Quoting prosa (Reply 197): I'm surprised there isn't more of a market for ISP-BOS

You are right, traffic is crazy during the weekend times. NYC to BOS carries 4,000 pax a day. JFK and LGA alone carry about 3,000. There is no reason to say there is no market on the Long Island area to fill 60 seats.

(200th post, do we need to move now?)

Figured I'd share some photos of two interesting visitors today.

First is N165HQ Republic Airways E-190. This E-190 visited ISP last year in Midwest Express colors..



The second was an unexpected visitor, turned out to be an A/C swap for a -700.. N8603F paid a visit to ISP today. She parked at gate A7.

Quoting SXDFC (Reply 201):

Thanks for the shots! Too bad the weather wasn't better for those two beauties!  

I didn't know that WN had the scimitar winglets already added to their 700's. I thought only UA currently had them on some. what a nice catch. Who was Republic flying for in this visit today? it would have been nice if the weather would have been better. ugly past few days we have had.

Quoting mark787 (Reply 203):

They don't have them on the -700s; the plane pictured above is an -800  

And the Republic E-190s now do a lot of casino flying.

Quoting JBAirwaysFan (Reply 198): Savannah and Myrtle Beach also come to mind.

I wonder if G4 would ever be interested in flying ISP-MYR. MYR is the only G4 focus city in the East, other than PGD, that's in a market not served nonstop from ISP right now. (The others are PIE, SFB and FLL.) And it's a market that isn't served by WN at all.

oops. wow, how did I miss that it was an -800 in that photo? I was tired. that would be nice if the 800 was more common at ISP!

Weather?? hahaha That's funny!

It snowed for 3 months straight...and since then it has been cool, cloudy with a chance of rain.

Long Island has been like the Pacific NW this spring!

Quoting BOACCunard (Reply 205): I wonder if G4 would ever be interested in flying ISP-MYR.

It could either be really great or really bad. 2x weekly, though, should be enough to work well for them. I imagine that G4 really isn't too interested in ISP at the moment.

Honestly, the Carolinas are becoming what Florida is (plus some business). Raleigh has strong traffic from ISP, and as does Charleston, and even Wilmington.

On Wednesday and Thursday of last week I drove two round-trips to LGA from a point that was about five miles to the east of ISP. With one exception each 50-mile trip took about 1:05 to 1:10. The one exception was my return on Wednesday, in which I caught the tail end of rush hour. It was about 1:25
If there's a lesson in this, it's that driving to LGA from a point that's actually a bit further away than ISP is no major ordeal, at least so long as you avoid the peak of rush hour. It is perhaps not surprising that ISP is a bit of an underachiever.

Have any of you flown the PenAir ISP-BOS route? How was it? Were their time tables good? I guess I'm wondering if PenAir's lack of success was due to flying small prop aircraft, or if it was strictly their lack of marketing. Would an airline flying a CRJ-200 with the same marketing strategy have seen the same results?

Harrahs did indeed run a charter using that plane left ISP 5/23 returned 5/26 to Atlantic City ACY. That must be it.

Harrahs has been very busy working hard on charters to AC to fill their casinos......they are filling the planes it appears to be working out well for them.

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 211): Harrahs did indeed run a charter using that plane left ISP 5/23 returned 5/26 to Atlantic City ACY. That must be it.

Interesting... I wonder if Commercial service to ACY on a plane of similar or lesser size would do well if it was partnered with the casinos?

Quoting tan1mill (Reply 210): Were their time tables good?

They had fairly good times, morning and evening, good for business travelers. It may have done better with a jet, but I believe it was mostly marketing/PR. If US Air had a routing to BOS (like they do with MDT, ROC, SYR, etc.) then there would be more opportunity to connect. But BOS really isn't much with connections. I think marketing was to blame.

Lets look at ACY-BOS. They are similar catchment sizes. NK fills (usually) 150 seats on their A319 daily (seasonal but daily). I do not know their advertising in ACY or BOS, but apart from marketing, the low (Extremely low) pricing allows them to fill seats.

Quoting RunningOnEmpty (Reply 212): Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 211):Harrahs did indeed run a charter using that plane left ISP 5/23 returned 5/26 to Atlantic City ACY. That must be it. Interesting... I wonder if Commercial service to ACY on a plane of similar or lesser size would do well if it was partnered with the casinos?

I don't think so, sadly i think the seat cost has to be very low. Harrah's books these people in very affordable packages to fill rooms. I don't think the demand is there at higher prices or without packages. The average age on these charters is pretty old and price is the factor, its not younger people willing to pay any type of a premium. I think all of the rich younger long island people can be found at foxwoods and mohegan sun in connecticut, much closer especially by ferry.

Forgot to mention, I love the -800 with the Split Scimitars, keep the pics coming  

Just because I had some time, here is a snapshot of ISP service on certain days this year (since WN has loaded the calendar to 2015).

(FRI) May 30th, 2014:
ISP to:

FLL: 2x
BWI: 5x
PBI: 2x
MCO: 4x
TPA: 2x

TOTAL: 15 Daily


(TUES) July 8th, 2014:
ISP to:

FLL: 1x
BWI: 5x
PBI: 2x
MCO: 3x
TPA: 2x

TOTAL: 13 Daily

(FRI) August 8th, 2014:
ISP to:

FLL: 1x
BWI: 5x
PBI: 2x
MCO: 3x
TPA: 2x

TOTAL: 13 Daily

(TUES) July 8th, 2014:
ISP to:

FLL: 1x
BWI: 5x
PBI: 2x
MCO: 3x
TPA: 2x

TOTAL: 13 Daily

(MON) September 8th, 2014:
ISP to:

FLL: 1x
BWI: 5x
PBI: 2x
MCO: 3x
TPA: 1x

TOTAL: 12 Daily

(WED) October 8th, 2014:
ISP to:

FLL: 1x
BWI: 5x
PBI: 2x
MCO: 3x
TPA: 1x

TOTAL: 12 Daily

(FRI) November 7th, 2014:
ISP to:

FLL: 2x
BWI: 5x
PBI: 2x
MCO: 3x
TPA: 1x

TOTAL: 13 Daily

(MON) December 8th, 2014:
ISP to:

FLL: 2x
BWI: 5x
PBI: 2x
MCO: 3x
TPA: 1x

TOTAL: 13 Daily

(WED) April 22nd, 2015:
ISP to:

FLL: 2x
BWI: 5x
PBI: 2x
MCO: 4x
TPA: 2x

TOTAL: 15 Daily




I would suppose if WN continues with its' Spring seasonal RSW Service, we may see it when it extends its' schedule, but I'm doubtful of a return due its poor results this spring. Anyone know more?

Around now is Southwests' strongest time with 15 daily flights a day, with seasonal changes more often with TPA and FLL, while PBI and MCO remain mostly strong. I was nervous for a while last year that WN would drop TPA because it was always very cheap in same month booking, far crys to other ISP destinations, but it seems with the 2x seasonal service, WN was able to retain traffic. I would assume with the high yields from ISP they (WN) must have a very low break-even load factor, or it may all just be non-revs.... So up until April of 2015, the Southwest schedule parallels this years, nothing too exciting, yet....

As for US, no more DCA past July 2nd is still in effect. US service to PHL 4x daily (2x Sat) will remain through 2015. After the summer, it seems there will be no more up gauges to CRJs on the ISP-PHL, and DH8's will remain through 2015. It seems ISP is locked into another subpar year, unless we see CapeAir (still no news...)or any new service for that matter....

Quoting RunningOnEmpty (Reply 214):

Interesting to note the starting this summer, we will be getting two 737-800s daily from BWI, with one turning to PBI.

Quoting MesaFlyGuy (Reply 215): two 737-800s daily from BWI, with one turning to PBI.

So by December (Pre-Holiday) we will have BWI-ISP-PBI, plus TPA-ISP-TPA, plus BWI-ISP-BWI, plus MCO-ISP-MCO, and a couple other peppered in daily. Looks like the rampers have their hands full. WN seems to be increasing seasonal service al a -800 service.

No news on the Boston service; I'm losing faith in their release about another Airline....

And recently seeing PeopleExpress starting service. Maybe we see growth at ISP? They may want a piece of the LI/NY market. Maybe not ISP-PHF, but other places. I think its a long shot, but aye, ya never know.

Apparently the future of ISP is this very long, never-ending thread!  

Quoting RunningOnEmpty (Reply 216): Apparently the future of ISP is this very long, never-ending thread!

HAHAHAHAHAHA!   

ISP is a viable airport to support the millions of people that live on LI. This is an important thread holding an important discussion. Feel free to chime in.

Another question out there; does anyone know whats going on with the BOS route? I feel bad for the gate agents and baggage guys who may be losing their job. Also, they are expanding 15R-33L to (almost) 7000' plus they will be restriping the runways, taxiways.

Quoting RunningOnEmpty (Reply 218): HAHAHAHAHAHA! ISP is a viable airport to support the millions of people that live on LI. This is an important thread holding an important discussion. Feel free to chime in.

I don't think he meant it contemptuously, just saying that the thread is long and seems to have a lot of update to ISP's info.

Quoting RunningOnEmpty (Reply 218): Another question out there; does anyone know whats going on with the BOS route?

I've been wondering the same thing. When the KS cut was announced, it was said that a new carrier could be announcing the route as soon as next week (which was last week).

Quoting RunningOnEmpty (Reply 212): believe it was mostly marketing/PR. If US Air had a routing to BOS (like they do with MDT, ROC, SYR, etc.) then there would be more opportunity to connect. But BOS really isn't much with connections. I think marketing was to blame.

You could actually connect pretty easily from KS via the AS codeshare. sha

It would be interesting to determine if the MDW service taken away from ISP produces more loads, better yield at LGA where Chicago competition is tough, operating costs are high and delays are far more common or is this just part of the trend to gradually thin out the medium perimeter airports that were part of the WN philosophy in favor of slugging it out at the big congested airports that Southwest eschewed a while ago. We see some of the same phenomenon at PVD after the WN BOS station opened. Its a bloodbath there where at PVD they pretty much owned the show. Now Southwest is offering a lot of lowball fares at BOS yet they could have charged a modest premium at a lower cost airport and get the traffic as well.

Quoting lat41 (Reply 221):

It is an interesting phenomenon. It's also funny because it seems ISP and PVD got the brunt of the drop in service and there used to be service between the two. Okay, not really funny, just ironic. It seems MHT saw the same thing when WN broke through to Boston. And yeah, ISP really is a premium now a days, not as much then as now. I recently purchased an old WN timetable and this is what they had in 2006.

ISP-____ June 11, 2006

9x to BWI (WOW, now 5x), 3x to FLL (WOW, now 1x), 1x to RSW (Now nothing/seasonal), 5-6x to MDW (WOW, and now nothing?), 2x to LAS (WOW, and also now nothing??), 5x to MCO (now 3x), 3x to TPA (now 1x, 2x seasonally), 3x to PBI (now 2x).

PVD-____ June 11, 2006

12x to BWI (now 9x), 4x to MDW (now 3x), 1x to LAS (now none), 5x to MCO (now 4x, B6 2x now), 5x to PHL (now none, from their failure at PHL), 2x to PHX (now none), 3x to TPA (now 2x), 1x to BNA (now none), 0x to DEN (now very seasonal).

^Interesting. There were cuts at PVD, but were more diverse routes. ISP had steady frequency decline until 0. I think MHT is more fitting to compare with ISP.

MHT-_____ June 11, 2006

11x to BWI (now 8x), 4x to MDW (now 3x -not much change-), 1x to LAS (now light seasonal), 3x to MCO (1x, 2x seasonal), 5x to PHL (also from the PHL US massacre  , 3x to TPA (now 1x)

So ISP falls somewhere in the middle of MHT and PVD. I also have 2003, 2002, and 2004 schedules, so if you want to know anything else, just let me know.

Quoting 32andBelow (Reply 220): You could actually connect pretty easily from KS via the AS codeshare. sha

Eh, maybe to SEA or PDX. But it's kind of a backwards hop. I would assume 90% would be O&D.

Also in the News, behind a paywall: http://www.newsday.com/long-island/t...ke-critical-improvements-1.8362303

So MacArthur wants 3.6 million for more direct taxiways, eh? Why not give a million to Delta or US/AA to get some routes started, and let their taxi take a little longer...  

Quoting 32andBelow (Reply 220): Quoting RunningOnEmpty (Reply 212):believe it was mostly marketing/PR. If US Air had a routing to BOS (like they do with MDT, ROC, SYR, etc.) then there would be more opportunity to connect. But BOS really isn't much with connections. I think marketing was to blame. You could actually connect pretty easily from KS via the AS codeshare. sha

Quoting RunningOnEmpty (Reply 222): Eh, maybe to SEA or PDX. But it's kind of a backwards hop. I would assume 90% would be O&D.

I feel like Cape Air would have better results on the route as they have a lot more connecting opportunities. Between their own and the JetBlue connections, 9K could fill more seats than PenAir can. Now, yields are another story but with more brand recognition and a larger operation in Boston, there's more working in their favor.

Maybe if PenAir had advertised its BOS service it might have done better.

Quoting prosa (Reply 224): Maybe if PenAir had advertised its BOS service it might have done better.

I heard countless radio advertisments for the service, but I agree maybe if something had been put on TV (we don't really have billboards) it would've made a little bit of a difference.

Quoting MesaFlyGuy (Reply 225): I heard countless radio advertisments for the service, but I agree maybe if something had been put on TV (we don't really have billboards) it would've made a little bit of a difference.

Yah, I never heard anything on the radio about PenAir, and that is not really the best advertising for the 21st century.

Quoting MesaFlyGuy (Reply 223): 9K could fill more seats than PenAir can

With the connections, as you said, its possible, but no word on if 9K still wants it after PenAir decided to drop it.

Quoting runningonempty (Reply 226): Yah, I never heard anything on the radio about PenAir, and that is not really the best advertising for the 21st century.

Hence why I made the point about television advertising.