Airnerd
Posts: 299
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 11:57 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Fri Sep 11, 2015 7:25 pm

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 198):
Even with AS feed at PDX, I don't think AA would be able to do more than NRT, ICN and possibly PEK. That's it. Look at how much DL is struggling to fill planes at SEA which has twice the metro population and a more robust overall economy.

Yeah, but come on, DL's competing with ANA, Asiana, EVA, Korean, and Hainan at SEA. And on many of the same routes! PDX would be a little different.
 
flyoregon
Posts: 743
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 5:29 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Fri Sep 11, 2015 7:34 pm

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 198):
Even with AS feed at PDX, I don't think AA would be able to do more than NRT, ICN and possibly PEK. That's it. Look at how much DL is struggling to fill planes at SEA which has twice the metro population and a more robust overall economy.
Quoting Airnerd (Reply 200):
Yeah, but come on, DL's competing with ANA, Asiana, EVA, Korean, and Hainan at SEA. And on many of the same routes! PDX would be a little different.

If AA wanted to make it work, they would and could. I'm not saying they should, I'm simply stating that from a geographical and AS partnership standpoint, it's not that ridiculous to consider. DL is struggling to fill planes because they're not relying on the AS feed in SEA as much as they could be until they assumed that because they were a bigger airline and knew better, they could do it themselves. Well, that's not working brilliantly, and loads aren't as awesome as they could be. However, that's not defeating Delta and they are boosting their own feed in and out of Seattle. Plus, as mentioned above, the Delta flights are competing directly with other airlines (although some are SkyTeam members).

SEA may be 2x bigger, but Delta is trying to win dominance by putting a lot of big jets, to far off destinations, simply to piss Alaska off. It's not working all that well, but they're trying. Alaska in Portland with American would be a different story. With Alaska's help, and more AA domestic destinations (mostly on the West Coast), American would be able to see decent loads to probably 5 Asian destinations. If the timings are right, if the logistics and network planning is done correctly in conjunction with Alaska's schedule, you'd probably be surprised.

Not saying it will happen, but simply saying it's not an impossibility.
 
User avatar
intotheair
Posts: 1846
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:49 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Fri Sep 11, 2015 8:48 pm

Quoting eugdjinn (Reply 199):
Er, no. For six months, (the very last six months pre-merger United had 737s) they operated them on the EUG-SFO runs to cover the Olympic track and field trials held at the U of O. During that six month period of poorly maintained aircraft which experienced one-two maintenance delays a day, there have not been mainline aircraft flying for United, Delta or American at Eugene in scheduled service since 2002.

It was 2002 when United turned the station over to SkyWest Airlines to run and under the union contract with United employees, mainline aircraft could not serve the station for more that six months without the station being handled by mainline, union employees. In 2012, just shy of 10 years of SkyWest management, United announced that Eugene, and the other small stations in Oregon were being handed over to even cheaper management companies, and Eugene was contracted to DGS, a wholly owned subsidiary of Delta.

There are two reasons I strongly doubt you'll ever see mainline aircraft in Eugene on regular scheduled service:

Eugene's market functions best with multiple flights on smaller aircraft and that actually provides more first class seating - which allows more upgrades.

Eugene's Airport manager for the last I think 7 years is entirely enamored with mainline aircraft to the exclusion of all else and has been frantically trying to get any mainline service for all of his time there, to no avail. If he hasn't succeeded at this point, it just isn't going to happen. He should perhaps have worked to maintain DL service on 700/900 aircraft two to three times a day instead of allowing it to fall to 200s. Or allowed the 200s back onto Denver - which is a brutally long flight for a 200. I'd even argue that doing anything at all to maintain the 2x daily AA to LAX is a critical link for EUG.

But then, what do I know? I only worked as a station supervisor there for SkyWest for 8 years.

Thanks for this information! I did see the very nicely compiled RWA380 list above but I was looking for destinations, timeframe, and equipment.

In the small amount of information I could find in my quick research, I did find a few articles from early 2008 announcing UA mainline service returning to EUG via a 737 to SFO. Seeing the date, that must mean the ghetto 737 classics of the PMUA days. Of course, if what you're saying is true about UA not being able to bring mainline back for more than 6 months at a time, then that may explain why that flight seemingly vanished. The article also mentioned that UA had to cut back on several flights in order to fill the single 737, so maybe you're right about EUG being better served with several flights.

Quoting eugdjinn (Reply 199):
Have fun in EUG!! Learn to love RJs. And NEVER schedule a connection in SFO tighter than 2.5 hours, ever!

Thanks! I've lived in SFO for four years so I have spent hours and hours of my life delayed somewhere because of that marine layer, so I know what that's like. And last week was my first time ever on an E-jet, and I actually did think it was nice. If the afternoon departure to DEN were on one instead of a CR2, I guess I wouldn't have many complaints.
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 380 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 CRK Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 5628
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Fri Sep 11, 2015 9:44 pm

Quoting bigfoot0503 (Reply 193):
One particular A-netter and fellow Oregonian, user RWA380 has compiled a very detailed list of airports in Oregon and the past and present air service that each community has seen. I would personally recommend reviewing anything that he may offer...I know he as done some excellent work in compiling this detailed information

This is the nicest thing anyone has ever said about me on A.net, Thank you! I do indeed have the lists mentioned & I have spent hours researching online, buying timetables & OAG's on E-bay, to fill in info. For example I just found out that CZ suspended all services to PDT effective 6/1/78. Anyone who wants either a route map of Inter Oregon flights from the 60's or 70's to present or a matching list of Oregon cities with commercial service & listed non-stop destinations let me know, I think it's posted in this thread as well.

Quoting bigfoot0503 (Reply 193):
I for one flew in and out of Eugene as a young airline manager in the early 1990's on mostly United and United Express. Specifically I recall flights from DEN n/s to Eugene flying on a B737..also I believe UA used the B727 on the DEN route. As for the UA flights from EUG to SFO I want to say that the B737 was utilized quite a bit during that same time period.

The 73S has been quite the shoe off at EUG, with UA routes to PDX, SLE, MFR, SFO, DEN, SLC, ACV & LAX over the years.

Quoting bigfoot0503 (Reply 193):
UA had a B767 and also I believe a B747 in at least once or twice.

IIRC, there was a 744 charter from Mahlon Sweet within th elast week or so, it was posted here on A.net.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 194):
If AA were to put together a small focus city in Portland, I wouldn't expect it to be huge, but I can see it doing well because of AS.

I agree, a 2 - 3 trans pac cities tops, with MIA added, & JFK on AS. BA to LHR.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 194):
I've read around from others on A.net and other sites about the plausibility of AA setting up a small trans-pac "hub" in PDX. While many will argue that's pointless because they have LAX, why add PDX as a launch point,



The folks from SEA & PDX are not going to go via LAX willingly to get to Asia, AA & O/W would be smart to see the future potential now.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 194):
I thought I read that AA requested more gate space at PDX near the end of C. That could simply be due to the merger, but there might be some underlying reason. It's fun to think about at least.

It seems you are in my head, LOL! It's amazing how easy my responses are when you do most of the writing for me.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 195):
As for the future of EUG, it wouldn't surprise me to see mainline return to the airport, and it wouldn't surprise me to Alaska add a 737 from the airport to somewhere. Pure wishing of course.

As areas in Oregon grow, EUG may be surpassed by RDM & MFR in the next decade in size & lift.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 195):
As mentioned above, RWA380 would have factual knowledge on this as he has compiled a nice list of past service.

Thanks for the kiind comments, it is so nice, given most people are adversarial here. I'm glad that has proven to be a good tool for us Oregon fans of aviation.

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 198):
Even with AS feed at PDX, I don't think AA would be able to do more than NRT, ICN and possibly PEK. That's it.

Fully agreed, since they are the three top destinations from PDX to Asia I'd expect those to be the three in that order. I'd expect that the NRT service would be offered by JL as well.

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 198):
Look at how much DL is struggling to fill planes at SEA which has twice the metro population and a more robust overall economy.

The only difference is, AS isn't the partner DL had hoped for & now they are in the competitior to the favorite local carrier beloved by most of the healed PNW traveler. AS would be a much more willing partner with AA at PDX.

Quoting eugdjinn (Reply 199):
And NEVER schedule a connection in SFO tighter than 2.5 hours, ever!

No truer words have been spoken.

Quoting Airnerd (Reply 200):
Yeah, but come on, DL's competing with ANA, Asiana, EVA, Korean, and Hainan at SEA. And on many of the same routes! PDX would be a little different

Exactly, the fact that PDX has only DL to NRT, means the market is still ripe for the picking. It's not an instant hit, it'll certainly be a cultivatable market.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 201):
SEA may be 2x bigger, but Delta is trying to win dominance by putting a lot of big jets, to far off destinations, simply to piss Alaska off. It's not working all that well, but they're trying. Alaska in Portland with American would be a different story. With Alaska's help, and more AA domestic destinations (mostly on the West Coast), American would be able to see decent loads to probably 5 Asian destinations. If the timings are right, if the logistics and network planning is done correctly in conjunction with Alaska's schedule, you'd probably be surprised.

Thanks, you make my replies so much shorter.  
707 717 720 727-1/2 737-1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 747-1/2/3/4 757-2/3 767-2/3/4 777-2/3 DC8 DC9 MD80/2/7/8 D10-1/3/4 M11 L10-1/2/5 A300/310/320
AA AC AQ AS BA BD BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WC WN WP YS 8M
 
flyoregon
Posts: 743
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 5:29 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Fri Sep 11, 2015 10:18 pm

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 203):
The folks from SEA & PDX are not going to go via LAX willingly to get to Asia, AA & O/W would be smart to see the future potential now.

Exactly. Nor does anyone in Alaska or the Mountain West want to go through LAX...aside from being slightly out of the way, it's not exactly the most comfortable place in the world. I have a feeling AA does see the potential, and I also have a feeling that might be why the AS/AA partnership was tightened up. More gates could mean more flights leading into a small gateway. Delta screwed it up once before, and that was 20 years ago, and things are a lot different and a lot better.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 203):
It seems you are in my head, LOL! It's amazing how easy my responses are when you do most of the writing for me.

I'll send you the bill later  
Quoting RWA380 (Reply 203):
Thanks for the kiind comments, it is so nice, given most people are adversarial here. I'm glad that has proven to be a good tool for us Oregon fans of aviation.

The pointless argument over the dumbest things that drag on for ages get old. Once in a while a sincere compliment seems to be in order.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 203):
Fully agreed, since they are the three top destinations from PDX to Asia I'd expect those to be the three in that order. I'd expect that the NRT service would be offered by JL as well.

JL to NRT would make the most sense rather than having it on AA metal, and I suspect that would knock Delta off the route. I could see Hainan do PEK as they codeshare with AA (?), and perhaps AA just flies ICN plus some more domestic. Who knows. Airlines need to get a little more creative in working with their partners that make the whole world go round.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 203):
The only difference is, AS isn't the partner DL had hoped for & now they are in the competitior to the favorite local carrier beloved by most of the healed PNW traveler. AS would be a much more willing partner with AA at PDX.

   Again, I think there's something developing underground between the two that no one is aware of yet. AA wouldn't just ask for more gate space at PDX for no reason...right? The US gates and AA gates would be more than sufficient for their ops currently I think.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 203):
Exactly, the fact that PDX has only DL to NRT, means the market is still ripe for the picking. It's not an instant hit, it'll certainly be a cultivatable market.

Would absolutely adore seeing a JL 787 landing in Portland. As much as I love to see the 763, something new would be pretty neat.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 203):
Thanks, you make my replies so much shorter.

I think people need to start looking more suspiciously at operations, markets, and strategic partnerships. When they do, they might find some hidden treasures in there in regards to what the future holds.
 
Airnerd
Posts: 299
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 11:57 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Fri Sep 11, 2015 10:50 pm

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 203):
As areas in Oregon grow, EUG may be surpassed by RDM & MFR in the next decade in size & lift.

As I wrote in Reply 174 above, if current passenger growth rates were sustained, both RDM and MFR would see more passengers than EUG sometime in 2023. I think EUG's proximity to PDX is going to continue to limit its long term growth potential more than RDM and MFR.
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 5628
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Fri Sep 11, 2015 11:46 pm

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 204):
I have a feeling AA does see the potential, and I also have a feeling that might be why the AS/AA partnership was tightened up.

I sure hope someone does, as it is inevitable that PDX will be connected n/s to ICN & PEK, why not make it organized & have AA & O/W dominate that growth.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 204):
More gates could mean more flights leading into a small gateway.

Someone had stated that the gates at the end of C that AA requested were for the 321's but I agree more could happen at the end of C, however AA would need to come into D first with any Intl as that is where FIS is.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 204):
Delta screwed it up once before, and that was 20 years ago, and things are a lot different and a lot better.

There were so many factors for that hub & it's disappearance, the fact that the L-1011-500's nor the M-11's had the range to do ATL-NRT n/s, so a west coast hub was needed, PDX made tham a deal & DL had an Asian hub. Here is a basic overview of what transpired, be careful a few facts are not in order.

http://www.airlinereporter.com/2011/...es-history-in-portland-guest-blog/

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 204):
The pointless argument over the dumbest things that drag on for ages get old.

Can I get an Amen & a Hallelujah on this statement ... well put!

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 204):
Once in a while a sincere compliment seems to be in order.

I can't agree more, I often feel beat up after reading this board & have wondered why I even bother, but then this kind of discussion comes up & I'm reminded why I enjoy this.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 204):
JL to NRT would make the most sense rather than having it on AA metal, and I suspect that would knock Delta off the route.

Agreed, DL may not be the winner if another carrier that participates fully in the AS mileage program joins NRT-PDX.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 204):
I could see Hainan do PEK as they codeshare with AA (?),

More importantly HU has an agreement with AS & that is what will create the PDX focus city.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 204):
I think there's something developing underground between the two that no one is aware of yet.

   I think the transfer of LAX-MEX rights, the co-operation at LAX with non-overlapping markets like BWI, there is certainly a new level of co-operation, but I am unsure of how deep that will get, although I'm thinking, in the future, that AS may consider entry into O/W to cinch the Northwest for their partners. Not anything in the near future.

Quoting Airnerd (Reply 205):
As I wrote in Reply 174 above, if current passenger growth rates were sustained, both RDM and MFR would see more passengers than EUG sometime in 2023. I think EUG's proximity to PDX is going to continue to limit its long term growth potential more than RDM and MFR.

Sorry nerd, it was your comment that I was thinking of when I said that, I failed to give you the credit.  
707 717 720 727-1/2 737-1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 747-1/2/3/4 757-2/3 767-2/3/4 777-2/3 DC8 DC9 MD80/2/7/8 D10-1/3/4 M11 L10-1/2/5 A300/310/320
AA AC AQ AS BA BD BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WC WN WP YS 8M
 
lhpdx
Posts: 914
Joined: Tue Dec 12, 2006 5:36 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Fri Sep 11, 2015 11:58 pm

Interesting..The Hainan flight has now been removed from PDX wiki....I think someone messing with us PDX enthusiast.
 
flyoregon
Posts: 743
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 5:29 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sat Sep 12, 2015 12:16 am

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 206):
I think the transfer of LAX-MEX rights, the co-operation at LAX with non-overlapping markets like BWI, there is certainly a new level of co-operation, but I am unsure of how deep that will get, although I'm thinking, in the future, that AS may consider entry into O/W to cinch the Northwest for their partners. Not anything in the near future.

I'd forgotten that...excellent observation.

Exciting times ahead in PDX as far as I'm concerned. I think BA to LHR is next...and at any moment. I hope so at least.

Logical int'l adds in the next 5 years:

-WestJet Encore to YYC (Q400)
-Air Canada Rogue to YYZ (A319)
-British Airways to LHR (788)
-Hainan Airlines to PEK (788)

Increased GDL on Volaris would be nice or additional destinations (a daytime flight would be nice), and after next summer, an increase from both Condor and Icelandair. Would love to see Condor go year-round, but the only year-round US service they have is Las Vegas. They should consider to make Portland the second. Both FI and DE are killin' it!
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 5628
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sat Sep 12, 2015 4:56 am

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 208):
I'd forgotten that...excellent observation.
Quoting flyoregon (Reply 208):
Exciting times ahead in PDX as far as I'm concerned. I think BA to LHR is next...and at any moment. I hope so at least.

When you look at the many small co-operations that have transpired between AA & AS, it seems that AS has chosen a "most favored status" domestic partner.

As SEA is packed now there is not much room for growth except the middle of the night, PDX is going to be the only other airport in the region to be able to handle the increased traffic to the Northwest.

Remember a reasonable portion of that SEA traffic connects onwards to PDX, having non-stops to PDX instead of expecting travelers to connect over SEA, will allow more O/D seats for the SEA market as well as more seats available for connections to places in the AS system that can't be reached n/s from PDX.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 208):
-WestJet Encore to YYC (Q400)
-Air Canada Rogue to YYZ (A319)
-British Airways to LHR (788)
-Hainan Airlines to PEK (788)

I think Westjet would be a good add, although that AC route to YYZ has never done anything better than seasonal YYZ service, I doubt even with Rouge costs the route could handle year round service.

I think HU & BA are givens IMO, I was surprised when BA announced SJC over PDX, very disappointing. I could see a carrier like Thomas Cook or even DY to start LGW or LHR to PDX one day if BA doesn't jump in.
707 717 720 727-1/2 737-1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 747-1/2/3/4 757-2/3 767-2/3/4 777-2/3 DC8 DC9 MD80/2/7/8 D10-1/3/4 M11 L10-1/2/5 A300/310/320
AA AC AQ AS BA BD BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WC WN WP YS 8M
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 5628
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sat Sep 12, 2015 5:11 am

I started another thread about this, but I'm mentioning it here just in cas it's deleted or off topic here it is:

B6 Pax ANC-PDX Whizzes All Over Passengers & Bags (by RWA380 Sep 11 2015 in Civil Aviation)

I was watching this on the news here in Portland, but I guess early this morning a B6 flight from ANC to PDX was only a 1/2 hour from landing when the waking passenger stood up & started relieving himself on the seats, people & bags around him. He passed out & was arrested when he arrived at PDX before 5am, what a drunken idiot.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/11/travel/jetblue-passenger-urinates/

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/i...etblue_passenger_pees_on_fell.html
707 717 720 727-1/2 737-1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 747-1/2/3/4 757-2/3 767-2/3/4 777-2/3 DC8 DC9 MD80/2/7/8 D10-1/3/4 M11 L10-1/2/5 A300/310/320
AA AC AQ AS BA BD BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WC WN WP YS 8M
 
bluejackets
Posts: 287
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 1:24 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sat Sep 12, 2015 9:34 pm

Quoting PDX88 (Reply 196):
They don't even run LAX, JFK, or MIA. To start up something as big as a Trans-Pac gateway, there needs to be somewhat of a visibly dominating brand already existing, something AA does not have in Portland.
Quoting HPRamper (Reply 198):
Look at how much DL is struggling to fill planes at SEA which has twice the metro population and a more robust overall economy.

All good points that puts me leaning on the side of this not happening. AA's visibility at PDX is far too low at this point, plus there are ample connection opportunities through LAX on AA.

The comparison between DL practically doing the same thing at SEA with a sheer population advantage also probably makes the idea of an AA hub at PDX premature at the moment.
It's funny when I tell people I love planes and they think I'm weird.
 
tan1mill
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 12:11 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sun Sep 13, 2015 12:57 am

Quoting 910A (Reply 189):
From Fly Crescent City:

The inaugural PenAir flight from Crescent City to Portland International Airport is scheduled to be flown by Ship 410.
We look forward to seeing its stylish livery glistening under a water cannon salute as it taxis out for departure Tuesday morning.

Looks like a change of plans. Ship 406 will fly the inaugural flight.
Love many, Trust few, Always paddle your own canoe.
 
Wingtips56
Posts: 1214
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 1:26 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:24 am

Any PenAir planes on base at PDX yet? I would expect something on hand for the mechanics familiarization. And I would expect at least on familiarization flight for flight and ground crews at PDX and CEC. I can't imagine the first time in would be the ferry flight PDX-CEC on the 14th for the ribbon cutting and first flight in the morning.

I'm guessing the first aircraft will be a transfer from Boston since the seasonal suspension of BOS-BHB. But has anyone heard if they are adding to the SF34 fleet> The Saab 2000s should do some freeing up, but I think they will still need to expand the fleet if they do indeed expand the PDX flying to additional markets.

Ears to the ground, anyone?
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 181 airports, 92 airlines, 78 a/c types, 403 routes, 58 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,119,414 passenger miles.

Home airport : CEC
 
tan1mill
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 12:11 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:18 am

Quoting Wingtips56 (Reply 213):
Any PenAir planes on base at PDX yet? I would expect something on hand for the mechanics familiarization. And I would expect at least on familiarization flight for flight and ground crews at PDX and CEC. I can't imagine the first time in would be the ferry flight PDX-CEC on the 14th for the ribbon cutting and first flight in the morning.

I'm guessing the first aircraft will be a transfer from Boston since the seasonal suspension of BOS-BHB. But has anyone heard if they are adding to the SF34 fleet> The Saab 2000s should do some freeing up, but I think they will still need to expand the fleet if they do indeed expand the PDX flying to additional markets.

Ears to the ground, anyone?

406XJ is reposition as we speak as Pen8808 from PBG to PDX via FAR.
369PX will reposition on Monday morning from ANC to PDX.

Doesn't look like there will be any familiarization flight. Flight crews have already been moved to the area to begin start up.

So far, one SF34 has been added to the fleet and is already painted in KS colors (N331AG) and in MX in ANC. One more should be arrive in the coming month or so. Saab 2000's are still on the way from what I understand, first one arriving sometime next month.
Love many, Trust few, Always paddle your own canoe.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4142
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:47 am

Quoting Wingtips56 (Reply 213):
Any PenAir planes on base at PDX yet? I would expect something on hand for the mechanics familiarization.

The Mechanics are already extensively familiar with the aircraft.
 
eugdjinn
Posts: 169
Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 5:58 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:33 pm

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 203):
IIRC, there was a 744 charter from Mahlon Sweet within th elast week or so, it was posted here on A.net.

Unless things have changed in the last three years, those are prestigious, but really costly. EUG's runway lights all have to be pulled for a 747 to land there, or the outboard engines destroy them... so it takes a day or two to prep the field for the arrival, and a day to restore it. I think the only reason they were so gung-ho to have 744s come in was that one of the ya-hoos who works in airport management was a retired United 747 pilot and needed to tell EVERYONE about that constantly.

In reality, it was far smarter, far cheaper, and much easier to have 764, 763, A330, or 777 charters on that field. (All of this even without any can loading equipment on the property.)

So, yes, you can land a 744 at EUG. But it is a colossal waste of taxpayer money, whether the U of O is paying, or the city is, or (in the case of Air Force One,) the Feds are. (And yes, I know the tired U of O sports moneys are from franchise and television fees and do not take away from state support... right... tell me again why the library is not supported by athletic monies when athletes supposedly use it???)

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 204):
Who knows. Airlines need to get a little more creative in working with their partners that make the whole world go round.

That works fine for Joe Vacation, but it really matters to Suzy MillionMiler that her flight is on the metal of the airline that she predominantly flies. None of the alliances has really made international upgrades transparent or pleasant. And that can make a serious difference, Suzy might pay the $3,000 M fare for her round trip Bozeman-PDX-ICN on AA if her 20,000 banked miles let that become a business class seat. But that's almost certainly not gonna happen if the ICN flight is on a partner carrier. (I know, you all think it'll be NRT, but I'm betting not. I'll explain in a minute.) Decisions like hers can spell the difference in profitability for the flight. Yes, it isn't full biz money, but its high econ, and much better than a plane full of discounts. Too, if the flight is being run on metal-neutral profit sharing ATI deal, then there is no benefit to it being the Asian carrier running the flight. This to me is the great advantage of AA picking up a solid fleet of 788s as well as 789s.

O.k. - with regard to NRT, I think its time to remember that while JAL has a serious hub there, the Japanese economy is not well, and the island nation is reeling from what I understood to be years of way too much rain. That was disastrous for Fukushima Daiichi, but it hasn't helped any of the country, flooding crops, flooding towns and villages and just generally making everything impossible. If that's the case, then maybe, just maybe it isn't the time to try that market. So, how about....

ICN since we know KE is about fed to the teeth with DL anyway, wouldn't it be a good time to bring them into OneWorld and start PDX-ICN instead??? Cue evil laugh...Bwah ha ha ha ha ha ha!
 
dc10lover
Posts: 1573
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2014 6:11 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:16 pm

Medford Airport on pace for 700,000 passengers in 2015


http://www.mailtribune.com/article/20150911/NEWS/150919901
Why endure the nightmare and congestion of LAX when BUR, LGB, ONT & SNA is so much easier to fly in and out of. Same with OAK & SJC when it comes to SFO.
 
910A
Posts: 1849
Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2015 2:11 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:56 pm

Quoting eugdjinn (Reply 216):
ICN since we know KE is about fed to the teeth with DL anyway, wouldn't it be a good time to bring them into OneWorld and start PDX-ICN instead??? Cue evil laugh...Bwah ha ha ha ha ha ha!

I really like the your idea. ICN is much more user friendly for service to China and SE Asia.
 
UnitedFlyer
Posts: 270
Joined: Wed Mar 03, 2004 2:43 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:03 pm

Quoting 910A (Reply 218):
Medford Airport on pace for 700,000 passengers in 2015

Fantastic! I have heard of the possibility of a 2nd jetway. MFR has come a long way!
 
910A
Posts: 1849
Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2015 2:11 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:30 pm

Quoting Wingtips56 (Reply 213):
And I would expect at least on familiarization flight for flight and ground crews at PDX and CEC.

I've been told the PDX and CEC staff went to ANC last month for training.
 
Wingtips56
Posts: 1214
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 1:26 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Sun Sep 13, 2015 10:25 pm

Quoting 910A (Reply 220):
I've been told the PDX and CEC staff went to ANC last month for training.

Actually a friend of mine in CEC went to ANC for training back in May and just returned last week. Lots of on the job training, but at ANC facilities. 3 of the CEC staff are ex-OO, so they do know where to park the plane, gate operation, etc., but I would think you'd want a newbie to get a little practice with the local facilities prior to meeting a live revenue flight.

I don't know this: is there a need for an airline to at least do a proving run on a new route at a new airport? 3 of 4 approaches here are over the ocean; the other over forest.
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 181 airports, 92 airlines, 78 a/c types, 403 routes, 58 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,119,414 passenger miles.

Home airport : CEC
 
tan1mill
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 12:11 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Mon Sep 14, 2015 5:39 am

Quoting Wingtips56 (Reply 213):
Any PenAir planes on base at PDX yet? I would expect something on hand for the mechanics familiarization. And I would expect at least on familiarization flight for flight and ground crews at PDX and CEC. I can't imagine the first time in would be the ferry flight PDX-CEC on the 14th for the ribbon cutting and first flight in the morning.
Quoting tan1mill (Reply 214):
Doesn't look like there will be any familiarization flight.

I spoke a little too soon I guess. Looks like there is a flight from PDX to CEC leaving at 2 pm local time using 406XJ. Pen8066.
Love many, Trust few, Always paddle your own canoe.
 
Wingtips56
Posts: 1214
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 1:26 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Mon Sep 14, 2015 7:32 am

Well that's likely the ferry flight coming in to be the inaugural flight equipment out in the morning, the 15th.

5 months with no air service coming to an end.
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 181 airports, 92 airlines, 78 a/c types, 403 routes, 58 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,119,414 passenger miles.

Home airport : CEC
 
tan1mill
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 12:11 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:00 am

Quoting Wingtips56 (Reply 223):
Well that's likely the ferry flight coming in to be the inaugural flight equipment out in the morning, the 15th.

5 months with no air service coming to an end.

Do you know if anyone will be there to snap some photos? Would be nice to see more PenAir photos on A.Net from someplace other than the same old spotting location in Anchorage.
Love many, Trust few, Always paddle your own canoe.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4142
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Mon Sep 14, 2015 3:37 pm

Quoting Wingtips56 (Reply 221):
I don't know this: is there a need for an airline to at least do a proving run on a new route at a new airport? 3 of 4 approaches here are over the ocean; the other over forest.

I think the KS pilots will be well prepared to shoot these approached over the ocean   See DUT.
 
Wingtips56
Posts: 1214
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 1:26 am

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:24 pm

Quoting tan1mill (Reply 224):
Do you know if anyone will be there to snap some photos? Would be nice to see more PenAir photos on A.Net from someplace other than the same old spotting location in Anchorage.

Pics and video already in Facebook, with water cannon salute on arrival a short time ago. It's Fly Crescent City page.

I decided not to get up and go to the ribbon-cutting ceremony in the morning (6:00am), and it would be still dark for photos anyway. But I'm sure there will be other spotters.

My sister-in-law is coming in Sunday afternoon, so I'll have my camera ready then. I'd love to get a shot of it landing with Castle Rock behind it (an island), but it's not common they come in on that approach.
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 181 airports, 92 airlines, 78 a/c types, 403 routes, 58 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,119,414 passenger miles.

Home airport : CEC
 
User avatar
KarelXWB
Posts: 26968
Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:13 pm

RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 8

Tue Sep 15, 2015 9:31 am

Thread now closed.

Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 9 (by KarelXWB Sep 15 2015 in Civil Aviation)
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos