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tomcbaker
Posts: 260
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 09, 2015 6:35 pm

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 32):
I grew up in the Portland area and now live in Seattle, and while the Portland tech scene is nothing to sneeze at, it absolutely is much smaller than the tech presence in Seattle.

   Definitely agree here. No one is saying PDX doesn't have a thriving, up and coming tech market. But in Seattle, I'd bet that Amazon, Boeing and Microsoft alone represent a larger share of the tech industry than all of what currently exists in Portland.

Digressing for a moment, another notable industry not related to tech but certainly related to civilian travel is military installations; the Seattle area has the largest military presence on the U.S. west coast outside of San Diego, and it's arguably as large or larger than San Diego in terms of total military presence; while San Diego is primarily Navy/Marines, the Seattle area has major installations for all of the services. This includes a huge Army/AF presence at JBLM; Navy/Marine Corps at NAS Whidbey Island, shipyard in Bremerton, sub base in Bangor and carrier battle group at Everett; and the Coast Guard also, who have all of their icebreakers in downtown Seattle in addition to an air station in Port Angeles. All of these are within 100 miles of SEA and they don't all use Space-A to travel on personal or official business.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 35):
I am miserable with a 50 minute dash between N satellite & C concourse during the morning or evening rush times.

   Agreed. There are times when connecting in SEA really sucks. I try to avoid QX's YYJ-SEA flight like the plague because it's a miserable experience to connect; YYJ does not have pre-clearance so you have dash trash parking at SEA's international terminal with the heavies. You have to clear customs and then take at least one (usually two different) airport trains/trams to get to your connecting terminal. And unlike some airports, you absolutely have to take the tram to connect between some terminals at SEA; the longer walk between terminals is not an alternative. I've also found some SEA gates, particularly AS gates, to be incredibly overcrowded with inadequate seating for the size of the airplane. Never had any of these problems at PDX, which in my opinion also has more/better food options in the terminals if you're connecting.

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 36):
SAN-LAX is definitely closer than SEA-PDX, but I don't know what the flight frequency is between the two. I have never heard of anyone mention a SAN-LAX shuttle which is what I was more referring to.

Frequencies between SAN-LAX have gone down significantly over the last 10 years since American Eagle and Skywest/UAX ended turboprop service. I've flown on Eagle Saab 340's SAN-LAX and Skywest EMB-120's SAN-BUR/SAN-LAX. Both carriers at one time had hourly service M-F between SAN-LAX in the 90's. Just like SBA-LAX, the frequencies are substantially reduced due to the operating characteristics and capacity of the regional jet.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 44):
Quoting HPRamper (Reply 39):
PDX is also a breeze to connect through in comparison.

Agreed

  

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 47):

When TWA/AA flew PDX-STL

Great picture - taken in the early 2000's would be my guess. Anyone else notice how many DL tails there are? I used to fly DL 727's and 757's in the early/mid-90's between PDX-LAX and they were even flying 767's PDX-LAX at one point around 1995-1996. Like UA in the late 2000's, DL's presence at PDX has never been the same, but 20 years ago they were huge in PDX. That's why I balk whenever someone on here makes the myopic claim that AS has always been PDX's only hometown airline. They either weren't around or forget UA and DL in the 70's-90's.
Tom
 
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NWAESC
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 09, 2015 7:00 pm

I know you put the word "only" in there, but I grew up in PDX as well, and never saw the same affinity for DL that I did for AS/QX...
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
tomcbaker
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 09, 2015 7:44 pm

Quoting NWAESC (Reply 51):
I know you put the word "only" in there, but I grew up in PDX as well, and never saw the same affinity for DL that I did for AS/QX...

I did. For DL and for UA, at one time.
Tom
 
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NWAESC
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 09, 2015 8:10 pm

I believe you both; I just never saw it.

For UA, other than my family flying them, I'm too young to know what it was like in the '70's...
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
flyoregon
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 09, 2015 9:12 pm

Do you think EUG or MFR will see flights to/from HNL in the next 5-8 years?

I doubt it, but I wonder if Alaska would give either one of those a shot or when the Hawaiian A321neo's come on-line, maybe they'd give one or both a try and split it 4x/3x weekly.
 
32andBelow
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:00 pm

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 54):

Do you think EUG or MFR will see flights to/from HNL in the next 5-8 years?

I doubt it, but I wonder if Alaska would give either one of those a shot or when the Hawaiian A321neo's come on-line, maybe they'd give one or both a try and split it 4x/3x weekly.

Would AS look at a market such as GEG or BOI before these?
 
Wingtips56
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:09 pm

G4 tried EUG-HNL, but it didn't work out. I don't know what percentage of the failure might be based on a weak market and how much was based on G4's poor performance. MFR I don't see as large enough for a non-stop. A tag perhaps more marketable than a connection, even though the timing would be the same.
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 181 airports, 92 airlines, 78 a/c types, 403 routes, 58 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,119,414 passenger miles.

Home airport : CEC
 
flyoregon
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:40 pm

Quoting 32andBelow (Reply 55):
Would AS look at a market such as GEG or BOI before these?

I would imagine so. I think if they did anything from EUG or MFR, it would be seasonal not unlike BLI.

Quoting Wingtips56 (Reply 56):
G4 tried EUG-HNL, but it didn't work out. I don't know what percentage of the failure might be based on a weak market and how much was based on G4's poor performance. MFR I don't see as large enough for a non-stop. A tag perhaps more marketable than a connection, even though the timing would be the same.

G4 hardly counts in my opinion. I think the poor performance has a lot to do with it, but I also think the G4 model doesn't work very well for that kind of market. For Hawaii, I think people like more options over 1x weekly. Just my opinion.
 
32andBelow
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 09, 2015 11:50 pm

You also have to factor if X amount come out of all these cities through SEA/PDX to HNL/OGG then you would have too much capacity out of the hub.
 
lhpdx
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Dec 10, 2015 12:03 am

With all of the new adds so far for PDX, I'm pretty certain 2016 is going to be another record year for the airport!! It wouldn't surprise me if we reach 18 million mark around the time the E extension is finished......
 
Airnerd
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Dec 10, 2015 12:31 am

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 57):
G4 hardly counts in my opinion. I think the poor performance has a lot to do with it, but I also think the G4 model doesn't work very well for that kind of market. For Hawaii, I think people like more options over 1x weekly. Just my opinion.

Definitely true. I won't fly G4 anywhere, and I think many people feel the same way.
 
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RWA380
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Dec 10, 2015 1:39 am

Quoting Wingtips56 (Reply 56):
G4 tried EUG-HNL, but it didn't work out. I don't know what percentage of the failure might be based on a weak market and how much was based on G4's poor performance.

G4's performance was a well known issue in Eugene, the paper often put an article in when the flights were delayed more than a few hours. Let's face it, if you have a real job to get back to & your choice is AS with a PDX connection any day of the week you want to go or a once a week operation with a bad track record of keeping their 757's flying in & out of Hawaii on time, plus the fact no other carrier would honor your G4 ticket, you'd be stuck in Hawaii for a day or a week.

Quoting Wingtips56 (Reply 56):
MFR I don't see as large enough for a non-stop.

If things go the way they are, MFR should exceed passenger counts vs EUG in less than 5 years, MFR has a much larger catchment area LMT to CEC, RBG to RDD.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 57):

I would imagine so. I think if they did anything from EUG or MFR, it would be seasonal not unlike BLI.

Agreed, a season is the only way I'd expect it could survive, but we go to Hawaii in the Summer too, the flights are full even when I go in late Oct to early to Nov every year. It just doesn't matter when you go, flights are full to Hawaii & many people are connections from down south out of Portland.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 57):
G4 hardly counts in my opinion. I think the poor performance has a lot to do with it, but I also think the G4 model doesn't work very well for that kind of market. For Hawaii, I think people like more options over 1x weekly. Just my opinion.

Well said .... And exactly true. I know people in Eugene that have a condo in the same building we do in Maui & they never used G4 telling me they were more than once mentioned in an unfavorable light in the Register Guard during the time that G4 was having so many problems with their 757 Hawaii operations, almost right after starting ops to the Islands.

At the onset, G4 was offering $99.00 o/w fares, we actually considered driving 2 hours from Portland to Eugene to try it just once, I am so glad we didn't gpo. The outbound we would have been on, got into Honolulu well after midnight & the return 2 weeks later was cancelled. And these are just the times I know of, there are many similar shout outs all around.
707 717 720 727-1/2 737-1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 747-1/2/3/4 757-2/3 767-2/3/4 777-2/3 DC8 DC9 MD80/2/7/8 D10-1/3/4 M11 L10-1/2/5 A300/310/320
AA AC AQ AS BA BD BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WC WN WP YS 8M
 
HPRamper
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Dec 10, 2015 1:58 am

Quoting tomcbaker (Reply 50):
YYJ does not have pre-clearance so you have dash trash parking at SEA's international terminal with the heavies.

Hm. Seems like an obvious add to the pre-clearance system.

Quoting tomcbaker (Reply 50):
Never had any of these problems at PDX, which in my opinion also has more/better food options in the terminals if you're connecting.

Better food and better beer, in my opinion. I haven't been in the D concourse in several years, have they added any food there? In my recollection, in the morning hours the concourse was mostly dead with only one Wendy's as a food option.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 54):
Do you think EUG or MFR will see flights to/from HNL in the next 5-8 years?

I doubt it, but I wonder if Alaska would give either one of those a shot or when the Hawaiian A321neo's come on-line, maybe they'd give one or both a try and split it 4x/3x weekly.

MFR is a dark horse with its ever-growing catchment area, EUG I just don't see.
 
pdx
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Dec 10, 2015 7:22 am

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 62):
Better food and better beer, in my opinion. I haven't been in the D concourse in several years, have they added any food there? In my recollection, in the morning hours the concourse was mostly dead with only one Wendy's as a food option.

Wendy's is long gone. It's Burgerville now!
 
tomcbaker
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Dec 10, 2015 10:40 pm

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 61):
If things go the way they are, MFR should exceed passenger counts vs EUG in less than 5 years, MFR has a much larger catchment area LMT to CEC, RBG to RDD.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 57):

I would imagine so. I think if they did anything from EUG or MFR, it would be seasonal not unlike BLI.

Point of fact just for clarification - BLI's flights to Hawaii were/are primarily to cater to the metro YVR crowd. Canadians are well known for their love of sun/sand destinations, and just as many in eastern Canada go to the Caribbean, many in the west go to Mexico or Hawaii (Mexico more recently due to the exchange rate). Before another person on here belts out the standard "but there's a lot of people in northwest WA state that also fly out of BLI", please google the factual decline in traffic at BLI that corresponds with the decline in the CAD-USD exchange rate over the last 18 months. Most people I know are going to Mexico or other Spanish speaking sun/sand destinations this year instead of SoCal, Florida or Hawaii.

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 62):

Quoting tomcbaker (Reply 50):
YYJ does not have pre-clearance so you have dash trash parking at SEA's international terminal with the heavies.

Hm. Seems like an obvious add to the pre-clearance system.

Yes, it does. Especially given that DL will start up flights out of YYJ this spring. We'll have three different airlines flying to the US (AS/QX, UA and DL) and quite a few daily flights. I believe YYJ and Kelowna are the only two left that QX flies to out of SEA that don't have pre-clearance.

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 62):
Better food and better beer, in my opinion. I haven't been in the D concourse in several years, have they added any food there? In my recollection, in the morning hours the concourse was mostly dead with only one Wendy's as a food option.

Definitely better food and beer. Although I'm still sad they shut down Gustav's at PDX - that's one of my favourite local chains.

Quoting pdx (Reply 63):
Wendy's is long gone. It's Burgerville now!

Speaking of favourite local chains, love Burgerville and grateful it's at PDX now!
Tom
 
UnitedFlyer
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 16, 2015 3:15 am

https://kobi5.com/news/medford-airport-adds-new-flights-6347/

A record year for MFR!
 
flyoregon
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 16, 2015 6:14 pm

Quoting UnitedFlyer (Reply 65):
https://kobi5.com/news/medford-airport-adds-new-flights-6347/

A record year for MFR!

I have to plead ignorance here...what's driving the growth out of MFR? Surely it's not ALL from LMT losing service? I think Medford and SW Oregon is a lovely part of the state and I'm more than happy to see this. It would be awesome to see mainline service from there and EUG again although I suspect those days are long gone. I loved seeing United Shuttle 737's coming and going from EUG/MFR!

 
mtnwest1979
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 16, 2015 7:56 pm

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 66):
mainline service from there and EUG again

Well Allegiant still flies mainline jets to both...  

I would tend to believe that the major factor driving the flying is increase in population from ex-Californians, and people coming for
quality of life and relatively lower cost of life there. Also, while places such as CEC still retain service, I tend to think more pax are driving and using MFR for their
commercial air service needs.
Riddle: Which lasts longer, a start-up airline or a start-up football league?
 
flyoregon
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 16, 2015 8:30 pm

Quoting mtnwest1979 (Reply 67):
Well Allegiant still flies mainline jets to both... I would tend to believe that the major factor driving the flying is increase in population from ex-Californians, and people coming for quality of life and relatively lower cost of life there. Also, while places such as CEC still retain service, I tend to think more pax are driving and using MFR for their commercial air service needs

Yeah, you're right. I guess Allegiant "counts"  

I assumed it was leakage from other nearby cities, but why now? I know many of those communities have seen somewhat dramatic cuts to their flight frequencies, so there loss is MFR's gain I suppose. It's great to see it grow.
 
flyoregon
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Wed Dec 16, 2015 8:52 pm

Another 'win' for PDX: http://www.oregonlive.com/commuting/...g_not_in_portland.html#incart_2box

Let's ride the momentum and get a flight to London!
 
ANA787
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Sun Dec 20, 2015 6:19 pm

Virgin America will FINALLY add frequency at PDX starting April 1, 2016!

VX PDX-SFO will go 2x daily April 1, 2016.
 
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ramprat74
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Sun Dec 20, 2015 7:28 pm

It looks like in the very near future the POP will close down E4 and E5 and AC will move to D2 and UA will use D4 while construction is going on. I don't know what gate NK will move to though?
 
mtnwest1979
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Mon Dec 21, 2015 4:33 am

Just a side note regarding the TSA lack of support to business at Klamath Falls.They also gave the same bullshit response to Del Rio, TX
that was looking at getting service once again. I am sure glad these fux at TSA can be so obtuse to any idea that a location can sustain and perhaps thrive with the
re-establishment of air service.
The folks in charge there are certainly doing a bang up job. Idiots.
Riddle: Which lasts longer, a start-up airline or a start-up football league?
 
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RWA380
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Mon Dec 21, 2015 7:26 am

Here are your Oregon OAG updates for the week, one nice add is VX going to 2x daily to SFO.

DL DTW-PDX MAR 0.8>0.5

UA DEN-MFR MAR 1.9>1.1
UA DEN-RDM FEB 1.6>1.0 APR 1.7>1.1
UA SFO-MFR APR 5>4

*VX PDX-SFO APR 1.0>2 MAY 1.0>2 JUN 0.9>1.9 JUL 0.8>1.8 AUG 0.9>1.9
707 717 720 727-1/2 737-1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 747-1/2/3/4 757-2/3 767-2/3/4 777-2/3 DC8 DC9 MD80/2/7/8 D10-1/3/4 M11 L10-1/2/5 A300/310/320
AA AC AQ AS BA BD BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WC WN WP YS 8M
 
flyoregon
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:02 pm

The Port of Portland released stats for Port operated airports (which include PDX) today for October 2015. International carrier data found below:

Condor:......................Total Pax:...0 .......No. Flts:....0......Avg Pax/Flt: 00............LF:...0%

Icelandair:..................Total Pax:...0.......No. Flts:....0......Avg Pax/Flt: 00............LF:...0%

Volaris:.................Total Pax:...3,548 .......No. Flts:....26......Avg Pax/Flt: 136.46 .............LF:...78.43%


-Passenger count is up YTD 5.6% with 15,410,790 YTD November 2015 and 14,594,568 November 2014.

-Passenger traffic is up 12.0% November 2015 over November 2014 with 1,360,912 and 1,215,182 respectively.
Average passenger count on all flights in: 100.67
Average passenger count on all flights out: 100.17

International Passenger Traffic is found below:

Total International :.........2015:.....36,182 ..........2014:......38,563 .....%Chg:.....-6.2%
Total Enplaned:...............2015:.....17,786 ..........2014:......19,582 ....%Chg:......-9.2%
Total Deplaned:...............2015:.....18,396 ..........2014:......18,981 ....%Chg:......-3.1%

Other airline figures:*
-Air Canada (Jazz):........ 42.2% change in passenger numbers YoY
-Alaska :........................10.3% change in passenger numbers YoY
-American :.................. 10.6% change in passenger numbers YoY
-Condor:....................... 0.0% change in passenger numbers YoY
-Delta :......................... 27.5% change in passenger numbers YoY
-Frontier:...................... 25.5% change in passenger numbers YoY
-Hawaiian:.................... -0.2% change in passenger numbers YoY
-Horizon :....................... 1.7% change in passenger numbers YoY
-Icelandair:................... 0.0% change in passenger numbers YoY
-JetBlue :...................... 5.4% change in passenger numbers YoY
-PenAir:......................... 0.0% change in passenger numbers YoY
-SeaPort:...................... 9.9% change in passenger numbers YoY
-Southwest :................. 20.7% change in passenger numbers YoY
-Spirit:.......................... -28.3% change in passenger numbers YoY
-United:......................... 20.8% change in passenger numbers YoY
-Virgin America :............ 7.0% change in passenger numbers YoY
-Volaris:......................... 52.5% change in passenger numbers YoY
*SkyWest, Compass, & Charter (i.e. Allegiant, Sun Country) omitted from analysis

PDX Flight operations saw a 7.0% increase with Military Operations decreasing by -16.6% and General Aviation increasing 12.9%

Also, outside of PDX, Troutdale Airport saw a 28.2% change in operations YTD, while Hillsboro saw a -14.1%change .

Source: http://www.portofportland.com/Aviation_Stat.aspx
 
ANA787
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Mon Dec 28, 2015 4:44 am

Delta has added PDX-ANC nonstop starting in May.

DL Adds PDX-ANC (by ANA787 Dec 27 2015 in Civil Aviation)
 
bluejackets
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Mon Dec 28, 2015 9:50 pm

Quoting mtnwest1979 (Reply 67):
I would tend to believe that the major factor driving the flying is increase in population from ex-Californians, and people coming for
quality of life and relatively lower cost of life there.

Certainly agree with this factor, but the overall economy in southern Oregon is very strong right now also. The tourism industry, in particular, seems to especially be booming.

I think another factor is the continued growth of AS in SEA. There are more and more places you can get to in one-stop at a very competitive price on AS after about an 1:15 flight. There is a 4th daily MFR-SEA flight starting soon. I think this is forcing the other airlines at MFR to compete even more.
It's funny when I tell people I love planes and they think I'm weird.
 
ANA787
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Mon Jan 04, 2016 5:36 am

PDX had an amazing year 2015.

Here are my PDX predictions/hopes for 2016. Feel free to add yours.

1. WN announces PDX-BNA
2. A new route to Europe will be announced either PDX-CDG(DL)? PDX-LHR(BA)? PDX-FRA(LH returning seeing as how successful DE was on PDX-FRA last year)?.
3. A new route to Asia will be announced either PDX-ICN?(KE) PDX-PEK?(HU) PDX-NRT?(NH)
4. A new route to Florida will finally be announced either PDX-MIA(AA), PDX-MCO(AS/B6), PDX-FLL(B6)
5. AS will announce PDX-DEN
6. DL will announce PDX-CUN seasonal service
7. AS will announce PDX-MSY
8. AS will announce PDX-ABQ
9. AA will announce PDX-JFK
10. AS will announce PDX-ATL
11. AS will announce PDX-MKE
12. AM will announce PDX-MEX
 
bjorn14
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Mon Jan 04, 2016 8:42 pm

Just curious by TSA not wanting to provide serve at LMT does that preclude LMT from getting a private screening contractor?
"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
 
ANA787
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 4:45 pm

Frontier adds nonstop PDX-ORD/PHX/CLE.

F9 Adds 42 Routes (by enilria Jan 7 2016 in Civil Aviation)

http://www.digitaljournal.com/pr/2794638

Three new cities from Portland, Ore.

Frontier will add non-stop service between Portland and Chicago O'Hare, Cleveland and Phoenix. Flights to Cleveland and Phoenix will operate on Tuesdays, Thursdays and Sundays while flights to Chicago O'Hare will operate on Mondays, Wednesdays, Fridays and Saturdays. Fares in these new markets will be as low as $79 and provide savings up to 50 percent.

Market Service Starts Industry Average Fare (1) New Frontier Fare (2) Intro Fare (3) Savings Versus Industry Average Fare with The WORKS (4)
PDX-ORD 4/14/2016 $226 $129 $79 43% $188
PDX-PHX 6/29/2016 $143 $79 $59 45% $142
PDX-CLE 4/14/2016 $256 $129 $79 50% $188


Read more: http://www.digitaljournal.com/pr/2794638#ixzz3wZt56xRJ
 
Airnerd
Posts: 304
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 4:57 pm

Quoting ANA787 (Reply 79):
Frontier will add non-stop service between Portland and Chicago O'Hare, Cleveland and Phoenix. Flights to Cleveland and Phoenix will operate on Tuesdays, Thursdays and Sundays while flights to Chicago O'Hare will operate on Mondays, Wednesdays, Fridays and Saturdays. Fares in these new markets will be as low as $79 and provide savings up to 50 percent.

Wow, Cleveland! Has PDX ever had non-stop service to CLE?

And what about PenAir? Seems like we can expect something from them in 2016...

[Edited 2016-01-07 08:58:24]
 
ANA787
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 5:03 pm

Quoting Airnerd (Reply 80):

Wow, Cleveland! Has PDX ever had non-stop service to CLE?

And what about PenAir? Seems like we can expect something from them in 2016...

In 2013 United operated a daily nonstop PDX-CLE. This was axed when UA dismantled their hub at CLE.

I would expect PenAir to announce PDX-RDD/ACV/LMT and maybe OTH for Summer 2016.

PDX has a lot of new service coming in 2016!
 
BoeingGuy
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 5:11 pm

Quoting ANA787 (Reply 77):
Here are my PDX predictions/hopes for 2016. Feel free to add yours.

1. WN announces PDX-BNA
2. A new route to Europe will be announced either PDX-CDG(DL)? PDX-LHR(BA)? PDX-FRA(LH returning seeing as how successful DE was on PDX-FRA last year)?.
3. A new route to Asia will be announced either PDX-ICN?(KE) PDX-PEK?(HU) PDX-NRT?(NH)
4. A new route to Florida will finally be announced either PDX-MIA(AA), PDX-MCO(AS/B6), PDX-FLL(B6)
5. AS will announce PDX-DEN
6. DL will announce PDX-CUN seasonal service
7. AS will announce PDX-MSY
8. AS will announce PDX-ABQ
9. AA will announce PDX-JFK
10. AS will announce PDX-ATL
11. AS will announce PDX-MKE
12. AM will announce PDX-MEX

I don't think any of these are beyond the realm of possibility, except I'd be surprised to see #12. If SEA and SJC don't have non-stop MEX flights, I wouldn't expect to see PDX get one.

Remember that several speculated AS routes on your list have been tried and dropped: DEN, MCO and ATL. For #2 and #3, my money would be on BA and NH.

I'd give #6 a lower probability too, and if it were to start I'd think AS would be more likely to start PDX-CUN.
 
mtnwest1979
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 5:20 pm

Any guesses on how long these new routes will be in operation until they are axed all together? I certainly don't hold out for
any long term on any Frontier route anymore.
Riddle: Which lasts longer, a start-up airline or a start-up football league?
 
flyoregon
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 6:19 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 82):
my money would be on BA and NH.

BA...yes.

NH....doubtful. More likely to see JAL or HU to Asia.

Quoting mtnwest1979 (Reply 83):
Any guesses on how long these new routes will be in operation until they are axed all together? I certainly don't hold out forany long term on any Frontier route anymore.

After summer, they won't come back. Remember COS and STL?
 
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RWA380
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 8:00 pm

Quoting Airnerd (Reply 80):

Wow, Cleveland! Has PDX ever had non-stop service to CLE?

Both CO & UA have operated it, CO used to do non-stop in the summer time & one stop (via Seattle) the rest of the year. I used to love using CLE as the easier way to reach my GF in BOS from PDX.

Quoting Airnerd (Reply 80):
And what about PenAir? Seems like we can expect something from them in 2016..

YES ... KS will have some more service this year from Portland.

Quoting ANA787 (Reply 81):
PDX has a lot of new service coming in 2016!

Seems you may be speaking to the same people I am, you are correct some nice things are planned for PDX in 2016.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 84):

NH....doubtful. More likely to see JAL or HU to Asia

         HU before JL, IMHO. JL has been in talks with PDX more than one time.
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ANA787
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 8:03 pm

So far new destinations from PDX for 2016:

OMA-First time ever served nonstop from PDX?
MWH-Previously operated by BigSky Airlines
CLE-UA used to operate this route nonstop up until 2014 when the CLE hub was dismantled.
YYZ-AC axed this in 2013. Thrilled to see it back!

With CLE now gone from the 10 largest unserved markets from PDX, I expect to see MCO added any time now.

DOT stats 10 largest UNSERVED markets from PDX:

1. Orlando:............ 331.44 passengers
2. Miami (metro):....265.11
3. New Orleans:......151.11
4. Nashville:............111.67
5. Indianapolis:........97.89
6. Cleveland:...........82.11  
7. Ft. Myers:............71.89
8. Pittsburgh:...........70.33
9. Cincinnati:............68.22
10. Columbus:..........66.33
 
flyoregon
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 8:24 pm

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 85):
HU before JL, IMHO. JL has been in talks with PDX more than one time.

I think you're right about that. HU makes more sense anyway because of Alaska. I know that's not everything to make it successful, but it certainly helps. As much as I'd love to see JL here, like you said, they've talked about it to death. If they're going to do it, then they just need to do it...but they aren't.

Quoting ANA787 (Reply 86):
YYZ-AC axed this in 2013. Thrilled to see it back!

I'm still trying to understand why SLC is year-round but PDX is seasonal. But thrilled to see it back as well! Love the E-190 in AC colors.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 85):
YES ... KS will have some more service this year from Portland.

They need to just take PDT and OTH from K5. I've always thought that they should work with Alaska to add a PDX-BOI frequency and then do a BOI-IDA flight. BOI-IDA on QX with the -200 was a great service and consistently full (I know that doesn't mean profit, yada yada yada). The Saab 340 would be a great airplane for that market as it would LMT, PDT, OTH and practically every former QX market once served by the -200.

I love seeing all of this growth at PDX! I'd hate to see all of this good stuff go away when/if the economy slides backwards again like it did in '08. I think local economy and tourism is certainly sufficient and solidifying itself for the market being supported right now at PDX, so I'm not overly concerned, but I also would like to be cautious and modest in growth this year, and I think the airlines are doing that. Alaska has plans for Portland, and I would be disappointingly surprised if BA didn't announce LHR this year. It's WAY overdue.
 
Airnerd
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 8:27 pm

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 87):
I'm still trying to understand why SLC is year-round but PDX is seasonal.

Winter ski traffic?
 
flyoregon
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 8:53 pm

Quoting Airnerd (Reply 88):
Winter ski traffic?

Maybe, but if the traffic was so strong, Delta would have kept the route around when they pushed AC out the last time. Once AC pulled out, DL dropped YYZ-SLC if I remember right. It's the same thing this time except AC is using the E190 and not the CRJ-900. AC announced; DL announced right after. AC is doing very well in Portland, so I suspect it will go year round like YYC has, but I don't understand why they don't do it right off the bat.

Maybe it's a range thing during the winter. I know the -190 already pushes the range limits on YYZ-PDX although only slightly longer than YYZ-SEA.
 
BoeingGuy
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 9:18 pm

Quoting ANA787 (Reply 86):
1. Orlando:............ 331.44 passengers
2. Miami (metro):....265.11
3. New Orleans:......151.11
4. Nashville:............111.67
5. Indianapolis:........97.89
6. Cleveland:...........82.11
7. Ft. Myers:............71.89
8. Pittsburgh:...........70.33
9. Cincinnati:............68.22
10. Columbus:..........66.33

This is an interesting list. AFAIK, four of the cities on this list have previously had PDX non-stops too: MCO (AS), CLE (CO), PIT (US), CVG (DL).

I'm surprised that AA hasn't started a PDX-MIA flight to connect with all its Caribbean and South America flights.

Any chance of AS resuming PDX-MCO?
 
lhpdx
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 9:55 pm

What wonderful news to wake up to about my favorite airport!! I hope Alaska, American and Delta will step up their operation too this summer......Does anyone know when concourse E will partially shutdown for extension construction? Any new international news at PDX? 2016 will definitely be another record years for passengers..........
 
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bigfoot0503
Posts: 429
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Thu Jan 07, 2016 11:37 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 90):
Any chance of AS resuming PDX-MCO?

IMHO this is a route that carriers at PDX are missing the mark on. Not only would AS be well served to resume this route I'm suprised that B6 hasn't made a move towards adding east bound service out of PDX. All of the B6 adds have been west coast routes, I would have to believe that B6 service from PDX to either MCO or FLL would be fairly lucrative.
 
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RWA380
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Fri Jan 08, 2016 12:37 am

Quoting ANA787 (Reply 86):
OMA-First time ever served nonstop from PDX?

Nope, EA served OMA-SEA/PDX for years with 727-100 & even L-1011 aircraft.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 87):
I think you're right about that. HU makes more sense anyway because of Alaska. I know that's not everything to make it successful, but it certainly helps.

I think it's the one thing that makes any long haul route to PDX viable. The tie up with AS makes all the difference in the world, IMHO. HU would be wise to start PEK-PDX before another Chinese carrier does.

Quoting flyoregon (Reply 87):

They need to just take PDT

Unfortunately KS will have the same issue in PDT as they do at LMT, no TSA & IIRC, the TSA has already said they woud not re-staff PDT again, just like LMT. Either the TSA changes their mind, which they have said will not happen or these communities will not have air service, as KS will not fly the route without TSA cleared passengers & places like OTH, RDD & ACV move up in the service calendar.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 90):
Any chance of AS resuming PDX-MCO?

Yes of course, with a tourist friendly schedule, I think AS could make a go of PDX-MCO. But I also think there are higher yielding routes they could fly with that frame.
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Airnerd
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Fri Jan 08, 2016 12:43 am

I think MIA is obvious for AA or AS with code shares and good connection timing. The AA network to the Caribbean, Central America and South America is so robust, I'm surprised they don't serve PDX already. Look at this list of non-stop destinations from MIA: http://www.miami-airport.com/cities_served_nonstop.asp. I could totally see PDX on that list.

Is it a range/aircraft availability issue? They'd want to use a fairly modest-sized aircraft. At 2700 mi, MD80 isn't going to work, maybe even a stretch for some of the 737 variants? Did AS try Florida with the 900s and have issues? Am I remembering that correctly.

Of course, it would probably have to be a red-eye to make the connections, bummer.
 
flyoregon
Posts: 820
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Fri Jan 08, 2016 5:05 am

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 93):
The tie up with AS makes all the difference in the world, IMHO

I'm with you on that 100%. Some will say that interline/codesharing doesn't help an airline be successful, but I think the complete opposite. Look at SEA- while a bigger metro/catchment area, the majority of the international carriers have interline agreements with Alaska...you can't tell me it doesn't help.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 93):
Unfortunately KS will have the same issue in PDT as they do at LMT, no TSA

Thanks for the info. I wasn't aware that PDT didn't have TSA although it only makes sense. I know there was talk about reverse screening at PDX and I wonder if that will be in the plans with the remodel? I thought I also heard the KS would be open to that as an option as well?
 
BoeingGuy
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Fri Jan 08, 2016 5:22 am

Quoting Airnerd (Reply 94):
Is it a range/aircraft availability issue? They'd want to use a fairly modest-sized aircraft. At 2700 mi, MD80 isn't going to work, maybe even a stretch for some of the 737 variants? Did AS try Florida with the 900s and have issues? Am I remembering that correctly.

That was the non-ER -900. AS does SEA-FLL and AA does SEA-MIA with 737-800s with no problems at all. A 738 or one of AA's A319s would be no sweat on PDX-MIA.
 
lhpdx
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Fri Jan 08, 2016 8:56 am

I wonder if Alaska plans to add more to PDX in 2016?
 
flyoregon
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Fri Jan 08, 2016 4:24 pm

Quoting lhpdx (Reply 97):
Quoting lhpdx (Reply 97):
I wonder if Alaska plans to add more to PDX in 2016?

With more ERJ-175's coming online at OO (and maybe QX in 2017), I'd count on it. It's the perfect airplane to start a new market and they can switch to a 737 if needed/able. ABQ and DEN are on my list for Alaska 2016 with the -175s. MCO/FLL with either AS or B6. LHR with BA. JFK with AA or AS. Would love to see KOA, LIH, PHL and Top
 
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RWA380
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RE: Oregon Aviation Thread - Part 10

Sat Jan 09, 2016 7:10 am

Quoting lhpdx (Reply 97):
I wonder if Alaska plans to add more to PDX in 2016?

Yes, Portland will see growth from AS in 2016, It's my understanding that we won't need to wait too terribly long to hear of additions in the Portland market, AS is ready to retain their title of #1 carrier at PDX for decades to come.
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