Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
KLM 747-400
Hi am about to fly on KLM 747-400 for the first time from CUR/AMS. I check seat map on seatguru and noticed that they waste so much space on Economy Confort on the right handside of the aircraft putting galleys. Can anybody explain to me why they do that? On the MD11 used to be the same. Imagine paying for a seat in Economy Confort next to the wall of that galley, and having to hear the banging of the trolleys against the wall. Horrible....
The World`s Favorite Airline
RE: KLM 747-400
it is very strange configuration, maybe it has something to be with the Combi planes, they don´t have tail in the galley so they couldn´t fit the galley anywhere else.
I think some of the planes were combi before but have been reconfigure to full pax, but I am sure soon someone will give us a perfect answer.
I think some of the planes were combi before but have been reconfigure to full pax, but I am sure soon someone will give us a perfect answer.
RE: KLM 747-400
TG does something similar with their 744s with the long galley serving both F and lower deck J.
The journey of life is not based on the accomplishments, but the experience.
RE: KLM 747-400
The thread describes the long galley, but what I'm curious about is how cost effective this layout is.
It seems to take up an inordinate amount of cabin space.
It seems to take up an inordinate amount of cabin space.
RE: KLM 747-400
| Quoting AT (Reply 4): The thread describes the long galley, but what I'm curious about is how cost effective this layout is. It seems to take up an inordinate amount of cabin space. |
Because the alternative is to put the galley in the lower cargo hold, which takes up an inordinate amount of revenue cargo space.
People forget how much space FOOD takes up. It's quite a lot!
RE: KLM 747-400
I believe the galley lay out is a throw back to the old KSSU Alliance, with
KLM, SAS, SWISSAIR, UTA. All of their planes were ordered with the same
Galley configs in order to get better pricing from Boeing on a larger order for similar
aircraft.
KLM, SAS, SWISSAIR, UTA. All of their planes were ordered with the same
Galley configs in order to get better pricing from Boeing on a larger order for similar
aircraft.
Cargo doesn't whine, moan, or complain
RE: KLM 747-400
| Quoting ba747 (Thread starter): Hi am about to fly on KLM 747-400 for the first time from CUR/AMS. I check seat map on seatguru and noticed that they waste so much space on Economy Confort on the right handside of the aircraft putting galleys. Can anybody explain to me why they do that? On the MD11 used to be the same. Imagine paying for a seat in Economy Confort next to the wall of that galley, and having to hear the banging of the trolleys against the wall. Horrible.... |
It was a popular option on the 747SP too - Pan Am had it and I recall seeing Iran Air's SP pictures with the same galley set up. I think it allowed for the galley to be serviced faster without interfering with boarding/deplaning of paxs.
In any case, an option back from when airlines could afford to dedicate that much valuable cabin square footage to such considerations. I highly doubt we would see that today on the A380 or the 747-8.
Keep calm and wash your hands.
RE: KLM 747-400
| Quoting AT (Reply 4): The thread describes the long galley, but what I'm curious about is how cost effective this layout is. It seems to take up an inordinate amount of cabin space. |
Have you seen the giant galley in the middle of the front section 77W? Same concept.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
RE: KLM 747-400
There is less galley noise with this configuration because the galley doesn't open onto a passenger area the way a width-ways galley does. Also I like the look of a jumbo with a whole segment between two doors with no windows (otoh some airlines with length-ways galleys have all the windows intact in that section eg TG).
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
-
- Viscount724
- Posts: 19316
- Joined:
RE: KLM 747-400
As already mentioned, several airlines ordered the longitudinal galley on later model 742s and 743s/744s, also as already mentioned on some SPs, including Pan Am's.
I've sat in that cabin several times on KLM and there is no noise issue. It was business class at one time, then Y class and now economy comfort (Y seats with a few more inches seat pitch).
They needed a bigger galley originally as they still offered first class service then. Had they already dropped F class when the aircraft were ordered (also the MD-11s) the galley configuration would probably have been different.
I've sat in that cabin several times on KLM and there is no noise issue. It was business class at one time, then Y class and now economy comfort (Y seats with a few more inches seat pitch).
They needed a bigger galley originally as they still offered first class service then. Had they already dropped F class when the aircraft were ordered (also the MD-11s) the galley configuration would probably have been different.
RE: KLM 747-400
The KLM B744 galley configuration is a very deliberate and considered decision resulting from collaborative decision making by multiple internal departments: Flight Ops., Engineering, Cabin design, Network design/economics and Cargo.
It was a standard Boeing galley option selected by multiple carriers for its positive impact on cabin flexibility, passenger comfort, economic benefit.
The design is based on:
- F Class cabin up front
- C Clas cabin zone 2
- A centralised forward galley for volume, cabin service efficiency, passenger comfort, weight and balance.
the most important factor was:
- Weight and Balance in B744 Combi aircraft.
- Fleet standardisation across B744 Full-pax and Combi.
By putting more galley weight in front on the main-deck, more cargo weight could be loaded in the rear main-deck.
The same was true for MD11.
An aircraft that suffered weight and balance issues, but not at KLM due to the extensive forward galley design.
Well........this cabin happens to be the favourite seating area of many (very) frequent flyers, as it is quiet, secluded, personal. It used to be dedicated to C Class when the aircraft were delivered.
If you are flying economy, you should certainly book a seat here.
It was a standard Boeing galley option selected by multiple carriers for its positive impact on cabin flexibility, passenger comfort, economic benefit.
The design is based on:
- F Class cabin up front
- C Clas cabin zone 2
- A centralised forward galley for volume, cabin service efficiency, passenger comfort, weight and balance.
the most important factor was:
- Weight and Balance in B744 Combi aircraft.
- Fleet standardisation across B744 Full-pax and Combi.
By putting more galley weight in front on the main-deck, more cargo weight could be loaded in the rear main-deck.
The same was true for MD11.
An aircraft that suffered weight and balance issues, but not at KLM due to the extensive forward galley design.
| Quoting ba747 (Thread starter): I check seat map on seatguru and noticed that they waste so much space on Economy Confort on the right handside of the aircraft putting galleys. |
Well........this cabin happens to be the favourite seating area of many (very) frequent flyers, as it is quiet, secluded, personal. It used to be dedicated to C Class when the aircraft were delivered.
If you are flying economy, you should certainly book a seat here.
-
- 747classic
- Posts: 3587
- Joined:
RE: KLM 747-400
The longitudinal fwd galley was introduced on (some) 747SP aircraft.
KLM adopted this galley configuration with the delivery of the first 747combi (PH-BUH) in 1975.
KLM 747 fwd galley configurations :
1970-1979/80 : PH-BUA/UG, normal Boeing galleys.
1975 : PH-BUH, introduction (factory installed) original (SP style) short longitudinal galley.
1975-1986 : PH-BUH/UT (short upperdeck) short longitudinal galley installed
1979/80-1991 : PH-BUA/UG , 32 seat upperdeck modification , short longitudinal galley installed.(for standarization)
1983 :PH-BUU, first 747-306 , introduction (factory installed) increased length longitudinal galley.
1983-2004 : 747-306, PH-BUU/W factory installed increased length longitudinal galley
1984/85-2004 : SUD modification of PH-BUH/UT, including modification to increased length longitudinal galley.
1989 until now : 747-406 PH-BFA-BFY, factory equipped with slightly modified increased length longitudinal galley.
Presently the cabin next to the longitudinal galley is "comfort economy "with a slightly increased pitch for more leg room.
The best economy seats on the plane are the rows (twin seating) next to the partition wall, the very best are the two forward seats. (11D -11E), with even more leg room.
[Edited 2015-05-01 06:29:18]
KLM adopted this galley configuration with the delivery of the first 747combi (PH-BUH) in 1975.
KLM 747 fwd galley configurations :
1970-1979/80 : PH-BUA/UG, normal Boeing galleys.
 |
| KLM 747 cabin plan 1973 |
1975 : PH-BUH, introduction (factory installed) original (SP style) short longitudinal galley.
1975-1986 : PH-BUH/UT (short upperdeck) short longitudinal galley installed
1979/80-1991 : PH-BUA/UG , 32 seat upperdeck modification , short longitudinal galley installed.(for standarization)
1983 :PH-BUU, first 747-306 , introduction (factory installed) increased length longitudinal galley.
1983-2004 : 747-306, PH-BUU/W factory installed increased length longitudinal galley
1984/85-2004 : SUD modification of PH-BUH/UT, including modification to increased length longitudinal galley.
 |
| KLM 747-206B/306 galley configurations. |
1989 until now : 747-406 PH-BFA-BFY, factory equipped with slightly modified increased length longitudinal galley.
Presently the cabin next to the longitudinal galley is "comfort economy "with a slightly increased pitch for more leg room.
The best economy seats on the plane are the rows (twin seating) next to the partition wall, the very best are the two forward seats. (11D -11E), with even more leg room.
 |
| KLM 744 "economy comfort" seat plan |
[Edited 2015-05-01 06:29:18]
Operating a twin over the ocean, you're always one engine failure from a total emergency.
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: 76er, a318, airportugal310, BOAC1966, bomber996, brooklynchris13, C525C, ClipperYankee, Cubsrule, CX747, danimarroquin, debonair, DEN1895, Devilfish, dfdubflyer, dkny, EIEIDW, FLYBY72, FlyingMSY, Fuling, GSPSPOT, hbernal1, hOMSaR, jabarei, Janj, jbs2886, LatinPlane, Lighthouse, marcogr12, maverick4002, mig17, mrkerr7474, N649DL, Oliver2020, ORDFlyer99, rjbesikof, ryanflyer, skennedy, snoopaloop, SunsetLimited, tomcat, TrafficCop, wedgetail737, WidebodyPTV, williaminsd, wjcandee, ytib, YVRbud, yyzkgkj and 366 guests