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nitepilot79
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D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:06 am

 
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Tugger
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:14 am

Quoting nitepilot79 (Thread starter):
I hope this guy doesn't get sent away.

I agree, I even tend to agree with his position and think it is worthless and meaningless and a waste of money to "send him away". I understand the law and all that and that laws were broken and law enforcement time and resources taken up by his action, and I even recognize the "example" that might need to be made to prevent copycats, and I even recognize the issue of precedence. But it still seems a waste to lock him up.

I know, how about require him to visit with and talk to every legislator in DC for at least one hour? That should be punishment enough for anyone!   

Tugg
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N747PE
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:18 am

If we did that to enemy combatants, we would be in trouble with Amnesty International. The sentence of making them listen to every legislator for at least one hour
 
 
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zeke
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:32 am

Quoting nitepilot79 (Thread starter):

I hope this guy doesn't get sent away.

http://news.yahoo.com/man-landed-gyr....html

I agree, it is healthy for people to be able to protest to their governments. Most protests involve things that some people wish were never brought to the public attention, he just found a unique way of doing this.

If this guy goes to goal, the US will be even closer to China and Russia.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
b747400erf
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:41 am

Quoting zeke (Reply 3):

If this guy goes to goal, the US will be even closer to China and Russia.

Breaking laws and airspace rules to score a political point is only illegal in oppressive countries like China and Russia?
 
OMP777X
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:41 am

While I also hope that he doesn't see any time in jail or in prison, I'm kind of surprised he appears to be thinking that they wouldn't come after him and try to lock him up for a very long time. As a person who's taken part in several CDs in the past, I realized before the first one I ever committed that I would be arrested and possibly spend time in jail. The authorities and prosecutors will always try to make an example out of you, and will slap as many charges against you they possibly can. Along with that, they also will try to lock you up for as long as possible.

Hell, during my first CD on the day that the US begun bombing Iraq during the second war we started with them, after I was arrested the building maintenance employee had already cleaned off the chalk on its wall where I wrote "No War" in huge letters all over it before the paddywagon I was locked up inside of had even left the scene where they arrested me. I know that because the busted door on the thing didn't close properly, and I saw them wash it off through the big gap between the door frame and the door itself. Even still, I spent the night in jail after they charged me with criminal tresspassing and criminal defacement of property, and went to court over it expecting the worst. When I met my attorney there I was ready for her to say that they were going to throw the book at me, but instead she said the plaintiff's attorney didn't even show up, so naturally all of the charges against me were dropped. It ended up being pretty effective anyhow since like this guys action the press was all over it, it made the papers, and for a day or two the image of me writing "No War" on that buildings wall was included on the top ten images viewed on Google worldwide.

Ironically, almost ten years later my contractor who has the maintenance account for electrical work on the whole building sent me to work there. During the time before my security clearance was approved, I completely expected it to be rejected, and for me to be laid off as a result of that. Instead, since the charges were dropped and no conviction was ever made, I was granted my all access security card and building ID badge and worked there for a while. In this guys situation, I am somehow getting the feeling that he was a newbie protester who figured that his past experiences of being a privileged member in society made him think he would be let off the hook, and wouldn't ever be facing any charges in court, let alone a prison sentence for committing his "spectacular" direct action. Either way, I also hope he gets off before ever being indicted.


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OMP777X
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Max Q
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 9:16 am

CD= What Civil disobedience OMP7 ?



Abbreviations are great for the person using them but often bewildering for the person trying to decipher what they mean.

Considering the length of your post I don't really see the point in this case !


Anyway I do agree with you, I hope this guy ends up with probation at worst but I doubt that will happen, prosecutors being the way they are here.
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


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PanHAM
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 9:39 am

Quote from the article
misdemeanor charge of operating a vehicle falsely labeled as a postal carrier, a charge that carries a maximum of six months in prison
unquote

now that is a big reasonj why postal Services should go public. Delivering letters should not be in government Hands. Now, I may not agree with his opinions, but he had no criminal intentions, he did not hurt anyone and therefore a prison term should be ruled out.

Even Greenpeace protestors who enter oil drilling platforms in the arctic cegion of Russia are kept there for a couple of weeks only and then sent. How can a legal System justify a "substantial jail term" for a civil protest?
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zeke
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 10:24 am

Quoting B747400ERF (Reply 4):

Time and time again constitutional rights have trumpeted laws in the courts. The role of the police is to charge this person, the role of the courts is to balance a citizens constitutional rights over the intent of the charges. That is how a healthy democracy works.

The intent of the laws in my view is not to prevent freedom of expression.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
bennett123
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:35 am

What is the probability of conviction.

I assume that if convicted he will go to prison.
 
OMP777X
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:42 am

Quoting Max Q (Reply 6):
Abbreviations are great for the person using them but often bewildering for the person trying to decipher what they mean.

Considering the length of your post I don't really see the point in this case !


Many people I've encountered who have nothing to do with activism have referred to a civil disobedience as a "CD". Sorry if drawing from a very relevant personal experience made for a lengthy post here, I just didn't want a whole string of comments claiming I know nothing about what I was talking about.

Best,

OMP777X
"Happy Flighting!"
 
b747400erf
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:52 am

Quoting zeke (Reply 8):
Time and time again constitutional rights have trumpeted laws in the courts. The role of the police is to charge this person, the role of the courts is to balance a citizens constitutional rights over the intent of the charges. That is how a healthy democracy works.

The intent of the laws in my view is not to prevent freedom of expression.

Freedom of expression and Constitutional rights cover this action? I do not think so. There are many other legal ways of getting your protest into the national news.
 
OMP777X
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 12:16 pm

Quoting B747400ERF (Reply 11):
Freedom of expression and Constitutional rights cover this action? I do not think so. There are many other legal ways of getting your protest into the national news.

I completely agree with you on that point. He seriously risked his life pulling this one off. They could've shot him out of the sky and he would've gone down and ended up inside a ball of fire within a flaming wreck. I'm guessing they're eventually going to have bigger fish to fry sooner or later, and the judge will steer both parties into the direction of agreeing upon him pleading guilty to some lesser charges with way more minimal sentence lengths.
"Happy Flighting!"
 
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zeke
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 12:47 pm

Quoting B747400ERF (Reply 11):

That is the line his attorney will take, and it is what a judge will hold on a pedistal like the judiciary.

Quoting OMP777X (Reply 12):

Sure they could have shot him down, imagine the headline.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
aviatorcraig
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:31 pm

Clearly this guy broke the law and knew what he was doing. The authorities will obviously want to make an example of him to deter others. They don't want a fleet of gyrocopters on the White House lawn when it becomes the fashionable way to protest! However, 9.5 years in jail? that seems very excessive give that no harm was done.

There is a precident here. In 1987 when West German Matthius Rust flew his Cessna 172 across Soviet Russia and landed in Moscow's Red Square to the total embarrasment of the Soviet military, he was sentenced to four years. As east-west relations thawed he was released after 11 months.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mathias_Rust
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nitepilot79
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 7:06 pm

Quoting aviatorcraig (Reply 14):

Wild story. I had a lot of respect for the guy, 'till I read this from that link:

Rust in 2012
While doing his obligatory community service (Zivildienst) in a West German hospital in 1989, Rust stabbed a female co-worker who had rejected him. The victim barely survived. He was convicted of attempted manslaughter and sentenced to two and a half years in prison, but was released after 15 months.[11] Since then he has lived a fragmented life, describing himself as a "bit of an oddball."[12] After being released from court, he converted to Hinduism in 1996 to become engaged to a daughter of an Indian tea merchant.[13] In 2001, he was convicted of stealing a cashmere pullover and ordered to pay a fine of DM 10,000, which was later reduced to DM 600.[4][11] A further brush with the law came in 2005, when he was convicted of fraud and had to pay €1,500 for stolen goods.[11] In 2009 Rust described himself as a professional poker player.[14] Most recently, in 2012, he described himself as an analyst at a Zurich-based investment bank.[12]
 
flightsimer
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:02 pm

The charges should easily be dismissed in my opinion.

Quote:
That includes two felonies: operating as an airman without an airman's certificate and violating aircraft registration requirements.


Last I checked, an autogiro is an ultralight. An ultralight A) does not require a pilots license and B) does not require an aircraft registration

Quote:

Hughes also faces three misdemeanor offenses of violating national defense airspace, each carrying a maximum of one year in prison.

he is not a certified pilot, therefore how can he held to FAR's?

Quote:

misdemeanor charge of operating a vehicle falsely labeled as a postal carrier

they are really stretching for this one... The use of a single A logo that he painted does not constatute a labeled vehicle.

I hope he gets off free...
Commercial / Airline Pilot
 
Maverick623
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:37 pm

Quoting flightsimer (Reply 16):
The charges should easily be dismissed in my opinion.

Your opinion is based on faulty assumptions.

Quoting flightsimer (Reply 16):
Last I checked, an autogiro is an ultralight. An ultralight A) does not require a pilots license and B) does not require an aircraft registration

He's not being charged with operating an aircraft without proper endorsements. He's being charged with violating prohibited airspace and trespassing, among other things.

Quoting flightsimer (Reply 16):

he is not a certified pilot, therefore how can he held to FAR's?

How would they enforce certification standards on larger aircraft if FARs didn't apply to non-certified pilots?

That's like saying a bicyclist can't be given a ticket for running stop signs or red lights because a bicycle doesn't require a license to operate.
"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
 
flightsimer
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RE: D.C. Gyro Copter Landing--Pilot Rejects Plea Deal

Wed Jun 24, 2015 5:13 am

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 17):
He's not being charged with operating an aircraft without proper endorsements. He's being charged with violating prohibited airspace and trespassing, among other things.

Did you not read the charges that I quoted? Those are the actual charges... He is being charged for operating as an airmen with no airmen certificates and violating aircraft registration requirements. As I said before, the autogyro does not require either so how can he be charged when it wasn't required?
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