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IrishAyes
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China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 4:25 pm

Service to start March 18, 2016, nonstop to Shanghai utilizing a 77W.

MU717 PVG1140 – 1240ORD 77W 257
MU718 ORD1450 – 1910+1PVG 77W 257
 
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lesfalls
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 4:31 pm

Congrats to ORD   Hope the route is successful .
Lufthansa: Einfach ein bisschen besser.
 
a380787
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 4:34 pm

Quoting irishayes (Thread starter):

MU717 PVG1140 – 1240ORD 77W 257
MU718 ORD1450 – 1910+1PVG 77W 257

This schedule looks decent for connections to/from mainland China and perhaps neighboring cities like ICN/PUS, but probably not well timed for SE Asia.

Let's see how AA and UA will react
 
EddieDude
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 4:41 pm

Great news for ORD and MU! Congratulations. Thanks for the heads up IrishAyes.

I suppose MU will want to increase frequency in the future. Otherwise, this flight won't mean much to business travelers.
Upcoming flights:
April/May: AM MEX-SCL 788 (J), AM EZE-MEX 789 (J).
 
LAXdude1023
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 4:47 pm

Wow...ORD-PVG just became very crowded.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD BRING BACK THE PAYWALL!!!!
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 4:52 pm

Quoting a380787 (Reply 2):
This schedule looks decent for connections to/from mainland China and perhaps neighboring cities like ICN/PUS, but probably not well timed for SE Asia.

Really?

I'm seeing connections ex-PVG onward to Xian, Fuzhou, Hong Kong, Shenyang, Dalian, Chengdu, Wuhan, Kota Kinabalu, Siem Riep, Krabi, Phuket, Haiku, Guangzhou, Delhi, Taipei, Bangkok, Changsha, Singapore, Ho Chi Minh City, Manila, Saipan, Melbourne, Sydney, Denpasar/Bali and Kuala Lumpur.

On the inbound from PVG to ORD, the morning bank supports inbound connections from the same list of cities...?

Quoting a380787 (Reply 2):
Let's see how AA and UA will react

I think ORD-PVG can support a third carrier, especially with connections. It's nice now that all three alliances are represented. UA and AA will have the upper hand with daily services, although I wouldn't be surprised to see UA down-gauge to a 777 from a 744.
 
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United787
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 4:55 pm

So ORD now has:

HKG - CX UA
PEK - AA HU UA
PVG - AA MU UA

Congrats to ORD. Kind of surprising that a Chinese carrier didn't start this earlier. HU and CX are also new to the ORD market.
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 5:20 pm

Quoting United787 (Reply 6):
Congrats to ORD. Kind of surprising that a Chinese carrier didn't start this earlier. HU and CX are also new to the ORD market.

Yes and no. CX has been in the market since 2011 and HU since 2013.

However, the context is a bit more political than that. Chinese carriers, and Asian carriers in general, tend to be more lethargic when it comes to opening up new long-haul routes. I think that the expansion of US carriers into mainland China in the post-2010 era was what spurred a lot of growth from Chinese carriers, and even more so as dynamics in the US-Asia market shifted from overflying traditional transit hubs like NRT (and secondarily, ICN) to primary and secondary Chinese cities.

The advent of 787s and 77Ws has also been a major catalyst in this growth.

If you had said 3-5 years ago that routes like DFW-PEK, BOS-HKG and SJC-PEK would exist today, it would be a hard sell.
 
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Miami
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 5:35 pm

3 weekly service.

Quoting irishayes (Thread starter):

I see you got it from airlineroute..

http://airlineroute.net/2015/11/11/mu-ord-mar16/
Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible. - Eddie Rickenbacker
 
FSDan
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 5:38 pm

MU have really upped their game to the U.S. A few years ago they just had LAX-PVG and JFK-PVG on the 346 (and I think JFK was 4 or 5 weekly). Now they have:
SFO-PVG 332
LAX-PVG 77W + 332 (
LAX-HGH 332 (less than daily)
ORD-PVG 77W (less than daily)
JFK-PVG 77W (double daily?)
HNL-PVG 332 (less than daily)

Quoting irishayes (Reply 5):
I wouldn't be surprised to see UA down-gauge to a 777 from a 744.

I could see AA moving ORD-PVG to the 788 as well in due time...

Well and truly gone are the days of AA and UA having ORD-China to themselves!
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
a380787
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 5:46 pm

Quoting irishayes (Reply 5):

I'm seeing connections ex-PVG onward to Xian, Fuzhou, Hong Kong, Shenyang, Dalian, Chengdu, Wuhan, Kota Kinabalu, Siem Riep, Krabi, Phuket, Haiku, Guangzhou, Delhi, Taipei, Bangkok, Changsha, Singapore, Ho Chi Minh City, Manila, Saipan, Melbourne, Sydney, Denpasar/Bali and Kuala Lumpur.

I didn't say "doesn't exist" I said not well timed

Take Singapore. It's PVG 2350 - SIN 0525

That's 4.5 hours at Pudong plus another painful 5.5 hour red-eye to Singapore. Be my guest if you like this type of routing.
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 5:47 pm

Quoting FSDan (Reply 9):

MU have really upped their game to the U.S. A few years ago they just had LAX-PVG and JFK-PVG on the 346

Yup! I think that the deployment of 77Ws was what was really hampering their expansion opportunities to the US. The same logic can be applied towards other Chinese and Taiwanese carriers with the 77Ws, including CA (has opened IAH, EWR and IAD since 2013), CZ (has launched SFO and JFK, as well as added A380 capacity to LAX), MU, BR (IAH), CX (ORD, EWR, BOS) and HU (SEA, SJC, BOS, ORD...all 787).

and I would suspect that CI will also unveil 1-2 more US routes in the near future.

The increased efficiency in visa processing for both Chinese and US nationals, as well as the duration of validity, has also been extremely helpful in facilitating the growth of Chinese airlines.

It's really nice to see  
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 5:57 pm

Quoting a380787 (Reply 10):
I didn't say "doesn't exist" I said not well timed

I'm aware.

For all intents and purposes, I think that you are correct about the connections to mainland China being primary feeders, but bear in mind, these markets are under-served via 1-stop itineraries to markets like Chicago. Whereas, SE Asian markets are lower-yielding and already pretty saturated.

Quoting a380787 (Reply 10):
Take Singapore. It's PVG 2350 - SIN 0525

That's 4.5 hours at Pudong plus another painful 5.5 hour red-eye to Singapore. Be my guest if you like this type of routing.

The journey time to SE Asia with that type of itinerary is hardly better/worse than a connection via DXB/DOH/AUH which many people are currently doing at low fares.

That said, I still am finding a decent selection of markets ex-PVG with decent connections:

20:00 - 21:00 bank: Kota Kinabalu, Krabi, Sydney, Melbourne, Taipei, Phuket, Hong Kong, Siem Reap, Kaohsiung
22:00 - 23:00 bank: Delhi, Phuket, Bangkok, Ho Chi Minh City, Taipei
23:00 - 00:00 bank: Manila, Singapore, Bangkok, Sydney, Guam

Other than Jakarta, Hanoi and Kuala Lumpur, I don't know what other salient SE Asian markets are missing?
 
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Ytraveller
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 11, 2015 5:58 pm

Nice, but ORD spotters will not be excited to see the MU 77W   


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Tokyo Spotter

 
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kngkyle
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Fri Nov 13, 2015 4:34 am

Announcement from the airline:

http://us.ceair.com/muovc/newsite/main/en_US/News/News3892.html

3x weekly to start, daily shortly after.

Interesting to note that both this and the new Icelandair service will start on the same day.

[Edited 2015-11-12 20:38:10]
 
DCA-ROCguy
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Fri Nov 13, 2015 6:24 am

Congratulations to ORD! When I was a child, the old y-shaped international terminal hosted mostly European major carriers, Pan Am, and TWA.

China Eastern. Fly the Colorless Skies.  

Jim
Need a new airline paint scheme? Better call Saul! (Bass that is)
 
stlgph
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Fri Nov 13, 2015 8:34 am

Good to see some more international tails coming to O'Hare. Even better the service will bump up to daily.
Speaking of international service, looking forward to the day when Eva Air starts showing up, and wouldn't be surprised if Icelandair eventually goes daily.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Nov 17, 2015 3:47 pm

Indeed! Really awesome 2016 for Chicago.
 
jcwr56
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:27 pm

Even though they announced 3x weekly to start that's just for the end of the IATA W15 season, it goes daily once IATA S16 begins.

Same times....

Quoting stlgph (Reply 16):
and wouldn't be surprised if Icelandair eventually goes daily.

They filed for S16 as a daily too.
 
ORD Boy 2
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:31 pm

Great that MU is now coming in.
My wish list is
the ORD-TLV route is reactivated by LY (or UA starts it).
Virgin goes year round.
EVA, Icelandair, QF, ANZ,
I'll take more Latin America too!
But like I said, just my wish list.
 
global1
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:35 pm

Expect to see more MU tails in the US and more DL tails in PVG in the years to come.
 
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United787
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Nov 17, 2015 10:01 pm

Do you think we will see anymore Chinese carriers at ORD in the next 3-5 years or does this cover the demand for now?
 
jcwr56
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Nov 17, 2015 10:46 pm

Quoting United787 (Reply 21):

Do you think we will see anymore Chinese carriers at ORD in the next 3-5 years or does this cover the demand for now?

My gut says 1-2 more and not the ones most people think of.
 
airplanedaj
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Wed Nov 18, 2015 4:43 am

Quoting jcwr56 (Reply 22):
My gut says 1-2 more and not the ones most people think of.

I take it you're not expecting CA to join the ORD Party?

Xiamen Air would not surprise me, nor would another HU offering.

Either way, Congrats to MU and ORD! Can't wait to see what other airlines come to Chicago! Any more word on expanding T5 for more widebodies? I know this isn't a "peak" departure, but with other airlines coming in, wouldn't be surprised to see expansion in the very near future
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Fri Nov 20, 2015 7:25 pm

More insight and analysis on the commercial business reasons behind the route

http://upgrd.com/aerospace/china-eas...-gain-foothold-in-interior-us.html
 
jetblue1965
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Fri Nov 20, 2015 8:38 pm

Quoting irishayes (Reply 24):
More insight and analysis on the commercial business reasons behind the route

http://upgrd.com/aerospace/china-eas...-gain-foothold-in-interior-us.html

Thanks for your self-promotion.
 
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kngkyle
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Fri Dec 04, 2015 4:33 pm

Launching as daily now, per airlineroute:


China Eastern has revised planned operational frequency on Shanghai Pu Dong – Chicago route, due to commence on 18MAR16. Previously scheduled to operate as 3 weekly flights, the Skyteam member now plans to operate this route on daily basis.

Reservation for the additional new flights are now available, on board Boeing 777-300ER.

MU717 PVG1140 – 1240ORD 77W D
MU718 ORD1500 – 1910+1PVG 77W D

http://airlineroute.net/2015/12/04/mu-ord-s16update2/
 
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VCEflyboy
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Fri Dec 04, 2015 5:16 pm

Good news, but bad news for CX. MU has been taking quite a bit of HK-US traffic lately.
 
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LAX772LR
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Sat Dec 05, 2015 1:27 am

Quoting global1 (Reply 20):
Expect to see more MU tails in the US and more DL tails in PVG in the years to come.

Thing is, CA has shown interest (to the point of applying) for longhauls out of PVG now.

I wonder if MU will retaliate in some way at PEK? Or perhaps do like CZ, and start offering secondary/tertiary cities, linking them to DL@JFK/LAX?
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
jetblue1965
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Sat Dec 05, 2015 1:44 am

Quoting LAX772LR (Reply 28):

I'm confident if MU really wants PEK-MSP DTW ATL, CA won't even bat an eye. But between CA and HU destination grab, there are few low hanging fruits left out of PEK for MU

Regarding secondary cities to JFK/LAX, as long as it's not CTU, I don't think CA really cares at all. MU can launch all the NKG HGH WUH CKG SHE they want.
 
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LAX772LR
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Sat Dec 05, 2015 2:44 am

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 29):
I'm confident if MU really wants PEK-MSP DTW ATL, CA won't even bat an eye.

   Doubt CA (or MU) have the slightest interest in any of the above. Though, wouldn't be surprised to see DL attempt to launch ATL-PVG for the third time.

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 29):
MU can launch all the NKG HGH WUH CKG SHE

IINM, they already fly NKG-LAX
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Mon Dec 07, 2015 3:11 pm

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 25):

Quoting irishayes (Reply 24):
More insight and analysis on the commercial business reasons behind the route

http://upgrd.com/aerospace/china-eas...-gain-foothold-in-interior-us.html

Thanks for your self-promotion.

You are so welcome! Thanks for reading!
 
sovietjet
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Mon Dec 07, 2015 3:37 pm

Finally, an alternative to the horrendous experience of flying ORD-PVG on United or AA... I personally can't wait for this.
 
jetblue1965
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Mon Dec 07, 2015 3:41 pm

Quoting sovietjet (Reply 32):

Finally, an alternative to the horrendous experience of flying ORD-PVG on United or AA... I personally can't wait for this.

Enjoy your 10-abreast 777 flight
 
EddieDude
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Mon Dec 07, 2015 4:55 pm

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 33):
Enjoy your 10-abreast 777 flight

I know.

I don't understand why CZ and CA have 9-abreast 77Ws, and MU has 10-abreast 77Ws.
Upcoming flights:
April/May: AM MEX-SCL 788 (J), AM EZE-MEX 789 (J).
 
sovietjet
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:02 pm

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 33):
Enjoy your 10-abreast 777 flight

The 747s UA uses are already 10-abreast. What with the constant delays, unkind and lazy service, super cold cabin temperature, the IFE which until a year ago was practically nonexistent and currently is almost always broken anyway, terrible seats, terrible food and the most non-ergonomic food trays ever designed, not to mention the constant nickel and diming from UA for every little thing. I'm glad someone is stepping in to make this flight a more enjoyable experience.
 
jetblue1965
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:22 pm

Quoting sovietjet (Reply 35):

The 747s UA uses are already 10-abreast. What with the constant delays, unkind and lazy service, super cold cabin temperature, the IFE which until a year ago was practically nonexistent and currently is almost always broken anyway, terrible seats, terrible food and the most non-ergonomic food trays ever designed, not to mention the constant nickel and diming from UA for every little thing. I'm glad someone is stepping in to make this flight a more enjoyable experience.

First, anyone who thinks 10-abreast 747 and 10-abreast 777 are identical are clearly failing at basic math. Second, Most ORD-Asia services are going back to 777 - the 747s are moved back to SFO once again.

For me, seat comfort on a long haul trumps all. Service is just fluff to make people feel good. You can give me Etihad Residence service levels with a private butler and I still won't fly AirAsia X.

[Edited 2015-12-08 10:46:13]
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:27 pm

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 36):
First, anyone who thinks 10-abreast 747 and 10-abreast 777 are identical clearing fail at basic math.


At least those same people may not be failing basic English.

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 36):
You can give me Etihad Residence service levels with a private butler and I still won't fly AirAsia X.

Right, because comparing arguably the world's most premium class product with that of a medium-haul low-cost carrier provides a sound example?
 
EddieDude
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:29 pm

Quoting sovietjet (Reply 35):
The 747s UA uses are already 10-abreast.

Yes, but it is not an issue of the actual total number of seats abreast, but rather the width of the seats. 10 seats across on the 747 main cabin is fine. 777s were originally equipped with 9 seats per row. Eventually some number crusher decided to try to squeeze an extra seat in order to make more money. Doing that meant using narrower seats, which is why people (including myself) complain of 10-abreast 777s.

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 36):
Most ORD-Asia services are going back to 777

UA at least has the decency of flying 777s with a 9-abreast configuration in Y.
Upcoming flights:
April/May: AM MEX-SCL 788 (J), AM EZE-MEX 789 (J).
 
jetblue1965
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:40 pm

Quoting irishayes (Reply 37):
At least those same people may not be failing basic English.

Nice to be a pedantic troll because i typed too fast and forgot the "ing". I'm glad your life is so meaningful, especially after posting that click-bait self-aggrandizing article of your own.

I guess there's a good reason why MSP is poorer per capita than cities like SEA BOS WAS.

Quoting irishayes (Reply 37):

Right, because comparing arguably the world's most premium class product with that of a medium-haul low-cost carrier provides a sound example?

AirAsia X from KUL to Europe is medium haul to you ? Talk about failing basic geography and common sense too.

[Edited 2015-12-08 10:47:57]
 
jetblue1965
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:45 pm

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 38):
Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 36):
Most ORD-Asia services are going back to 777

UA at least has the decency of flying 777s with a 9-abreast configuration in Y.

They also have an economy plus section that's free for elites and very reasonably priced for general pax who want to purchase it. MU has no such thing (except standard exit rows) - suck it out in Y, or pay king's ransom to sit in J.
 
ORDTLV2414
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:51 pm

Jeez, Terminal 5 is going to be packed. Its time for ORD to invest in ICE facilities in terminal 1 and 3 to alievate that traffic.
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:14 pm

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 39):
Nice to be a pedantic troll because i typed too fast and forgot the "ing". I'm glad your life is so meaningful, especially after posting that click-bait self-aggrandizing article of your own.

oh mogando (or is it A380787)? you never cease to provide amazing comic relief on this site.

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 39):
I guess there's a good reason why MSP is poorer per capita than cities like SEA BOS WAS.

Cool stat! I must share this with my MSP friends since I no longer reside there.


Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 39):
AirAsia X from KUL to Europe is medium haul to you ? Talk about failing basic geography and common sense too.

Well, at risk of sounding "pedantic," I recall that AirAsia X has not served Europe since 2012....
 
jetblue1965
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:17 pm

Quoting irishayes (Reply 42):
Cool stat! I must share this with my MSP friends since I no longer reside there.

Then I'm glad you're admitting you're publicly LYING on your profile. Really appreciate your honesty and integrity.

You can share this link with your MSP friends all you want :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._metropolitan_areas_by_GDP

[Edited 2015-12-08 11:22:20]
 
EMB170
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:50 pm

Quoting United787 (Reply 6):
Congrats to ORD. Kind of surprising that a Chinese carrier didn't start this earlier. HU and CX are also new to the ORD market.

While MU might be a little slow on the uptake, I could definitely see this coming. Look at what MU already has:

Quoting FSDan (Reply 9):

MU have really upped their game to the U.S. A few years ago they just had LAX-PVG and JFK-PVG on the 346 (and I think JFK was 4 or 5 weekly). Now they have:
SFO-PVG 332
LAX-PVG 77W 332 (
LAX-HGH 332 (less than daily)
ORD-PVG 77W (less than daily)
JFK-PVG 77W (double daily?)
HNL-PVG 332 (less than daily)
Quoting global1 (Reply 20):
Expect to see more MU tails in the US and more DL tails in PVG in the years to come.

You beat me to it. I was thinking the exact same thing when I read that this had been announced. I remember it being said that DL was looking to do with MU across the Pacific what they currently do with VS, and AF/KL/AZ across the Atlantic in terms of setting up an ATI joint venture agreement. MU starting a route to ORD (which, while extremely important, is "enemy hub" territory for S
IND ORD ATL MCO PIT EWR BUF CVG DEN RNO JFK DTW BOS BDL BWI IAD RDU CLT MYR CHS TPA CID MSP STL MSY DFW IAH AUS SLC LAS
 
jetblue1965
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:58 pm

Quoting EMB170 (Reply 44):

You beat me to it. I was thinking the exact same thing when I read that this had been announced. I remember it being said that DL was looking to do with MU across the Pacific what they currently do with VS, and AF/KL/AZ across the Atlantic in terms of setting up an ATI joint venture agreement. MU starting a route to ORD (which, while extremely important, is "enemy hub" territory for S

This isn't "enemy hub" or what not. CHI area, I recall, is 4th highest demand from China, after LA, SF, and NY (forgot the exact order), and itself the 3rd largest metro region only after NY and LA. This is simply flying to where the demand is, and closing a glaring hole in their network.

Now, if MU were brave enough to fly PVG-DFW/IAH, then yes I would agree that's very hostile "enemy hub" territory.

Quoting EMB170 (Reply 44):
LAX-HGH 332 (less than daily)

I think you meant NKG not HGH ?
 
EMB170
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RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:14 pm

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 45):

I think you meant NKG not HGH ?

Sorry...I was only quoting someone else. They must have mistyped the code.

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 45):
This isn't "enemy hub" or what not. CHI area, I recall, is 4th highest demand from China, after LA, AF Airlines (Argentina)">SF, and NY (forgot the exact order), and itself the 3rd largest metro region only after NY and LA. This is simply flying to where the demand is, and closing a glaring hole in their network.

It is enemy hub territory if you consider that most FFs in ORD have a loyalty to either *A (due to UA) or oneworld (due to AA). While there are no doubt some FFs in the ORD catchment area that are SkyTeam loyalists, it will always be more difficult to profitably serve cities that are large hubs for competing airlines than it will be to add cities that are large hubs for airlines in one's own alliance. Just look at what happens to the CDG and LHR routes out of ORD on SkyTeam during the winter...they transition to DL metal from AF and VS, respectively, since DL can operate the flight with smaller a/c.
IND ORD ATL MCO PIT EWR BUF CVG DEN RNO JFK DTW BOS BDL BWI IAD RDU CLT MYR CHS TPA CID MSP STL MSY DFW IAH AUS SLC LAS
 
jetblue1965
Posts: 5050
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:28 pm

RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:21 pm

Quoting EMB170 (Reply 46):

It is enemy hub territory if you consider that most FFs in ORD have a loyalty to either *A (due to UA) or oneworld (due to AA). While there are no doubt some FFs in the ORD catchment area that are SkyTeam loyalists, it will always be more difficult to profitably serve cities that are large hubs for competing airlines than it will be to add cities that are large hubs for airlines in one's own alliance. Just look at what happens to the CDG and LHR routes out of ORD on SkyTeam during the winter...they transition to DL metal from AF and VS, respectively, since DL can operate the flight with smaller a/c.

You're viewing it only from the US POV. MU, I would guess, is much more heavy on Chinese side point-of-sale, in which they have an advantage over both UA and AA there. For all 3 players, it's own hub on one side and rival hub on other, so it's equal footing for everyone around.

The cases where a large hub of one alliance really impedes on rival competition is when most of the traffic is outbound not inbound, e.g. ATL. Despite being the world's busiest airport, long-haul services to ATL by rival alliances is marginal at best on Atlantic side and virtually non-existent on the Pacific side.

Both ORD and PVG are huge destinations on their own, with a healthy mix of business and leisure. In that sense, I don't expect MU having too much difficulty with this market (whether their 77W is too premium heavy or not is a different debate)
 
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IrishAyes
Topic Author
Posts: 2435
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 6:04 pm

RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:41 pm

Quoting jetblue1965 (Reply 43):
You can share this link with your MSP friends all you want :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._metropolitan_areas_by_GDP

I'll pass. My MSP friends don't get butthurt over the same things that you do.

Quoting EMB170 (Reply 46):
While there are no doubt some FFs in the ORD catchment area that are SkyTeam loyalists, it will always be more difficult to profitably serve cities that are large hubs for competing airlines than it will be to add cities that are large hubs for airlines in one's own alliance.

The selling point of MU is the vast connections to interior China over PVG for traffic heading to ORD. Whether or not AA or UA is already in the market has minimal impact. This has been the case with HU on its ORD-PEK flight.
 
jetblue1965
Posts: 5050
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:28 pm

RE: China Eastern Announces ORD

Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:51 pm

Quoting irishayes (Reply 48):
I'll pass. My MSP friends don't get butthurt over the same things that you do.

Sure, the same way those in poverty always say money doesn't matter. I guess the grape is sour afterall.

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