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TC957
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Wed Jul 30, 2014 4:51 pm

It seems the 5029 l/n is now with a UA 739ER N66831, info from Puget Sound.

Seems odd to me then that in the past l/n's have been cancelled because of late cancelled orders, so what's the difference ?
 
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speedygonzales
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Wed Jul 30, 2014 5:42 pm

Quoting dc1030cf (Reply 246):
Boeing is sending the fuselages to the scrap yard. So sad http://seattletimes.com/html/busines...024160934_737fuselagescrapxml.html

They will actually shred the fuselages. I guess that's to make 100% sure that no parts end up on the market somehow.
Ignorance kills. :tombstone:
 
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7BOEING7
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Wed Jul 30, 2014 8:18 pm

Quoting TC957 (Reply 250):
Seems odd to me then that in the past l/n's have been cancelled because of late cancelled orders, so what's the difference ?

I can't remember Boeing ever cancelling a line number, can you provide an example? AB appears to cancel MSN on the A380 from time to time but not Boeing.

If this airplane is 5029 I find it hard to believe it was part of the train derailment unless it was undamaged (didn't come off the tracks). Does anybody know how long it generally takes from arriving in Renton to B-1 these days? Was it another -900 for UAL (higher ln) that they renumbered?
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Wed Jul 30, 2014 9:09 pm

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 252):
AB appears to cancel MSN on the A380 from time to time but not Boeing.

A320s and A330s as well.
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
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kanban
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Thu Jul 31, 2014 12:35 am

If a customer had another unit following, they slide the line number as many things are tied to it.. like wings.. however if there is no immediate customer unit, and the line assigned parts are unique in some way, they will accelerate the line around it, store the components until a replacement hull is available. That said there are exceptions such as another customers basic configuration is identical or or damn close, they may just shift.. at some point it all balances. good thing there was no P-8 or C-40 in the mix
 
Viscount724
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Thu Jul 31, 2014 12:55 am

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 252):
I can't remember Boeing ever cancelling a line number, can you provide an example?

There's no 767 line number 718. Reason is explained in a 1999 thread in Reply 4 of this 2010 thread.
767 LN 718 - Why Not Built? (by FlyCaledonian Feb 19 2010 in Civil Aviation)

That 1999 reply quoted here to simplify:

The mystery surrounding this number has been cleared up. The order for this aircraft, a -300 for Asiana, was cancelled after construction was started and for the first time Boeing stopped building the plane rather than complete a white tail and hope for a sale. The line number will not be reused so subtract one from the highest 767 line number to get the total built


So 767 line number 1000 was actually the 999th.
 
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7BOEING7
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:45 am

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 255):
There's no 767 line number 718.

Learn something everyday -- the one exception to the rule as far as Boeing is concerned. They conveniently forgot about that 13 years later, since ANA also got 1001 it wouldn't have been an issue.
 
flightsimer
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Thu Jul 31, 2014 4:31 pm

Quoting exFWAOONW (Reply 227):
The railroad considers anything that derails "paid for by the insurance company" and aren't concerned about saving the contents. Opening the mainline and getting trains moving (ie. making money instead of losing it) is job #1. Sometimes, most times, they don't even wait for the accident investigation to begin.

Exactly. There have been quite a few derailments in my area over the years, and with the exception of one, they had the cars tossed off to the side and the old track removed and new track laid within hours of the incident, especially since the lines going through my area are the main lines between Chicago and the East Coast. As soon as the Fire commander in charge of the scene gives the go ahead, they would go full out in reopening the lines.

Depending on the line we are talking about 100's of millions in lost revenues PER day with the lines closed.

A specific case in my region, was after a fire erupted in a warehouse next to train tracks, that caused the track to be closed so water lines could be run across them, CSX or Norfolk Southern (can't remember which), was going to have a large crew come in (which is is now during the middle of the night) and tunnel underneath the tracks and reinforcing it with quick setting concrete so that the hoses could be moved down beneath so they could reopen the lines as they had be closed for over 12 hours while the fire was being fought. To do that would have costed the rail company tens of millions of dollars in crew and materials, but they were willing to do it just so they could get trains moving again.
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UA444
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Fri Aug 01, 2014 1:56 am

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 256):
Learn something everyday -- the one exception to the rule as far as Boeing is concerned. They conveniently forgot about that 13 years later, since ANA also got 1001 it wouldn't have been an issue.

There's also a similar precedent with the 727. The 2nd 727 never got delivered and remained a test aircraft, so even though Boeing delivered 1831, 1832 were built.
 
Viscount724
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Fri Aug 01, 2014 2:01 am

Quoting UA444 (Reply 258):
Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 256):
Learn something everyday -- the one exception to the rule as far as Boeing is concerned. They conveniently forgot about that 13 years later, since ANA also got 1001 it wouldn't have been an issue.

There's also a similar precedent with the 727. The 2nd 727 never got delivered and remained a test aircraft, so even though Boeing delivered 1831, 1832 were built.

That's quite a different situation as the aircraft was built and the line number exists. Same for several other Boeing types where the original aircraft wasn't delivered but retained for test purposes. This thread wasn't talking about deliveries but about line numbers.
 
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7BOEING7
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Fri Aug 01, 2014 3:31 am

The question remains -- If ln 5029 was involved in the train wreck how did that same ln end up flying a B-1 yesterday? Any answers????
 
justplanesmart
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Fri Aug 01, 2014 4:19 am

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 260):

The question remains -- If ln 5029 was involved in the train wreck how did that same ln end up flying a B-1 yesterday? Any answers????

Because it is line number 5029, not fuselage number 5029. Just because Spirit (and Boeing Wichita prior to that) paints a number on the fuselage for reference does not necessarily mean that is the position said fuselage takes on the production line. I am certain it is most often the case, but under unusual circumstances such as the derailment, you just take the next available fuselage and send it down the line.
"So many planes; so little time..."
 
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bikerthai
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Fri Aug 01, 2014 1:18 pm

Quoting justplanesmart (Reply 261):

Because it is line number 5029, not fuselage number 5029.

  

Suppliers will have their own serial numbers for major components. And it is not uncommon to initially have the supplier serial number match the Boeing line number or effectivities. Then something happens and the sequencing of the hardware at the supplier changed and the two numbers get out of sequence. Just happened to us recently. Does cause some confusion if you are not careful when reviewing the status charts. In our case, we will get back in sequence in a couple of months.

bt
Intelligent seeks knowledge. Enlightened seeks wisdom.
 
karadion
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Fri Aug 01, 2014 1:51 pm

The numbering system is just identifying which fuselage will go where they need to go. X is a 900ER fuselage so it will correspond with the X components whereas Y is a 800 fuselage so it will correspond with Y components. The fuselages is just an aluminum can with nothing on it. So they can just get the one one in line and replace it. The delay isn't significant. When the train derailment happened, they were at LN5000 and now here we are almost done with the month, the Renton FAL is somewhere around 5040-5060. There are literally 737 fuselage sitting outside the FAL waiting to go in but there's no room yet. So with 5029 on test flights, it's quite obvious that they were able to keep the supply of fuselage from Kansas to Washington going despite the derailment.
 
MEA-707
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:45 pm

In the mean time there have been other first flights already of line numbers which were earlier reported in the derail accident
5036 Delta 932ER ff 01 august
5037 Air China 8L9 ff 05 august
5038 Southwest 8H4 ff 04 august

It's interesting to see if they will fill up all the gaps, 5030-5035 and 5039-5040 are not accounted for (yet). It might be true that they will skip a few of these, as apart from 5039 (photo confirmation) I have heared conflicting reports which frames were involved in the derailing.
nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?
 
karadion
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RE: Train Derails And Sends 3 737 Fuselages Into River

Wed Aug 06, 2014 4:28 pm

http://www.planespotters.net/Product...st/Boeing/737/737NG/index.php?p=51

If you go to this page, guess what is missing from the list. 5030-5035.

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