Australian Aviation Thread Part 119

QF175 · Mon Apr 20, 2015 11:48 am

G'day and welcome to the Australian Aviation Thread Part 199, in the previous thread the following was discussed / announced:

Australian Aviation Thread Part 118

- Alliance Airlines to convert F70 charter flights from Brisbane to Emerald to RPT
- VIPA (Virgin Independent Pilots Association) voices opinion of two-person cockpit rule
- Hong Kong Airlines reportedly planning to operate charter flights to Australia
- ANA Japan still considering launching flights to Australia
- XiamenAir planning to launch Australia services in October 2015 with 787s
- Flight diversions from Sydney due to fog
- Solomon Airlines Sydney flight and future fleet plans
- Polynesian Airlines looking to re-start international flights, effects on Virgin Samoa
- Repatriation flights and the role of Qantas and Virgin Australia
- Australian Air Force
- Last minute airfares
- Industrial action, previous Qantas grounding
- Jetstar A320s with new sharklets
- QantasLink to perform 717 heavy maintenance in Canberra from late 2015
- Australian Government to purchase two more C-17 aircraft taking fleet to 8
- Qantas 747 noted at Domestic terminal in Melbourne
- Air New Zealand to add summer Maroochydore-Auckland flights
- Air Niugini replaces Q400s with F100s on the Cairns-Port Moresby route
- A330 VH-EBA returns to Sydney due to illumination of an indicator light
- Network Aviation new uniform
- Brisbane Airport announces plans for new $20 million Regional Satellite Terminal
- Virgin Australia opens the expanded sections of its Brisbane Lounge
- Possibility of LionAir services to Australia
- Calls for ACCC to reverse draft determination to block Qantas-China Eastern Airlines alliance
- Perth Airport weather and effects on recent JetstarAsia flight from Singapore
- Airnorth releases statement explaining rational behind suspension of Gold Coast flights
- Construction begins on Aviation Australia's new educational campus at Brisbane Airport
- Virgin Australia expands FOC catering to all Domestic Australian flights
- Virgin Australia on-time performance (OTP)
- Plans leaked for second Sydney Airport
- Air New Zealand announces flights from Auckland to Houston, effects on QF DFW flights
- Qatar Airways and request for increased access to Australia
- Former Qantas 747-400 VH-OJA at Wollongong
- Article about Qantas' poor on-time performance for its London flights
- Qantas announces a return to Singapore from Perth, 5x weekly 737s from June 2015
- Perth-Singapore fares launch at $199 o/w, $398 return and $1499 r/t Business Class
- Lack of 737-900ERs in Australia
- Use of Qantas A330s on the golden triangle

Here's to another great thread!

QF175 · Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:14 pm

BRISBANE AIRPORT TO GET PLAZA PREMIUM LOUNGE

Now this is great news...

Source - AusBT

Quote:
Brisbane Airport will gain a new airline-independent lounge later this year with the opening of a Plaza Premium lounge at the international terminal.

The paid-access lounge is aimed at travellers who either lack the frequent flyer status to access their own airline’s lounge, or are flying with an airline which doesn’t have a lounge at Brisbane.

Unlike the company's two Sydney lounges, which are managed by Plaza Premium on behalf of the SkyTeam airline alliance (above) and American Express (below), the Brisbane lounge will be branded as a Plaza Premium property and is expected to welcome Priority Pass members.

Continues...

QANTAS - FLIGHT INCREASES / OPERATING AIRCRAFT CHANGES

Qantas has announced various schedule increases / aircraft changes via the following page:

Melbourne - Coffs Harbour

With effect 5 June 2015, QantasLink will take over the Melbourne-Coffs Harbour route from Qantas. This will see the once-weekly 737-800 (all Economy) replaced with an all Economy 717-200. Additionally flight numbers will change from QF868/869 to QF1570/1571 to reflect the change in operating Airline

Brisbane - Hamilton Island

On 15 August, 19/26/28 September and 5 October 2015 QantasLink will operate additional flights on the Brisbane - Hamilton Island route. The additional flights will be operated by 717-200 aircraft under QF1722/QF1723. Currently QantasLink operates Q400 aircraft on the route a couple of times a week

Sydney - Gold Coast (Coolangatta)

As previously announced QantasLink will commence 717-200 services on the Sydney - Gold Coast route. Services will operate as QF1574/QF1575

Sydney - Christchurch

Between 15 Dec 2015 and 7 Jan 2016 Qantas will operate additional services on the Sydney - Christchurch route. The additional services will operate as QF136/137 with a 737-800 aircraft (Jetconnect operated)

bwwt · Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:18 pm

Quoting QF175 (Reply 1):
BRISBANE AIRPORT TO GET PLAZA PREMIUM LOUNGE

Good news! Where will it be located though?

777Jet · Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:28 pm

There was some nasty weather around Sydney today - it's still wild outside here and there are plenty of trees down... Does anybody know if there were any more delays than usual today at SYD or any interesting diversions?

And on the topic of weather... and Sydney's second airport...

I have heard in the past that fog would be more of an issue in the area where Sydney's second airport is to be built than at SYD; does anybody know if this is correct? If so, will Sydney's second airport be at least CAT II ILS operations capable from the get go?

Also, I wonder if one Sydney airport will be able to take planes due into the other if weather becomes an issue at just one of the airports? Specifically, if the international heavies arriving in SYD in the morning might be diverted out West instead of up to BNE or where ever else in case fog just creates issues at SYD?

RyanairGuru · Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:44 pm

Quoting 777Jet (Reply 3):

From what I saw there was havoc at SYD this morning. My flight from CBR was delayed due to weather, we bumped the entire way from Qqueanbeyan to Balmain, and we then had to wait 25 minutes for an available stand due to everything generally being out of sequence.

777Jet · Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:48 pm

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 4):
From what I saw there was havoc at SYD this morning. My flight from CBR was delayed due to weather, we bumped the entire way from Qqueanbeyan to Balmain, and we then had to wait 25 minutes for an available stand due to everything generally being out of sequence.

Thanks for that info. If there was havoc in the morning and the weather has gotten worse since then I would assume that things might have gone from bad to worse out there...

Today is one day that I'm glad I'm not flying in / out of SYD

IndianicWorld · Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:48 pm

MEL's pax numbers were released today for March.

http://melbourneairport.com.au/news-...esults-for-third-quarter-1684.html

March
International +18%
Domestic. +5%
Total +8%

Q3
International +12%
Domestic. +3%
Total +5%

SYDSpotter · Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:09 pm

Quoting 777Jet (Reply 3):
I have heard in the past that fog would be more of an issue in the area where Sydney's second airport is to be built than at SYD; does anybody know if this is correct? If so, will Sydney's second airport be at least CAT II ILS operations capable from the get go?

Also, I wonder if one Sydney airport will be able to take planes due into the other if weather becomes an issue at just one of the airports? Specifically, if the international heavies arriving in SYD in the morning might be diverted out West instead of up to BNE or where ever else in case fog just creates issues at SYD?

Hmm, there are differences in weather between Sydney's west and the coast, but generally when there is fog in Sydney, the whole Sydney basin is covered in it.
Potentially there may be a situation where planes are diverted from SYD to the 2nd airport, e.g. cross winds at SYD (on the coast) prevent aircraft from landing, but the winds are weaker and/or become headwinds/tailwinds due to the positioning of the runways at SYD (North-South) vs the planned runways at the 2nd airport (which according to the Telegraph will be positioned SW-NE).

QF175 · Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:12 pm

Quoting bwwt (Reply 2):

Quoting QF175 (Reply 1):
BRISBANE AIRPORT TO GET PLAZA PREMIUM LOUNGE

Good news! Where will it be located though?

That's the million dollar question, perhaps more space has become available as part of the Brisbane International Terminal refurbishment due for completion in July?

SKYTRANS

Skytrans is once again gracing Far North Queensland skies, this time with a refreshed brand and under new ownership/management (Peter Collings and Jonathan Thurston, yes the NRL player). Dash 8-100 VH-QQA is currently the airline's sole aircraft and sports the new Skytrans corporate livery:

Image Source

A new corporate website has also been launched per below, however people making bookings for Cape York flights are re-routed to the West Wing Aviation booking engine:

Skytrans

[Edited 2015-04-20 06:16:36]

SYDSpotter · Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:28 pm

Quoting QF175 (Reply 8):
Skytrans is once again gracing Far North Queensland skies, this time with a refreshed brand and under new ownership/management (Peter Collings and Jonathan Thurston, yes the NRL player).

Wow, I knew the top NRL players got paid fairly well (up to ~$1m per season) but owning part of an airline (albeit small) is not exactly a cheap undertaking.

Perhaps the Dash 8 will be chartered by the Nth Qld Cowboys to fly them to their away games

Quoting QF175 (Reply 1):
BRISBANE AIRPORT TO GET PLAZA PREMIUM LOUNGE

Now this is great news...

Any idea's on which airlines will use the Plaza Premium lounge as their offering?

The pay-in lounge concept works well in transit airports (i.e. SIN/HKG/BKK/KUL etc) where passengers have a long layover between connecting flights, but would BNE attract a sufficient number of passengers paying for one-time access given the majority of passengers would be originating in BNE and therefore are likely to minimise their time at the airport before their flights? The Plaza Premium lounges I've been to in Asia are a nice escape from the main terminal but certainly not worth coming to the airport a few hours earlier to enjoy the facilities (and paying for the privilege).

The bulk of their business I guess is going to come from contracts with credit card providers and airlines who don't have any lounges in BNE.

qf002 · Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:36 pm

Quoting 777Jet (Reply 3):
There was some nasty weather around Sydney today - it's still wild outside here and there are plenty of trees down... Does anybody know if there were any more delays than usual today at SYD or any interesting diversions?

This beauty was running a couple of hours late, though I was too scared to get out the car for a better look.

csturdiv · Tue Apr 21, 2015 2:43 am

Quoting 777Jet (Reply 3):
There was some nasty weather around Sydney today - it's still wild outside here and there are plenty of trees down... Does anybody know if there were any more delays than usual today at SYD or any interesting diversions?

Still going strong into Tuesday, it is really windy and rainy here. As I was walking into work today, the office is in Alexandria near SYD, as I was fighting with my umbrella to keep it intact, I was surprised to see Qantas A330 on approach on 16R. Rain is foretasted all of today, tomorrow and Thursday. Hopefully the wind lets up, I have a flight on Thursday on REX.

On a side note, non aviation, due to the wind and the swells they have closed Sydney Harbour and there is a cruise ship outside The Gap waiting to get in. They say it might be out there another 48 hours. I'd hate to be the pax on that ship as it is getting rocked around out there!

allrite · Tue Apr 21, 2015 2:58 am

Quoting csturdiv (Reply 11):
Still going strong into Tuesday, it is really windy and rainy here. As I was walking into work today, the office is in Alexandria near SYD, as I was fighting with my umbrella to keep it intact, I was surprised to see Qantas A330 on approach on 16R. Rain is foretasted all of today, tomorrow and Thursday. Hopefully the wind lets up, I have a flight on Thursday on REX.

I'm under the northern flight path and having fun watching the aircraft on descent into SYD though the windows are a bit smeared with rain and the building creaks.

They seem to be really slow today.

tullamarine · Tue Apr 21, 2015 3:45 am

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 9):
Wow, I knew the top NRL players got paid fairly well (up to ~$1m per season) but owning part of an airline (albeit small) is not exactly a cheap undertaking.

Investing in an airline tends to suggest he is not too fond of his fortune and would be happy to see the back of it.

EK413 · Tue Apr 21, 2015 5:36 am

Quoting QF175 (Thread starter):
G'day and welcome to the Australian Aviation Thread Part 199

Wow, wasn't long ago and we kicked off Pt 118

Quoting QF175 (Reply 1):
Sydney - Gold Coast (Coolangatta)

As previously announced QantasLink will commence 717-200 services on the Sydney - Gold Coast route. Services will operate as QF1574/QF1575

Now this is a very interesting move by QF / Link. Hopefully QFLink will operate alongside mainline QF and continue to provide J/C for business travellers on the route.

Quoting bwwt (Reply 2):
Where will it be located though?

The article isn't clear as to where the lounge will be located but certainly possible due to the terminal refurbishment.

In regards to the Sydney weather and disruptions I noticed SQ was operating from Int. Bay 8 normally allocated to QF US bound services and OneWorld carriers.

EK413

csturdiv · Tue Apr 21, 2015 5:55 am

Quoting qf002 (Reply 10):
This beauty was running a couple of hours late, though I was too scared to get out the car for a better look.

I was out at SYD on Saturday and got some shots of the LA B788 departing. What a difference a few days makes weather wise! I also added a new airline to my own personal photo database, JA when I finally caught them. The one airline I do not think I will ever be able to capture is HA, their timings just do not match up with mine.

TruemanQLD · Tue Apr 21, 2015 6:09 am

Quoting QF175 (Reply 8):
That's the million dollar question, perhaps more space has become available as part of the Brisbane International Terminal refurbishment due for completion in July?

There was talks of something on Level 4, with elevator/escalator access to Level 3 (so still access once cleared security), and I would think this is where it will be. There is currently a lot of empty space up on Level 4 and Level 3 is pretty full as it is.

Nouflyer · Tue Apr 21, 2015 10:08 am

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 9):
would BNE attract a sufficient number of passengers paying for one-time access given the majority of passengers would be originating in BNE and therefore are likely to minimise their time at the airport before their flights?

Have you seen the Qantas Club in the international terminal?

SYDSpotter · Tue Apr 21, 2015 10:23 am

Quoting Nouflyer (Reply 17):
Have you seen the Qantas Club in the international terminal?

No I haven't flown internationally out of BNE before, but the Qantas Club doesn't offer patrons the ability to pay for one time access, Premium Plaza does. So we aren't exactly comparing apples to apples.

EK413 · Tue Apr 21, 2015 1:18 pm

Was about to call it a night but decided I'll check out flight radar as I knew the QF 100 Years Gallipoli Charter was departing tonight. The aircraft B747-438ER VH-OEI was scheduled to depart at 9:50pm, however departed 10:24 more than likely due to the heavy rain Sydney has been experiencing all day.

Question I need to ask would be how does QF schedule in their additional MEL-LAX services & manage to squeeze in charter flights? Is there enough fat in the schedule?

EK413

qf789 · Tue Apr 21, 2015 6:17 pm

Quoting EK413 (Reply 19):
Question I need to ask would be how does QF schedule in their additional MEL-LAX services & manage to squeeze in charter flights? Is there enough fat in the schedule?

I was wondering that too. Does anyone know how full the flight is?

I dropped into the airport to see it come in. Parked at gate 51. This is the A380 gate. Took a picture. Sorry for poor quality, was on my iPhone.

EK413 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 1:32 am

Quoting qf789 (Reply 20):

I'm not sure as to the loads, hopefully someone can provide further details.

In regards to SYD weather MEL & BNE would be a spotters dream today! Melbourne received UA863/839 x 2 B772,
1 x NZ B772 NZ103 (plus scheduled NZ123 B77W) which didn't bother holding opting to operate directly AKL-MEL.
BNE on the other hand received 2 x QF A380's QF8 & QF12, DL17 B77L & VA2 B77W. Would appear the delays continue with several international flights in holding patterns Air Asia X, QF6, TZ2, CI51, DL17, SQ231.

Other news.

Air China plans first class, Boeing 777 on Melbourne-Beijing flights

Melbournians could soon be swanning their way to Beijing in Air China first class, with the airline contemplating a swap from the current A330s – offering business class and economy – to its larger Boeing 777s, complete with first class.
Huang Bo, Chairman of Air China Limited confirmed the plan to Australian Business Traveller, adding that the change would most likely occur during peak travel periods as previously seen with Air China’s Sydney-Beijing flights.
China’s national airline currently serves Beijing from Melbourne via Shanghai but is dropping that connection to go non-stop from June 1, and then ramping up the route from four-times-weekly flights to daily from October 25.
Read more: http://www.ausbt.com.au/air-china-pl...g-777-on-melbourne-beijing-flights

Qantas releases Q Streaming iPhone, iPad app for Boeing 717 trial

Qantas is now beaming movies, TV shows and music over WiFi directly to passengers' iPads and iPhones on selected Boeing 717 flights using its new Q Streaming app, and says an Android app will follow.
The wireless streaming media service has previously relied on a Qantas-owned iPad being loaned to passengers for the duration of the flight, or using the web browser on their own device to tap into the plane's content server.
Read more: http://www.ausbt.com.au/qantas-relea...hone-ipad-app-for-boeing-717-trial

EK413

[Edited 2015-04-21 19:32:52]

tullamarine · Wed Apr 22, 2015 1:58 am

Quoting EK413 (Reply 21):

I'd be guessing that the on-time stats for April for all of the domestics will be pretty dreadful. 2 full days of significant delays at the biggest hub has caused havoc across all their schedules. Now we know what the US airlines feel like when winter strikes in New York or Chicago!!!

qf2220 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 2:43 am

Quoting tullamarine (Reply 22):
Now we know what the US airlines feel like when winter strikes in New York or Chicago!!!

And im sure the US guys on here would probably say that the weather SYD has copped is a fine spring morning to them!!

csturdiv · Wed Apr 22, 2015 4:31 am

Quoting Qf2220 (Reply 23):
And im sure the US guys on here would probably say that the weather SYD has copped is a fine spring morning to them!!

I have never seen a Chicago spring morning like what I have experienced the past 2 1/2 or so days here in SYD and NSW. I am kind of hesitant to say this, but it looks like it has stopped raining finally.

qf002 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 5:11 am

Quoting EK413 (Reply 19):
Question I need to ask would be how does QF schedule in their additional MEL-LAX services & manage to squeeze in charter flights? Is there enough fat in the schedule?

More than enough slack at the moment, though it will be a major issue for them if they do drop back to just the 9 frames as announced (especially given that they already appear to be struggling with the new schedule at LHR).

Quoting csturdiv (Reply 24):
I am kind of hesitant to say this, but it looks like it has stopped raining finally.

There's supposed to be another wave of rain come through overnight, but things should be pretty much back to normal tomorrow.

jrfspa320 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 5:21 am

I think they may need to keep the 2 A330s they were going to return to enable all asian flying to be A330, otherwise there is no way they can reduce to 9 frames..

tullamarine · Wed Apr 22, 2015 5:44 am

Quoting qf002 (Reply 25):
More than enough slack at the moment, though it will be a major issue for them if they do drop back to just the 9 frames as announced (especially given that they already appear to be struggling with the new schedule at LHR).

In addition it appears they may be down 1 A380 following a maintenance incident which will mean it is out of action for 4-6 weeks.

Sydscott · Wed Apr 22, 2015 5:54 am

Quoting qf002 (Reply 25):
There's supposed to be another wave of rain come through overnight, but things should be pretty much back to normal tomorrow.

It's stopped raining. Our office building has views to the East, North and West and I can't see rain anywhere. It's so clear out there, it appears that Sydney has been washed and is fresh again.

Quoting jrfspa320 (Reply 26):
I think they may need to keep the 2 A330s they were going to return to enable all asian flying to be A330, otherwise there is no way they can reduce to 9 frames..

There is still plenty of slack in the A330 fleet and by the time refurbs are done we may see some more regional flying done by A330's anyway. (SYD-HKG, as an example, could easily go twice daily on the A330 rather than the daily 744 etc) But that won't happen until the new suites are all in.

vhebb · Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:09 am

Surely its more beneficial now that the business has turned around for QF to hold onto all 30 A330 rather than reducing the fleet by 2 to 28??

TruemanQLD · Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:13 am

Quoting vhebb (Reply 29):

Surely its more beneficial now that the business has turned around for QF to hold onto all 30 A330 rather than reducing the fleet by 2 to 28??

Aren't these leased? They could be on some bad rates. Also, are we including the few more that are coming over from JQ?

Sydscott · Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:23 am

Quoting TruemanQLD (Reply 30):
Aren't these leased? They could be on some bad rates. Also, are we including the few more that are coming over from JQ?

The 28 includes the Jetstar ones minus the two being returned.

zkncj · Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:38 am

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 18):
No I haven't flown internationally out of BNE before, but the Qantas Club doesn't offer patrons the ability to pay for one time access, Premium Plaza does. So we aren't exactly comparing apples to apples.

NZ also sells access to there lounges, and is opening an New Lounge in BNE this year.

EK413 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:56 am

Quoting qf002 (Reply 25):
More than enough slack at the moment, though it will be a major issue for them if they do drop back to just the 9 frames as announced (especially given that they already appear to be struggling with the new schedule at LHR).

How many B744's are we down to 13 frames?

Quoting tullamarine (Reply 27):
In addition it appears they may be down 1 A380 following a maintenance incident which will mean it is out of action for 4-6 weeks.

Another unplanned grounded? The last A380 gone u/s was VH-OQJ.

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 31):
The 28 includes the Jetstar ones minus the two being returned.

Wasn't the 2 x A332's to be returned on a short term lease / direct result of the B787 delivery delays?

EK413

[Edited 2015-04-22 00:34:52]

qf002 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 7:21 am

Quoting jrfspa320 (Reply 26):
I think they may need to keep the 2 A330s they were going to return to enable all asian flying to be A330, otherwise there is no way they can reduce to 9 frames..

They can fly everything that is currently scheduled with ~24 frames. Add BNE-NRT and you get to 25 frames, which leaves three spares once the refurbishments are completed.

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 28):
It's stopped raining. Our office building has views to the East, North and West and I can't see rain anywhere. It's so clear out there, it appears that Sydney has been washed and is fresh again.

Hopefully it stays that way!

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 28):
But that won't happen until the new suites are all in.

I think they're all supposed to be done by the end of next year? I've said it before, but hopefully we also see more PER-AKL and SYD-CGK/MNL at that stage.

Quoting vhebb (Reply 29):
Surely its more beneficial now that the business has turned around for QF to hold onto all 30 A330 rather than reducing the fleet by 2 to 28??

If they were A333s then I'm sure they would hang onto them (at least until the 787s start arriving), but QF really has very little use for any extra A332s outside domestic. They are not the right aircraft to use to open new routes (ie SYD-PEK/ICN) and the A333 is a far better aircraft for the rest of the existing network (similar trip costs but with 15-20% more seats and more cargo space).

The fact that they are now in the black doesn't mean that the disciplined approach that got them there can go out the window -- if anything, they have to work harder to stick with it.

jrfspa320 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 7:31 am

Quoting qf002 (Reply 34):
similar trip costs but with 15-20% more seats and more cargo space).

Almost wonder why they bothered ordering 332...may as well have gone all 333.

qf002 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 7:37 am

Sorry for the double post.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 33):
How many are we do to presently? 13 frames?

12 now that -OJA is gone.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 33):
Wasn't the 2 x A332's being returned to Airbus on a short term lease due to the B787 delays?

Is it clear which two aircraft will be going yet? I think it's generally assumed that it will be -EBE and -EBF which are July and August 2007 deliveries (so coming up to 8 years in the second half of this year) and still at JQ.

qfvhoqa · Wed Apr 22, 2015 8:07 am

Quoting qf002 (Reply 34):
If they were A333s then I'm sure they would hang onto them (at least until the 787s start arriving), but QF really has very little use for any extra A332s outside domestic. They are not the right aircraft to use to open new routes (ie SYD-PEK/ICN) and the A333 is a far better aircraft for the rest of the existing network (similar trip costs but with 15-20% more seats and more cargo space).

If QF can't fill a daily A333 SYD-MNL/CGK (and I'm guessing they can't as they aren't daily) then there can be a small role for A332s on international. While trip costs may be similar, bringing the service to daily could attract some business pax who need daily flights available.

EK413 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 10:58 am

Quoting qf002 (Reply 34):
The fact that they are now in the black doesn't mean that the disciplined approach that got them there can go out the window -- if anything, they have to work harder to stick with it.

Spot on! Discipline is the key to QF's successful turn around and QF need to stick to the plan.

Quoting jrfspa320 (Reply 35):
Almost wonder why they bothered ordering 332...may as well have gone all 333.

The original order was for the A333's, correct me if I'm wrong but I believe QF found the aircraft difficult to turn around on the domestic triangular routes.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 36):
Is it clear which two aircraft will be going yet?

I don't have a clear indication as to which 2 aircraft will be going but make perfect sense to return the 2007 deliveries.

EK413

SYDSpotter · Wed Apr 22, 2015 11:18 am

Quoting qf002 (Reply 34):
but QF really has very little use for any extra A332s outside domestic. They are not the right aircraft to use to open new routes (ie SYD-PEK/ICN) and the A333 is a far better aircraft for the rest of the existing network (similar trip costs but with 15-20% more seats and more cargo space).

Quoting jrfspa320 (Reply 35):
Almost wonder why they bothered ordering 332...may as well have gone all 333.

Weren't the A332's used for SYD-BOM when QF were still operating the route, the A333's didn't have the legs to do it non-stop (although wasn't there an issue about the floor strength of the A332's that couldn't handle the Skybeds?)
Also the A332's did AKL-LAX for a while, a route where the A333 didn't have a hope of ever operating (range wise).

EK413 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:11 pm

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 39):
Weren't the A332's used for SYD-BOM when QF were still operating the route, the A333's didn't have the legs to do it non-stop (although wasn't there an issue about the floor strength of the A332's that couldn't handle the Skybeds?)

Correct, the A333's didn't have the range to operate SYD-BOM non-stop hence the DRW pit-stop. The service went non-stop with the introduction of VH-EBG,EBH,EBI, & EBL.

In regards to the early birds VH-EBA,EBB,EBC, & EBD I'd say the myth has been put to rest evident -EBA being refitted with the NEW Business Suites.

EK413

qf002 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:47 pm

Quoting jrfspa320 (Reply 35):
Almost wonder why they bothered ordering 332...may as well have gone all 333.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 39):
Weren't the A332's used for SYD-BOM when QF were still operating the route, the A333's didn't have the legs to do it non-stop (although wasn't there an issue about the floor strength of the A332's that couldn't handle the Skybeds?)
Also the A332's did AKL-LAX for a while, a route where the A333 didn't have a hope of ever operating (range wise).

The four international A332s were ordered specifically for SYD-BOM and AKL-LAX (hence the premium heavy configuration). It seemed like a sensible idea at the time ($1.4b profit in 2007-8), but of course we all know how those two routes turned out!

I think the A333s did SYD-BOM nonstop in one direction but had to stop in the other (can't remember which way around it was).

Quoting qfvhoqa (Reply 37):
If QF can't fill a daily A333 SYD-MNL/CGK (and I'm guessing they can't as they aren't daily) then there can be a small role for A332s on international. While trip costs may be similar, bringing the service to daily could attract some business pax who need daily flights available.

I agree -- they definitely have a role (for example they already do SYD-CGK and some SYD-SIN services), but I don't think that it would make sense to substantially expand that role.

In addition to a daily SYD-MNL (and hopefully more PER-AKL!), I think an A332 could make sense on the quieter of two daily A330s on SYD-HKG. We're not going to suddenly see SYD-PEK or SYD-ICN with these spare aircraft that QF will have though.

EK413 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:59 pm

Quoting qf002 (Reply 41):
I think the A333s did SYD-BOM nonstop in one direction but had to stop in the other (can't remember which way around it was).

The stop was on the west bound leg operating QF0123 operating SYD-DRW-BOM & QF0124 non-stop BOM-SYD.

EK413

Bluebird191 · Wed Apr 22, 2015 7:52 pm

Not forgetting the BOM flight ended up being swapped to being a tag on QF51/52 back in the fay when the BNE-SIN sector was seasonally a 744 - when that happened, BNE-SIN was a 744 and SIN-BOM was an A333 (was the aircraft inbound from ADL if memory serves me right).

qfvhoqa · Wed Apr 22, 2015 11:27 pm

Quoting qf002 (Reply 41):
In addition to a daily SYD-MNL (and hopefully more PER-AKL!), I think an A332 could make sense on the quieter of two daily A330s on SYD-HKG. We're not going to suddenly see SYD-PEK or SYD-ICN with these spare aircraft that QF will have though.

I doubt we would see any new service to Asia at all using A330s, even if CGK & MNL are switched to all-A332 and some A333s are able to be freed up.

I'm inclined to agree on SYD-HKG: run a similar schedule to SYD-SIN with morning and afternoon departures ex-SYD, probably with an A332 on the afternoon departure. The former QF87 which was overnight SYD-HKG didn't seem to attract great loads, the very early arrival at HKG killed it unless you were connecting beyond.

EK413 · Thu Apr 23, 2015 2:43 am

Quoting Bluebird191 (Reply 43):
Not forgetting the BOM flight ended up being swapped to being a tag on QF51/52

Quoting qfvhoqa (Reply 44):
I'm inclined to agree on SYD-HKG: run a similar schedule to SYD-SIN with morning and afternoon departures ex-SYD, probably with an A332 on the afternoon departure.

Would this be viable even though QF have scheduled seasonal A380 services during the peak season?

EK413

qfvhoqa · Thu Apr 23, 2015 3:48 am

Quoting EK413 (Reply 45):
Would this be viable even though QF have scheduled seasonal A380 services during the peak season?

I would imagine most of the extra capacity required is for the Y cabin, so 2x daily A330s should suffice. CX have stated that the reason they want more access to SYD is due to demand in Y.

Let's assume that QF would not switch SYD-HKG to A330s until they can reliably send refurbished frames. So 1x A333 & 1x A332 would provide 56J/512Y seats - quite the increase from 1x daily 744 with 56J/40W/275Y or 66J/32W/255Y (with 14F sold as J). The loss of W is not so much of an issue, with QF claiming it doesn't sell on Asian flights.

Nouflyer · Thu Apr 23, 2015 4:57 am

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 18):
No I haven't flown internationally out of BNE before, but the Qantas Club doesn't offer patrons the ability to pay for one time access, Premium Plaza does. So we aren't exactly comparing apples to apples.

Sure, I get that.

The issue/opportunity is simply that the BNE International Qantas Club is so poor - by Qantas' usually excellent standards - that the Plaza Premium lounge is likely to be preferred by passengers eligible for Qantas Club entry who are either Priority Pass or Amex Platinum/Centurion cardholders.

Which, I think, is why it is not simply going to be AMEX-branded.

Qantas have been doing a great job of ensuring that their quality remains very good, especially with a domestic lead over Virgin. From their catering to their iWatch app, they are doing really, really well. Ticking an awful lot of the right boxes.

But the Brisbane international lounge is still an absolute shocker!

Sydscott · Thu Apr 23, 2015 5:20 am

Quoting qfvhoqa (Reply 44):
I doubt we would see any new service to Asia at all using A330s, even if CGK & MNL are switched to all-A332 and some A333s are able to be freed up.

I disagree. I think the cooling off in the domestic market could prompt more deployment of aircraft into the International division. Though I tend to agree that given the current number of A330's a significant number of new routes won't be launched I can see a route like SYD-ICN re-starting along, and I've long agreed with this, making SYD-HKG double daily A330. That along with BNE-NRT, increased PER-AKL and increased SYD-MNL would just about see the A330 fleet fully utilised.

csturdiv · Thu Apr 23, 2015 5:51 am

Today I flew REX out of Sydney to Ballina with a stop in Newcastle. As we taxied to the ramp in Newcastle , I noticed a lot of foam on the tarmac. I was sitting next to the door and overheard the FA talking with somebody at the airport. She said that the fire suppression system in a hangar went off in the middle of the night and layer down a good Base of foam. I heard her say something about a couple A320s and there was a JQ A320 near the foam with an engine cowling off. Not sure if it was related to the hangar issue, but before we left, the A320 was towed to a remote spot, I forgot to look for a reg. I looked on the Newcastle newspaper website but didn't see any mention. I also heard the computers for Virgin Australia were affected by the hangar issue and they and JQ had to manually check in around 400 passengers today.

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