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BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 6:52 am

Link to thread 2 BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 2 (by KarelXWB Sep 9 2015 in Civil Aviation)
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joffie
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 6:59 am

Not sure if this has been posted however you can see some footage from inside the plane. Not much, but someone recorded the takeoff - https://youtu.be/BMZp8iP6isE

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N14AZ
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 7:53 am

Maybe I missed this information in part 2 but where is the Boeing now stored? Any pics?
 
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lapper
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 8:36 am

Quoting joffie (Reply 1):

Wow, incredible scenes from inside the aircraft. You can hear the explosion as well.

Lol @ the presenter though "the pilots stopped the plane in minutes..."
 
a320fan
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 8:38 am

Interesting video above. You can hear what sounds quite similar to a compressor stall when the engine goes. Also note how sudden and violent the yay is towards the dead engine, indicating it lost thrust quite rapidly. I would like to see the video un edited without the news reports around it but it seems the flames develop really quickly once the aircraft has come to a stop.
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D L X
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 12:06 pm

Quoting A320fan (Reply 4):
I would like to see the video un edited without the news reports around it but it seems the flames develop really quickly once the aircraft has come to a stop.

Seriously. The edit is ridiculous. My guess is that there were no visible flames until the plane stopped, and that's just not sensational enough for this report.

"I can only imagine how hot it was inside the cabin."
 
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TheRedBaron
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 12:21 pm

That video reminded me why I don't watch TV... thanks

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BravoOne
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 2:16 pm

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 2):

The airplane is parked in plain sight on the cargo ramp at KLAS. No big deal and I doubt if there are any photo ops.
 
richierich
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 2:31 pm

I would love to see the unedited version as well - but to be fair, this is not as oversensationalized as some news reports on air incidents. CNN is notoriously bad for covering these types of events.

I'm surprised ABC News didn't mention people leaving with their luggage, including some larger roller-type bags I saw in one video. I guess that wasn't deemed newsworthy enough.
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holzmann
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 2:46 pm

For those in the know, what is the procedure for an evacuation?

1. Captain and FO make a join decision? Or captain alone?
2a. Captain (or FO) gets on the PA, says what?
OR
2b. Captain (or FO) calls the head FA?
3a. All FAs react, unbuckle, get up, and open the door closest to them?
3b. Head FA gets on PA and makes the announcement. All FAs react, unbuckle, etc.

When/where is the decision made to open which doors? Which side? I know if's a water landing, the rear dears are not opened. The FAs know this and just don't open them.
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BobMUC
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 2:50 pm

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 2):

Maybe have a look at "Miamis" reply 152 of thread 2 or here
http://twitter.com/NYCAviation/status/641636023043235840


The heat must have been very high if you see the pictures with the damage and that the fire was "only" burning for some 3 to 4 minutes.

To have only 170 people on board might help with the flawless evacuation too. Could be a different story if this would have been a full flight with around 285....
 
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readytotaxi
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 3:11 pm

The BA pilot says,"that's it, no more flying for me."

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-34206347
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hivue
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 3:44 pm

Quoting readytotaxi (Reply 11):
The BA pilot says,"that's it, no more flying for me."

On his last trip anyway after 42 years with BA. No surprise.
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ssteve
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 4:23 pm

Quoting holzmann (Reply 9):
For those in the know, what is the procedure for an evacuation?

In this case, there's been mention of a 3rd pilot in a jumpseat who checked out the damage.
 
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 4:23 pm

Quoting holzmann (Reply 9):
For those in the know, what is the procedure for an evacuation?

I'll admit I haven't been crew for 6 years now but I really can't see the general idea changing. It depended on the individual airline procedures however the three I worked for all had the same ones.

The Captain / First Officer would primarily decide on initiating an evacuation in IDEAL conditions (as in just taxiing along and suddenly something happens), that said ANY crewmember can initiate an evacuation if they decide the circumstances warrant it (for example a cabin fire that appears uncontrollable) or a "Catastrophic situation" (to quote an old manual), that means should there be a big hole in the fuselage or the gear has collapsed or something similar then any one of the crew can initiate the evacuation as they may spot something that the guys/gals up front might not.

I've had a close one back in the day, I was sat in the aft galley on a 737 and myself and the assistant purser thought we were going off the side of the runway. We looked at each other almost wanting the other to start shouting the brace commands but just as we were about to agree on that we stopped and everything was fine. That could have been embarrassing for the pair of us...

For the record that is why some airlines have a PA from the Flightdeck which is "Attention Cabin Crew on Station", this means exactly as it sounds, it gets our attention straight away so for example if we were in the middle of a safety demo we would stop and move to our predetermined door assignments and await a further announcement which would either be a PA to advise us to "Stand Down", "Stand By" or to Evacuate. The announcement doesn't have to happen during taxi, depending on the airline they can be used after an RTO (had a few of these) but also perhaps during refuelling should something go wrong for example a fuel spillage resulting in an unsafe situation.

I'm glad to say I've never had to evacuate a plane outside of training 

Hope this helps  

Phil
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readytotaxi
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 4:28 pm

Quoting hivue (Reply 12):
No surprise.

Well yes, he was due to end with a Barbados flight from LGW.
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INFINITI329
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 4:31 pm

Quoting hivue (Reply 12):
On his last trip anyway after 42 years with BA. No surprise.

I hope he still gets a retirement flight, even if it is circling around the southern u.k. after that great career he deserves that water cannon salute.
 
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ER757
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 4:43 pm

Quoting richierich (Reply 8):
but to be fair, this is not as oversensationalized as some news reports on air incidents.

I don't know - it was pretty bad IMO. Good Lord, the reporting and comments were ridiculous as pointed out above.
 
D L X
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 4:44 pm

Quoting infiniti329 (Reply 16):
I hope he still gets a retirement flight, even if it is circling around the southern u.k. after that great career he deserves that water cannon salute.


Uhh....

what were those things on the fire engines pointing at his plane?  
 
vv701
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 5:36 pm

In the two earlier threads there has been some discussion about the impact of the loss - temporary or permanently - of G-VIIO from BA's operational fleet.

First a little history.

Until January 2008 and the loss od G-YMMM at LHR in a very heavy landing after power loss on finals, BA had a back-up 772 stationed at both LHR and LGW.

Following the loss of G-YMMM they decided to use just one 772 as a back-up for both LHR and LGW operations. So they did not replace 'MM. This has resulted in a significant increase in 772 ferry flights between these two LON airports. So, as an example, G-YMME positioned LHR-LGW yesterday (9 September) to cover for the loss of G-VIIO. This same 773 had last ferried to and from LGW as recently as 19 and 21 August. Diring its brief appearance in the BA Gatwick Fleet it operated a rotation to BDA and then to LAS.

Now BA appears to be without an operational back-up 772. But whether it needs one or can use another type is a matter for conjecture.

If it does need a back-up 772 then a wet lease either on an as required basis or more likely more permanently is certainly possible. But so is substituting an alternative type such as one of BA's 744s or 763s that are parked in the desert at VCV.

It has been suggested that aircraft sent to the desert are usually if not always Coca-Cola cans within weeks of their arrival. This does not apply to all the BA aircraft at VCV. Foir example here are two extracts from the 'British Airways Annual Report 2014', page 73:


'One Boeing B747-400 aircraft was permanently stood down from service during the period [2014] and seven Boeing B747-400 aircraft were temporaily(sic) stood down during the period.'


and


'Two Boeing B767-300 aircraft were permanently stood down from service during the period [2014] and four Boeing B747-300 (sic) aircraft were temporaily (sic) stood down during the period.'


Checking out the 'G-INFO' section of the CAA web site shows that the above aircraft and some retired prior to 2014 remain actively registered to BA. However there is a likely problem. All of these aircraft would likely require major maintenance before being returned to service. This will also likely apply to the three 744s scheduled to be withdrawn from use in November this year and the 763s that are currently in service, one of which is scheduled to be stood down next month with two more to follow in December. This is because BA most usually retires their old aircraft in front of a major service, usually a 'D' Check.
 
anjin
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 5:41 pm

"I hope he still gets a retirement flight, even if it is circling around the southern u.k. after that great career he deserves that water cannon salute"

He's probably very happy he got the water canon at LAS to be honest
 
roseflyer
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 5:59 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 19):

Now BA appears to be without an operational back-up 772. But whether it needs one or can use another type is a matter for conjecture.

Airlines with a fleet as big as the BA 777 fleet don't limit their spares that closely. Maintenance causes the number of spare planes to change every day. Some days there may be no spare. Others they could have 3 or 4 planes. Airplanes also get grounded for a variety of reasons. On any given day, one of the BA 777s is likely grounded for maintenance. Another two may be in C or D check. In general I think they will adjust their fleet as soon as they can. They don't need to pull a plane out of the desert. They can move the schedule around a little. It is quite fluid although they probably will need some extra capacity. Once their peak busy summer season schedule ends (which I assume is soon) they'll probably have some flexibility.
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G-CIVP
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 6:01 pm

"But so is substituting an alternative type such as one of BA's 744s or 763s that are parked in the desert at VCV".

Can't see that happening. Not worth the hassle and cost of returning the frames to airworthiness.
 
flightless
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 6:08 pm

Quoting anjin (Reply 20):
He's probably very happy he got the water canon at LAS to be honest

And he probably would be perfectly happy to never again have fire trucks coming out to meet his plane.
 
EMAman
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 6:14 pm

I suspect from the few photographs I have seen, a repair job will be expensive, or poss a write off. Funnily enough, the only other BA 777 I have been on (LHR - ATL - LHR in 2014) was G-VIIK, which was the 777 involved in the Denver fire in 2001, where sadly a life was lost.

If it is a write off BA will share with MH unenviable record of having now lost 2x 777!

Ironically, the 1985 MAN fire has been a recently reinvigorated topic of discussion due to it's 30th anniversary last month. There are some striking similarities here, but hopefully it demonstrates how safe flying has become, and in many ways (like Asiana 214) demonstrates how safe the 777 is, as we have the fortune of having not lost 55 lives as we did on that terrible day in 1985.
 
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 6:52 pm

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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 7:15 pm

Quoting Max Q (Reply 23):

Anyway, superb job by the BA crew as expected and a fantastic response by ATC and emergency services.

"I don't think it was particually great controlling, she didn't say anything to the Speedbird until he called her, she concentrated on the go-arounds. Making the pilot aware of what is happening to the outside of his aircraft is a vital part of the process, especially where the pilot can't see the engine. She should have at least told him the services were on their way rather than waiting for him to ask.

[Edited 2015-09-09 04:03:51]"


Personally, I disagree with the above statement... If I just had a rejected take off, the last thing that I want as a pilot is ATC distracting me. Pilot in the cockpit will have already know they have an engine failure with fire (hence the rejected take off, plus the fire loop detection in the engine), so there is no need for anyone to tell them anything. The more urgent thing the pilot need to do is to shutdown the engine (they can't evacuate until the engine is shut down), and second thing is discharge the fire extinguisher bottle to buy them more time... And once the engine is shutdown then initiate the evacuation. To do all that checklist will takes 20-30 seconds, which is approximately how long it takes the BA crew to do it before they inform ATC that they will be evacuating. If the ATC were to call the pilot and interrupt the process, it might take the pilot even longer before the actual evacuation starts (or what a logical pilot will probably do, will be just ignore the ATC while they are running the checklist, "if the ATC did decided to call")... Anyway, just my point of view anyway.
 
Gasman
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 7:30 pm

Quoting BobMUC (Reply 10):
To have only 170 people on board might help with the flawless evacuation too. Could be a different story if this would have been a full flight with around 285....

Yes, although ultimately the fire was contained........ so the time taken for evacuation turned out not to be an issue.
 
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litz
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 8:24 pm

Quoting thunderboltdrgn (Reply 25):
NTSB findings:

http://www.ntsb.gov/news/press-releases/Pages/PR20150910.aspx

this would seem to confirm this was an un-contained high pressure turbine disc failure ...

now the question becomes how/why ...

(and we get to watch a.net speculate for the next 12 months while the NTSB does its thing ...)
 
Gasman
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 8:31 pm

Quoting litz (Reply 28):
(and we get to watch a.net speculate for the next 12 months while the NTSB does its thing ...)

No, the NTSB gets to watch a.net for 12 months, chooses the most assertive opinions that incorporate phrases like "thermal component separation", and uses them for the basis of their report.  
 
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beau222
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 8:38 pm

How long until BA is allowed to cover up their name on the Fuselage?
 
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FredrikHAD
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 8:45 pm

Quoting gasman (Reply 29):
No, the NTSB gets to watch a.net for 12 months, chooses the most assertive opinions that incorporate phrases like "thermal component separation", and uses them for the basis of their report.

That's what litz meant, wasn't it?
 
Ronaldo747
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 9:01 pm

Several tweets indicate that the plane is already written off and will never fly again. RIP.
 
steve6666
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 9:17 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 19):
This will also likely apply to the three 744s scheduled to be withdrawn from use in November this year and the 763s that are currently in service, one of which is scheduled to be stood down next month with two more to follow in December.

The counterfactual to that is that G-BNLE was (according to Jethros) due to be retired two months after the BNLL incident happened. In the event, it got a stay of execution (from memory) for most of 2014. If VIIO is written off, presumably the insurance money will cover a D check for a 744. And with $45 oil, that won't be the worst thing in the world.

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 21):
In general I think they will adjust their fleet as soon as they can. They don't need to pull a plane out of the desert. They can move the schedule around a little. It is quite fluid although they probably will need some extra capacity. Once their peak busy summer season schedule ends (which I assume is soon) they'll probably have some flexibility.

Right, and there's also some (5?) 789s arriving in the next few months as well. I think with a mix of delaying 744 retirement, accelerating 789 deployment and juggling equipment between routes and bases they'll get over the next few months. I think they would be more likely long term to exercise an A350/B789 option than lease in a 772 - but it's going to get very difficult to attribute long haul fleet expansion to potential G-VIIO write off because of the general need for more long haul frames regardless.
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 9:21 pm

Quoting litz (Reply 28):
this would seem to confirm this was an un-contained high pressure turbine disc failure ...

The NTSB indicated a failure in the high pressure compressor, not the turbine.
 
voodoo
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 9:25 pm

Quoting wowpeter (Reply 26):
If the ATC were to call the pilot and interrupt the process, it might take the pilot even longer before the actual evacuation starts (or what a logical pilot will probably do, will be just ignore the ATC while they are running the checklist, "if the ATC did decided to call")... Anyway, just my point of view anyway.

Yep. Aviate, Navigate, and then Communicate.
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FredrikHAD
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 9:32 pm

Quoting jetwet1 (Reply 31):
(Quote from part 2)The crews were already heading for the engines when the alarm came in, as he explained it, they know the noises of an airport, when an engine lets go, it's something that clearly stands out from the background noise and they know the call is coming.

Now, that's a dedicated fire crew! You hear something is wrong and run to the fire engines, THEN the alarm bell rings! Those heroes know that an external fire will heat up the cabin quickly and those maybe 10 seconds from them running to the engines before the alarm went off were in no way insignificant. In this case, they may have avoided a penetrating fire causing the cabin to fill up with toxic smoke, causing the last passengers in the line to panic even worse and inhaling the fumes. Ok, I'll stop here... You get the point - seconds count. They cut a number of seconds.


Please all agruing about the ATC not doing a good job, listen to the recordings. She and the pilot goes on the radio simultaneously, her saying "...fireservices on the way" and pilot says "Mayday Mayday...request fire services". ATC then repeats "fireservices on the way". Nothing to complain about here. As they start transmitting simultaneously, they cannot realize they do (beacuse when you transmit, you can't receive), but ATC gets off the air first and hears the last part of the BA pilots call, realizing the need for a repeat. Besides, all of you complaining about ATC actions and radio behavior, do you have any clue as to what ATC is supposed to do in this situation? I don't, and I guess you don't either. Minimum disturbance for the pilots having the emergency sounds natural, but a quick flash to sort of confirm "yes, we see you're in trouble, help is on the way" makes the pilots realize that that part is being dealt with, and they can focus on the checklist. Please note that in both calls, ATC doesn't request a confirmation, just saying "Speedbird 2276, fireservices on the way". Exemplary.

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/Fredrik
 
rugger
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 9:44 pm

Quoting D L X (Reply 18):
Uhh....

what were those things on the fire engines pointing at his plane?

Those could be water or foam injectors on the fire trucks. Most big airports have these nowadays. In case of fire they can puncture the fuselage and spray in water, foam or other fire extinguishing materials into the cabin under pressure. Some of these systems can also inject a Halon mixture into the cabin where a "clean" fire extinguishing agent is needed.
They can take a fire down pretty quickly.

[Edited 2015-09-10 14:45:44]
 
huxrules
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 9:48 pm

Just a curious question- in the soundcloud recording of the ATC when speedbird transmits you can hear several alarms in the background. Are they fire or master warning?
 
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PW100
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:11 pm

Quoting Rugger (Reply 37):
Those could be water or foam injectors on the fire trucks. Most big airports have these nowadays. In case of fire they can puncture the fuselage and spray in water, foam or other fire extinguishing materials into the cabin under pressure. Some of these systems can also inject a Halon mixture into the cabin where a "clean" fire extinguishing agent is needed.
They can take a fire down pretty quickly.

I can't believe that you just posted that . . .
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bluesky73
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:13 pm

I've been reading this topic and watching the news since I got sky news alert on my mobile yesterday and with us just recently discussing the 30th anniversary of the British Airtours disaster we have to celebrate how far air safety has come since then. Hats off, full salute to crew, fire and emergency teams and ATC - great work all!
I'm sure there will be lessons learned but overall we had all passengers and crew disembark safely and according to NTSB mainly bumps and scratches so let's celebrate the success of what could have been a potential disaster if G-VIIO had passed V1 or timing circumstances were just slightly different (e.g fire spread quicker/further and/or caused death by smoke inhalation).

Sadly looks like IIO will not fly again but hopefully with further 789s/A380s arriving soon plus as mentioned in previous posts a rejig of either 744/763 retirements, the loss can be absorbed.

BA had not had good few of years (hull loss wise), G-YMMM, G-BNLL and now G-VIIO. Also G-EUOE was out of action for months when she had the engine naville emergency back in 2013. With a summer of shortages in the shorthaul fleet due to delays in delivery of LGW G-GAT* A320s I hope BA will get healthy slack and flexibility for next year otherwise Titan should purchase more aircraft, maybe a 777 to lease to BA in times of need 
 
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Aaron747
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:36 pm

I am a little confused by Flightglobal's description of the AD that affected this powerplant.

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...ntained-engine-failure-fro-416634/

In 2011, the US Federal Aviation Administration issued an airworthiness directive on a larger version of the same engine core. Pieces of seal teeth from the compressor's first and second stages exploded within the engine. The failure was traced to "heavy rubs" by the seal teeth and the FAA mandated that operators perform eddy current inspection to identify tell-tale signs of cracking that could lead to uncontained failures.

AD 2011-15-06 actually requires FPI and eddy current inspections of GE90-76B, GE90-77B, GE90-85B, GE90-90B, and GE90-94B powerplants. So, isn't the article misstating the AD applied to a 'larger version of the same engine core'?

AD.nsf/0/e320fd22cf917da1862578cd0046bc80/$FILE/2011-15-06.pdf" target="_blank">http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Gu...578cd0046bc80/$FILE/2011-15-06.pdf
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Fri Sep 11, 2015 12:35 am

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 41):
So, isn't the article misstating the AD applied to a 'larger version of the same engine core'?

No. The FG article is referring to a different AD issued for the larger GE90-115, not the GE90-94 family.

The AD they're referring to is this one:

Airworthiness Directives; General Electric Company (GE) GE90-110B1 and GE90-115B
Turbofan Engines
AGENCY: Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), DOT.
ACTION: Final rule.
––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
SUMMARY: We are adopting a new airworthiness directive (AD) for the products listed above, with
certain part number (P/N) high-pressure compressor (HPC) stages 2-5 spools installed. This AD was
prompted by an aborted takeoff caused by liberation of small pieces from the HPC stages 1-2 seal
teeth and two shop findings of cracks in the seal teeth. This AD requires eddy current inspection
(ECI) or spot fluorescent penetrant inspection (FPI) of the stages 1-2 seal teeth of the HPC stages 2-5
spool for cracks. This AD only allows installation of either HPC stator stage 1 interstage seals that
are pregrooved or previously worn seals with acceptable wear marks to prevent heavy rubs. We are
issuing this AD to detect cracks in the HPC stages 1-2 seal teeth due to heavy rubs that could result in
failure of the seal of the HPC stages 2-5 spool, uncontained engine failure, and damage to the
airplane.


http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Gu...57976004f3876/$FILE/2011-26-11.pdf
 
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Aaron747
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Fri Sep 11, 2015 12:48 am

Quoting ChaosTheory (Reply 42):
No. The FG article is referring to a different AD issued for the larger GE90-115, not the GE90-94 family.

Thank you. So that leads to my next question - why reference an AD for an engine core not installed on the accident airplane in an article related to this accident?
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Chaostheory
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Fri Sep 11, 2015 1:10 am

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 43):
Thank you. So that leads to my next question - why reference an AD for an engine core not installed on the accident airplane in an article related to this accident?

No idea. Doesn't make sense to me either. I have noticed a serious deterioration in the quality of FG and I don't think they have any writers with an engineering background. You'll find their writers often browse aviation forums to pick up scoops for their articles.
 
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RayChuang
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Fri Sep 11, 2015 1:22 am

By the way, what are they going to do with the plane? Can it be patched up enough so it could fly a short hop to VCV for repairs at the Southern California Logistics Airport facilities?
 
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BoeingVista
Posts: 2028
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Fri Sep 11, 2015 1:31 am

Quoting RayChuang (Reply 45):
By the way, what are they going to do with the plane? Can it be patched up enough so it could fly a short hop to VCV for repairs at the Southern California Logistics Airport facilities?

No, really doubt it. Fuel system in wing would need to be replaced along with engine, holes in wing may have caused further damage before you even start looking at damage to the structral integrity of the wingbox. It will be either a full repair at LAS or scraping.
BV
 
prebennorholm
Posts: 7020
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Fri Sep 11, 2015 2:34 am

Quoting RayChuang (Reply 45):
By the way, what are they going to do with the plane? Can it be patched up enough so it could fly a short hop to VCV for repairs at the Southern California Logistics Airport facilities?

With that "heat treatment" of the center wing box and wing main spar I would be very surprised to see that plane in the air again.

I would gamble my money on a scrapping. There are good tail feathers and one good engine, and not much more.

There is much more damage than what we see. Metal structures, which has suffered such heat, may look undamaged, except for soot covering. But remaining strength is unpredictable.
Always keep your number of landings equal to your number of take-offs
 
Skydrol
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RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Fri Sep 11, 2015 2:49 am

Quoting BoeingVista (Reply 46):
No, really doubt it. Fuel system in wing would need to be replaced along with engine, holes in wing may have caused further damage before you even start looking at damage to the structral integrity of the wingbox. It will be either a full repair at LAS or scraping.

This was fortunately only a small fire. It would still be possible to repair the airplane.

In the case of this 777, the fire was large:








LD4
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nm2582
Posts: 174
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 2:15 pm

RE: BA 777 On Fire At Las Vegas - Part 3

Fri Sep 11, 2015 3:27 am

To keep the idea of repairing this one in perspective, consider Qantas 32 (the A380 that had an uncontained failure a few years ago).

* QF32 has slightly smaller diameter engines and also was at cruise power; BA2276 quite possibly released significantly more kinetic energy when it failed (larger diameter engines, higher power setting at takeoff). Where that energy went is the crucial question...

* QF32 did not have a fire in the manner that BA2276 did.

* QF32 was a nearly brand new airplane (higher value to justify repair costs)

* QF32 took a LONG time to repair (time is money)

I'm no expert but I would be quite surprised if anyone even bothered to incur the expense of calculating repair costs.

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