crank
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:27 am

ORD has issued a ground stop until 1300z, aircraft are being turned around to their point of origin or diverting. Anyone know why?
 
jcwr56
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:35 am

Chicago Center evacuated due to small fire.

Impacts arrivals and depatures at both ORD and MDW.

[Edited 2014-09-26 04:38:35]

Update...WGN TV is reporting some minor injuries.


[Edited 2014-09-26 04:42:45]
 
Thenoflyzone
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:35 am

Fire at the Chicaco ARTCC i believe. (Control Center)

Thenoflyzone
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
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tjwgrr
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 12:13 pm

More than just ORD and MDW. Affecting all flights in, out, and through Chicago Center's airspace.

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2014/09/...s-due-to-fire-at-faa-radar-center/





Here's a DAY-MSP 9E flight clearly avoiding Chicago Center airspace:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/FLG4026


[Edited 2014-09-26 05:31:39]
Direct KNOBS, maintain 2700' until established on the localizer, cleared ILS runway 26 left approach.
 
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jfklganyc
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 12:22 pm

Wasn't there a fire at the same center within the last year that shut down the same airspace for an extended period of time?
 
YYZatcboy
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 12:34 pm

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 4):

Wasn't there a fire at the same center within the last year that shut down the same airspace for an extended period of time?

Last years fire was at the TRACON IIRC
DH1/3/4 MD11/88 L1011 A319/20/21/30/50/80 717 727 735/6/7/8/9 744 762/3 77E/W 788/789 E40/75/90 CRJ/700/705 CC150
J/S DH8D 736/7/8 763
 
N766UA
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 12:57 pm

This is going to affect flights all over the country, not just Chicago. The ripples will spread all over as contingencies are put in place. An ATC-Zero ARTCC is a big deal.
 
blueflyer
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:05 pm

Fire has been extinguished and a man with a self-inflicted wound (!) was found in the basement.
http://www.nbcchicago.com/traffic/tr...chicago-air-traffic-277194591.html
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DiscoverCSG
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:08 pm

Is this part of ATL's plot to retain the "busiest airport" title?
 
PHX787
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:17 pm

https://www.facebook.com/FlightAware/photos/a.116289281863.100239.6139406863/10152404029956864/?type=1&theater

Here's a post from Flightaware's Facebook page.
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aeromandan
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:19 pm

http://www.fly.faa.gov/ois/

Stop out til 1500z thru ZAU now with high POE
 
ozark1
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:21 pm

Quoting aeromandan (Reply 10):
Stop out til 1500z thru ZAU now with high POE

Can you translate that ?  
 
jcwr56
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:25 pm

NH012 just landed and it looks like certain internationals arrivals are being worked in.

Thank god for clear skies!

* and the excellent work of ATC across the country.

[Edited 2014-09-26 06:27:07]
 
blueflyer
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:26 pm

Ground stop for flights to/from Chicago Center until 1500 UTC with high probability of extension beyond 1500.
Corona is God’s punishment for the amoral, principles-free, holier-than-thou Evangelicals. The rest of us are just collateral damage
 
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aeromandan
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:30 pm

Haha sure! No traffic can take off bound for or through the Chicago Center airspace...



...until at least 11:00a EDT. The Probability of Extension (POE) is high.
 
N766UA
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:30 pm

Quoting ozark1 (Reply 11):
Can you translate that

Everybody's screwed  
 
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tjwgrr
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:32 pm

Quoting aeromandan (Reply 10):
Stop out til 1500z thru ZAU now with high POE

Wow, that's 10 a.m. local Chicago (11 a.m. eastern) What a growing mess.....
Direct KNOBS, maintain 2700' until established on the localizer, cleared ILS runway 26 left approach.
 
MDW22L31C
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:48 pm

Just looked at IND on flightware it looks like the 405 freeway in LA.
 
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lugie
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ORD and MDW Ground Stop Due to ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 2:21 pm

It seems like they're partially reopening at ORD - just saw some UA flights over Lake Michigan on FR24

http://www.flightradar24.com/data/flights/ua1645/#46cb173

But look at this track they've been holding east of STL before flying halfway across the country at FL070 (do this in Germany and you'll get sued by every single NIMBY on the flight path
  )
Q400 E175 E190 CRJ7 CRJ9 CRJX MD88 A319 A320 A321 A332 A333 A359 B733 B73G B738 B739 B748 B764 B772 B77W B788 B789
FRA STR HAM TXL MUC ZRH ACE BRU BLL DUB MAN ARN MAD OPO LIS FNC AMS PHL RDU LGA CLT EWR ORD ATL SFO MDW IAD YYZ SJO PTY
 
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LAXintl
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 2:30 pm

Lots of cancels.

Per Media -

Southwest - canceled nearly all flights at MDW and MKE till noon

United - cancel over 50% of ORD flights till 2pm.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
wilcal
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 2:34 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 19):

UA has cancelled two of the IAH-ORD but two of them are showing delays until just after 10am. Somehow I don't think those birds are getting off anytime soon.
 
29erUSA187
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 2:55 pm

Oof that's rough. My heart goes out to all travelers affected. I was in the same boat when that U2 fried LAX ATC. I do hope everyone in the ATC building is ok
 
ckfred
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 3:58 pm

I saw a biz jet in the westbound MDW departure pattern at around 10:30 CDT, but it has dawned on me that I haven't see the usual string on WN departures headed west. But with a wind from the east/southeast, the lack of ORD departures on 22L isn't unusual.
 
RDUDDJI
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:01 pm

Looks like they're shifting to EDCTs for the MDW/ORD airspace. Looks like all the other airports in ZAU will still have ground stops for a while. Flights from the SE have an average 452 minute delay...very ouch.

There must have been some significant damage. Perhaps their still offloading ZAU work to other centers.

[Edited 2014-09-26 09:01:20]
Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
 
Goldenshield
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:13 pm

They are shifting to Tower Enroute Control for ORD/MDW. It's not very nice, but at least it gets planes moving.
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roseflyer
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:21 pm

It appears to be arson and someone may have tried to commit suicide after setting the fire:

http://rt.com/usa/190920-ohare-airport-fire-cancel/

About 850 flights cancelled so far. This is going to have repercussions throughout the networks of UA, AA and WN. Fortunately with the mega airlines that we have today, there are options to reroute people who were just connecting through Chicago, but on a busy Friday filled with business travelers, I expect the airports to be jammed. I expect things to stay messy for the entire day. UA has cancelled a significant number of flights throughout the entire day.

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 24):
They are shifting to Tower Enroute Control for ORD/MDW. It's not very nice, but at least it gets planes moving.

What does that mean?

[Edited 2014-09-26 09:24:10]
If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
 
wilcal
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:22 pm

Does anybody think there will be any significant impact to air traffic tomorrow? Connecting through ORD to get to BOS tomorrow morning.
 
airstatdfw
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:27 pm

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 25):
Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 24):
They are shifting to Tower Enroute Control for ORD/MDW. It's not very nice, but at least it gets planes moving.

What does that mean?

The TRACONs will work the aircraft with in their airspace to the next TRACON. You have to fly at a low level to stay inside the TRACON airspace. if going west stay in Chicago TRACON airspace until you are in Rockford airspace and they could hand you off to ZMP center, or north to MKE to be handed off to ZMP center, etc.
 
RDUDDJI
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:35 pm

Quoting airstatdfw (Reply 27):

The TRACONs will work the aircraft with in their airspace to the next TRACON. You have to fly at a low level to stay inside the TRACON airspace. if going west stay in Chicago TRACON airspace until you are in Rockford airspace and they could hand you off to ZMP center, or north to MKE to be handed off to ZMP center, etc.

Yeah, if you look on flightradar24, you can see that all planes in ZAU seem to be below 14,000. That has to really complicate things (read: low volume of planes).

I'm a bit surprised that ZAU doesn't have a backup facility somewhere else. Our dispatch center had a backup plan (another temporary location) for disaster scenarios.

[Edited 2014-09-26 09:39:05]
Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
 
lweber557
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:36 pm

They are saying the fire was intentionally set by a contract employee who was found in the building with self-inflicted injuries. Its not being considered an act of terrorism though. If you ask me they should charge this scumbag as a terrorist. Can someone explain to me how attempting to burn down an ATC facility is not a terrorist act?
FAA Licensed Aircraft Dispatcher
 
roseflyer
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:38 pm

Quoting airstatdfw (Reply 27):

The TRACONs will work the aircraft with in their airspace to the next TRACON. You have to fly at a low level to stay inside the TRACON airspace. if going west stay in Chicago TRACON airspace until you are in Rockford airspace and they could hand you off to ZMP center, or north to MKE to be handed off to ZMP center, etc.

I see what you mean. For example looking at UA 218 that diverted to STL while flying HNL-ORD, they flew the STL-ORD section at 10,000ft. It appears that all the flights now getting in to ORD are entering the airspace around 10,000ft.

Flights are slowly getting in to Chicago, but they appear to be descending to 10,000ft or below while still in Cleveland, Minneapolis, Kansas City, or Indianapolis center airspace.
If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
 
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tjwgrr
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 5:39 pm

Quoting airstatdfw (Reply 27):
Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 25):
Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 24):
They are shifting to Tower Enroute Control for ORD/MDW. It's not very nice, but at least it gets planes moving.

What does that mean?

The TRACONs will work the aircraft with in their airspace to the next TRACON. You have to fly at a low level to stay inside the TRACON airspace. if going west stay in Chicago TRACON airspace until you are in Rockford airspace and they could hand you off to ZMP center, or north to MKE to be handed off to ZMP center, etc.

GRR-ORD flights do tower enroute fairly often when ZAU is jammed up with inbound delays. GRR-AZO-SBN TRACONs and then finally to Chicago TRACON.

-----------

Found this on Chicago TRACON's Facebook page:

"FAA FACILITY FIRE UPDATE: ATF source says a disgruntled contractor was upset because he was being transferred to Hawaii. He went down to the transmission lines in the basement, wrapped them in rags and soaked the rags in gasoline."

https://www.facebook.com/ChicagoTRACON
.
.
Direct KNOBS, maintain 2700' until established on the localizer, cleared ILS runway 26 left approach.
 
bmacleod
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 5:43 pm

Could this qualify as ORD's 9/11? No terrorist act but still it's September; 1,000+ flights cancelled....

[Edited 2014-09-26 10:44:55]
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus
 
phillyramp270
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 5:47 pm

Overtime! For me in PHL
Barack Obama is not a foreign born, brown skinned, anti-war socialist who gives away healthcare. You're thinking of Jesu
 
TPAJAY
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 6:14 pm

Poor guy was obviously sick if he was disgruntled to be going to Hawaii!!!! Oh the humanity!!

Quoting tjwgrr (Reply 31):
Found this on Chicago TRACON's Facebook page:

"FAA FACILITY FIRE UPDATE: ATF source says a disgruntled contractor was upset because he was being transferred to Hawaii. He went down to the transmission lines in the basement, wrapped them in rags and soaked the rags in gasoline."

https://www.facebook.com/ChicagoTRACON
 
Rdh3e
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 6:18 pm

Quoting lweber557 (Reply 29):
Can someone explain to me how attempting to burn down an ATC facility is not a terrorist act?

Because this is Arson, not terrorism.

ar·son
ˈärsən
noun
the criminal act of deliberately setting fire to property.

Terrorism:
Common definitions of terrorism refer only to those violent acts that are intended to create fear (terror); are perpetrated for a religious, political, or ideological goal; and deliberately target or disregard the safety of non-combatants (e.g., military personnel in peacetime or civilians).

[Edited 2014-09-26 11:19:15]
 
jcwr56
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 6:36 pm

Breakdown of actual flights over the last few hours.

Zulu
1300-1359
Arrivals 11
Departures 6

1400-1459
Arrivals 15
Departures 25

1500-1559
Arrivals 22
Departures 26

1600-1659
Arrivals 26
Departures 22

It will probably be like this over the weekend.
 
29erUSA187
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 6:38 pm

Can anybody find out if this is why my flight tonight, WN 1099 is delayed? (SAN-SFO). I
 
KELPkid
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 6:39 pm

Can Tower-to-Tower IFR be implemented in the Chicago area? One way to keep stuff moving (albeit at low altitude)  

[Edited 2014-09-26 11:44:12]
Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
 
NBGSkyGod
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 6:42 pm

Quoting 29erUSA187 (Reply 37):

More than likely as your plane may be stranded somewhere else in the network.
Pilots are idiots, who at any given moment will attempt to kill themselves or others.
 
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Tugger
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 6:43 pm

Quoting 29erUSA187 (Reply 37):
Can anybody find out if this is why my flight tonight, WN 1099 is delayed? (SAN-SFO).

Positioning all across WN's network is getting impacted by this. If it not directly delaying the flight it could be the connecting crew or two stops prior etc. Very tough to compensate for.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
Productivity isn’t about getting more things done, rather it’s about getting the right things done, while doing less. - M. Oshin
 
N766UA
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 6:48 pm

Quoting lweber557 (Reply 29):
Can someone explain to me how attempting to burn down an ATC facility is not a terrorist act?

There are separate and distinct legal definitions for arson and terrorism, and just like you can't charge someone who commits a B&E with attempted murder, you can't charge an arsonist with terrorism.
 
flyinryan99
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 6:52 pm

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 38):
Can Tower-to-Tower IFR be implemented in the Chicago area? One way to keep stuff moving (albeit at low altitude)

I wonder if a lot of business aircraft are flying VFR today to get to where they need to go...
 
lweber557
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 7:44 pm

Quoting RDH3E (Reply 35):
deliberately target or disregard the safety of non-combatants

They could easily charge him with both terrorism and arson as he put hundreds of peoples safety at risk.
FAA Licensed Aircraft Dispatcher
 
freakyrat
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 7:49 pm

Tower to Tower is being implemented between Rockford Approach, Chicago Approach and South Bend Approach.
 
kraz911
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 7:52 pm

Hello all,

I suspect that because this person was on a federal installation and caused such damage to this critical facility and the potential to hurt many people that were in the air at the time, that they will throw the book at him. I salute the ATC personnel and the flight crews that were airborne that have a hard job, made harder by this goof. Many disasters were prevented today...
 
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Tugger
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 7:58 pm

Quoting lweber557 (Reply 43):
They could easily charge him with both terrorism and arson as he put hundreds of peoples safety at risk.

If by "hundreds of peoples" you are referring to the people on board the flights in the air... No such thing happened. This is not Die Hard 2.

And if you are referring the people in the tower.... no, that alone does not constitute terrorism. It may have criminal penalties ("reckless disregard"..etc.) but not be regarded as terrorism.

People sure like throwing that word around nowadays.

Quoting kraz911 (Reply 45):
Many disasters were prevented today...

While I too salute the good work ATC and pilots all do everyday, no "disasters" were prevented today regarding the problem in Chicago today. The system works quite well and pilots know what to do and so does ATC. So good job to them on a very hard day in the office.


Tugg

[Edited 2014-09-26 13:24:06]
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
Productivity isn’t about getting more things done, rather it’s about getting the right things done, while doing less. - M. Oshin
 
ckfred
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 8:45 pm

I watched the press briefing at 2pm CT, and law enforcement, including Aurora Police and Fire, ATF, FBI, and other federal law enforcement are still investigating in the building. They said it would be some time, before the building would be turned over to the FAA to assess the damage.

In terms of criminal investigation, it's not a "who done it", but they need to go through all of the damaged portions of the basement to see what the suspect did, so that they can ensure that every appropriate charge is filed. In theory, the suspect could be charged with both state and federal crimes.

The ATF agent said that the U.S. Attorney's Office in Chicago was being kept up to date on the investigation, but there was no comment one way or the other as to whether the Kane County State's Attorney's Office was also involved in any way.

I get the feeling that it could be late in the day, before law enforcement is done with the crime scene. Besides the fire damage, I've heard media reports that there was also water damage from the efforts of Aurora F.D. to put out the fire. It could take a while for the FAA to assess damage to wiring and systems and get repairs/replacements done.

So, two issues arise. First, getting traffic in and out of airports within the airspace of Chicago Center. Second is rerouting traffic that normally flies through Chicago Center airspace rerouted.
 
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illinoisman
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 8:49 pm

My ORD-DTW flight was canceled and basically everything is booked solid or oversold. I was rebooked to Sunday which is unacceptable.

Quoting N766UA (Reply 6):
This is going to affect flights all over the country, not just Chicago.

A single tower out of service shouldn't cause this much disruption to air travel. This very much points out vulnerabilities. Probably 3 or 4 key towers across the country could take out the whole system.

Quoting blueflyer (Reply 7):
Fire has been extinguished and a man with a self-inflicted wound (!) was found in the basement.

Hopefully this selfish a-hole stays alive so the state can recoup a small fraction of their losses today. A total failure of a human being, can't even get suicide done correctly.
 
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AmricanShamrok
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RE: ORD And MDW Ground Stop Due To ATC Fire

Fri Sep 26, 2014 8:51 pm

Quoting jcwr56 (Reply 36):

Breakdown of actual flights over the last few hours.

Zulu
1300-1359
Arrivals 11
Departures 6

1400-1459
Arrivals 15
Departures 25

1500-1559
Arrivals 22
Departures 26

1600-1659
Arrivals 26
Departures 22

What is the normal number of movements per hour?

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