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VV
Posts: 1540
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:03 pm

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Sat Feb 08, 2020 2:48 pm

Embraer should stick with their plan. That's it that's all.

As for the 900 design changes so late in the SpaceJet development, I would say, "What the heck???"
 
VV
Posts: 1540
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:03 pm

Re: Mitsubishi to delay SpaceJet deliveries to late 2021 or 2022

Sun Feb 09, 2020 2:17 pm

EMBSPBR wrote:
...

Source: https://www.flightglobal.com/air-transp ... 80.article

"Mitsubishi upbeat on SpaceJet despite fresh delays, citing ‘certifiable design’"

Excerpts:

“We have made significant changes to our organisation and improvements in the way we do business,” the company says on 6 February. “We have also made a myriad of changes to the design of our aircraft.”

Mitsubishi Aircraft has made more than 900 SpaceJet design changes in the last three years, the company said earlier this month.

“There is an incredible amount of interdependency among these components and systems, and it takes time to fully investigate the impact of the changes,” it said.

...


I do not understand their style of communication.

Wouldn't you prefer to not say there were 900 design changes?
What are those changes? Are they all equally important?

Why would you even say such details during a press conference?

The more I look into it the more I think this program is going nowhere.
 
ITB
Posts: 208
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2017 4:50 am

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Feb 13, 2020 8:48 am

Earlier this week a Reuters news article (link below) explained in more detail why delivery of the first M90 frame was pushed back to mid-2021.

Mitsubishi Aircraft Chief Development Officer Alex Bellamy said a test plane that had around 960 changes from the original design was due to fly in the coming weeks to prove its airworthiness to regulators.

Some of the changes, such as to crew alerts, were made after two deadly crashes of the Boeing Co 737 MAX that has led to global regulatory scrutiny on pilot responses to emergency situations, he said.

“We have completely redesigned the philosophy of human factors on the flight deck in the last year,” Bellamy told Reuters in an interview at the Singapore Airshow.


https://www.reuters.com/article/singapo ... SL4N2AB0QC

Above I've bolded and underlined the pertinent statement. Obviously, with such significant modifications, considerable additional time will be necessary to complete the certification process, thus the revised schedule. It's very possible Mitsubishi decided to embark on these flight deck changes on its own. At the same time, it's also reasonable to believe the FAA and other authorities pushed them to make modifications. And if that's true, it's likely due to the 737 MAX incidents.

Evidently when Mitsubishi pushed back the M90's developmental time frame to accommodate the necessary re-wiring redesign, the additional time allowed dozens of other changes, both big and small, to be incorporated in the new frame. In total, 960 modifications were made. Some of these modifications were, undoubtedly, necessary to the certification process. However, dozens, if not hundreds, probably were not. While Mitsubishi could have implemented a good number of these modifications after certification, they chose not to go in that direction. The result is very "refreshed" frame, one that is virtually a production aircraft.

Even though a sixth delay to the project doesn't look good, Mitsubishi had little choice, particularly if the FAA and other regulatory authorities asked for (or mandated) modifications. When questions arose concerning the certification of 737 MAX some analysts speculated Mitsubishi would face a more rigorous certification process with its SpaceJet. That projection has come true.

VV wrote:
Wait! Mine hundred modifications implemented on the latest flight test article?????

Does it mean the first ones are useless for certification?

What"a going on there????


No, the first four frames continue to fly and have satisfied a great many certification requirements. The new frame(s) with the revised wiring system and other modifications are planned to complement the test flying done by the earlier frames, completing certain certification requirements not possible with the early builds. At this time, at least one new test aircraft — and maybe two or three — is to be ferried to Moses Lake to join the test fleet.
 
User avatar
EMBSPBR
Posts: 597
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:03 pm

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Feb 13, 2020 2:58 pm

ITB wrote:
Some of the changes, such as to crew alerts, were made after two deadly crashes of the Boeing Co 737 MAX that has led to global regulatory scrutiny on pilot responses to emergency situations, he said.
“We have completely redesigned the philosophy of human factors on the flight deck in the last year,” Bellamy told Reuters in an interview at the Singapore Airshow.


Use the MAX saga as an excuse for their incompetence and that this caused changes in the project regarding the pilot warning system ??? No way ...
What would they have done if there was no MAX?

Same source:
https://www.reuters.com/article/singapo ... SL4N2AB0QC

“We have signed a number of commitments with many airlines – a very big number in the hundreds that we haven’t publicly disclosed because we still have a lot of work to do before we get there,” he said.

Ohhh, really ???
 
Nean1
Posts: 347
Joined: Mon May 30, 2016 11:08 pm

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:08 pm

EMBSPBR wrote:
ITB wrote:
Some of the changes, such as to crew alerts, were made after two deadly crashes of the Boeing Co 737 MAX that has led to global regulatory scrutiny on pilot responses to emergency situations, he said.
“We have completely redesigned the philosophy of human factors on the flight deck in the last year,” Bellamy told Reuters in an interview at the Singapore Airshow.


Use the MAX saga as an excuse for their incompetence and that this caused changes in the project regarding the pilot warning system ??? No way ...
What would they have done if there was no MAX?

Same source:
https://www.reuters.com/article/singapo ... SL4N2AB0QC

“We have signed a number of commitments with many airlines – a very big number in the hundreds that we haven’t publicly disclosed because we still have a lot of work to do before we get there,” he said.

Ohhh, really ???

Neverland Airlines, Rekkof, Dornier and friends.
 
UnMAXed
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Jul 20, 2019 9:55 am

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:46 pm

Baltia Airlines alone will probable place firm orders for at least 200 frames any day now!
 
VV
Posts: 1540
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:03 pm

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Feb 13, 2020 6:37 pm

EMBSPBR wrote:



Do they have a dedicated communication team to coach the execs?

I have the feeling they do not have any clear communication plan. What's going on there???
 
mxaxai
Posts: 1464
Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2016 7:29 am

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:26 pm

Mitsubishi claims that "the first M90 spacejet completed its maiden flight" about a week ago. https://www.aerospacetestinginternation ... leted.html

I'm not quite sure what they mean by "first"? Unless they mean "the first that is supposed to be identical to the planned serial production models"
 
ekozie
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2020 12:43 am

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Mar 26, 2020 2:10 am

mxaxai wrote:
Mitsubishi claims that "the first M90 spacejet completed its maiden flight" about a week ago. https://www.aerospacetestinginternation ... leted.html

I'm not quite sure what they mean by "first"? Unless they mean "the first that is supposed to be identical to the planned serial production models"


The very first sentence in the article states that the frame is in the "final, certifiable baseline configuration."
 
N505fx
Posts: 336
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2008 3:02 am

Re: Mitsubishi to delay SpaceJet deliveries to late 2021 or 2022

Thu Mar 26, 2020 2:23 am

VV wrote:
EMBSPBR wrote:
...

Source: https://www.flightglobal.com/air-transp ... 80.article

"Mitsubishi upbeat on SpaceJet despite fresh delays, citing ‘certifiable design’"

Excerpts:

“We have made significant changes to our organisation and improvements in the way we do business,” the company says on 6 February. “We have also made a myriad of changes to the design of our aircraft.”

Mitsubishi Aircraft has made more than 900 SpaceJet design changes in the last three years, the company said earlier this month.

“There is an incredible amount of interdependency among these components and systems, and it takes time to fully investigate the impact of the changes,” it said.

...


I do not understand their style of communication.

Wouldn't you prefer to not say there were 900 design changes?
What are those changes? Are they all equally important?

Why would you even say such details during a press conference?

The more I look into it the more I think this program is going nowhere.


Very typical Japanese cultural response...the process is the product. A culture that praises process not pragmatism.
 
Waterbomber2
Posts: 1019
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Thu Mar 26, 2020 7:50 am

Capital expenditure is essentially gone for the coming 3 years. 3 years is 20% of the lifespan of a regional aircraft program.
By the time this aircraft can ramp up, we'll be 2026ish.
By 2030 the GTF will be 15 years old, obsolete and facing competing or new versions.
 
User avatar
Antaras
Posts: 311
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2019 6:18 am

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Fri Mar 27, 2020 2:06 pm

Will the CRJ-acquisition help speeding up this SpaceJet production???
I am tired of seeing 7749 articles announce that this program is delayed once more ~
Edit signature
This is a block of text that can be added to posts you make. There is a 255 character limit.
 
VV
Posts: 1540
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:03 pm

Re: Mitsubishi SpaceJet — Flight Test & Production Thread

Fri Mar 27, 2020 9:00 pm

Antaras wrote:
Will the CRJ-acquisition help speeding up this SpaceJet production???
....


I do not think it will.
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