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imagoagnitio
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:06 am

Quoting Tapir (Reply 196):

not sure about Mangosteens, but Banana's can be extremely volatile whilst ripening.

over 20 years ago in my insurance days, we had a ripening shed explode from the gases given off by the Bananas.

Any fruit growers/aviators out there confirm?
 
BG777300ER
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:06 am

https://plus.google.com/app/basic/stream/z13cv1gohsmbv5jmy221vrfyiz3vdhbop04

interesting point, not sure if it has been posted
 
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FlyingJhawk
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:07 am

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 197):
This was debunked a couple of thousand posts ago. The airworthiness directive does not apply to this aircraft as it does not have this type of antenna.

Yeah. It's hard to keep up with these thousands upon thousands of posts. I figured it would be quicker for someone to instantaneously correct me. I'll go back to lurking!
 
Lindenwold
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:08 am

wait, the jet was turned around before the "good night" message? when did this come out?
 
CaptainKramer
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:09 am

This is a question for any Military Pilots or Tanker Pilots out there. From your experience, how difficult is it to rendesvous with a Military tanker, factoring in that both lead plane and chase plane are working together to meet up in a preset point in space and time.

Now consider the scenario involving a B777-200ER trying to intercept another airliner, in this case SQ68, another airliner (Can anyone confirm it was a B777?) lets assume it is a B777 for now.

What is the procedure that would need to be followed to execute a rendesvous, given that the lead plane will be flying at speed and not slowing down for the chase plane and the chase plane would have to execute a timely turn prior to intercepting the lead plane. Is this how the military do it?

Given that a B777 is not a fighter and cannot accelerate to catch up, because there is no way of preplaning this unless you use a simulator (I know Captain has a home built B777 sim) and receive instructions from someone in the know and have the co-operation of the lead plane, I imagine timing would be everything to make this shadowing scenario work in the real world.

In case you haven't already guessed I'm still a skeptic.

Thanks in advance.
 
KIAS
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:14 am

Quoting twincessna340a (Reply 174):
FWIW Les Abend (a check 777 captain at AA and author of "Flying"'s 'Jumpseat' column) doesn't have detailed knowledge of the E/E bay.

http://www.flyingmag.com/technique/a...Tk1S0
Quote:

“I’ve always asserted that there was some type of mechanical issue that might have progressively gotten worse and worse, where the pilots were trying to go to a checklist and determine what their problem was by troubleshooting it,” Abend told Anderson Cooper on CNN last night.

I dare say the vast majority of people operating/maintaing heavy iron will agree it's still a valid possibility. People who are claiming that it's absolutely 100% some Tintin plot, frankly, are blowing smoke. Sorry, I don't mean to be rude, but to discount a mechanical issue solely based on the flimsy and rapidly changing evidence we've been given is a bad idea.

Could it be a hijacking? Of course. Should it be explored as a possibility? Of course. Do I think so? Still not convinced. Won't be until there's harder evidence. Will I blow off the mechanical angle because of some of the dots don't line up? Absolutely not.

[Edited 2014-03-18 18:15:28]
"We fly, but we have not 'conquered' the air. When we presume mastery, we are often startled by our ignorance." - DHW
 
CaptainKramer
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:14 am

I've never ever seen a Primate explode, so I'm ruling out exploding banana scenario for now.  

Edit : Add Smile!

[Edited 2014-03-18 18:16:08]

Edit : Added Banana for context .


[Edited 2014-03-18 18:24:05]
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:14 am

Quoting osloflyer (Reply 198):
1. Where did the aircraft come in from, prior segment to this flight ?
HKG, and KUL before that.

Quoting osloflyer (Reply 198):
2. Can the known radar data from the climb out be used to determine how heavy the aircraft was during takeoff ?

No.

Quoting osloflyer (Reply 198):
3. Could someone have hidden in the aircrafts electronic bay and controlled the aircraft from there, and overridden pilot inputs?

Very much in theory. However it seems rather much "direct to DVD action movie".

Quoting flyingjhawk (Reply 202):

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 197):
This was debunked a couple of thousand posts ago. The airworthiness directive does not apply to this aircraft as it does not have this type of antenna.

Yeah. It's hard to keep up with these thousands upon thousands of posts. I figured it would be quicker for someone to instantaneously correct me. I'll go back to lurking!

No worries. However I would urge you to at least look up rcair1's latest "Sanity Check" as it contains everything you need to get up to speed. In this case: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35 (by SA7700 Mar 18 2014 in Civil Aviation)

[Edited 2014-03-18 18:16:24]
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
hivue
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:15 am

Quoting Lindenwold (Reply 203):
wait, the jet was turned around before the "good night" message?

Where did you see that?
"You're sitting. In a chair. In the SKY!!" ~ Louis C.K.
 
rampart
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:16 am

Quoting laxboeingman (Reply 161):
On another note, was testing ever done on the slick that was discovered in the Indian Ocean?

Yes. It was found to be oil or fuel from a ship.

-Rampart
 
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FlyingJhawk
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:16 am

Quoting CaptainKramer (Reply 204):
Given that a B777 is not a fighter and cannot accelerate to catch up, because there is no way of preplaning this unless you use a simulator (I know Captain has a home built B777 sim) and receive instructions from someone in the know and have the co-operation of the lead plane, I imagine timing would be everything to make this shadowing scenario work in the real world.

Yeah, I find this scenario highly unlikely. If MH370 was delayed for some reason wouldn't it make that rendezvous extremely difficult if not impossible?
 
capri
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:19 am

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 207):
Quoting osloflyer (Reply 198):
2. Can the known radar data from the climb out be used to determine how heavy the aircraft was during takeoff ?

No.

some people used fr24 and flightaware and from the graph said that plane initial climb was slower that it should be for a PEK flight weight
 
imagoagnitio
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:20 am

Quoting CaptainKramer (Reply 206):

what? Primate  
 
Lindenwold
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:20 am

Quoting hivue (Reply 208):

cnn and fox said it turned around 12 mins before the final message, "Goodnight".

sorry, they said it was programmed to do the u-turn 12 mins prior to final contact with the pilot.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/mis...grammed-signoff-sources-say-n56151

[Edited 2014-03-18 18:22:14]
 
twincessna340a
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:21 am

Quoting capri (Reply 211):

Could be all the mangosteens   
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:22 am

Quoting capri (Reply 211):
Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 207):
Quoting osloflyer (Reply 198):
2. Can the known radar data from the climb out be used to determine how heavy the aircraft was during takeoff ?

No.

some people used fr24 and flightaware and from the graph said that plane initial climb was slower that it should be for a PEK flight weight

That seems like an extremely dodgy conclusion based on unverified data that is known to frequently be inaccurate.

For example, it could be an ATC restriction or atmospheric factors.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
hivue
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:23 am

Quoting Lindenwold (Reply 213):
cnn and fox said it turned around 12 mins before the final message, "Goodnight".

But that's before the transponder went dead. That would have rung some bells with Singapore SSR, right?
"You're sitting. In a chair. In the SKY!!" ~ Louis C.K.
 
capri
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:23 am

Quoting twincessna340a (Reply 214):

talking about mangosteens, do they need dry ice????
 
tomlee
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:24 am

Quoting BackSeater (Reply 180):

Not sure how that has anything to do with being curious. I specifically said,

Quoting tomlee (Reply 169):
There isn't any point into that as the satcom pings would tell you nothing else and releasing a picture with that shape would lead to highly confusing media reports.

There is a difference between being curious and rampant unfounded speculation. See taking apart electronics, reverse engineering firmware, and the such is being curious in my books. Releasing information which doesn't help the search, doesn't add anything to the existing public knowledge, and is highly likely to cause more confusing media reports is not my definition of being curious.
 
tapir
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:24 am

Quoting imagoagnitio (Reply 200):

It is categorized as Ethylene-emitting fruit. One more theory - exploding mangosteen?
 
hivue
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:25 am

Quoting Lindenwold (Reply 213):
sorry, they said it was programmed to do the u-turn 12 mins prior to final contact with the pilot.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/mis...56151

Wow. Now that's interesting.
"You're sitting. In a chair. In the SKY!!" ~ Louis C.K.
 
hivue
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:29 am

Quoting hivue (Reply 220):
Wow. Now that's interesting.

Or could it just be the NBC "source" just making a WAG?
"You're sitting. In a chair. In the SKY!!" ~ Louis C.K.
 
capri
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:31 am

I raised 2 theories, have not seen given any thoughts

1. instead of pilot suicide, how about pax(s) suicide, i.e deportees to China?
2. no one and no talks about a Russian and 2 Ukrainians onboard, no reports on them or families or if passports stolen or anything else, especially with Crimea coincidence
 
rickabone
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:32 am

So if the new timeline is correct and the FMS was reprogrammed for the turn prior to the last ACARS transmission and prior to it being shut off it looks like an act of one of the pilots (co-pilot if it was his voice on the recording). Would the data also have been transmitted about the entire route that was input? Or are they saying that only the turn itself was input and there were no other waypoints plugged in... Or are they saying that ACARS only transmits limited data and that info is not available to them, but somehow they know it was reprogrammed to make the turn?
 
imagoagnitio
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:32 am

Quoting capri (Reply 217):

not sure about dry ice...BUT

Mangosteens are the only fruit banned from airline cabins, because of it's overwhelming and foul smell. It has been described as having the smell of rotten onions, over-ripe cheese or even sewerage.

i'm not suggesting there was a leak from the cargo hold into the cabin, but it is interesting. well i think so anyway.
 
65mustang
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:33 am

I originally started this as a short post but ended up with one a little longer than intended. Reading a lot of the previous post has fostered a few questions that I think are pertinent and that I have not found conclusive answers to. This is more of a brainstorming of ideas and a list of things to think about.

Does this particular T7 have the reinforced cockpit door? I have read that they are mandatory in the US, but are not in other parts of the world.

At what time did the a/c reach its cruising altitude? I think I read somewhere that it had been at cruising altitude for about 5 minutes before it went black.

At what time did the pilots turn off the seat belt sign? Was it ever turned off?

Is the data that indicates FL45 FL23 and a 40000fpm drop accurate? Is that data transmitted from the aircraft or determined by ground radar? If this is accurate data, I think if you figure out why this happened, you will solve the puzzle.

Regarding the 8:11am sitcom ping. We keep seeing a 2d map with an arc that indicates where the plane was. Shouldn't this be thought of in a 3d context? Imagine a sphere around the immersat satellite. Wouldn't the aircraft be located at some point on the surface of a sphere bisected by a plane running from about 40000ft altitude to the ground?

When a pilot enters waypoints, does each one have to be entered individually or are there macros or sets of waypoints that can be entered with one button? Are previous sets of waypoints stored in the computer that can be recalled and used?

Did MH370 fly waypoint to waypoint or are the waypoints simply along the route the plane was flying?

What happens to a T7 at cruising altitude with no pilots and no autopilot? Does it plunge to the ground or does the computer try to fly it? (addressed in the updated sanity check)

Does daylight savings time have any effect on the reported local times?

Has it been conclusively determined that there was not a shipment of Lithium batteries in the cargo hold?

Is there a common point in the cargo hold that if damaged can short ACARS and the transponder?


ELT
Is the life raft/emergency slide accessible while in flight? I read it is located in the door in the "side bustle". Can this be opened by one of the FAs or PAX? If it is, can the ELTs on the raft be retrieved? How is the life raft ELT activated - by a button or by impact? Once activated, can the signal be seen at 29500? Are MA FAs trained about how to access a ELT in an emergency?

PILOTS
What is the Captains history with allowing access to the cockpit? Does he leave the door open? Is it locked? I think interviews with all fight attendants that he has worked with during the past 3 months could answer these questions.

When was the last time the Captain slept?

Was he a substitution at the last minute? Why? Has the originally scheduled pilot, Anas Mazlin, been interviewed? MAS denies the roster switch. The facebook page of the wife of Anas Mazlin has been cancelled. (http://devel.malaysiandigest.com/news/493357-mas-official-denies-pilot-swap-in-mh370-roster.html)

CELL PHONES
There has been a lot of talk about cell phones. I have not seen any mention of the possibility of a cell phone or computer in checked baggage trying to connect to a network. Devices in checked baggage would have been safe from possible hijackers. With so many passengers I expect that there is a probable chance that there were devices left on in checked bags. If the plane was ever within range of a tower )via low flying to avoid radar or landing) I find it extremely hard to believe that there would have been 0 transmissions between the peoples devices and a cellular network. That means, if investigators can obtain phone records from all devices possessed by people on the plane and then if there is no data to indicate the devices were within cellular coverage area, we might be able to determine where the plane wasn't(up until the estimated time of battery life).

THEORIES

1. Political stunt/suicide by cop -- The pilot was a vocal critic of the current Malaysian government and posted many rants against them on Facebook. Given the overturn of Anwar's conviction earlier in the day, the pilot could have decided to do something about it. What if the MO was to embarrass the current regime and to get the plane carrying 154 Chinese to be shot down by the Malaysian government. When that failed, he just set autopilot to fly the plane until it ran out of fuel. Are there any ground based defenses along the suspected route of the plane? Is there anything with the altitude, waypoints, or behavior of the plane that indicates that the pilot was trying to disguise it as a military aircraft?

2. Hack - I have seen several experts say the flight computers cannot be hacked and there is no way that this could happen. I think if humans can put a man on the moon, a flight computer could be hacked. Could the plane have been hacked by a passenger during flight, someone somewhere in the world on the ground, or was a virus planted in the computer before the flight? There were many engineers on board that worked for Freescale Semiconductor. Did Freescale Semiconductor have any military contracts? Are any Freescale Semiconductor chips used in the construction of a Boeing 777? From Wikipedia:

Freescale Semiconductor, Inc. is an American company that produces and designs embedded hardware, with 17 billion semiconductor chips in use around the world. The company focuses on the automotive, consumer, industrial and networking markets with its product portfolio including microprocessors, microcontrollers, digital signal processors, digital signal controllers, sensors, RF power ICs and power management ICs. In addition, the company offers software and development tools to support product development.

3. Fire - It is a known issue that Lithium batteries can burst into flames when exposed to air. They will burn until burnt out and fire suppression will not work. This has happened several times before. If there was a fire in the cargo bay could the acars system short before smoke/fire detectors send alarms? Knowing there was a fire in the cargo hold but not the source, would this pilot make and ascent to try to put it out? (one answer part 34 post 260)

4. Collision - Could there have been a mid air collision with a military aircraft or drone from another government on a covert operation? Meteor?

5. Unknown aircraft failure - Some kind of failure left the pilots incapacitated and with a reinforced cockpit door, nobody was able to get inside. The plane was on autopilot or computer flown until the fuel was exhausted.

6. Pilot Error - I think this is the most plausible. It appears the captain was exhausted and was not scheduled for this flight. There are reports that he was on vacation and was a substitute at the last minute. MAS has denied this. Could there have been a medical issue with the captain such as a seizure or heart attack? Step by step, what is the procedure if the Captain intended to get some sleep? Exactly what would he be doing procedurally from about 1:15 to 1:35? What would he be turning off and what would he be turning on?

7. Failed or successful Hijack - Somali pirates are pretty brazen. They have attacked and taken over massive cargo ships with skiffs. Read the Wiki about them. They collect an average of $4.7 million per ship. Since the attack on the Maersk Alabama, thousands of pirates have been caught and are in prison. The Malaysian navy has caught many of them and they are held in Malaysian prisons. The success of anti-piracy measures has lead to an increase in land based attacks has caused them to go further and further out to sea looking for targets. Ship piracy has gone from several hundred attacks in 2010 to 2 in 2013. Maybe a few of them figured out how to hijack a plane a forced the pilots to fly somewhere. I am not saying the plane actually made it to Somalia and that is where SAR should look. This theory is that there was an attempt by Somali pirates. They fail all the time. Maybe the pilots won the struggle but were fatally wounded. If the seatbelt light had been turned off about 5 min prior to the dramatic turn, it would lend credence to a hijack by one of the PAX.
 
tapir
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:34 am

Quoting imagoagnitio (Reply 224):

Worse than durians? Anyway, new theory from dailymail pointing to hidden explosive device in the mangosteen. http://malaysia-chronicle.com/index....cargo-hold?&Itemid=2#axzz2wMrliUr1

And interestingly the cargo manifest is yet to be released.

[Edited 2014-03-18 18:35:45]
 
CaptainKramer
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:35 am

Quoting imagoagnitio (Reply 212):

Just free associating. It's 1.30am, I'm signing off for now.
 
iberiadc852
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:36 am

Quoting flyingjhawk (Reply 210):

Yeah, I find this scenario highly unlikely. If MH370 was delayed for some reason wouldn't it make that rendezvous extremely difficult if not impossible?

Have you checked in some flight tracker that they didn't have other posible "wagons" in similar routes to cling to?
(I haven't, but given how well the shadowing explains many things, I wouldn't wonder to discover they had one or more B-plans for that matter)
variety is the spice of life; that's what made the "old times" so good
 
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DeltaMD90
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:36 am

Quoting capri (Reply 222):
1. instead of pilot suicide, how about pax(s) suicide, i.e deportees to China?

"How?" is the big question. Also, I doubt a bunch of asylum seekers would just decide to kill a bunch of random innocent, people

Quoting capri (Reply 222):
2. no one and no talks about a Russian and 2 Ukrainians onboard, no reports on them or families or if passports stolen or anything else, especially with Crimea coincidence

How would this further either side's cause?

Doubt both of them
 
rcair1
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:37 am

Quoting iberiadc852 (Reply 156):
When can the SATCOM signals be detected?.
Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 197):
This was debunked a couple of thousand posts ago. The airworthiness directive does not apply to this aircraft as it does not have this type of antenna.
Quoting flyingjhawk (Reply 202):
Yeah. It's hard to keep up with these thousands upon thousands of posts. I figured it would be quicker for someone to instantaneously correct me. I'll go back to lurking!

Can I recommend you read the sanity checks - current one

Quoting rcair1 (Reply 49):
Sanity Check

These questions and just a few more are discussed there
rcair1
 
imagoagnitio
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:38 am

Quoting Tapir (Reply 226):

i've always thought of them the same durians/mangosteens...anyway they both smell bloody horrible and stain skin and clothes. if one was squashed during loading the smell would get worse, i cannot imagine what 3-4 tons would be like seeping through the fuselage
 
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zeke
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:40 am

Quoting imagoagnitio (Reply 224):
Mangosteens are the only fruit banned from airline cabins, because of it's overwhelming and foul smell. It has been described as having the smell of rotten onions, over-ripe cheese or even sewerage.

Think you mean Durian. Mangosteen is small like a apple with a passion fruit color, Durian is big green and looks prickly, about the size of rockmelon or a small watermelon.
“Don't be a show-off. Never be too proud to turn back. There are old pilots and bold pilots, but no old, bold pilots.” E. Hamilton Lee, 1949
 
JAAlbert
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:40 am

So many theories and speculation that seem to defy common sense.

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 19):
And as I've said before, I think the guys at Boeing would have mentioned this days ago if there was a fire that could have more or less replicated what MH370 did. That is barring any crazy conspiracy theory or Boeing being silent while they connect the dots.

Even if a fire started, I would imagine that ACARS would have documented something, however small, before it stopped sending information. Unless there was an explosion first that took out ACARS instantaneously followed by a fire, I just don't see how a fire would go totally undetected. And if there was an explosion strong enough to take out ACARS instantaneously, and/or a fire, it probably would have taken out a lot of other systems, so it seems very odd that the plane could nonetheless fly for another 7 hours.

Quoting kevinkevin (Reply 53):
Pelau Perak was this point hence the right turn to intercept SQ68. Before now I don't think there's any other theory/explanation that can explain MH370's movements after MH370 said "Goodnight" to the Malaysia ATC.
Quoting seatran (Reply 74):
but I'll say that it'd be difficult for a crew that was untrained and inexperienced in rendezvous procedures to accomplish a successful rendezvous esp at night and esp if there was any weather around. It wouldn't be impossible, but definitely difficult.

If the transponder is off, can the cockpit still receive specific information about the exact location of other aircraft in the vicinity? Again, it seems to defy common sense that a commercial airline pilot could go searching for -- and find -- a specific airplane in flight - especially at night, without some GPS or radar assistance.

Quoting aseem (Reply 84):
while it was on the ground. If so, why couldn't the pilots have overruled it??

If the plane had landed, I would think that someone would have tried to make a call on their cell phone. Or if the passengers had been incapacitated, I imagine that at least some phones would send some sort of transmission especially if on roaming. Even Al Qaida use cell phones.

Quoting gatorman96 (Reply 121):
but you can be sure that the fueling company would document any extra fuel that was loaded onto an aircraft.

Especially since Jet A isn't free. The airline knows exactly how much fuel was loaded into the tanks because they paid the tab-which means that all the investigators know exactly how much fuel was loaded.
 
tomlee
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:40 am

Quoting hivue (Reply 220):
Wow. Now that's interesting.

It would help stop all this crazy speculation if they someone released the already transmitted in the clear ACARS data (they should start adding ACARS receivers to the public FR24 sites so we can watch all the messages fly around.)

Need more radio enthusiasts in the world. But with SDRs becoming more common and cheap coverage will probably improve a lot in the future. ( http://www.hamradioscience.com/addin...er-using-multiple-rtl2832u-sticks/ ) I should add some to Malaysia, Philippines next time I visit family.
 
tomlee
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:41 am

Quoting zeke (Reply 232):
Think you mean Durian. Mangosteen is small like a apple with a passion fruit color, Durian is big green and looks prickly, about the size of rockmelon or a small watermelon.

Yeah I believe the saying is, durian smells like hell tastes like heaven (Still can't stand the smell and it really can soak into everything even nearby plastics).
 
Gatorman96
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2005 2:22 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:42 am

Quoting capri (Reply 222):

I raised 2 theories, have not seen given any thoughts

1. instead of pilot suicide, how about pax(s) suicide, i.e deportees to China?
2. no one and no talks about a Russian and 2 Ukrainians onboard, no reports on them or families or if passports stolen or anything else, especially with Crimea coincidence

I can assure you that every passenger on MH370 has had their background checked, re-checked, and checked again by a multitude of intel agencies from multiple countries. They probably know what meal each passenger ate the morning of that flight so if there are any connections to a terrorist orgs or passengers that are part of a particular movement, said agencies will know about it.
 
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Starlionblue
Posts: 20554
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:43 am

Quoting 65Mustang (Reply 225):
When a pilot enters waypoints, does each one have to be entered individually or are there macros or sets of waypoints that can be entered with one button? Are previous sets of waypoints stored in the computer that can be recalled and used?

There are "company routes" containing multiple waypoints can be selected.

If memory serves you can also save routes up to a point. You can save alternate routes that can be called up with a few presses.

Quoting 65Mustang (Reply 225):
At what time did the pilots turn off the seat belt sign? Was it ever turned off?

AFAIK there is no way of knowing that as this information is not transmitted via ACARS. If the plane has crashed that information could be gleaned from the CVR's audio.

Quoting 65Mustang (Reply 225):
What happens to a T7 at cruising altitude with no pilots and no autopilot? Does it plunge to the ground or does the computer try to fly it? (addressed in the updated sanity check)

It could fly for hours. As opposed to non-FBW planes which would most likely fall into a spiraling descent, FBW flight control systems will keep the plane stable in whatever attitude it was left by the pilots or autopilot. This could, of course, be a steady turn or a descent, but if the plane was flying straight and level it would keep flying straight and level.

[Edited 2014-03-18 18:48:05]
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
capri
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2003 1:32 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:44 am

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 229):
"How?" is the big question. Also, I doubt a bunch of asylum seekers would just decide to kill a bunch of random innocent, people

if you read the article i posted earlier has different views, they may have no chance surviving anyway in China and 2nd they might avenge Malaysia that put own interest with China above Human rights
this article could be why this theory is possible
http://www.scmp.com/news/asia/articl...fficking-camp-may-face-deportation
 
hivue
Posts: 2125
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:26 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:44 am

Quoting 65Mustang (Reply 225):
Regarding the 8:11am sitcom ping. We keep seeing a 2d map with an arc that indicates where the plane was. Shouldn't this be thought of in a 3d context?

The arcs are just sets of points on the earth's surface which are below all the possible places in the air the plane could have been at 08:11L (it's also possible the plane was on the ground at one of the points).
"You're sitting. In a chair. In the SKY!!" ~ Louis C.K.
 
jelliesR
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:46 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:44 am

I think you are confusing mangosteen and Durian. Durian is the one with the strong smell.
Mangosteens are fine They are often in tropical fruit welcome plates in hotel rooms.
 
tapir
Posts: 136
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 12:07 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:45 am

Quoting zeke (Reply 232):

Correct. Durian doesn't stain.
 
tomlee
Posts: 610
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 9:01 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:46 am

Quoting 65Mustang (Reply 225):
2. Hack - I have seen several experts say the flight computers cannot be hacked and there is no way that this could happen. I think if humans can put a man on the moon, a flight computer could be hacked. Could the plane have been hacked by a passenger during flight, someone somewhere in the world on the ground, or was a virus planted in the computer before the flight? There were many engineers on board that worked for Freescale Semiconductor. Did Freescale Semiconductor have any military contracts? Are any Freescale Semiconductor chips used in the construction of a Boeing 777? From Wikipedia:

Freescale Semiconductor, Inc. is an American company that produces and designs embedded hardware, with 17 billion semiconductor chips in use around the world. The company focuses on the automotive, consumer, industrial and networking markets with its product portfolio including microprocessors, microcontrollers, digital signal processors, digital signal controllers, sensors, RF power ICs and power management ICs. In addition, the company offers software and development tools to support product development.

Just because you can fly to the moon doesn't mean you can break physics. The flight computer can be hacked if you could hack it in the first place. The way it seems to be designed is to isolate the redundant channels from external exposure. Not to mention even if hacked you would have to modify or replace/hack the very sensors and simpler digitization hardware which allows for direct control without the more complex (hackable) flight computers.

As mentioned ages ago the Freescale employee's are likely production engineers not associated with firmware programming or chip design. The two plants they were moving between are for packaging and assembly. Potting chips and putting them in tape/reel, chip trays is not usually associated with expert hackers.
 
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Starlionblue
Posts: 20554
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:46 am

Quoting JAAlbert (Reply 233):
f the transponder is off, can the cockpit still receive specific information about the exact location of other aircraft in the vicinity?

No. For TCAS to work you need the transponder to be on. However as has been suggested you could use a laptop with a USB receiver for ADS-B signals.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
Gatorman96
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2005 2:22 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:53 am

Quoting 65Mustang (Reply 225):
Failed or successful Hijack - Somali pirates are pretty brazen.

With all due respect to Somali pirates, I'm willing to bet that not one of them have ever set foot on an aircraft, let alone own a passport. Why branch out to Malaysia to steal an aircraft when there are hundreds of massive, lumbering ships right off the coast of Somalia ripe for pirating? Makes no sense...
 
tapir
Posts: 136
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 12:07 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:53 am

Could MH370 have flown on autopilot after pilots passed out?

http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/m...-autopilot-after-pilots-passed-out
 
jelliesR
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:46 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:53 am

The Maldives report sounds very peculiar. the plane was low and loud. 9/11 was loud as well, because they were travelling too fast for low altitude. The Maldives residents would know the difference between a low, incredibly loud, passenger jet and the normal regional planes they see and hear. If the witness reports were corroborated (perhaps someone whipped out a camera?) and no known jets overflew the island that morning, then, I have no words. MH370 was a ghost plane. The satellite pings are being read incorrectly. Maldives has a GSM cellphone company, covering most islands. Do they log phones from other carriers auto-logging onto their network? There would be phones on board that would auto-roam from low altitude and try to handshake.
 
tapir
Posts: 136
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 12:07 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:55 am

Quoting jelliesR (Reply 246):

Not if everyone unconscious.
 
jelliesR
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:46 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:00 am

Quoting Tapir (Reply 247):
Not if everyone unconscious.

You never landed in an airport and your phone gets sent a text from the local carrier?
mine does all the time. I don't have to do anything, it handshakes. Automatically. If it is on..
some people may have left their phones on, even if everyone was unconscious.
 
jcxroberts
Posts: 97
Joined: Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:41 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 35

Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:01 am

We know almost nothing, including if the radar pings in Malaysia were the plane or even accurate. After all, it appears
the climb to 45,000 was a false read.

No Aircraft, No Case - nearly everything will be conjecture.

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