MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 34

SA7700 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:11 am

Due to length part 33 was locked for further contributions. Please feel free to continue your discussion in part 34:

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 1 (by Longhornmaniac Mar 7 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 2 (by LipeGIG Mar 7 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 3 (by SA7700 Mar 8 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 4 (by SA7700 Mar 8 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 5 (by SA7700 Mar 8 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 6 (by SA7700 Mar 9 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 7 (by SA7700 Mar 9 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 8 (by jetblueguy22 Mar 9 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 9 (by SA7700 Mar 10 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 10 (by SA7700 Mar 10 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 11 (by jetblueguy22 Mar 10 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 12 (by SA7700 Mar 10 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 13 (by SA7700 Mar 11 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 14 (by SA7700 Mar 11 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 15 (by jetblueguy22 Mar 11 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 16 (by SA7700 Mar 12 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 17 (by 777ER Mar 12 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 18 (by jetblueguy22 Mar 12 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 19 (by SA7700 Mar 13 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 20 (by SA7700 Mar 13 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 21 (by SA7700 Mar 13 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 22 (by SA7700 Mar 13 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 23 (by SA7700 Mar 14 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 24 (by SA7700 Mar 14 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 25 (by SA7700 Mar 14 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 26 (by SA7700 Mar 15 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 27 (by SA7700 Mar 15 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 28 (by jetblueguy22 Mar 15 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 29 (by SA7700 Mar 16 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 30 (by SA7700 Mar 16 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 31 (by jetblueguy22 Mar 16 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 32 (by ManuCH Mar 17 2014 in Civil Aviation)

MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 33 (by jetblueguy22 Mar 17 2014 in Civil Aviation)

**********************************************************************************************

**** ADDITIONAL NEWS REPORTS ****

MH370: search for missing Malaysia Airlines plane extended to southern Indian Ocean

Najib's full press statement on MH370

Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370: What we know so far

MISSING MH370: Timeline

Flight MH370: Police focus on pilots as search for airliner goes on - live updates

Flight MH370: New timeline casts doubt on pilot deception theory

***********************************************************************************************

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Regards and thanks for your co-operation,

SA7700

tapir · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:21 am

From the previous thread,

Quoting jelliesR (Reply 308):
it's not suicide it's criminal anti-government protest. Direct action. Occupy Wall Street taken to a lunatic extreme. News outlets say he attended the trial 7 hours before taking off. How many people arranged their life to be there, to watch the verdict! he was deeply invested and very angry. IMO of course. It just isn't a simple murder suicide.

Quoting dandelany (Reply 309):
If it was a protest, the protester did a pretty terrible job of communicating their message to anyone whatsoever.

That's what bothering most Msians. Will they ever get to know the truth if that was the case?

chaseus1 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:23 am

To this comment (from last page, reply 301).....

"It depends on the statement you want to make. Hitting the Petronas Tower would likely make the pilot a "terrorist", and nobody would question the government. An outcome would be easy to establish (Plane hits tower in KL. Period). Malaysian government would receive support from the US and other countries/international organizations in order to figure out potential terrorist plots.

When countries are deeply shocked by an event of this type, usually the government emerges stronger, since even non-supporters will align in such exceptional circumstances (it will be seen at least of "bad taste" trying to build political influence over hundreds - or likely thousands if you hit the Petronas - deaths).

Under the current circumstances, the Malaysian government has been in the global spotlight for more than a week just showing how lost/incompetent they are, and how confusing their statements are".

_____________________________________________________________________________________________

I don't think the 9/11 terrorists did their attack to make the United States look stronger.

They hated the United States. They went after a symbol of their strength and power and money.

If you are mad at a government , you may go after its symbols of pride, and money. Certainly the towers would be such a symbol in Malaysia. Probably as much as any other. Besides, hate usually defies logic.

As far as making the country look weak... a successful attack by a full airliner on the Petronas Towers would do that.

It would make people question how a defense force could allow another September 11th all these years later.

[Edited 2014-03-18 01:24:30]

Shmendr · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:25 am

Reuters reporting that search area in India Ocean drastically cut due to new information from NTSB after Satellite Data analysis.

"The Australian Maritime Safety Authority (AMSA) shrunk its search field to a 600,000 sq km (230,000 sq mile) corridor, just 3 percent of the estimated 19 million sq km area in the Indian Ocean where the plane could be, based on satellite tracking data."

"AMSA said its revision of the search area was based on analysis of satellite data collected from the plane by the United States National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) it received on Monday."

I assume the NTSB was also able to narrow down the area to equivalent sq. miles in the North?

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...es-australia-idUSBREA2H07J20140318

Starlionblue · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:36 am

Quoting Shmendr (Reply 3):
"The Australian Maritime Safety Authority (AMSA) shrunk its search field to a 600,000 sq km (230,000 sq mile) corridor, just 3 percent of the estimated 19 million sq km area in the Indian Ocean where the plane could be, based on satellite tracking data."

Or to put it in context, about the size of 1 200 000 000 football fields assuming my maths is correct.

monjonman · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:36 am

Quoting chaseus1 (Reply 2):

But still why no communication to that effect .I am still thinking it was a botched hijacking by someone with limited knowledge of the systems.
Who then inadvertently compromised the aircraft and themselves in the process.
Motive could possibly have been asylum to Australia as we have recently been making it harder for boat arrivals seeking asylum off our coast sending them back to Indonesia .

PanHAM · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:39 am

Quoting chaseus1 (Reply 2):
I don't think the 9/11 terrorists did their attack to make the United States look stronger.

Don't expect rational intentions or explanations from terrorists. The 9/11 terrorists hated the "West" and all that was connected to it.

They lost in the beginning because the USA received the sympathi at least from the western world.

They won finally because the US introduced the Patriot Act which took away civil liberties.

terrorists fight for a cause and if they win that fight they have to Keep the fire glowing because they can never cope with reality.

If MH370 was seized by terrorists is not clear yet and just an Option taken as Explanation of the unexplainable.

k83713 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:41 am

From that reuters article: "Ships in the southern Indian Ocean have been requested to keep a lookout and to travel through the search area if possible. One ship is currently in the area, with another due to travel through on Wednesday."
And the area is 230000 sq.km. And the ships are just passing by...well, I really want to wish best possible luck, but I mean, oh well...I never really imagined there are such incredibly vast areas of wilderness on the planet.

flood · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:42 am

I recall discussions on the captain's political interests but don't recall reading of his family ties before:

Malaysia opposition leader Anwar admits MH370 pilot is his relative
Opposition leader Anwar Ibrahim has admitted that Malaysia Airlines MH370 pilot Captain Zaharie Ahmad Shah is related to his son's in-laws.

"I am not denying that he (Zaharie) is related to one of my in-laws and that I have met him on several occasions.

"In fact, he is a close friend of (PKR supreme council member and Subang MP) R. Sivarasa, as we said before," Mr Anwar told reporters at the Parliament lobby here on Tuesday."
http://www.straitstimes.com/breaking...s-mh370-pilot-his-relative-2014031

China says has 21 satellites looking for missing Malaysian jet
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...rlines-china-idUSBREA2H04420140318

chaseus1 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:46 am

Maybe no communication due to it being the act of only a few, and not a cell of large group.

Or they planned to announce a message later in the flight via radio, but the plane depressurized.

Or maybe the message will be on someones computer.

I don't know. There are many mysteries in any scenario.

I just obviously think it was a botched attack, and then plane flew off with no one flying it. And I think if the plane flew north, some country would have detected it, or a land crash.

So I think it went in the ocean. Which is a big area to search. But hopefully, it just got narrowed down.

Plus, there was never really a message sent after 9/11 I don't think. Just like here.

[Edited 2014-03-18 01:49:07]

Starlionblue · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:47 am

Quoting k83713 (Reply 7):
And the area is 230000 sq.km. And the ships are just passing by...well, I really want to wish best possible luck, but I mean, oh well...I never really imagined there are such incredibly vast areas of wilderness on the planet.

230000 square miles - 600000 sq.km - 1 200 000 000 football fields.

[Edited 2014-03-18 01:50:23]

tim73 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:53 am

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 10):
230000 square miles - 600000 sq.km.

That is almost the size of Texas or two Germanies.

CBRboy · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:53 am

Quoting k83713 (Reply 7):
I never really imagined there are such incredibly vast areas of wilderness on the planet

Perhaps this map will help you see how big the Pacific, Indian and Southern Oceans are. The internationally-agreed Australian Search and Rescue Region covers 52.8 million square kilometres - over one-tenth of the earth's surface!

chaseus1 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:55 am

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 6):
Don't expect rational intentions or explanations from terrorists. The 9/11 terrorists hated the "West" and all that was connected to it.

I agree. As I said, I believe hate defies logic.

tim73 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:58 am

Pretty hopeless to find it that far away in ocean unless they find that 30 day black box ping sound in time. They might someday find some piece of debris thousands of kilometers away washed onshore. The bodies are by now fish food.

[Edited 2014-03-18 02:00:09]

Starlionblue · Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:58 am

Quoting cbrboy (Reply 12):

Quoting k83713 (Reply 7):
I never really imagined there are such incredibly vast areas of wilderness on the planet

Perhaps this map will help you see how big the Pacific, Indian and Southern Oceans are. The internationally-agreed Australian Search and Rescue Region covers 52.8 million square kilometres - over one-tenth of the earth's surface!

I'll grant you that the Australian SSR is huge but that map uses a Mercator projection so it severely distorts area, making it seem increasingly bigger than reality the further you go from the Equator.

kevinkevin · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:00 am

With all the technology in today and they still can't find this plane?

jelliesR · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:01 am

Quoting Tapir (Reply 1):
That's what bothering most Msians. Will they ever get to know the truth if that was the case?

I think this is significant, pilot related to Anwar:
http://www.straitstimes.com/breaking...s-mh370-pilot-his-relative-2014031

[Edited 2014-03-18 02:07:16]

icanfly · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:03 am

The one aspect of the hijacking, terrorism and suicide theories that doesn't make sense to me is, why choose the flight to PEK? If the intended destination was Central Asia, a flight to Europe would have been a better choice. If the intended destination was the southern Indian Ocean, the aircraft could have turned south over the Bay of Bengal. In either case the backtrack over the Gulf of Thailand and Malay Peninsula could have been avoided.

Starlionblue · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:05 am

Quoting kevinkevin (Reply 16):
With all the technology in today and they still can't find this plane?

Technology is often severely overrated in these cases.

chaseus1 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:10 am

Quoting icanfly (Reply 18):
The one aspect of the hijacking, terrorism and suicide theories that doesn't make sense to me is, why choose the flight to PEK? If the intended destination was Central Asia, a flight to Europe would have been a better choice. If the intended destination was the southern Indian Ocean, the aircraft could have turned south over the Bay of Bengal. In either case the backtrack over the Gulf of Thailand and Malay Peninsula could have been avoided.

Unless the target was something very close.

CBRboy · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:12 am

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 15):
I'll grant you that the Australian SSR is huge but that map uses a Mercator projection so it severely distorts area, making it seem increasingly bigger than reality the further you go from the Equator.

Agreed. The maps people look at most of the time are Mercator projections with Europe at the top and centre. That usually means the Pacific is split and placed on the two edges of the map. I posted the link mainly because it places the Pacific and Indian Oceans together, emphasising the large proportion of the globe they occupy. Of course, if you look further at the linked map, you'll notice that the equator has been placed more than halfway up the map, so some of the Southern Ocean and all of Antarctica are missing, while important features like Greenland are included...

tapir · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:13 am

Quoting jelliesR (Reply 17):

Not really. Capt Zaharie supposedly is the uncle of his daughter in law. It is common to call even a distant relative as uncle or aunty.

k83713 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:17 am

Quoting jelliesR (Reply 17):

Yeah, and that would explain his attention to the trial, but that would not explain his suicide with 238 other people on board after 7 hours of flying in secret from the rest of the world.

jelliesR · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:19 am

related by marriage is still the extended family. Initially there were denials he was even a member of the party! What are the chances that the same day conviction of a big political figure would be linked only by chance to the PIC of the first major plane hijacking for years?

Starlionblue · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:21 am

Quoting Tapir (Reply 22):
Quoting jelliesR (Reply 17):

Not really. Capt Zaharie supposedly is the uncle of his daughter in law. It is common to call even a distant relative as uncle or aunty.

To clarify, this kind of title is common in many countries in East and Southeast Asia. It can even be used without any real family ties, and is then known as fictive kinship. For example calling a nanny "auntie" and an older man "big brother" in China, or an older woman "big sister" in The Philippines.

[Edited 2014-03-18 02:24:03]

[Edited 2014-03-18 02:24:22]

tapir · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:22 am

Quoting k83713 (Reply 23):

Capt Zaharie is a popular and much loved personality. However, we cannot dismiss the possible impact of the trial on many Msians. If not for MH370 everyone would be talking about it.

This is a video paying tribute to Zaharie. Hard to believe he would do something so sinister.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi8DIaqBnW4

HAWK21M · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:23 am

What about the IMARSAT last ping on the mapped areas....

tapir · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:25 am

Live PC in 10 minutes. You can catch them via astroawani or BFM89.9 . IPhone users can download the apps.

oly720man · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:26 am

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 19):

Quoting kevinkevin (Reply 16):
With all the technology in today and they still can't find this plane?

Technology is often severely overrated in these cases.

And it is more difficult if "the technology" is turned off or disabled.

coolian2 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:28 am

Quoting jelliesR (Reply 24):
related by marriage is still the extended family. Initially there were denials he was even a member of the party! What are the chances that the same day conviction of a big political figure would be linked only by chance to the PIC of the first major plane hijacking for years?

Years? It's only been a few months.

Dalavia · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:31 am

The press conference will be at the same URL as yesterday: http://www.astroawani.com/videos/live

tapir · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:32 am

Quoting jelliesR (Reply 24):

No. That's incorrect. His friend and MP tweeted as early as Sat or Sunday Zaharie was a life member of PKR. He never denied.

monjonman · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:34 am

Quoting jelliesR (Reply 24):

I personally can not see someone performing such a radical act for something which does not directly affect them.
So what if this politician goes to gaol for a few years ,most of them should be in there anyway!

k83713 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:34 am

Quoting Tapir (Reply 26):

Thanks for the link, Tapir

jelliesR · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:37 am

"After it was speculated that the pilot was present during the trial of Ibrahim, following which he got a five-year jail sentence for sodomy charges, his People's Justice Party, aka Parti Keadilan Rakyat (PKR) has admitted that Shah campaigned for the party. "

it sounded like a reluctant and late admission / but maybe that is just the press spin.

slinky09 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:41 am

Today's PC:

- Listing search assets ...
- Reiterated belief that ACARS was deliberately turned off without saying why.
- Police investigation no new comment.
- No other news from the minister.

Now to questions - I wonder if any will have any value ...

Stealthz · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:42 am

And the condescending nature of US media knows no bounds...

From http://jalopnik.com/this-is-how-the-...laysia-airli-1545497359/@ericlimer

"The US Navy, along with various tidbits from the Australian Navy, the Indian Navy, and the Singaporean Navy, is searching this southern zone.
The USS Kidd has been involved for some days but to say "the US Navy, along with various tidbits" is offensive to all the countries and the service people involved.
Considering their resources the US is a minor player in this effort

HAWK21M · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:47 am

Quoting slinky09 (Reply 36):

Better to save the varied news and disclose most after the aircraft is found as disclosure could be used by those involved to further hide the details which could otherwise be found.

smokeybandit · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:56 am

Quoting stealthz (Reply 37):
And the condescending nature of US media knows no bounds...

The article is about the US Navy's search efforts. While no doubt the US media is condescending (and quite often wrong) there's nothing wrong with the article you linked.

BlueShamu330s · Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:59 am

Quoting stealthz (Reply 37):

And the condescending nature of US media knows no bounds...

From http://jalopnik.com/this-is-how-the-...laysia-airli-1545497359/@ericlimer

"The US Navy, along with various tidbits from the Australian Navy, the Indian Navy, and the Singaporean Navy, is searching this southern zone.
The USS Kidd has been involved for some days but to say "the US Navy, along with various tidbits" is offensive to all the countries and the service people involved.
Considering their resources the US is a minor player in this effort

I must admit, I was thinking exactly the same thing. It's the Captain America syndrome; USA to the rescue. It's what their audience want to see and hear.

Rgds

Buyantukhaa · Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:01 am

China is beginning a land search on its territory:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-26609569

Stealthz · Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:04 am

Quoting smokeybandit (Reply 39):
there's nothing wrong with the article you linked.

As a generic - How sea searches are conducted - the article is fine, the inference that the search is being conducted by the US with minor assistance from others is incorrect.
Indeed the current US assets are a single P-3 and P-8, The Kidd has returned to it's normal duties.

slinky09 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:09 am

One update from the PC, the head of Malaysian Airways said they believed the transponder was switched off at 1:21 am.

k83713 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:10 am

Quoting stealthz (Reply 42):

Thanks for interesting link indeed. In relation to P-3 it's explained that it looks for metallic parts in the ocean. Modern airplane has in fact very few steel parts, but mainly aluminum and carbon fiber. What's the use then or it's capable to detect Al as well?

[Edited 2014-03-18 03:13:11]

flood · Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:12 am

Area search chart released by AMSA:

Image can be found in their media kit:
http://drive.google.com/folderview?i...iQpM1dxMzdSTHRMeW8&usp=sharing

[Edited 2014-03-18 03:15:03]

turn720 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:16 am

Quoting stealthz (Reply 37):

And the condescending nature of US media knows no bounds...

Here's an idea since you seem to be offended by this story. Why don't you give us a link to an article about an Australian navy ship that has been out searching for the plane since day one. I promise I'll read it.

Also, if American news which is geared towards an American audience offends you stop reading it. I don't read Australian news myself just because of that reason.

chaseus1 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:21 am

Quoting k83713 (Reply 44):
Thanks for interesting link indeed. In relation to P-3 it's explained that it looks for metallic parts in the ocean. Modern airplane has in fact very few steel parts, but mainly aluminum and carbon fiber. What's the use then or it's capable to detect Al as well?

Engines maybe? Landing gear? Find them, you may find the plane...

tapir · Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:21 am

Quoting k83713 (Reply 34):

You're welcome. That video actually made me to be extra cautious with my words before implicating someone. It must be very painful for his family. Apparently, his daughter lives in Australia..

Quoting jelliesR (Reply 35):

That must be from The Star. Capt Zaharie is just an ordinary life member like the rest of thousands of PKR members, You can't remember everyone. The full fact is irrelevant for this forum but to put things in perspective. Anwar confirmed recognising him after showing photograph of him with Zaharie. The could be thousands of photos like that involving many.

[Edited 2014-03-18 03:30:20]

k83713 · Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:29 am

Ah, sorry, in the bottom of that article it was clarified in fact, that it will not use this sensor as primary for exactly that reason of lacking ferrous parts.

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