starrymarkb
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KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Wed Jun 18, 2014 9:48 pm

Just had this email from KLM.

Quote:

When KLM introduced the paid option for check-in baggage in May 2013, the airline waived the fee for Flying Blue Ivory members. Recently, the paid check-in baggage policy has been reviewed for Ivory members travelling within Europe on a KLM Economy Class ticket.

What’s new?
All Ivory members benefit from 50% discount on their first check-in baggage when booking a European flight as of 1 October 2014. You can check in the first piece of baggage for €7.50 (one-way) by booking it before arriving at the airport. Checking in one bag at the airport costs €15 (one-way). This fee can also be paid with 1,500 Miles through MyTrip on klm.com or 3,000 Miles at the airport.

Naturally, you have the choice to travel light. You can continue to take one item of hand baggage and one accessory with a maximum combined weight of 12kg in the cabin free of charge.

In addition, this update does not apply to:

• European Economy Class tickets booked and issued before 1 October 2014
• Fully flexible tickets (booking class Y or B) within Europe
• European Economy Class tickets booked with Award Miles (award tickets)
• Flights to Italy, Georgia, Ukraine, Russia or Belarus, or passengers travelling on and/or transferring to intercontinental KLM flights


Their hand baggage is a bit on the small side compared with EZY or BA!
 
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Mortyman
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 2:19 am

This angers me !

KLM should keep away from such silly fees ... Very negative and not customer friendly.

I have always liked KLM, but it's the small and silly Things like this that annoys People.
 
avek00
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 4:28 am

Quoting Mortyman (Reply 1):
KLM should keep away from such silly fees ... Very negative and not customer friendly.

USA legacies make serious bank off of ancillary fees, and the Euro legacies would be stupid to leave that money on the table for much longer.
Live life to the fullest.
 
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Heavierthanair
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 7:20 am

G'day

A few years back they also charged for beer in economy, do they still do that? Since then I have stayed away from them.


Cheers

Peter
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." (Albert Einstein, 1879 - 1955)
 
debonair
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 7:30 am

Quoting starrymarkb (Thread starter):
In addition, this update does not apply to:
...
• Flights to Italy,

Any idea why Italy is exempted? Why is the Italian market so different, any idea?
 
anstar
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 7:51 am

Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 3):
A few years back they also charged for beer in economy, do they still do that? Since then I have stayed away from them.

Heineken is complimentary on all KLM flights.
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 8:43 am

Quoting anstar (Reply 5):
Heineken is complimentary on all KLM flights.

And it should be, Heineken is not worth spending money on   
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
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Plane Holland
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 4:49 pm

I read a funny comment somewhere regarding this.

If the person next to you weighs 20kg more than you, shouldn't he/she pay extra?
 
Joost
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 6:04 pm

Quoting starrymarkb (Thread starter):
Flights to Italy, Georgia, Ukraine, Russia or Belarus
Quoting debonair (Reply 4):
Any idea why Italy is exempted? Why is the Italian market so different, any idea?

It most probably has to do with the code share agreements on routes to these destinations, and the partners policies. To the aforementioned countries, KL has codeshare agreements with AZ, A9, PS, SU and B2. Note that KL doesn't even fly its own metal to Georgia or Belarus, but A9 and B2 tickets from/to AMS can be booked directly through KLM.

To France, AF already offers the mini fares, which also don't include baggage. Other European codeshare agreements (like BT to RIX or EI to DUB) don't apply as on these routes, KL can only sell the flights in combination with an intercontinental flight.
 
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PW100
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 6:32 pm

Quoting plane holland (Reply 7):
If the person next to you weighs 20kg more than you, shouldn't he/she pay extra?

That person is self loading cargo. Your suitcase has to go through extensive baggage handling; there is a cost involved, regardless of the weight of your suitcase.

Rgds,
PW100
Immigration officer: "What's the purpose of your visit to the USA?" Spotter: "Shooting airliners with my Canon!"
 
lhrnue
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 6:53 pm

Flying Blue Ivory ... ?!? is that good, bad or some sort of hay fever?
 
caaardiff
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 7:12 pm

When KLM introduced the baggage fee, it must've gained a lot of new Ivory card holders. It's free and easy to join, and would always give a free 1st item of baggage.
It probably meant KLM now has a whole new bunch of frequent flyers.
Was it always the intention to introduce a fee for Ivory card holders once they got more people to join? :-/
 
anstar
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 9:09 pm

Quoting caaardiff (Reply 11):
It probably meant KLM now has a whole new bunch of frequent flyers.
Was it always the intention to introduce a fee for Ivory card holders once they got more people to join? :-/

The strategy was probably to gain members - then see who took another KL/AF flight within 12 months. Ie by offering the free bag and encouraging future loyalty would it make that pax book KL/AF again - hence a strategy to offer somehting for free to the customer in return for future loyalty.

The answer seems to be that it hasn't worked and pax are not rebooking another flight with AF/KL hence the change in policy.
 
ozzietukker
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 9:24 pm

Quoting caaardiff (Reply 11):
When KLM introduced the baggage fee, it must've gained a lot of new Ivory card holders. It's free and easy to join, and would always give a free 1st item of baggage.
It probably meant KLM now has a whole new bunch of frequent flyers.
Was it always the intention to introduce a fee for Ivory card holders once they got more people to join? :-/

It probably always was the idear to start charging fees for hold luggage, on short term this will generate quite some money as people still book KLM tickets, especially in advance they are not that expensive compared to low cost airliners, not as cheap, but 99 euro return in Europe is not bad.

But on long term, this is not the best descision, people get stung by extra fees for hold luggage, and looking for alternatives in the like of Lufthansa or other mainstream airlines, or worse for KLM, looking more and more to low cost airlines, as there it is expected to pay for luggage and their prices are lower then KLM with now the same service.
KLM might end up flying their Europe network even more then now as feeder for the longhaul flights, which are more and more under price pressure because of the Middle Eastern Carriers, and where luggage will stay free of charge as charging on those flights is still a bridge to far.
 
prebennorholm
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 10:28 pm

Quoting caaardiff (Reply 11):
When KLM introduced the baggage fee, it must've gained a lot of new Ivory card holders. It's free and easy to join, and would always give a free 1st item of baggage.
It probably meant KLM now has a whole new bunch of frequent flyers.

Yeah, I guess so. I am one of them.

Last year, just after they had introduced baggage fees, I ordered a ticket, with two bags on four sectors. But their web site wasn't yet functioning properly, every time I tried to add a bag it answered with a stupid error message. I "complained" in an email, and when it remained unanswered a week later, I called them, and was shocked by being very fast connected to a very competent agent.

She fixed everything in a minute, and then asked if I was a Flying Blue member.
- No, I was not.
- Why not?
- Because I will hardly ever be a serious frequent flyer on KLM.
- But your first bag is free, being a Flying Blue member.
- You should have told me that a a couple of weeks ago.
- Why weeks ago?
- Because then I would saved a little of my hard earned money.
- No problem, I will make you a member right away, I have all information except your date of birth.

She charged my credit card for the second bag only, and everything worked perfectly well.

Nothing wrong with baggage fees. When it's a sensible amount, some ailines charge crazy amounts, some charge a fair amiunt for 1st bag and a crazy amount for the 2nd bag. They all have a little red flag on the list of favorites on my browser.

I was a little "tired" of the non-functioning web site which could have caused me to pay double fee for two bags on four sectors because they were not prepaid. Plus all the hazzle with paying at check-in.

Because the web site didn't work, then incidentally I paid only half instead of double (roughly $50 instead of $200), and became a Flying Blue Ivory member. After next October it will be $100 which is OK with me.
Always keep your number of landings equal to your number of take-offs
 
Joost
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Thu Jun 19, 2014 11:41 pm

Quoting caaardiff (Reply 11):
When KLM introduced the baggage fee, it must've gained a lot of new Ivory card holders. It's free and easy to join, and would always give a free 1st item of baggage.

There was never any mention of 'always'.

IMHO, one could easily expect that when they introduced the policy, it would be temporary. It was a nice way to gradually introduce a fee, test the public's reaction and to become Europe's biggest FFP.

And of course still now, FB members receive 50% discount.

Quoting ozzietukker (Reply 13):
But on long term, this is not the best descision, people get stung by extra fees for hold luggage

People get used to it. Who still remembers that Ryanair and easyJet offered free hold luggage? Or Delta and American? Who still remembers that 2x32kg was normal for Europe-US flights even on discounted economy? Luggage is more and more considered as an extra.

Personally, the exorbitant fees for luggage after the 1st piece charged by some airlines, upset me. Not the fees for one suitcase.

Quoting ozzietukker (Reply 13):
and where luggage will stay free of charge as charging on those flights is still a bridge to far.

Give it two years. Nowegian already charges for hold luggage on long-haul. And it doesn't seem to upset people. (or at least not as much as their infamous delays). Personally, I wouldn't mind. For shorter long-haul trips or to warm-weather destinations, one 23kg suitcase can often be enough for two travelers. I wouldn't mind saving some money here.

Quoting ozzietukker (Reply 13):
KLM might end up flying their Europe network even more then now as feeder for the longhaul flights

Why so, as competition is also introducing checked baggage fees within Europe for their cheapest flights:

AF - introduced mini fees Jan 2013
BA - Feb 2013 (LGW), Oct 2013 (LHR, LCY)
EI - Dec 2013
IB
Lufthansa Group: Germanwings has a basic fare without hand luggage. By transferring all Lufthansa DUS, HAM en TXL to Germanwings, LH practically started charging for checkec baggage. They probably have a close look at KL and I wouldn't be surprised to see them follow.
 
ozzietukker
Posts: 60
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Fri Jun 20, 2014 7:36 am

Quoting Joost (Reply 15):
Give it two years. Nowegian already charges for hold luggage on long-haul. And it doesn't seem to upset people. (or at least not as much as their infamous delays). Personally, I wouldn't mind. For shorter long-haul trips or to warm-weather destinations, one 23kg suitcase can often be enough for two travelers. I wouldn't mind saving some money here.

Norwegian is not a threat for KLM, the Middle Eastern Carriers are, charging for hold luggage on long haul flights means that KLM is even more on a disadvantage.

Quoting Joost (Reply 15):
Why so, as competition is also introducing checked baggage fees within Europe for their cheapest flights:

AF - introduced mini fees Jan 2013

The exact reason why I will never choose Air France with their not so mini fares for travel within Europe, not that I need hold luggage on Europe trips, but because Easyjet have on the average cheaper prices, and Air France does not offer anything more then a small can of coke....

Ofcourse management have made an calculated descission and only time will tell if this was the right one, my feeling is that KLM will generate some money in short term, but loose more in the long term as they look more and more like an expensive low cost carrier which will make people look at alternatives, the likes of Easyjet might even open up new routes to compete to make life for KLM very difficult. (Or Middle Eastern joint ventures which are trying to take over smaller European airliens to try to gain acces to the European market)
With the new fees the amount of hand luggage taken on board will rise even more, aleady the bins are much more full then they used to be, and gate check them cost time, and this does upset passengers.
 
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Mortyman
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RE: KLM New Baggage Fees For Flying Blue Ivory

Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:06 am

Quoting Joost (Reply 15):
Nowegian already charges for hold luggage on long-haul. And it doesn't seem to upset people.

Just because Norwegian does it, does'nt mean that KLM has to act like a lowcost carrier ...

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