Hangar Queens

UA735WL · Sun Mar 01, 2015 10:45 pm

It's interesting how certain frames just don't work quite as well as others and seem to go tech more often than their brethren. Anyone here have examples of hangar queens they'd like to share?

I'll start with two that I know of...apparently the original BN's Alexander Calder 722 seemed to spend more time in mx than in the air. Ironically, it ended up being blown up as a setpiece for the film "Bad Boys". Beautiful scheme though. Another one that comes to mind is one of NW's original 320s...I don't know the reg but I believe it was given a rather flattering nickname because of its "exploits"...I've heard "Jeanine, the Airbus from Hell" thrown around here a few times

Anyone else have particularly good examples of these flying lemons?

Jonas

[Edited 2015-03-01 14:48:06]

DocLightning · Sun Mar 01, 2015 11:14 pm

Hangar Queens (by Dc863 Dec 9 2003 in Civil Aviation)?threadid=1294838&searchid=1296086&s=hangar+queens#ID1296086

This thread had such a discussion

UA735WL · Sun Mar 01, 2015 11:20 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 1):

I saw that...thought it might be okay to discuss it again since it's been nearly 12 years.

Jonas

Tan Flyr · Sun Mar 01, 2015 11:40 pm

well..some years back when AA grounded the A300-600 fleet, one of the "unofficial" reasons were that they had become frequent visitors to the hangers at JFK and MIA.
I think the F-100 fleet was right behind the A300-600's in frequency to the hangers for persistent issues.

N415XJ · Mon Mar 02, 2015 12:16 am

A question related to this topic- Say an airline orders 10 737s, and one of those 10 is a particularly bad Hangar Queen. Can the airline 'send it back' for a replacement, or are they pretty much stuck with it once it's delivered?

[Edited 2015-03-01 16:16:44]

MesaFlyGuy · Mon Mar 02, 2015 1:44 am

Quoting UA735WL (Reply 2):

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 1):

I saw that...thought it might be okay to discuss it again since it's been nearly 12 years.

I think it's probably okay

UA444 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 2:35 am

Quoting N415XJ (Reply 4):

I imagine there is some sort of financial compensation from the manufacturer if it doesn't meet stated reliability and performance metrics.

UA735WL · Mon Mar 02, 2015 5:16 am

Quoting N415XJ (Reply 4):

I agree with UA444- if they could prove that the aircraft was defective, they would probably be entitled to compensation, or free or discounted mx to bring it up to operational standards.

In a bit of a broader sense, I've also heard the E-jets can be problematic from a software standpoint...anyone know more?

Jonas

[Edited 2015-03-01 21:19:00]

flynhi808 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 8:23 am

HA's 330's come to mind... The good old 767 always comes to the rescue.

a36001 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 8:29 am

What about VH-NLH? Wasn't it dubbed by the Qantas Jet Base VH-Never Leaves Hanger? Read on this site it wasn't a popular aircraft? It was originally G-BNLH and operated for a while in a hybrid livery
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Craig Murray

jetblastdubai · Mon Mar 02, 2015 8:38 am

There was a rumor floating around the breakrooms at ORD years ago that AA was going to paint their fleet of MD11s blue...like the rest of their ground equipment. I guess the planes had issues.

p201055r · Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:36 am

Was one of Monarch's A300s - G-OZBB maybe - reputedly plagued with reliability problems during its service?

jetblastdubai · Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:46 am

My all-time favorite repair technique:

http://www.engadget.com/2007/09/08/n...sacrifices-two-goats-to-fix-a-757/

hibtastic · Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:51 am

Qatar Dreamliner A7-BCG seems to be a bit of problem child. It appears to have a technical problem regularly, the latest being last week on a service to Vienna. I have also noticed it go tech several times at EDI.

AAMDanny · Mon Mar 02, 2015 12:56 pm

When I worked at CVT when Thomsonfly was there, (TOM) (when it was originally a LCC side company of Britannia) one of the B735's (G-THOB or OB) was often referred to as 'Often Broken' as it was always tech with something wrong with it!

maxpower1954 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 1:35 pm

Quoting UA735WL (Thread starter):
'll start with two that I know of...apparently the original BN's Alexander Calder 722 seemed to spend more time in mx than in the air. Ironically, it ended up being blown up as a setpiece for the film "Bad Boys". Beautiful scheme though.

I flew N408BN from March to June 1986 at World Airways. Everyone knew it was the ex-Calder airplane, and I had read John Nanc's book "Splash of Colors" which went on and on about of what a clunker it was. When I started flying it, I half-expected a wing to fall off. While it was approaching 20 years old and certainly well-used, not once did it have a single mechanical problem on my watch - I checked my logbook. Just another 727.

10 years later I often flew "Christine" the infamous ex-Eastern 757. Other than the time I found a big section of wing-body fairing missing on the walk-around (that flight cancelled) it didn't seem any better or worse than other early 757s we got. Rode hard and put away wet, you might say .

It's more fun for people to assign an airplane a personality; like a ship I guess. I'm only relating my experiences with those two famous "queens".

Russ Farris

bwest · Mon Mar 02, 2015 3:06 pm

Belgian airline Jetairfly (yes, horrible name) used to operate a 767 registered OO-TUC. Because of its many... many... visits to the hangar, crew nicknamed the plane OO-(S)TUC. Besides the reference to the English "stuck", the Dutch word "stuk" means broken. It got replaced by a 787, which also had its fair share of hangar visits already...

CALTECH · Mon Mar 02, 2015 3:14 pm

Quoting N415XJ (Reply 4):
A question related to this topic- Say an airline orders 10 737s, and one of those 10 is a particularly bad Hangar Queen. Can the airline 'send it back' for a replacement, or are they pretty much stuck with it once it's delivered?

The aircraft is kept. Sometimes the problems get worked out, such as a loose or damaged wire, or a weak component was installed. They do come with warranties, especially for certain parts. If there is a systemic problem that is found out after the fleet being in service, sometimes there are compensations.

UA735WL · Mon Mar 02, 2015 3:17 pm

Quoting maxpower1954 (Reply 15):
I flew N408BN from March to June 1986 at World Airways. Everyone knew it was the ex-Calder airplane, and I had read John Nanc's book "Splash of Colors" which went on and on about of what a clunker it was. When I started flying it, I half-expected a wing to fall off. While it was approaching 20 years old and certainly well-used, not once did it have a single mechanical problem on my watch - I checked my logbook. Just another 727.

10 years later I often flew "Christine" the infamous ex-Eastern 757. Other than the time I found a big section of wing-body fairing missing on the walk-around (that flight cancelled) it didn't seem any better or worse than other early 757s we got. Rode hard and put away wet, you might say .

That's really cool...wasn't actually expecting someone who had experience flying those particular aircraft! Any idea how the 757 got the name "Christine"?

Btw, I also enjoyed your contributions to the DC-8 thread a few weeks ago.

Jonas

[Edited 2015-03-02 07:37:41]

UA735WL · Mon Mar 02, 2015 3:30 pm

Quoting CALTECH (Reply 17):
The aircraft is kept. Sometimes the problems get worked out, such as a loose or damaged wire, or a weak component was installed. They do come with warranties, especially for certain parts.

Which parts might those be? I've always wondered which parts on aircraft are replaced most often...if those are what have the warranties.

Jonas

[Edited 2015-03-02 07:35:09]

bennett123 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 3:51 pm

I do not think that G-OZBB was an A300.

Lofty · Mon Mar 02, 2015 3:54 pm

BA / KT had a Tristar BAJ (Bravo Alpha Junk) and B747 MGS (Might go someday) .

They say Alpha Junk felt her days where numbered so she deployed the masks on her last revenue flight, gave the passengers and crew a bit of a surprise as they come over the channel heading for LGW.

[Edited 2015-03-02 07:59:48]

steady eddie · Mon Mar 02, 2015 3:56 pm

BB is / was an A320
there was an article in the press many years back regarding G-MONX serviceability but its was just garbage

A300's NR and NS were often referred to as 'non runner' and ' non starter' but none were particularly worse than any other. They all fell over fairly regularly but thats the nature of the game.

DTWPurserBoy · Mon Mar 02, 2015 4:04 pm

I flew N408BN from September 1974 until May 1982. It was technically not built for Braniff--it was a 727-291 having originally served with Frontier. Braniff employees could never figure out why they chose that particular 727 to have been painted by Calder unless it just happened to be the next one on the schedule to enter the paint shop at DAL. Personally,, I would have picked a brand new ship --during that time period we were buying 727's about as fast as they could get them off the line at Renton.

Braniff pilots used to joke that Boeing must have dropped it on the assembly line as it always flew sideways--it was a very hard airplane to keep in trim.

I would add the two 747's leased from LH--N610BN and N611BN (fondly known as "The Hindenburg" and "Hitler's Revenge.") Both were frequently down for nuisance items like inoperative galley equipment, popping circuit breakers, no movies, broken seats, etc

Northwest had two 747-135's they had purchased from NA--N620US and N621US (known affectionately as "Laverne and Shirley" since NA named all their airplanes after female employees. The biggest problems with those two were weird electrical issues in the cabin and very unreliable lavatories.

32andBelow · Mon Mar 02, 2015 4:35 pm

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 23):
I would add the two 747's leased from LH--N610BN and N611BN (fondly known as "The Hindenburg" and "Hitler's Revenge.")

Thank you, great way to start my Monday morning!

birdbrainz · Mon Mar 02, 2015 4:36 pm

These two might just be tall tales, but for what it's worth...

When United bought Pan Am's Pacific Division, I'm told there were three 747-100s that were nicknamed the "Lemon Sisters" due to all of the write-ups.

I was also told there were some L-1011s in such bad shape (immediately after the purchase) that union pilots refused to even ferry them, and that management pilots had to do it.

bigbird · Mon Mar 02, 2015 4:54 pm

When I worked for DL years ago and we were still operating L-1011s N712DA was the Queen of the hangar.

n901wa · Mon Mar 02, 2015 5:26 pm

Hi bigbird. For us out west Ship 724 was the ground lover. It even fought me when we parked it at Mohave. I guess 781 spent the longest time on our ramp at nbr 3 spot without moving, before being ferried to Lockheed.
When we had the 2 CF-6-80 powered MD-11s one was called Denise and Damien.
Denise the good one and Damien the problem. I don't remember which one was 891 & 892.

northwestEWR · Mon Mar 02, 2015 5:32 pm

Quoting UA735WL (Reply 7):

Quoting N415XJ (Reply 4):

I agree with UA444- if they could prove that the aircraft was defective, they would probably be entitled to compensation, or free or discounted mx to bring it up to operational standards.

In a bit of a broader sense, I've also heard the E-jets can be problematic from a software standpoint...anyone know more?

Jonas

[Edited 2015-03-01 21:19:00]

I've heard the same thing about the Embraer fleet. Seems every time we take a maintenance delay, it's a software or computer problem. Usually not a major issue, but time consuming to do all the resets.

p201055r · Mon Mar 02, 2015 5:57 pm

Quoting bennett123 (Reply 20):

One stands corrected on all issues raised in my post, reply 11, above.
Suggest it be deleted or at least disregarded

readytotaxi · Mon Mar 02, 2015 6:14 pm

Quoting jetblastdubai (Reply 12):

Hang on, I read somewhere that goats are being used to keep the runway area grass down at some airports, own goal?

DTWPurserBoy · Mon Mar 02, 2015 6:18 pm

I have already heard many times that the 767-200 purchased by Delta employees (ship 102) and presently on display at the ATL Museum was known for its fondness for hangar concrete flooring.

CV880 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 6:26 pm

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 31):

I have already heard many times that the 767-200 purchased by Delta employees (ship 102) and presently on display at the ATL Museum was known for its fondness for hangar concrete flooring.

It had it share of mechanicals.

Sparrow787 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 6:36 pm

Cessna 310's are the Hangar Queens of GA, those things are also known for oil leaks.

ckfred · Mon Mar 02, 2015 6:39 pm

Quoting Tan Flyr (Reply 3):
I think the F-100 fleet was right behind the A300-600's in frequency to the hangers for persistent issues.

I was of the opinion that the F100s didn't have a lot of problems (althogh I read somewhere that the plane did have an issue with the lights in the instrument panels failing, and my parents were on a delayed F100 for that very reason), but the problem got to be the lack of spare parts because of the demise of Fokker.

I heard from a friend of flies for AA that one of the DC-10s had a lot more time in the hanger, compared to the rest of the fleet. Supposedly, Douglas workers went on strike while the plane was on the assembly line, and some workers might have done some "modifications" to the wiring before leaving for the picket line. Apparently, that DC-10 had persistant electical issues throughout its time with AA.

flynhi808 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 7:39 pm

Quoting northwestEWR (Reply 28):
I've heard the same thing about the Embraer fleet. Seems every time we take a maintenance delay, it's a software or computer problem. Usually not a major issue, but time consuming to do all the resets.

also reminds me of HA's 330's

LH707330 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 8:45 pm

I've heard that one of the BA 744s, G-BNLB, was nicknamed "bird never left base."

DL_Mech · Mon Mar 02, 2015 9:11 pm

I guess BA runs a poor 747 operation if...

BNLA never leaves the airport,

BNLB never leaves base,

BNLC never leaves Cardiff,

BNLG never leaves Gatwick, the gate or ground,

BNLH never leaves Heathrow

neromancer · Mon Mar 02, 2015 9:22 pm

Quoting northwestEWR (Reply 28):
I've heard the same thing about the Embraer fleet. Seems every time we take a maintenance delay, it's a software or computer problem. Usually not a major issue, but time consuming to do all the resets.

I know when the E-175's and E-190's first entered the fleet with Air Canada they were known as the E-180's because they would taxi out and then need to do a 180 to go back to the gate because of software problems.

I don't think it's still an issue today as I have not heard much about it over the last few years.

greggariouspdx · Mon Mar 02, 2015 10:49 pm

Quoting Tan Flyr (Reply 3):
I think the F-100 fleet was right behind the A300-600's in frequency to the hangers for persistent issues.

AA's F100's were awful - especially those that were reconfigured for the DAL-LAX/LGA/ORD routes. I tried, unsuccessfully, to fly one of these birds no less than 4 times and each time they had a mechanical. The DAL Agents would then give you a voucher for a taxi to DFW.

WesternDC6B · Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:18 pm

Quoting greggariouspdx (Reply 39):
AA's F100's were awful - especially those that were reconfigured for the DAL-LAX/LGA/ORD routes.

How were they re-configured, and how did this contribute to their high failure rate?

UA444 · Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:35 pm

Quoting birdbrainz (Reply 25):

Yes, UA had to spend a considerable amount of time and money bringing the PA fleet up to snuff. DL flat out refused to purchase them at the time. Only after UA had them and fixed them up did DL eventually buy them.

maxpower1954 · Tue Mar 03, 2015 1:11 am

Quoting UA735WL (Reply 18):
That's really cool...wasn't actually expecting someone who had experience flying those particular aircraft! Any idea how the 757 got the name "Christine"?

Btw, I also enjoyed your contributions to the DC-8 thread a few weeks ago.

Thank you, Jonas! As the years go by I appreciate the DC-8 more and more. One of the great airliners in history.

"Christine" was a Stephen King horror novel and movie about demon possessed 1958 Plymouth Fury and the affect on it's teen aged owner. You never knew what that devil car was going to do next!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christine_(1983_film)

777STL · Tue Mar 03, 2015 1:16 am

Quoting jetblastdubai (Reply 10):
There was a rumor floating around the breakrooms at ORD years ago that AA was going to paint their fleet of MD11s blue...like the rest of their ground equipment. I guess the planes had issues.

I've heard that people within the company referred to the MD11s as the "lawn darts" because once they were in the air, you never knew where they were going to land.

Aaron747 · Tue Mar 03, 2015 1:37 am

My flight school had a C172 known for her love of the wrench. Her tail number was 738HY, but she was affectionately known as 'Hotel Cranky'

kgaiflyer · Tue Mar 03, 2015 1:38 am

Quoting UA735WL (Reply 18):
That's really cool...wasn't actually expecting someone who had experience flying those particular aircraft! Any idea how the 757 got the name "Christine"?

After the John Carpenter horror movie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O08w8CegEeg

WesternDC6B · Tue Mar 03, 2015 1:57 am

I would imagine that all those late piston-prop aircraft with the Wright 3360 (?) engines graced the hangars at high intervals.

LH707330 · Tue Mar 03, 2015 3:23 am

Quoting maxpower1954 (Reply 42):
"Christine" was a Stephen King horror novel and movie about demon possessed 1958 Plymouth Fury and the affect on it's teen aged owner. You never knew what that devil car was going to do next!

I've seen the car used in a museum over here, pretty cool.

Quoting WesternDC6B (Reply 46):
I would imagine that all those late piston-prop aircraft with the Wright 3360 (?) engines graced the hangars at high intervals.

"The Connie was the most beautiful trimotor ever designed." A BOAC DC-7C pilot also once referred to the 3350s as "the oil-burning, petrol-cooled, 14-foot windmill." Reportedly they ran out of their oil (56 quarts or gallons per engine, IIRC) before fuel on some trips.

WesternDC6B · Tue Mar 03, 2015 3:33 am

Quoting LH707330 (Reply 47):
"The Connie was the most beautiful trimotor ever designed." A BOAC DC-7C pilot also once referred to the 3350s as "the oil-burning, petrol-cooled, 14-foot windmill." Reportedly they ran out of their oil (56 quarts or gallons per engine, IIRC) before fuel on some trips.

That engine had not exactly stood out as an example of good American design, has it? I guess the only real purpose it served was to tell us that we had taken aero piston engines about as far as they could go.

shaq · Tue Mar 03, 2015 3:41 am

Nobody mentioned the lovely 787?
I really like this aircraft, its curves are sexy but it sure loves the hangar.

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