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MDW22L31C
Topic Author
Posts: 246
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2005 7:03 am

UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sat Dec 20, 2014 11:36 pm

It looks like UPS is running 757 & 767s into RIV daily for the holidays. I'm surprised since ONT is so cloce.
 
wnflyguy
Posts: 1846
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RE: UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sat Dec 20, 2014 11:43 pm

Actually RIV has offered UPS a good deal on landing fees and space to build a major western processing and shipping center.
Last thing I have heard 90% of their ONT operations would relocate if a deal is made.
Flyguy
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
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william
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RE: UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sun Dec 21, 2014 1:17 am

How big of an operation does UPS have at Ontario? ONT can not catch a break.
 
N747PE
Posts: 82
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2005 9:47 pm

RE: UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sun Dec 21, 2014 2:09 am

ABX used to have a sort center at RIV after DHL closed down the sort center in FAT.
 
COSPN
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RE: UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sun Dec 21, 2014 3:22 am

ONT is owned by LAX so may be a take it or leave it type operation where as RIV could probally be much cheaper on rent and landing fees because they don't have the huge debt payments LAX has
 
Jetfixr757
Posts: 138
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2006 9:16 am

RE: UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sun Dec 21, 2014 3:23 am

That's the western air hub for UPS!!!
Jet
 
Jetfixr757
Posts: 138
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2006 9:16 am

RE: UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sun Dec 21, 2014 3:29 am

Wow, looks to be only another 15 mins south east on the 215. For years they were killing ups with tax on spare parts that were held in stock like engines and such it was expensive.
 
N1120A
Posts: 26560
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RE: UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sun Dec 21, 2014 3:46 am

Quoting william (Reply 2):

How big of an operation does UPS have at Ontario? ONT can not catch a break.

Very big, and has been there as long as I can remember.

Quoting COSPN (Reply 4):

ONT is owned by LAX so may be a take it or leave it type operation where as RIV could probally be much cheaper on rent and landing fees because they don't have the huge debt payments LAX has

ONT is owned by the City of Los Angeles, which operates it though LAWA. UPS is huge there, so I don't see LAWA screwing that up.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
fxra
Posts: 600
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RE: UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sun Dec 21, 2014 12:46 pm

Probably looking for some leverage to use at KONT to get some fee relief. Operationally, moving a hub from an airport with 2 runways with instrument approaches to both of them (one CAT 3) to a single runway field with one Cat ! approach to one end... (OK, there is a GPS to the other end but the 757s can't use that)... That's operationally a bad decision....

Then again being a trucking company running an airline it's probably about highway access more than anything.
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strfyr51
Posts: 4851
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:04 pm

RE: UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sun Dec 21, 2014 1:45 pm

could it ALSO be that Ontario is operated by Los Angeles World Airports (LAWA) have a thing to do with this. March is operated by San Bernadino County. Thus might have Less of a tax Bite to UPS.
 
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ramprat74
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RE: UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:05 pm

March is in Riverside County. I remember as a kid growing up in the IE and traveling out of ONT. I always saw the UPS 747's sitting on the ramp where the International terminal sits now. It looks like they have 18 parking positions on their ramp. They could build a new ramp to the west but that land is owned by some farmer. You have to remember that their sorting facility is located on the other side of Jurupa St. They have their own bridge from their current ramp to this facility.

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echster
Posts: 399
Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2004 4:01 pm

RE: UPS Using March Air Force Base

Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:06 pm

Holiday overflow. Nothing more, nothing less. The last scheduled flight is the morning of 24 December. The reason, largely, is Amazon built a massive warehouse just a few miles ESE of the airfield.

RIV on the civilian side is run by the March Joint Powers Authority, which would be the County and City of Riverside and the Cities of Moreno Valley and Perris. The JPA exists as a result of BRAC downsizing RIV from an active duty AFB to an Air Reserve Base. The JPA does have some room east of the approach end of Runway 32 and immediately south of the March Museum along the 215 Freeway (at Van Buren).

RIV does only have a Cat I ILS to one runway, but it had Cat II a few years go. The Air Force replaced all of the airfield lighting and the JPA decided against funding the Cat II center line lights. The Air Force has no requirement for Cat II at RIV, so they weren't paying. Requesting the FAA fund Cat II or III for RIV civilian operations would be a logical step for any move.

Moving from ONT to RIV, in my opinion, has benefits and negatives. I'm not smart enough to perform the business case, however. For example, civilian operations are limited at RIV to less than 25,000 operations due to the State Implementation Plan when the Base was reviewed under BRAC. That would be less than 12,500 aircraft in/out in a year. Now, the JPA could possibly go to the Air Force and ask to buy some of their operations, but I'm not sure they would do that. They could also pay for a full EIR to increase the operations. Another hurdle, and this may be crazy to some, is DHL still owns the hangar they built at RIV. There is no way, IMO, they would allow UPS to use it. Heck, they probably wouldn't even sell it. I think that was a 30 year deal, so they have another 20 or so years left.

As far as the money side is concerned, RIV is way, way, way cheaper than ONT. There is a Joint Use Agreement between the Air Force and the JPA, but I cannot recall the exact terms. As for landing fees, I believe it is a one-time annual payment due in January for $10,000 that covers all aircraft below 40,000 pounds. For aircraft above 40,000 pounds, the fee owed to the Air Force is $0.25 per 1,000 pounds over the base 40,000 pound figure. There are probably fuel flowage fees and parking fees, but I'm not at all sure. Again, I think those are close. Outside of that, they would probably have to reimburse the Air Force for personnel costs to staff the airfield after their normal closing hours. That looks to be from 2300-0700. The Joint Use Agreement is probably available via FOIA if anyone were interested.

http://www.marchjpa.com/airport.shtml

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