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ITB
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Aug 01, 2019 5:05 am

Some news tidbits that may be of interest.

Two or three additional frames are planned to join the SpaceJet M90 test fleet in Moses Lake, WA, beginning this fall. Frame number 10, after initial test flights in Japan, is expected to be the first new test aircraft to be ferried to Moses Lake. Frame number 7 will then follow, and then possibly frame number 11. No timeline was given when the later two aircraft might join the test fleet.

Link: https://www.aviationwire.jp/archives/178180 [in Japanese]

At the 2019 Paris Air Show, Mitsubishi Aircraft finalized an agreement with the Triumph Group to provide engineering services in support of the design and development of the SpaceJet M100. Triumph's Aerospace Structure unit has been tasked with projects related to wing optimization and analysis and access of advanced material technologies, as well as weight optimization.

Link: https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... pa-459078/

In mid-July, MITAC and Triumph announced they had identified design changes to the SpaceJet M100 that should allow the aircraft will meet or exceed the targeted weight stipulations of U.S. airlines scope agreements. The goal was a 15% weight reduction of certain structural components. Triumph was tasked to focus on the wings, aft fuselage and empennage. As the announcement came just a month after the Paris Air Show agreement, it's possible Triumph's first charge was to affirm the design modifications of MITAC engineers as the MRJ70 was transformed into the SpaceJet M100. Of crucial importance was to confirm that the necessary weight optimization was possible and could be accomplished at reasonable cost. That it is indeed possible, as MITAC and Triumph announced, is a major step forward for the SpaceJet M100 program.

Link: https://atwonline.com/manufacturers/mit ... gn-changes [only the first paragraph is available if not a subscriber]

Lastly, it was announced in early July that mass production of the SpaceJet 90 has commenced, with expected delivery of the first frame still slated for mid-2020.

Link: https://www.sankei.com/economy/news/190 ... 01-n1.html [in Japanese]
 
JA786A
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Mon Oct 21, 2019 9:59 am

Nikkei reports that EIS may be delayed again due to difficulties in the production of testframes with the new wiring design. JA26MJ was originally planned to be completed by June but is still in production now. MITAC refuses to comment on the report but that doesn't deny it. Explanations are expected to be given on a press conference on October 31st.
https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Transportation/Mitsubishi-s-SpaceJet-has-new-name-but-suffers-same-problems
https://www.aviationwire.jp/archives/187481
 
VV
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:26 pm

Is it a surprise?
 
Noshow
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:32 pm

THEY should have aquired Embraer not Boeing.
 
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EMBSPBR
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:20 pm

VV wrote:
Is it a surprise?


And some here insist that it "annihilate" the competition ...
Everyone here knows that after EIS "headaches" and tweaking still occur ...

Meanwhile, the E175-E2, the last member of the E2 family, is already testing and preparing for the maiden flight by the end of this year ...
 
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ordell
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Oct 24, 2019 12:24 am

Oh good grief. I hope this is wrong.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... ys-461678/

Japanese news service Nikkei, without citing a source, says that the latest round of delays stems from setbacks with development of the aircraft's fuselage, which is slowing type certification.

Nikkei adds that Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, the airframer's parent company, is pushing for a revision to the delivery schedule. The first SpaceJet M90 was due to be handed over to launch customer All Nippon Airways in mid-2020.

Mitsubishi Aircraft declines to comment, saying only that there “has been no official announcement or comment on our schedule”.

The airframer adds that it has “made tremendous progress” over the past two years and is “in a much stronger position now”.
 
JA786A
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:39 am

Trans States Airlines has cancelled their order of 50 M90s (+ 50 options) as they are apparently not willing to wait for the M100. Meanwhile, comments on the EIS delay were postponed until next month.
https://www.mitsubishiaircraft.com/latest/mitsubishi-aircraft-corporation-statement-cancellation-of-trans-states-holdings-contract
https://www.aerotime.aero/zivile.zalagenaite/24137-mitsubishi-confirms-order-for-50-spacejet-m90-canceled
 
WaywardMemphian
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:46 am

JA786A wrote:
Trans States Airlines has cancelled their order of 50 M90s (+ 50 options) as they are apparently not willing to wait for the M100. Meanwhile, comments on the EIS delay were postponed until next month.
https://www.mitsubishiaircraft.com/latest/mitsubishi-aircraft-corporation-statement-cancellation-of-trans-states-holdings-contract
https://www.aerotime.aero/zivile.zalagenaite/24137-mitsubishi-confirms-order-for-50-spacejet-m90-canceled


Delays to the announcement of delays.

Is Japanese way of coming up with a reason to try to save face, kinda past that now aren't we.
 
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EMBSPBR
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:01 pm

Source: https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... rs-461915/

Excerpts:

"The decision to axe the order for 50 SpaceJet M90s – plus 50 options – was made "after close discussions" as the 88-seat variant "does not meet the requirements of the United States market", says Mitsubishi Aircraft."

"Further discussions will be focused on the scope-compliant SpaceJet M100 aircraft," the Japanese airframer states."

I think the long overdue M90 (and may still be a little late) will not immediately benefit the M100 project.
MHI still has a long learning curve ahead ...
 
JA786A
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Tue Jan 07, 2020 2:18 pm

JA26MJ has left the factory and is now at Komaki Airport. Ground tests began today. https://www.asahi.com/articles/ASN170BTKN16OIPE022.html Image Image
 
Nean1
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Tue Jan 07, 2020 6:35 pm

Twelve years and 5 billions dollars later ...
 
T4thH
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:08 pm

Nean1 wrote:
Twelve years and 5 billions dollars later ...

The regional jet program started already 2003 (with 50 Billion YEN by the Japanese government), to verify, if a regional jet program is liable. 2017 the MRJ program started.

2020 it will be 800 billion Yen, so 7.4 billion $.
https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Company-in-focus/Mitsubishi-hopes-global-ambitions-will-fly-with-revamped-jet
And the link to a YEN/$ calculator for 800 Billion YEN..
https://www.xe.com/currencyconverter/convert/?Amount=800%2C000%2C000%2C000&From=JPY&To=USD

And I believe, the price for the Bombardier maintenance network/CRJ program, which they are now shutting down (the CRJ program), is not included. These were additional 550 Million $ + 200 Million debt + additional costs till the CRJ program will be shut down.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/bombardier-mitsubishi-1.5188779


And this for firm orders of 67x M90 and 50x M100. The firm 100x M90 Sky West order is dead as a Dodo, as the M90 does not fulfill the scope clauses.
 
VV
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Wed Jan 08, 2020 12:18 pm

Twelve years is a long time.

Is their market assessment done fourteen years ago still valid?


Or perhaps they do not care about the market and the project is only to acquire a capability.
 
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Polot
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Wed Jan 08, 2020 12:22 pm

T4thH wrote:
Nean1 wrote:
Twelve years and 5 billions dollars later ...

The regional jet program started already 2003 (with 50 Billion YEN by the Japanese government), to verify, if a regional jet program is liable. 2017 the MRJ program started.

The MRJ launched in 2007, i.e. 12 years ago. It’s first flight was in late 2015.
 
T4thH
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Wed Jan 08, 2020 1:16 pm

Polot wrote:
T4thH wrote:
Nean1 wrote:
Twelve years and 5 billions dollars later ...

The regional jet program started already 2003 (with 50 Billion YEN by the Japanese government), to verify, if a regional jet program is liable. 2017 the MRJ program started.

The MRJ launched in 2007, i.e. 12 years ago. It’s first flight was in late 2015.


Of course you are right, it is just a typing error. I mean 2007 (and not 2017).
 
T4thH
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Wed Jan 08, 2020 1:44 pm

VV wrote:
Twelve years is a long time.

Is their market assessment done fourteen years ago still valid?


Or perhaps they do not care about the market and the project is only to acquire a capability.

All have failed; Embraer as also Mitsubishi have expected, the scope clauses on the US market will be modified. The unchanged scope clauses are still there and the E2 jets as the MRJ jets were to heavy and outside of the scope clauses of 39 t. Now Mitsubishi has to restart with the M100, to have a regional jet, which fulfills the scope clauses of 39 t and can carry an according number of 76 PAX.
No, the old market assessment was not valid.
 
Nean1
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Wed Jan 08, 2020 2:07 pm

T4thH wrote:
VV wrote:
Twelve years is a long time.

Is their market assessment done fourteen years ago still valid?


Or perhaps they do not care about the market and the project is only to acquire a capability.

All have failed; Embraer as also Mitsubishi have expected, the scope clauses on the US market will be modified. The unchanged scope clauses are still there and the E2 jets as the MRJ jets were to heavy and outside of the scope clauses of 39 t. Now Mitsubishi has to restart with the M100, to have a regional jet, which fulfills the scope clauses of 39 t and can carry an according number of 76 PAX.
No, the old market assessment was not valid.


Don't rush into the fate of 175E2, as the marginal development cost of the model does not reach 10% of the amount Mitsubishi has spent.
 
T4thH
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Wed Jan 08, 2020 3:08 pm

Nean1 wrote:
T4thH wrote:
VV wrote:
Twelve years is a long time.

Is their market assessment done fourteen years ago still valid?


Or perhaps they do not care about the market and the project is only to acquire a capability.

All have failed; Embraer as also Mitsubishi have expected, the scope clauses on the US market will be modified. The unchanged scope clauses are still there and the E2 jets as the MRJ jets were to heavy and outside of the scope clauses of 39 t. Now Mitsubishi has to restart with the M100, to have a regional jet, which fulfills the scope clauses of 39 t and can carry an according number of 76 PAX.
No, the old market assessment was not valid.


Don't rush into the fate of 175E2, as the marginal development cost of the model does not reach 10% of the amount Mitsubishi has spent.


Sorry... and what do you want to say? What has the statement, that Embraer as Mitsubishi have failed with their market assessment (and the expectation, that the US scope clauses will be modified)?

And there is a big and important difference between the MRJ70 and the E175E2. The MRJ70 was only few low t to heavy, so it will be possible to modify the jet to get the M100 and to get inside of the 39 t scope clause limit.
The E175E2 is just far too heavy, it will be impossible to modify the jet to get it below the 39 t. There is a reason, why the E175 is till selling pretty well (and the E175E2 not).
As the US market will be something like 70% of the total global regional jet market (so below 100 PAX, according to Boeing (and other forcasts) around 2400 jets of them 1600 for the US market) in the next 20 years and as other possible big regional jet markets (China and Russia) will be covered by local products (the SSJ for Russia and the COMAC ARJ21 for China); if the US scope clauses will not be modified, it is likely, no E175E2 will be ever sold. So it is likely/possible, 100% of the E175E2 development costs are for the bin.
 
VV
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:48 am

MRJ was launched in 2008. It was twelve years ago.

Do you think market needs may have changed since then?
 
Waterbomber2
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Jan 09, 2020 8:00 am

The big problem is that Mitac has been working 12 years on this and don't even have a flying prototype of the final production specification.
That aircraft would have to undergo its own flight test campaign, production and ramp up.
So it won't be before 2025 to see significant deliveries and by then who knows how scope clauses and the market will look. Plus PW1000 GTF technology will no longer be “advanced".

Might as well cancel the program right away and start working on a 200-seater instead.

Another big question is the implications of Japan's corrupt justice/legal system. Who's going to sign jet contracts with a OEM from a country with such a corrupt legal system? What assurance can customers they get considering that Japan's justices are known for protecting their big corporations at any cost no matter whether they are suing or defending? After all, this is a legal system that emprisons their corporate messiahs, who would want to do business with Japan anymore after what they did to Ghosn?
 
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brianK73
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Jan 09, 2020 11:37 am

Waterbomber2 wrote:
Another big question is the implications of Japan's corrupt justice/legal system. Who's going to sign jet contracts with a OEM from a country with such a corrupt legal system? What assurance can customers they get considering that Japan's justices are known for protecting their big corporations at any cost no matter whether they are suing or defending? After all, this is a legal system that emprisons their corporate messiahs, who would want to do business with Japan anymore after what they did to Ghosn?


Mr. Ghosn, as a fugitive from justice (no matter what one thinks of Japan's justice system, that fact is not in dispute), his credibility, veracity and personal integrity are separate issues from his managerial competence or his competence in misappropriating corporate funds.

As for Japan's government's justice/legal system, WorldJusticeProject.org ranks the countries in government openness, transparency, integrity, civic participation, complaint mechanism.

https://worldjusticeproject.org/our-wor ... Default1-1

Their WJP Rule of Law Index Ranking:

1. Sweden
2. New Zealand
3. Norway
4. Denmark
....
7. Canada
....
11. U.S.A.
12. Japan
....
15. Germany
16. Belgium
17. France
....
....
38. Brazil
....
....
81, Lebanon


I tend to think WorldJusticeProject.org, among other organizations, has more credibility than a fugitive from justice.

By the way, I believe a lot of customers "signed jet contracts" with the OEM in Brazil and will continue to do so.
 
commpilot
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Jan 09, 2020 12:14 pm

Nean1 wrote:
Twelve years and 5 billions dollars later ...


And still on a better track and budget than Berlin.
 
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c933103
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Jan 09, 2020 2:42 pm

VV wrote:
MRJ was launched in 2008. It was twelve years ago.

Do you think market needs may have changed since then?

That's why they are also changing spec of tgeir aircraft offer
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JA786A
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Fri Jan 24, 2020 11:06 am

Various media outlets reporting that MITAC has decided to delay EIS until 2021 OR LATER, citing "issues with the electronic system". https://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/en/news/20200124_46/
 
by738
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Fri Jan 24, 2020 11:36 am

This is a dead duck. Will sell some after further delays then will be quietly dropped.
Im guessing some predicted this from the outset. I'll stick my head out and say no more than 100 will ever see light of day.
 
VV
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Fri Jan 24, 2020 12:15 pm

JA786A wrote:
Various media outlets reporting that MITAC has decided to delay EIS until 2021 OR LATER, citing "issues with the electronic system". https://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/en/news/20200124_46/


Kid that a surprise?
 
F27500
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Fri Jan 24, 2020 1:05 pm

Its so ugly too .. that pointy weird nose .. and that baggage compartment on the main floor behind the cabin .. can u imagine the balance issues theyre gonna have while unloading and unloading?
 
dstblj52
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Fri Jan 24, 2020 4:01 pm

by738 wrote:
This is a dead duck. Will sell some after further delays then will be quietly dropped.
Im guessing some predicted this from the outset. I'll stick my head out and say no more than 100 will ever see light of day.

I disagree it has no viable competition that meets the scope clause beyond last-gen aircraft, it has been a badly mismanaged program but ultimately without viable competition that doesn't really matter.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:50 am

I was surprised Mitsubishi announced 495 commitments:

https://leehamnews.com/2020/01/22/mitsu ... -spacejet/

"The M100 is the only new generation regional airliner that meets the current US Scope Clause restrictions for unlimited specification operations."

"Embraer and Mitsubishi will essentially have a global duopoly of regional jets."

Mitsubishi hasn't managed the program well, but as it looks like a 2021 EIS, we will soon see the type fly. The US market provides economy of scale.

Note, I happen to be skeptical of the M100 EIS date. 2024 is plausible, but I make no bet.

I wonder who is in negotiations.

Lightsaber
Winter is coming.
 
Nean1
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Mon Jan 27, 2020 2:56 am

lightsaber wrote:
I was surprised Mitsubishi announced 495 commitments:

https://leehamnews.com/2020/01/22/mitsu ... -spacejet/

"The M100 is the only new generation regional airliner that meets the current US Scope Clause restrictions for unlimited specification operations."

"Embraer and Mitsubishi will essentially have a global duopoly of regional jets."

Mitsubishi hasn't managed the program well, but as it looks like a 2021 EIS, we will soon see the type fly. The US market provides economy of scale.

Note, I happen to be skeptical of the M100 EIS date. 2024 is plausible, but I make no bet.

I wonder who is in negotiations.

Lightsaber


The article fails to inform the new deadlines for putting into service (see below), nor does it detail the customers and how firm these commitments are.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/mitsubis ... 8?rpc=401&
https://mainichi.jp/english/articles/20 ... bu/056000c "Mitsubishi Aircraft to delay passenger jet delivery for 6th time"
https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2020/ ... i5REmhKgdU "Mitsubishi's SpaceJet delivery plans postponed again to 2021 or 2022 - Nikkei"
 
ITB
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Tue Jan 28, 2020 8:34 am

Nean1 wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
I was surprised Mitsubishi announced 495 commitments:

https://leehamnews.com/2020/01/22/mitsu ... -spacejet/

"The M100 is the only new generation regional airliner that meets the current US Scope Clause restrictions for unlimited specification operations."

"Embraer and Mitsubishi will essentially have a global duopoly of regional jets."

Mitsubishi hasn't managed the program well, but as it looks like a 2021 EIS, we will soon see the type fly. The US market provides economy of scale.

Note, I happen to be skeptical of the M100 EIS date. 2024 is plausible, but I make no bet.

I wonder who is in negotiations.

Lightsaber


The article fails to inform the new deadlines for putting into service (see below), nor does it detail the customers and how firm these commitments are.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/mitsubis ... 8?rpc=401&
https://mainichi.jp/english/articles/20 ... bu/056000c "Mitsubishi Aircraft to delay passenger jet delivery for 6th time"
https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2020/ ... i5REmhKgdU "Mitsubishi's SpaceJet delivery plans postponed again to 2021 or 2022 - Nikkei"


Late last weeks reports surfaced in Japanese media that Mitsubishi Aircraft's first delivery of its SpaceJet90 (formerly MRJ90) would be delayed a 6th time, perhaps pushing the handover to 2021 (see the above links). However, on Monday, January 28, 2020, it was reported that Mitsubishi had issued NO announcement pertaining to a delay, and there has been NO decision to adjust the development schedule.

Link: https://www.jiji.com/jc/article?k=2020012700678&g=eco (in Japanese)

That isn't to say the previous reports were entirely inaccurate. Mitsubishi Aircraft executives have repeatedly stated the present schedule, with first delivery to NH by the middle of 2020, is extremely tight and difficult. In Japanese culture, statements like that are generally inferred as meaning the current schedule is probably not going to hold.

As many of you already know, on January 6th, the latest M90 test aircraft (JA26MJ) was released by the factory in Nagoya and transferred to the flight line. Aside from the extensive re-wiring work, another 900 points of improvement have been incorporated into that frame. 900. That's a significant and telling number, evidence that MITAC and its engineers are not content to stand pat, but are working hard, utilizing the model of continuous improvement to drive quality.

A MITAC rep noted in a news report that first flight usually occurs about one month after rollout, but is dependent on various factors. As JA26MJ has yet to commence taxi tests, the schedule is getting tighter, but if those tests get underway late this week or next, first flight could happen in the first two weeks of February; that is, if all goes well.

After a handful of flights in Japan, JA26MJ is to be ferried to Moses Lake in Washington to join the other four test aircraft stationed there. Already those four have accumulated over 3,500 flight hours. It is anticipated JA26MJ is to fly an additional 500 hours. Originally, the test flight schedule for JA26 was to be apportioned over six months, but as the aircraft won't arrive at Moses Lake until late February or March, the schedule may need to be condensed. How much can be accomplished in a shortened time frame is unknown.

It should be noted the SpaceJet M90 is the first new aircraft attempting to receive certification since the troubles of the 737MAX. Undoubtedly, the path to certification is now much more challenging. Right now, MITAC is laser-like focused on getting the M90 certified. And, yes, it may take more time, much more time, than initially planned for. That's just the reality of today. And, to be sure, other major manufacturers, going forward, may face similar challenges in the certification process.

As for the M100, it's been seven months since the MITAC announcement to move forward. On a positive note, the manufacturing of parts should begin this year, or early next. There may or may not be a formal announcement when that happens. By now, MITAC engineers are well seasoned, plus dozens, if not hundreds, of outside specialists have been brought in. The accumulated design knowledge as well as the hundreds of modifications incorporated in the new M90 frames will, undoubtedly, ease the development of the M100. At the very least, it can be hoped for.

To be sure, it's been a long and bumpy for MITAC, as it endeavors to bring its regional jet project to fruition. Perhaps it will be another six or nine months, or maybe a year, but the end is in sight.

And for those always looking for more, here's a short video of JA26MJ undergoing ground tests in mid-January: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8EvGNCiy7g
 
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PepeTheFrog
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Tue Jan 28, 2020 10:32 am

Why would there be another delay? How much work is left before certification? Any insights?
Good moaning!
 
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PepeTheFrog
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Mitsubishi to delay SpaceJet deliveries to late 2021 or 2022

Wed Jan 29, 2020 11:54 pm

For the sixth time, Mitsubishi Heavy Industries has postponed the first delivery of its regional jet, the SpaceJet, to late 2021 or 2022, according to local media reports.

SpaceJet, which is also known as Mitsubishi Regional Jet, is set for delivery to the launch customer All Nippon Airways by the mid-year according to the current plan. The Mitsubishi Aircraft Corporation had planned to begin flight testing with the redesigned jet last June. But technical problems forced the Mitsubishi Heavy Industries subsidiary to delay it.

Recent progress revealed that the planemaker wouldn't be able to obtain safety certification from the Japanese regulator before 2021. Mitsubishi Heavy Industries is now preparing to announce the sixth delay on Feb. 6 during the presentation of the yearly figures of 2019, sources familiar with the matter said.

The manufacturer initially planned to deliver the first aircraft in 2013.


Formal announcement expected on February 6.

Any insight on those new technical problems?
Good moaning!
 
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PepeTheFrog
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Re: Mitsubishi to delay SpaceJet deliveries to late 2021 or 2022

Thu Jan 30, 2020 12:23 am

crjflyboy wrote:
I'm shocked ...


Well, they redesigned the aircraft to get rid of several design flaws. So I'm surprised that even the redesign comes with new issues.
Good moaning!
 
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PepeTheFrog
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Re: Mitsubishi to delay SpaceJet deliveries to late 2021 or 2022

Thu Feb 06, 2020 10:57 am

It's official:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mits ... SKBN2000FI

Japan’s Mitsubishi Heavy Industries (7011.T) said on Thursday it will book a 496.4 billion yen ($4.5 billion) special loss after its aircraft unit delayed the delivery of its SpaceJet regional jet for at least another year until after March 2021.
Good moaning!
 
Nean1
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Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Feb 06, 2020 11:09 am

Lazy Godzilla breaking all records.
 
VV
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Re: Mitsubishi to delay SpaceJet deliveries to late 2021 or 2022

Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:38 pm

PepeTheFrog wrote:
It's official:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mits ... SKBN2000FI

Japan’s Mitsubishi Heavy Industries (7011.T) said on Thursday it will book a 496.4 billion yen ($4.5 billion) special loss after its aircraft unit delayed the delivery of its SpaceJet regional jet for at least another year until after March 2021.


I hope the did a thorough audit on the state of the program this time.

According to my estimate it could not get the initial type certificate only in early 2022.
 
crjflyboy
Posts: 456
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2019 10:54 pm

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Feb 06, 2020 3:18 pm

Japanese should bring back a modernized version of the NAMC YS - 11

Piedmont loved those planes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NAMC_YS-11
 
docmtl
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:04 pm

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Feb 06, 2020 5:18 pm

And I'm wondering whether Boeing-Embraer Brasil will take notice and have a scope-compliant E2-175 project underway...

docmtl
 
User avatar
EMBSPBR
Posts: 677
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:03 pm

Re: Mitsubishi to delay SpaceJet deliveries to late 2021 or 2022

Thu Feb 06, 2020 8:36 pm

PepeTheFrog wrote:
It's official:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mits ... SKBN2000FI

Japan’s Mitsubishi Heavy Industries (7011.T) said on Thursday it will book a 496.4 billion yen ($4.5 billion) special loss after its aircraft unit delayed the delivery of its SpaceJet regional jet for at least another year until after March 2021.


Source: https://www.flightglobal.com/air-transp ... 80.article

"Mitsubishi upbeat on SpaceJet despite fresh delays, citing ‘certifiable design’"

Excerpts:

“We have made significant changes to our organisation and improvements in the way we do business,” the company says on 6 February. “We have also made a myriad of changes to the design of our aircraft.”

Mitsubishi Aircraft has made more than 900 SpaceJet design changes in the last three years, the company said earlier this month.

“There is an incredible amount of interdependency among these components and systems, and it takes time to fully investigate the impact of the changes,” it said.


This will take a longgggg timeeeee ...
 
VV
Posts: 1864
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:03 pm

Re: Mitsubishi to delay SpaceJet deliveries to late 2021 or 2022

Thu Feb 06, 2020 9:04 pm

EMBSPBR wrote:
PepeTheFrog wrote:
It's official:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mits ... SKBN2000FI

Japan’s Mitsubishi Heavy Industries (7011.T) said on Thursday it will book a 496.4 billion yen ($4.5 billion) special loss after its aircraft unit delayed the delivery of its SpaceJet regional jet for at least another year until after March 2021.


Source: https://www.flightglobal.com/air-transp ... 80.article

"Mitsubishi upbeat on SpaceJet despite fresh delays, citing ‘certifiable design’"

Excerpts:

“We have made significant changes to our organisation and improvements in the way we do business,” the company says on 6 February. “We have also made a myriad of changes to the design of our aircraft.”

Mitsubishi Aircraft has made more than 900 SpaceJet design changes in the last three years, the company said earlier this month.

“There is an incredible amount of interdependency among these components and systems, and it takes time to fully investigate the impact of the changes,” it said.


This will take a longgggg timeeeee ...


It sounds the aircraft will enter into service only in 2022 or 2023.

I do not understand why the interdependence analysis among the modifications has not been done concurrently with the design itself.

What if some modifications are not compatible and it is discovered only in six months?
 
User avatar
william
Posts: 3334
Joined: Thu Jun 10, 1999 1:31 pm

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Feb 06, 2020 9:40 pm

There is no more CRJ, so really the Embraer and this are the only game in town for RJs.
 
VV
Posts: 1864
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:03 pm

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Feb 06, 2020 9:59 pm

Wait! Mine hundred modifications implemented on the latest flight test article?????

Does it mean the first ones are useless for certification?

What"a going on there????
 
User avatar
TheZ
Posts: 105
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 7:26 pm

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Sat Feb 08, 2020 2:04 am

What a mess. I really hope Mitsubishi turns this around.
If you have to say "pun intended," it's not a good enough pun.
 
User avatar
c933103
Posts: 4508
Joined: Wed May 18, 2016 7:23 pm

Re: Mitsubishi to delay SpaceJet deliveries to late 2021 or 2022

Sat Feb 08, 2020 3:11 am

EMBSPBR wrote:
PepeTheFrog wrote:
It's official:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mits ... SKBN2000FI

Japan’s Mitsubishi Heavy Industries (7011.T) said on Thursday it will book a 496.4 billion yen ($4.5 billion) special loss after its aircraft unit delayed the delivery of its SpaceJet regional jet for at least another year until after March 2021.


Source: https://www.flightglobal.com/air-transp ... 80.article

"Mitsubishi upbeat on SpaceJet despite fresh delays, citing ‘certifiable design’"

Excerpts:

“We have made significant changes to our organisation and improvements in the way we do business,” the company says on 6 February. “We have also made a myriad of changes to the design of our aircraft.”

Mitsubishi Aircraft has made more than 900 SpaceJet design changes in the last three years, the company said earlier this month.

“There is an incredible amount of interdependency among these components and systems, and it takes time to fully investigate the impact of the changes,” it said.


This will take a longgggg timeeeee ...

Will they finish testing it first or will the Max get back to sky first?
It's pointless to attempt winning internet debate. 求同存異. よく見て・よく聞いて・よく考える
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Waterbomber2
Posts: 1343
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Re: Mitsubishi to delay SpaceJet deliveries to late 2021 or 2022

Sat Feb 08, 2020 4:01 am

EMBSPBR wrote:
PepeTheFrog wrote:
It's official:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mits ... SKBN2000FI

Japan’s Mitsubishi Heavy Industries (7011.T) said on Thursday it will book a 496.4 billion yen ($4.5 billion) special loss after its aircraft unit delayed the delivery of its SpaceJet regional jet for at least another year until after March 2021.


Source: https://www.flightglobal.com/air-transp ... 80.article

"Mitsubishi upbeat on SpaceJet despite fresh delays, citing ‘certifiable design’"

Excerpts:

“We have made significant changes to our organisation and improvements in the way we do business,” the company says on 6 February. “We have also made a myriad of changes to the design of our aircraft.”

Mitsubishi Aircraft has made more than 900 SpaceJet design changes in the last three years, the company said earlier this month.

“There is an incredible amount of interdependency among these components and systems, and it takes time to fully investigate the impact of the changes,” it said.


This will take a longgggg timeeeee ...


As you know, I was cheering for this program until they came out with this Spacejet thing, redesigning it to match scope etc...

At this pace, it won't be ramping up until 2030.

Might as well scrap the whole thing and start work on a 200-seater.

In the meanwhile Embraer can look into ways to make a scope compliant E2. What are they waiting for, the market is up for grabs.
Last edited by Waterbomber2 on Sat Feb 08, 2020 4:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
airlineworker
Posts: 189
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2019 1:20 am

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Sat Feb 08, 2020 4:02 am

Sad outcome for this plane. From the top down, Mitsubishi should clean house. No excuse for such poor planning and execution. It's an RJ, not a wide body.
 
JayinKitsap
Posts: 2257
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 9:55 am

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Sat Feb 08, 2020 8:12 am

Well at this rate the SSJ100 is starting to look good. How did Sukhoi mess that program up so bad that used ones can't be given away
 
dstblj52
Posts: 502
Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2019 8:38 pm

Re: Mitsubishi to delay SpaceJet deliveries to late 2021 or 2022

Sat Feb 08, 2020 1:51 pm

Waterbomber2 wrote:
EMBSPBR wrote:
PepeTheFrog wrote:


Source: https://www.flightglobal.com/air-transp ... 80.article

"Mitsubishi upbeat on SpaceJet despite fresh delays, citing ‘certifiable design’"

Excerpts:

“We have made significant changes to our organisation and improvements in the way we do business,” the company says on 6 February. “We have also made a myriad of changes to the design of our aircraft.”

Mitsubishi Aircraft has made more than 900 SpaceJet design changes in the last three years, the company said earlier this month.

“There is an incredible amount of interdependency among these components and systems, and it takes time to fully investigate the impact of the changes,” it said.


This will take a longgggg timeeeee ...


As you know, I was cheering for this program until they came out with this Spacejet thing, redesigning it to match scope etc...

At this pace, it won't be ramping up until 2030.

Might as well scrap the whole thing and start work on a 200-seater.

In the meanwhile Embraer can look into ways to make a scope compliant E2. What are they waiting for, the market is up for grabs.

It's almost impossible to remove 13000 pound from the E175-E2 so they would have to also do substantial redesign work for a scope compliant aircraft.
 
VV
Posts: 1864
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:03 pm

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Sat Feb 08, 2020 2:48 pm

Embraer should stick with their plan. That's it that's all.

As for the 900 design changes so late in the SpaceJet development, I would say, "What the heck???"
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