terrorists also bought their tickets, and on J class even

Because, given that the two stolen passport holders do not seem to have crashed the MH plane (instead of the QR or EY flights they were initially booked on) into anything, and no-one has claimed responsibility for bringing down MH370, there does not seem to have been a terrorist outcome. And, as another poster has said, if the travel agent can be believed, how can you conceive of a terrorist booking the cheapest flight via anywhere as the target? There's no motive!
 
mdavies06
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:14 pm

Quoting gosimeon (Reply 164):

Quoting SKAirbus (Reply 159):
In the same area as the other flight? Is this the same debris?

I don't think so. From the Av Herald:

Hong Kong’s Air Traffic Control Center reported on Mar 10th 2014 around 17:30L (09:30Z) that an airliner enroute on airway L642 reported via HF radio that they saw a large field of debris at position N9.72 E107.42 about 80nm southeast of Ho Chi Minh City, about 50nm off the south-eastern coast of Vietnam in the South China Sea and about 281nm northeast of the last known radar position. Ships have been dispatched to the reported debris field.
Hong Kong news channel TVB said the sighting was reported by a CX flight operating HKG-KUL or HKG-SIN.

[Edited 2014-03-10 07:15:30]

[Edited 2014-03-10 07:17:29]

[Edited 2014-03-10 07:33:27]
 
LTC8K6
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:15 pm

I hope they are not running around to every report, and neglecting the area of the last known position.
 
flyenthu
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:24 pm

What really makes me wonder is that how with so much security layers these days, X-ray machines, body scanners, metal detectors etc., how can someone, if this was foul play, carry things like explosives onto a plane? Also, what about checked-in baggage security measures? If this indeed were deliberate human act, so many security measures had to have failed. I am sure many are asking these questions.
 
rj777
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:26 pm

My question is.......... when we finally DO find the plane...... (which realistically will be wreckage).... will people be celebrating or getting even more upset?
 
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fotoflyer71
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:26 pm

Thanks for the correction cbrboy - I remember seeing map plots but you're right, they were from position reports.
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Finn350
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:27 pm

Here is a map showing the current and expanded search areas

http://twitter.com/501Awani/status/443007706735968257

I still don't get why they are looking West of the peninsula.
 
greenair727
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:27 pm

I’ve read the holders of the stolen passports were destined to AMS, while another story said FRA and CPH. As we know, the stolen passports got these folks on the plane. But once they arrive “home” according to the passports they now hold, wouldn’t their home country scan it as they enter---and even if the airline’s system didn’t pick them up as stolen documents, wouldn’t at least the home government’s system raise a flag? OR are passports not scanned, and folks just waived in with a ‘welcome home’? I’ve seen that in Europe, but haven’t entered Europe in a while. Or are certain ports of entry easier than others—one scans the passports of all entrants (citizens and not citizens), while another just waives the citizens in after visually looking at the passport? (The US always scans all passports---citizens and not—at entry.)

IF it is standard procedure these days to scan each entering passport AND the home (issuing) countries would have immediately known that the document being scanned was stolen, then using a stolen passport to illegally enter AMS/FRA/CPH would not have worked. And if this is the case, did the provider/seller of the passports know this or was the plan that they would never attempt to enter into Europe. If so, a strong argument can be made for terrorism.
 
AT
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:28 pm

One thing I still have not figured out is why it is at all possible to turn a transponder off voluntarily. One would think that these are programmed so that they cannot be turned off while the aircraft is in the air.
 
flyenthu
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:30 pm

Quoting rj777 (Reply 184):
My question is.......... when we finally DO find the plane...... (which realistically will be wreckage).... will people be celebrating or getting even more upset?

It may bring some solace, but it will not be any easier on loved ones. For the search crew it will be bittersweet if I had to suspect.
 
nupogodi
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:31 pm

Quoting michi (Reply 175):

I am curious about public availability of primary radar data too, but I have not yet seen such a thing on the Internet. I believe it is also possible that primary radar can often be of such an age that it predates the Internet itself. Furthermore, an ATC poster further up the thread has said that it's unlikely they would have primary radar covering the flight levels. If this is true, then military radar is our best hope, but it would be amusing to pitch them on the idea of making that publicly available.
A man must know how to look before he can hope to see.
 
hohd
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:32 pm

If it is a mechanical failure, and it looks like it could be, especially with an earlier wing repair, Boeing should be assisting more in locating this aircraft. Any one flying on a 777 would feel secure if any fixes needed has been done.
 
Stabilator
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:33 pm

Quoting chieft (Reply 12):
data are not sent to the maintenance basis live and constantly. Technically it shouldn't be a problem. A loss of a FDR would then not be so dramatic.

A given airline with hundreds or thousands of flights a day would require massive amounts of storage capacity, and huge centers to collect the data. Why waste a ton of money on all of that when there are rarely any crashes?
So we beat on against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past.
 
nupogodi
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:34 pm

Quoting AT (Reply 188):
One thing I still have not figured out is why it is at all possible to turn a transponder off voluntarily. One would think that these are programmed so that they cannot be turned off while the aircraft is in the air.

Two reasons. Transponders can misbehave and sometimes need to be power-cycled as a diagnostic step during flight. Second, circuit breakers. Any part of the electrical system needs to be able to be disconnected due to a number of reasons.

Third - and I know I said two - aircraft are not built with the assumption that flight crew will attempt to down the aircraft. While this has happened, there are valid reasons for cutting electrical power to the transponder and that is good enough.
A man must know how to look before he can hope to see.
 
Westjet_737
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:35 pm

Quoting greenair727 (Reply 187):
IF it is standard procedure these days to scan each entering passport AND the home (issuing) countries would have immediately known that the document being scanned was stolen, then using a stolen passport to illegally enter AMS/FRA/CPH would not have worked. And if this is the case, did the provider/seller of the passports know this or was the plan that they would never attempt to enter into Europe. If so, a strong argument can be made for terrorism.

I'm not sure about how exactly it works in the EU, but neither itinerary to be used by the stolen passport holders passed through any of the issuing countries.
 
marosbts
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:36 pm

The fact that they are searching west/south of the peninsula looks to me like them saying that their national air defense is so bad that you can fly with a large airliner through the country and remain undetected. Not something the generals would like to admit.
 
na
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:36 pm

I wonder wether the Malaysian authorities already know what happened and are hiding it. I mean, this plane cant disappear without sending out its regular automatic messages. These messages are known to the authorities.
 
washingtonflyer
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:37 pm

If this had been terrorism (i.e., a bomb), one would have expected the plane to basically drop out of the sky then and there - explosive decompression at FL350 means almost a guaranteed crash into the ocean. This would mean that the FlightRadar plot would have basically pinpointed the location of the crash - within a few miles. One would almost have certainly expected debris to have been ejected from the explosion (seats, panels, skin fragments, carry on luggage, insulation, etc.). None of that has been found. None.

Same thing with a breakup. Where are panels? Where are the floating shoes? Where are the seat cushions? Apparently nowhere where the radar lost its transponder contact....
 
KFlyer
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:38 pm

Given that this is actually a commercial air crew (that is probably used to flying on this route) that reported this - I'm inclined to think that this debris field might likely be the real one. However let's be hopeful.
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LTC8K6
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:38 pm

There's no indication of anything yet, except that 9M-MRO is missing.

The debris field, when it's finally located might be our first clue as to what happened. But even that is being distorted by the ocean as the hours pass.

Right now, we have only the barest of info.

The plane is missing, there were no calls for help, and data and radar were lost around 41 minutes into the flight near IGARI waypoint.

I must admit that I am beginning to wonder about the search effort.
 
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Buyantukhaa
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:39 pm

Quoting spacecadet (Reply 171):
What am I looking at at the very top of that photo? It looks like part of the wing of the plane taking the *photo* is damaged, but that can't be right. That's definitely not a piece of debris sitting on the water, though.

It's the flap track mechanism of the Twin Otter:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-9X09-JgaJME/Ut1kHpkmiZI/AAAAAAAACsE/M-NMmfflOAM/s1600/1998-T1-19-2000.jpg
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Starlionblue
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:39 pm

Quoting theaviator380 (Reply 142):
Any one surprised, no statement or any information from Boeing or NTSB (as US national was involved) ? I know too early to jump to a conclusion however no statements or whatsoever yet from those 2? (Unless I have missed it).

Neither Boeing nor the NTSB can really do much right now since there is practically no data to base an investigation on.

Quoting nupogodi (Reply 144):

Quoting theaviator380 (Reply 142):
Looks like Chinese officials are frustrated that Malaysian authority haven't had any luck whatsoever in this situation yet. They have sent 10 officials as a aid to help in this mission.

Based on the content of the press conference, the apparently poor organization of the SAR effort, and the completely boneheaded reporting coming out of the country ("They look Asian, wait no they don't one of them is black, the plane turned around, wait no they didn't, a pilot made contact wait no he didn't"), they seem wholly incompetent - or at least incapable of dealing with a disaster of this magnitude. The more foreign assistance, the better.

This was even commented on in a New Straits Times editorial this morning: http://www.nst.com.my/opinion/letter...od-communication-strategy-1.504815

Quoting hohd (Reply 191):
If it is a mechanical failure, and it looks like it could be, especially with an earlier wing repair, Boeing should be assisting more in locating this aircraft. Any one flying on a 777 would feel secure if any fixes needed has been done.

And how could Boeing help besides analyzing ADS-B data (done in 30 seconds)? They are not a search and rescue organizatoin.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
redadeco
Posts: 114
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 5:13 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:39 pm

Quoting greenair727 (Reply 187):
I’ve read the holders of the stolen passports were destined to AMS, while another story said FRA and CPH. As we know, the stolen passports got these folks on the plane. But once they arrive “home” according to the passports they now hold, wouldn’t their home country scan it as they enter---and even if the airline’s system didn’t pick them up as stolen documents, wouldn’t at least the home government’s system raise a flag? OR are passports not scanned, and folks just waived in with a ‘welcome home’? I’ve seen that in Europe, but haven’t entered Europe in a while. Or are certain ports of entry easier than others—one scans the passports of all entrants (citizens and not citizens), while another just waives the citizens in after visually looking at the passport? (The US always scans all passports---citizens and not—at entry.)

IF it is standard procedure these days to scan each entering passport AND the home (issuing) countries would have immediately known that the document being scanned was stolen, then using a stolen passport to illegally enter AMS/FRA/CPH would not have worked. And if this is the case, did the provider/seller of the passports know this or was the plan that they would never attempt to enter into Europe. If so, a strong argument can be made for terrorism.

In a nutshell, what you need to know is that in all EU airports there are 2 sections for immigration, one for EU citizens and the other one for other passports holders. If we assume that the main goal of these two suspect passengers was to smuggle themselves into Europe using forged EU passports, they are betting on the possibility that immigration officers at AMS will waive them in after a quick look on their passports which is quite common and happened to me personally during my last entries into Schengen at CDG and BCN respectively.

This will certainly not work for people from a visible minority as it is the case with these two "black skinned" suspects even if they were genuine EU citizens.
 
holzmann
Posts: 599
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2011 3:43 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:40 pm

Could we please quit mentioning TWA800? Everyone knows the report is bogus. Watch the documentary.

So if no small debris is found, what are the chances it landed intact on the water ( Miracle on Hudson) and then sank as a whole? Slim to none but that could explain the lack of debris.

Terrorism: never forget the possibility that this flight could be someone's idea a practice run. Terrorism must be ruled out.
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LTC8K6
Posts: 1538
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 8:36 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:40 pm

Quoting na (Reply 198):
I wonder wether the Malaysian authorities already know what happened and are hiding it. I mean, this plane cant disappear without sending out its regular automatic messages. These messages are known to the authorities.

There's no indication that ACARS was active on 9M-MRO, iirc. It's an optional service.
 
bobnwa
Posts: 4514
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 12:10 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9

Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:40 pm

Quoting 77west (Reply 6):
A commercial jet does not do this. Ever. In the history of aviation.

What is it that commercial jets do not do? Your statement is not clear to my pea brain

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