Delta Starting SEA-YYC/GEG LAX-DFW

deltal1011man · Wed May 21, 2014 9:09 pm

All have a NOV 3rd start date, except those with * which start NOV 4

DL5729 SEA-YYC 1130 1355 E75 CP
DL5741 SEA-YYC 1940 2205 E75 CP

DL5729 YYC-SEA 0725 0800 E75 CP*
DL5755 YYC-SEA 1155 1230 E75 CP

DL4581 SEA-GEG 0650 0750 CR7
DL4709 SEA-GEG 1000 1100 CR7
DL4747 SEA-GEG 1335 1435 CR7
DL4758 SEA-GEG 1730 1830 CR7

DL4581 GEG-SEA 0825 0925 CR7
DL4740 GEG-SEA 1000 1100 CR7
DL4747 GEG-SEA 1525 1625 CR7
DL4758 GEG-SEA 1905 2005 CR7

DL5724 LAX-DFW 0700 1210 E75 CP
DL5726 LAX-DFW 0920 1429 E75 CP
DL5731 LAX-DFW 1350 1858 E75 CP
DL5754 LAX-DFW 1705 2211 E75 CP

DL5767 DFW-LAX 0700 0834 E75 CP*
DL5724 DFW-LAX 1240 1411 E75 CP
DL5726 DFW-LAX 1500 1628 E75 CP
DL5731 DFW-LAX 1930 2100 E75 CP

All listed in the downloadable timetable. The GEG flights have a N/A for the connection carrier but i bet it will be operated by OO.

Also LAX-BJX is going from CR9 to a 738. Nice capacity bump. Starts 7/2

DL0651 LAX-BJX 1315 1828 738 DL

DL0950 BJX-LAX 0730 930 738 DL

Tdan · Wed May 21, 2014 9:14 pm

Man, the gloves are REALLY off now going into SEA-GEG! The next round of earnings calls will be interesting, especially if DL is starting to have a tangible impact on AS's business

steex · Wed May 21, 2014 9:15 pm

Quoting Deltal1011man (Thread starter):
DL4581 SEA-GEG 0650 0750 CR7
DL4709 SEA-GEG 1000 1100 CR7
DL4747 SEA-GEG 1335 1435 CR7
DL4758 SEA-GEG 1730 1830 CR7

DL4581 GEG-SEA 0825 0925 CR7
DL4740 GEG-SEA 1000 1100 CR7
DL4747 GEG-SEA 1525 1625 CR7
DL4758 GEG-SEA 1905 2005 CR7

Well, shoot, now how will people deny that DL is looking to truly take on AS at SEA? Maybe we can use ANC-FAI as the next benchmark on the moving yardstick.

sccutler · Wed May 21, 2014 9:15 pm

DFW-LAX on an Embraer?

Naw...

EricR · Wed May 21, 2014 9:18 pm

Quoting Deltal1011man (Thread starter):
DL5767 DFW-LAX 0700 0834 E75 CP*
DL5724 DFW-LAX 1240 1411 E75 CP
DL5726 DFW-LAX 1500 1628 E75 CP
DL5731 DFW-LAX 1930 2100 E75 CP

As expected. DL continues its successful expansion at LAX by connecting the dots to yet another large business market.

Quoting sccutler (Reply 3):
DFW-LAX on an Embraer?

Arguably more comfortable in Y class with 2X2 seating instead of 3X3 used by AA

c172akula · Wed May 21, 2014 9:21 pm

Rumour was WS Encore was looking at SEA from YYC. Wonder if this will give them pause?

jporterfi · Wed May 21, 2014 9:26 pm

Quoting Deltal1011man (Thread starter):
DL5724 LAX-DFW 0700 1210 E75 CP
DL5726 LAX-DFW 0920 1429 E75 CP
DL5731 LAX-DFW 1350 1858 E75 CP
DL5754 LAX-DFW 1705 2211 E75 CP

DL5767 DFW-LAX 0700 0834 E75 CP*
DL5724 DFW-LAX 1240 1411 E75 CP
DL5726 DFW-LAX 1500 1628 E75 CP
DL5731 DFW-LAX 1930 2100 E75 CP

Will this cause AA to retaliate in some way?

panamair · Wed May 21, 2014 9:29 pm

LAX-DFW shouldn't be news to anyone, given that they have been selling LAX-DAL for a while now. If they had gotten some gates at DAL, they would have stayed out of LAX-DFW.

MSYtristar · Wed May 21, 2014 9:30 pm

I doubt DL is going to get much if any local traffic on SEA-GEG considering the substantial AS presence in the market. And if the route is more about feed for the transpac network out of SEA, the only thing I wonder is what the demand is between GEG and Asia? Probably not that much.

BoeingGuy · Wed May 21, 2014 9:33 pm

Time for AS to start SLC-ANC, MSP-ANC, LAX-ATL,LAX-MSP, SFO-ATL and SFO-MSP.

deltairlines · Wed May 21, 2014 9:33 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 3):
DFW-LAX on an Embraer?

Much more comfortable than the 3x CRJ-700 that UA runs on this route. At least on Delta, you won't need to planeside valet your bags, will have wi-fi, multiple lavs (gotta love those CR7s on UA with one lav on a 1250 mile flight!) and in first class will have real glassware and meal service (albeit a cold plate, so not as good as what AA offers, but still light years beyond the UA snackbox).

I did DFW-LGA on a Delta E-175 in F a year or so ago; was an extremely comfortable ride; that was also about 150 miles longer than the LAX flight.

seatback · Wed May 21, 2014 9:42 pm

Quoting jporterfi (Reply 6):
Will this cause AA to retaliate in some way?

Let's hope we see AA start LAX-ATL & MSP.

sccutler · Wed May 21, 2014 9:46 pm

Quoting EricR (Reply 4):

Arguably more comfortable in Y class with 2X2 seating instead of 3X3 used by AA

Ya' got a point...

...if (highly unlikely, but one never knows, do one?) I ever go back to LA, I'll consider this.

kgaiflyer · Wed May 21, 2014 9:48 pm

Quoting Deltal1011man (Thread starter):

DL5729 SEA-YYC 1130 1355 E75 CP
DL5741 SEA-YYC 1940 2205 E75 CP

DL5729 YYC-SEA 0725 0800 E75 CP*
DL5755 YYC-SEA 1155 1230 E75 CP

DL has carefully worked around AS's SEA-YYC schedule.

I'm guessing that since the Q400s are flying full, that there's plenty of business for everyone.

ScottB · Wed May 21, 2014 10:00 pm

Quoting deltairlines (Reply 10):
Quoting sccutler (Reply 3):
DFW-LAX on an Embraer?

Much more comfortable than the 3x CRJ-700 that UA runs on this route. At least on Delta, you won't need to planeside valet your bags, will have wi-fi, multiple lavs (gotta love those CR7s on UA with one lav on a 1250 mile flight!) and in first class will have real glassware and meal service (albeit a cold plate, so not as good as what AA offers, but still light years beyond the UA snackbox).

Not just that, the E175 is an easier upgrade if you're an elite. 12 F seats in a 76-seat aircraft vs. 22 of 188 (757), 16 of 160 (738), or 30 of 228 (767).

klkla · Wed May 21, 2014 10:10 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 9):
Time for AS to start SLC-ANC, MSP-ANC, LAX-ATL,LAX-MSP, SFO-ATL and SFO-MSP.

Why would they want to commit corporate suicide?

Quoting seatback (Reply 11):
Let's hope we see AA start LAX-ATL & MSP

I would think LAX-ATL will be coming sooner than later. However, with DL having the largest domestic hub in the U.S. in ATL and AA the second largest hub in U.S. in Dallas the impact will not be all that bad for either carrier.

Iloveboeing · Wed May 21, 2014 10:12 pm

It seems that DL is taking an, "Well if we can't buy 'em, let's crush 'em" strategy and is redeploying a significant amount of assets to the Pacific Northwest. Will AS' fierce brand loyalty among Pacific Northwesterners be enough to withstand the DL onslaught?

Things are getting very interesting indeed.

gdg9 · Wed May 21, 2014 10:15 pm

I should point out then that there will be about 30 daily flights from DFW/DAL to LAX by November:

AA about 17/18x daily from DFW
DL Connection 4x daily from DFW
UA Express 3x daily from DFW
NK 1x daily from DFW

VX 3x daily from DAL
WN 3x daily from DAL

A quick check on Nov 6 for example, which doesn't include WN, shows 29 flights and 3,729 seats. Saturation??

[Edited 2014-05-21 15:24:08]

Osubuckeyes · Wed May 21, 2014 10:25 pm

Quoting gdg9 (Reply 17):
AA about 17/18x daily from DFW
DL Connection 4x daily from DFW
UA Express 3x daily from DFW

VX 3x daily from DAL
WN 3x daily from DAL

Saturation??

Spirit is 2x daily from DFW as well IIRC.

What I find interesting is that the Canadian additions aren't really in retaliation to AS and to feed their Asian flights they really are competing more against AC in YVR. Some of the sales DL has had via SEA to Asia indicates that they don't mind low yielding connecting traffic to fill coach. The question becomes are they taking premium traffic from other carriers or has there been a significant enough shift in routing away from NRT to keep a strong network out of SEA viable.

steex · Wed May 21, 2014 10:31 pm

Quoting Deltal1011man (Thread starter):
DL5729 SEA-YYC 1130 1355 E75 CP
DL5741 SEA-YYC 1940 2205 E75 CP

DL5729 YYC-SEA 0725 0800 E75 CP*
DL5755 YYC-SEA 1155 1230 E75 CP

I assume we'll have to see some adjustments to the SLC and/or MSP schedules to make these timings work. As it is in the schedules at the moment, the last two E75 departures from YYC are 11:55 to SEA and 14:30 to MSP, but all four E75 arrivals are after 13:30. Unless something changes, the inbound E75 at 13:55 from SEA would have to RON - clearly they won't be leaving that much wasted time in the schedule.

DL YYC Schedule
13:11 CR9 SLC > 13:55 CR9 SLC
13:31 E75 MSP > 14:30 E75 MSP
13:55 E75 SEA > RON > 07:25 E75 SEA
19:31 E75 MSP > RON > 08:10 E75 MSP
20:05 E75 SEA > RON > 11:55 E75 SEA
20:22 CR7 SLC > RON > 08:00 CR7 SLC

[Edited 2014-05-21 15:33:46]

MIflyer12 · Wed May 21, 2014 10:49 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 9):
Time for AS to start SLC-ANC, MSP-ANC, LAX-ATL,LAX-MSP, SFO-ATL and SFO-MSP.

Sure. What current routes and frequencies do you recommend AS cut to have the equipment available for that flying?

32andBelow · Wed May 21, 2014 10:54 pm

ANC/SLC and ANC/MSP would be dumb. Those airports are used to connect for the majority of travelers from ANC, you can accomplish anything you need to on AS with SEA or LAX to the west or ORD to the East.

SLCUT2777 · Wed May 21, 2014 11:21 pm

Quoting steex (Reply 19):
I assume we'll have to see some adjustments to the SLC and/or MSP schedules to make these timings work.

I would not be the least bit surprised if DL dropped YYC-SLC nad gave SEA & MSP those two frequencies.

realsim · Wed May 21, 2014 11:26 pm

Wow, another AA key domestic market where DL isn't afraid to enter, after others like LGA-ORD and LGA-DFW. Congratulations to them.

I wonder what AA is waiting to do the same. The nation's top 20 metropolitan areas are connected to all of AA's 9 hubs except the 11 following pairs:

- IAH-DCA/NYC
- ATL-LAX/DCA/NYC
- DTW-LAX/DCA
- MSP-LAX/DCA/NYC
- TPA-LAX

8 of these are routes to DL's hubs. Will AA always avoid domestic competition?

[Edited 2014-05-21 16:28:24]

travelin man · Wed May 21, 2014 11:46 pm

Excellent, hopefully this means LAX-ATL is right around the corner for AA.

steex · Thu May 22, 2014 12:08 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 22):
I would not be the least bit surprised if DL dropped YYC-SLC nad gave SEA & MSP those two frequencies.

I wouldn't necessarily expect SLC to get dropped, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it switch to E75s and the schedules between the six frequencies more evenly distributed throughout the day at YYC to avoid the extremely long ground times that would be required currently.

YYZAMS · Thu May 22, 2014 12:23 am

It's about time SEA to GEG!! Don't really care for AS and finally an easier way to get to YYC from SEA area instead of going through YVR!

slcdeltarumd11 · Thu May 22, 2014 2:13 am

Quoting Deltal1011man (Thread starter):
DL4581 SEA-GEG 0650 0750 CR7
DL4709 SEA-GEG 1000 1100 CR7
DL4747 SEA-GEG 1335 1435 CR7
DL4758 SEA-GEG 1730 1830 CR7

DL4581 GEG-SEA 0825 0925 CR7
DL4740 GEG-SEA 1000 1100 CR7
DL4747 GEG-SEA 1525 1625 CR7
DL4758 GEG-SEA 1905 2005 CR7

WOW. This is really not even a shot across AS bow, its literally shooting at them at this point. I am not sure AS how much gate space AS has to do their usual SLC response. I can't imagine AS won't respond with something at some Delta airport? Delta responded when B6 recently announced SLC-MCO by adding a frequency, its just part of the industry, protect cities and FF bases that are important to you. I think AS needs to protect GEG that is an important market and FF base for them

PSU.DTW.SCE · Thu May 22, 2014 2:19 am

DFW-LAX was just a matter of time, its been discussed numerous times on this board itself. It made sense of them to connect 2 of the major business centers in the US with a focus city on one end and a major spoke on the other (former hub). There is a huge amount of business traffic between the two markets. Plus, since they intended to operate DAL-LAX it was going to happen one way or another.

Doubtful that this will impact AA too much. AA LAX-ATL is going to happen sooner or later. Again, two of the largest business markets in the country.

DeltaMD90 · Thu May 22, 2014 2:32 am

Oh no SEA-GEG... everyone is going to lose their minds lol. It's the arbitrary act of war we've been hearing about for a while Wow!

[Edited 2014-05-21 19:36:00]

Cubsrule · Thu May 22, 2014 2:34 am

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 27):
WOW. This is really not even a shot across AS bow, its literally shooting at them at this point.

I'm not show how it's a "literal shot" when AS will have more than four times the frequency plus a much better airport experience at GEG (and, arguably, at SEA too).

PSU.DTW.SCE · Thu May 22, 2014 2:35 am

I thought A.net would blow-up the day that DL and NW announced the merger, but DL announcing SEA-GEG may be what does it!

Some posters are going to go nuclear on here......

laca773 · Thu May 22, 2014 3:13 am

Quoting Deltal1011man (Thread starter):
Also LAX-BJX is going from CR9 to a 738. Nice capacity bump. Starts 7/2

DL0651 LAX-BJX 1315 1828 738 DL

DL0950 BJX-LAX 0730 930 738 DL

I was wondering how long it would be before we saw this route go mainline. Happy to see it working for DL. Surprised AM hasn't operated it. Definitely shows high demand in this market.

n7371f · Thu May 22, 2014 3:45 am

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 30):
I'm not show how it's a "literal shot" when AS will have more than four times the frequency plus a much better airport experience at GEG (and, arguably, at SEA too).

What's so much better about GEG on AS? The 1 bar/restaurant and newsstand in Terminal C? There's a Starbucks in the DL terminal too

And as for the in-flight experience I'll take a CRJ-700 any day over a cramped Q400. I never understood how Alaska/Horizon get away with such kudos for the Q400. It used to seat 70 and that was a nice, comfy configuration. Now it's a crammed 76 with no recline.

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 27):
WOW. This is really not even a shot across AS bow, its literally shooting at them at this point.

I had written about this several times before -- that I'd know DL is serious about serious without AS if GEG was added.

It's a vital route in the NW and since WN pulled out it's been all Alaska...and they've made a killing.

I would look for AS to move to more 737's to try and disrupt DL's move into GEG out of SEA but that's just my two bits. I can tell you that DL was aware that AS was spilling traffic on heavy business travel days -- in other words leaving revenue behind with full flights booked several days out, sometimes entire days booked days out.

32andBelow · Thu May 22, 2014 3:48 am

Quoting n7371f (Reply 33):
What's so much better about GEG on AS?

Free beer....that is all.

BoeingGuy · Thu May 22, 2014 3:49 am

Quoting MIflyer12 (Reply 20):
Sure. What current routes and frequencies do you recommend AS cut to have the equipment available for that flying?

Keep their -400s and -700s longer.

deltal1011man · Thu May 22, 2014 4:25 am

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 9):

oh goodness.

AS can't even make PDX-ATL work, so now they should add a bunch of flying that has even less of a chance?

meh, I would be okay with them being that stupid.

Quoting panamair (Reply 7):
LAX-DFW shouldn't be news to anyone, given that they have been selling LAX-DAL for a while now. If they had gotten some gates at DAL, they would have stayed out of LAX-DFW.

this. LAX-DFW is something Delta has to offer.

Quoting jporterfi (Reply 6):
Will this cause AA to retaliate in some way?

I'm not sure. I would have thought if they were going to take a shot, they would have done it when Delta announced LAX-DAL.

Having said that, LAX-ATL on AA is not if but when, IMO.

dbo861 · Thu May 22, 2014 4:39 am

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 35):
Keep their -400s and -700s longer.

Speaking of, how many -700s do they have left after the batch they sold to WN? Are they planning on getting rid of all of them, or are the remaining ones here to stay?

Quoting 32andBelow (Reply 34):

Quoting n7371f (Reply 33):
What's so much better about GEG on AS?

Free beer....that is all.

Any chance Delta will offer free beer as well..just to keep up with AS?

[Edited 2014-05-21 21:44:08]

mayor · Thu May 22, 2014 4:47 am

Quoting iloveboeing (Reply 16):
"Well if we can't buy 'em, let's crush 'em"

Except there is no evidence that they've even considered buying AS.

Viscount724 · Thu May 22, 2014 5:04 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 22):
I would not be the least bit surprised if DL dropped YYC-SLC

Why would they drop YYC-SLC? It's a good connecting hub for many destinations popular with Canadians, including LAS/PHX/TUS/PSP/LAX/SAN etc.

Acey · Thu May 22, 2014 6:09 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 22):
I would not be the least bit surprised if DL dropped YYC-SLC

You must be unaware of the O&D connection southern Alberta has to SLC. I'd bet a good amount of money on this route staying right where it is.

MAH4546 · Thu May 22, 2014 6:17 am

Quoting Acey (Reply 40):
You must be unaware of the O&D connection southern Alberta has to SLC. I'd bet a good amount of money on this route staying right where it is.

SLCYYC is 20 PDEW and SLCYEG is 8 PDEW.

That doesn't even fill a CRJ-200 flying SLC-YYC-YEG-SLC.

STT757 · Thu May 22, 2014 11:00 am

Now that it's clear DL isn't going to get gates at Love Field, this is where DL will be putting the capacity they had planned for DAL.

MIflyer12 · Thu May 22, 2014 11:57 am

Quoting dbo861 (Reply 37):
Any chance Delta will offer free beer as well..just to keep up with AS?

Any chance that AS' Q400s will get window shades (!), extra legroom seats, an F cabin, overhead bins that accept roll-aboards, wifi, and jet engines to 'keep up' with Delta E75s?

bobnwa · Thu May 22, 2014 12:21 pm

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 8):
the only thing I wonder is what the demand is between GEG and Asia? Probably not that much.

The question should be ,what is the demand between Asia and GEG since the majority of passengers on US to Asia flights originated in Asia

Cubsrule · Thu May 22, 2014 12:40 pm

Quoting n7371f (Reply 33):
What's so much better about GEG on AS?

No 30 minute security lines, which happen pretty routinely in the main terminal (though the addition of precheck last summer (?) made things better).

miaami · Thu May 22, 2014 1:09 pm

Quoting Deltal1011man (Reply 36):

I'm not sure. I would have thought if they were going to take a shot, they would have done it when Delta announced LAX-DAL.

Having said that, LAX-ATL on AA is not if but when, IMO.

Im not so sure about that. I would have thought AA would have started ATL-DCA and remained on ATL-LGA, but even those routes are not happening. DL started MIA-LAX and MIA-LGA/JFK with no responce from AA. MIA is a strong hub for AA and they still only offer 4 mainline and 4 RJ's on ATL-MIA versus 11 mainline on DL. I think AA has sort of bowed to DL at ATL, we shall see down the road I guess.

[Edited 2014-05-22 06:22:15]

PSU.DTW.SCE · Thu May 22, 2014 1:16 pm

Note that with the recent schedule change, DL has removed the new DAL flying. The only thing that remains is the 6x 717 ATL-DAL.

Cubsrule · Thu May 22, 2014 1:28 pm

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 47):
Note that with the recent schedule change, DL has removed the new DAL flying. The only thing that remains is the 6x 717 ATL-DAL.

. . . for which they still don't have a gate, though I expect a UA sublease is in the works.

PSU.DTW.SCE · Thu May 22, 2014 1:46 pm

The whole situation would be rediculous if the airport or city or whoever cannot at least find a way for DL to maintain their existing service all due to this completely arbitrary limitation on gates.

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