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queb
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First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 5:31 pm

 
ODwyerPW
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 5:47 pm

What are the significant differences between a 738NG fuselage and a 738MAX fuselage?
I know the MAX8-200 has different exits, but is the standard 738MAX fuselage all that different from the 738NG?

(I know the 7s are in fact different, with a plug combined with the rear section, but don't know what is specifically different in the 8 and 9).
learning never stops.
 
questions
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 5:58 pm

Why has Boeing never redesigned the cramped nose/cockpit, especially since these aircraft are used in much longer missions than the original series? Would it changed the aerodynamics of the aircraft significantly?
 
Arniepie
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 6:05 pm

Quoting questions (Reply 3):
Why has Boeing never redesigned the cramped nose/cockpit, especially since these aircraft are used in much longer missions than the original series? Would it changed the aerodynamics of the aircraft significantly?

My guess would be that they change as little as possible to keep commonality and certification.
[edit post]
 
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litz
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 7:00 pm

Now let's see if BNSF can get it to Boeing without dropping it in a river ...
 
hiflyeras
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 7:40 pm

Sigh...wish it was about 12" wider. People aren't getting any smaller.
 
AM744
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 9:05 pm

Quoting ODwyerPW (Reply 1):
What are the significant differences between a 738NG fuselage and a 738MAX fuselage?

There aren't many visible changes in the fuselage AFAIK . I don't think materials change either. (I'd love to know from someone knowledgeable if they do)
Major changes for the MAX will affect the wing and engines.
 
JAGflyer
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 9:40 pm

Quoting AM744 (Reply 8):
I don't think materials change either.

No changes in materials? I thought they were going to Dreamlinerize this new "MAX" variant of the 737 by using composite materials. I'm still curious why they chose to use pneumatic starters vs. electric ones (on the GEnx).
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KC135Hydraulics
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 10:05 pm

Didn't they have to add a little bulge under the nose to accommodate taller landing gear? If you look closely, you can see a small bulge in the lower right hand side of the fuselage under the nose.
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Natflyer
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 10:13 pm

Wow! This looks like...another 737. (Yawn).
 
Ruscoe
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 10:22 pm

Unless it has changed, the MAX has a completely new rear fuselage on all models, which is why the photo is disappointing because we cannot see that.

Ruscoe
 
bgm
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Thu Aug 13, 2015 11:36 pm

Quoting HiflyerAS (Reply 7):
Sigh...wish it was about 12" wider.

You mean like the A32X?  

This is one seriously pimped out 737. Boeing definitely have gotten their money's worth out of this vintage design...
 
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Boeing778X
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 12:06 am

Quoting bgm (Reply 13):
Boeing definitely have gotten their money's worth out of this vintage design...

I'm really eager for Boeing to move to the NSA/YA/797/737-X, but the 737 will always be my favorite type. Really excited for the MAX, and perhaps some of the progress made by it can be carried over to the next single aisle Boeing.
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 12:09 am

Quoting KC135Hydraulics (Reply 10):
Didn't they have to add a little bulge under the nose to accommodate taller landing gear?

That feature, though added at one point, has since been engineered out.

Quoting Jagflyer (Reply 9):
I'm still curious why they chose to use pneumatic starters vs. electric ones (on the GEnx).

Because an electric starter on anything larger than a PT-6A is a terrible idea. The only reason you go that route is out of necessity, a-la the fact that the 787 has no useful bleed system to start engines with. The pneumatic starter- in use for decades- has two moving parts: the on/off valve, and the spinny-real-fast thing. An electric starter has..... SOFTWARE. The nemesis to reliability.
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 12:34 am

Quoting queb (Thread starter):

Are you sure you didn't post a picture of an NG?   
 
Ruscoe
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 12:54 am

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 16):
Are you sure you didn't post a picture of an NG?

You can see 5602 stamped on the fuselage, which according to Karadion's Post is the first one for South West.

Ruscoe
 
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WROORD
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 1:00 am

Quoting HiflyerAS (Reply 7):
Sigh...wish it was about 12" wider. People aren't getting any smaller.

Exactly, and why do big people always take up my space just because I am thin? I pay for the whole seat and not the half.
 
KELPkid
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 1:07 am

Quoting litz (Reply 6):
Now let's see if BNSF can get it to Boeing without dropping it in a river ...

   However, I believe the train was actually on MRL (Montana Rail Link) trackage when the derailment happened...
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AirPacific747
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 2:05 am

Quoting Ruscoe (Reply 17):
You can see 5602 stamped on the fuselage, which according to Karadion's Post is the first one for South West.

It was a joke... but to the untrained eye, there's no difference what so ever.
 
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NWAROOSTER
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 3:01 am

Boeing can't make any significant or major changes on the 737 as the aircraft is grandfathered in.
I wonder how long the grandfather can survive??????   
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aerokiwi
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 4:37 am

I'm interested to see how the aircraft's attitude looks on the ground with the new, taller landing gear.

The NGs had more of a nose-down attitude to the Classics, and looked the better for it. The MAXs, I suspect, will have similar lines to the Classics.
 
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TWA772LR
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:00 am

Quoting NWAROOSTER (Reply 21):
wonder how long the grandfather can survive??????   

Well EIS of the MAX is about 2017, and the 100s EIS was in 1968. NG productions about 20 years old with a huge backlog, say 5 years max. So the MAX could see production until 2040. Throw in the secondhand market and the 737 series could very well see 100 years of service! A milestone that will probably only be matched by the B52 and maybe the C130 and TU95, and probably the DC-3 in remote parts of the world!
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hz747300
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:14 am

Still 42k ceiling service, or did they bump it up to 45k? Can they make it a teensy bit wider too.
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32andBelow
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:19 am

Quoting TWA772LR (Reply 23):
Well EIS of the MAX is about 2017, and the 100s EIS was in 1968. NG productions about 20 years old with a huge backlog, say 5 years max. So the MAX could see production until 2040. Throw in the secondhand market and the 737 series could very well see 100 years of service! A milestone that will probably only be matched by the B52 and maybe the C130 and TU95, and probably the DC-3 in remote parts of the world!

I'm sure DL will still be adding DC-9s   
 
hiflyeras
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:36 am

Quoting hz747300 (Reply 24):
Can they make it a teensy bit wider too.

They won't make it any wider because then they wouldn't be able to ship the fuselages by rail from Wichita to Renton, WA. God forbid they built the MAX fuselage near the assembly plant and widened it to equal the Airbus narrow bodies. I thought this was a huge mistake on Boeing's part but sales have been good. Still, an opportunity lost.

I also felt they should have moved the L1 (forward left door) back a bit, in a similar configuration to the L2 door on the 757 but that was just my preference...would make for a more civilized boarding process.
 
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csturdiv
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:52 am

Quoting Natflyer (Reply 11):
Wow! This looks like...another 737. (Yawn).

Wow, imagine that, a 737 Max looking like a 737. What were you expecting, for it to look like?
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Ruscoe
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 10:52 am

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 20):
It was a joke... but to the untrained eye, there's no difference what so ever.

OK my apologies.
The MAX however does look obviously different from the side in the rear fuselage behind the pressure bulk head.

Ruscoe
 
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barney captain
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 10:54 am

Quoting hz747300 (Reply 24):
Still 42k ceiling service, or did they bump it up to 45k? Can they make it a teensy bit wider too.

Maximum certified altitude is FL410 for the NG's. I suspect the MAX will be the same.
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neutronstar73
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 12:52 pm

Quoting KC135Hydraulics (Reply 10):
Didn't they have to add a little bulge under the nose to accommodate taller landing gear? If you look closely, you can see a small bulge in the lower right hand side of the fuselage under the nose.

I think the part you are looking at is the landing gear bay cut-out, and the image is deceptive in that it may appear to be a bulge. If you look real closely, there are no nose gear bay doors installed.
 
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cathay747
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 1:05 pm

Quoting Karadion (Reply 2):
FYI, the two digit customer codes does not exist anymore. Boeing stopped that when they started the 787 programme and that will continue onto the 737 MAX as well as any future projects. For example, 737-8H4, 737-8GP, etc will not carry on.

Yes, and I really wish they had not done this. I always liked
how you could tell the original customer of an airplane by that
code, no matter how many times it changed hands.  
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par13del
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 1:54 pm

Quoting HiflyerAS (Reply 26):
They won't make it any wider because then they wouldn't be able to ship the fuselages by rail from Wichita to Renton,

....or they could have gone the 777X route and try to "narrow the walls internally" with improved sound insulation.
 
VC10er
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 1:58 pm

Will Captain Kirk fly a 737? If they add anti-gravitational propulsion, perhaps!
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
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Polot
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 2:03 pm

Quoting KC135Hydraulics (Reply 10):
Didn't they have to add a little bulge under the nose to accommodate taller landing gear? If you look closely, you can see a small bulge in the lower right hand side of the fuselage under the nose.
Quoting neutronstar73 (Reply 30):
I think the part you are looking at is the landing gear bay cut-out, and the image is deceptive in that it may appear to be a bulge. If you look real closely, there are no nose gear bay doors installed.

Boeing found a way increase the height without the nose bump years ago, it was fairly early on in the program. You will notice that renderings of the aircraft don't have it. I agree that it is an optical illusion making it appear liek there is a small bulge in the picture from the landing gear cutout.

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/737max/#/gallery

[Edited 2015-08-14 07:05:14]
 
jayfred
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 2:24 pm

Quoting Ruscoe (Reply 28):
OK my apologies.
The MAX however does look obviously different from the side in the rear fuselage behind the pressure bulk head.

I'm curious - I haven't seen this. Can someone explain the difference (perhaps with a good picture or two illustrating the differences?

Thanks!
 
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Polot
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 2:32 pm

Quoting jayfred (Reply 36):

The MAX has a 787 style APU outlet/rear fuselage. You can see it in the pictures that I linked to in reply 35. Compare that to the stubbier version found on the current 737:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Andrés Contador - AirTeamImages

 
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Revelation
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 3:04 pm

Quoting TWA772LR (Reply 23):
Throw in the secondhand market and the 737 series could very well see 100 years of service! A milestone that will probably only be matched by the B52 and maybe the C130 and TU95, and probably the DC-3 in remote parts of the world!

Add to the list the KC-135 which is the basis for the 707 and is scheduled to keep flying till 2040.
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dergay
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 3:14 pm

Quoting hz747300 (Reply 24):
Well EIS of the MAX is about 2017, and the 100s EIS was in 1968. NG productions about 20 years old with a huge backlog, say 5 years max. So the MAX could see production until 2040. Throw in the secondhand market and the 737 series could very well see 100 years of service! A milestone that will probably only be matched by the B52 and maybe the C130 and TU95, and probably the DC-3 in remote parts of the world!

Maybe throw in the AN-2
Flown on A300,A310,A318,A319,A320,A321,A330,B707,B720,B727,B737,B747,B757,B767,L382,L1011,C5,DC-3,DC8,
 
liftsifter
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 4:15 pm

Did they at least raise the window line so that, you know, you can actually look out the window... One of my biggest pet peeves with the 737, besides the narrow and short cabin.
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Sooner787
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 4:20 pm

Quoting liftsifter (Reply 39):
Did they at least raise the window line so that, you know, you can actually look out the window... One of my biggest pet peeves with the 737, besides the narrow and short cabi

Agreed, never noticed the difference until I flew to LAS last Sunday on an AA 737
and returned on a S80. The old S80 windows were at perfect height
 
citationjet
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 4:56 pm

Quoting HiflyerAS (Reply 26):
They won't make it any wider because then they wouldn't be able to ship the fuselages by rail from Wichita to Renton,

It is amazing to think that all 737 fuselages built since the late 1960s were built in Wichita (first by Boeing, now Spririt) and shipped by rail to Renton. I am sure multiple generations of families have worked on the 737 program.
Boeing Flown: 701,702,703;717;720;721,722;731,732,733,734,735,73G,738,739;741,742,743,744,747SP;752,753;762,763;772,773,788.
 
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GSPFlyer
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:02 pm

Quoting liftsifter (Reply 39):

Did they at least raise the window line so that, you know, you can actually look out the window... One of my biggest pet peeves with the 737, besides the narrow and short cabin.

How tall are you that you have that problem? I'm 6'0," I flew on a DL 737-900 recently, and found it to be about the right height.

Now I flew on a CRJ-200 a few years ago, and my neck hurt because of the awkward angle I had to bend down to see out the window.
 
bgm
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:56 pm

Quoting liftsifter (Reply 39):
Did they at least raise the window line so that, you know, you can actually look out the window... One of my biggest pet peeves with the 737, besides the narrow and short cabin.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed that. It's by no means as bad as the CRJ-200, but they are definitely a bit too low. Are Boeing also going reduce the cabin noise in the 737 MAX? I always found it noiser than the A320.
 
lostsound
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 6:57 pm

Quoting GSPFlyer (Reply 42):
How tall are you that you have that problem? I'm 6'0," I flew on a DL 737-900 recently, and found it to be about the right height.

I'm 6'3 and the 737s window height hurts for me. I look like an idiot trying to look out the window lol. The CRJ-200 is definitely worse though. I needed a chiropractor after that!
 
iahcsr
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 7:31 pm

How much higher will the Max sit than the NG? Not as much as the A320 obviously.
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Natflyer
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 8:52 pm

Quoting NWAROOSTER (Reply 21):

Well, the -7 Grandfather is already on a ventilator.
 
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barney captain
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:43 pm

Quoting iahcsr (Reply 45):
How much higher will the Max sit than the NG? Not as much as the A320 obviously.

The -700NG has a 1% nose down stance, the MAX will sit at 0%. I don't believe the overall height will change.
Southeast Of Disorder
 
14ccKemiskt
Posts: 87
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:56 pm

A 60s aircraft for the 2010s? Not sure if it is going to survive very long. But for now, it will do.
 
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Revelation
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 10:12 pm

Quoting 14ccKemiskt (Reply 48):
A 60s aircraft for the 2010s? Not sure if it is going to survive very long. But for now, it will do.

That's OK, some people were saying the same thing back in 1968...
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
The heart has its beaches, its homeland and thoughts of its own
Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
The heart has its seasons, its evenings and songs of its own
 
yeelep
Posts: 766
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RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 10:15 pm

Quoting iahcsr (Reply 45):

The MAX will sit 8 inches higher at the nose gear, the mains will stay the same.
 
AS512
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue Mar 24, 2015 10:46 pm

RE: First Boeing 737 MAX Fuselage Completed

Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:22 pm

Quoting yeelep (Reply 50):

Wouldn't the mains need to sit higher to account for the larger engines?

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