Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
FB330
Posts: 111
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:46 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Thu Feb 06, 2020 12:12 pm

Whilst I have no official statistics, I too have been looking at 744 on time performance.

I was on BFY to Delhi a few weeks back and whilst it was on time, there were some serious delays on several of the days either side of my despatch. Noticed delays also on other routes.

I do wonder if, depending on how long the China oubreak continues, whether this will allow a quicker retirement of the old queen whilst the spares freed from the China routes get re-deployed to cover the 744 exits. Far too early to know this but there will be a lot of spare KLM capacity at the moment all whilst expensive 744s trundle on with their less than great delays....
 
A388
Posts: 8004
Joined: Mon May 21, 2001 3:48 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Thu Feb 06, 2020 12:42 pm

747classic wrote:
Just returned from a holiday at Curacao, flew with the present oldest en youngest KLM 744
Jan 14th. KL735 AMS-CUR PH-BFH
Feb 04th. KL736 CUR-AMS PF-BFY

Note : during my stay at CUR I started to follow the punctuality of the present KLM 744 operation.
Conclusion : punctuallity is slowly decreasing due fewer aircraft available and very thight schedules, causing delays at CUR up to 24 hours during my 3 weeks stay.
My flights were both operated according schedule.


Hi 747classic, nice to read that you were on my island. It would have been nice to meet you. About the on time performance, KLM indeed has cancelled 3 flights if I remember correctly and there was a 1 day delay but that was only on that day. This is the first time KLM did this but looking at the entire month and their daily operation, the on time performance fortunately is still good :)

A388
 
User avatar
747classic
Posts: 3338
Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:13 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Thu Feb 06, 2020 4:29 pm

A388 wrote:
747classic wrote:
Just returned from a holiday at Curacao, flew with the present oldest en youngest KLM 744
Jan 14th. KL735 AMS-CUR PH-BFH
Feb 04th. KL736 CUR-AMS PF-BFY

Note : during my stay at CUR I started to follow the punctuality of the present KLM 744 operation.
Conclusion : punctuallity is slowly decreasing due fewer aircraft available and very thight schedules, causing delays at CUR up to 24 hours during my 3 weeks stay.
My flights were both operated according schedule.


Hi 747classic, nice to read that you were on my island. It would have been nice to meet you. About the on time performance, KLM indeed has cancelled 3 flights if I remember correctly and there was a 1 day delay but that was only on that day. This is the first time KLM did this but looking at the entire month and their daily operation, the on time performance fortunately is still good :)

A388

A friend was on that 24 hour delayed KL735 flight and was not amused.
PH-BFY was scheduled to operate KL735 at Jan 30th, however the flight was cancelled with all passengers already at AMS, but the same aircraft departed to DEL (KL871) two hours after KL735 scheduled departure. (preference was given to the DEL flight ?)
After return from DEL, PH-BFY was used to operate KL 735/736 at Jan 31th.
Note : on Jan31th 2020 KL735/736 was not scheduled due aircraft shortage
Operating a twin over the ocean, you're always one engine failure from a total emergency.
 
User avatar
aeromoe
Posts: 1344
Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2006 8:34 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Thu Feb 06, 2020 11:06 pm

747classic wrote:
A388 wrote:
747classic wrote:
Just returned from a holiday at Curacao, flew with the present oldest en youngest KLM 744
Jan 14th. KL735 AMS-CUR PH-BFH
Feb 04th. KL736 CUR-AMS PF-BFY

Note : during my stay at CUR I started to follow the punctuality of the present KLM 744 operation.
Conclusion : punctuallity is slowly decreasing due fewer aircraft available and very thight schedules, causing delays at CUR up to 24 hours during my 3 weeks stay.
My flights were both operated according schedule.


Hi 747classic, nice to read that you were on my island. It would have been nice to meet you. About the on time performance, KLM indeed has cancelled 3 flights if I remember correctly and there was a 1 day delay but that was only on that day. This is the first time KLM did this but looking at the entire month and their daily operation, the on time performance fortunately is still good :)

A388

A friend was on that 24 hour delayed KL735 flight and was not amused.
PH-BFY was scheduled to operate KL735 at Jan 30th, however the flight was cancelled with all passengers already at AMS, but the same aircraft departed to DEL (KL871) two hours after KL735 scheduled departure. (preference was given to the DEL flight ?)
After return from DEL, PH-BFY was used to operate KL 735/736 at Jan 31th.
Note : on Jan31th 2020 KL735/736 was not scheduled due aircraft shortage


I flew on PH-BFY on 29th January JFK-AMS. My first time on KLM and my first time to AMS...and I'm in my mid-50s. I specifically chose this routing over any other 747 operation to celebrate my 747th logged departure. I could have also done VS, BA, KE, LH, or CA (thankfully I didn't choose CA!!) direct from the USA but I chose KLM because they have such a beautiful color scheme and I'd never been to Amsterdam. I enjoyed my experience in economy, right behind the wing in 44A. 44B was empty and 44C was taken but that person moved across the aisle after takeoff. I was hyped to fly a "Combi" but alas this airframe while built as a Combi now has a full passenger interior.

My return was AMS-LAX on PH-BFV, thankfully a Combi. I was in 22K, right at the wing root and one seat row behind door 2R. Again, the middle seat was vacant so it was a more pleasant experience than it could have been otherwise. After a very soggy February 2 departure from AMS, it was a beautiful flight and beautiful landing in mostly-sunny Los Angeles. By the time I disembarked (pretty quick since I was just across the cabin from door 2L) the Side Cargo Door was already open and the loader was working on the cargo. We were 1.5 hours delayed due to the tardy arrival of BFV from Toronto prior to our flight, but the connection I built myself was over 6 hours away so I was in no hurry. During my flight I chatted with the cabin crew about the fact this was my first ride on a "Combi" and the fact the entire trip was centered around my 747th flight overall. I pointed out I chose KLM for that event to occur on a KLM 747 from JFK to AMS a few days ago. They were a bit enthralled by my story and by the end of the flight, I was handed a little gift packet that included one of the porcelain KLM houses, a nice postcard from the cabin crew, and a couple of KLM writing pens. Thank you to the crew of KL601 on 2/2/20!

Thank you KLM for a very nice Amsterdam experience during my extended weekend. I thought the weather was going to be crappy over there but I was pleasantly surprised with some periods of beautiful sunshine enabling some nice photography atop the "Panorama Terrace" at AMS on the Thursday after my arrival and the Saturday before my departure on a soggy Sunday morning.

KLM 747s are beautiful and will be missed by the aviation enthusiasts community at large when they're eventually retired.
Since 60s: AA AC AS BA BD BF BN BR(85) BY B6 CO CZ(16) DG DL EA EI EN FI FL FT F9 HA HP ICX JI JQ J7 KE KL KS LH MC NW OC OO OZ(87) OZ(88) PA PI PN(97) PT QF QQ RM RO RV(99) RV(16) RW SK SM SQ S4 TI TS TW UA UK US UZ VS VX WA WN WS W7 XV YV YX(13) ZZ 9K
 
FlyingHonu001
Posts: 221
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2020 2:33 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:09 pm

On February 21st, full pax 744 will make a one-of-a-kind visit to MEX.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... -feb-2020/
 
User avatar
TurboJet707
Posts: 158
Joined: Wed May 10, 2017 11:30 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:29 am

FlyingHonu001 wrote:
PH-BFS (74E) put in the spotlights, thanks to Sam Chui.
https://youtu.be/FgeHMW79MFU


Wonderful video! Thanks for sharing.
 
A388
Posts: 8004
Joined: Mon May 21, 2001 3:48 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Feb 10, 2020 3:49 pm

747classic wrote:
A friend was on that 24 hour delayed KL735 flight and was not amused.
PH-BFY was scheduled to operate KL735 at Jan 30th, however the flight was cancelled with all passengers already at AMS, but the same aircraft departed to DEL (KL871) two hours after KL735 scheduled departure. (preference was given to the DEL flight ?)
After return from DEL, PH-BFY was used to operate KL 735/736 at Jan 31th.
Note : on Jan31th 2020 KL735/736 was not scheduled due aircraft shortage


That indeed isn't a nice experience so I totally agree with you but again, when looking at all their 744 flights to CUR, the punctuality is still good. It's just those few flights with big delays which aren't good.

A388
 
butwhole
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2020 2:04 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:38 pm

Hello Experts,

I am looking to fly on a KLM 744 from JFK to AMS, sometime this Spring. Does someone know of a good method to search for that particular type of plane, or does anyone know the scheduled flights? I was trying through KLM's official booking website but it leaves much to be desired. I click on a KLM, not Delta, and when i click on trip details it still says the flight is on a DL 767 (barf). Anyways, if anyone can direct, would greatly appreciate it.
 
ramsesp
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2012 7:00 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Wed Feb 12, 2020 8:55 am

butwhole wrote:
Hello Experts,

I am looking to fly on a KLM 744 from JFK to AMS, sometime this Spring. Does someone know of a good method to search for that particular type of plane, or does anyone know the scheduled flights? I was trying through KLM's official booking website but it leaves much to be desired. I click on a KLM, not Delta, and when i click on trip details it still says the flight is on a DL 767 (barf). Anyways, if anyone can direct, would greatly appreciate it.


Hi,
you have to look for Flight# KL644 (dep 9:30p / 9:45p). This flight is operated with 744 five days a week (Tu, We, Fr, Sa, Su). The other days a 789 operates this flight.
AB
 
butwhole
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2020 2:04 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Wed Feb 12, 2020 5:00 pm

ramsesp wrote:
butwhole wrote:
Hello Experts,

I am looking to fly on a KLM 744 from JFK to AMS, sometime this Spring. Does someone know of a good method to search for that particular type of plane, or does anyone know the scheduled flights? I was trying through KLM's official booking website but it leaves much to be desired. I click on a KLM, not Delta, and when i click on trip details it still says the flight is on a DL 767 (barf). Anyways, if anyone can direct, would greatly appreciate it.


Hi,
you have to look for Flight# KL644 (dep 9:30p / 9:45p). This flight is operated with 744 five days a week (Tu, We, Fr, Sa, Su). The other days a 789 operates this flight.
AB


thanks ramses! much obliged
 
FlyingHonu001
Posts: 221
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2020 2:33 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sat Feb 15, 2020 6:06 pm

Nice farewell salute for a retiring KL pilot featuring PH-BFS (74E) at AMS... Maybe a preview for things to come

Video #1

Video #2
 
User avatar
Iemand91
Posts: 679
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2015 2:25 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Feb 24, 2020 6:37 pm

The last week for another KLM 747. This time it's PH-BFH "City of Hong Kong".
At the moment she's about to land in Delhi. This Sunday she will land at Amsterdam for the final time.
She will make her last flight a week later to Teruel, Spain.
Her first flight was on March 30, 1990, so she's just short of 30 years of flying...

One interesting note on her; -BFH is one of two KLM 747-400's that was build as combi but she's been flying as a full pax 747 since ~ June 2009.

"Hong Kong' seen here earlier this month blasting of runway 24 at Amsterdam Airport, bound for Paramaribo:

Image
KLM Royal Dutch Airlines | Boeing 747-400 | PH-BFH by Tim van Donselaar, on Flickr
Some aviation photo's on my Flickr-page: https://www.flickr.com/photos/iemand91/
 
airsmiles
Posts: 126
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 9:14 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:16 pm

That’s an early one so the total hours will be interesting.
 
User avatar
Iemand91
Posts: 679
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2015 2:25 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:07 pm

Looks like work is done for PH-BFH. She was scheduled to make one final return flight to Paramaribo this morning, but sistership -BFN took over.
So the last commercial flight for -BFH was Thursday afternoon as KL602 from LAX to AMS which landed at Amsterdam Airport on Friday morning at 09:04.

Image
PH-BFH resting at Amsterdam Airport Schiphol by BOSCHH, on Flickr
Some aviation photo's on my Flickr-page: https://www.flickr.com/photos/iemand91/
 
User avatar
Iemand91
Posts: 679
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2015 2:25 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sat Feb 29, 2020 3:19 pm

Also, at the moment the last KLM 747 flight to Delhi is on her way: https://www.flightradar24.com/KLM871/240704fa
Some aviation photo's on my Flickr-page: https://www.flickr.com/photos/iemand91/
 
na
Posts: 9778
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 1999 3:52 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sat Feb 29, 2020 4:15 pm

airsmiles wrote:
That’s an early one so the total hours will be interesting.

Looking at the equally old PH-BFG retired two months ago BFH likely has accumulated north of 135.000 hours/18.000 cycles. Its certainly among the dozen aircraft with the highest flight hour count ever, no matter what type. And likely all of these are/were 747s. The only type I can think of that perhaps come close could be some early-built Fedex DC/MD-10s though I am unaware of their hours.
 
User avatar
747classic
Posts: 3338
Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:13 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:04 pm

na wrote:
airsmiles wrote:
That’s an early one so the total hours will be interesting.

Looking at the equally old PH-BFG retired two months ago BFH likely has accumulated north of 135.000 hours/18.000 cycles. Its certainly among the dozen aircraft with the highest flight hour count ever, no matter what type. And likely all of these are/were 747s. The only type I can think of that perhaps come close could be some early-built Fedex DC/MD-10s though I am unaware of their hours.


PH-BFH was 3 months longer active, compared to PH-BFG
PH-BFH was one of the "easy to convert" combi's and has been operated in the combi configuration until July 2009. Thereafter she was operated in the full pax configuration.
Because of the higher flight hour/cycles count of KLM's combi fleet (more flight hours, less cycles. average longer stretches ) it is to expect that PH-BFH has a slightly higher flight hours count, with slightly less cycles than PH-BFG (dedicated full pax).

The Fedex MD10-10/30 fleet has a relative low usage and are not even close to the flight hours of KLM's 747 aircraft and all MD10's will be phased out in two years time.
The highest count I could find was still below 100.000 hours.
Oldest active MD10-10, N375FE, L/N42, delivered July 7th 1972, at Aug 2019 : 96.743 hrs, 41375 cycles
Oldest active MD10-30, N303FE, L/N110, delivered July 3th 1973, at july 2019 : 95.515 hrs, 31569 cycles

You can find the hours/cycles of USA registred aircraft at this link : https://av-info.faa.gov/sdrx/Query.aspx
- Add the required registration, wihout the "N" . (to be found at one of the Fedex fleet pages via Google)
- click : RUN QUERY
- search in the list for the latest available date
- Double click the "unique control number" with the latest date.
Operating a twin over the ocean, you're always one engine failure from a total emergency.
 
Starfuryt
Posts: 195
Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2008 2:58 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:29 pm

How many hours/cycles did the retired LH 744s have? Same question for the still active frames as well. I remember seeing some very high numbers for them.

-Mikhail
 
na
Posts: 9778
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 1999 3:52 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sat Feb 29, 2020 7:52 pm

Starfuryt wrote:
How many hours/cycles did the retired LH 744s have? Same question for the still active frames as well. I remember seeing some very high numbers for them.

-Mikhail



The first batch of 744 of LH, built 1989-1992, which were retired 2012-2015 all had close too or slightly above 120.000 flight hours at the end.
There have been no LH 744 retirements since 2015 as the seond batch was built from 5 years later onwards. I haven´t checked lately but the oldest among the active fleet must also have done about 120.000 hours by now, I would even expect that some are above 125.000 or closing in on 130.000 as the oldest in the active fleet are older in years than the ones retired with 120.000 some time ago.
 
na
Posts: 9778
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 1999 3:52 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sat Feb 29, 2020 7:55 pm

747classic wrote:
na wrote:
airsmiles wrote:
That’s an early one so the total hours will be interesting.

Looking at the equally old PH-BFG retired two months ago BFH likely has accumulated north of 135.000 hours/18.000 cycles. Its certainly among the dozen aircraft with the highest flight hour count ever, no matter what type. And likely all of these are/were 747s. The only type I can think of that perhaps come close could be some early-built Fedex DC/MD-10s though I am unaware of their hours.


PH-BFH was 3 months longer active, compared to PH-BFG
PH-BFH was one of the "easy to convert" combi's and has been operated in the combi configuration until July 2009. Thereafter she was operated in the full pax configuration.
Because of the higher flight hour/cycles count of KLM's combi fleet (more flight hours, less cycles. average longer stretches ) it is to expect that PH-BFH has a slightly higher flight hours count, with slightly less cycles than PH-BFG (dedicated full pax).

The Fedex MD10-10/30 fleet has a relative low usage and are not even close to the flight hours of KLM's 747 aircraft and all MD10's will be phased out in two years time.
The highest count I could find was still below 100.000 hours.
Oldest active MD10-10, N375FE, L/N42, delivered July 7th 1972, at Aug 2019 : 96.743 hrs, 41375 cycles
Oldest active MD10-30, N303FE, L/N110, delivered July 3th 1973, at july 2019 : 95.515 hrs, 31569 cycles

You can find the hours/cycles of USA registred aircraft at this link : https://av-info.faa.gov/sdrx/Query.aspx
- Add the required registration, wihout the "N" . (to be found at one of the Fedex fleet pages via Google)
- click : RUN QUERY
- search in the list for the latest available date
- Double click the "unique control number" with the latest date.


Thank you!
I am a bit surprised the Fedex-MD-10s have done such "little" hours. That´s way below 747 territory. Cycles are twice that of a pax 747 though. I haven´t come over a 747 freighter yet which had/has done considerably more than 25.000 cycles.
 
jimmy9irons
Posts: 44
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 4:28 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sat Feb 29, 2020 11:39 pm

How many LH 747s still flying and what is their retirement schedule? Will they claim the record for flight hours on 747 or will it be KLM?
 
na
Posts: 9778
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 1999 3:52 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sun Mar 01, 2020 5:53 pm

jimmy9irons wrote:
How many LH 747s still flying and what is their retirement schedule? Will they claim the record for flight hours on 747 or will it be KLM?


There haven´t been any official updates regarding the LH 744 retirement schedule but certainly due to the 779 delays at least some of them will fly about one year (ca. 5000 hours) longer than foreseen a few years ago. I doubt that this will mean LH 744s beat the KLM record, but you never know what happens if there are more delays to the 77X program. D-ABVO, the oldest one, is 24 years old very soon. Older, now retired LH744 had reached 120.000 hours in ca. 23 years. D-ABVO would need to fly about three years longer from now to be able to reach the hours of the highest record achieved by KLM 744s.
 
a2b7
Posts: 48
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 8:17 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sun Mar 01, 2020 8:34 pm

na wrote:
airsmiles wrote:
That’s an early one so the total hours will be interesting.

Looking at the equally old PH-BFG retired two months ago BFH likely has accumulated north of 135.000 hours/18.000 cycles. Its certainly among the dozen aircraft with the highest flight hour count ever, no matter what type. And likely all of these are/were 747s. The only type I can think of that perhaps come close could be some early-built Fedex DC/MD-10s though I am unaware of their hours.

I cannot recall seeing an aircraft on airliners.net with more than 135000 hours other than KLM 747s. However I recently saw a post about C-FCAE, a 767-300ER that Air Canada retired in September 2019 with more than 139.000 flight hours and nearly 25000 flight cycles, see https://twitter.com/tompodolec/status/1175911968521297922 and https://www.morson.com/blog/2019/11/air-canada-retires-boeing-767-after-an-amazing-139000-hours-of-flight.

Edit: By the way, Delta's 767-300ER N171DN may have accumulated more than 135000 hours as well in the meantime. It had 134410 hours on 8th October 2019 according to the FAA av-info SDR query.
 
User avatar
747classic
Posts: 3338
Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:13 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:28 pm

According Dutch message board Scramble,'t Praethuys, KLM , page 282, member aws747 :

PH-BFH : 144976 flight hours, 18403 cycles

Highest KLM 744 PH-BFI : 146.041 hours
Highest KLM 744 PH-BFH : 18.403 cycles

KLM 744 Fleet overview (except freighters) :

BFA 125.836 / 16.881
BFB 134.729 / 18.024
BFC 141938 / 17.271
BFD 137.735 / 16.761
BFE 137.069 / 16.493
BFF 140.214 / 17.210
BFG 138.442 / 18.185
BFH 144.976 / 18.403
BFI 146.041 / 17.517
BFK 129.511 / 15.419
BFL active
BFM 123.221 / 14.596
BFN active
BFO 120.665 / 14.126
BFP 120.457 / 14.004
BFR 124.375 / 14.421
BFS active
BFU 112.422 / 12.587
BFV active
BFW active
BFY active
Operating a twin over the ocean, you're always one engine failure from a total emergency.
 
TheEuphorian
Posts: 443
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 9:35 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:21 pm

Apperently HS-TGP, a TG 747-4D7, the former retro-liveried TG 747, has withdrawn from use and has already been flown to UTP for storage.
 
FB330
Posts: 111
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:46 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:38 pm

I wonder with the short-medium term demand drop that we'll see in the coming months whether KLM will take the opportunity to accelerate the retirement of the remaining 747s and use the spare, more efficient aircraft?
 
diverted
Posts: 1293
Joined: Sat May 17, 2014 3:17 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:27 pm

a2b7 wrote:
na wrote:
airsmiles wrote:
That’s an early one so the total hours will be interesting.

Looking at the equally old PH-BFG retired two months ago BFH likely has accumulated north of 135.000 hours/18.000 cycles. Its certainly among the dozen aircraft with the highest flight hour count ever, no matter what type. And likely all of these are/were 747s. The only type I can think of that perhaps come close could be some early-built Fedex DC/MD-10s though I am unaware of their hours.

I cannot recall seeing an aircraft on airliners.net with more than 135000 hours other than KLM 747s. However I recently saw a post about C-FCAE, a 767-300ER that Air Canada retired in September 2019 with more than 139.000 flight hours and nearly 25000 flight cycles, see https://twitter.com/tompodolec/status/1175911968521297922 and https://www.morson.com/blog/2019/11/air-canada-retires-boeing-767-after-an-amazing-139000-hours-of-flight.

Edit: By the way, Delta's 767-300ER N171DN may have accumulated more than 135000 hours as well in the meantime. It had 134410 hours on 8th October 2019 according to the FAA av-info SDR query.


And apparently C-FCAE is in TLV for a P2F conversion for Cargojet. Flew her in July 2019 YOW-FRA, glad to see the old bird living on
 
FlyingHonu001
Posts: 221
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2020 2:33 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 02, 2020 5:17 pm

FB330 wrote:
I wonder with the short-medium term demand drop that we'll see in the coming months whether KLM will take the opportunity to accelerate the retirement of the remaining 747s and use the spare, more efficient aircraft?


Not really, KL phasing out the 744's was already pre-planned in advance as they are still masters in capacity on their current respective routes. Also the current route cancellations are still temporary and might still be reinstated for S20.
 
bennett123
Posts: 10061
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 02, 2020 5:37 pm

C-FCAE is a B767, not a B747.
 
User avatar
Iemand91
Posts: 679
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2015 2:25 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 02, 2020 5:59 pm

I just wanted to share this picture KLM posted on Facebook today:

Monday morning meeting, 1991 style!

Image

Source: https://nl-nl.facebook.com/KLM/photos/a ... &__tn__=-R

What a wonderful image never to be seen again. This would make their entire 747 fleet now that PH-BFH is out...
Some aviation photo's on my Flickr-page: https://www.flickr.com/photos/iemand91/
 
inkjet7
Posts: 189
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2019 9:32 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 02, 2020 7:44 pm

Not even that as KLM has only got seven left ;)
 
User avatar
AirKevin
Posts: 630
Joined: Wed Apr 26, 2017 2:18 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 02, 2020 10:41 pm

I'm curious as to how they loaded the cargo on the main deck with the jetway being right there since the cargo door looks fairly close to the jetway.
Captain Kevin
 
User avatar
Iemand91
Posts: 679
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2015 2:25 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:56 am

inkjet7 wrote:
Not even that as KLM has only got seven left ;)

D'oh!

Something else you won't see anymore are all those overwing jet bridges. There are only 2 left (gate E20 and E22) and they will be removed eventually.
Some aviation photo's on my Flickr-page: https://www.flickr.com/photos/iemand91/
 
User avatar
N14AZ
Posts: 4189
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:19 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:14 pm

Iemand91 wrote:
I just wanted to share this picture KLM posted on Facebook today:

Monday morning meeting, 1991 style!

Image

That's an amazing picture. Thanks for sharing. I am definitely not a Cher-fan but suddenly I have this song in my mind "If I could turn back time..."
 
CURQ400
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 10:29 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:26 pm

bennett123 wrote:
C-FCAE is a B767, not a B747.


And?

That was clearly stated in the post. Additionally, they were talking about airliners (any) with more than 135.000 hours..
 
Flanker7
Posts: 490
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 4:38 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:54 pm

AirKevin wrote:
I'm curious as to how they loaded the cargo on the main deck with the jetway being right there since the cargo door looks fairly close to the jetway.

There is still quite a bit of space for the highloader to load cargo, more then the photo shows. The door is right after the wing and then you still have plenty room left as long there is no obstruction on the ground.
Flying blue only if possible
 
Flanker7
Posts: 490
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 4:38 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:55 pm

AirKevin wrote:
I'm curious as to how they loaded the cargo on the main deck with the jetway being right there since the cargo door looks fairly close to the jetway.

There is still quite a bit of space for the highloader to load cargo, more then the photo shows. The door is right after the wing and then you still have plenty room left as long there is no obstruction on the ground.
Flying blue only if possible
 
User avatar
Iemand91
Posts: 679
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2015 2:25 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Thu Mar 05, 2020 10:08 pm

PH-BFH with (most of the) titles removed at Schiphol today:

Image

Source: Heiko Cramer at Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/Farewel ... 640577803/

She's scheduled for the last flight to Teruel Monday morning.
Some aviation photo's on my Flickr-page: https://www.flickr.com/photos/iemand91/
 
User avatar
seabosdca
Posts: 6607
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 8:33 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Sat Mar 07, 2020 6:24 pm

Yes, if any type threatens the 747's records in the near future, it will be the 767, not the DC-10/MD-11, and most likely early 767s of Delta. After that, we'll have to wait until the latter part of this decade to see if any 777 approaches these totals.

The hours totals reached by these 747s and 767s exceed the LOV of earlier Airbus widebodies even after A330 ESG.
 
User avatar
Iemand91
Posts: 679
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2015 2:25 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 09, 2020 9:39 am

And she's gone; PH-BFH is on her way on her final flight to Teruel: https://www.flightradar24.com/KLM747/24202154
Some aviation photo's on my Flickr-page: https://www.flickr.com/photos/iemand91/
 
PANAMsterdam
Posts: 290
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2019 7:45 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 09, 2020 10:14 am

Iemand91 wrote:
And she's gone; PH-BFH is on her way on her final flight to Teruel: https://www.flightradar24.com/KLM747/24202154


Sad moment :| , but after almost 30 years she deserves her retirement in the Spanish sun!
Every country has an airline. The world has Pan Am.
 
User avatar
TurboJet707
Posts: 158
Joined: Wed May 10, 2017 11:30 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 09, 2020 10:46 am

Iemand91 wrote:
And she's gone; PH-BFH is on her way on her final flight to Teruel: https://www.flightradar24.com/KLM747/24202154


Flight number is 'KLM747'...
Now overflying Zaragoza, started its last descent ever. Another sad moment.

I could imagine that with the current Corona crisis and the resulting overcapacity, the phase-out of KL's 747s could even be accelerated.
I will miss them a lot.
 
PANAMsterdam
Posts: 290
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2019 7:45 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:02 am

And she has landed! Enjoy your well deserved retirement, Hong Kong!
Every country has an airline. The world has Pan Am.
 
User avatar
Iemand91
Posts: 679
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2015 2:25 pm

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Mon Mar 09, 2020 8:51 pm

A couple of pictures from today. The crew made a nice wing wave on departure from Amsterdam.

Image
Image
Image
Image
Source

Image
Source

Image
Image
Source
Some aviation photo's on my Flickr-page: https://www.flickr.com/photos/iemand91/
 
EddieDude
Posts: 7048
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2003 10:19 am

Re: KL 744 Phase out News and Discussion Thread

Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:13 am

Is the last 747-400Combi for AMS-MEX-AMS still confirmed for November 28th, 2020?
Upcoming flights:
April/May: AM MEX-SCL 788 (J), AM EZE-MEX 789 (J).
 
Flanker7
Posts: 490
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 4:38 pm

KLM retires all 747 by end of March

Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:01 pm

Today KLM announced that all remaining 747 will be retired by the end of March. A real shame but under the current circumstances understandable. You will have to take my word for it, my partner is crew on the 747.
Flying blue only if possible
 
uta999
Posts: 937
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2010 11:10 am

Re: KLM retires all 747 by end of March

Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:04 pm

I wonder if BA will follow suit and accelerate their 744 storage / retirements.
Your computer just got better
 
User avatar
Revelation
Posts: 24794
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 9:37 pm

Re: KLM retires all 747 by end of March

Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:09 pm

Flanker7 wrote:
Today KLM announced that all remaining 747 will be retired by the end of March. A real shame but under the current circumstances understandable. You will have to take my word for it, my partner is crew on the 747.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KLM#Fleet suggests there were 2 pax and 5 combi left, all due to go by Jan 2021.

Clear evidence that the summer season is a write off for KLM (and of course other airlines), I would say.
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
The heart has its beaches, its homeland and thoughts of its own
Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
The heart has its seasons, its evenings and songs of its own
 
AirwayBill
Posts: 183
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2019 8:37 am

Re: KLM retires all 747 by end of March

Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:13 pm

Sad but not surprising if true.

Anyone cares to provide a reliable source?
 
716131
Posts: 892
Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2017 11:51 am

Re: KLM retires all 747 by end of March

Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:15 pm

AirwayBill wrote:
Sad but not surprising if true.

Anyone cares to provide a reliable source?

I don't see it yet. One source in Dutch says KL will keep 744 until 2021. So I guess this might go for a short time storage first.

https://luchtvaartnieuws.nl/nieuws/cate ... r-de-sloop
If it's not Boeing, I'm not going!

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: 717atOGG, A320B737NGCapt, airbuster, airpearl, AN743, Baidu [Spider], FGITD, gregn21, hoons90, jamie86, JoshP1, Kato79, kriskim, LAX772LR, Noshow, Oliver2020, PERA346, qf002, seansasLCY and 148 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos