At KLM's Flight Crew Training Center; their 747-400 full flight simulator PH-BFX "Olympia" has been permanently powered down today and they have started dismantling her.
Rumours are that the simulator will be used someplace else (outside of The Netherlands)


Source: https://www.facebook.com/groups/Farewel ... 570708270/

Why do I subscribe to this thread? It's quite sad! KLM 747s have been such a staple in commercial aviation.

Looks like another one is planned 07DEC. AMS/ORD/MCI times stopping at ORD looks like 1730/1900 UTC.

Jet Midwest Group have a salvage/scrapping facility at MCI, they ferried a QF 744 there from VCV a few months back for tear down.

I've heard PH-BFT would be the next one to go, looks like she's headed to MCI for immediate scrap then. Damn, really hoped that we'd get her over at MHV...still holding out for BFV/BFW though

Iemand91 wrote:

Titles have been removed from PH-BFV "City of Vancouver' as well.







Source

Always a treat so see them in AMS. One of the best liveries ever. IMO. So sad. How many KLM 747's are left to be disposed off?

FlyingViking wrote:

How many KLM 747's are left to be disposed off?

Three:
PH-BFT (flying AMS-ORD-MCI on December 7)
PH-BFV (tiles painted over, will likely ferry to her final resting place early 2021)
PH-BFW (also 2021, will likely be the last KLM 747 flight).

VCVSpotter wrote:

FlyingViking wrote:

How many KLM 747's are left to be disposed off?

Three:
PH-BFT (flying AMS-ORD-MCI on December 7)
PH-BFV (tiles painted over, will likely ferry to her final resting place early 2021)
PH-BFW (also 2021, will likely be the last KLM 747 flight).

Thank you, I'm bummed I never got to fly on the 747 Combi.

Today, the last remaining 747 pax (PH-BFW "City of Shanghai") had her titles removed.
For the first time in 50 years, there are no passenger 747's left with KLM livery.


Source: https://www.facebook.com/groups/Farewel ... 993688661/

KLM A330-200 PH-AOM hit 747-400 PH-BFV yesterday at Schiphol-East during tow.

Iemand91 wrote:

KLM A330-200 PH-AOM hit 747-400 PH-BFV yesterday at Schiphol-East during tow.

Interesting, does this affect airworthiness of PH-BFV in any way?

Phosphorus wrote:

Interesting, does this affect airworthiness of PH-BFV in any way?

Operators of aircraft that are being stored, reduce their insurance cover to include only ground risk.

The accident is a notifiable event for financiers holding security, as well as their insurers, so even if deemed airworthy, KLM have a few boxes to tick before either of these planes take to the air again, for a non-revenue transit for repairs or storage, let alone commercial service.

Commercial aviation insurance revenues have fallen as much as their customers revenues. Claim events will not be appreciated by any of those involved. On the other hand, the owners and financiers might wish they had hit with more force, and two write offs were on the cards.

smartplane wrote:

Phosphorus wrote:

Interesting, does this affect airworthiness of PH-BFV in any way?

Operators of aircraft that are being stored, reduce their insurance cover to include only ground risk.

The accident is a notifiable event for financiers holding security, as well as their insurers, so even if deemed airworthy, KLM have a few boxes to tick before either of these planes take to the air again, for a non-revenue transit for repairs or storage, let alone commercial service.

Commercial aviation insurance revenues have fallen as much as their customers revenues. Claim events will not be appreciated by any of those involved. On the other hand, the owners and financiers might wish they had hit with more force, and two write offs were on the cards.

On the insurance side, that makes a lot of sense. But BFV was being prepped for her last flights to her final destination, would that mean that insurance coverage would be immediately reduced?
In the meantime, the question stands -- is BFV good to be ferried to scrappers, or is this incident dictating a change of plans?

Phosphorus wrote:

smartplane wrote:

Phosphorus wrote:

Interesting, does this affect airworthiness of PH-BFV in any way?

Operators of aircraft that are being stored, reduce their insurance cover to include only ground risk.

The accident is a notifiable event for financiers holding security, as well as their insurers, so even if deemed airworthy, KLM have a few boxes to tick before either of these planes take to the air again, for a non-revenue transit for repairs or storage, let alone commercial service.

Commercial aviation insurance revenues have fallen as much as their customers revenues. Claim events will not be appreciated by any of those involved. On the other hand, the owners and financiers might wish they had hit with more force, and two write offs were on the cards.

On the insurance side, that makes a lot of sense. But BFV was being prepped for her last flights to her final destination, would that mean that insurance coverage would be immediately reduced?
In the meantime, the question stands -- is BFV good to be ferried to scrappers, or is this incident dictating a change of plans?

In normal times, most aircraft in the fleet are subject to a continuous all cover policy, though canny operators customise this for example when an aircraft is undergoing lengthy heavy maintenance, to reduce costs.

Today, most stored aircraft will just have ground cover, unless return to service is imminent.

The owner / operator of a stored aircraft undertaking a test or final flight, will obtain comprehensive insurance (less passengers - the crew are insured separately) for the specific period when the flight is scheduled.

Once the nature of the damage is ascertained, it may need to be repaired before flying (and to obtain insurance cover), or receive special approval for the flight such as altitude restrictions. Some commercial aviation insurers will not quote for impaired aircraft cover.

One interesting note: PH-BFV was also hit during tow last year with a KLM 787: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1415457

i heard rumor they were to move to Israel

What was going to move to Israel?.

There were some not confirmed (one source only) rumours about two of the three aircraft would be heading to Israel (IAI) for P-F conversion for a start-up carrier.

The 3 747's at Schiphol-East, together with A330-200 PH-AON.
Apparently taken yesterday (Tuesday, 24 november)


Source: https://www.luchtopname.nl/single-post/ ... qx3H8_KAcs / https://www.facebook.com/groups/Farewel ... 683492025/

The A330 being completely ignored by the three 747's, after slapping one of them in the face a few days ago.

PANAMsterdam wrote:

The A330 being completely ignored by the three 747's, after slapping one of them in the face a few days ago.

That was sister ship AOM.

Last night at home for the 23 year old PH-BFT "City of Tokyo". Parked at gate E75 today.
Tomorrow morning at 10 she'll depart for Chicago and continue to Kansas City.

Tokyo was the 747 that performed the final ever KLM 747 pax flight on March 28, flight KL686 from Mexico-City.
She touched down at Schiphol Airport on March 29 at 15:32, ending more then 49 years of KLM 747 passenger flights.



Her sisters that stay for just a little while longer in the background:


Source: https://www.facebook.com/groups/Farewel ... 600470633/

I was over at Kemble a few days ago.

PH-BFG/TF-AMG is now in the scrapping area.

Whether it will see 2021 is anyone's guess.

bennett123 wrote:

I was over at Kemble a few days ago.

PH-BFG/TF-AMG is now in the scrapping area.

Whether it will see 2021 is anyone's guess.

Indeed she is. Looks like the was moved there around November 15. Picture was taken Yesterday (December 5).

G-LSAG & TF-AMG by QSY on-route, on Flickr

inkjet7 wrote:

PANAMsterdam wrote:

The A330 being completely ignored by the three 747's, after slapping one of them in the face a few days ago.

That was sister ship AOM.

I hope AON has nothing bad in her mind !?

And on her way: https://www.flightradar24.com/KLM747/263e2fbb

PH-BFT, the evening before ..................................


Original uploaded by Peter Leyfeldt at facebook, see : https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=369 ... 5794012547

PH-BFT seems to be heading to Kansas City (MCI) after landing at ORD. (customs clearing) for a HMV (at Aviation Technical Services) ?
New owner is still unk.

747classic wrote:

PH-BFT, the evening before ..................................


Original uploaded by Peter Leyfeldt at facebook, see : https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=369 ... 5794012547

PH-BFT seems to be heading to Kansas City (MCI) after landing at ORD. (customs clearing) for a HMV (at Aviation Technical Services) ?
New owner is still unk.

Jet Midwest Group

Do we know yet where the remaining aircraft are headed in 2021? MCI, MHV?

I flew on the 'City of Nairobi' January 2020, AMS-BOM. Little did I know that would be my last ride on a KL Queen.

And now the last bit to Kansas: https://www.flightradar24.com/KLM747/263f43c0

Iemand91 wrote:

And now the last bit to Kansas: https://www.flightradar24.com/KLM747/263f43c0

It's over... Tokyo has landed!

It must have been quite a while ago since the last time a 747 (passenger plane) landed at Kansas City International Airport! Reminder of the old TWA times for sure.

PANAMsterdam wrote:

Iemand91 wrote:

And now the last bit to Kansas: https://www.flightradar24.com/KLM747/263f43c0

It's over... Tokyo has landed!

It must have been quite a while ago since the last time a 747 (passenger plane) landed at Kansas City International Airport! Reminder of the old TWA times for sure.

Don’t track much ops at MCI, but N953JM (ex Qantas VH-OJL) ferried VCV-MCI in the summer. 747 pax ops (revenue) are very limited, but repositioning flights or retirement flights are not that uncommon.

But definitely a sad reality that there are just two more KLM 747s left....

Iemand91 wrote:

The 3 747's at Schiphol-East, together with A330-200 PH-AON.
Apparently taken yesterday (Tuesday, 24 november)


Source: https://www.luchtopname.nl/single-post/ ... qx3H8_KAcs / https://www.facebook.com/groups/Farewel ... 683492025/

What's up with the engineless A330?

ojjunior wrote:

Iemand91 wrote:

The 3 747's at Schiphol-East, together with A330-200 PH-AON.
Apparently taken yesterday (Tuesday, 24 november)


Source: https://www.luchtopname.nl/single-post/ ... qx3H8_KAcs / https://www.facebook.com/groups/Farewel ... 683492025/

What's up with the engineless A330?

Because this way she can`t move and slap one of her mothers !

ojjunior wrote:

Iemand91 wrote:

The 3 747's at Schiphol-East, together with A330-200 PH-AON.
Apparently taken yesterday (Tuesday, 24 november)


Source: https://www.luchtopname.nl/single-post/ ... qx3H8_KAcs / https://www.facebook.com/groups/Farewel ... 683492025/

What's up with the engineless A330?

According to a source at Scramble (forum) the lease of this bird (PH-AON) will expire in the first half of 2021, so she’s probably stored before being returned to the lessor.

Interesting tidbit: PH-AON is a former MRTT prototype.

petertenthije wrote:

76er wrote:

Interesting tidbit: PH-AON is a former MRTT prototype.

Would this be of interest to the NATO tanker wing? Maybe not for tanking, but for training and transport duties? Are there many differences between PH-AON and the NATO A330s? (except obviously for the boom)

PH-AON is customized to KLM configuration before delivery. However some small differences stil excist (non standard wiring and especially wiring splices)

747classic wrote:

petertenthije wrote:

76er wrote:

Interesting tidbit: PH-AON is a former MRTT prototype.

Would this be of interest to the NATO tanker wing? Maybe not for tanking, but for training and transport duties? Are there many differences between PH-AON and the NATO A330s? (except obviously for the boom)

PH-AON is customized to KLM configuration before delivery. However some small differences stil excist (non standard wiring and especially wiring splices)

Actually, the wing config of the latest MRTT is based from the A340 to accomodate the wingmounted refueling pods

petertenthije wrote:

76er wrote:

Interesting tidbit: PH-AON is a former MRTT prototype.

Would this be of interest to the NATO tanker wing? Maybe not for tanking, but for training and transport duties? Are there many differences between PH-AON and the NATO A330s? (except obviously for the boom)

Minor correction- this plane was to be a KC-45 (USAF tanker) prototype that was never completed due to the canceling of that contract and rebid. There are probably a few differences compared to a normal MRTT, but I don’t know what they may be. There is also another KC-45 prototype (msn 871) that Airbus never sold.

FlyingHonu001 wrote:

747classic wrote:

petertenthije wrote:

Would this be of interest to the NATO tanker wing? Maybe not for tanking, but for training and transport duties? Are there many differences between PH-AON and the NATO A330s? (except obviously for the boom)

PH-AON is customized to KLM configuration before delivery. However some small differences stil excist (non standard wiring and especially wiring splices)

Actually, the wing config of the latest MRTT is based from the A340 to accomodate the wingmounted refueling pods

Right, put that doesn’t preclude any wiring and other minor differences from standard passenger A330s.

PH-BFV , AMS, Hangar 11, Dec 14th, still waiting ..........................................................................




Original uploaded by Bianca Krijthe-Moens at facebook, see : https://www.facebook.com/groups/FarewellKLMBoeing747

A nice video of the last A check of a KLM 747 pax aircraft (PH-BFV) by KLM/TD : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-zD9Zh ... e=youtu.be

PH-BFT, MCI, January 13th 2021.
Now in the queue, awaiting dismantling according Jet Midwest. However in contrast to all other to be scrapped KLM 744's all engines seem to be still present !


Original uploaded by Jet Midwest at twitter, see : https://twitter.com/JetMidwest/status/1 ... 7640378375

PH-BFW is scheduled to be ferried to Tel Aviv (TLV) at Monday 18 January 2021, 07:30 UTC, 08:30LT with callsign KL747.
The new owner and the details of a possible modification (partial freighter or full -BDSF conversion ? ) are still unknown.

Source : https://www.scramble.nl/community/messa ... /14/155253

PH-BFW, just airborne, ferry flight towards TLV with callsign KL747, see : https://flightaware.com/live/flight/PHB ... 0813Z/EHAM



Original uploaded by Ruben Daman at facebook, see : https://www.facebook.com/groups/Farewel ... 966454862/

See also : https://www.flightradar24.com/data/airc ... w#2699c093

747classic wrote:

PH-BFW is scheduled to be ferried to Tel Aviv (TLV) at Monday 18 January 2021, 07:30 UTC, 08:30LT with callsign KL747.
The new owner and the details of a possible modification (partial freighter or full -BDSF conversion ? ) are still unknown.

Source : https://www.scramble.nl/community/messa ... /14/155253

IAI-Bedek is also based in TLV, could this be a possibilty??
https://www.iai.co.il/commercial/aviati ... onversions

Would be nice if IAI could convert it to a freighter for Martinair Cargo to replace the aging PH-MPS (over 30 years old).

Food for speculation : According Skyliner, PH-BFW will be operated by Longtail Aviation after P-F conversion at TLV.
See : https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=3

If the plane returns to service with KLM (or Martinair), why would they remove all titles? Or was the decision to convert the plane later?

According TLVspotters at facebook : PH-BFW, a former KLM Royal Dutch Airlines 747-400 Combi arriving from Amsterdam yesterday for "light freighter conversion" for Longtail Aviation. As the aircraft already has a side cargo door on the main deck, the freighter conversion will only include removal of the cabin so that the former pax cabin will be used for small packages while the back of the main deck and lower deck will carry containers/pallets.



See : https://www.facebook.com/TLVspotters/