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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Sat Aug 02, 2014 9:47 pm

I think this announcement will put torest the prepetual a.net rumors that SLC-CDG is on the DL chopping block or that SLC is the next DL hub to go theway of MEM or CVG.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
factsonly
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Sun Aug 03, 2014 7:26 am

It seems even DL itself has problems counting the number of destinations it serves from AMS!!

The Official Press Release title announces SLC as the 8th destination, while the lower text talks about the 9th destination and I count 10x DL destinations from AMS in 2015:

Quote from Press Release:

DELTA ANNOUNCES NEW SERVICE FROM AMSTERDAM TO SALT LAKE CITY
DAILY FLIGHTS WILL START IN MAY 2015 SALT LAKE CITY WILL BE DELTA’S EIGHTH U.S. DESTINATION FROM AMSTERDAM AIRPORT SCHIPHOL
Jul 30, 2014

AMSTERDAM, July 30, 2014 – Delta Air Lines (NYSE: DAL) will launch daily nonstop services from Amsterdam Airport Schiphol to Salt Lake City International Airport in May 2015. The summer service, Delta’s ninth destination from Amsterdam, will be operated in conjunction with joint venture partners Air France, KLM and Alitalia.

1. ATL
2. DTW
3. MSP
4. BOS
5. EWR
6. JFK
7. SEA
8. PDX
9. SLC
10. BOM
 
n521na
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Sun Aug 03, 2014 7:55 am

Quoting factsonly (Reply 51):
It seems even DL itself has problems counting the number of destinations it serves from AMS!!

The title states that SLC is the eighth U.S. destination from AMS, not overall. Also, if you count JFK and EWR both as NYC, then SLC is indeed the eighth U.S. destination from AMS, and the ninth overall when you include BOM. That matches up with the lower text which does not make any reference to number of U.S. destinations specifically.

[Edited 2014-08-03 00:55:39]
 
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airportugal310
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:57 am

Quoting Nola (Reply 49):

With all due respect, your links offer nothing substantive. The hotel occupancy one offers no comparison to other cities (74% is nice but not that super high). New terminal is because it needs it to boost the economy. Population growth is because it's coming back from when people left.

Did you not expect people to actually read the articles?
“They bought their tickets, they knew what they were getting into. I say, let 'em crash.”
 
WesternA318
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:21 am

Already booked a ticket onm the inaugural from SLC with my wife! I sold her on it as lunch in AMS, dinner in ATH...  
 
donindc
Posts: 33
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2008 7:21 pm

RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:12 pm

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 53):
Population growth is because it's coming back from when people left.

Not exactly true. Katrina was 9 years ago. The population growth of New Orleans the last few years is NEW growth, not people returning from 9 years ago. I moved away from there in 1988, but I can say the last few times I visited in the past year, it is evident that young, educated people are flocking there. There's a vibe and energy now that never existed even before Katrina. I know that's not based on hard data, but I for one am very optimistic about the city's future. While it still has a long way to go, I'd disagree the city is in decline. Seems to be on the upswing. Go see for yourself.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Mon Aug 04, 2014 7:02 pm

Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 54):
Already booked a ticket onm the inaugural from SLC with my wife! I sold her on it as lunch in AMS, dinner in ATH...


Congrats! Hope you have a great time and please write a trip review for us and snap a few photos of the event!
 
Viscount724
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Mon Aug 04, 2014 7:12 pm

Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 54):
Already booked a ticket onm the inaugural from SLC with my wife!

Just curious what was the round trip fare involving the inaugural flight?
 
slcdeltarumd11
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Mon Aug 04, 2014 8:00 pm

The dates i looked at Delta was charing thousands more for business class to CDG than AMS. I guess its a mature route with more business demand?
 
Nola
Posts: 373
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Tue Aug 05, 2014 8:37 pm

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 53):
With all due respect, your links offer nothing substantive. The hotel occupancy one offers no comparison to other cities (74% is nice but not that super high). New terminal is because it needs it to boost the economy. Population growth is because it's coming back from when people left.

The population growth from Katrina is over. This is new growth. I suppose you could say that the next stage of growth will be Katrina related in that new LSU and VA hospitals are being built to replace the destroyed ones but that is only $2B in investment. The increases in tourism, development of a tech center and an education hub (with most of the public schools now being charter schools), and of course, the movie/television industry which is now #3 in the nation, are not Katrina related.

With all due respect, as you say, the view that Nola is in decline is outdated.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Tue Aug 05, 2014 9:29 pm

If Europe has demand to New Orleans and its tourists i don't see why a charter carrier wouldn't be there already? They would need some premium demand to support a flight to Europe and last minute business travel to pay high fares. I just don't think there is the level of tourism required to fill an international flight or business travellers. A widebody is alot of seats to fill and if you cant get a premium over connections it isn't worth flying.
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Tue Aug 05, 2014 11:46 pm

Quoting Nola (Reply 59):
the view that Nola is in decline is outdated

Stagnant by national comparisons is a better term. Keep in mind the demand for Europe service to MSY just isn't there. Unlike BUF, JAX or OAK, the NFL Saints do look to stay in the "Big Easy."
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
BoeingGuy
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Tue Aug 05, 2014 11:52 pm

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 61):
Quoting Nola (Reply 59):
the view that Nola is in decline is outdated

Stagnant by national comparisons is a better term. Keep in mind the demand for Europe service to MSY just isn't there. Unlike BUF, JAX or OAK, the NFL Saints do look to stay in the "Big Easy."

I certainly admire Nola's passion for his city. A previous girlfriend was from LFT so I've visited New Orleans several times. I love it there and the people in both MSY and LFT are super nice.

Actually, OAK is very underrated. Although the area east of the airport and Coliseum is not the greatest, there are very safe and interesting parts of OAK. It's a lot like Tacoma - bad rap but actually a pretty cool place in many area.

So is everyone sure that, say, BA couldn't support a MSY-LHR flight, or DL couldn't support MSY-CDG or AMS? How do we know the demand just isn't there?
 
MSYtristar
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Wed Aug 06, 2014 1:21 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 61):
Keep in mind the demand for Europe service to MSY just isn't there.

Oh really? Check out the stats in this link. These are 2013 numbers.

http://www.anna.aero/2014/06/25/new-...m=0_ecdbf41674-d679b429b8-86887533

MSY had more pax to Europe than BNA, AUS, STL, MCI, and CMH. Not sure where CLE or BDL stand, but the posted article makes a great case for MSY.

The city and state have been in long negotiations with BA and the chances are very high that we'll see them in MSY in the near future.

[Edited 2014-08-05 18:22:59]

I'm sorry the thread took this turn but I felt like I had to dispel the notion earlier that NOLA is in decline, and I'm glad others have joined in. Again, very happy for SLC's new DL service to AMS...I've had many great visits to the SLC area over the years.


[Edited 2014-08-05 18:31:57]
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Wed Aug 06, 2014 1:56 am

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 63):
The city and state have been in long negotiations with BA and the chances are very high that we'll see them in MSY in the near future.

The odds are there that BA could add 4-5 U.S. destinations next year as their 787 fleet increases. The DL SLC-AMS announcement clearly was a distractional shot at BA, since DL or joint venture partner VS can't get the slot they want. BA, VS & LH have all talked with SLC about trans-atlantic service to one of the 4 big Europe hubs. SLC-AMS is a clear indication that DL wants the eventuality of SLC-LHR over BA.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 4700
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RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Wed Aug 06, 2014 8:09 pm

Austin has more passengers to London and I am sure much more premium demand than MSY. I really see premium or business demand as the problem for MSY plus European tourism is truly not that high as the passengers to Europe is not high for the population of the area.

I just dont see BA looking at New Orleans and being wowed regardless of what one article is saying, it would be cool to see BA in MSY but it seems like a long shot to me.......
 
MSYtristar
Posts: 7543
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2005 12:52 am

RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Wed Aug 06, 2014 8:51 pm

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 65):
Austin has more passengers to London

Yeah. A tiny amount more; however the combined AUS+SAT Euro traffic made the region the #1 underserved market to Europe. It only made sense that it would be added next.

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 65):
I just dont see BA looking at New Orleans and being wowed regardless of what one article is saying, it would be cool to see BA in MSY but it seems like a long shot to me.......

It's probably going to happen in late 2015. The article just sort of reaffirmed what has been going on behind the scenes.
 
EddieDude
Posts: 7048
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2003 10:19 am

RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Thu Aug 07, 2014 3:00 am

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 48):
Lets not forget that Delta just announced the SLC-MEX flight will resume in December!

Don't mean to go astray but is it going to be seasonal? 2x weekly? Thanks!
Upcoming flights:
April/May: AM MEX-SCL 788 (J), AM EZE-MEX 789 (J).
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 4700
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Thu Aug 07, 2014 3:33 am

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 67):
Lets not forget that Delta just announced the SLC-MEX flight will resume in December!

Don't mean to go astray but is it going to be seasonal? 2x weekly? Thanks!

DEC 0>0.4 JAN 0>1.0 FEB 0>1.0 MAR 0>1.0 APR 0>1.0
Yes daily a319. As of now loaded indefinitely not seasonal
 
Nola
Posts: 373
Joined: Thu May 29, 2014 1:40 am

RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Sat Aug 09, 2014 2:48 am

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 62):
I certainly admire Nola's passion for his city. A previous girlfriend was from LFT so I've visited New Orleans several times. I love it there and the people in both MSY and LFT are super nice.

So is everyone sure that, say, BA couldn't support a MSY-LHR flight, or DL couldn't support MSY-CDG or AMS? How do we know the demand just isn't there?

Thanks BoeingGuy. I'm just tired of people bashing Nola. There was a lot of the "you shouldn't rebuild" feeling going on after the storm (forgetting that there pretty much has to be a port at the mouth of the Mississippi) and, even now, people ask me whether parts of the city are still under water... It's been 9 years!

As for AMS or CDG on DL, I suppose it could happen, but given DL runs a lot of people through Atlanta from MSY, I'd doubt it. I wouldn't' think they would want to eat into that feed. If they did decide to try one, I'd guess AF if they had the right equipment. On the other hand, unless one goes through CLT or PHL, AA/US don't really have any convenient connections to LHR, so I wouldn't be surprised if BA/oneworld tried a nonstop to Europe through the JV.

Not sure what *A would be interested in doing--probably not enough demand for a nonstop to one of their European hubs from MSY.
 
Cubsrule
Posts: 14425
Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 12:13 pm

RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Sat Aug 09, 2014 2:11 pm

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 66):
Yeah. A tiny amount more; however the combined AUS+SAT Euro traffic made the region the #1 underserved market to Europe.

This is an interesting point, and one on which I'd be curious to see some numbers. Downtown San Antonio to AUS is about 80 miles, and it's easily doable in an hour and 15 minutes most of the time. AUS-LHR isn't clearly more convenient for getting to London than SAT-DFW/IAH/ORD/ATL-LHR, and driving to AUS-LHR-CDG is clearly less convenient than SAT-DFW-CDG or even driving to Houston and flying IAH-CDG nonstop.

It's different from SLC in that regard, as the "out of the metro but close to SLC" passengers in places like Provo are almost all going to use SLC.

Quoting Nola (Reply 69):
As for AMS or CDG on DL, I suppose it could happen, but given DL runs a lot of people through Atlanta from MSY, I'd doubt it. I wouldn't' think they would want to eat into that feed. If they did decide to try one

New Orleans and other similarly-located markets (SAT is a good example) are sort of victims of the same problem: the number of hubs in the way and the solid lineup of domestic service. It's already pretty easy to get from most European population centers to New Orleans.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
MSYtristar
Posts: 7543
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2005 12:52 am

RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Sat Aug 09, 2014 2:22 pm

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 70):
This is an interesting point, and one on which I'd be curious to see some numbers. Downtown San Antonio to AUS is about 80 miles, and it's easily doable in an hour and 15 minutes most of the time. AUS-LHR isn't clearly more convenient for getting to London than SAT-DFW/IAH/ORD/ATL-LHR, and driving to AUS-LHR-CDG is clearly less convenient than SAT-DFW-CDG or even driving to Houston and flying IAH-CDG nonstop.

Someone on the MSY spotters page on FB posted 2012 numbers a few months ago (tried to just do a quick search for the post but I can't locate it), and speaking of just areas that didn't have a nonstop to Europe, AUS+SAT was number one, while STL was second and MSY third. According to the anna.aero article I posted, it looks like MSY and SAT swapped places in 2013. If I can find the post (it detailed many cities), I'll post it here. Interesting stuff.
 
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SLCUT2777
Posts: 3476
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2006 12:17 am

RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Sat Aug 09, 2014 10:23 pm

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 70):
New Orleans and other similarly-located markets (SAT is a good example) are sort of victims of the same problem: the number of hubs in the way and the solid lineup of domestic service. It's already pretty easy to get from most European population centers to New Orleans.

SLC has had that issue with its albeit greater distance proximity to DEN, PHX & LAS over the years.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
WesternA318
Posts: 4603
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 11:55 am

RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Sat Aug 09, 2014 10:38 pm

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 56):
Congrats! Hope you have a great time and please write a trip review for us and snap a few photos of the event!

We shall see...at the very least I will write a trip report for my blog (fl310travel.blogspot.com).

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 57):
Just curious what was the round trip fare involving the inaugural flight?

The fare I paid was $1552 per person. Not a bad price at all!
 
Cubsrule
Posts: 14425
Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 12:13 pm

RE: DL Starting SLC-AMS In MAY

Sat Aug 09, 2014 11:55 pm

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 72):
SLC has had that issue with its albeit greater distance proximity to DEN, PHX & LAS over the years.

True, although those are all backtracks. There's really not very much on the great circle path SLC-Europe.

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 71):
Someone on the MSY spotters page on FB posted 2012 numbers a few months ago (tried to just do a quick search for the post but I can't locate it), and speaking of just areas that didn't have a nonstop to Europe, AUS+SAT was number one, while STL was second and MSY third.

I believe the numbers. I'm just a little skeptical about lumping SAT and AUS together given SAT's level of service.

A good analog for SAT might be IND (CVG is like AUS; DTW/ORD are like IAH). Nobody is adding the populations of Indianapolis and Cincinnati together in a conversation about TATL service to that part of the world.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more

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