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PanAm1971
Posts: 444
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2007 4:28 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:04 am

Quoting tayser (Reply 97):
I just looked at the map again, the search area is the same distance from Perth that Melbourne is from Perth - 3-4 hour flying time from PER.

Long long long way away.

This recovery and investigation will be epic... if its even possible. That area is literally in the middle of nowhere.
 
tapir
Posts: 136
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 12:07 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:04 am

Quoting PanAm1971 (Reply 98):
Quoting hivue (Reply 85):It's interesting that the Malaysians are not announcing this, don't you think?I think the time for them is done. I think, given the possible crash location, Australia should take the lead on the recovery.

If not for joint SAR from several countries, I believe they would still be searching in South China Sea.  
 
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Finn350
Posts: 1601
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:05 am

I suppose they are relatively certain the objects might belong to MH 370. Hopefully they will release the satellite imagery in the conference.
 
coolian2
Posts: 2483
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:06 am

Aussies, when does Question Time finish? Surely any real update will be independent of this, right?
Q300/ATR72-600/737-200/-300/-400/-700/-800/A320/767-200/-300/757-200/777-300ER/
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alberchico
Posts: 3206
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:06 am

Wouldn't the ocean currents have carried any floating objects far away from the suspected crash area by now ?
short summary of every jewish holiday: they tried to kill us ,we won , lets eat !
 
hivue
Posts: 2067
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:26 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:07 am

Quoting PanAm1971 (Reply 98):
I think the time for them is done. I think, given the possible crash location, Australia should take the lead on the recovery.

That's my point. Everyone has gotten frustrated enough that they've laid diplomatic niceties and international conventions aside.
"You're sitting. In a chair. In the SKY!!" ~ Louis C.K.
 
wxmeddler
Posts: 78
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:07 am

Quoting alberchico (Reply 104):

Would you rather backtrack a piece of debris or continue searching the whole Indian Ocean?
 
Gatorman96
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2005 2:22 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:08 am

Quoting alberchico (Reply 104):
Wouldn't the ocean currents have carried any floating objects far away from the suspected crash area by now ?

Yes, but if this is truly debris from MH370, they can study the currents over the last 12 or so days and estimate a new search box with pretty good accuracy.
 
undertheradar
Posts: 407
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:02 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:08 am

Quoting hivue (Reply 85):

the daily 'update' by the Malay 'authorites' isn't due for another 5hrs!! ..I don't think they are capable of releasing 'breaking news'.....please excuse my sarcasm
 
jelliesR
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:46 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:08 am

Quoting alberchico (Reply 104):
Wouldn't the ocean currents have carried any floating objects far away from the suspected crash area by now ?

Yes, if the surface currents are at a walking speed, over 1000km from impact point.
 
kiwiinoz
Posts: 2000
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:09 am

I am guessing they found it. Why hold a press conference otherwise. They have already told us they found a couple of objects. And I doubt they would hold a press conference to tell us it turned out to be nothing.
 
PanAm1971
Posts: 444
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2007 4:28 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:09 am

Quoting hivue (Reply 105):
That's my point. Everyone has gotten frustrated enough that they've laid diplomatic niceties and international conventions aside

Happily (I'm sure for everyone) practicalities will probably push a handover of responsibilities to Australia.
 
rcair1
Posts: 1147
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:10 am

Sanity Check - Update.

Typically, when I a new "thread" starts (and I'm awake) I do a new Sanity Check - but I just reviewed the current edition - and with the exception of the Australia 'possible debris' satellite imagery - nothing has changed.

So here is a link to the current one Sanity Check by rcair1 in MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 37
This link puts the sanity check at the top of the screen - you will have to "expand" it to read it.

One more depressing thought

Here is the "What we know" from the one of the first "Sanity Checks"
-----
In summary
We KNOW 4 things.
  • - The a/c disappeared from secondary radar and stopped communicating. We do not know why or what happened to it.

  • - There is some evidence that it traveled west. But that evidence is not conclusive or sure.

  • - We have not found it despite multiple governmental agencies from multiple countries searching hard.

  • - We have a better idea were it is NOT


----
Here is the same from the current Sanity Check - and note, the only addition is not really a "know"

IN summary what we know is.
The a/c disappeared from secondary radar and stopped communicating. We do not know why or what happened to it.
It seems we have data that says that way-points (undefined as yet) were added to the FMS prior to the 1:07 ACARS report.
There is evidence from SATCOM and Radar that the a/c traveled west - then most likely north west.
Hourly SATCOM signals show the a/c was operating till at least 8:11am Malaysia time, over 7 hrs total flight time
We have not found it despite multiple governmental agencies from multiple countries searching hard.


After how many days? - we "KNOW" basically nothing new.
- The a/c and all the people are missing.
- We don't know where they are or 'how' they are
- We don't know if it was accidental or directed.

I will post a new sanity check in the morning (my morning)

- G'night
-rcair1
rcair1
 
k83713
Posts: 160
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:11 am

Quoting alberchico (Reply 104):

Even if so, it's big fixation of the search area, there will be no any distraction by lyrics from Maldivian fishermen or other fancy theories. Matter of time to get to the real assets.
 
hh65man
Posts: 183
Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2013 7:52 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:12 am

Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott has informed us about two objects sighted by satellite imagery as may being related to the aircraft. US P-8 is in route now and the Australians have sent out another P-3 to help...... I'll try to post the link...
 
Lindenwold
Posts: 58
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:13 am

Quoting hh65man (Reply 114):

just link this thread.
 
lazybones
Posts: 159
Joined: Thu Jan 13, 2005 7:32 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:13 am

Quoting PanAm1971 (Reply 98):
Only viewable within Austrailia it says..

davs5032, you're not missing anything it's just our PM speaking in parliament. No vision on the satellite images or anything we can debate yet.
 
edmountain
Posts: 235
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 10:00 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:15 am

I'm not holding my breath, but why else would Abbott himself make the announcement? Egg will certainly cover his face if it turns out to be something else.
 
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mercure1
Posts: 4607
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:15 am

Quoting 777Jet (Reply 6):
VAMPI would likely be reach 82min after takeoff, via the DCT PIBOS R208 IGARI DCT VAMPI routing.
398min (6.6hrs) range from VAMPI @ 485KTAS = 3217nm . Heck thats almost to the Kerguelen Islands."

that spot being searched now is basically 3200nm SSW of VAMPI. Which would be about right, based on known takeoff fuel, Gross Wt at departure time, normal 772ER T892 fuel burns at M.84/OPT FL w/ an assumed 3% fuel burn adjustment for aircraft/engine degradation.

Quoting tayser (Reply 79):
Pic of search area in relation to Australian continent from the Herald Sun: https://twitter.com/theheraldsun/status/446494542078824450/photo/1
mercure f-wtcc
 
rcair1
Posts: 1147
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2009 8:39 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:15 am

Quoting Norcal773 (Reply 96):
Sad that in this case 'optimism' is in relation to a 777 wreckage.

For those who are really impacted, family and friends of passengers, any concrete news will be viewed as, if not good, welcome.

Sometimes we need to remember - while we are living this event vicariously, they are living it for real.

- My heart goes out to them....
rcair1
 
PanAm1971
Posts: 444
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2007 4:28 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:16 am

Quoting edmountain (Reply 117):
I'm not holding my breath, but why else would Abbott himself make the announcement? Egg will certainly cover his face if it turns out to be something else.

Maybe, like 447, the sat can see the tail floating. Would a 777 tail float?
 
Centre
Posts: 321
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 11:37 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:16 am

According to the Australian PM the RAAF Aircraft should have made contact with the "Two objects" by now.
aircraft was diverted to the objects location based on the "expert analysis" of satellite images.
I have cut 4 times, and it's still short.
 
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Finn350
Posts: 1601
Joined: Tue Jul 09, 2013 4:57 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:17 am

And we will probably also get information when those satellite images were taken. The closer the incident date the better (although that means it is more difficul to spot the objects now).
 
Norcal773
Posts: 1059
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 8:19 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:21 am

Quoting rcair1 (Reply 119):
Sometimes we need to remember - while we are living this event vicariously, they are living it for real.

- My heart goes out to them....

Those were my sentiments too when I wrote that, there are a lot of people out there who have lost loved ones in this accidents and my heart goes out to them...but like you said, this can only be 'welcome' news to them at the same time.
If you're going through hell, keep going
 
rfields5421
Posts: 6064
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:21 am

Quoting PanAm1971 (Reply 120):
Would a 777 tail float?

Maybe.

The AF447 stabilizer floated because of trapped air. Without air trapped in various segments - it would have sunk with the rest of the plane.

Wings and the tail could contain enough air to offset the weight of the piece making them float. Then again, they might sink if not enough air is trapped.
Not all who wander are lost.
 
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fotoflyer71
Posts: 41
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:24 am

Looks like CNN is going to carry the press conference too...
Try to learn from the mistakes of others. You won't live long enough to make all of them yourself.
 
jelliesR
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:46 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:24 am

They are showing a slide with two possible southern tracks, very close to each other. Why two?
 
socalgeo
Posts: 408
Joined: Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:56 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:24 am

Quoting mercure1 (Reply 118):
that spot being searched now is basically 3200nm SSW of VAMPI. Which would be about right, based on known takeoff fuel, Gross Wt at departure time, normal 772ER T892 fuel burns at M.84/OPT FL w/ an assumed 3% fuel burn adjustment for aircraft/engine degradation.

Quoting tayser (Reply 79):Pic of search area in relation to Australian continent from the Herald Sun: https://twitter.com/theheraldsun/status/446494542078824450/photo/1



The northern tip of the search area is the 3200 mile location that you are describing. I pulled this location from a Aus Govt SAR site that tomlee provided earlier today.

Their web site said they planned to search to the south of that point...

SoCalGeo
 
aviators99
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon May 19, 2008 6:41 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:25 am

CNN will show the press conference.

"Expert" on there now who was good for a while, but now is talking about Part 121 rules (or lack of) for ELTs.  Wow!
 
Gatorman96
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2005 2:22 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:25 am

If this turns out to be wreckage from MH370, prepare for another 40 threads. Get your coffee ready Rcair1!

[Edited 2014-03-19 21:27:25]
 
Centre
Posts: 321
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 11:37 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:26 am

press conference in 5 minutes from now
I have cut 4 times, and it's still short.
 
AR385
Posts: 6930
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 8:25 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:26 am



Quoting rcair1 (Reply 119):
For those who are really impacted, family and friends of passengers, any concrete news will be viewed as, if not good, welcome.

Sometimes we need to remember - while we are living this event vicariously, they are living it for real.

- My heart goes out to them....

Up until today I was giving the Malaysian Government the benefit of the doubt. But what they did today, dragging that distraught Chinese woman away with such force was pretty disgusting. Not only are they incompetent in investigating this event but also in treating people with respect and compassion.

[Edited 2014-03-19 21:29:43]
 
stuyyz
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 6:09 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:27 am

They are setting up for the news conference, watch live here:
http://www.katu.com/news/live2
 
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RyanairGuru
Posts: 8213
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:27 am

Re the Abbott statement, note that it was an announcement to Parliament rather than a press conference. Beyond his announcement to the House of Representatives, the Australian Government has said nothing to the media about it yet.

AMSA presser starts in 5 minutes.

People not in Australia, do the Channel Nine or NZ links posted above work? I didn't realise that ABC was only available in Australia.

For people in other countries, despite the very short lead-in time I would expect that at the very least New Limited news sources (Sky News UK, Fox News etc) will be able to cover it because Sky News Australia will have their people on the ground; and ABC and BBC often swap feed so BBC News 24 will probably carry it as well. CNN, Al-Jazeera, France 24 etc will probably pay for feed from ABC as well, so must local 24 hour news sources will probably pick it up.

Quoting coolian2 (Reply 103):
Aussies, when does Question Time finish? Surely any real update will be independent of this, right?

ABC cut off Question Time at 15:20, but off the top of my head it finishes at 15:30
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
chaseus1
Posts: 77
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RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:28 am

Well now we have a good clue which country found radar rata that could be pertinet... Australia! Malaysia was saying another country was providing new radar data... there it is! No wonder the US started steering things that way.

The northern route would have led to that plane being detected somewhere. Just like it was when it reached the southern Indian Ocean.

[Edited 2014-03-19 21:29:48]
 
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Starlionblue
Posts: 19704
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:28 am

Quoting PanAm1971 (Reply 71):
Those are some very deep waters. What is the max depth of the black boxes?

I'm not sure there is a max depth. The recordings themselves are hard to crush.

The recorders of AF447 was found at around 4000 meters and the CVR of South African 295 at 4900 meters. The latter was degraded but that may have been from over a year at the bottom.

Quoting PanAm1971 (Reply 120):
Maybe, like 447, the sat can see the tail floating. Would a 777 tail float?

Definitely maybe. Just like an A330 tail, a 777 tail is made of composite. However the reason the AF447 tail floated was because it had air trapped inside. So I suppose it would depend on what it had been subjected to.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
jelliesR
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:46 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:29 am

Quoting chaseus1 (Reply 134):
Well now we have a good clue which country found radar rata that could be pertinet... Australia! No wonder the US started steering things that way.

Why do you think that.
From the slide at the press conference it looks like the USA simply sent the tip to Australia, US Satellite, just nearest friendly country is australia.
 
stuyyz
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 6:09 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:29 am

...from the press conference
See lots of maps but no pictures yet....

http://www.katu.com/news/live2
 
tapir
Posts: 136
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 12:07 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:29 am

Quoting stuyyz (Reply 132):

Thanks. Works fine.
 
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RyanairGuru
Posts: 8213
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:59 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:30 am

The AMSA press conference looks very low-budget and thrown together in haste!
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
tayser
Posts: 430
Joined: Sat Mar 29, 2008 10:49 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:30 am

they just announced the ABC Geo blcok has been removed: http://www.abc.net.au/news/abcnews24/
 
345tas
Posts: 182
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 7:05 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:31 am

A more reliable link might be this radio like to ABC News Radio (it's only audio though) http://www.abc.net.au/radio/player/?station=news
 
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a36001
Posts: 322
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 2:47 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:31 am

According the news on 2GB.com.au PM Abbott has spoken to the Malaysian PM, he is fully informed. It was not a news conference, PM Abbott was addressing the Australian Parliament.

I have great trust in our government and the RAAF, so this sounds positive, in a negative kind of way, but you know what I mean....
 
undertheradar
Posts: 407
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:02 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:32 am

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 133):

sorry..my mistake..not a press conference...just an interruption to parliament!!!
 
sbkom
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:03 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:33 am

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 124):
The AF447 stabilizer floated because of trapped air.

AF447 stabilizer was in composite material. 777 is not, so it may not float, no guarantees.
 
Lindenwold
Posts: 58
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 8:52 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:33 am

Quoting undertheradar (Reply 144):

press conference is going on now!
 
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RyanairGuru
Posts: 8213
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:59 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:35 am

I get the impression that the "news" is that there is no news, but we might know more later

Quoting Lindenwold (Reply 146):
press conference is going on now!

He was referring to the earlier announcemtn
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
coolian2
Posts: 2483
Joined: Sun Oct 22, 2006 3:34 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:36 am

"we wanted to look important, even if we're not. thanks!"

waste of hope and time. cruel.
Q300/ATR72-600/737-200/-300/-400/-700/-800/A320/767-200/-300/757-200/777-300ER/
747-200/-300/-400/ER/A340-300/A380-800/MD-83/-88/CRJ-700/-900
 
ciaran
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2005 8:49 pm

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:36 am

The debris was spotted by satellite initially and then confirmed by Orion

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2014/...ers-malaysia-airlines.html?hp&_r=0
 
PanAm1971
Posts: 444
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2007 4:28 am

RE: MH370 Malaysia Airlines B772 Missing Enroute KUL-PEK Part 38

Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:36 am

The matter of fact tone and professionalism is a relief. Things are moving.
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