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boefan
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WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 1:49 pm

WestJet says it'll induct 4 Boeing 767-300ERs in late-2015 for Alberta - Hawaii operations

http://twitter.com/airlineroute/status/494114252827787264

not a surprising move after all

anyone knows from where they will buy/lease them?
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 1:55 pm

In addition, the airline also ordered 5 more Q400's.

http://www.bombardier.com/en/media-c...venewbombardier.bombardiercom.html
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BlueSky1976
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:03 pm

Quoting boefan (Thread starter):
not a surprising move after all

anyone knows from where they will buy/lease them?

When is Boeing starting full-scale deliveries of KC-46? Perhaps they offered a good price to WS to fill production slots?
Proudly avoiding 737 MAX since 18.11.2020.
 
ytz
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:06 pm

I wonder why 763s. Why not some 739s with aux tanks or a 737-700ER?
 
Boeing744
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:11 pm

I assume they will eventually use these on European or southern vacation routes. Any thoughts?
 
Thenoflyzone
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:11 pm

Quoting ytz (Reply 3):
Why not some 739s

738s and 739s barely make it to HNL from the US west coast, much less Alberta-Hawaii. Winter headwinds to Hawaii are brutal.

B738 with winglets - max range 5765 km
B739 with winglets and 2 aux tanks, 2 class layout, max range 6045km

Just as an example, YEG-HNL is 5161km, great circle. Add in the headwinds and ATC routings, and your ESAD is borderline, if not above the max range of the 738 and 739, even with winglets and 2 aux. tanks, especially with a one class layout that WS would surely use.

Quoting ytz (Reply 3):
a 737-700ER?

Not enough seats to justify the expense of operating the route.

A 757/767 is the right frame for Alberta-Hawaii, and considering WS wants to expand with long haul service to Europe/Asia as well, the 763ER is the obvious choice here. The fact that they are getting 4 birds is proof enough. They dont need that many for Alberta-Hawaii.

WestJet Goes Wide-body (by steelhead Jul 7 2014 in Civil Aviation)

Thenoflyzone

[Edited 2014-07-29 07:45:43]
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TWA772LR
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:12 pm

Quoting ytz (Reply 3):
I wonder why 763s

They are also wanting to make a name for them self's in Europe too. Hence YYZ-St. Johns(?)-Dublin.
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boefan
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:47 pm

WestJet official tweet : http://twitter.com/WestJet/status/494131095256850432
the're gonna be B767-300ER with Winglets  
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:52 pm

Quoting boefan (Reply 7):
the're gonna be B767-300ER with Winglets

Yup, here's the computer render.

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BtuBc3SCYAA2Tqx.png:large
http://twitter.com/WestJet/status/494130917984587777
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boefan
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:52 pm

nice one  Smile i like it

[Edited 2014-07-29 07:53:50]
 
MIflyer12
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:26 pm

Maybe AS and WN can take a lesson: sometimes network growth demands a new type.
 
INFINITI329
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:59 pm

Quoting MIflyer12 (Reply 10):
Maybe AS and WN can take a lesson: sometimes network growth demands a new type.

   Your 100% right. You can only do so much with one airframe
 
timpdx
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 4:01 pm

These new builds? Nothing on the press release section of Boeing's website.
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GCT64
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 4:14 pm

"WestJet has not decided whether it will purchase or lease the 767s. “We’re not disclosing where they’re coming from other than to say that they’re used 767s that will be completely refurbished before going into service with WestJet,” Saretsky said."

http://atwonline.com/finance-data/we...boeing-767s-2015-2q-net-profit-159
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SpaceshipDC10
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 4:31 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 8):
here's the computer render.

I love it. WS livery looks great on a 767.

Quoting GCT64 (Reply 13):
they’re used 767s that will be completely refurbished before going into service with WestJet,

Wise move for a start of such operation and, as I've probably already said in a previous thread on that topic, WS already started ops with second hand aircraft. Then will come the time to buy new.
 
MesaFlyGuy
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 4:34 pm

Quoting SpaceshipDC10 (Reply 14):

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 8):
here's the computer render.

I love it. WS livery looks great on a 767.

It's the nicest livery I've seen on a 767 ever, besides the Caribbean Airways one.
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Whiteguy
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 4:37 pm

Quoting timpdx (Reply 12):

These new builds? Nothing on the press release section of Boeing's website.


They are not new build aircraft!
 
INFINITI329
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 4:53 pm

Will these operate in tandem with their 757's?
 
SpaceshipDC10
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:01 pm

Quoting timpdx (Reply 12):
These new builds? Nothing on the press release section of Boeing's website.

See below.

Quoting GCT64 (Reply 13):
"WestJet has not decided whether it will purchase or lease the 767s. “We’re not disclosing where they’re coming from other than to say that they’re used 767s that will be completely refurbished before going into service with WestJet,” Saretsky said."

http://atwonline.com/finance-data/we...boeing-767s-2015-2q-net-profit-159

Since they don't want to disclose the origin of these aircraft, I wonder whether they'll be former AC 767s....  
Quoting infiniti329 (Reply 17):
Will these operate in tandem with their 757's?

Per previous thread below, they are to replace the 757s.

WestJet Goes Wide-body (by steelhead Jul 7 2014 in Civil Aviation)
 
FighterPilot
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:03 pm

Great news.. It'll be interesting to see where they will get them from.
Cal   
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Whiteguy
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:03 pm

Quoting infiniti329 (Reply 17):

Will these operate in tandem with their 757's?


The B757s aren't WS, they are wet leased from Thomas Cook. The contract with TC ends in the spring of 2015. The B763 are to replace the wet lease for Alberta-Hawaii flights in the winter 2015/16 and long haul expansion in the summer 2016.
 
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United_fan
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:07 pm

Maybe AA or DL will be giving up some wingletted 767's ?
"Suspicion is a matter of opinion"
 
drgmobile
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:09 pm

Quoting ytz (Reply 3):
I wonder why 763s. Why not some 739s with aux tanks or a 737-700ER?
Quoting Boeing744 (Reply 4):
I assume they will eventually use these on European or southern vacation routes. Any thoughts?

As was widely reported about a month or so ago, WestJet already had said it was going to do this and service to Europe is part of the plan.

Quoting SpaceshipDC10 (Reply 18):
Since they don't want to disclose the origin of these aircraft, I wonder whether they'll be former AC 767s....

It is curious. I was under the impression that they were all being transferred to Rouge for the forseeable future, alas I'm not good with math.

Quoting infiniti329 (Reply 11):
Quoting MIflyer12 (Reply 10):
Maybe AS and WN can take a lesson: sometimes network growth demands a new type.

Your 100% right. You can only do so much with one airframe

Canadian population: 34 million. Population of the U.S.: 314 million, so not exactly a straight line comparison, me thinks.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:14 pm

Quoting drgmobile (Reply 22):
It is curious. I was under the impression that they were all being transferred to Rouge for the forseeable future, alas I'm not good with math.

Originally, plans were to transfer 20 767s to Rouge. Per Planespotters, AC currently has 21 active 763s while there are 8 in RV fleet.
 
brilondon
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:32 pm

Quoting drgmobile (Reply 22):
Canadian population: 34 million. Population of the U.S.: 314 million, so not exactly a straight line comparison, me thinks.

I am not sure what you are referring to; about what comparison? WS is a up and coming airline in Canada who draws US travelers to go through out Canada and will continue to do so wit their flights from Canada to Europe next year. Are they still going to use their hub in eastern Canada or will they be flying from YYC or YYZ?
Rush forever Closer To My Heart
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 6:01 pm

Update:

Quote:
[email protected]'s pre-owned 767s will be sourced from Boeing, declines to specify previous operator, reports @jmhdinger

And:

Quote:
[email protected]'s 767s will have 262 seats, including premium economy, reports @jmhdinger

http://twitter.com/ghimlay
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drgmobile
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 6:04 pm

Quoting SpaceshipDC10 (Reply 23):
Originally, plans were to transfer 20 767s to Rouge. Per Planespotters, AC currently has 21 active 763s while there are 8 in RV fleet.

See. I knew there would be math involved.

We'll of course know where they're coming from once they're registered.

Quoting brilondon (Reply 24):
I am not sure what you are referring to; about what comparison? WS is a up and coming airline in Canada who draws US travelers to go through out Canada and will continue to do so wit their flights from Canada to Europe next year. Are they still going to use their hub in eastern Canada or will they be flying from YYC or YYZ?

The original suggestion was that Southwest or Alaska should "learn" something from WestJet about *needing* to add an aircraft type to grow networks. The comparison is weak. Canada and the U.S. are very different sized markets and any Canadian carrier has by rule fewer opportunities to grow relative to U.S. carriers.
 
brilondon
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 6:21 pm

Quoting drgmobile (Reply 26):

The original suggestion was that Southwest or Alaska should "learn" something from WestJet about *needing* to add an aircraft type to grow networks. The comparison is weak. Canada and the U.S. are very different sized markets and any Canadian carrier has by rule fewer opportunities to grow relative to U.S. carriers.

I understand where you are coming from but also remember that there are fewer carriers in Canada that have the ability to compete with the US based carriers. AC has always been on the top of the list of favourite carriers as well as WS being NA's most popular LCC, although they are not cheap to fly. I unfortunately cannot always take the Canadian carriers as I have to fly more based on schedule than on my preferred airline.
Rush forever Closer To My Heart
 
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lightsaber
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 6:36 pm

Quoting boefan (Thread starter):
anyone knows from where they will buy/lease them?

Me too. I also wonder how well lease prices are holding up since the last thread with improved 787 deliveries. I doubt there is an impact yet... but there will be one.

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Ronaldo747
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 6:49 pm

I think it might be Air NZ 767s which will be replaced by 787-9.
 
YYZatcboy
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:34 pm

Shame it's not the A330. Canada is getting very Boeing heavy. Also shame about the winglets... (from an aesthetic point of view)
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cosyr
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:37 pm

I bet they're from UA. UA is cutting 1 this year, and presumably more next year, and they've been working hard on the used market like the FedEx 757's.
 
PlanesNTrains
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:13 pm

I love the 767-300ER with winglets. I think it's a great used frame for a carrier like WS. Smart choice. They can always grow later once they've proven the market, including ordering A330neo's or 787's. For now, good selection WS.

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United_fan
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:28 pm

On second thought, AC would scrap those 763's before they would sell them to WS  
"Suspicion is a matter of opinion"
 
MD80Nut
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:28 pm

This is a smart way to do it. Start with some used 763s and see how it goes. Meanwhile they can look into whether more 763s or something newer (787 or A330neo) is warranted for the next step in international expansion.

I think carriers like SW and AS are going to have to step up their game and add wide body jets for long range international flights in the future. That's where the real potential for growth is. The 787 and A330neo may make enough economic sense to tempt them.

By the way, that 767 looks great in Westjets's scheme.

Cheers, Ralph
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Thenoflyzone
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:01 pm

Quoting YYZatcboy (Reply 30):

Shame it's not the A330. Canada is getting very Boeing heavy. Also shame about the winglets... (from an aesthetic point of view)

U crazy?  crazy 

The 767s will disappear sooner than the A330s. Enjoy them while you can! Besides, i think this is a temporary move from WS. Once they get their feet wet, in my opinion, they will buy new 787s !

As for those winglets, they look awesome on the 67!

Thenoflyzone

[Edited 2014-07-29 15:06:16]
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
SpaceshipDC10
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:12 pm

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 35):
The 767s will disappear sooner than the A330s

Disappear from passenger services, yes, but not completely. As for the A330, so far only TS and AC still have them and I'm not sure until when for the latter. There used to be two other operators for the type.
 
lpdal
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:12 pm

Excellent! Maybe one day they can fly the 763s down to FLL. I've always wanted to try WestJet, especially in exit row seats 10A and 10F in the 736...Do they fly the 736 to FLL? I'm going to look into that now...

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Viscount724
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:28 pm

Quoting timpdx (Reply 12):
These new builds?
Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 35):
Once they get their feet wet, in my opinion, they will buy new 787s

For any routes likely to be operated by WS they have no need for anything with the 787's range. I would bet more on something like the new A330neo, but not for several years. Used 763s do everything they need at much lower capital cost.
 
yvphx
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Wed Jul 30, 2014 12:14 am

A source for the birds could be from HA with their retirement coming online. Also, one might think some birds are up for sale or lease that are currently sitting at GYR or MZJ.

Congrats to Westjet!
 
DXBDFWHGA
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Wed Jul 30, 2014 12:43 am

I'm happy for WS. I hope they join OW.
 
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sunrisevalley
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Wed Jul 30, 2014 12:59 am

Quoting Ronaldo747 (Reply 29):
I think it might be Air NZ 767s which will be replaced by 787-9.

I believe NZ's would be in very good condition . Average age 18.6 years according to NZ's annual report. Too old, I don't know but they are in good enough shape to give 13hrs a day utilization.
 
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airportugal310
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:00 am

Quoting yvphx (Reply 39):
A source for the birds could be from HA with their retirement coming online.

Not coming from HA...I can tell you that

Although, I have it on some decent authority that they aren't coming from AC either, as suggested above. Not confirmed but that's the scuttlebutt
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DexSwart
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:30 am

Could be from QF, they're getting rid of 767's like no tomorrow with more A330's for domestic ops.
Durban. Melbourne. Denver. Hong Kong.
 
PRAirbus
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:34 am

Are those 763s going to be recycled from another airline or brand new? Surprised they opted for 763 instead of 787s!
 
DexSwart
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:59 am

Quoting PRAirbus (Reply 44):
Are those 763s going to be recycled from another airline or brand new? Surprised they opted for 763 instead of 787s!
Quoting whiteguy (Reply 16):
They are not new build aircraft!

  
Durban. Melbourne. Denver. Hong Kong.
 
cylw
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Wed Jul 30, 2014 2:04 am

Rumor is they're from Qantas. Not official by any means though.
 
747400sp
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Wed Jul 30, 2014 2:40 am

Quoting ytz (Reply 3):
I wonder why 763s. Why not some 739s with aux tanks or a 737-700ER?

Quiet!! Do not stop progress, there are to many airlines down sizing from wide bodies to A32Xs and 737s, it nice to see an airline bring wide bodies onboard.

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 38):
For any routes likely to be operated by WS they have no need for anything with the 787's range. I would bet more on something like the new A330neo, but not for several years. Used 763s do everything they need at much lower capital cost.

Yes, a 767 would be a good fit for WS. It is a Boeing jet like their 737s, so they can use the same suppliers for parts. Remember with the USAF and Fed Ex getting new 767s, there will be parts for 767s for years, so it was a smart buy.

Quoting MD80Nut (Reply 34):
I think carriers like SW and AS are going to have to step up their game and add wide body jets for long range international flights in the future. That's where the real potential for growth is. The 787 and A330neo may make enough economic sense to tempt them.

Hopefully, and it would be intresting to see which wide body B6 goes with, it likely A330s.
 
JoeCanuck
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Wed Jul 30, 2014 3:12 am

Perhaps the first customer for the 767MAX.   
What the...?
 
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RyanairGuru
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RE: WestJet Inducts 4 B763ER

Wed Jul 30, 2014 3:18 am

Quoting DexSwart (Reply 43):
Could be from QF, they're getting rid of 767's like no tomorrow
Quoting cylw (Reply 46):
Rumor is they're from Qantas

QF was my first thought as they are retiring the type completely by 1Q15, but QF's don't have winglets. There must be four WL 767s on the market somewhere?

The other thing to remember about the QF 767s is that (I assume) they have relatively high cycles, as that they've been used/abused on SYD-MEL and SYD-BNE, and even SYD/BNE/MEL-PER is barely half the length of LHR-ORD. Frames that have been used predominantly on TATL will surely have lower cycles (and hours) than the QF frames which were predominantly used on domestic routes.

Quoting MesaFlyGuy (Reply 15):
It's the nicest livery I've seen on a 767 ever

Call me biased, but I personally give that title to the latest QF livery with brilliant white/bright red. I agree with you in principle, though, "EuroWhite" seems to suit the 767 more than just about any aircraft.


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