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enilria
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OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 7:51 pm

FAQ

WHAT IS THIS REPORT?
This compares what is for sale THIS WEEK for the stated period versus what was for sale LAST WEEK...It does NOT compare to last year or now (UNLESS OTHERWISE STATED).

HOW DO I READ IT?
XXX-YYY DEC 4>5 JAN 4>5 ; means that the listed airline changed the frequency between the two airports to add from 4 to 5 roundtrips in December and January. No other months were changed. I only list one direction, although it is possible the listed change is only one way. It is too difficult to average the two directions. I assume the change is roundtrip and that is most often the case.

HOW ARE THE DAILY DEPARTURES CALCULATED?
This report uses total operations for the month listed, divided over the days in the month.

WHAT ARE THE FRACTIONAL FLIGHTS?
Flights that do not operate every day of the month create fractional service. In most cases flights are rounded, but in the case of international service or markets with low frequency, fractions are shown. For example, if a flight operates 4 times in April it will show 4/30=0.133=0.1. Also , a flight that only operates once per week may vary between 0.1 and 0.2 because a weekday may repeat either 4 or 5 times depending on the month.

WHAT ABOUT CARRIERS THAT DON'T PUBLISH A SCHEDULE 9 MONTHS IN ADVANCE?
Most airlines publish schedules 11 months in advance. This report covers the next 9 months. That avoids seeing schedules as they are loaded. Several LCCs load their schedules less than 9 months into the future. I remove the schedule adds if I see them and show a year over year (YOY) comparison if I notice them.

THOSE FLIGHTS AREN'T DELTA, THEY ARE SKYWEST
This report only shows the marketing code. It is too complicated to show all the operators.

THE FREQUENCIES MAY HAVE CHANGED AS YOU SHOW, BUT THE SEATS DIDNT CHANGE BECAUSE OF EQUIPMENT SWAPS
That is a natural weakness of a frequency based report, but it provides something to discuss below.

THIS LOOKS LIKE AN ERROR?
The carriers file the schedules. They do make mistakes. Most of the mistakes I have seen are either related to code shares not being marked as "duplicates" or carriers filing flights with invalid data such as equipment codes that are not standard. This causes flights to not appear.

CHARTERS?
Lately charters have been showing up in the database. I have no idea if that will continue.

I marked some of the ones I thought were interesting with an "*".

1X BKG-MDW APR 0.6>0.3

AC CMH-YYZ MAY 3>4 JUN 3>4 JUL 3>4 AUG 3>4
AC CVG-YYZ MAY 1.7>3 JUN 1.7>3 JUL 1.7>3 AUG 1.7>3
*AC EWR-YVR MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0 JUL 1.0>0 AUG 1.0>0
*AC JFK-YVR MAY 0>1.0 JUN 0>1.0 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0
AC LAS-YUL MAY 2>1.1
AC LAX-YUL MAY 3>2 JUL 3>4 AUG 3>4
AC LAX-YYZ MAY 7>6 JUN 7>6
AC MIA-YYZ MAY 1.0>2 JUN 1.0>2 JUL 1.0>2 AUG 1.0>2
AC PDX-YYC MAY 2>1.0 JUN 2>1.4
AC ROC-YYZ MAY 1.8>3 JUN 1.9>3 JUL 1.9>3 AUG 1.8>3
AC SEA-YVR MAY 7>6
AC SEA-YYC MAY 2>0.7 JUN 2>1.4
AC SEA-YYZ MAY 2>1.0 JUL 2>3 AUG 2>3
AC SYR-YYZ MAY 2>3 JUN 2>3 JUL 2>3 AUG 2>3

AM FAT-GDL APR 0.6>0.4 MAY 0.6>0.4 JUN 0.6>0.4 JUL 0.5>0.4 AUG 0.6>0.4
AM MIA-MID MAR 0.5>0.6 APR 0.4>0.6 MAY 0.4>0.6 JUN 0.4>0.6 JUL 0.4>0.6 AUG 0.5>0.6
AM SFO-GDL MAR 0.7>0.8 APR 0.7>0.9 MAY 0.7>0.9 JUN 0.7>0.8 JUL 0.7>0.9 AUG 0.7>0.9

AS PDX-SLC JUL 2>3 AUG 2>3
*AS PDX-STL JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0
It's back. I guess it was a filing error.
*AS SEA-IAD JUN 0.2>1.0 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0
*AS SEA-MKE JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0
*AS SEA-OKC JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0
AS SEA-SLC JUL 3>4 AUG 3>4
AS SEA-TUS JUL 1.0>2 AUG 1.0>2

*AV EWR-SAL FEB 0.7>0 MAR 0.7>0 APR 0.7>0 MAY 0.7>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 1.0>0 AUG 1.0>0
AV IAD-SAL MAR 3>2 APR 3>2 MAY 3>2 JUN 3>2 JUL 3>2 AUG 3>2
AV ORD-SAL FEB 1.0>0.7 MAR 1.0>0.7 APR 1.0>0.7 MAY 1.0>0.7 JUN 1.0>0.7 JUL 1.0>0.7 AUG 1.0>0.7

B6 BOS-IAD JUL 4>3 AUG 4>3
B6 FLL-CUN FEB 1.5>1.0

DL ATL-ECP APR 6>7 MAY 6>7
DL ATL-HSV MAR 7>8
DL ATL-IAH MAY 9>10
DL ATL-TYS APR 8>9
DL AZO-MSP MAY 1.8>1.0
DL BDL-CLE MAY 1.0>0.7
Well, it looks like CVG may be funding the SEA build-up. This is the first pull-back there in a while. Don't they have a flight commitment?
*DL CVG-BWI MAR 3>1.9
*DL CVG-CLT MAR 3>1.8 APR 3>0.9 MAY 3>0.8 JUN 3>1.5 JUL 3>1.7 AUG 3>1.7
*DL CVG-EWR MAR 4>3 JUL 4>3 AUG 4>3
*DL CVG-PHL MAR 4>1.7 APR 4>1.7 MAY 4>1.7 JUN 4>1.7 JUL 4>1.7 AUG 4>1.7
*DL CVG-RDU MAR 3>1.7 APR 3>1.7 MAY 3>1.7 JUN 3>1.7 JUL 3>1.7 AUG 3>1.7
DL DTW-ATW FEB 4>3 MAR 4>3 APR 4>3 MAY 4>3 JUN 4>3
DL DTW-BTV MAR 3>1.9 APR 3>1.9 MAY 3>1.8 JUN 4>3 JUL 4>3 AUG 4>3
DL DTW-CIU JUN 1.9>1.3
DL DTW-GRR MAY 6>7
DL DTW-IAD MAR 4>3
DL DTW-LEX MAY 4>5
DL DTW-MHT MAR 4>3 APR 4>3
DL DTW-PVD APR 4>3
DL DTW-YUL MAR 5>3 APR 5>4 MAY 5>4 JUN 5>4 JUL 5>4 AUG 5>4
DL JFK-BUF APR 4>5 MAY 4>5 JUN 4>5 JUL 4>5 AUG 4>5
DL JFK-CHS FEB 1.9>1.4
DL JFK-IAD MAR 3>2 APR 3>1.9 MAY 3>2 JUN 3>2 JUL 3>2 AUG 3>2
*DL JFK-ORF FEB 1.0>0.4 MAR 1.0>0 APR 1.0>0 MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0 JUL 1.0>0 AUG 1.0>0
*DL JFK-RIC MAR 3>1.0 APR 3>1.7 MAY 3>1.8 JUN 3>2 JUL 3>2 AUG 3>2
DL JFK-PHL FEB 3>1.8 MAR 3>2.0 APR 3>1.9 MAY 3>2 JUN 3>2 JUL 3>2 AUG 3>2
DL JFK-RDU APR 4>5 MAY 4>5 JUN 4>5 JUL 4>5 AUG 4>5
*DL LEX-MSP MAY 0.8>0
DL LGA-CLT JUN 7>8 JUL 7>8
DL LGA-ORF MAY 3>4 JUN 3>4 JUL 3>4 AUG 3>4
DL LGA-PWM APR 3>5 MAY 3>5 JUN 3>5 JUL 3>5 AUG 3>5
DL LGA-SDF APR 3>4 MAY 3>4 JUN 3>4 JUL 3>4 AUG 3>4
DL MIA-ATL APR 13>12
*DL SAN-SJD FEB 0.5>0 MAR 1.0>0.4 APR 0.3>0.1 MAY 0.2>0 JUN 0.1>0 JUL 0.1>0 AUG 0.2>0
DL SLC-MCO MAY 1.0>2.0
DL SLC-YVR MAR 1.5>1.1

EI JFK-SNN MAR 0.3>0.5

G4 AZA-FAR MAY 0.6>0.4 AUG 0.6>0.4
G4 AZA-GFK MAY 0.5>0.3 JUN 0.4>0.3 JUL 0.4>0.3 AUG 0.5>0.3
G4 AZA-GTF MAY 0.4>0.3 JUN 0.4>0.3 JUL 0.4>0.3 AUG 0.4>0.3
G4 AZA-MOT MAY 0.6>0.3 JUN 0.6>0.3 JUL 0.6>0.3 AUG 0.6>0.3
G4 AZA-PVU MAY 0.7>0.5 JUN 0.7>0.3 JUL 0.7>0.3 AUG 0.7>0.3
G4 BGR-SFB MAY 0.5>0.3 JUN 0.4>0.3 JUL 0.4>0.3 AUG 0.5>0.3
G4 BLI-PSP JUN 0.8>0.3 JUL 0.9>0.3 AUG 0.9>0.3
G4 CID-PGD MAY 0.3>0.1
G4 ELM-PIE MAY 0.3>0.2 JUN 0.3>0.1 JUL 0.3>0.1 AUG 0.3>0.2
G4 FAR-PIE MAY 0.3>0.0
G4 FSD-LAS MAY 0.4>0.3 JUN 0.4>0.3 JUL 0.4>0.3 AUG 0.5>0.3
G4 FWA-PGD JUN 0.6>0.4
G4 FWA-PIE AUG 0.6>0.4
G4 GFK-SFB MAY 0.3>0.2 JUN 0.3>0.1 JUL 0.3>0.1 AUG 0.3>0.2
G4 GRR-SFB MAY 0.4>0.3 JUN 0.4>0.3 JUL 0.5>0.3 AUG 0.4>0.3
G4 GTF-LAS JUL 0.6>0.4
G4 HNL-LAX JUL 0.4>1.2 AUG 0.5>1.2
G4 IAG-PGD JUN 0.4>0.3 JUL 0.5>0.3 AUG 0.4>0.3
G4 IAG-SFB MAY 0.6>0.3 JUN 0.6>0.3 JUL 0.6>0.3 AUG 0.6>0.3
G4 LAS-MOT MAY 0.5>0.3 JUN 0.6>0.3 JUL 0.6>0.3 AUG 0.6>0.3
G4 LAX-PVU MAY 0.3>0.2 JUN 0.3>0.1 JUL 0.3>0.1 AUG 0.3>0.2
G4 MLI-PGD MAY 0.2>0.0
G4 OAK-PVU JUN 0.3>0.1 JUL 0.3>0.2 AUG 0.3>0.1
G4 PBG-PGD MAY 0.3>0.1
G4 PBG-SFB MAY 0.6>0.4 JUN 0.6>0.3 JUL 0.6>0.3 AUG 0.6>0.3
G4 PIE-SBN MAY 0.5>0.3 JUN 0.4>0.3 JUL 0.4>0.3 AUG 0.5>0.3
G4 SBN-SFB MAY 0.4>0.3 JUN 0.4>0.3 JUL 0.5>0.3 AUG 0.4>0.3

HA LAX-OGG JUN 1.0>1.9 JUL 1.0>2 AUG 1.0>2

J2 JFK-GYD APR 0>0.4 MAY 0>0.4 JUN 0>0.4 JUL 0>0.4 AUG 0>0.5

JJ MCO-GRU APR 1.5>2 MAY 1.6>2 JUN 1.6>2 JUL 1.5>2 AUG 1.6>2

MS JFK-CAI JUN 0.7>1.0 JUL 0.7>1.0 AUG 0.7>1.0

PS JFK-KBP APR 0.7>0.6

SY BOS-MSP MAY 1.6>3

TN LAX-PPT JAN 1.5>1.4 MAR 1.2>1.1

UA DEN-ISN MAY 4>5 JUN 4>5 JUL 4>5 AUG 4>5
UA EWR-AUA AUG 1.6>1.5
UA EWR-SJD AUG 0.4>0.3
*UA EWR-VCE JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0
UA IAD-CDG JUN 1.0>1.9 JUL 1.0>2 AUG 1.0>1.5
UA IAH-BHM MAR 6>5
UA IAH-CHS MAR 1.0>1.9
UA IAH-CLT MAR 5>4
UA IAH-NAS MAY 0.6>1.0
UA IAH-SAT MAR 9>10
UA IAH-SHV APR 4>5
*UA LAX-CLD APR 7>1.3 MAY 7>0 JUN 7>0 JUL 7>0 AUG 7>0
*UA ORD-BIL JUL 0>0.9
*UA ORD-BZN MAY 0>0.8 JUN 0>1.9 JUL 0>2 AUG 0>2
UA ORD-CUN MAY 1.2>1.3
*UA ORD-DUB JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>0.5
*UA ORD-FCA JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0
*UA ORD-JAC JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0
*UA ORD-MSO JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0
UA ORD-RAP JUN 1.0>1.9 JUL 1.0>2 AUG 1.0>2
UA ORD-YQB JUN 1.0>1.9 JUL 1.0>2 AUG 1.0>2
*UA SFO-CEC APR 1.9>0.4 MAY 1.8>0 JUN 1.9>0 JUL 1.9>0 AUG 1.8>0
 
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yellowtail
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:04 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*AV EWR-SAL FEB 0.7>0 MAR 0.7>0 APR 0.7>0 MAY 0.7>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 1.0>0 AUG 1.0>0

I am surprised this took so long to cancel. Loads were horrid most of the time. the O&D to SAL wants JFK and LGA and would rather take a connect in MIA, ATL etc than drive across the hudson.

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL SAN-SJD FEB 0.5>0 MAR 1.0>0.4 APR 0.3>0.1 MAY 0.2>0 JUN 0.1>0 JUL 0.1>0 AUG 0.2>0

Is this hurricane related or is the hurricane an excuse to close a route that wasn't performing.
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
SLCSFOPDX
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:09 pm

Looks like AS is adding two additional flights to SLC, one from SEA and one from PDX. Good to see AS expanding and adding in SLC. I believe they'll be up to fifteen flights next summer at SLC.
 
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enilria
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:19 pm

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 1):
Is this hurricane related or is the hurricane an excuse to close a route that wasn't performing.

It was an oddball, but I'm sure the hurricane is the bulk of the issue.
 
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adamh8297
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:27 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):

SY BOS-MSP MAY 1.6>3

Wow... How much of this is MSP point of sale? I'm not sure if most BOS folks even know SY exists.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
N757ST
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:30 pm

I don't know that the Delta cuts are correct. Those flights are to be taken over by Air Wisconsin and for example ORF-JFK is still bookable in March. Maybe because AWAC is now flying the flights its not coded right?
 
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SANFan
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:33 pm

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 1):
Is this hurricane related or is the hurricane an excuse to close a route that wasn't performing.

I'm wondering the same thing; it's VERY similar to their SAN-HNL experiment a few years ago.

My guess remains that DL grabbed this remaining SAN-SJD authority just so no one else (read: WN) would get it, and maybe, as a bonus, to screw with AS. Now DL will serve the route minimally for just a few months...

Not at all as they had originally scheduled it -- and I don't think the hurricane had anything to do with it. (Unless, as you mention, a handy excuse.)

Quoting SLCSFOPDX (Reply 2):
Looks like AS is adding two additional flights to SLC, one from SEA and one from PDX. Good to see AS expanding and adding in SLC. I believe they'll be up to fifteen flights next summer at SLC.

These 2 new SLC-flights are for a/c positioning -- getting the planes to SLC for OO mx. (They are both flown with the new OO E-175s joining the fleet next summer, as discussed in another thread.)

(And btw, the added SEA-TUS frequency is the same thing: getting the 3rd E-175 to the OO mx base in Arizona for the night.)

bb

[Edited 2014-12-01 12:36:12]
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:33 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
Well, it looks like CVG may be funding the SEA build-up. This is the first pull-back there in a while. Don't they have a flight commitment?
*DL CVG-BWI MAR 3>1.9
*DL CVG-CLT MAR 3>1.8 APR 3>0.9 MAY 3>0.8 JUN 3>1.5 JUL 3>1.7 AUG 3>1.7
*DL CVG-EWR MAR 4>3 JUL 4>3 AUG 4>3
*DL CVG-PHL MAR 4>1.7 APR 4>1.7 MAY 4>1.7 JUN 4>1.7 JUL 4>1.7 AUG 4>1.7
*DL CVG-RDU MAR 3>1.7 APR 3>1.7 MAY 3>1.7 JUN 3>1.7 JUL 3>1.7 AUG 3>1.7
DL DTW-ATW FEB 4>3 MAR 4>3 APR 4>3 MAY 4>3 JUN 4>3
DL DTW-BTV MAR 3>1.9 APR 3>1.9 MAY 3>1.8 JUN 4>3 JUL 4>3 AUG 4>3
DL DTW-CIU JUN 1.9>1.3
DL DTW-GRR MAY 6>7
DL DTW-IAD MAR 4>3
DL DTW-LEX MAY 4>5
DL DTW-MHT MAR 4>3 APR 4>3
DL DTW-PVD APR 4>3
DL DTW-YUL MAR 5>3 APR 5>4 MAY 5>4 JUN 5>4 JUL 5>4 AUG 5>4

This has more to do with the continued draw-down of 50 seat RJs, less than the SEA build-up.

I'd be careful the the short-term as there is a lot of noise in the week to week changes in these regional markets out of DTW, CVG, and JFK. Due in part to the shift of some CRJ-200 flying from 9E to ZW. There may be some noise in how that is getting adjusted. Following some of the markets closely like ERI and SCE have been all over the place with changes in equipment, operating carrier, and frequency week to week as they made system-wide adjustments in 2015.
 
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:36 pm

Quoting N757ST (Reply 5):
I don't know that the Delta cuts are correct. Those flights are to be taken over by Air Wisconsin and for example ORF-JFK is still bookable in March. Maybe because AWAC is now flying the flights its not coded right?

I'm seeing the same thing.....there appears to be a lot of recently loaded ZW flying that is now not making it through, could be a filing error, or not.

We'll have to see what comes through in the electronic timetable push later this week and then what gets loaded for sale over next week.

Either way, there is a lot of noise week to week with the adjustments of operating carriers, equipment, and frequency.
 
Tdan
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:41 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*UA EWR-VCE JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0

Can't believe no one is discussing this as it's a big deal.

Seasonal EWR-VCE has been a no-brainer add that UA (and formerly CO) has resisted since they wanted to fly all US-EUR destinations year-round. If I am not mistaking, this will be their first seasonal destination and if so, it should open up many many more market opportunities such as NCE, ATH, etc.
We will ride this thunderbird, silver shadows on the earth, a thousand leagues away our land of birth... -Captain Bruce
 
uberflieger
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:48 pm

Quoting Tdan (Reply 9):
Can't believe no one is discussing this
UA To Fly EWR-VCE (by CALMSP Nov 24 2014 in Civil Aviation)

 
 
MAH4546
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:51 pm

Quoting Tdan (Reply 9):

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*UA EWR-VCE JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0

Can't believe no one is discussing this as it's a big deal.

It was announced about two weeks ago. It's been discussed at length.
a.
 
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enilria
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 9:03 pm

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 8):
I'm seeing the same thing.....there appears to be a lot of recently loaded ZW flying that is now not making it through, could be a filing error, or not.

We'll have to see what comes through in the electronic timetable push later this week and then what gets loaded for sale over next week.

Either way, there is a lot of noise week to week with the adjustments of operating carriers, equipment, and frequency.

If the flights were sent to OAG at all, the main two problems I have seen that would result in it not showing up are:

1) Submitting a schedule with an equipment type OAG does not consider valid. For example, CR5 isn't valid I don't think so if they used that to denote a configuration difference internally on a CRJ and released it to OAG like that it would not appear in the database.

2) Marking the flight as a duplicate/child code share instead of a primary/parent. There's like 10 code shares on each flight these days. The additional code shares are called "children" or "duplicate" records. It gets confusing with regional affiliates because the primary/parent flight, in this case DL, is also a code share with ZW as the operator.

Having said all of that, these schedules were filed by DL and not ZW so I don't usually expect DL to make those types of filing errors...it was a Holiday though so perhaps the expert was on vacation.

Quoting adamh8297 (Reply 4):
Wow... How much of this is MSP point of sale?

Very high, but i'm sure it is a block of B6.

Quoting SANFan (Reply 6):
Now DL will serve the route minimally for just a few months...

That may have been the goal. They have done that elsewhere, but doesn't the new Mexico bilateral now prevent that tactic?
 
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 9:39 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 12):
f the flights were sent to OAG at all, the main two problems I have seen that would result in it not showing up are:

1) Submitting a schedule with an equipment type OAG does not consider valid. For example, CR5 isn't valid I don't think so if they used that to denote a configuration difference internally on a CRJ and released it to OAG like that it would not appear in the database.

It looks like these ZW flights are showing an equipment type of CRY which would go along with the theory they sent out an internal code that isn't considered valid.
 
Tdan
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 10:28 pm

Quoting uberflieger (Reply 10):
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 11):

Ugh, can't believe I missed it! I'll add to that thread.
We will ride this thunderbird, silver shadows on the earth, a thousand leagues away our land of birth... -Captain Bruce
 
HPRamper
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 10:32 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*AC EWR-YVR MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0 JUL 1.0>0 AUG 1.0>0
*AC JFK-YVR MAY 0>1.0 JUN 0>1.0 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0

This seems strange - shutting off service to a Star hub and starting service to a non-Star hub.

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*UA LAX-CLD APR 7>1.3 MAY 7>0 JUN 7>0 JUL 7>0 AUG 7>0

Was this an E120 route?
 
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AirportRival
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:38 pm

I was just on Delta's website and I didn't notice any reductions to the number flights. All the specified routes above from CVG had the initial number of flights as originally scheduled. I didn't notice any cuts or upgauges.
 
michman
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:46 pm

Quoting AirportRival (Reply 16):
I was just on Delta's website and I didn't notice any reductions to the number flights. All the specified routes above from CVG had the initial number of flights as originally scheduled. I didn't notice any cuts or upgauges.

Looks like it's an OAG mistake. Several flights out of CVG and DTW are transitioning to ZW and they weren't properly picked up. There's no significant reductions.
 
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adamh8297
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:48 pm

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 15):
This seems strange - shutting off service to a Star hub and starting service to a non-Star hub.

Especially with the JV and UA's portfolio of secondary European destinations from EWR.
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nomorerjs
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:20 am

Nice to see some seasonal increases at ORD!
 
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N62NA
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:15 am

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*AC EWR-YVR MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0 JUL 1.0>0 AUG 1.0>0
Quoting HPRamper (Reply 15):

This seems strange - shutting off service to a Star hub and starting service to a non-Star hub.

I used to think so too, but I've been told on here that the EWR hub isn't really a Star Alliance hub, as there are quite a few Star Alliance carriers that DON'T fly to EWR but DO fly to JFK.
 
cessna2
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:15 am

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL JFK-RDU APR 4>5 MAY 4>5 JUN 4>5 JUL 4>5 AUG 4>5

Should see the CVG flights bounce back next week.

Good to see another JFK add. Still not sure about the additional PHL announced last week. But nonetheless slowly building up RDU. Wonder if we will see more routes now that ZW is taking over the 200 flying.
 
Thomaas
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:16 am

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 15):

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*AC EWR-YVR MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0 JUL 1.0>0 AUG 1.0>0
*AC JFK-YVR MAY 0>1.0 JUN 0>1.0 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0

This seems strange - shutting off service to a Star hub and starting service to a non-Star hub.

connecting in EWR from YVR doesn't make much sense. AC's own hub in YYZ can handle the international connection and the rest can be fed through ORD.
 
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N62NA
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:37 am

Quoting Thomaas (Reply 22):
connecting in EWR from YVR doesn't make much sense. AC's own hub in YYZ can handle the international connection and the rest can be fed through ORD.

Which once again underscores the ridiculousness of EWR functioning as a "hub" airport.
 
dtwpilot225
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:52 am

It was just announced today that air Wisconsin will NOT be flying for delta anymore, not sure if the planes are staying with 9e but that could contribute to what's going on with the schedules
 
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AVLAirlineFreq
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:56 am

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL LEX-MSP MAY 0.8>0

I'm surprised this flight has lasted this long.

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL DTW-LEX MAY 4>5

I'm guessing this is added to compensate for the loss of the MSP flight...


...Unless this is another glitch that will be reversed next week.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 4:02 am

Ok, wow. So now the deal for ZW to fly CRJ-200s for Delta is off. So who knows what is going on with the flying, the aircraft, etc. Crazy that they have numerous flights for sale Operated by Air Wisconsin.

The game of musical chairs at the regional carriers continues.

As another poster mentioned on a different forum, "This may be the quickest the DL has screwed a regional partner"

Don't read much into these short term frequency changes week over week on the regional side of the house as they quickly have to add/delete, re-allocate, swap between carriers, and even have mainline step in to cover flying.
 
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 4:41 am

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 1):
Is this hurricane related or is the hurricane an excuse to close a route that wasn't performing.

I would say if Odile didn't hit in mid-September this flight would have continued. Many resorts are still shuttered having been down to SJD barely a month ago myself. SLC-SJD continues 1 per day (5 OO, 2 mainline A320).
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
silentbob
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 5:03 am

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 26):
As another poster mentioned on a different forum, "This may be the quickest the DL has screwed a regional partner"

ZW couldn't staff the aircraft and start when DL wanted. I don't think there was any "screwing" of anyone, it's just the shortage of pilots making things difficult.
 
ericm2031
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 10:11 am

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 15):

Yes it was an E120 route.
 
dtwpilot225
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 12:04 pm

Delta runs a fine operation, but I think this may cause them to take a look at what is going on with their feeders. Basically they can't staff their planes at their own wholly owned regional so they attempted to transfer them to the highest costing regional out there and i think Air Wisconsin saw the writing on the wall that it may end up hurting them long term and they backed out. This is only my opinion of what happened, not fact. I bet we see Express Jet back into the picture now soon.
 
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jfklganyc
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:15 pm

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 15):
This seems strange - shutting off service to a Star hub and starting service to a non-Star hub.

JFK is the preferred airport for a long haul transcon like this. They must not be getting many connectors via EWR and UA and decided to focus solely on O and D from JFK.
 
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enilria
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:05 pm

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 13):
It looks like these ZW flights are showing an equipment type of CRY which would go along with the theory they sent out an internal code that isn't considered valid.
Quoting AirportRival (Reply 16):

I was just on Delta's website and I didn't notice any reductions to the number flights. All the specified routes above from CVG had the initial number of flights as originally scheduled. I didn't notice any cuts or upgauges.
Quoting michman (Reply 17):
Looks like it's an OAG mistake.

If they posted as a CRY then it's DL's mistake and not OAG, but...

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 26):
Ok, wow. So now the deal for ZW to fly CRJ-200s for Delta is off.
Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 26):
As another poster mentioned on a different forum, "This may be the quickest the DL has screwed a regional partner"

Don't read much into these short term frequency changes week over week on the regional side of the house as they quickly have to add/delete, re-allocate, swap between carriers, and even have mainline step in to cover flying.

...is that confirmed? link? So these cuts are real or not?
 
Rdh3e
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:24 pm

Quoting N62NA (Reply 23):
Which once again underscores the ridiculousness of EWR functioning as a "hub" airport.

It's a great D to I hub. No one ever thought EWR was a great D to D connector. NYC geography is just not good for that.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:27 pm

The short answer: "Who knows"

The long answer:
In November, ZW announced it was awarded flying for DL starting in 2015 as 26 CRJ-200s were to transition from 9E to ZW. The CRJs are leased by DL which were being reallocated to ZW as 9E winds down its CRJ-200 flying, due in part to the fact they are having trouble retaining and hiring enough pilots to operate the aircraft.

DL even went as far as 1-2 weeks ago loading flights for sale as Operated by Air Wisconsin. They are still in fact for sale today on delta.com. These include 50 seat RJ routes out of DTW, CVG, and JFK.

Then suddenly yesterday word comes out that the DL-ZW deal is "off"

Then in the OAG filing as detected yesterday, even before word came out that the DL-ZW deal was off, that there are flight reductions that coorelate exactly with the routes that were to be operated by ZW.

So, it appears to have been a very quick and hastily done schedule adjustment to pull the ZW flights, but they didn't get time to reload and adjust the schedule.

Not sure of the exact timing of the OAG data feed, but the Delta schedule gets pushed out later in the week and then updates on Saturday to reflect any changes in inventory for sale.
 
apodino
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:28 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 32):

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 26):Ok, wow. So now the deal for ZW to fly CRJ-200s for Delta is off. Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 26):As another poster mentioned on a different forum, "This may be the quickest the DL has screwed a regional partner"

Don't read much into these short term frequency changes week over week on the regional side of the house as they quickly have to add/delete, re-allocate, swap between carriers, and even have mainline step in to cover flying.
...is that confirmed? link? So these cuts are real or not?

It's true. There was no official press release or anything but multiple people at ZW have told me that an internal email went out to all employees saying the Delta deal was off and there would be no flying for Delta at Air Wisconsin. Needless to say, the way the Delta deal has been handled, coupled with the bizarre departure of CEO Jim Rankin a few weeks ago, has led to morale being in the absolute toilet at ZW and management looks really bad right now. I feel really bad for the front line employees there who are some of the finest in the business, but it really makes you wonder about the long term viability of the company.
 
Rdh3e
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:40 pm

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 34):
So, it appears to have been a very quick and hastily done schedule adjustment to pull the ZW flights, but they didn't get time to reload and adjust the schedule.

It would actually have been both faster and easier to just assign the flights to 9E as a placeholder until they figured it out. If they pulled the flights because of ZW leaving and didn't put in a placeholder, they are probably gone.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:47 pm

Quoting RDH3E (Reply 36):
It would actually have been both faster and easier to just assign the flights to 9E as a placeholder until they figured it out. If they pulled the flights because of ZW leaving and didn't put in a placeholder, they are probably gone.

Let's just wait and see before we jump to conclusions either way.

We've seen far to many times when there is rapidly changing circumstances when adjustments are being made and/or in process and it gets reflected in the OAG thread and everyone starts shouting from the mountaintops.
 
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enilria
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 8:48 pm

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 34):
So, it appears to have been a very quick and hastily done schedule adjustment to pull the ZW flights, but they didn't get time to reload and adjust the schedule.
Not sure of the exact timing of the OAG data feed, but the Delta schedule gets pushed out later in the week and then updates on Saturday to reflect any changes in inventory for sale.
Quoting RDH3E (Reply 36):
If they pulled the flights because of ZW leaving and didn't put in a placeholder, they are probably gone.
Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 37):
We've seen far to many times when there is rapidly changing circumstances when adjustments are being made and/or in process and it gets reflected in the OAG thread and everyone starts shouting from the mountaintops.

Well, here's why I didn't question it when I posted it. I would assume ZW took over at least some whole markets. Usually you don't want 3 operators operating the 3 flights in a market. It creates an operational pain for the stations. So, the fact we only see frequency cuts...and cuts in markets that we all probably know aren't exactly greatly profitable...makes me lean toward these cuts being real.

Since DL owns the planes and we know Endeavor has a pilot shortage, perhaps what we saw is the planes back to Endeavor and an interim trimming to deal with the pilot shortage. That is what I presently think is the most likely. Those planes used a lot of pilots at Endeavor and when they went away those pilots would not have been utilized fully immediately afterward. So, my guess based upon your info is that those are all the flights Endeavor can get into the air with their pilot expectations and no ZW deal. They just haven't fixed the operated by yet.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 9:25 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 38):
Well, here's why I didn't question it when I posted it. I would assume ZW took over at least some whole markets. Usually you don't want 3 operators operating the 3 flights in a market. It creates an operational pain for the stations. So, the fact we only see frequency cuts...and cuts in markets that we all probably know aren't exactly greatly profitable...makes me lean toward these cuts being real.

You would think, but DL loves adding all sorts of complexity at the DCI stations. There are numerous markets, particularly out of DTW and MSP that may see 3 DCI carriers and even mainline in the mix. Almost every market with more than 3 flights sees at least 2 different connection carriers.

DTW-YUL is currently showing a mix of RP & ZW (was 9E)
CVG-PHL is currently showing a mix of RP, ZW, and 9E

Here are some more fun ones:
DTW-YYZ: 9E, EV, CP

Quoting enilria (Reply 38):
Since DL owns the planes and we know Endeavor has a pilot shortage, perhaps what we saw is the planes back to Endeavor and an interim trimming to deal with the pilot shortage. That is what I presently think is the most likely. Those planes used a lot of pilots at Endeavor and when they went away those pilots would not have been utilized fully immediately afterward. So, my guess based upon your info is that those are all the flights Endeavor can get into the air with their pilot expectations and no ZW deal. They just haven't fixed the operated by yet.

Either way, it will be interesting to see when this settles.
 
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enilria
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Tue Dec 02, 2014 10:22 pm

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 39):
Either way, it will be interesting to see when this settles.

Yes please post or PM
 
PHX787
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:23 am

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
AC CVG-YYZ MAY 1.7>3 JUN 1.7>3 JUL 1.7>3 AUG 1.7>3

This is surprising. Are these still on Jazz CRJs?

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL CVG-CLT MAR 3>1.8 APR 3>0.9 MAY 3>0.8 JUN 3>1.5 JUL 3>1.7 AUG 3>1.7
*DL CVG-EWR MAR 4>3 JUL 4>3 AUG 4>3
*DL CVG-PHL MAR 4>1.7 APR 4>1.7 MAY 4>1.7 JUN 4>1.7 JUL 4>1.7 AUG 4>1.7

These three are hubs that other airlines will probably introduce more flights to.
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AirportRival
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:20 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 41):
This is surprising. Are these still on Jazz CRJs?

Air Georgian flies this route now but yes it is still served by CRJ's
 
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enilria
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:50 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 41):
These three are hubs that other airlines will probably introduce more flights to.

It is hard to believe those cuts are random mistakes. You point out a pattern.
 
flyboy80
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:08 pm

I've noticed DL IND-SLC is gone? has this gone seasonal for Delta?
 
SLCSFOPDX
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Wed Dec 03, 2014 5:31 pm

Quoting flyboy80 (Reply 44):

Yes it has gone seasonal.
 
apodino
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:47 pm

Supposedly the reason the Delta deal with ZW fell through was because DL didn't feel that ZW could adequately staff the planes by the time DL wanted them. IMO Delta created their own problem by starting this whipsawing trend and now it's biting them.
 
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enilria
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Wed Dec 03, 2014 7:22 pm

Quoting apodino (Reply 46):
IMO Delta created their own problem by starting this whipsawing trend and now it's biting them.

Actually in terms of pilot pay this is a good thing. We have established a floor. The problem has always been that pilot and flight attendant jobs were so "sexy" that you could keep paying less and less, but still maintain staffing. Having hit rock bottom and bounced off of it is a great thing for everything but ticket prices...hopefully fuel helps with that. The airlines are not exactly destitute these days. It was time for wages to go up anyway.
 
ordbosewr
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Wed Dec 03, 2014 8:36 pm

Quoting N62NA (Reply 20):
I used to think so too, but I've been told on here that the EWR hub isn't really a Star Alliance hub, as there are quite a few Star Alliance carriers that DON'T fly to EWR but DO fly to JFK.

it is a Star alliance hub in that it is a UA hub, but I guess I don't know what a *A hub really is.

Quoting N62NA (Reply 23):
Which once again underscores the ridiculousness of EWR functioning as a "hub" airport.

I think this is funny. talk to many millions of people that connect through EWR every year

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 31):
JFK is the preferred airport for a long haul transcon like this. They must not be getting many connectors via EWR and UA and decided to focus solely on O and D from JFK.

I find the AC timing of the flights odd, and puts in question the O/D side
EWR to YVR - 6:50pm to 9:30pm arrival
YVR to EWR - 6:15 to 5:30pm arrival

If I was AC, what is the benefit of flying to EWR for connections to UA. Why not route those to YYZ and stay on AC.
The timings seem to be to the UA European bank, but that can be serviced by other AC hubs rather than flying a long-thin route.
The westbound segment is timed to Asia. Why would a UA customer fly through YVR vs other UA hubs to Asia.
 
Rdh3e
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RE: OAG Changes 12/5/2014: AC/AS/DL/UA

Wed Dec 03, 2014 9:01 pm

Quoting ordbosewr (Reply 48):
rather than flying a long-thin route.

It's not exactly "thin". EWR and JFK both have more than 100 PDEW and LGA adds a few more as well. The NYC total market size is somewhere around 250 PDEW.

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