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longhauler
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Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 2:53 pm

So ... it's not Melbourne after all.

http://aircanada.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=43&item=901
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ben175
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:12 pm

Great news for BNE! Was hoping they would launch MEL though.
 
airplanedaj
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:13 pm

Congrats to both AC and BNE! Nice to see BNE getting some love when seemingly all the love is going to MEL. Hopefully the route works!
 
Noise
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:25 pm

I think most of us knew it was going to be BNE and not MEL. With that being said, Congrats to AC and BNE!!
 
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OA412
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:52 pm

Quoting Noise (Reply 3):

I think most of us knew it was going to be BNE and not MEL. With that being said, Congrats to AC and BNE!!

Is YVR-MEL on the 788 even doable with any sort of meaningful payload?

[Edited 2015-07-08 08:52:26]
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ytz
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 4:27 pm

Quoting ben175 (Reply 1):
Great news for BNE! Was hoping they would launch MEL though.

Wouldn't the the 788 be too short-legged and small for MEL?

I don't get why AC lauches with 3x weekly. Why not go daily?
 
Scorp82
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 4:36 pm

In another recent thread, there were high indications the new route to Australia by AC would be to BNE as opposed to MEL for a variety of reasons.

One factor as to why AC is commencing BNE 3x weekly is because of the current bilateral agreement between Canada and Australia. Unless I am mistaken, the current agreement only allows 2 cities in Australia to be served by Canadian carriers as a whole, in this case SYD and now BNE. I understand there are only 3 weekly frequencies currently allotted, thus a major reason YVR-BNE will only be operated as such and not with higher frequency, such as daily.
 
Noise
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 4:36 pm

Quoting OA412 (Reply 4):

Is YVR-MEL on the 788 even doable with any sort of meaningful payload?

I believe so. Whatever airline decides to start MEL-YVR, it would have to be either with the 777-200LR or the 789.
 
wpigott
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 4:40 pm

Quoting YTZ (Reply 5):
I don't get why AC lauches with 3x weekly. Why not go daily?

There probably aren't enough 788s in the fleet free to fly the route daily, once they get more 789 to free up another 788 they'll go daily.
 
Thenoflyzone
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 4:42 pm

Quoting OA412 (Reply 4):
Is YVR-MEL on the 788 even doable with any sort of meaningful payload?

Meaningful payload, yes. Max payload, not quite. At over 7000nm, it is definitely pushing the range of the 788.

YVR-MEL, should it come to be, would probably be operated by a B789.
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a380787
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 4:57 pm

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 9):

YVR-MEL, should it come to be, would probably be operated by a B789.
Quoting scorp82 (Reply 6):
Unless I am mistaken, the current agreement only allows 2 cities in Australia to be served by Canadian carriers as a whole, in this case SYD and now BNE.

Now that BNE is coming along, the chance of YVR-MEL is pretty much nil unless AC cancels one of the 2 existing destinations.

BNE is a lot more logical than MEL. AC can leverage UA's LAX-MEL for any Canada-MEL traffic while UA can now leverage AC's YVR-BNE for any US-BNE traffic (not as efficient as via LAX, but helps a bit)
 
briguychau
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 5:03 pm

Quoting YTZ (Reply 5):
I don't get why AC lauches with 3x weekly. Why not go daily?

The current Canada Australia air bilateral allows only 3000 seats per week for one country's airlines. AC would love to do daily but it's not possible at this time. In fact they say in the press release that they intend to go daily once they obtain government approval.

[Edited 2015-07-08 10:05:33]
 
behramjee
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 5:06 pm

Interesting move and nice to see AC experimenting with niche long haul markets. Market demand to/from Canada to Brisbane is nothing great but it will get feed from U.S. West Coast and perhaps ORD/EWR/Texas too which should help out. Starting off with 3 weekly is good but flying daily year round will be very interesting to monitor.

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 9):
YVR-MEL, should it come to be, would probably be operated by a B789.

YVR-MEL is a 15 hour 45 minute flight approx so it cannot be performed by the B789 but rather B77L only.
 
Thenoflyzone
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 5:07 pm

Quoting a380787 (Reply 10):
the chance of YVR-MEL is pretty much nil unless AC cancels one of the 2 existing destinations.

.....or the bilateral is amended to add a third destination and more seats/week, which is clearly something AC will be pushing for regardless.

"... with the intention to increase to daily service, subject to obtaining the necessary government approvals."
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a380787
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 5:10 pm

Quoting behramjee (Reply 12):
. Market demand to/from Canada to Brisbane is nothing great but it will get feed from U.S. West Coast and perhaps ORD/EWR/Texas too which should help out. Starting off with 3 weekly is good but flying daily year round will be very interesting to monitor.

Only certain parts of west coast. A LAX-YVR-BNE flight is quite a bit longer than LAX-BNE nonstop offered by QF/VA or even LAX-AKL-BNE on NZ.

From east coast, especially the northeast, a transit through YVR would be relatively competitive against at transit at LAX (discounting small nuances of higher NAVCAN taxes and transit passport control)
 
Thenoflyzone
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 5:51 pm

Quoting behramjee (Reply 12):
cannot be performed by the B789

Cannot is a bit too harsh. Technically it can.

According to the Boeing ACAP (which btw only has typical engines on its payload/range chart for the 789, not hi-thrust) anything over 7500 nm ESAD means they will have to leave some of the 298 seats open, as payload capacity goes below 70,000 lb.

http://www.boeing.com/assets/pdf/commercial/airports/acaps/787.pdf

Page 24.

Considering YVR-MEL is 7118 nm, and that with the headwinds and ATC routings the ESAD is probably closer to 8000 nm, seats will definitely need to be kept open (with typical engines). So yes, it is not as ideal as the 77L.

Keep in mind though that hi-thrust engines will improve those payload-range numbers. So it's not as bad as it seems.

Plus Airbus and Boeing ACAPs usually tend to be more conservative in the values they give.

[Edited 2015-07-08 11:03:47]
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Noise
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 5:53 pm

Quoting briguychau (Reply 11):
The current Canada Australia air bilateral allows only 3000 seats per week for one country's airlines. AC would love to do daily but it's not possible at this time. In fact they say in the press release that they intend to go daily once they obtain government approval.

If they can change the number of seats allowed, maybe they can change the number of destinations allowed as well, from 2 to 3?

Also, what are the chances of an Australian airline such as Qantas or Virgin Australia starting YVR-MEL instead of Air Canada?
 
a380787
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 6:11 pm

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 13):

.....or the bilateral is amended to add a third destination and more seats/week, which is clearly something AC will be pushing for regardless.
Quoting Noise (Reply 16):
Quoting briguychau (Reply 11):
The current Canada Australia air bilateral allows only 3000 seats per week for one country's airlines. AC would love to do daily but it's not possible at this time. In fact they say in the press release that they intend to go daily once they obtain government approval.

AC 788 = 251 seats
AC 77L = 270 seats
AC 789 = 298 seats (30 biz seats here instead of 42 on the 77L, and 77L is still at 9-abreast)

Daily 77L takes 270 x 7 = 1890 seats. 1110 residual seats / 251 seats-of-788 = 4.4x weekly cap for YVR-BNE

Even if YVR-SYD is downgauged to 788, 3000 seats would mean 11.95 weekly flights - not even sufficient 6x weekly each.

Short of changing the bilateral (which has low chance), AC would have be creative with their seating configurations to make both of them daily.
 
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EK413
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 6:47 pm

Congratulations BNE & AC. Hope QF is watching this space another new route on Aussie turf thanks to the B787, time to firm that B789 order & bring the aircraft online pronto!

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N1120A
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 7:17 pm

Quoting a380787 (Reply 17):
Even if YVR-SYD is downgauged to 788, 3000 seats would mean 11.95 weekly flights - not even sufficient 6x weekly each.

Such a downgauging would be foolish, given the premium traffic.
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a380787
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 7:21 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 19):
Such a downgauging would be foolish, given the premium traffic.

I'm just showcasing the ceiling of the 3000 seat cap with hypothetical scenarios. No need to be rude.
 
Kaiarahi
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 7:27 pm

Quoting a380787 (Reply 17):
Short of changing the bilateral (which has low chance)

What's the basis for this statement?
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a380787
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 7:41 pm

Quoting Kaiarahi (Reply 21):
Quoting a380787 (Reply 17):
Short of changing the bilateral (which has low chance)

What's the basis for this statement?

Think from the Australian side - QF only fly SYD-YVR a few flights over winter for the ski market demand. Otherwise the rights are wasted on the Aussie side.

In terms of tourism dollars, it's hard to gauge what the net inflow/outflow might be (more Aussies heading north or more Loonies heading south), but in terms of air carriers, expanding it will lopsidedly benefit AC at the expense of QF/VA.
 
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Stitch
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 7:45 pm

Good news as this will be a fair bit more convenient for me from SEA when I travel to BNE.
 
edmountain
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 9:10 pm

Quoting Noise (Reply 16):
Also, what are the chances of an Australian airline such as Qantas or Virgin Australia starting YVR-MEL instead of Air Canada?

I would think QF would go year-round from SYD before doing anything else with YVR. And seeing as VA just ditched MEL-LAX in favour of BNE I wouldn't expect them to jump on the MEL-YVR route anytime soon.

MEL-YVR is a really long flight which I think would make it hard to work for anyone.
 
AussieItaliano
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 9:44 pm

Quoting a380787 (Reply 22):
Think from the Australian side - QF only fly SYD-YVR a few flights over winter for the ski market demand. Otherwise the rights are wasted on the Aussie side.

In terms of tourism dollars, it's hard to gauge what the net inflow/outflow might be (more Aussies heading north or more Loonies heading south), but in terms of air carriers, expanding it will lopsidedly benefit AC at the expense of QF/VA.

Not so sure I agree. Even if the rights aren't used on the Aussie side, but more options are available to Australian travellers and the impact is not unfair to the Australian industry, I don't think they would have a huge problem.

A real catalyst from the Australian side to change the bilateral would be if a Canadian carrier such as Westjet entered into a code-share agreement with QF from YVR. That would create more demand for connections through YVR as opposed to 2 connections via LAX and another city or via DFW.
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 9:45 pm

Just spent 3 days in Brisbane...great airport, great AirTrain, great nightlife...very cool place
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briguychau
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 10:07 pm

Quoting AussieItaliano (Reply 25):
A real catalyst from the Australian side to change the bilateral would be if a Canadian carrier such as Westjet entered into a code-share agreement with QF from YVR. That would create more demand for connections through YVR as opposed to 2 connections via LAX and another city or via DFW.

QF applied to codeshare many of WS's routes, but I'm not sure if they were ever approved.

Here is a list:

http://airlineroute.net/2014/09/10/qfws-codeshare-oct14/
 
Noise
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 10:09 pm

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 26):
Just spent 3 days in Brisbane...great airport, great AirTrain, great nightlife...very cool place

Really? I found it to be a rather quiet town. Melbourne, on the other hand, felt like a world-class, global and cosmopolitan city.
 
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EK413
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 10:36 pm

Quoting a380787 (Reply 22):
Think from the Australian side - QF only fly SYD-YVR a few flights over winter for the ski market demand. Otherwise the rights are wasted on the Aussie side.

QF have been operating YVR services the past month up until the end of July. The seasonal services return in December and I'd say when the B789's come online the service will become all year round.

EK413
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ZuluAlpha
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 10:51 pm

Quoting briguychau (Reply 27):
Quoting AussieItaliano (Reply 25):
A real catalyst from the Australian side to change the bilateral would be if a Canadian carrier such as Westjet entered into a code-share agreement with QF from YVR. That would create more demand for connections through YVR as opposed to 2 connections via LAX and another city or via DFW.

QF applied to codeshare many of WS's routes, but I'm not sure if they were ever approved.

Here is a list:

Short answer is Yes. QF have a codeshare agreement with WS

Checked on QF.com and have found codeshares on the LAX YYC and YVR YYC flights.

On a side note, unrelaxed .. WS did / is buying some of QF's 763's
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SpaceshipDC10
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 10:51 pm

This is cool to see AC getting close to the Gold Coast.
 
777ER
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Wed Jul 08, 2015 11:38 pm

This is excellent news and if the fares are competitive then this could cause NZ to loose some YVR traffic as the BNE timings wok perfectly with all AKL, WLG, CHC - BNE flights
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B737900
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:07 am

Reminds me of flying LAX to BNE a few years ago on Qantas. About a 13 hour flight arriving about 0700. Being accustomed to driving on the right side of the road. We picked up our rental car and headed out into rush hour traffic. Caught me by surprise; driving on the left. We were very, very tired and a bit confused. Say no more. Except that I loved Australia. Still do mate.
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airportugal310
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:32 am

Quoting Noise (Reply 28):
Really? I found it to be a rather quiet town.

Well, in all fairness, I do like a more "subdued" place...by great nightlife, I think I probably meant something that fit that description  
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qfvhoqa
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:35 am

Quoting Noise (Reply 16):
Also, what are the chances of an Australian airline such as Qantas or Virgin Australia starting YVR-MEL instead of Air Canada?

Slim to none. Slim for QF, as it's a very long flight and overflies QF's SYD hub. None for VA, their 77W didn't do that well on MEL-LAX and YVR is a bridge too far.

Quoting a380787 (Reply 17):
Even if YVR-SYD is downgauged to 788, 3000 seats would mean 11.95 weekly flights - not even sufficient 6x weekly each.

SYD has far more demand to & beyond YVR than BNE, so I can't imagine AC downgrading SYD for the sake of BNE. What will be interesting though is that AC usually upgrades SYD from 77L to 77W over the Northern Winter. That won't be possible with BNE using up the remaining capacity.

Quoting Kaiarahi (Reply 21):
What's the basis for this statement?
Quoting a380787 (Reply 22):
Think from the Australian side - QF only fly SYD-YVR a few flights over winter for the ski market demand. Otherwise the rights are wasted on the Aussie side.

I think it is reluctance on both sides. QF being in bed with EK would not win them any friends in Canada, especially with AC's strong lobbying.
QF previously wanted the ability to fly SYD-LAX-Canada but was restricted to SYD-HNL/SFO-Canada. Canada denied that request.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 32):
This is excellent news and if the fares are competitive then this could cause NZ to loose some YVR traffic as the BNE timings wok perfectly with all AKL, WLG, CHC - BNE flights

That's quite a detour, the pricing would have to be pretty good. It's like flying AKL-SYD-LAX, some people do it for the price but not a lot. NZ will lose more Australia-Canada traffic that used to transit AKL than they will lose NZ-Canada traffic.
 
777ER
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:41 am

Quoting qfvhoqa (Reply 35):
Quoting 777ER (Reply 32):
This is excellent news and if the fares are competitive then this could cause NZ to loose some YVR traffic as the BNE timings wok perfectly with all AKL, WLG, CHC - BNE flights

That's quite a detour, the pricing would have to be pretty good. It's like flying AKL-SYD-LAX, some people do it for the price but not a lot. NZ will lose more Australia-Canada traffic that used to transit AKL than they will lose NZ-Canada traffic.

Yes it is a detour but I've done WLG-MEL-LAX and LAX-SYD-WLG with UA before and will do it again. Might even look at via Asia also. The price compared to via AKL to LAX is a big saving. Since the flights are not daily, NZ won't loose much traffic compared to if it was daily.
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travelin man
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:43 am

I am honestly very surprised that Australia and Canada do not have an "open skies" type of arrangement. Economically and culturally it would seem that they are similar and there wouldn't be a huge advantage for one country versus another.
 
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sunrisevalley
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 1:53 am

Quoting behramjee (Reply 12):
YVR-MEL is a 15 hour 45 minute flight approx so it cannot be performed by the B789 but rather B77L only.

At 16-hrs the 789 would be at less than max passenger load. I figure the westbound time on a not so good day at 16hrs 15 min. Don't forget to deduct from the ACAP payload tables about 4t for catering , crew and their bags. This is equivalent to about 35 passengers.
 
Noise
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 3:16 am

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 38):
At 16-hrs the 789 would be at less than max passenger load. I figure the westbound time on a not so good day at 16hrs 15 min. Don't forget to deduct from the ACAP payload tables about 4t for catering , crew and their bags. This is equivalent to about 35 passengers.

Looks like the 777-200LR would have been your best bet for YVR-MEL nonstop.
 
Thenoflyzone
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 3:34 am

Quoting travelin man (Reply 37):

I am honestly very surprised that Australia and Canada do not have an "open skies" type of arrangement.

The agreement dates back to 1988 ( with an amendment in 2000). Until now, there has been no need to modify it. I'm sure something will be done in the coming year enabling AC to at least fly daily each to SYD and BNE.
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IndianicWorld
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 7:14 am

Route length wise, MEL would only work with the 77L or at a stretch the 789, but in AC's config I am not so sure the latter is well suited. BNE was the only other option when they were looking at using the 788.

We will see how successful it is, as AC's SYD flights have stayed relatively steady at daily with a few seasonal increases over the years.

Comments attributed to the local AC rep had indicated that MEL was likely the stronger market of the 2, but given their aircraft they looked to use it would be less likely.

[Edited 2015-07-09 00:17:36]
 
tayser
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 10:25 am

Quoting travelin man (Reply 37):

I am honestly very surprised that Australia and Canada do not have an "open skies" type of arrangement. Economically and culturally it would seem that they are similar and there wouldn't be a huge advantage for one country versus another.

spot on.

MEL now only likely to happen if a) new bilateral is arranged and b) if the YVR-SYD flights were flown with 789s eventually thus freeing up the 77Ls for MEL if a) were to ever come about.
 
Sydscott
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 11:25 am

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 40):
The agreement dates back to 1988 ( with an amendment in 2000). Until now, there has been no need to modify it. I'm sure something will be done in the coming year enabling AC to at least fly daily each to SYD and BNE.
Quoting travelin man (Reply 37):
I am honestly very surprised that Australia and Canada do not have an "open skies" type of arrangement. Economically and culturally it would seem that they are similar and there wouldn't be a huge advantage for one country versus another.

I'm not surprised in the slightest there is no Open Skies:

1. The last time it was discussed AC wanted to do YYZ-LAX-SYD back when UA & QF were in an effective duopoly. QF wasn't using any capacity at the time and Australia didn't see the need to give AC access to the LAX route so the request was denied by Australia.
2. After that QF decided it wanted to return to Canada and had to do so via SFO but wanted to go via LAX. Australia approaches Canada, AC wasn't interested in letting QF onto LAX - Canada so Canada said no.

After that there was a period when neither served each other country. Then AC got wise, launched YVR-SYD direct and has made a success out of it. The question is still one of how we get from Australia to Eastern Canada. Given the way Australia generally negotiates these things I'd say we would want a lifting of the City stopover restrictions in North America, (which would allow for QF to fly LAX / DFW Canada), in return for the same for Canadian Carriers along with more frequencies / capacity. It would be interesting to see if Canada would be open to that sort of liberalisation because on one hand they appear to highly protectionist of AC but on the other this would benefit AC and, medium long term, would be good for both countries. So it would be interesting to see what was possible.

But congrats to BNE. I think people would be surprised at the ski traffic etc that BNE will be able to draw onto AC.
 
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sunrisevalley
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 11:50 am

Quoting Noise (Reply 39):
Looks like the 777-200LR would have been your best bet for YVR-MEL nonstop.

It was the only bet.
 
Gemuser
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RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:05 pm

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 40):
The agreement dates back to 1988 ( with an amendment in 2000)

Not to be too picky but the agreement dates back to 1949 (or there about), and it reads like it too! It was amended in 1988 & 2001.

Gemuser
DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
 
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sunrisevalley
Posts: 5392
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:26 am

RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:27 pm

Quoting YTZ (Reply 5):
Wouldn't the the 788 be too short-legged and small for MEL?

For sure. It is also close to coming up short on YVR-BNE assuming a typical day 14 hr. sector time. The load factor makes it possible from what I can tell. AC's air cargo loads have dropped substantially according to BITRE . Not sure why that would be but capacity required for freight is now only about one half of what it was in 2013.
 
Thenoflyzone
Posts: 3103
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 4:42 am

RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 1:00 pm

Quoting gemuser (Reply 45):
Not to be too picky but the agreement dates back to 1949 (or there about), and it reads like it too! It was amended in 1988 & 2001.

Gemuser


To correct your pickiness,

The 1988 agreement replaces the 1946 agreement. And the last amendment was in July 13, 2000. The only other thing that has been done since 2000 was the designation of VA in 2010.

http://www.otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/australia

http://www.info.dfat.gov.au/Info/Tre...s/18F9C02E8220C75ACA256AF8000C9F52

[Edited 2015-07-09 06:05:57]
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
drgmobile
Posts: 989
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 3:06 am

RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 2:01 pm

Quoting travelin man (Reply 37):
I am honestly very surprised that Australia and Canada do not have an "open skies" type of arrangement. Economically and culturally it would seem that they are similar and there wouldn't be a huge advantage for one country versus another.

My sense is that it comes down to timing. Australia certainly has taken a very liberal approach to international air services. Much has been made of its protection of trans-Pacific to the U.S. West coast from third country carriers but in my mind that represents a small bit of protectionism in what is one of the most liberal international air policy environments around.

While much has been made of Canadian protectionism, from outside observation of how the team has approached markets, Australia isn't typical of one where Canada would usually seek major limitations on frequency, capacity, points served, etc...
 
CPA62
Posts: 125
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:13 am

RE: Air Canada To Brisbane

Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:40 pm

There are high level trade talks happening at the moment in Vancouver. Talks are between Australia and Canada.
Maybe a new air agreement is on the agenda?

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