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KarelXWB
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Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 11:37 am

Los Angeles, Hong Kong, Bangkok, San Francisco, São Paulo and Tel Aviv will be served by the new 77W equipment.

The first 6 A340's will be returned to their lessors while three other A340's will be transferred to Edelweiss.

Press release:
http://www.swiss.com/corporate/EN/me...ss-releases/media-release-20150709
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SpaceshipDC10
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:07 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Thread starter):
while three other A340's will be transferred to Edelweiss.

Will they be used to replace the A330s or as a mean to develop WK's network/frequencies? Do they intend to use those on routes where range might be an issue?
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:10 pm

Quoting SpaceshipDC10 (Reply 1):
Will they be used to replace the A330s

I doubt that, Edelweiss will also receive a brand new A330 next year.
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
Cipango
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:14 pm

Quoting SpaceshipDC10 (Reply 1):
Will they be used to replace the A330s or as a mean to develop WK's network/frequencies? Do they intend to use those on routes where range might be an issue?

They are being used to replace the A343's and also to expand the long haul fleet.


No sign of what will happen to CPT and JNB as they are A343 routes, will they be moved to A333's?
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SpaceshipDC10
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:15 pm

Quoting Cipango (Reply 3):
They are being used to replace the A343's and also to expand the long haul fleet.

I was talking of Edelweiss' A330s, not LX.
 
Cipango
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:21 pm

Quoting SpaceshipDC10 (Reply 4):

Ah yes, I read your reply too fast  
Let's fly! Unless it's on a CRJ 200, then I'll stay down here.
 
DALCE
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:25 pm

No surprises but very good news! It looks like Edelweiss will be the Swiss version of Eurowings LongHaul  

WK A330-300 HB-JHR will come online next year as well, so good exoansion in the WK fleet!
Looking forward to new destinations!
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,CS3,E75,E90,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,
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Yakamoz
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:25 pm

Quoting SpaceshipDC10 (Reply 1):

In a economic press article, CEO of Edelweiss talk about new destinations. He is very interested in Philippines, Vietnam and Myanmar. Other North American destinations are following.
 
330lover
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:36 pm

Quoting dalce (Reply 6):
It looks like Edelweiss will be the Swiss version of Eurowings LongHaul

Exactly my 1st thoughts.
Fortunately with a much better livery...

I suppose we will also see more LX, operated by EDW flights to some destinations.
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LH707330
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 3:03 pm

Quoting Cipango (Reply 3):
They are being used to replace the A343's and also to expand the long haul fleet.


No sign of what will happen to CPT and JNB as they are A343 routes, will they be moved to A333's?

I think the plan is to keep some of the 343s. They've got 15 of them, so replacing the 6 oldest (but most-recently acquired) 343s and then moving three of the newer ones to Edelweiss leaves them with 6.
 
LXLucien
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 3:16 pm

Quoting Cipango (Reply 3):
Quoting SpaceshipDC10 (Reply 1):
Will they be used to replace the A330s or as a mean to develop WK's network/frequencies? Do they intend to use those on routes where range might be an issue?

They are being used to replace the A343's and also to expand the long haul fleet.

One A340 will probably be used to replace the single A332 the others for expansion. Far East destinations sounds very nice but very unexpected as almost all destinations in the Indian Ocean were canceled.
Quote "Syriana": "Beirut, it's like Paris in the Mid-East"
 
as739x
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 3:46 pm

SFO was not a surprise considering Swiss is running almost 2 daily this summer.
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kaitak744
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 5:28 pm

They currently have a fleet of 15 A340-300s and fly them to PVG, BKK, SIN, HKG, NRT, JNB, GRU, SFO, & LAX.

So, more 777-300ER orders coming?
 
VAM8789
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 5:40 pm

How is LX able to maintain a pretty good size long haul network, despite having less than 30 planes to fly the routes?
 
DALCE
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 5:49 pm

The 340 fleet does have some inreased mx-issues but LX is flexible in switching equipment on short term.
The TLV rotations can easily be operated by 321's or an available A330 from WK. This helps to overcome flights being cancelled.
The 330's are fairly new and do not have many mx-issues other than scheduled mx.
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,CS3,E75,E90,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,
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liftsifter
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 6:09 pm

Quoting VAM8789 (Reply 13):
How is LX able to maintain a pretty good size long haul network, despite having less than 30 planes to fly the routes?

Super high utilization of these birds. LX is a well-oiled money maker for LH.
A300 A310 A319 A320 A321 A332 A333 A342 A343 A346 A380 B736 B737 B738 B744 B763 B77L B77E B77W B788 E190
 
JOYA380B747
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 6:24 pm

Why isn't JFK on the list? Isn't there always a high premium cabin demand between JFK and ZRH?
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DALCE
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 6:42 pm

JFK has 3 daily flights, 2 ex ZRH and 1 ex GVA all operated by A330's. Plenty of premium seats available.
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,CS3,E75,E90,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,
753,763,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 7:17 pm

Quoting VAM8789 (Reply 13):
How is LX able to maintain a pretty good size long haul network, despite having less than 30 planes to fly the routes?
Quoting liftsifter (Reply 15):
Super high utilization of these birds. LX is a well-oiled money maker for LH.

These are the first four A340 in LX fleet. Just have a look at their schedule during the last seven days. They don't spend much time on the ground.

http://www.flightradar24.com/reg/hb-jma
http://www.flightradar24.com/reg/hb-jmb
http://www.flightradar24.com/reg/hb-jmc
http://www.flightradar24.com/reg/hb-jmd
 
Thenoflyzone
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 7:46 pm

Apparently these 77W will be operated by swiss global airlines. Will these be lower payed pilots and F/A's compared to swiss Int'l?
.
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thekorean
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 7:59 pm

Wouldn't 777-300ER be a good choice to fly JNB or will it still be payload restricted, being high and hot and all?
 
richiemo
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 8:24 pm

Wow!!! This is the first I'm hearing od Swiss getting 777s. That's fantastic. They will look most spectacular in Swiss colors. Looking forward to it.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 8:28 pm

Quoting richiemo (Reply 21):
Wow!!! This is the first I'm hearing od Swiss getting 777s.

Really? Where were you these last two years? On Trantor?

Swiss 773 Will Have 3-4-3 Seat Config...Bad Move? (by Gonzalo Jun 7 2013 in Civil Aviation)
Swiss Airlines Future 777-300ER Routes? (by g500 May 4 2015 in Civil Aviation)
Boeing Confirms SWISS' 777 Order (by NYC777 May 23 2013 in Civil Aviation)

[Edited 2015-07-09 13:31:03]
 
rbrunner
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 8:30 pm

Quoting richiemo (Reply 21):
Wow!!! This is the first I'm hearing od Swiss getting 777s. That's fantastic. They will look most spectacular in Swiss colors. Looking forward to it.

That's right. The last Boeing aircraft operated by the Swiss national carrier were the B747-300s operated by Swissair, disposed off many years ago (early 2000's, if I remember correctly)
 
panamair
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:36 pm

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 19):
Apparently these 77W will be operated by swiss global airlines. Will these be lower payed pilots and F/A's compared to swiss Int'l?

The pilots will belong to Swiss Global (name changed from Swiss European) - the same ones as the ones flying the Avros ("Jumbolinos") today; they are on a "cheaper" contract than the Swiss International pilots.
The cabin crew however will be the same as Swiss International (the cabin crew have never been split between Swiss Int'l and Swiss European)
 
Bluebellya380
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:49 pm

Can we look forward to another airline with 10 abreast 777s?
 
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mercure1
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:59 pm

JFK will receive the 77W on some weekly frequencies from delivery in February till end of March. Additionally Montreal will also see the 77W. Its part of crew experience and building hours.

The first long range route will be HKG effective April 10th with Los Angeles following on June 9th.
mercure f-wtcc
 
Thenoflyzone
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 10:53 pm

Quoting panamair (Reply 24):
they are on a "cheaper" contract than the Swiss International pilots.

that's what i figured !

Well I hope at least the Swiss Global B77W pilots get paid more (even if only slightly!) than the Swiss intl A333/A343 pilots. That's a difference of at least 100 seats, so the pay should go with the added responsibility.

btw, the Swiss intl pilot union really agreed to this?

[Edited 2015-07-09 15:55:18]
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
smi0006
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 11:38 pm

For anyone interested- the cabin.

http://www.ausbt.com.au/new-swiss-bo...=flipper&utm_campaign=home-flipper

http://youtu.be/t0hC0IIEUvE

Looks beautiful to me!! Very very understated and classy. Are they doors into F, as opposed to curtains? Be nice if American Airlines brought proper curtains back!

[Edited 2015-07-09 16:43:19]
 
laca773
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Thu Jul 09, 2015 11:47 pm

Quoting JOYA380B747 (Reply 16):
Why isn't JFK on the list? Isn't there always a high premium cabin demand between JFK and ZRH?

JFK doesn't need the range of the 77W.
 
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res77W
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 12:53 am

Quoting Bluebellya380 (Reply 25):

Yes.
 
Viscount724
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 2:21 am

Quoting JOYA380B747 (Reply 16):
Why isn't JFK on the list? Isn't there always a high premium cabin demand between JFK and ZRH?
Quoting dalce (Reply 17):
JFK has 3 daily flights, 2 ex ZRH and 1 ex GVA all operated by A330's. Plenty of premium seats available.

And the overall New York market has 3 daily from ZRH including 1 to EWR in addition to the 2 to JFK..
 
incitatus
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 2:53 am

340 seats on a 3-class 77W is quite dense. Coach is 10-abreast and the legroom is nothing to write home about.

Business has a good seat, but it is a bit slim and the window seats do not have direct aisle access. Depending on how one wants to count, it could be said Business is also 10-abreast.

Now the F seat, F***! It is awesome. It makes that blinged out Emirates first class look so 1990s. Swiss F is real class. Only thing left is to call it Swissair.
I do not consume Murdoch products including the Wall Street Journal
 
Rafabozzolla
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 4:49 am

Quoting incitatus (Reply 32):
Depending on how one wants to count, it could be said Business is also 10-abreast.

No it couldn´t. That´s quite a stretch and you know it.
 
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Boeing778X
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 4:55 am

I guess TLV surprises me. What there to demand a plane that size?
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LXLucien
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:37 am

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 27):
btw, the Swiss intl pilot union really agreed to this?

As far as I saw it in the media, No!
But it's a tricky terrain, maybe something in the background has been agreed.
Quote "Syriana": "Beirut, it's like Paris in the Mid-East"
 
The777Man
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:47 am

Really looking forward to seeing LX's 77W here at LAX in 11 months from now!

Routes are logical; GRU and LAX are too long for the 333 to fly nonstop.

The livery is simple but very classy. It will be nice to see Swiss flying the 777-300/ER soon!

The777Man
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777
 
aviationaware
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:19 am

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 27):
Well I hope at least the Swiss Global B77W pilots get paid more (even if only slightly!) than the Swiss intl A333/A343 pilots.

Most definitely not.

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 27):
That's a difference of at least 100 seats, so the pay should go with the added responsibility.

The size of the aircraft has nothing to do with pilot salary in Europe. That is a phenomenon that is exclusive to America. At Lufthansa for example, an A380 pilot earns the same as an A320 pilot of the same seniority. Pilot pay is solely dependent on seniority here in Europe.
 
DALCE
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:45 am

Quoting Boeing778X (Reply 34):
I guess TLV surprises me. What there to demand a plane that size?

Fleet utilization is the magic word here.
It helps tremendously to throw in a ZRH-TLV-ZRH rotation for long haul equipment otherwise standing idle at ZRH.
Currently TLV sees mostly A330's but occasionly a A340 is thrown in the mix or even Edelweiss equipment.
Other than that LX has a very very good reputation in Israel.
I have no doubt LX will fill the lower yielding seats. Premium is a different story, probably mostly upgrades
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,CS3,E75,E90,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,
753,763,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
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SR380
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 8:47 am

WK annonce it will also receive a single A320 aircraft next year, and that LX A340 will be transferred to WK in 2017. They will open routes to Rio de Janiero and Calgary. Any idea if they will increase frequency on some existing route?

http://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/ne...dd-one-more-a320-three-swiss-a340s
 
DALCE
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:24 am

Will the additional 320 also be sourced from LX?
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,CS3,E75,E90,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,
753,763,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
ka
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:34 am

Quoting dalce (Reply 40):

Most probably yes. Word is it is going to be HB-IJU. The last of the the ex-SwissSun a/c still with LX. The other two are already with WK.

brgds,
Ka.
Keep smiling - you might be on Radar!
 
DALCE
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:43 am

Quoting ka (Reply 41):
Word is it is going to be HB-IJU

My thoughts exactly, other option was HB-IJX ( ex AB ) from my point of view.
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,CS3,E75,E90,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,
753,763,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
SR4ever
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 12:41 pm

Nice cabin, but J class now lags behind, as there is still no full access to aisle, whereas it is increasingly the norm in Europe.

No Y+ cabin either, quite surprising, as LX saif it would follow the trendn of Mother Lufty
 
Thenoflyzone
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 4:07 pm

Quoting AviationAware (Reply 37):
The size of the aircraft has nothing to do with pilot salary in Europe. That is a phenomenon that is exclusive to America. At Lufthansa for example, an A380 pilot earns the same as an A320 pilot of the same seniority. Pilot pay is solely dependent on seniority here in Europe.


Why not reward the pilots flying more passengers with more money? It makes perfect sense. more responsibility, more pay.

I think the way it is done here in N. America is the correct way. Seniority and aircraft gauge.

[Edited 2015-07-10 09:08:27]
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
330lover
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 4:58 pm

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 44):

So a bus driver, driving a 50 seater bus should earn more than a 30 seater?
Or the captain of a 2000 guests cruise ship should earn much more than one of a 500 pax luxury cruise vessel?

And what with common rated types?
Captain flying 340 this week and 320 next week? Should they give in a part of the salary?
Maybe not that common, but stil.

Next step is considering it flight to flight.
What about a 777 with low load (say 150 pax) and a 321 filled to the last seat with 200 souls on board...

Nope, an equal salary, based only on seniority, in one single company looks perfect to me.
But then again, we have never lived in a perfect world and never will...
Britten Norman Islander VP-FBR on Falkland Islands. THAT'S FLYING!
 
a380787
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 5:09 pm

Quoting SR4ever (Reply 43):
Nice cabin, but J class now lags behind, as there is still no full access to aisle, whereas it is increasingly the norm in Europe.

KL, LH, OS doesn't have all-aisle access either, even in their latest J re-designs.

It's mostly the oneworld carriers centering on the all aisle access meme, but there's also no indication that customers are booking away from LH/LX/KL just because of that. (the higher profitability of IAG over AF-KL or LH Group is a weak link to this)
 
aviationaware
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RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 8:53 pm

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 44):
Why not reward the pilots flying more passengers with more money? It makes perfect sense. more responsibility, more pay.

I think the way it is done here in N. America is the correct way. Seniority and aircraft gauge.

I think you would have a pretty hard time convincing the pilot unions of your views.

Quoting SR4ever (Reply 43):
Nice cabin, but J class now lags behind, as there is still no full access to aisle, whereas it is increasingly the norm in Europe.

Seriously, what are you complaining about? Yes, there are a few seats without direct aisle access. They will only come into the equation when loads are very high. And even then, there will most definitely be people traveling together who want to sit together and will value this above any direct aisle access.

This entire direct aisle access issue is a made up one. If you want to sit by the aisle you can do so on any aircraft, even Emirates with their 7 abreast J class in the 777. Quite the contrary, this seating arrangement Swiss has chosen is what I perceive to be commercially superior to the all-aisle arrangements. Swiss offer the vast majority a direct aisle access, but they also have seats that are very nice for traveling pairs - who have absolutely no nice way of sitting together in arrangements like that of Cathay or American. I can only laud Swiss for having been the first to come up with this extraordinary design. I think it was a bad move of Lufthansa's to have wanted to keep this exclusive to Swiss when they were selecting their mainline J seat. Getting this one would have been a very strong move.
 
Kashmon
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Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2014 8:08 am

RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:01 pm

kinda sad that Swiss new business class is not even competitive to Cathay's first generation flatbed

let alone the current CX flatbed to Zurich
and probably way behind the new CX Flatbed to be introduced to Zurich on a superior aircraft next year...

European airlines
always behind the times...
 
a380787
Posts: 4573
Joined: Tue Jul 09, 2013 4:38 pm

RE: Swiss Announces First 77W Routes

Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:17 pm

Quoting Kashmon (Reply 48):
kinda sad that Swiss new business class is not even competitive to Cathay's first generation flatbed

let alone the current CX flatbed to Zurich
and probably way behind the new CX Flatbed to be introduced to Zurich on a superior aircraft next year...

European airlines
always behind the times...

Why does every single one of your posts have to link back to CX ? They compete on exactly ONE route.

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