Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
Tolmachevo
Posts: 62
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2006 12:49 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 10:10 am

The combination of low cost long haul to a relatively expensive destination - it just doesn't add up for me. Orlando, New York - I think these are viable destinations from Europe (and work for other "leisure" carriers in Europe) and have unique selling points.

I also think it is less about the overall price of your vacation and more about the value for money. You can spend EUR 3500-4000 on a dream holiday to Hawaii - but imagine what that would get you in Bali, Malaysia, Thailand, Sri Lanka, Maldives, Seychelles - all places offering wonderful tropical scenery and are all safe (even Thailand - just to give an idea - Hawaii state has a population of 1.4 million - take a look at the crime numbers for this "safe" destination: http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/hicrime.htm )

What also doesn't really work (apart from France for obvious reasons) is flights from Europe to French overseas departments like Reunion - you simply get better value for your hard-earned money elsewhere. And while Norwegians are very wealthy, they are not crazy crazy spenders like (I imagine) people from the Arabian/Persian Gulf, rich Russians or Chinese. I think they are as interested in value for money and quality of service to the same extent as many other northern European citizens.

I think if it would be viable at all from Europe, then it would already be tried and done successfully from LHR / LGW or maybe Condor from FRA. Bigger population centers, with just as many wealthy people (if not substantially more) than Norway/Scandinavia.
 
flylonghaul
Posts: 154
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:31 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 10:25 am

I am based in Stockholm and currently the quickest option to fly ARN-HNL is around 24 hours. 2 stops and involves transferring at at least one of the "nightmare transfer airports LHR, LAX etc" on the way.
Even the 1 stop option via EWR takes over 24 hours due to flight timings.
OSL-HNL is much the same with the option of around 21 hour on the outbound, with the inbound taking 24 hours
I can fly to Australia quicker.
If DY enters the market this will cut the time by almost half for OSL and by around 8-9 hours from ARN
I would not currently travel to Hawaii due to travel time, but if the time will be cut by such a massive amount then I, and a lot of my family and friends (we were chatting about it this morning) here would be interested as well.
In the end it will all come down to whether or not DY can price the flights right to maintain yield, as I seriously doubt that the flights will be going out empty.
Flying for Pleasure
 
BestWestern
Posts: 8368
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2000 8:46 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 10:31 am

Quoting Max Q (Reply 45):

Norwegians don't brag to start with. Secondly, Hawaii is just one of many 'exotic' destinations, and is comparable to other locations. It's just not different enough or 'exotic, enough than Thailand, or exclusive enough to say Bora Bora to fill a direct wide body profitably.

Even AF and TN can't make CDG PPT pay with the perfect mix of connections, VFR, exclusive tourism and business traffic yet people think that HNL can work from Europe from a small city like Oslo just focusing on point to point low cost tourism.
Greetings from Hong Kong.... a subsidiary of China Inc.
 
JimJupiter
Posts: 347
Joined: Sat Sep 24, 2011 4:28 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 10:33 am

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 10):
And there's no shortage of convenient connections for Europeans who want to visit Hawaii. On such a long trip I expect many would want to include a stopover somewhere else in North America anway.

That's true. But connecting in the US is no fun and the flying public knows this by now.
One is born, one runs up bills, one dies.
 
ukoverlander
Posts: 408
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 10:57 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 10:37 am

Quoting HALFA (Reply 39):

If Europeans vacationed in Hawaii, this would be a "foreign" vacation for them and they would be using foreign currency.
I don't get your point.

You're quite correct. You completely missed my point. My comment was about why Americans like to visit Hawaii - not about why Europeans don't like to visit Hawaii. So your comment that the Dollar would be a foreign currency to Europeans is irrelevant to the point I was making.
 
SCQ83
Posts: 5868
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 10:58 am

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 52):
HNL can work from Europe from a small city like Oslo just focusing on point to point low cost tourism.

Norwegian works with connections on their long-haul flights from Scandinavia. OSL is pretty well situated from the rest of Europe. More convenient to change planes in OSL than in the continental US.

Quoting Tolmachevo (Reply 50):
The combination of low cost long haul to a relatively expensive destination - it just doesn't add up for me. Orlando, New York.

easyJet, Norwegian or Vueling fly to expensive holiday destinations in Europe (like Mykonos or Santorini). Sometimes being the only option available. If you are Russian, i.e. Vueling charges very high fares flying Russians to Spain in summer.

Europe-OSL-HNL VS Europe-LAX/SFO-HNL seems to be like a no brainer. First, flying via OSL saves about 1000 nm. But more importantly, flying via OSL you take one short-haul flight and one long-haul flight changing in a quiet environment like OSL.

Flying via California, you take a long-haul and a medium haul flight changing planes in an stressful place like a major US airport. And then it is not like you are flying Economy continental US - Hawaii you will usually get a brand new aircraft. I would rather a new 787 all the way from Europe.

Quoting Tolmachevo (Reply 50):
Orlando, New York - I think these are viable destinations from Europe (and work for other "leisure" carriers in Europe) and have unique selling points.

Hawaii is not only beach from an European perspective. It is volcanos, surf, nature (hiking/trails), Polynesian culture (whatever remains), even shopping (part of the US much cheaper in technology or clothes). You don't have that in Thailand (obviously you have other stuff). They are not comparable. Other than hard-core AI beach resorts like Punta Cana, when people fly to Bali, Sydney or Rio de Janeiro from the other side of the world, beach and sun is only one expression in the equation.
 
User avatar
VCEflyboy
Posts: 1237
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:23 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 11:26 am

I think most people here seem to equate the average Norwegian and the average Norwegian Air customers, while in fact those are very different. Regardless of the airline and origin, Hawaii for Europeans could only work as a niche high-end destination, just like Bora Bora or the Maldives, and even then it would require some marketing efforts and time to mature. On the other end, Thailand ex Europe is an established destinations for young people, students and backpackers. Hawaii simply cannot compete with Thailand on the cost. It is simply not possible, and Norwegian knows it well having hired Thai crew for their flights. There must be something beyond this. For instance, do these "talks" with HTA involve subsidies? Would there be decent cargo profits to be made? Norwegian is a young and fast-growing airline, so they have the luxury to try and see what sticks which major airlines are not often able to do.
 
SCQ83
Posts: 5868
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 11:34 am

I am really curious to know how those average Norwegians and average Norwegian Air customers are in fact very different.  
 
User avatar
Pohakuloa
Posts: 219
Joined: Fri Jun 09, 2006 4:28 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 11:42 am

I think that if ever there were a chance for routes like this to work it would be in the current time. Routes like these never worked before whether for a lack of interest or a lack of a suitable aircraft to even make the journey without half the seats empty. The 787 and the 350 are the type of planes that could be/are game changers. I'm not sure how densely packed the seating could be to make the journey consistently so likely if it were going to happen perhaps a differently configuration might be considered. If so the cramped/LCC seating issue becomes a little better and perhaps dissipates somewhat. Using an aircraft that is better on fuel than any other aircraft they could use is also a big advantage. Already the 787 has regular rotations in HNL thanks to JL. Smart if you ask me as the trip costs are likely far lower than a 763 or 772 that they otherwise would send. Even Jetstar will start regular 787 service to HNL in mid February. By most anetters logic a leisure route is low yielding so it just makes sense to keep costs down o those routes and having the most fuel efficient equipment can only increase margins. It would not surprise me to see HNL move again in a shift from the current norms of 332/333 767/757 to more of the 788 aircraft. Of course then there is the 737 frame which I'd rather leave alone in more ways than one... Yes in the past a city pair such as OSL-HNL would not be thought twice about. But with the 787 and 350, things are changing faster than we may realize. These aircraft were designed to fly further and more efficiently in doing so. If a city pair such as this won't even get consideration based on past numbers/thinking, then the pushing of the envelope in this size category of airframe would seem rather pointless... in my humble (and terribly late night rambled) opinion.

Respectfully,
Pohakuloa
Fast cars and 'Jet A' - such a sweet smell!
 
User avatar
VCEflyboy
Posts: 1237
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:23 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 11:48 am

Quoting SCQ83 (Reply 57):






I am really curious to know how those average Norwegians and average Norwegian Air customers are in fact very different.

According to this http://www.aneki.com/income_countries.html Norway has the highest per capita income in the world. Why would they subject themselves to hours of delays, cancellations and substandard services which are all very public thanks to the extensive media reports that Norwegian has attracted to save a couple of krowns? Those flights are for backpackers, budget travelers, young people and the like.
 
by738
Posts: 3137
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2000 7:59 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 12:07 pm

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 29):
No European carrier or tour operator has attempted this for years

Yes but in years gone by there wasnt 20% fuel savings to be had on an ultra low cost model. They will have done their homework. Niche and unique in itself is enough to generate pax, this is how Goa Phuket and Male first started
 
Thenoflyzone
Posts: 3107
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 4:42 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 12:22 pm

Quoting kl911 (Reply 23):
That's the issue i'm afraid too. how often do their 787's divert or go tech? Too often IMO

If something were to go wrong, the alternates on such a flight would probably be (from east to west) KEF, SFJ, YZF, YXY and ANC. Hope you like the cold weather !

180 min ETOPS on a potential OSL-HNL should look something like this, assuming a one engine out speed of 410 kts.

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=OSL-HNL...r&MS=wls&DU=km&E=180&EV=410&EU=kts

Edit: Edited map. THU (Thule air base, in Greenland) can be used as an alternate. Fairbanks (FAI) and Svalbard Airport (LYR) can also be used, which are more "convenient" alternates than YXY or YZF in terms of flight distance.

Thenoflyzone

[Edited 2014-10-05 06:31:40]
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
Maersk737
Posts: 660
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2004 3:37 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 12:27 pm

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 61):
If something were to go wrong, the alternates on such a flight would probably be (from east to west) KEF, SFJ, YFB, YXY and ANC. Hope you like the cold weather !

LOOOOOOOL   No bikini-girls to welcome you in these locations?  

Cheers

Peter

[Edited 2014-10-05 05:31:21]
I'm not proud to be a Viking, just thankfull
 
aviationaware
Posts: 2858
Joined: Mon May 19, 2014 12:02 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 12:48 pm

1) Wrong terminus - London is what I perceive as the only terminus in Europe that would work with a direct Hawaii flight. I doubt Oslo will work, certainly not with the current connectivity of Norwegian.

2) Too far. Low cost long haul has a sweet spot and longer routes don't work, AirAsia X woefully experienced that with their Europe flights. Granted, the 787 is much more efficient than the A340 AirAsia was trying with, but I still doubt the yields will be able to sustain such a long flight for Norwegian.
 
LY777
Posts: 2587
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:58 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 12:53 pm

Quoting AviationAware (Reply 63):
1) Wrong terminus - London is what I perceive as the only terminus in Europe that would work with a direct Hawaii flight. I doubt Oslo will work, certainly not with the current connectivity of Norwegian.

I agree.
London would work better, or even maybe CDG
Flown:717,727,732,733,734,735,738,73H,742/744/748,752,753,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, 789, DC8,DC10,E190,E195,MD83,MD88, L1011, A3B2,A319,A320-100/200,A321,A332/A333,A343,A388
 
brilondon
Posts: 3164
Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2005 6:56 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 1:21 pm

Quoting rotating14 (Reply 2):

I think its a good idea actually. It gives travelers another option for a winter vacation spot. The 787 would have the legs for the trip and folks who are tired of the French Riviera, Ibiza and Italy can explore the other side of paradise.

This is the reason people would be attracted to Hawaii. It is someplace different.

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 40):
A Norwegian family or a single male trading Thailand for Hawaii?
I don't know.
Hawaii is a nice place to visit. Once.
However, Europeans used to go to Thailand for two weeks at least.
Thailand is addictive.
One can choose beach and/or trip to the North of Thailand; shopping in Singapore or Kuala-Lumpur. Visiting Khmer temples.
And all these treasures within 1.5 hour flight. And easy on Air Asia.
Besides, EK offers amazing deals for 1-3 day stops in Dubai.
Viability of the route is doubtful.

I have news for you, these reasons you have listed above are also reasons to go to Hawaii. It can be inexpensive or as expensive as you want to make it. People are individuals and they will choose what makes sense for them, I have lived in Hawaii for about 7 years and have no desire to vacation anywhere, but I do love to go to Europe. I have business interests in the UK and in Germany which I have to visit regularly and try to combine the two every other time I travel to Europe. Now that being said, I find that if you don't break up the trip into 3 or four segments, the longggggggggg flight really wears you out and you need a couple of days at least at both ends of the trip to recover no matter which class you fly. I have tried every type of service and found that if you can take a break especially on the way home. Just for one night, that really helps with the jetlag and the exhaustion. I don't see how Norwegian is going to make this work. Hawaii is not a premium traffic destination as most of the seats up front on most airlines are award seats people use for vacations. As to your reason of closeness all the islands are within an 45 minute flight from each other and not a bad way to get to other islands. I do agree with the viability question as I am not seeing a whole lot of Hawaiians flocking to Europe and vice versa. I also read a post that they are not looking at Hawaii as a new addition right now so this is really a moot post as they will not be coming to Hawaii anytime soon.
Rush forever Closer To My Heart
 
BestWestern
Posts: 8368
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2000 8:46 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 1:38 pm

This route is not a Heathrow Austin style route. It is a secondary European destination to a secondary North American destination.

Quoting SCQ83 (Reply 57):

In same way spirit airlines doesn't fly the typical American customer, the wealthier Norwegian customer will not subject themselves to Norwegian for such a long flight given their terrible reputation on long haul services.

Anyway, this is a futile conversation - even Norwegian have said it isn't on the cards, just like Hawaiian said it was at least five years away from even being considered. Just because an aircraft is 20% more fuel efficient doesn't create a market from zero. Oslo to Hawaii has a tiny tiny market demand today - I doubt it is in the top 100 served routes from
Europe to North America. That, the lack of business traffic, lack of VFR and better value holiday alternatives elsewhere makes Europe to HNL unserveable.
Greetings from Hong Kong.... a subsidiary of China Inc.
 
User avatar
enilria
Posts: 10410
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 1:49 pm

Quoting SpaceshipDC10 (Reply 1):
Although it can seem attractive to serve HNL nonstop from Europe, I'm not sure whether it could be successful even for a company like Norwegian. And Hawaii is not really cheap.

I agree. This is not a market for people trying to save money. Hawaii is expensive and so will this flight be. It works better for a legacy than a ULCC.

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 5):
Probably launching it like 2x weekly with agreements / guarantees from tour package operators

That'll have to be on the Europe side. Nobody on the Hawaii is side is going to guarantee this beyond a few months because Hawaii hotels don't need to. That's another reason I don't see it working. If I was a Euro tour operator I'd risk my money on Caribbean where there are plenty of distressed properties to prop it up.
 
Amsterdam
Posts: 450
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 12:52 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 2:00 pm

I see many people here talk about expensive and not cheap.
Do they know how expnsive Norway is?
For Norwegians Hawaii is cheap.
Almost any place in the world is that for them.
In Europe only Switserland comes close to the prices in Norway.
Norway is not just another European country.
 
User avatar
Kiwirob
Posts: 13419
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 2:16 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 2:01 pm

Quoting SpaceshipDC10 (Reply 1):
Although it can seem attractive to serve HNL nonstop from Europe, I'm not sure whether it could be successful even for a company like Norwegian. And Hawaii is not really cheap.

I don't like Norwegian at all and go out of my way to avoid flying them, but I would fly to Hawaii if they decided to operate there.

Compared to having a holiday in Norway Hawaii is cheap, Norwegians spend a lot of money on holidays, they would lap up Hawaii and it would be relatively cheap for them.

Quoting S75752 (Reply 8):
Who would Norwegian interline with for island to island? The whole point of Hawaii is that each island is different, interlines are an absolute must...

Most Norwegians on package holidays aren't interested in actually seeing anything, they want sun, a pool and as much booze as they can drink. Most of full board packages might not even leave the resort they are staying at. With Hawaii they can get all this, at a pretty cheap price with the added bonus of cheap shopping.

Quoting MIflyer12 (Reply 12):
Hawaii is not cheap.

I'll say it again, Hawaii for a Norwegian would be a cheap holiday.

Quoting S75752 (Reply 24):
Hawaii isn't set where you can just go to HNL and be satisfied, each island offers different things.

The Norwegian taking his family to somewhere hot and sunny isn't going to venture far beyond Honolulu, the backpacker will, but the family guy with wife and 2 kids won't.

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 29):
For example, two weeks in November at the holiday inn Waikiki resort in Hawaii is 3050USD.

Which is 20,000 NOK, double that with flights from Norway and it's still less than what most Norwegians get paid in Holiday pay. Most families I know get somewhere from 100-150,000 NOK (15-23k USD) holiday pay. Dropping 100K NOK on summer holidays is pretty common. Holiday pay in Norway is tax free, paid in a lump sum every June/July.
 
User avatar
lesfalls
Posts: 3509
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:58 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 2:51 pm

Quoting LY777 (Reply 64):
even maybe CDG

They dont have enought connecting flights to get those flights full.
Lufthansa: Einfach ein bisschen besser.
 
okay
Posts: 642
Joined: Tue Dec 12, 2006 10:11 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 3:39 pm

Sounds interesting. I wonder what kind of target group they have in mind? People in the Nordics are getting a bit tired of Thailand. It was the same in the 1980s. All the Caribbean destinations were popular, Barbados, Jamaica, Florida, Dominican Republic. Then came the Thai boom. They said African leisure destinations would come next with a few very well established places already existing, like Mombasa. But maybe Africa is not perceived safe enough for a real mass tourism on the scale it is happening in Thailand, for example, would be possible just yet.

I think it could work, for the same target group who have been to Thailand too many times and do not wanna do Caribbean anymore, Canaries is a definite no-go (there is a general attitude among some people that Canaries is like the dumpster of holidays)... If I think about it from my personal point of view, I would not choose a direct flight to Hawaii, but would make a stop over on the West Coast to get more out of such a long trip. But if its the Hawaiian beaches one is looking for, and only those, then such flight could work! I hope to market is there.
 
User avatar
VCEflyboy
Posts: 1237
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:23 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 3:44 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 69):
Most families I know get somewhere from 100-150,000 NOK (15-23k USD) holiday pay.

Then perhaps you could ask your friends why on earth would someone with a 15-23k USD holiday budget fly on this monopoly airline that makes ryanair look like a 7-star airline? I would be intrigued.
 
SCQ83
Posts: 5868
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 4:07 pm

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 66):
This route is not a Heathrow Austin style route. It is a secondary European destination to a secondary North American destination.

In no way it would be comparable to BA's LHR-AUS. This flight would be on a 1x or 2x weekly basis (like many Norwegian's destinations) targeting the holiday market; maybe on a seasonal basis. There are plenty of such flights even with larger planes; i.e. Virgin Atlantic flies Belfast-Orlando with a B747. In addition to holiday packages, Norwegian will sell tickets and make connections; at least for HEL/CPH/ARN will be the quickest way to Hawaii.

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 66):
In same way spirit airlines doesn't fly the typical American customer, the wealthier Norwegian customer will not subject themselves to Norwegian for such a long flight given their terrible reputation on long haul services.

The wealthier Norwegian customer will look for a deal like everyone else, and will favor a shorter flight to Hawaii. Their "terrible reputation on long-haul services" will be forgotten for a cheaper fare and in this case for a shorter flight.
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 5787
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 4:55 pm

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 40):
Hawaii is a nice place to visit. Once

From somebody who is well into his thirty something trip to Hawaii, I respectfully disagree with your statement.

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 40):
Thailand is addictive

Having been both places, I can honestly say Hawaii has much more to offer than Thailand, and the fact that I went to Thailand once, and I'm ready to embark on my 35th trip to the Hawaiian Islands should say something to you.

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 40):
One can choose beach and/or trip to the North of Thailand; shopping in Singapore or Kuala-Lumpur. Visiting Khmer temples

In Hawaii you can go to the beach, shop at world class stores, visit ancient Hawaiian temples & go hiking up Diamond Head then have a 5 star meal, all in one day without having to fly to different destinations.

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 42):
Hawaiian are not planning Europe either - if anyone knows the market - it's them.


When HA placed their order for the 358, ability to reach Europe n/s was a factor given to substantiate the orders. I think there is every indication that HA has at least been looking at the viability of a European service.

Quoting SCQ83 (Reply 43):
I am thinking for instance of Airbnb

Another company that recently re-based here in Portland Oregon.

Quoting blueflyer (Reply 47):
Because this is how the European market is evolving. The once-a-year somewhat-expensive vacation is being replaced by several cheap trips throughout the year

Really? Someone better tell all the Europeans I meet when I'm on my yearly vacation to Hawaii that they are doing it wrong.

Quoting Tolmachevo (Reply 50):
The combination of low cost long haul to a relatively expensive destination

Expensive to whom? It has been established by members from Europe, that the average Norwegian is not going to see Hawaii as expensive.

Quoting Tolmachevo (Reply 50):
I think they are as interested in value for money and quality of service to the same extent as many other northern European citizens.

Hawaii is a value, there is no place on earth that you can get all of what Hawaii has to offer for such a remarkable price.

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 52):
Norwegians don't brag to start with

Do you know any Norwegians? I do, they love to talk about where they have vacationed, they love to talk about their home in Spain, they are just as happy to share their good fortune as anyone else I know. Broad generalizations about a specific group of people are just plain ignorant & misleading.

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 52):
Secondly, Hawaii is just one of many 'exotic' destinations, and is comparable to other locations. It's just not different enough or 'exotic, enough than Thailand, or exclusive enough to say Bora Bora to fill a direct wide body profitably.

Have you ever vacationed in Hawaii? Obviously not, otherwise you'd not have said what you just did.

Quoting VCEflyboy (Reply 59):
Why would they subject themselves to hours of delays, cancellations and substandard services

Who says that is going to be the case? As with most carriers who don't have their tickets honored by other carriers, you always run a risk of a tech delay becoming a nightmare. It's called travel insurance, if you're spending a lot on a vacation, you would be stupid not to get insurance should something go wrong, it's rather inexpensive too.

Just because DY has had bad issues in the past, does that mean it will always be like that? Seems they are doing better than they did at first already, with their additional expansion into the US market, HNL is a natural add to their roster of US tourist destinations.

Quoting AviationAware (Reply 63):
Wrong terminus - London is what I perceive as the only terminus in Europe that would work with a direct Hawaii flight.

I have a feeling that LGW wouldn't be too far behind if this first route shows some promise, I'd be surprised if there were not 2-3 cities that may end up with a connection to HNL (seasonally at least)

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 66):
In same way spirit airlines doesn't fly the typical American customer, the wealthier Norwegian customer will not subject themselves to Norwegian for such a long flight given their terrible reputation on long haul services

A wide variety of people fly NK, yes mostly bargain hunters, but there are some markets where NK is the only n/s option like BWI-MYR for example. I am sure many folks will consider the convenience of a n/s vs the less than ample legroom.

Quoting Amsterdam (Reply 68):
For Norwegians Hawaii is cheap

Thank you, I'm glad some of us get this fact. Hawaii is "cheap" for many Nationals from around the world.

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 69):
The Norwegian taking his family to somewhere hot and sunny isn't going to venture far beyond Honolulu, the backpacker will, but the family guy with wife and 2 kids won't

You think so? If I had flown a long distance from half way around the world to such a unique and inviting place like Hawaii, I'd want to see more than just the one big city. The true Hawaiian atmosphere is on the outer Islands.

These Europe to Hawaii threads ALWAYS come down to these same issues:

1) There are beaches closer to home
2) Hawaii is Expensive vs (Insert Beach Destination Here)

The bottom line is, unless you have been to Hawaii (not just Waikiki) and have experienced first hand the feeling of Aloha, you are likely to get it. Hawaii goes way beyond beaches, though they are spectacular, Hawaii is natural beauty that is unrivaled, Hawaii has magnificent year round weather, active volcanoes, great snorkeling & diving, 5 star gourmet faire that spans the globe, Honolulu & Waikiki have world class shopping with all the big designer stores, to the handmade tapa.

The Australians we met last year were buying Uggs to take back home with them, because they were less expensive than home, if you can imagine that.

Hawaii has a vacation for almost every budget, there are local places like L & L, where one plate lunch will last the average eater 2 meals for like $12.00, you can do tons of free things, hiking, swimming, beaches, museums, Iolani palace, Chinatown is cool.

Or you can spend your NOK, GBP or USD as much as you wish to. And you can do all this while experiencing the most wonderful set of Islands on the planet, they are so close the longest flight from HNL is 45 minutes, and the best thing that is totally free is the feeling of Aloha that is the fabric of this great place, if you haven't felt it, you'll unlikely get why so many people are so passionate about these Islands, you can't get this anywhere else on earth. It's worth the journey.
707 717 720 727-1/2 737-1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 747-1/2/3/4 757-2/3 767-2/3/4 777-2/3 DC8 DC9 MD80/2/7/8 D10-1/3/4 M11 L10-1/2/5 A300/310/320
AA AC AQ AS BA BD BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WC WN WP YS 8M
 
User avatar
AirPacific747
Posts: 9755
Joined: Mon May 19, 2008 9:52 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 4:57 pm

Quoting 9w748capt (Reply 7):
Hawaii is an amazing place no doubt - but not sure how LCC and ULH mix...

Well let's see exactly how "low cost" it will be if it takes off. DY would have a monopoly on the route from Europe direct to Hawaii and so far they are far from always the cheapest option across the Atlantic even when competing with legacy carriers where everything is included in the price.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 74):
The bottom line is, unless you have been to Hawaii (not just Waikiki) and have experienced first hand the feeling of Aloha, you are likely to get it. Hawaii goes way beyond beaches, though they are spectacular, Hawaii is natural beauty that is unrivaled, Hawaii has magnificent year round weather, active volcanoes, great snorkeling & diving, 5 star gourmet faire that spans the globe, Honolulu & Waikiki have world class shopping with all the big designer stores, to the handmade tapa.

Completely agree. Have been to Hawaii three times myself. Would love to go again any day! One of my favourites destinations on this planet and especially Maui!

[Edited 2014-10-05 10:06:01]
 
User avatar
pylon101
Posts: 564
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2008 5:36 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 4:58 pm

I would say it is a real catastrophe that the most amazing places on Earth, namely: Venezuela, Columbia and South Africa are out of our reach.
For various reasons, it is nearly impossible to travel there; rent a car and drive wherever you wish.

Back to the subject.
If FR tried and failed to maintain regular service to SSH (Sharm-El- Sheikh) where thousands of Europeans own property, I see no viability in the route in question.
Norwegians used to count money.
However, if they decide to fly to Hawaii, they will make a comfortable stop for a day or two.

Within the last couple of years, I cut the flight from Moscow to Bangkok into two parts; with intermediate stops in Dubai.
It works great. Highly recommended.
I am on EK 231/232. The rest is just jet lag.
 
User avatar
AirPacific747
Posts: 9755
Joined: Mon May 19, 2008 9:52 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 5:04 pm

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 76):
If FR tried and failed to maintain regular service to SSH (Sharm-El- Sheikh) where thousands of Europeans own property, I see no viability in the route in question.

1. There's a lot more competition to/from SSH and Europe on direct flights. DY would be the sole carrier in Europe to offer non-stop flights out of Europe.

2. I think Hawaii attracts a different clientel with a different (bigger) budget than SSH does.

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 76):
Within the last couple of years, I cut the flight from Moscow to Bangkok into two parts; with intermediate stops in Dubai.
It works great. Highly recommended.

Hmm each to his own. I tried EK to Hong Kong via Dubai back in May - While EK is a great airline, having a stop in the middle of two semi-long flights is not pleasant to me. I'd rather fly a very short flight and a very long flight instead.

[Edited 2014-10-05 10:05:16]
 
User avatar
Kiwirob
Posts: 13419
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 2:16 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 5:28 pm

Quoting VCEflyboy (Reply 72):
Then perhaps you could ask your friends why on earth would someone with a 15-23k USD holiday budget fly on this monopoly airline that makes ryanair look like a 7-star airline? I would be intrigued.

I have no idea, all I know is I don't think would be the only flight they could operate which might interest me.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 74):
You think so?

I know so. I think off all the well paid, educated people I work with who go on package holidays to Crete, Canary Islands, Turkey and rest, they do noting except sit around the resort drinking, eating and swimming in the pool, with the odd trip to the closest town to get their daughters hair braided and maybe dinner in a local restaurant. Staying put in Waikiki would be perfect for them. The beach is ok, lots of restaurants, hamburger joints, close to Ala Moana Centre for shopping, a few daytrips to Pearl Harbour, Diamond Head, Hanauma Bay, The Punchbowl, Waimea Falls.

I went to Honolulu as a kid, I loved it, I would like to take my kids as well, just looked on skyscanner.no for reasonably priced tickets for my family, it's going to be 40 plus hours flight time, my 3 year old wouldn't like that, neither would my wife, but direct from Oslo, that would be fine.
 
User avatar
JetBuddy
Posts: 2610
Joined: Wed Dec 25, 2013 1:04 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 6:24 pm

Quoting HAL (Reply 41):

Quoting JetBuddy (Reply 38):
It's a 6700 NM flight..

OSL - HNL is about 5900nm. OSL to both Seychelles and Maldives is about 4400nm, and OSL to Bangkok is about 4700nm.

They're all long flights, but Hawaii isn't an impossible distance farther than the others.

HAL

Great Circle mapper says its 6782 nm direct route. But I agree with your sentiment.

OSL-HNL" target="_blank">http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=OSL-HNL
 
User avatar
airportugal310
Posts: 3710
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2004 12:49 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 6:47 pm

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 74):

that was a very accurate and nice description of this place. Some either get it, or they don't but do once they come and see for themselves.

That said, I've been on Kauai all weekend on a little getaway and I don't want to leave!! My favorite island of them all...
“They bought their tickets, they knew what they were getting into. I say, let 'em crash.”
 
User avatar
readytotaxi
Posts: 7899
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:09 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 7:12 pm

If this was gonna be a money earner from Europe I think that Virgin or Thompson would have been in there by now.
Great location too be sure,more holiday sights than Florida but further to fly. And as others have said more cost than the East Coast.
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
Growing older, but not up.
 
User avatar
JetBuddy
Posts: 2610
Joined: Wed Dec 25, 2013 1:04 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 7:14 pm

I feel like most things have been said already about this, but I would like to add that Norwegian has a very well established short haul network in Europe. Offering one-stop (OSL) service to Hawaii from all those European cities is very attractive. Oslo is already directly on flight path from continental Europe to Hawaii and much shorter than connecting stateside. The catchment area of such an offer isn't just Norway, and OSL is a small, efficient and quiet airport (by international standards).

Personally I avoid Norwegian long haul like the plague, but I don't mind their short haul operations. The OSL-HNL route would be the only long haul route I would consider.
 
User avatar
saleya22r
Posts: 180
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 2:13 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 7:19 pm

Which is 20,000 NOK, double that with flights from Norway and it's still less than what most Norwegians get paid in Holiday pay. Most families I know get somewhere from 100-150,000 NOK (15-23k USD) holiday pay. Dropping 100K NOK on summer holidays is pretty common. Holiday pay in Norway is tax free, paid in a lump sum every June/July.

KiwiRob, it's taxable income on a yearly basis in Norway. And you don't get the basic salary in June when the holiday pay(10,2% from previous year's income) is paid. But yes, Norwegians still have a better holiday budget these days -specially the blue collar workers..
Regarding the topic, I believe it's too small a market. Any non stop flights should depart from the UK or from a hub with enough connecting traffic.
I agree with you, tried to avoid DY when lived in Oslo although I have now booked FLL LGW in December as I needed a nicely priced one way ticket..my first Dreamliner experience (I hope)
 
UALWN
Posts: 2186
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:27 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 7:27 pm

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 80):
Some either get it, or they don't but do once they come and see for themselves.

I've been twice to Hawaii. Been to the Big Island, Maui, Kauai and Oahu. I love all the islands, which are very diverse. However, I don't think Hawaii is fundamentally different or superior to many other tropical or semi-tropical destinations, including the Caribbean, the Canary Islands, French Polynesia, etc. The fact is that there are already many ways of getting from Europe to Hawai'i, and yet the demand is rather weak, and in no way comparable to that to, say, the Caribbean or Thailand. Even flights from the US East coast to Hawaii have historically struggled. People in the East coast just go to the Caribbean to get their tropical fix.

[Edited 2014-10-05 12:29:02]
AT7/111/146/Avro/CRJ/CR9/EMB/ERJ/E75/F50/100/L15/DC9/D10/M8X/717/727/737/747/757/767/777/787/AB6/310/32X/330/340/350/380
 
Mortyman
Posts: 5939
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 8:26 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 7:29 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 69):
Most Norwegians on package holidays aren't interested in actually seeing anything, they want sun, a pool and as much booze as they can drink. Most of full board packages might not even leave the resort they are staying at. With Hawaii they can get all this, at a pretty cheap price with the added bonus of cheap shopping.

You Paint With a broad brush ...

Quoting VCEflyboy (Reply 72):
monopoly airline that makes ryanair look like a 7-star airline

Huh ?

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 69):
100-150,000 NOK (15-23k USD) holiday pay

The average family gets less than this. You also have to remember that holiday pay is instead of normal salary, so you still have to pay Your normal bills in adittion to your holiday Money With what you get.

[Edited 2014-10-05 12:32:03]
 
frostyj
Posts: 1786
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:04 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 8:03 pm

I can't see any real backing for a flight to Hawaii.

Hawaii is about 7,000 miles away with a 11 hour time difference, ok maybe Florida would be acceptable but are British people really going to go through all that hassle just for a two week holiday?

The jetlag would be horrendous.
[url=http://m.maploco.com/details/5f34zxvq][img]http://www.maploco.com/vmap/s/8395334.png[/img][/url]
 
frostyj
Posts: 1786
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:04 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 8:04 pm

Quoting brilondon (Reply 65):

It may well be but when people see the flight time and the time difference they will soon change their minds.
[url=http://m.maploco.com/details/5f34zxvq][img]http://www.maploco.com/vmap/s/8395334.png[/img][/url]
 
frostyj
Posts: 1786
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:04 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 8:07 pm

Quoting SpaceshipDC10 (Reply 16):

Yes you are right some people would fly to the Caribbean and Florida but that is because it is cheap to go there and there is only a 4 hour time difference.

We kind of have to go far anyway as its cold everywhere in Europe during winter.
[url=http://m.maploco.com/details/5f34zxvq][img]http://www.maploco.com/vmap/s/8395334.png[/img][/url]
 
Mortyman
Posts: 5939
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 8:26 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 9:00 pm

Quoting frostyj (Reply 86):
British people really going to go through all that hassle just for a two week holiday?

Seems like it will be from OSL first and foremost if it happens
 
LN-KGL
Posts: 822
Joined: Sun Sep 12, 1999 6:40 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 9:04 pm

If you want to fly from OSL to HNL today it takes at least 21 hours to Haiwaii or back home to Oslo again it takes 25 hours. You need to change flights at AMS and SEA to reach these times, and compared with two times 13 hours for flights you will gain almost one whole day more at the destination if DY starts direct flights. Comparing the tourist classes between KLM, Delta and Norwegian I would say the difference between them is minimal provided you buy the plus package at DY. If you're buying the around 30% more expensive Premium cabin tickets at DY you end up with 8-10" extra seat pitch compared with what the legacy carrier offers in their 787 Premium Economy classes.

With 12 hours time difference between OSL and HNL the term red eye flight get a new meaning - to catch some sleep will be necessary both ways with that difference. There will also be a huge difference between summer and winter flights with large parts of the flights during winter being in pitch dark except for the occasional Dance of the Spirits outside while at mid summer the sun never sets below the horizon for large part of the 13 hour long flights.
 
777STL
Posts: 2770
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2004 8:22 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 9:52 pm

Quoting frostyj (Reply 86):
Hawaii is about 7,000 miles away with a 11 hour time difference, ok maybe Florida would be acceptable but are British people really going to go through all that hassle just for a two week holiday?

I just got back from Kauai a few weeks ago. There was no shortage of people speaking French, Spanish, German and King's English.

Base on first hand experience, I don't really buy the notion that there's no market for such a flight. The demand is there. Whether they can operate it economically and still return a profit is certainly up for debate.
PHX based
 
airbazar
Posts: 10363
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Sun Oct 05, 2014 11:25 pm

This topic comes up all the time. Why does it have to be Hawaii vs. A, B, or C? Some people would go to Hawaii and so e wouldn't. Tahiti is even further from Europe and whole lot more expensive and yet, plenty of Europeans still go there. Hawaii gets 130,000+ annual visitors from Europe, without a single non-stop flight and with crappy connections and expensive fares. That's nothing to sneeze at. The idea that Europeans do not visit Hawaii is absolutely ludicrous.
 
User avatar
MillwallSean
Posts: 988
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2008 3:07 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Mon Oct 06, 2014 12:15 am

This type of flight wouldnt be catered to just Norwegians it would aim to bring in pax from all over Scandinavia. However as already said, Hawaii would be a niche market.
I think its important for you to realise that in the holiday brochures thats displayed at the subsidiaries of Thomas Cook and TUitravel you have destinations such as Cook islands featured. Should norwegian start a route to hawaii it would do so in partnership with tour operators and its likely to be a seasonal route.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 74):

In Hawaii you can go to the beach, shop at world class stores, visit ancient Hawaiian temples & go hiking up Diamond Head then have a 5 star meal, all in one day without having to fly to different destinations.

Hmm, I dont think you fully understand what the competitors offer. SE Asia has guide Michelin starred restaurants, cheaper electronics including pirated stuff, jailbreaked stuff. It has everyone of the high end shops and they sell at a discount to Europe. The jungle treks, the nature is all there. And to be honest I have yet to meet a European traveller who thinks great food - USA.

What would drive Hawaii would be curiosity and ease. Its easy to go to the US, people speak English, its a perception that its safe and should something happened medical care is equivalent to home, you dont need to bargain and you wont get any disease etc. (The day they start to include taxes in prices it would be like home almost)

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 74):
Have you ever vacationed in Hawaii? Obviously not, otherwise you'd not have said what you just did.
Quoting RWA380 (Reply 74):
Hawaii is a value, there is no place on earth that you can get all of what Hawaii has to offer for such a remarkable price.
Quoting RWA380 (Reply 74):
The bottom line is, unless you have been to Hawaii (not just Waikiki) and have experienced first hand the feeling of Aloha, you are likely to get it. Hawaii goes way beyond beaches, though they are spectacular, Hawaii is natural beauty that is unrivaled, Hawaii has magnificent year round weather, active volcanoes, great snorkeling & diving, 5 star gourmet faire that spans the globe, Honolulu & Waikiki have world class shopping with all the big designer stores, to the handmade tapa.

Hmm id say you adore hawaii and thus make the assumption that its better than everything else. ive been to hawaii a few times and I dont get the same wow feeling as you do.
For me other Polynesian islands is nicer. And I much prefer Asia. A place like Mauritius or Sri lanka has even more to offer. But taste differs and there will be some Europeans who will agree with you. Enough of a market to profitably fill a 787 from Europe is debatable though...

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 78):

I know so. I think off all the well paid, educated people I work with who go on package holidays to Crete, Canary Islands, Turkey and rest, they do noting except sit around the resort drinking, eating and swimming in the pool, with the odd trip to the closest town to get their daughters hair braided and maybe dinner in a local restaurant. Staying put in Waikiki would be perfect for them.

I dont think people from outside Scandinavia, the nordics and Russia can understand the pull of a beach for Scandinavians. Beach holidays is a staple of what they travel to. Sure you may add a few days of other stuff, some day excursions, but the main part of the holiday is the beach, the pool and the evening taverna which is within walking distance.

Quoting UALWN (Reply 84):

I've been twice to Hawaii. Been to the Big Island, Maui, Kauai and Oahu. I love all the islands, which are very diverse. However, I don't think Hawaii is fundamentally different or superior to many other tropical or semi-tropical destinations, including the Caribbean, the Canary Islands, French Polynesia, etc. The fact is that there are already many ways of getting from Europe to Hawai'i, and yet the demand is rather weak, and in no way comparable to that to, say, the Caribbean or Thailand. Even flights from the US East coast to Hawaii have historically struggled. People in the East coast just go to the Caribbean to get their tropical fix.

I tend to agree. I enjoy the destination and its a good place but it offers no added value compared to the competitors. In fact Id say it offers less than several of its main competitors.
No One Likes Us - We Dont Care.
 
User avatar
Miami
Posts: 6251
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2012 8:37 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Mon Oct 06, 2014 12:30 am

This seems like a good idea for Norwegian, no?

Quoting frostyj (Reply 88):
We kind of have to go far anyway as its cold everywhere in Europe during winter.

Have you ever been to Florida? More specific, South Florida?
Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible. - Eddie Rickenbacker
 
frostyj
Posts: 1786
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:04 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Mon Oct 06, 2014 12:40 am

[/quote]

Quoting Miami (Reply 94):

Yes! I have been twice!!!
[url=http://m.maploco.com/details/5f34zxvq][img]http://www.maploco.com/vmap/s/8395334.png[/img][/url]
 
User avatar
Miami
Posts: 6251
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2012 8:37 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Mon Oct 06, 2014 12:42 am

Quoting frostyj (Reply 95):
Yes! I have been twice!!!

Very nice! I hope you enjoyed your stay!  
Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible. - Eddie Rickenbacker
 
frostyj
Posts: 1786
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:04 am

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Mon Oct 06, 2014 12:47 am

Quoting Miami (Reply 96):

Yes of course. We enjoyed our time Palm Beach Gardens.

[Edited 2014-10-05 17:49:33]
[url=http://m.maploco.com/details/5f34zxvq][img]http://www.maploco.com/vmap/s/8395334.png[/img][/url]
 
savethequads
Posts: 37
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2014 10:55 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Mon Oct 06, 2014 1:11 am

This absolutely will work. 13 hrs or not. The countless Europeans I meet in the Pacific region have all flown 20 hours or more to come to the Pacific Islands and no one I have every talked to has said they were disappointed in Maui, Kauai, Bora Bora or Moorea. I tend to gravitate towards talking to Germans or Dutch people on tour and I know they are brutally honest and would say if they were disappointed.

There is something magical about Pacific islands that is not captured by Indian Ocean and Caribbean destinations. The Seychelles look amazing but are 20 hours away and very expensive, I still plan to visit though. I have been to Diego Garcia (it is beautiful, but atolls get boring to me) but I have no desire to visit the Maldives.

I like Cancun, St. Thomas, and Greece, they are all beautiful, but there is something about the islands of Hawaii and French Polynesia that keep me flying over the pacific year after year. I really think it is the uniqueness of Polynesian culture and language. I don't know what it is but plenty of others feel it too.

Also keep in mind HNL has many connection possibilities. Fiji, Tahiti, Guam/Palau/Micronesia, Samoa, even Australia and NZ.

The new trend in travel is to go to untouched places most people have never heard of with minimal creature comforts.
 
airbazar
Posts: 10363
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

RE: Norwegian Air In Talks To Start Hawaii Flights

Mon Oct 06, 2014 1:26 am

Quoting MillwallSean (Reply 93):
This type of flight wouldnt be catered to just Norwegians it would aim to bring in pax from all over Scandinavia.

It wouldn't be catered to Scandinavians at all. The largest European group in Hawaii comes from the UK, followed by Germans. Also French, Italians, and Swiss. This flight would most likely operate out of LGW.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos