FR Set To Place Order For 100 MAX + Options

phxa340 · Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:04 pm

Talks are being finalized but sources said the order will be complete in 2 weeks.

No surprise but FR will order the high density configuration with 200 seats.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/ryanai...ng-10-120231173.html?.tsrc=applewf

jetwet1 · Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:18 pm

why not go 199 and saved the extra FA cost?

rj777 · Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:20 pm

over 200 seats. Wouldn't that be the MAX -9?

817Dreamliiner · Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:24 pm

Quoting rj777 (Reply 2):
over 200 seats. Wouldn't that be the MAX -9?

The MAX8 will have the extra exit option seen on the -900ER to allow the 200 seat option.

tommy1808 · Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:26 pm

Quoting 817Dreamliiner (Reply 3):

The MAX8 will have the extra exit option seen on the -900ER to allow the 200 seat option.

So bye-bye 31" pitch at FR?

best regards
Thomas

Andy33 · Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:35 pm

Quoting jetwet1 (Reply 1):
why not go 199 and saved the extra FA cost?

Current Ryanair planes seat 186 and require 4 cabin crew/flight attendants. As the European regulations have one FA for each 50 passengers as the minimum, the same size crew can handle 200 pax (but not 201).

bunumuring · Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:25 pm

I actually thought the order was going to be bigger. I remember reports last year of the order being for 200 units plus options,with breathless commentary that it could end up being the largest numerical order in history...
I guess reality set in.
I can't help but wonder if they looked at the MAX9 as well... And what Boeing might have offered them ...
Cheers,
Bunumuring.

KarelXWB · Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:36 pm

Hardly a surprise, they were talking about this order last year. The 200-seat option is a given, MOL always wanted it and has been pushing Boeing for years.

The only question left is how many remaining 737 NG orders will be converted to the MAX?

Quoting bunumuring (Reply 6):
I actually thought the order was going to be bigger. I remember reports last year of the order being for 200 units plus options,with breathless commentary that it could end up being the largest numerical order in history...

Once there was a time people thought an order for 100 jets was big

trent900 · Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:45 pm

Bang goes their 25 minute spins. It's difficult enough at the moment with a full compliment of 189!

Anyone guesstimate delivery year?

D.

RandWkop · Fri Sep 05, 2014 9:45 pm

Quoting trent900 (Reply 8):

I was at a lean manufacturing demonstration day hosted by a company in Northern Ireland. The CEO of the host company gave a spiel about their business. One interesting part was that some low cost carriers have asked them to see if air mail / air cargo security can be automated using things like inert gas and x-rays to speed up the scanning process. If this succeeds, maybe the 25 minute turn around will not as important.

Mortyman · Fri Sep 05, 2014 9:49 pm

Can anyone give a possible delivery schedule ? When can we expect to see these B737-Max in FR colours if this deal goes through ?

scbriml · Fri Sep 05, 2014 10:14 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 7):
The only question left is how many remaining 737 NG orders will be converted to the MAX?

They still have 180 unfilled NG orders.

MD80 · Fri Sep 05, 2014 10:29 pm

Quoting andy33 (Reply 5):
Current Ryanair planes seat 186 and require 4 cabin crew/flight attendants.

I always thought that Ryanair configures their Boeing 737-800s with 189 seats?
This is already not the most comfortable way to configure an aircraft due to the fact that this is the maximum allowed aboard this type but it´s quiet OK and it can´t be expected that a LLC operates with comfortable seating-configurations.

QANTAS747-438 · Fri Sep 05, 2014 10:40 pm

Quoting jetwet1 (Reply 1):
why not go 199 and saved the extra FA cost?

4 FA includes 200 paxs. 201 and up requires a 5th.

olddominion727 · Fri Sep 05, 2014 11:11 pm

if the seat pitch isn't 31" in this 200 seats, what would it be: 29" or 30" ?

tommy1808 · Sat Sep 06, 2014 5:10 am

Quoting olddominion727 (Reply 14):

if the seat pitch isn't 31" in this 200 seats, what would it be: 29" or 30" ?

Unless boeing found some extra room in the fuselage it would have to be mostly 29".

Best regards
Thomas

TWA772LR · Sat Sep 06, 2014 5:25 am

Will the the whole MAX family have a flat rear pressure bulkhead like the 900ER to allow for more PAX?

BA777 · Sat Sep 06, 2014 7:19 am

Quoting MD80 (Reply 12):

I always thought that Ryanair configures their Boeing 737-800s with 189 seats?

That is correct

StTim · Sat Sep 06, 2014 7:47 am

Hopefully Boeing are making O'Leary pay a reasonable price this time. There is no order drought so no need for extra aggressive pricing - and they know Airbus are not really interested in talking to RyanAir.

flyabr · Sat Sep 06, 2014 8:12 am

Quoting StTim (Reply 18):
Hopefully Boeing are making O'Leary pay a reasonable price this time. There is no order drought so no need for extra aggressive pricing - and they know Airbus are not really interested in talking to RyanAir.

Uh, how much did MOL pay for those previous 737s? I'm sure Boeing didn't lose any money on the transaction!

VCEflyboy · Sat Sep 06, 2014 8:25 am

I am puzzled here. Didn't they just launch "business" class seats last week?
Will they be able to squeeze in 200 seats including those premium business seats?

[email protected] · Sat Sep 06, 2014 8:37 am

Quoting VCEflyboy (Reply 20):
Didn't they just launch "business" class seats last week?

No, not business class. Like easyJet, simply a package of components - unlimited changes, seating in exit row/first few rows, priority boarding, speed-through immigration, etc. - valued by business travellers called Business Plus. It isn't business class.

[Edited 2014-09-06 01:39:12]

VCEflyboy · Sat Sep 06, 2014 9:00 am

But this article from the guardian clearly states "extra legroom"

"Last week Ryanair launched a business-class service offering flexible tickets as well as "premium" seats with extra legroom and priority boarding"

http://www.theguardian.com/business/...ustomer-service-profits-passengers

scbriml · Sat Sep 06, 2014 9:04 am

Quoting VCEflyboy (Reply 22):
"Last week Ryanair launched a business-class service offering flexible tickets as well as "premium" seats with extra legroom and priority boarding"

They're only talking about bulk-head and exit rows where, by definition, there are a couple of extra inches room.

VCEflyboy · Sat Sep 06, 2014 9:55 am

oh ok thank you for the info!

frostyj · Sat Sep 06, 2014 9:59 am

Maybe they will finally start a chepa transatlantic serivce.

That plane can reach Washington, Chicago, Boston, Charlotte, NYC and Atlanta from here so it should be easy.

StTim · Sat Sep 06, 2014 10:16 am

There was talk on here - no idea how true - that it was $20million a frame for the last order. Remember this was placed in the slump post 911 and meant security for the 737 line. I am sure it was of value to Boeing but not sure it was very profitable.

KarelXWB · Sat Sep 06, 2014 10:44 am

Quoting scbriml (Reply 11):
They still have 180 unfilled NG orders.

I presume there is some flexibility in the schedule. Some of those unfilled NG orders might be converted to MAX.

Eagleboy · Sat Sep 06, 2014 11:54 am

Quoting StTim (Reply 26):
Remember this was placed in the slump post 911 and meant security for the 737 line. I am sure it was of value to Boeing but not sure it was very profitable.

Quoting StTim (Reply 18):
Hopefully Boeing are making O'Leary pay a reasonable price this time. There is no order drought so no need for extra aggressive pricing -

While Boeing may have made little to no profit on the post 9/11 order, in the long term it was still good for them. At that point Boeing were looking into a black hole in aviation, there was a risk that they would have had to lay off workers and partially shut the line. The FR keep the production chain in operation and the skilled workers busy so that Boeing still had the ability to pump out B737's when other airlines started to order again.

Short term pain, long term gain for Boeing.

StTim · Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:13 pm

I agree - but times have now changed and there is no need for Boeing to offer up such discounts.

I am also not sure if Boeing are too keen on conversions from NG to MAX at this point as they still have (to my knowledge) NG slots to fill. Conversions will just make that more difficult.

PhilInBRN · Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:21 pm

Quoting tommy1808 (Reply 15):
Unless boeing found some extra room in the fuselage it would have to be mostly 29".

I hope they will put in some slim line seats such as the LH Group NEK seats that enable the airline to install more seats while keeping legroom relatively stable.

UALWN · Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:52 pm

Quoting flyabr (Reply 19):
Uh, how much did MOL pay for those previous 737s? I'm sure Boeing didn't lose any money on the transaction!

Well, MOL used to boast about how he "raped" Boeing on that order, so I wouldn't be so sure...

scbriml · Sat Sep 06, 2014 3:32 pm

Quoting UALWN (Reply 31):
Well, MOL used to boast about how he "raped" Boeing on that order, so I wouldn't be so sure...

And Boeing's response was "We enjoyed it!"

Despite frequent claims that both OEMs "give their planes away", there's zero evidence to support it.

KarelXWB · Sun Sep 07, 2014 4:09 pm

Boeing and Ryanair will make an announcement tomorrow:

http://twitter.com/BoeingAirplanes/status/508647854660128768

[Edited 2014-09-07 09:36:17]

CRJ900 · Sun Sep 07, 2014 4:33 pm

200 seats in a B738 means 28" pitch with slimline seats and slimline lavatories for sure. I just worked three days in a B738 with 189 seats spaced at 29-30 inch pitch, full house on all flights. It's tight, but it works.

Will be interesting to see the new cabin layouts. Wonder what the realistic range will be for a 200-seat MAX 8?

KarelXWB · Sun Sep 07, 2014 4:34 pm

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 34):
but it works.

That's the thing. For short hops, nobody cares about tight seats.

frostyj · Sun Sep 07, 2014 4:39 pm

Its a 737-800 MAX not a 737-800.

CRJ900 · Sun Sep 07, 2014 4:48 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 35):
That's the thing. For short hops, nobody cares about tight seats

Nobody cares about tight seating on longer flights either, as long as the airfare is low enough. We fly up to six-hour nonstop flights with these birds with a full house all the time.

From what I understand, the B737 MAX 8 fuselage and cabin will be identical to the current B738NG. Plus the added Type II doors aft of the wings.

Andy33 · Sun Sep 07, 2014 5:23 pm

Quoting BA777 (Reply 17):
Quoting MD80 (Reply 12):

I always thought that Ryanair configures their Boeing 737-800s with 189 seats?

That is correct

My typo. Sorry for the error.

KarelXWB · Sun Sep 07, 2014 5:45 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 33):
Boeing and Ryanair will make an announcement tomorrow:

A press conference will be held in New York tomorrow, an order for 100 737 MAX-8 aircraft is expected.

tommy1808 · Sun Sep 07, 2014 8:01 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 35):

That's the thing. For short hops, nobody cares about tight seats.

Well, i kinda have to disagree. I can sit ok with 28" seats for a while, but i have been sitting next to people fighting tears and visibly being in pain if the person in front moved as much as coughed. Slimmer slim line seats will certainly be an improvement, but there is a hard limit in every sense of the word.

best regards
Thomas

par13del · Sun Sep 07, 2014 8:52 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 35):
That's the thing. For short hops, nobody cares about tight seats.

Does FR have any routes that are not considered short hops? Maybe we need to settle on a definition of short, up to 3 hours, less or more?

GSPSPOT · Sun Sep 07, 2014 11:36 pm

Quoting [email protected] (Reply 21):
No, not business class. Like easyJet, simply a package of components - unlimited changes, seating in exit row/first few rows, priority boarding, speed-through immigration, etc. - valued by business travellers called Business Plus. It isn't business class.

Something like what WN does in the U.S. with "business" fares.

karadion · Mon Sep 08, 2014 12:10 am

Quoting frostyj (Reply 36):
Its a 737-800 MAX not a 737-800.

Not to nitpick but actually it's a 737 MAX 8

[email protected] · Mon Sep 08, 2014 7:46 am

Quoting GSPSPOT (Reply 42):

Something like what WN does in the U.S. with "business" fares.

Yep! Exactly.

neutrino · Mon Sep 08, 2014 7:50 am

Quoting Karadion (Reply 43):

Quoting frostyj (Reply 36):
Its a 737-800 MAX not a 737-800.

Not to nitpick but actually it's a 737 MAX 8

You are absolutely right.
A lot of folks, including enthusiasts & so-called experts, still could not the official designations of aircraft right.
Worst are those who tried to correct others but still get it wrong!

scbriml · Mon Sep 08, 2014 11:39 am

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 35):
For short hops, nobody cares about tight seats.

Not true. I'm 6'4" and even at 30" pitch, my knees are jammed hard against the seat in front. Even for a one-hour flight, 28" pitch would be very uncomfortable if not physically painful.

KarelXWB · Mon Sep 08, 2014 12:31 pm

It's about to happen.

http://twitter.com/FG_STrim/status/508955413988278272

Flyglobal · Mon Sep 08, 2014 12:52 pm

So it seems 200 Planes? Probably 100 orders and 100 purchase rights, or 200 Orders straight away.

Congrats in advance!

Flyglobal

n1786b · Mon Sep 08, 2014 12:56 pm

I think that "200" is the variant name (for 200 seats) instead of the number of airframes to be ordered.

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