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mwh787
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WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 10:18 am

There was a couple of references in the SWA schedule extension thread about WN getting 20 -700 planes, maybe 10 from China.
This is a lot of planes that could be online fairly quickly. Probably help retire the -500's
Does anyone have any information on this rumor?

I searched some and couldn't find anything

Thanks

Ken
 
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gdg9
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 12:10 pm

I know they have already acquired, and are in the process of acquiring more, WestJet 737-700s. I think perhaps they've already taken on 5 or 6. The pickup was 10-12?
@dfwtower
 
SXDFC
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 4:06 pm

Yes, WN is currently obtaining many second hand -700s. So far they've acquired -700s from the following airlines:


China Eastern Airlines
China Southern Airlines
China United Airlines
Aeromexico
LAN Colombia
Jet Time ( Belgian)
Oman Air
Germania
Virgin Australia
Air Berlin
 
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larshjort
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 4:48 pm

Quoting SXDFC (Reply 2):
Jet Time ( Belgian

Just a tiny correction, Jettime is a Danish Airline.
139, 306, 319, 320, 321, 332, 34A, AN2, AT4, AT5, AT7, 733, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 146, AR1, BH2, CN1, CR2, DH1, DH3, DH4,
 
Sooner787
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 5:21 pm

There's an outfit at KPAE that is refurbishing these -700's for WN.

Looks like there are more -700's sitting around Everett right now waiting for re-work than the
remaining "terrible teen " Dreamliners
 
7673mech
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 5:45 pm

Don't forget 20+ WestJet.
 
n471wn
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 5:50 pm

16 a/c are awaiting conversion at Everett and coming on board at about 3 per month
 
32andBelow
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 5:53 pm

Weren't they getting some from AS?
 
n471wn
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 6:05 pm

Quoting 32andBelow (Reply 7):
Weren't they getting some from AS?

Yes and there are quite a number of other operators they received a/c from that are not listed and not sure the poster meant this to be an all-inclusive list. I just did an analysis of the 737-700 fleet and NOT COUNTING AIR TRAN 700's there are 48 700 a/c that SWA acquired on the second hand market---a very prudent business decision and so while many sing the praises of Delta for prudent buying of used aircraft, SWA has been doing very well doing the same thing.
 
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Acey
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 9:18 pm

5 -700's from WS to WN last year and 5 more frames this year, as they essentially replace those frames with new -800 deliveries.
If a man hasn't discovered something that he will die for, he isn't fit to live. -- Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
dbo861
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 9:27 pm

Are these 73Gs coming online used mostly to replace retiring 735 and 733s? Is there much/any fleet growth happening?
 
n471wn
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 9:38 pm

Quoting dbo861 (Reply 10):
Are these 73Gs coming online used mostly to replace retiring 735 and 733s? Is there much/any fleet growth happening?

Both but over the last year only a very few 300's and 500's have been retired so it is growth for now
 
SXDFC
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 11:12 pm

Quoting dbo861 (Reply 10):
Are these 73Gs coming online used mostly to replace retiring 735 and 733s? Is there much/any fleet growth happening?

From what I was told, these -700s were used to fill in the void the 717's left behind. This is also why very few 733s and 735's have been staying around a bit longer. There is also an on going rumor that the -500s will be parked next year so it will be interesting to see what becomes of that.
 
gilesdavies
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Wed Jul 01, 2015 11:38 pm

Are the 737-700's quite cheap to come by for the airline?

The 737-700's seem to be falling out of favour, looking at the boeing order book and the 737-800 is steeling all the thunder.
 
caleb1
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 1:16 am

I am assuming that all of these aircraft have 2 lavatories in the rear of the cabin as opposed to the usual 1 that most WN -700s have.
 
N1120A
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 1:24 am

Quoting caleb1 (Reply 14):

I am assuming that all of these aircraft have 2 lavatories in the rear of the cabin as opposed to the usual 1 that most WN -700s have.

Doesn't WN standardize their interiors before sending the planes out?

Quoting gilesdavies (Reply 13):

Are the 737-700's quite cheap to come by for the airline?

Fairly, especially since WN pays cash and buys in bulk.

Quoting gilesdavies (Reply 13):
The 737-700's seem to be falling out of favour, looking at the boeing order book and the 737-800 is steeling all the thunder.

The -800 does 90% of what the -700 does, only with 30-40 more seats and with only marginally higher costs. The -700 still has some limited purpose, particularly where range and/or performance are necessary, but -800 is hypercompetitive.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
WNCrew
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 1:41 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 15):

Quoting caleb1 (Reply 14):

I am assuming that all of these aircraft have 2 lavatories in the rear of the cabin as opposed to the usual 1 that most WN -700s have.

Doesn't WN standardize their interiors before sending the planes out?

Yes, these interiors are standardized prior to entering the fleet. There have been times when we've operated aircraft with a non-standard cabin configuration (galleys/seats/lavs) as they awaited conversion, but currently that's not the case. I WISH we had the additional AFT lav bc we have a very high pax:lav ratio and provide lots of onboard service-many daily flights-no lav cleaning. It is bad. BUT the company turn a blind eye.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
cschleic
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 2:13 am

Didn't they buy some from Alaska, too?
 
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Acey
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 3:48 am

Quoting cschleic (Reply 17):

Didn't they buy some from Alaska, too?

I see 3 73G's they grabbed from AS: N557WN, N560WN, and N562WN came from AS as N623AS, N617AS, and N624AS respectively.


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mwh787
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 4:28 am

I find this all very interesting.WN is able to replace the 717 Airtran capacity with used -700 planes. I am sure at a very good price. At the same time increasing capacity with new -800 planes. All the while still making good profits and paying good dividends.
It does seem that they are acquiring every good -700 they can find. I am amazed they are able to find so many.


Thanks for all the information
 
justplanesmart
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 6:10 am

More information here:

SWA 2nd hand 73Gs Entry Into Service Update? (by The777Man Jun 8 2015 in Civil Aviation)
"So many planes; so little time..."
 
MSPNWA
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 6:29 am

Quoting WNCrew (Reply 16):
I WISH we had the additional AFT lav bc we have a very high pax:lav ratio and provide lots of onboard service-many daily flights-no lav cleaning.

I wish they did too. But it's only a big deal on the longer flights. I can see why they don't. WN has a short average stage length on the 733/73G. It's not worth the loss of seats.

Quoting mwh787 (Reply 19):
I find this all very interesting.WN is able to replace the 717 Airtran capacity with used -700 planes. I am sure at a very good price.

I am sure a very good price. And the 73G will be much more economical to operate than the 717. Looks like WN did the right thing by shedding the 717s.
 
mwh787
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 9:40 am

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 21):
I am sure a very good price. And the 73G will be much more economical to operate than the 717. Looks like WN did the right thing by shedding the 717s.

I believe they did the right thing also, maybe not for the short term but definitely for the long term. I know there are people here that don't like WN I think they are a very smart rum airline.

They are always looking long term and are not short sighted... smart staying with 737 family
 
ltbewr
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 11:22 am

So what is happening to the retired WN 737's and ex-AirTran 717's ? Scrap, parts or to 3rd tier operators ?
 
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RayChuang
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 11:59 am

The answer is why not? Those used 73G's are essentially the same planes WN now flies and after a mechanical rebuild and reconfiguration to WN specs, will stay with that airline for many years to come.
 
wnflyguy
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 2:07 pm

There was talk about WN picking up another 41 used 700's next year with a split between growth and ALL of the 737-500s retirments. But now I can see them up retirement of more 300s.
Flyguy
My Wings are clipped just another Retired Airline person. The Ultimate Armchair out of the loop airline industry geek. Aloha Mr Hand!
 
mwh787
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 3:09 pm

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 23):

So what is happening to the retired WN 737's and ex-AirTran 717's ?

717's went to DL
 
karadion
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 3:21 pm

Around 98 second-hand 737-700's were sold to SWA as of late. Comparing between two sources:

3 Aeromexico
52 Airtran Airways
3 Alaska Airlines
2 Aloha Airlines
5 China Eastern
4 China Xinjiang Airlines
1 Eastwind Airlines
4 Easyjet
1 Easyjet Switzerland
1 LAPA
3 Maersk Air
1 Oman Air
2 Sahara India Airlines
2 SAS Norway
4 Virgin Australia Airlines
10 Westjet
 
SWADawg
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 3:32 pm

That's really only 46 used -700's since you can't really include the 52 FL birds that were part of the acquisition. In order to replace the 717 fleet and bring the combined WN/FL fleet back to pre merger levels, WN would need to procure 42 more used -700's.
My posts are my opinion only and do not reflect the views of Southwest Airlines
 
panam330
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 3:35 pm

Quoting SXDFC (Reply 2):
Aeromexico

Not to hijack, but I had no idea AM was shedding any 737 frames. Does anybody know what their ultimate strategy is? I'm guessing something like WS' - dumping 700s as they take more 800s?
 
SXDFC
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 4:19 pm

Here is ALL the secondhand -700s so far and their status. I only added the two airTran NTU -700s into the mix as we all know the rest of the FL -700s were inherited.

N270WN (737-705) Ex Ford VP-BBT (IN SERVICE)
N271LV (737-705) Ex Ford VP-BBU (IN SERVICE)

N550WN (737-76Q) Ex Air Sahara VT-SIR (IN SERVICE)
N551WN (737-76Q) Ex Air Sahara VT-SIS (IN SERVICE)
N552WN (737-7BX) Ex Virgin Australia VH-VBQ (IN SERVICE)
N553WN (737-7BX) Ex Virgin Australia VH-VBR (IN SERVICE)
N554WN (737-7BX) Ex Virgin Australia VH-VBS (IN SERVICE)
N555LV (737-7BD) Air Tran NTU (IN SERVICE)
N556WN (737-7BD) Air Tran NTU (IN SERVICE)
N557WN (737-790) Ex Alaska Airlines N623AS (IN SERVICE)
N558WN (737-73V) Ex Estar Airlines HL8204 (IN SERVICE)
N559WN (737-73V) Ex Enerjet C-EZEJ (IN SERVICE)
N560WN (737-790) Ex Alaska Airlines N617AS (IN SERVICE)
N561WN (737-73V) Ex Estar Airlines HL8215 (IN SERVICE)
N562WN (737-790) Ex Alaska Airlines N624AS (IN SERVICE)
N563WN (737-752) Ex Lan Colombia HK4660 (IN SERVICE)
N564WN (737-73V) Ex Enerjet C-FENJ (IN SERVICE)
N565WN (737-76Q) Ex China Eastern B-2680 (IN SERVICE)
N566WN (737-7CT) Ex Westjet C-FWAD (IN SERVICE)
N567WN (737-7CT) Ex Wesjet C-FWAF (IN SERVICE)
N568WN (737-76N) Ex China Southern Airlines B-2698 (STORED/ IN MODIFICATION)
N569WN (737-76N) Ex Westjet C-FWAI (IN SERVICE)
N570WN (737-7CT) Ex Wesjet C-FWAD (IN SERVICE)

N798SW (737-7AD) Ex Eastwind N700EW (IN SERVICE)
N799SW (737-7Q8) Ex BWIA 9Y-TJI (IN SERVICE)

N7811F (737-76N) Ex Air Berlin D-ABBS (IN SERVICE)
N7812G (737-76N) Ex Air Berlin D-ABBT (IN SERVICE)
N7813P (737-7K9) Ex China Southern B-2162 (IN SERVICE)
N7814B (737-7K9) Ex China Southern B-2163 (IN SERVICE)
N7815L (737-76Q) Ex Virgin Australia VH-VBU (IN SERVICE)
N7816B (737-7L9) Ex Yakutia VP-BSP (IN SERVICE)
N7817J (737-7L9( Ex Germania D-AGEY (IN SERVICE)
N7818L (737-76N) Ex Jetair Fly OO-JAN (IN SERVICE)
N7819A (737-7Q8) Ex Oman Air A4O-BS (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7820L (737-79P) Ex China Eastern B-2683 (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7821L (737-7CT) Ex Wesjet C-FWAQ (IN SERVICE)
N7822A (737-76N) Ex China Southern B-2699 (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7823A (737-7CT) Ex Wesjet C-FWBQ (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7825A (737-7CT) Ex Wesjet C-FWBL (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7826B (737-79P) Ex China Eastern B-5032 (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7827A (737-79P) Ex China United Airlines B-5031 (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7828A (737-7CT) Ex Wesjet C-FWBW (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7829A (737-7CT) Ex Wesjet C-FWBX (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7830A (737-7L9) Ex Jettime OY-JTW (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7831B (737-7CT) Ex Westjet C-FWCC (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7834A (737-752) Ex Aeromexico XA-HAM (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
N7844A (737-752) Ex Aeromexico XA-GMV (STORED/IN MODIFICATION)
 
n471wn
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 6:40 pm

Quoting SWADawg (Reply 28):
That's really only 46 used -700's since you can't really include the 52 FL birds that were part of the acquisition

I have been through the fleet twice and I still show 48 used 737-700's and I suspect the 2 difference is that some posters are forgetting about the 2 ex-Fordair a/c
 
SWADawg
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 7:41 pm

I don't count those either as they were acquired several years prior to the AirTran purchase.
My posts are my opinion only and do not reflect the views of Southwest Airlines
 
MSPNWA
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 8:12 pm

If you really want to be technical, it doesn't take 88 73Gs to replace the capacity of the 717s. And we can say that the delayed retirement of the 733s and 735s replaced the rest of the capacity. The combination of delayed retirements, used 73Gs, and new 738s more than makes up for the 717s by now.
 
karadion
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 9:11 pm

Quoting n471wn (Reply 31):

Are you referring to me? That would be the "2 SAS Norway" I'm talking about which Fordair bought their jets from which ended up in Southwest's hands.

Serial # 29089 and # 29090
http://www.planespotters.net/Product...9089,N270WN-Southwest-Airlines.php
http://www.planespotters.net/Product...9090,N271LV-Southwest-Airlines.php

You see, Ascend doesn't track anyone in between the delivery operator & current operator from the general view. Anyone who operated a plane in between the delivery operator and current operator is not listed. Technically Ascend does track them but you'd have to look at each individual plane history more closely.
 
n471wn
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Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 12:23 am

RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 10:55 pm

Quoting Karadion (Reply 34):
Are you referring to me? That would be the "2 SAS Norway" I'm talking about which Fordair bought their jets from which ended up in Southwest's hands.

Not referring to anyone---I am just saying that the correct count for the used 737-700' s is 48 (not including any Air Tran a/c)
 
DDR
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 11:06 pm

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 21):

Is that an anti-Delta jab by chance? Let's not forget, AirTran did just fine with the 717 and apparently DL is as well.
 
JoeCanuck
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Joined: Mon Dec 19, 2005 3:30 am

RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 11:27 pm

Quoting DDR (Reply 36):
Is that an anti-Delta jab by chance? Let's not forget, AirTran did just fine with the 717 and apparently DL is as well.

I don't know if that was a shot at Delta or not, but I agree with the sentiment. Keeping a one type fleet is probably saving them the price of those used -700's. It would have cost a fortune to have to train people for, and have to support an entirely new fleet.

They are both winners in the deal. Delta has enough 717's to get great savings because of commonality as well.
What the...?
 
DiamondFlyer
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Thu Jul 02, 2015 11:52 pm

Quoting joeCanuck (Reply 37):
It would have cost a fortune to have to train people for, and have to support an entirely new fleet.

They had people trained in it, they had a support system already there for it. It wasn't a new fleet type, it was an absorbed fleet type. They just wanted nothing but 737's.

-DiamondFlyer
From my cold, dead hands
 
gr8slvrflt
Posts: 1485
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Fri Jul 03, 2015 12:04 am

Southwest has also taken delivery of almost 100 737-800s since the AirTran acquisition ~
I work for Southwest, but the views expressed are my own and do not necessarily represent those of Southwest.
 
karadion
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:42 am

Quoting n471wn (Reply 35):

So where's the missing two? Two sources I use have exactly the same information.

Here's the serial list:
28008
28009
28013
28209
28253
28255
28436
28609
28654
29089
29090
30035
30041
30042
30166
30244
30248
30249
30279
30280
30282
30288
30542
30649
30657
30744
30745
30746
30778
32417
32582
32583
32596
32747
32748
32749
32750
32751
32752
32753
33656
33657
33697
33789
34296
35118

So with that serial list, can you find out what the missing two you're referring to?
 
n471wn
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Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 12:23 am

RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Fri Jul 03, 2015 2:51 am

Quoting Karadion (Reply 40):
So where's the missing two? Two sources I use have exactly the same information.

You are missing 30617 and 34294 which are currently flying in Mexico but are scheduled to go to SWA
 
karadion
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Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2014 8:06 pm

RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Fri Jul 03, 2015 2:55 am

Quoting n471wn (Reply 41):

So in other words, the sale hasn't been finalized yet so it's still 46. 30617 and 34294 will not join SWA until October 30th at the very least and is owned by Apollo Aviation Holdings on lease to Aeromexico.
 
n471wn
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Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 12:23 am

RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Fri Jul 03, 2015 4:17 am

Quoting Karadion (Reply 42):
So in other words, the sale hasn't been finalized yet so it's still 46. 30617 and 34294 will not join SWA until October 30th at the very least and is owned by Apollo Aviation Holdings on lease to Aeromexico.

Ok technically you are correct but they are coming so let's not quibble as I know this to be a "done deal" so I count them and if you do not wish to do so that is fine--we are all just trying to share information
 
mwh787
Topic Author
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Fri Jul 03, 2015 4:18 am

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 33):

If you really want to be technical, it doesn't take 88 73Gs to replace the capacity of the 717s. And we can say that the delayed retirement of the 733s and 735s replaced the rest of the capacity. The combination of delayed retirements, used 73Gs, and new 738s more than makes up for the 717s by now.

Yes this does show the 717's have been replaced and more capacity added.


It should start to show that WN was very smart in ditching the 717's, not because there are a bad airplane (there are not bad) They were smart to keep the commonality and stay with 737 family. It is a great luxury for WN.
 
JoeCanuck
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Joined: Mon Dec 19, 2005 3:30 am

RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Fri Jul 03, 2015 5:13 am

Quoting DiamondFlyer (Reply 38):
They had people trained in it, they had a support system already there for it. It wasn't a new fleet type, it was an absorbed fleet type. They just wanted nothing but 737's.

I agree...they only wanted the 737's. It seems that was the primary reason for buying Airtran.

Technically, they owned the support system and held the jobs but they were far from absorbed. WN made it clear very soon after the purchase of Airtran that they were not interested in a second aircraft type and absorbing the 717 fleet and all that entailed wasn't as cost effective as passing the 717's on to someone who really wanted them.
What the...?
 
SXDFC
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RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Fri Jul 03, 2015 5:54 am

Quoting Karadion (Reply 40):

Are these the serials to the planes that I've listed or to other -700s that have yet to get a WN regi?
 
n471wn
Posts: 1717
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 12:23 am

RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Fri Jul 03, 2015 4:28 pm

Quoting SXDFC (Reply 46):
Are these the serials to the planes that I've listed or to other -700s that have yet to get a WN regi?

Both. The 48 serials are those in service, those undergoing modifications, in storage awaiting modification and those still flying with other carriers but under contract and scheduled to go to WN but not yet registered to them.
 
SWADawg
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Joined: Tue Dec 03, 2013 6:43 pm

RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Fri Jul 03, 2015 9:13 pm

Quoting n471wn (Reply 47):

Great. Only 40 more -700's need to be acquired to replace the 88 717's that left the fleet already, and I don't count new -800's from Boeing that WN already had orders and options for prior to the FL acquisition.
My posts are my opinion only and do not reflect the views of Southwest Airlines
 
grain
Posts: 39
Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2008 3:38 am

RE: WN Acquiring 20 Used -700 Planes?

Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:48 pm

48 737 planes is 6864 seats
88 717 planes is 10296 seats.

they only need 72 to replace the 88 717.

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