Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
User avatar
enilria
Topic Author
Posts: 10372
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 1:19 pm

FAQ

WHAT SA) and Eagle Air/Arnaflug (Iceland)">IS THIS REPORT?
This compares what is for sale THIS WEEK for the stated period versus what was for sale LAST WEEK...It does NOT compare to last year or now (UNLESS OTHERWISE STATED).

HOW DO I READ IT?
XXX-YYY DEC 4>5 JAN 4>5 ; means that the listed airline changed the frequency between the two airports to add from 4 to 5 roundtrips in December and January. No other months were changed. I only list one direction, although it is possible the listed change is only one way. It is too difficult to average the two directions. I assume the change is roundtrip and that is most often the case.

HOW ARE THE DAILY DEPARTURES CALCULATED?
This report uses total operations for the month listed, divided over the days in the month.

WHAT ARE THE FRACTIONAL FLIGHTS?
Flights that do not operate every day of the month create fractional service. In most cases flights are rounded, but in the case of international service or markets with low frequency, fractions are shown. For example, if a flight operates 4 times in April it will show 4/30=0.133=0.1. Also , a flight that only operates once per week may vary between 0.1 and 0.2 because a weekday may repeat either 4 or 5 times depending on the month.

WHAT ABOUT CARRIERS THAT DON'T PUBLISH A SCHEDULE 9 MONTHS IN ADVANCE?
Most airlines publish schedules 11 months in advance. This report covers the next 9 months. That avoids seeing schedules as they are loaded. Several LCCs load their schedules less than 9 months into the future. I remove the schedule adds if I see them and show a year over year (YOY) comparison if I notice them.

THOSE FLIGHTS AREN'T DELTA, THEY ARE SKYWEST
This report only shows the marketing code. It is too complicated to show all the operators.

THE FREQUENCIES MAY HAVE CHANGED SA)">AS YOU SHOW, BUT THE SEATS DIDNT CHANGE BECAUSE OF EQUIPMENT SWAPS
That is a natural weakness of a frequency based report, but it provides something to discuss below.

THIS LOOKS LIKE AN ERROR?
The carriers file the schedules. They do make mistakes. Most of the mistakes I have seen are either related to code shares not being marked as "duplicates" or carriers filing flights with invalid data such as equipment codes that are not standard. This causes flights to not appear.

CHARTERS?
Lately charters have been showing up in the database. I have no idea if that will continue.

I marked some of the ones I thought were interesting with an "*".

Why was the SA)">UA code dropped off these? I'm guessing not a mistake because it happens in sync with SA)">UA and that was two separate filings as each carrier must file their own schedule.
*SA)">3M CKB-IAD OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0 JAN 0>1.0 FEB 0>1.0 MAR 0>1.0 APR 0>1.0 MAY 0>1.0
*SA)">3M CKB-MGW OCT 0>0.9 NOV 0>0.8 DEC 0>0.9 JAN 0>0.9 FEB 0>0.9 MAR 0>0.8 APR 0>0.9 MAY 0>0.8
*SA)">3M CKB-PKB OCT 0>0.7 DEC 0>0.7 JAN 0>0.7 FEB 0>0.7 MAR 0>0.7 APR 0>0.7 MAY 0>0.7
*SA)">3M DUJ-IAD OCT 0>0.7 DEC 0>0.7 JAN 0>0.7 FEB 0>0.7 MAR 0>0.7 APR 0>0.7 MAY 0>0.7
*SA)">3M DUJ-JST OCT 0>1.8 NOV 0>1.8 DEC 0>1.9 JAN 0>1.8 FEB 0>1.9 MAR 0>1.9 APR 0>1.9 MAY 0>1.8
*SA)">3M IAD-JST OCT 0>1.7 NOV 0>1.7 DEC 0>1.7 JAN 0>1.7 FEB 0>1.7 MAR 0>1.7 APR 0>1.7 MAY 0>1.7
*SA)">3M IAD-LWB OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.8 DEC 0>2 JAN 0>2 FEB 0>2 MAR 0>2 APR 0>2 MAY 0>2
*SA)">3M IAD-MGW OCT 0>1.6 NOV 0>1.5 DEC 0>1.6 JAN 0>1.5 FEB 0>1.6 MAR 0>1.6 APR 0>1.6 MAY 0>1.5
*SA)">3M IAD-PKB OCT 0>1.9 NOV 0>1.8 DEC 0>1.9 JAN 0>1.8 FEB 0>1.9 MAR 0>1.9 APR 0>1.9 MAY 0>1.8
*SA)">3M IAD-SHD OCT 0>3 NOV 0>1.9 DEC 0>1.9 JAN 0>1.8 FEB 0>1.9 MAR 0>1.9 APR 0>1.9 MAY 0>1.8
*SA)">3M LWB-SHD DEC 0>0.7 JAN 0>0.7 FEB 0>0.7 MAR 0>0.7 APR 0>0.7 MAY 0>0.7

7H ANC-CDV NOV 1.4>1.0 DEC 1.5>1.0 JAN 1.5>1.0 FEB 1.6>1.0 MAR 1.6>1.0 APR 1.6>1.0 MAY 1.5>1.0
7H ANC-HOM OCT 6>5 NOV 6>5 DEC 6>5 JAN 6>5 FEB 6>5 MAR 6>5 APR 6>5

8D ADQ-ANC OCT 0>1.7 NOV 0>1.7 DEC 0>1.7 JAN 0>1.7 FEB 0>1.7 MAR 0>1.7 APR 0>1.7 MAY 0>1.7

SA)">AA DAY-LGA DEC 3>1.7 JAN 3>1.7 FEB 3>1.7 MAR 3>1.7 APR 3>1.7 MAY 3>1.7
SA)">AA LAX-HNL JAN 5>4
SA)">AA LAX-OGG MAR 2>3 APR 2>3
I'm assuming these are equipment swaps...
SA)">AA LAX-PIT NOV 0.9>0.1 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0
SA)">AA LAX-RDU NOV 1.0>0.1 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0
SA)">AA LGA-ORF DEC 3>1.9 JAN 3>1.8 FEB 3>1.9 MAR 3>1.9 APR 3>1.9 MAY 3>1.8
SA)">AA LGA-RIC NOV 1.5>0 DEC 4>0 JAN 4>0 FEB 4>0 MAR 4>0 APR 4>0 MAY 4>0
SA)">AA LGA-ROA NOV 0.7>0 DEC 0.9>0 JAN 0.8>0 FEB 0.9>0 MAR 0.9>0 APR 0.9>0 MAY 0.8>0

AC BOS-YUL DEC 5>6 JAN 5>6 FEB 5>6
AC LGA-YYZ NOV 13>12 DEC 13>12 JAN 13>12 FEB 13>12 MAR 13>12
AC ORD-YYZ DEC 6>7 JAN 6>7 FEB 6>7
AC PHX-YYZ JAN 3>2
AC TPA-YHZ DEC 0.2>0.1
AC TPA-YYZ MAR 3>4

BA EWR-ORY OCT 1.6>1.5 JAN 1.7>1.1 FEB 1.7>0.8 MAR 1.7>1.3
BA JFK-ORY DEC 0.9>0.8 JAN 1.0>0.8 FEB 1.0>0.9

*CZ SFO-WUH DEC 0>0.2 JAN 0>0.4 FEB 0>0.4 MAR 0>0.4

SA)">DL ATL-OAK DEC 0.2>0.1
SA)">DL ATL-PUJ FEB 4>3 MAY 3>2
SA)">DL CVG-JAX DEC 0.3>0.1
SA)">DL CVG-LAS DEC 0.8>0.5
SA)">DL CVG-SAN DEC 0.4>0.2
SA)">DL DTW-HSV FEB 1.3>0.9 MAR 1.7>0.9 APR 1.7>0.9 MAY 1.7>0.8
SA)">DL JFK-NAS FEB 1.1>1.0 MAR 1.1>1.0 APR 1.1>1.0 MAY 1.2>1.0
**SA)">DL LAX-SAT APR 0>1.6 MAY 0>2
SA)">DL MEM-CUN MAY 0>0.2
SA)">DL MSP-MBJ FEB 0.3>0.4 MAR 0.3>0.4
SA)">DL MSP-SJU FEB 0.1>0.3 MAR 0.1>0.3
SA)">DL PDX-SEA NOV 4>5
SA)">DL SLC-SAT MAY 3>1.8

*DY FLL-ARN APR 0>0.1 MAY 0>0.2

*EQ JFK-GYE OCT 1.0>0.6 NOV 1.0>0 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0
*EQ JFK-UIO OCT 0>0.4 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0 JAN 0>1.0 FEB 0>1.0 MAR 0>1.0 APR 0>1.0 MAY 0>1.0

FI IAD-KEF MAY 1.1>0.9

*G3 MCO-PUJ DEC 0>0.1 JAN 0>0.1 FEB 0>0.1

JJ MCO-GRU DEC 1.8>3 JAN 2>4

LA MIA-PUJ FEB 0.3>0.4

QR MIA-DOH DEC 0.5>0.7 JAN 0.6>0.7 FEB 0.6>0.7 MAR 0.6>0.7 APR 0.6>0.7 MAY 0.6>0.7

RJ JFK-AMM NOV 0.4>0.6 DEC 0.4>0.5 JAN 0.5>0.6
RJ ORD-AMM NOV 0.6>0.7 DEC 0.6>0.7 JAN 0.5>0.7

SA IAD-DKR FEB 1.0>0.9

SK EWR-ARN JAN 0.8>1.0 FEB 0.9>1.0

SV IAD-JED APR 0.6>0.4 MAY 0.6>0.5
SV IAD-RUH APR 0.4>0.6 MAY 0.4>0.5

*SA)">UA AOO-JST OCT 1.9>0 NOV 1.8>0 DEC 1.9>0 JAN 1.8>0 FEB 1.9>0 MAR 1.9>0 APR 1.9>0 MAY 1.8>0
*SA)">UA BFD-JHW NOV 1.8>0 DEC 1.9>0 JAN 1.9>0 FEB 1.9>0 MAR 1.8>0 APR 1.9>0 MAY 1.8>0
*SA)">UA BKW-SHD OCT 0.9>0 NOV 0.8>0 DEC 0.9>0 JAN 0.9>0 FEB 0.9>0 MAR 0.8>0 APR 0.9>0 MAY 0.8>0
*SA)">UA CKB-MGW OCT 1.9>0 NOV 1.8>0 DEC 1.9>0 JAN 1.9>0 FEB 1.9>0 MAR 1.8>0 APR 1.9>0 MAY 1.8>0
*SA)">UA CLE-BFD DEC 0.7>0 JAN 0.7>0 FEB 0.7>0 MAR 0.7>0 APR 0.7>0 MAY 0.7>0
*SA)">UA CLE-DUJ OCT 1.7>0.0 NOV 1.7>0 DEC 1.7>0 JAN 1.7>0 FEB 1.7>0 MAR 1.7>0 APR 1.7>0 MAY 1.7>0
*SA)">UA CLE-FKL NOV 1.7>0 DEC 1.7>0 JAN 1.7>0 FEB 1.7>0 MAR 1.7>0 APR 1.7>0 MAY 1.7>0
*SA)">UA CLE-JHW OCT 1.7>0.9 NOV 1.7>0 DEC 1.7>0 JAN 1.7>0 FEB 1.7>0 MAR 1.7>0 APR 1.7>0 MAY 1.7>0
*SA)">UA CLE-PKB OCT 4>0 NOV 4>0 DEC 4>0 JAN 4>0 FEB 4>0 MAR 4>0 APR 4>0 MAY 4>0
SA)">UA DEN-CUN JAN 0.8>1.4 FEB 0.6>0.9
*SA)">UA DUJ-FKL OCT 1.7>1.0 NOV 1.7>0 DEC 1.7>0 JAN 1.7>0 FEB 1.7>0 MAR 1.7>0 APR 1.7>0 MAY 1.7>0
SA)">UA EWR-AVP DEC 3>1.5
SA)">UA EWR-PUJ FEB 1.4>2.0 MAR 1.5>3 APR 1.4>1.7
SA)">UA EWR-PVR JAN 0.5>0.7 FEB 0.3>0.8 MAR 0.3>0.8 APR 0.3>0.4
SA)">UA EWR-SDQ JAN 1.2>1.4
SA)">UA EWR-SJD FEB 0.6>1.0 MAR 0.6>1.2 APR 0.6>0.7
SA)">UA EWR-SJU JAN 1.4>3 FEB 1.0>1.3
SA)">UA IAD-AOO OCT 0.7>1.7 NOV 0.7>1.7 DEC 0.7>1.7 JAN 0.7>1.7 FEB 0.7>1.7 MAR 0.7>1.7 APR 0.7>1.7 MAY 0.7>1.7
SA)">UA IAD-BKW OCT 0.9>1.7 NOV 0.8>1.7 DEC 0.9>1.7 JAN 0.8>1.7 FEB 0.9>1.7 MAR 0.9>1.7 APR 0.9>1.7 MAY 0.8>1.7
SA)">UA IAD-BNA APR 1.9>3 MAY 1.8>3
*SA)">UA IAD-CKB OCT 0.7>0 DEC 0.7>0 JAN 0.7>0 FEB 0.7>0 MAR 0.7>0 APR 0.7>0 MAY 0.7>0
SA)">UA IAD-CUN JAN 0.7>1.4 FEB 0.6>0.8
*SA)">UA IAD-JST OCT 0.9>0 NOV 0.8>0 DEC 0.9>0 JAN 0.9>0 FEB 0.9>0 MAR 0.8>0 APR 0.9>0 MAY 0.8>0
*SA)">UA IAD-LWB OCT 1.0>0 NOV 1.0>0 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0
*SA)">UA IAD-MGW OCT 1.6>0 NOV 1.5>0 DEC 1.6>0 JAN 1.5>0 FEB 1.6>0 MAR 1.6>0 APR 1.6>0 MAY 1.5>0
*SA)">UA IAD-SHD OCT 1.7>0 NOV 1.7>0 DEC 1.7>0 JAN 1.7>0 FEB 1.7>0 MAR 1.7>0 APR 1.7>0 MAY 1.7>0
SA)">UA IAH-GCM MAR 0.5>1.3 APR 0.6>0.7
SA)">UA IAH-PVR JAN 1.9>3 FEB 1.9>3
SA)">UA IAH-SAP JAN 1.1>1.3
SA)">UA IAH-ZIH FEB 0.9>1.0 MAR 0.7>1.0
SA)">UA LAX-CUN JAN 0.9>1.2
SA)">UA ORD-AVP JAN 1.9>1.2
SA)">UA ORD-CLE JAN 12>10 FEB 13>12
SA)">UA ORD-CUN JAN 1.3>1.8 FEB 1.0>1.2
SA)">UA ORD-FWA JAN 4>3 FEB 4>3 MAR 4>3
SA)">UA ORD-LIR MAR 0.1>0.5
SA)">UA ORD-MCO JAN 5>7 FEB 5>6
SA)">UA ORD-SRQ JAN 1.2>2 FEB 1.0>2 MAR 1.3>3
SA)">UA ORD-YEG JAN 1.8>1.2
SA)">UA ORD-YVR FEB 3>2 MAR 4>3
SA)">UA ORD-YWG JAN 5>4
SA)">UA ORD-YYZ JAN 6>5
SA)">UA SFO-CUN JAN 0.7>1.0
SA)">UA SFO-ORD MAR 15>14
SA)">UA SFO-PVR JAN 0.6>0.8

More swaps...Very hard to tell what is going on...
US EWR-MIA NOV 2>0.3 DEC 2>0 JAN 2>0 FEB 2>0 MAR 2>0 APR 2>0 MAY 2>0
US LAX-YEG NOV 1.0>0.2 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0
US LAX-YVR NOV 2>0.3 DEC 2>0 JAN 2>0 FEB 2>0 MAR 2>0 APR 2>0 MAY 2>0
US LGA-MIA NOV 1.0>0.2 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0
US MIA-TPA DEC 3>2 JAN 3>2 FEB 3>2 MAR 3>2 APR 3>2 MAY 3>2
US PHX-TUS NOV 10>9

VS EWR-LHR NOV 2>1.9 FEB 2>1.9
VS IAD-LHR NOV 1.0>0.8
VS SFO-LHR FEB 1.0>0.9
 
User avatar
enilria
Topic Author
Posts: 10372
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 1:21 pm

MODS: Something is screwed up with the HTML stylesheet today. A bunch of HTML garbage is injected into my post. It does not have any formatting differences from the many prior version.
 
User avatar
OzarkD9S
Posts: 5760
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2001 2:31 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 1:41 pm

As always, thanks for your hard work on these threads.

And yes, the AA/US stuff is a mess.
"My soul is in the sky". -Pyramus- A Midsummer's Night Dream
 
jetblue1965
Posts: 5050
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:28 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 1:59 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
Why was the SA)">UA code dropped off these? I'm guessing not a mistake because it happens in sync with SA)">UA and that was two separate filings as each carrier must file their own schedule.

it is fully in-line with what UA/3M did at FLL too. So with this change, I think 3M's operations will 100% be under their own branding.

Maybe not branding them at UAX allows them to interline and code-share with more carriers. (Or a very shrewd way for UA to exclude 3M's operational performance from UAX metrics without losing the feed ?)
 
User avatar
yellowtail
Posts: 3938
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 3:46 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:08 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
QR MIA-DOH DEC 0.5>0.7 JAN 0.6>0.7 FEB 0.6>0.7 MAR 0.6>0.7 APR 0.6>0.7 MAY 0.6>0.7

Well I guess we have our answer to all our "how is QR doing at MIA" threads
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
jetblue1965
Posts: 5050
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:28 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:23 pm

Quoting Yellowtail (Reply 4):

Well I guess we have our answer to all our "how is QR doing at MIA" threads

Here's the standard template for the exact same thread every week :

How is [EK/EY/QR] doing at [MIA/DFW/ORD/PHL/LAX] ?
 
jetskipper
Posts: 534
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2001 1:50 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:24 pm

With both JFK and ORD having huge OW presence through AA, I'm surprised Royal Jordanian is offer more weekly services to ORD. One would think the O/D would always be higher out of JFK.
 
User avatar
enilria
Topic Author
Posts: 10372
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:38 pm

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 3):
Maybe not branding them at UAX allows them to interline and code-share with more carriers. (Or a very shrewd way for UA to exclude 3M's operational performance from UAX metrics without losing the feed ?)

Yeah, DL dropped the props because of product concerns. I guess it is the same here. I think it kills those IAD markets.

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 5):
Here's the standard template for the exact same thread every week :

How is [EK/EY/QR] doing at [MIA/DFW/ORD/PHL/LAX] ?

They can't be doing well at PHL. The others have a shot of some sort.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 8771
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:41 pm

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 3):
Maybe not branding them at UAX allows them to interline and code-share with more carriers. (Or a very shrewd way for UA to exclude 3M's operational performance from UAX metrics without losing the feed ?)

What UAX metrics would that be? Operational performance - on-time, repeated tardiness, VDB, IDB, baggage failure - that's all DOT-reported by operating carrier, right?
 
UALFAson
Posts: 1100
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2004 2:41 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:45 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
UA IAD-BNA APR 1.9>3 MAY 1.8>3

Reverses the change made last week.

Although I noticed they cut the early morning flight two weeks ago when I tried to standby for it and had to connect through ORD instead.
"We hope you've enjoyed flying with us as much as we've enjoyed taking you for a ride."
 
Cubsrule
Posts: 14723
Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 12:13 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:48 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 7):
DL dropped the props because of product concerns. I guess it is the same here. I think it kills those IAD markets.

Do you mean props in general or 3M props in particular? I've seen no indication that UA is unhappy with C5, for instance.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
jetblue1965
Posts: 5050
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:28 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:03 pm

Quoting MIflyer12 (Reply 8):

What UAX metrics would that be? Operational performance - on-time, repeated tardiness, VDB, IDB, baggage failure - that's all DOT-reported by operating carrier, right?

Doesn't have to be external metrics.
 
miaami
Posts: 943
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 2:27 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:45 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
I'm assuming these are equipment swaps...
SA)">AA LAX-PIT NOV 0.9>0.1 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0
SA)">AA LAX-RDU NOV 1.0>0.1 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0
SA)">AA LGA-ORF DEC 3>1.9 JAN 3>1.8 FEB 3>1.9 MAR 3>1.9 APR 3>1.9 MAY 3>1.8
SA)">AA LGA-RIC NOV 1.5>0 DEC 4>0 JAN 4>0 FEB 4>0 MAR 4>0 APR 4>0 MAY 4>0
SA)">AA LGA-ROA NOV 0.7>0 DEC 0.9>0 JAN 0.8>0 FEB 0.9>0 MAR 0.9>0 APR 0.9>0 MAY 0.8>0

You are correct, these routes are having metal swaps starting in November

LAX-PIT/RDU will now operate on US metal A319
LGA-ORF will now operate with mix of AE and US Express
LGA-RIC/ROA will now be operated by US Express

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
US EWR-MIA NOV 2>0.3 DEC 2>0 JAN 2>0 FEB 2>0 MAR 2>0 APR 2>0 MAY 2>0
US LAX-YEG NOV 1.0>0.2 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0
US LAX-YVR NOV 2>0.3 DEC 2>0 JAN 2>0 FEB 2>0 MAR 2>0 APR 2>0 MAY 2>0
US LGA-MIA NOV 1.0>0.2 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0
US MIA-TPA DEC 3>2 JAN 3>2 FEB 3>2 MAR 3>2 APR 3>2 MAY 3>2
US PHX-TUS NOV 10>9

It seems that AE (Envoy) is back to the routes they were operating out of LAX and also on one of the flights from PHX-TUS. AA Metal will take over the freq loss on MIA-EWR/LGA/TPA

Also, on a side note. Starting in November, Miami will start to see more AA metal A319/A321 flying on both domestic and international routes.
 
krsw757
Posts: 104
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:22 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:55 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 1):
JJ MCO-GRU DEC 1.8>3 JAN 2>4

Am I reading this correctly? 4 times daily to MCO?!?!
 
User avatar
enilria
Topic Author
Posts: 10372
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 4:19 pm

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 10):
Do you mean props in general or 3M props in particular? I've seen no indication that UA is unhappy with C5, for instance.

I'm speculating that UA is trying to make their code "all-jet" like DL has done (although technically OO hasn't completely complied despite Anderson announcing they had a year ago). Following DL is a very UA thing to do. DL only has interline agreements with Zk and such.

Quoting krsw757 (Reply 13):
Am I reading this correctly? 4 times daily to MCO?!?!

That's what it says. Could be duplicates...
 
Cubsrule
Posts: 14723
Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 12:13 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 4:23 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 14):
I'm speculating that UA is trying to make their code "all-jet" like DL has done (although technically OO hasn't completely complied despite Anderson announcing they had a year ago).

UA still has gobs of Dashes, though. That's why I'm confused.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
User avatar
enilria
Topic Author
Posts: 10372
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 7:19 pm

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 15):
UA still has gobs of Dashes, though. That's why I'm confused.

Baby steps
 
AA77W
Posts: 43
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 7:15 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 7:22 pm

Quoting miaami (Reply 12):

I looked on the AA & US websites last week when I saw on the RDU Wikipedia page that US is starting RDU-LAX and there was a date (that I don't remember) that listed an A321 for the route. Could it have been an error?
 
AABB777
Posts: 575
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 12:05 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 7:34 pm

Quoting Yellowtail (Reply 4):

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
QR MIA-DOH DEC 0.5>0.7 JAN 0.6>0.7 FEB 0.6>0.7 MAR 0.6>0.7 APR 0.6>0.7 MAY 0.6>0.7

Well I guess we have our answer to all our "how is QR doing at MIA" threads

Yes, goes 5x weekly in December.
 
cessna2
Posts: 400
Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2006 6:16 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 7:42 pm

Quoting AA77W (Reply 17):
I looked on the AA & US websites last week when I saw on the RDU Wikipedia page that US is starting RDU-LAX and there was a date (that I don't remember) that listed an A321 for the route. Could it have been an error?

I'm going to say most likely. I also checked and saw it operated by an A319 however a one way F class ticket was close to $10,000 dollars! 20k roundtrip! Must of been an error!
 
User avatar
kgaiflyer
Posts: 2741
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:22 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 9:01 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
Why was the SA)">UA code dropped off these [3M flights]? I'm guessing not a mistake because it happens in sync with SA)">UA and that was two separate filings as each carrier must file their own schedule.

In Tampa, Fort Lauderdale, Orlando, and Jacksonville -- Silver Airways flies from its own gates. Some passengers have SA)">3M boarding passes and some have United boarding passes. There are Silver Airways ticket counters, and you are clearly flying on Silver Airways planes at the behest of a Silver Airways crew.

I can only assume that -- as in Florida -- SA)">3M will now have its own crew base at Dulles, and flight check-in for SA)">UA codeshare flights flown by SA)">3M will be on the SA)">3M web site -- also as in Florida.
 
PIEAvantiP180
Posts: 520
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 6:04 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 9:37 pm

DL LAX-SAT APR 0>1.6 MAY 0>2

I'm surprised that nobody has made any comments regarding DL starting LAX to SAT. Was this already announced? If not another Texas market added from Los Angeles, only city missing now is Houston out of the big TX markets.
 
steeler83
Posts: 7700
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 2:06 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 9:51 pm

Quoting miaami (Reply 12):
You are correct, these routes are having metal swaps starting in November

LAX-PIT/RDU will now operate on US metal A319
LGA-ORF will now operate with mix of AE and US Express
LGA-RIC/ROA will now be operated by US Express

It is good to see AA/US stay committed to LAX-PIT. I hope this will suit them better.

What equipment are they using on the other city pairs. I'm assuming these are all down-gauges...
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
 
User avatar
compensateme
Posts: 3279
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 4:17 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 10:28 pm

Quoting AA77W (Reply 17):
I looked on the AA & US websites last week when I saw on the RDU Wikipedia page that US is starting RDU-LAX and there was a date (that I don't remember) that listed an A321 for the route. Could it have been an error?

Not an error, just misinformation. Most likely an RDU fanboy saw that US was "taking over" RDU/LAX and assumed it was to upgauge the route to a 321. As with any Wikipedia entry, always exercise caution when reading about airports... plenty of dated information (especially hubs) and some really defensive fanboys. At one airport I edited out a "seasonal" route that operated only two years, the last time being five years ago, and my edits were reversed with the fanboy requesting a reliable source...
We don’t care what your next flight is.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 5056
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Mon Sep 08, 2014 11:24 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
8D ADQ-ANC OCT 0>1.7 NOV 0>1.7 DEC 0>1.7 JAN 0>1.7 FEB 0>1.7 MAR 0>1.7 APR 0>1.7 MAY 0>1.7

What is this about? A 3rd player on this route? Good luck.
 
deltal1011man
Posts: 5377
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 9:17 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 12:48 am

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 21):

No, It hasn't been announced yet.

Now the biggest missing gaps are (JMO) DEN,IAH/HOU, IAD and ORD.
 
twa727
Posts: 33
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 7:15 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 1:00 am

Quoting steeler83 (Reply 22):

You are correct, these routes are having metal swaps starting in November

LGA-ORF will now operate with mix of AE and US Express
LGA-RIC/ROA will now be operated by US Express

What equipment are they using on the other city pairs. I'm assuming these are all down-gauges...

Looks like it's a move from an ERJ-140 to a CRJ-200 (operated by ZW), so equivalent capacity.

That's a relief to me. When I saw it was switching to US Express, I expected they might be going back to the Dash 8 too, and ROA-LGA is a long, loud flight in a turboprop.
 
Cubsrule
Posts: 14723
Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 12:13 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 12:36 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 16):
Baby steps

I certainly understand that YX has had a host of problems with staffing and reliability on the DH4, but I don't see how getting rid of the 3M codeshare demonstrates anything about UA's desire (or not) to get rid of the YX and C5 prop operations. Much like AA, DL did not historically operate modern props; they had nasty old ATRs that no rational passenger misses.

[Edited 2014-09-09 05:37:01]
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
commavia
Posts: 11489
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:30 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 12:53 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
AA LAX-PIT NOV 0.9>0.1 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0
Quoting miaami (Reply 12):
LAX-PIT/RDU will now operate on US metal A319
Quoting steeler83 (Reply 22):
It is good to see AA/US stay committed to LAX-PIT. I hope this will suit them better.

It also appears that with the shift to a US 319, the schedule changes to something better - still suboptimal in my opinion, but at least better than the awful schedule they have now:

AA726 LAX 1130 PIT 1859
AA727 PIT 0800 LAX 1030

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 21):
DL LAX-SAT APR 0>1.6 MAY 0>2

Another LAX "add" from Delta, on top of AA also starting this route in a few weeks. Will be interesting to see the response from United, which has been the sole legacy in this market for years (since AA exited the route the last time).
 
lpdal
Posts: 1966
Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2012 9:49 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 1:00 pm

3M is a completely independent company that used to be a COX carrier, then a UAX carrier, and finally Silver Airways after emerging from bankruptcy. Nearly all of the former XJ Saabs have gone to them to replace the old B1900s.

You cannot check in or get a UA boarding pass unless your routing involves connecting with 3M. For example, if I book FLL-MCO-EWR-TPA-FLL, you can check in with UA and receive a UA code share boarding pass. If your routing is all 3M, let's say FLL-TPA-PNS-MCO-FLL, you cannot check in at the United desks. The kiosk or agent will give you this error message:

https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3898/14912484929_af833529bf_c.jpg
Silver Airways Saab 340B+, United Club FLL-MCO-FLL (by LPDAL Aug 31 2014 in Trip Reports)

-LPDAL
TWU represented. All of my views and posted content are mine alone, and should not be viewed as official communication from my employer, its subsidiaries thereof, or any other entities or airlines.
 
lpdal
Posts: 1966
Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2012 9:49 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 3:29 pm

I forgot to mention, UA doesn't own 3M (Victory Park Capital does) nor does 3M operate as a UAX carrier (except for the rapidly dropping number of B1900s in CLE) and therefore cannot "drop" any of its routes. The only thing UA can do with 3M is drop codesharing/interline if it so chooses so UA customers cannot book 3M tickets through UA and vice versa. 3M wants to be its own airline, and once a replacement carrier is found for the CLE B1900D routes, the aircraft will be sold and no 3M aircraft will be in the UAX livery.

For all intents and purposes, Silver Airways is a completely independent airline already.

-LPDAL
TWU represented. All of my views and posted content are mine alone, and should not be viewed as official communication from my employer, its subsidiaries thereof, or any other entities or airlines.
 
masseybrown
Posts: 5569
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 4:51 pm

Quoting LPDAL (Reply 30):
and once a replacement carrier is found for the CLE B1900D routes,

Replacements have been found. The CLE flights end September 30. PKB, DUJ, and AOO will get 3M service to IAD. The others may get some 9-pax flights to PIT.
 
lpdal
Posts: 1966
Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2012 9:49 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 7:43 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 31):

Good, that just proves my point further: Silver Airways is a completely independent regional airline with no affiliation to UA except the interlining and MileagePlus agreement. Thus UA has no control over what routes they do and don't serve, so to refer to them as a "UAX Carrier, UAX Flights" and saying that UA can drop 3M routes are all completely inaccurate.

Silver Airways flights are not operated by UA, they are operated by Silver Airways. Thus to say they are "UA Flights" is incorrect. As you said, 3M is dropping the final UAX flights in 21 days. Beyond September they will never fly under any UA banner, and the only affiliation will be the interlining (of which they already do also with DL and B6) and the fact that you can earn MPMs on their flights. Nothing more, nothing less.

-LPDAL

[Edited 2014-09-09 12:52:09]

[Edited 2014-09-09 12:53:41]
TWU represented. All of my views and posted content are mine alone, and should not be viewed as official communication from my employer, its subsidiaries thereof, or any other entities or airlines.
 
AA77W
Posts: 43
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 7:15 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:20 pm

Quoting CompensateMe (Reply 23):

Yea....No.
The merits of Wikipedia isn't a debate that I'm going to engage in. RDU's Wikipedia page doesn't list equipment for a carrier's route - only cities served non-stop listed by airline. Furthermore, my "sources" for questioning the equipment come from the US Airways, AA, and ITA iPhone apps. To my point about potential errors by the Airline, pick any of the there aforementioned apps or go to any of the websites, enter LAX-RDU on Nov. 29 and it lists US 789 as an A-321.
 
User avatar
compensateme
Posts: 3279
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 4:17 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:28 pm

Quoting AA77W (Reply 33):
The merits of Wikipedia isn't a debate that I'm going to engage in. RDU's Wikipedia page doesn't list equipment for a carrier's route - only cities served non-stop listed by airline. Furthermore, my "sources" for questioning the equipment come from the US Airways, AA, and ITA iPhone apps. To my point about potential errors by the Airline, pick any of the there aforementioned apps or go to any of the websites, enter LAX-RDU on Nov. 29 and it lists US 789 as an A-321.

I misinterpreted your original comment -- if you go back and read the exchange, you can realize my error.  

That said, you do realize the date in question is part of the Thanksgiving Holiday block, in which AA-US are offering plenty of equipment upgaguges and additional frequency to handle holiday traffic? For example, on Nov. 30, there's a second LAX-RDU flight, also with a 321.
We don’t care what your next flight is.
 
User avatar
RyanairGuru
Posts: 8508
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:59 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:30 pm

Quoting LPDAL (Reply 30):
nor does 3M operate as a UAX carrier

You've clearly completely missed the point of this conversation. What people have been discussing would have been very clear if you had read the data provided by the OP.

IAD *IS* a UAX station for 3M. While it has not been announced, it is looking like 3M are going to stop being a UAX carrier at IAD and instead (presumably) have the more arms-length relationship like they have in Florida going forward.

Quoting AA77W (Reply 33):
To my point about potential errors by the Airline, pick any of the there aforementioned apps or go to any of the websites, enter LAX-RDU on Nov. 29 and it lists US 789 as an A-321.

You realise that's Thanksgiving weekend, don't you? You could well be both right, with the route normally a 319 but up-gauged on that day.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
PIEAvantiP180
Posts: 520
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 6:04 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:37 pm

Quoting Deltal1011man (Reply 25):

Yea I'm not sure how they are even managing these additions. I know they are out of gate space and desperately need more. Adding another 4 cities with a schedule anywhere from 2 to 4-5 daily rotations I think will be impossible. I just don't see them getting any more gates than what they already have.
 
steeler83
Posts: 7700
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 2:06 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:40 pm

Quoting commavia (Reply 28):
It also appears that with the shift to a US 319, the schedule changes to something better - still suboptimal in my opinion, but at least better than the awful schedule they have now:

AA726 LAX 1130 PIT 1859
AA727 PIT 0800 LAX 1030

Maybe with a better schedule, they'll likely have these A319s at or above 90% capacity?   
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
 
User avatar
enilria
Topic Author
Posts: 10372
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:48 pm

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 21):
DL LAX-SAT APR 0>1.6 MAY 0>2

I'm surprised that nobody has made any comments regarding DL starting LAX to SAT. Was this already announced? If not another Texas market added from Los Angeles, only city missing now is Houston out of the big TX markets.

I thought it was big. Is this directed at AA for any particular reason I wonder?

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 27):
I certainly understand that YX has had a host of problems with staffing and reliability on the DH4, but I don't see how getting rid of the 3M codeshare demonstrates anything about UA's desire (or not) to get rid of the YX and C5 prop operations. Much like AA, DL did not historically operate modern props; they had nasty old ATRs that no rational passenger misses.

Well, let me revisit my statement. I think UA is moving away from props, but more immediately I think they are moving away from small props in EAS markets.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 26413
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:50 pm

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 36):
Yea I'm not sure how they are even managing these additions. I know they are out of gate space and desperately need more. Adding another 4 cities with a schedule anywhere from 2 to 4-5 daily rotations I think will be impossible. I just don't see them getting any more gates than what they already have.

When does the DL agreement to share under-used AS gate space come to an end?

AA has reportedly begun talks to start using AS T6 gates at LAX as well; wonder how that does affect the DL deal, if at all.
a.
 
MesaFlyGuy
Posts: 3916
Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:36 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 10:44 pm

Quoting cessna2 (Reply 19):
I'm going to say most likely. I also checked and saw it operated by an A319 however a one way F class ticket was close to $10,000 dollars! 20k roundtrip! Must of been an error!
Quoting AA77W (Reply 33):
To my point about potential errors by the Airline, pick any of the there aforementioned apps or go to any of the websites, enter LAX-RDU on Nov. 29 and it lists US 789 as an A-321.

Indeed, there are a few days around Thanksgiving where there are two flights from PIT to LAX, one being an a321 and the other being the usual a319.
The views I express are my own and do not reflect the views and opinions of my company.
 
lpdal
Posts: 1966
Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2012 9:49 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 11:42 pm

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 35):

You've clearly completely missed the point of this conversation. What people have been discussing would have been very clear if you had read the data provided by the OP.


What you have been discussing is what you've been discussing. I was just correcting whoever said 3M is a UAX carrier, because it isn't. 3M hasn't been a UAX carrier since mid-2012 technically. I wouldn't know about 3M if it wasn't in the OP.

Quote:

IAD *IS* a UAX station for 3M. While it has not been announced, it is looking like 3M are going to stop being a UAX carrier at IAD and instead (presumably) have the more arms-length relationship like they have in Florida going forward.
3M is not a UAX carrier, and hasn't been a UAX carrier since the majority of the Beechcraft were exchanged for Saabs starting with the bankruptcy. Silver Airways Going Solo In Florida (by FlyDeltaJets May 30 2013 in Civil Aviation)

3M wants nothing to do with UA apart from the codeshares and interlining, and they've been cutting the cord little by little, first by beginning interlining with competitors DL and B6. The zapping of 3M's CLE routes on September 30th will cut all ties with United-branded flights and make Silver a fully independent airline.

By your logic, Lufthansa must be a UA station at IAD because they codeshare at that airport. And all the other *A carriers.

-LPDAL

[Edited 2014-09-09 16:44:12]

[Edited 2014-09-09 16:46:32]

[Edited 2014-09-09 16:48:04]
TWU represented. All of my views and posted content are mine alone, and should not be viewed as official communication from my employer, its subsidiaries thereof, or any other entities or airlines.
 
deltal1011man
Posts: 5377
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 9:17 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Tue Sep 09, 2014 11:52 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 39):
When does the DL agreement to share under-used AS gate space come to an end?

My understanding is DL has the ability to buy AS out at any time.
but for the lease terms I believe it was a 10 year agreement just like the 6 gates AS is leasing from LAWA.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 39):
wonder how that does affect the DL deal, if at all.

It doesn't. AA wouldn't be using the DL gates unless they signed a sublease with DL.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 39):
AA has reportedly begun talks to start using AS T6 gates at LAX as well;

If/When AS completely moves out of the DL space they will be operating at 8-9 flights per day per gate out of their 6 gates. AA can talk all the want but I see no possible way AS could give up any space to AA, unless AA needs a gate a 3am.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 26413
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Wed Sep 10, 2014 12:08 am

Quoting Deltal1011man (Reply 42):
AA can talk all the want but I see no possible way AS could give up any space to AA, unless AA needs a gate a 3am.

Who leases what gates? When does Delta's leases expire?

The terminal is very underutilized at night, when AS has one redeye to Guadalajara and a late night to Seattle, and AA has tons of flights leaving east.

Why hasn't Alaska been kicked out already given that Delta is already incredibly pressed for gate space?

Really excited to see Delta keep adding these markets - there is so much excess capacity in so many of these markets that it's just so cheap to fly to the likes of Nashville, Raleigh, Austin, etc. from Los Angeles, and nobody is giving in, not even when Delta is flying LAXBNA at 50% loads.

[Edited 2014-09-09 17:13:50]

[Edited 2014-09-09 17:14:32]
a.
 
lpdal
Posts: 1966
Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2012 9:49 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Wed Sep 10, 2014 12:22 am

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
US MIA-TPA DEC 3>2 JAN 3>2 FEB 3>2 MAR 3>2 APR 3>2 MAY 3>2

I'm actually taking this route next month in First Class but doing TPA-MIA.
Why was this route added to MIA? A319 reliever service for AA's 738 MIA-TPA-MIA turn?

-LPDAL
TWU represented. All of my views and posted content are mine alone, and should not be viewed as official communication from my employer, its subsidiaries thereof, or any other entities or airlines.
 
deltal1011man
Posts: 5377
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 9:17 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Wed Sep 10, 2014 12:29 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 43):
Who leases what gates?

AS leases 6 gates from LAWA and has preferential rights on two Delta gates (68A and 69A or 69B, can't remember which one) and then the rights to use the other Delta gate (68B) if Delta isn't

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 43):
When does Delta's leases expire?

Should be at the same time as T6. Its a direct lease with LAWA.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 43):
Why hasn't Alaska been kicked out already given that Delta is already incredibly pressed for gate space?

Because Delta isn't as space constricted as everyone on anet makes them out to be.

this is the same reason Delta didn't push hard for the 4 UA gates that AA is subleasing. When AA started talking to UA about it, Delta quickly walked away. Juice wasn't worth the squeeze.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 26413
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Wed Sep 10, 2014 12:34 am

Quoting Deltal1011man (Reply 45):
this is the same reason Delta didn't push hard for the 4 UA gates that AA is subleasing. When AA started talking to UA about it, Delta quickly walked away. Juice wasn't worth the squeeze.

Not sure where you got that false information. AA has first right to negotiate on any free gates on the west side through 2016. The only way Delta could get them is if AA had turned it down first. Delta would have absolutely killed to have those gates, but AA negotiated a very smart settlement agreement. In the same agreement, AA negotiated the right to turn over it's Eagle gates 1:1 for new mainline gates at the Midfield.

Delta is pretty much done adding at LAX absent removing frequencies elsewhere.

[Edited 2014-09-09 17:36:07]
a.
 
deltal1011man
Posts: 5377
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 9:17 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Wed Sep 10, 2014 12:50 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 46):
Not sure where you got that false information. AA has first right to negotiate on any free gates on the west side through 2016.

No. Again, AA has the first right to any open space returned to LAWA. The Terminal 6 gates are a sub-lease from United to American. Nothing in AA's lease agreement says it has first rights for any sub-lease space.

I have seen nothing that says UA gave the space back to LAWA, but is simply sub-leasing AA the 4 gates for 3-4 years till UA's lease hold in Terminal 6 ends. (in which case, UA will give up the space or re-lease the space and use it or sub-lease it.)

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 46):
Delta is pretty much done adding at LAX absent removing frequencies elsewhere.

I'll be more than happy to take that bet. You have said that already and yet here we are......
 
User avatar
RyanairGuru
Posts: 8508
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:59 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Wed Sep 10, 2014 1:43 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 46):
AA has first right to negotiate on any free gates on the west side through 2016. The only way Delta could get them is if AA had turned it down first. Delta would have absolutely killed to have those gates

From everything we've heard, I agree with Delta1011man here. As UA is the lease holder, they can do whatever they like with the gates, and had DL put in a higher bid they could have won the sub-lease. Had UA returned the gates to LAWA, then, sure, AA would have had right of first refusal.

Quoting Deltal1011man (Reply 47):
4 gates for 3-4 years till UA's lease hold in Terminal 6 ends. (in which case, UA will give up the space or re-lease the space and use it or sub-lease it.)

I assume that UA will still have the right to renew the lease in 2016 if they wanted those gates back?
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
deltal1011man
Posts: 5377
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 9:17 am

RE: OAG Changes 9/12/2014: AA/DL/UA Drops 3M At IAD?

Wed Sep 10, 2014 1:52 am

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 48):
I assume that UA will still have the right to renew the lease in 2016 if they wanted those gates back?

Yes and i wouldn't be shocked to see UA do so and then keep sub-leasing to the highest bidder.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos