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speedbored
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 11:58 am

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 44):
But why suddenly do the undisclosed appear in December when they haven't done it before?

It is not Airbus who decide that an order will be "undisclosed"; it is the customer.
 
fcogafa
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:05 pm

So the fact that these orders coincidentally pushes the total just above Boeings doesn't seem suspicious to you all?
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:10 pm

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 51):
So the fact that these orders coincidentally pushes the total just above Boeings doesn't seem suspicious to you all?

We could also revert the question: does 659 unidentified 737 737Max look suspicious to you?  
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speedbored
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:13 pm

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 51):
So the fact that these orders coincidentally pushes the total just above Boeings doesn't seem suspicious to you all?

And they somehow manage to do the same suspicious manipulation EVERY year. Must be magic.
 
travelhound
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:14 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 40):
Only if they're prepared to completely ignore the fact that around 43% of Boeing's entire order book for 2014 was "undisclosed". Leahy clearly doesn't like it, but it is what it is.

I think we can safely assume the good majority of these are for Chinese airlines.

Boeing announce unidentified orders all the time. What's the big deal?

Do we have a total breakdown as yet. From what I have read Airbus had cancellations around the 400 aircraft mark!
 
Asiaflyer
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:17 pm

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 44):
He did sound embarrassed to have to explain the order jump. But why suddenly do the undisclosed appear in December when they haven't done it before?

Any corporation tries to sell as much as possible. Thats what business is about. Why should Airbus be embarresed that they managed to sell this many aircrafts? They should be and they are proud. Whats the big issue with this?
 
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Ab345
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:17 pm

1796 gross 1456 net so 340 cancellations
 
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moo
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:19 pm

Quoting speedbored (Reply 53):
And they somehow manage to do the same suspicious manipulation EVERY year. Must be magic.

While still passing internationally recognised financial audits and posting a profit. Must be *black* magic...
 
fcogafa
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:23 pm

I just think it is a sales race that Airbus likes winning, and if that means using creative accounting and saving up orders to the last moment, they will do it. Nothing illegal in it, but companies do it all the time to make themselves look better or beat the competition.

For example, in the conference Leahy said that since 2006 they have beaten Boeing on widebody orders. As was stated on this list recently, that starting date excludes early B787 orders. It is like Boeing saying that since the B737MAX was offered they had outsold the NEO (maybe not now though). They all do it.
 
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:29 pm

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 51):
So the fact that these orders coincidentally pushes the total just above Boeings doesn't seem suspicious to you all?

It would if you, or anyone for that matter, can provide one shred of evidence that would bring into question any of the orders booked by Airbus in 2014. Reuters reported that Airbus had beaten Boeing on orders as soon as Boeing's numbers were available.

Frankly, I find it hilarious that so many people get so bent out of shape every time Airbus has the temerity to sell more planes than Boeing in a year.   

Quoting speedbored (Reply 53):
And they somehow manage to do the same suspicious manipulation EVERY year. Must be magic.

EVERY year? The magic failed to work in 2006, 2007 and 2012 and Airbus clearly didn't have a good supply of magic before 2000.   
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Ab345
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:29 pm

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 58):
They all do it

Your reasoning is sound and yes that is what they do what there is a difference here. A calendar year is something both have to agree on. Counting from January 1st to December 31st each has to announce the orders that were booked. If one company counted from February to January for example yes that could be viewed as a manipulation of facts but saying that for 2014 Airbus sold more planes (even suffering the extremely embarassing EK 350 cancellation, the Skymark A380 incident and Boeing launching the 777X with 250 orders) is a fact. End of story  
 
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speedbored
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:29 pm

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 58):
I just think it is a sales race that Airbus likes winning, and if that means using creative accounting and saving up orders to the last moment, they will do it. Nothing illegal in it, but companies do it all the time to make themselves look better or beat the competition.

Then please do enlighten us as to exactly how you think Airbus are managing to "creatively" magic up these additional orders every year without the auditors managing to notice the deceit. These are real orders from real airlines with real contracts and real deposits being paid. Airbus simply could not make them up.

Unless of course JL has recruited Harry Potter to his team now that he has finished making movies.
 
astuteman
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:32 pm

Quoting PM (Reply 29):
Six (6!) unidentified A320 customers (not five as Airbus claim) for 214 planes (!!!) in December?

Very un-Airbus.

Perhaps. But it's absolutely no grounds for a conspiracy theory is it, given that the inevitable response to any critics of Airbus making the point would be:-

Quoting Scrimbl (Reply 40):
Only if they're prepared to completely ignore the fact that around 43% of Boeing's entire order book for 2014 was "undisclosed".

Which is so obvious I'd be astonished if anyone would be stupid enough to make an issue out of it.

[quote =fcogafa,reply=51]So the fact that these orders coincidentally pushes the total just above Boeings doesn't seem suspicious to you all? [/quote]

then again there's always one, isn't there ... and on cue, the reply becomes.. ..

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 52):
We could also revert the question: does 659 unidentified 737 737Max look suspicious to you?

hopefully we're done with this one now..

Quoting Travelhound (Reply 54):
Do we have a total breakdown as yet. From what I have read Airbus had cancellations around the 400 aircraft mark!

There have been a lot. clearly the 70xA350 feature large in that. It's worth noting that a lot of the "cancellations" are actually conversions, particularly in the narrowbody space. I believe AirAsia's 55 x A330NEO order may have come complete with a 20 x A330CEO "cancellation" - i.e. they converted 20 CEO's to NEO's.

Nearly 3000 net orders for 2014.....   

Rgds
 
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:33 pm

Quoting Ab345 (Reply 56):
1796 gross 1456 net so 340 cancellations

100 of those cancellations were A32x ceo to neo conversions.
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:39 pm

Regarding deliveries, A321 output increased significantly:

2013
A318: 1
A319: 38
A320: 352
A321: 102

2014
318: 0
319: 34
320: 306 (-13.07%)
321: 150 ( +47.06%)
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Ab345
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:43 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 64):

The 321 has become a force to be reckoned with and thankfully Airbus has been following the market demand on this. Karel do you see 1.000 orders for the 321 before EIS or even testing?  
 
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BobMUC
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:01 pm

Presentations from Press Conference now online:

http://www.airbus.com/presscentre/pressroom/presentations-speeches/
 
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BaconButty
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:05 pm

Just knocked up this chart which may be of interest - it's the proportions of A320 family members delivered over time. The trend towards the larger members of the family is pretty distinct from 2005 on.
Down with that sort of thing!
 
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:18 pm

So can we have a breakdown of models of the total orders and cancelations of the year for both companies? There are many who believe the Max 8 beats the A320neo (some use strong terms), and I would like to see if this past year such thing happened. Hopefully for those who support that claim it is true, but if not, I do wonder what will fanboys do if they have to wait another twelve months trying to make an excuse.. Nevermind, I guess they'll use Randy's same rhetoric speech.
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:31 pm

Quoting atnight (Reply 68):
Max 8 beats the A320neo

In absolute numbers that is only wishful thinking from Boeing. The tag line is that "For the amount of time that both of them have been on offer, the MAX8 is outselling the 320". Personally I hate this kind of thinking and practically only kinda "works" in aircraft of extremely similar capabilities. But again if you exclude the MAX7 that has about 20 orders more than the 319neo, the rest of the MAXfamily is second fiddle to the neo in terms of pure sales.

Not to mention that we can use the above argument in the reverse and say that for the amount of time that the 339 and the 789 have been on sale the 339 has outsold the Dreamliner 3 to 1 in net orders, which is ridiculous. So why don't we stay at pure numbers when conditions surely allow it  
 
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:40 pm

Quoting Ab345 (Reply 69):
The tag line is that "For the amount of time that both of them have been on offer, the MAX8 is outselling the 320"

Wasnt that debunked up-thread?
 
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Ab345
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:40 pm

So for this year:

Airbus
Gross: 1.796
Net: 1.456
Total backlog: 6.386

Boeing
Gross: 1.550
Net: 1.432
Total backlog: 5.789
 
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EPA001
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:48 pm

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 58):
I just think it is a sales race that Airbus likes winning, and if that means using creative accounting and saving up orders to the last moment, they will do it. Nothing illegal in it, but companies do it all the time to make themselves look better or beat the competition.

Boeing would like to win that race just as eagerly. You have not replied on the remarks below:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 52):
We could also revert the question: does 659 unidentified 737 737Max look suspicious to you?  
Quoting EPA001 (Reply 34):
Quoting tommy1808 (Reply 18):
signed, legally binding, downpayments made and externally audited orders

An man in his position can not make a statement like this if it would be incorrect. The number of orders for undisclosed customers is still lower than at Boeing btw.

So where is the "creative accounting" you seem to stumble over in Airbus numbers where Boeing has a much larger amount of these undisclosed customers?

Quoting speedbored (Reply 50):
It is not Airbus who decide that an order will be "undisclosed"; it is the customer.

Indeed. The customers determine when these orders will be made fully public instead of them being "undisclosed" as they are now at Airbus and Boeing.
 
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:51 pm

Quoting Asiaflyer (Reply 55):
Any corporation tries to sell as much as possible. Thats what business is about. Why should Airbus be embarresed that they managed to sell this many aircrafts? They should be and they are proud. Whats the big issue with this?

They should be embarrassed at 340 cancellations in one year.

Points of observation:

1) Although close on gross orders, the Boeing 2014 order book is substantially higher in value. 23% of the B orders were wide body vs 8% for A ( I don't count the Amedeo order)

2) On deliveries as well B delivered a lot more aircraft but also at a much higher value - 49% widebody vs 23% for B

3) Airbus appears to have a higher cancellation rate.

Summary - A Boeing sales unit is larger and of a higher value than Airbus and Boeing is currently delivering more of those sales units.

Orders are orders but a delivery and aircraft size cannot be argued.
 
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:53 pm

Question.....

I see 7 A380 cancellations on the Airbus website. I know 6 are Skymark, what is the 7th?
 
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:56 pm

Quoting racercoup (Reply 74):
Question.....

I see 7 A380 cancellations on the Airbus website. I know 6 are Skymark, what is the 7th?

That's what I asked above as well. India1 thinks it might be the VVIP A 380 MSN 002 (see reply 12 and 13)
 
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EPA001
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:56 pm

Quoting racercoup (Reply 73):
They should be embarrassed at 340 cancellations in one year.

Quite a number of them were however converted into A320-neo orders. Meaning 1 new order for every cancellation. The big hit was the A350 being cancelled by EK but that was part of the deal for 50 additional A380's a couple of months earlier. And for which the numbers are taken into the 2013 order account.
 
Asiaflyer
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:01 pm

Quoting racercoup (Reply 73):
They should be embarrassed at 340 cancellations in one year.

Not embarrassed but of course disappointed when clients cancels orders.
The point with the initial sales contract was of course to deliver the contracted goods and collect the money from the clients.
No difference there comparing to sell tailormade shirts or potatoes.

For the rest, I have absolutely no interest in the A vs B war which I think is totally naive and annoying.
Each company do as good as they can.  
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:11 pm

Quoting racercoup (Reply 73):
3) Airbus appears to have a higher cancellation rate.

Oddly enough, 2013 was exactly the opposite. It seems both OEM's are cleaning up their backlogs.

Quoting racercoup (Reply 73):
They should be embarrassed at 340 cancellations in one year.
Quoting Asiaflyer (Reply 77):
Not embarrassed but of course disappointed when clients cancels orders.

The cancellation number also includes A320ceo to A320neo conversions.
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
Alfons
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:12 pm

Where did I displaced the darn popcorn?...
 
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speedbored
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:15 pm

Quoting racercoup (Reply 73):
Points of observation:

1) Although close on gross orders, the Boeing 2014 order book is substantially higher in value. 23% of the B orders were wide body vs 8% for A ( I don't count the Amedeo order)

2) On deliveries as well B delivered a lot more aircraft but also at a much higher value - 49% widebody vs 23% for B

3) Airbus appears to have a higher cancellation rate.

Points of observation:
Your points would be far more effective if you didn't attempt to manipulate things by omitting orders that are inconvenient to your agenda
List price value is a meaningless comparison (a) because no aircraft are actually sold at list prices and (b) what really matters is profit and we have no way of getting those numbers.
Despite the higher cancellation rate, Airbus still manage to have the higher net order figure. Clearly, those cancellations really aren't hurting.
 
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:35 pm

Is there anyone working on a detailed summary of orders of each model?
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BestWestern
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:36 pm

Wow. sourgrapes.

Congrats to Boeing and Airbus for a fantastic year.
Greetings from Hong Kong.... a subsidiary of China Inc.
 
PacificBeach
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:37 pm

This is from wiki:
"In the 10 years from 2004 to 2013, Airbus has received 8,933 orders while delivering 4,824, and Boeing has received 8,428 orders while delivering 4,458"

10 year is a long enough duration to average out individual years. It shows that manipulating orders by concentrating orders in a particular year or adding orders in order to cancel later is total nonsense. Secondly A and B are quite well matched.

Also if I added correctly, widebody deliveries for Boeing in that period are 1104 and for Airbus 1038. Narrowbody deliveries are 3354 for Boeing and 3786 for Airbus. 66 more widebody deliveries for Boeing and 432 more narrowbody for Airbus in that period.
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:40 pm

Quoting atnight (Reply 81):
Is there anyone working on a detailed summary of orders of each model?

The guy behind http://www.pdxlight.com/neomax.htm will update his list shortly.
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
wingman
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:56 pm

Great year for both companies. Airbus just nips Boeing on total order numbers while Boeing crushes on delivery revenue and net new order value. Congratulations to both.
 
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scbriml
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 3:36 pm

Quoting racercoup (Reply 73):
They should be embarrassed at 340 cancellations in one year.

120 of those (over 35%) were ceo to neo conversions (100 x A320 & 20 x A330).

Embarrassed?   
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KarelXWB
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:19 pm

Quoting Ab345 (Reply 71):
Total backlog: 6.386
Quoting Ab345 (Reply 71):
Total backlog: 5.789

Amazing: 10,000 airplanes in backlog from both OEM's.

[Edited 2015-01-13 08:19:43]
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FRNT787
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:22 pm

Quoting racercoup (Reply 73):
They should be embarrassed at 340 cancellations in one year

This is a rather unique year for Airbus in the cancellation department. As mentioned above, much of these are conversions. Airbus is rectifying their order book with their customers to reflect the changed product line over the previous couple of years. Lots of A320 to A320neo orders converted. Same story with a couple of conversions to the A330 and A358 to A330neo conversions. The one major cancellation outright they seemed to suffer was the Emirates A350 order. And that can largely be attributed to the 777X which clearly has EK mission profiles in mind, and fills a need they've wanted addressed for years. Given that EK is reportedly interested in the 787 again, the A330neo could play a role as well there. Periods like this come round for manufacturers time and again as they rework their product offerings.

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 78):
Oddly enough, 2013 was exactly the opposite. It seems both OEM's are cleaning up their backlogs.

Quite right. It seems like solid accounting practices to me. Boeing suffered numerous cancellations in the 787 orderbook and we saw similar cancellation/new order 737Max agreements as well (Southwest comes to mind...I don't think Boeing will ever feel embarrassed about that part of their orderbook)
 
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Stitch
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:26 pm

Quoting moo (Reply 32):
For the conspiracy theorists to be at all correct, they have to throw into doubt the international reputations of two major independent auditors - Ernst & Young Accountants LLP and KPMG Accountants N.V.

*cough* Arthur Anderson and Enron *cough*  

Seriously, I also put no credence into Airbus doing order shenanigans to beat Boeing for orders, especially considering only a.net seems to care about who wins. Investors sure don't, especially when both have strong sales years (as they did this year).

Quoting Ab345 (Reply 47):
Don't the Chinese usually order in "undisclosed" form?

Yes.
 
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 5:59 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 78):
Quoting racercoup (Reply 73):3) Airbus appears to have a higher cancellation rate.

Oddly enough, 2013 was exactly the opposite. It seems both OEM's are cleaning up their backlogs.

Quite true. Sometimes it is quite embarrassing how short people's memory is, when they start doing the blame game . . .

Quoting racercoup (Reply 74):
I see 7 A380 cancellations on the Airbus website. I know 6 are Skymark, what is the 7th?

Does this mean that there are now more A380 white tails than 748 white tails?
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goosebayguy
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:04 pm

Airbus has enough orders now to last 24 years. That's longer than most aircraft fly for. Airlines must be ordering aircraft to replace aircraft still on order otherwise they will never get replacements.
 
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N14AZ
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:11 pm

Right now there are three A380's stored in TLS:
- 2 ex Skymark
- MSN 002 (provided it's true that this one has been cancelled)

Well, not classic white tails. Rather victims of circumstances...

Well, how many 748's? Not my department  
 
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817Dreamliiner
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:21 pm

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 92):
MSN 002 (provided it's true that this one has been cancelled)

Its shown here in the total orders list:

http://i1264.photobucket.com/albums/jj484/817Dreamliiner/Screenshot2015-01-13181619_zps4bb575f8.png

http://www.airbus.com/presscentre/pr...tx_maglisting_pi1%5BdocID%5D=42433

[Edited 2015-01-13 10:31:58]
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LTH
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:27 pm

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 92):
Well, how many 748's?

Depends on how you count them. If you include the ones that are VIP planes getting their interior and the temporarily stored freighters and Intercontinentals we have (I hope its correct):

9 Intercontinentals getting their VIP touches done. The first ones are almost ready for delivery.
2 Intercontinentals in short term storage at Everett, due for Korean Air Lines
1 Intercontinental owned by Boeing which was due to go to LH but its unconfirmed if it will or not.
3 freighters owned by Boeing that don't seem to have a customer yet (LN1437, 1501, 1502).


LTH
 
BiggerJetsPlz
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:28 pm

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 92):
Well, how many 748's? Not my department

3 Freighter (2 Asiana, 1 Atlas) and 1 Intercontinental (Lufthansa) NTUs.

So 4 total. 748 wins!
 
tortugamon
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:33 pm

Impressive 4th/5th quarter for Airbus. I do wonder when they are going to announce a rate increase as I just don't see how they can produce all of these aircraft in a timely manner. A great problem to have! I don't doubt that Boeing thought they had the advantage on early delivery slots for the MAX vs the neo but it does not seem so yet.

So if I am not mistaken the widebody orders in 2014 are: 328 for Boeing and 135 for Airbus in 2014 making the total list price revenue for these orders roughly $233 Billion for Boeing vs $175 Billion for Airbus. Actual revenue is probably closer to half that. Widebody deliveries were 238 for Boeing vs 139 for Airbus.

The difference in deliveries should tighten slightly in 2015 as the 787 growth in deliveries should be insufficient to cover the A350 rate increase.

Impressive years for both OEMs.

tortugamon
 
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moo
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:41 pm

Quoting Stitch (Reply 89):
*cough* Arthur Anderson and Enron *cough*

Cough all you want, but thats precisely why Airbus has two of the four remaining top flight accounting firms independently signing off on their books  
 
astuteman
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RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:54 pm

Quoting racercoup (Reply 73):
1) Although close on gross orders, the Boeing 2014 order book is substantially higher in value. 23% of the B orders were wide body vs 8% for A ( I don't count the Amedeo order)

If you want to be absolutely accurate, Boeing 2014 net orders were worth about $760Bn. Airbus's 2014 net orders were worth about $730Bn.
That means that by value, Boeing secured 51% of the net orders and Airbus secured 49%.
"Substantial" indeed  
thank Goodness for Emirates eh?   

Quoting racercoup (Reply 73):
On deliveries as well B delivered a lot more aircraft but also at a much higher value - 49% widebody vs 23% for B

No argument there. About $115Bn to $84Bn at list

Quoting racercoup (Reply 73):
They should be embarrassed at 340 cancellations in one year.

But Boeing shouldn't be embarrassed that they couldn't win the order race despite 340 cancellation for Airbus?
no. Don't answer that  
Quoting PacificBeach (Reply 83):
This is from wiki:

good post my friend, which nicely shows the balance between the big two

Quoting atnight (Reply 68):
There are many who believe the Max 8 beats the A320neo

The 737-8 MAX has enjoyed a small lead over the A320NEO up to now.

confirmation of the year-end figures gives this:-

"B"737-7 MAX - 65 in 41 months = 1.6 per month
"B"737-8 MAX - 2312 in 41 months = 56.4 per month
"B"737-9 MAX - 286 in 41 months = 7.0 per month

Total = 2663 for 65.0 per month

A319NEO - 49 in 49 months = er, 1?  
A320NEO - 2817 in 49 months = 57.5 per month
A321NEO - 755 in 49 months = 15.4 per months

Total = 3621 for 73.9 per month

which shows that the clear winner is...... the 737-7MAX  .

In all the MAX v NEO "fluff" a little bit of curiosity seems to have dropped off the radar.

The A320CEO sold 310 copies this year vs 204 for the 737NG.   
This is against the recent trend, Which, unsurprisingly, has had the NG leading.
And it means that the A320CEO backlog only went down by 180 this year.
There's still 1 500 to deliver in the backlog which I personally find amazing when Airbus's stated aim is to transition to "All NEO" by 2018 (they don't say when in 2018)

With 200 sales and 1640 backlog, the NG sort of looks where I would expect it to look.
More sales required, but orders still coming in.

The A320CEO backlog?
The very, very best can come up with is 1300 slots, and that assumes 600 a320 deliveries in 2018, and the final A320CEO delivery at end 2018.
nothing says it won't book more orders yet either

rgds
 
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N14AZ
Posts: 4097
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:19 pm

RE: Airbus And Boeing Orders - Part 6

Tue Jan 13, 2015 7:01 pm

Quoting 817Dreamliiner (Reply 93):
Quoting N14AZ (Reply 92): MSN 002 (provided it's true that this one has been cancelled)Its shown here in the total orders list:

Oh, thank you very much. I had asked for confirmation before since I hadn't seen that table - hey, in between I have to work a little bit, just a little bit. So thank you for the confirmation.

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