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qf789
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Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Nov 25, 2015 5:56 pm

With over 200 replies in Australian Aviation Thread Part 132 (by qf789 Nov 15 2015 in Civil Aviation) Australian Aviation Part 133 is now open

In thread 132 we discussed

- 2nd Retro Roo revealed
- AA Advantge eyes closer tie up with QF
- QF increases DFW to daily from end of April
- QF reduces SYD-LAX to daily with Tuesdays been operated by 744
- QF to operate 744 on 3 flights a week MEL-HKG, frees an A330 3 days a week what route will this fly?
- Aus BT - QF eyes nonstop SYD-JFK flights using 778
- JQ moves into T4 at MEL
- QF returns to investment grade credit rating
- QF A380 vs 777X debate
- QF A330 refurbs, half the fleet have been done
- VA to operate A332 to NAN from MEL, BNE & SYD on between June & October 2016
- QF19 Lengthy 10hr delay to MNL
- QF A332's EBA, EBB and EBE operating international sectors
- QF A332's Y product consistency PTVs vs ipads
- QF PER-AKL flights
- MU to operate seasonal 3 weekly BNE-PVG in Jan & Feb 2016, year round from Nov 2016
- Malindo Air starts KUL-PER
- Rex to recommence Sydney-Cooma
- UAE/AUS bilateral increased by 28 frequencies a week (14 UAE/14 AUS)
- CX flies 747-8F into Wellcamp
- VH-OGR positions ASP-SYD-VCV
- Announcement of a new passenger service from CX to Aus soon
- rumour that EK424/425 PER-DXB will be upgraded to A388 towards the end of 2016
- OOL lack of airbridges
- Tigerair first 737-800 revealed
- A340 Qatari Amiri Flight
- VA moves into T1 at PER
- CBR and international flights
- QF Group A320NEO on order
- AKL-CNS to see 772 between July and October 2016
- VA's ATR's
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Thai77w
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Thu Nov 26, 2015 2:46 am

Alliance just announced they have purchased Austrian's remaining Fokker 70 and F100 (21 aircraft) for US $15.5 million.

The article refers to them being stored in Bratislava so suggests these will be mostly used as parts donors.

http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetalk...al-with-austrian-for-21-rare-jets/
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Thu Nov 26, 2015 2:53 am

VA to operate a weekly flight between CHC and RAR between 25 June and 8 October 2016

http://australianaviation.com.au/201...rt-christchurch-rarotonga-flights/
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Thu Nov 26, 2015 3:17 am

Quoting thai77w (Reply 1):
Alliance just announced they have purchased Austrian's remaining Fokker 70 and F100 (21 aircraft) for US $15.5 million.

The article refers to them being stored in Bratislava so suggests these will be mostly used as parts donors.

Seems to make sense as they don't fly the F70 AFAIK. But surely they only need wait until Rekkof production is operational. 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Thu Nov 26, 2015 3:32 am

Quoting thai77w (Reply 1):

And LH will take part ownership of Alliance until the deal is done.....
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Thu Nov 26, 2015 3:40 am

Quoting allrite (Reply 3):
Seems to make sense as they don't fly the F70 AFAIK. But surely they only need wait until Rekkof production is operational. 

They do fly the F70, often see it at BNE. Believe you can book it as an RPT flight to Emerald now IIRC.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Thu Nov 26, 2015 5:21 am

Quoting allrite (Reply 3):
Seems to make sense as they don't fly the F70 AFAIK. But surely they only need wait until Rekkof production is operational.

They do fly a few F70s, and as far as I've heard, they were wanting a few more of them in particular. As for F100s, they have recently sold a couple to VA, so not sure what they'll do with the ex-Austrian ones.

I believe Alliance is starting a European venture, not for RPT flights, but for wet-leasing and dry-leasing out some aircraft, so, it remains to be seen how many of the ex-Austrian aircraft actually get to Australia.

The $15M seems like a bargain, with $9.5M being in cash, and the rest in shares in Alliance, making OS (and therefore LH), part owners in Alliance. Believe part of the deal is to keep heavy maintenance done at Austrian's facility in Bratislava.

-CXfirst
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Thu Nov 26, 2015 5:42 am

You can indeed book tickets on the F70 to Emerald.

As for what they plan on using them for ifs pretty well explained in the Linked article, they will be stored at Bratislava to extend the life of in service examples (read for parts) and also some will be available for leasing. From what is alluded I'd doubt many of them if any actually make it to Australia, keeping in mind they've closed the heavy maintenance in Brisbane
And Adelaide and off shored it to Austrian Technik Bratislava (funny that they are storing them there...)
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Fri Nov 27, 2015 1:35 am

ACCC has issues drafting ruling approving QF/AA expanded alliance

http://australianaviation.com.au/201...panded-alliance-in-draft-decision/
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Fri Nov 27, 2015 1:45 am

Speaking of which you can now also book AKL-JFK via LAX using the new AA AKL-LAX and the QF LAX-JFK-LAX service.

Should provide some nice additional feed onto the QF JFK flights.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Fri Nov 27, 2015 2:07 am

Quoting vhebb (Reply 9):
Speaking of which you can now also book AKL-JFK via LAX using the new AA AKL-LAX and the QF LAX-JFK-LAX service.

Should provide some nice additional feed onto the QF JFK flights.

QF/AA still the ok from the New Zealand side, for this to happen. It will happen, just takes a while as NZ & friends file against.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Fri Nov 27, 2015 3:11 am

Quoting zkncj (Reply 10):
QF/AA still the ok from the New Zealand side, for this to happen. It will happen, just takes a while as NZ & friends file against.

I'm not sure what you mean. The NZ Minister has approved the alliance, as in the article:

"The expanded alliance was approved by the New Zealand transport minister in October."

Is there something else that prevents it?

mariner

[Edited 2015-11-26 19:14:47]
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Fri Nov 27, 2015 8:04 am

Quoting zkncj (Reply 10):
QF/AA still the ok from the New Zealand side, for this to happen. It will happen, just takes a while as NZ & friends file against.
Quoting mariner (Reply 11):
Is there something else that prevents it?

It's just awaiting US regulatory approval. As Mariner said, NZ approval has already been granted.
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:35 am

Quoting zkncj (Reply 10):

No they don't, QF already have beyond rights from NZ and AA don't require them. QF*AA AKL-LAX, QF LAX-JFK and AA AKL, AA*QF LAX-JFK are perfectly legitimate routings within existing bilaterals and don't require JV approval to code-share.
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Fri Nov 27, 2015 8:08 pm

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 13):
No they don't, QF already have beyond rights from NZ and AA don't require them. QF*AA AKL-LAX, QF LAX-JFK and AA AKL, AA*QF LAX-JFK are perfectly legitimate routings within existing bilaterals and don't require JV approval to code-share.

Question:

it is my understanding that Qantas cannot carry domestic US passengers JFK-LAX unless it is part of an onward international ticket - JFK-LAX-SYD - and vv of course.

But under the new alliance, can pax book with American for JFK-LAX (only) and actually fly on Qantas metal?

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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Fri Nov 27, 2015 8:42 pm

Quoting mariner (Reply 14):

No unfortunstely, it would still need to be connecting to an international flight. It doesn't have to be a QF flight, they voluntarily imposed that restriction on themselves to make compliance easier. You don't need to be in transit to the QF flight, stopovers are permitted, so you can effectively fly QF LAX-JFK as a standalone flight so long as your ticket originates in Australia or New Zealand.
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Fri Nov 27, 2015 9:54 pm

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 15):
It doesn't have to be a QF flight, they voluntarily imposed that restriction on themselves to make compliance easier.

Howso? If QF can see the inbound or outbound pax comes from or goes to an international flight per the ticket/res data, should be easy no?
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:26 pm

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 13):
No they don't, QF already have beyond rights from NZ and AA don't require them. QF*AA AKL-LAX, QF LAX-JFK and AA AKL, AA*QF LAX-JFK are perfectly legitimate routings within existing bilaterals and don't require JV approval to code-share.

Yes but this new deal is revenue sharing no? Hence the need to get additional approval.
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Sat Nov 28, 2015 2:29 am

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 15):

Interestingly QF are now allowing LAX-JFK pax to connect from AA's AKL-LAX. Seems possible only when booked on the QF codeshare on AKL-LAX.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Sat Nov 28, 2015 3:03 am

Quoting qfvhoqa (Reply 18):
Seems possible only when booked on the QF codeshare on AKL-LAX.

Well in which case it's a QF flight as far as they are concerned.

Quoting QF2220 (Reply 16):
If QF can see the inbound or outbound pax comes from or goes to an international flight per the ticket/res data, should be easy no?

They would have to check each ticket manually, to ensure compliance, which is a big overhead. Much easier to just restrict it to their own passengers.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Sat Nov 28, 2015 9:39 am

Quoting qfvhoqa (Reply 18):

In which case it is a QF ticket

Quoting QF2220 (Reply 16):

It can be done, but for whatever reason QF decided it wasn't worth the effort.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 17):

Sure, but the poster I was referring to was suggesting that QF/AA would require approval before they can interline over LAX. That's complete garbage.

Revenue share is of course a different matter.
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Mon Nov 30, 2015 10:37 am

JQ A320 VH-VQG has new decals promoting the Peanuts movie

http://australianaviation.com.au/201...etstar-a320-promotes-snoopy-movie/
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Mon Nov 30, 2015 10:45 am

Is China Airlines still starting MEL, have not heard any more of late about this service?
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Mon Nov 30, 2015 10:58 am

^^ CI started services at the end of Oct.

They fly 3 x weekly TPE-MEL-CHC, with the TPE-MEL year round and the MEL-CHC a seasonal tag.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Mon Nov 30, 2015 11:02 am

Quoting qf789 (Reply 21):
JQ A320 VH-VQG has new decals promoting the Peanuts movie

I'm surprised this is permitted in this day and age, what with all the allergies...  
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Mon Nov 30, 2015 11:05 am

N130FF - EC-130Q "Hercules" operated by Coulson made a quick stop this afternoon in Brisbane. Here it is departing:

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e303/OZJIM/N130FFAAS_zpsfobbusmd.jpg

Final destination is AVV, where it arrived tonight.
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Tue Dec 01, 2015 8:15 am

R2D2 will operate the first NH 787-9 SYD flight arriving 12DEC.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Tue Dec 01, 2015 11:58 am

First Korean Air A380 into Sydney today? I believe so ...

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 26):
R2D2 will operate the first NH 787-9 SYD flight arriving 12DEC.

Yes, this is something I have been aware of for some time now. I haven't seen anything official from the airline nor 'movie' confirming this and I asked for confirmation in the previous thread. It's a Saturday that day and I don't have to work so I will have to drag out an old C3-PO costume from the 80s to wear to the 'mound' on the 12 December ... anyone care to dress up as well? I guarantee instant media coverage if you do!

Cheers,
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Tue Dec 01, 2015 12:29 pm

BITRE for September came out today

BNE-NRT loads outbound increased from 67.07% in August to 80.61% in September, inbound they dropped a little from 73.09% in August to 70.89% in September.
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zkncj
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:32 pm

Yesterday Jetstar (Propstar), made it's first Q300 services within New Zealand.

If it becomes successful, what is the chance the same could be repeated in Australia?
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Tue Dec 01, 2015 7:19 pm

Quoting zkncj (Reply 29):

Very low IMHO, because the regional routes where the market is big enough to possibly take another carrier like SYD-TMW or SYD-DBO or BNE-BDB are cozy little monopolies/duopolies where QantasLink dominates the market. Their concern for releaving passengers in regional centres from high fares only goes so far  
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Tue Dec 01, 2015 9:32 pm

Quoting zkncj (Reply 29):
Yesterday Jetstar (Propstar), made it's first Q300 services within New Zealand.

If it becomes successful, what is the chance the same could be repeated in Australia?
Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 30):
Very low IMHO, because the regional routes where the market is big enough to possibly take another carrier like SYD-TMW or SYD-DBO or BNE-BDB are cozy little monopolies/duopolies where QantasLink dominates the market.

Yes, but exactly the same could be said for the regional New Zealand routes that JQ is now operating.
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Tue Dec 01, 2015 10:07 pm

Quoting DavidByrne (Reply 31):
Yes, but exactly the same could be said for the regional New Zealand routes that JQ is now operating.

With an important difference in that the regional routes in NZ have a carrier, Jetstar, that is looking to expand into them. There is no airline in Australia looking to expand into regional services in that way. The big 2 aren't going to deploy regionall LCC's and I doubt REX is interested. Who else is there?
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Tue Dec 01, 2015 10:17 pm

Quoting DavidByrne (Reply 31):
Yes, but exactly the same could be said for the regional New Zealand routes that JQ is now operating.

True, but the difference of course is that in New Zealand it's a competitor that dominates the markets. In the Australian context, it's QantasLink and it's better for the Qantas Group to leave things as they are rather than dilute (already marginal, in many instances) yields by having Jetstar compete against QLink.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Tue Dec 01, 2015 10:21 pm

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 32):
With an important difference in that the regional routes in NZ have a carrier, Jetstar, that is looking to expand into them. There is no airline in Australia looking to expand into regional services in that way. The big 2 aren't going to deploy regionall LCC's and I doubt REX is interested. Who else is there?

It doesn't have to be at LCC prices, more to reduce staffing cost base.

E.g. looking at AKL-NSN next week, NZ is cheaper than JQ
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Tue Dec 01, 2015 11:38 pm

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 26):
R2D2 will operate the first NH 787-9 SYD flight arriving 12DEC.

Good.

Quoting bunumuring (Reply 27):
It's a Saturday that day and I don't have to work so I will have to drag out an old C3-PO costume from the 80s to wear to the 'mound' on the 12 December ... anyone care to dress up as well? I guarantee instant media coverage if you do!

I'm supposed to work that Saturday but if this new trainee at work makes it through this week then I'll have to train them next week so my roster will change to M-F meaning Saturday off! Yay!

If I can make it out there I'll let you know, but there is a 100% chance that I will not be dressing up...  

Having said that, there is a Darth Vader look alike at my work who wears the full black trench coat and always uses a red light saber so I'll let him know that C3-PO will be at the mound on the 12th to see R2D2  
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 12:12 am

Last week I saw three different people walking in Sydney's CBD wearing the long sleeve grey with black roo QF pyjama top like normal clothing. One late teens / early twenties guy was wearing it with his mates who were all dressed up to go clubbing... Hmmm... Does anybody wear their QF premium class pyjamas in public or see others wearing them? Just wanted to share that as I don't see the QF pyjamas being worn out in public, especially in the CBD, too often. I guess it's a compliment to the design which I like, but I don't like it enough to wear them out in public...
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 12:37 am

Quoting zkncj (Reply 34):
It doesn't have to be at LCC prices, more to reduce staffing cost base.

I doubt it would be cheaper for QF to do that. QFLink already have lower costs than mainline, and the propstar planes are operated by QFLink on behalf of JQ.

Quoting 777Jet (Reply 36):
Does anybody wear their QF premium class pyjamas in public or see others wearing them?

I once saw a homeless man wearing the QF J pyjama top.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 12:57 am

Quoting qfvhoqa (Reply 37):
I doubt it would be cheaper for QF to do that. QFLink already have lower costs than mainline, and the propstar planes are operated by QFLink on behalf of JQ.

With JetStar crew (JetConnect) contracted to Eastern....
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 6:02 am

Quoting zkncj (Reply 34):
It doesn't have to be at LCC prices, more to reduce staffing cost base.

E.g. looking at AKL-NSN next week, NZ is cheaper than JQ

But again there is no realistic operator. QF isn't going to change their highly profitable and successful Qantaslink carrier while Virgin has built it's own prop operation. And as QF pointed out, Qantaslink is significantly lower cost than mainline anyway.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 6:38 am

I landed at AKL at 5am Tuesday morning and noticed a few Q300s parked between the domestic and international terminals. I presumed they were NZ birds which I thought operated from the other end of the domestic terminal, I didn't think much more of it forgot it was the day JQ were starting operations. Thought later when I remembered that these were probably the JQ birds awaiting their first day in service. I only saw them nose on and it was dark and the Windows progressively fogged up after landing.. Shame as it would have been cool to see them. I fly back into AKL in a NZ Q300 on Friday evening so will hopefully see a JQ one then 
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IndianicWorld
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 8:25 am

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 39):
But again there is no realistic operator. QF isn't going to change their highly profitable and successful Qantaslink carrier while Virgin has built it's own prop operation. And as QF pointed out, Qantaslink is significantly lower cost than mainline anyway.

Given that Jetstar is the sole operating domestic brand of the QF Group in NZ it made sense for them to use that over there for the regional venture.

It makes next to no sense to try that over here.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 10:42 am

Rumours now confirmed the HA BNE- HNL flight is not doing well now... Flight affected by JQ competition, a lower AUD, and QLD mining downturn transit traffic.
 
IndianicWorld
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 10:59 am

It seems HNL numbers across the board from Australia have been falling. I could see frequencies reduced or airlines quitting routes completely soon.

Hawaii was a star performer for a while when the stars were aligning but those days have gone for a while anyway.

I must admit I saw HA as a stronger player on the BNE route (as compared to JQ) given the connections it offers at HNL, but with the amount of capacity now on BNE-LAX with QF and VA it would be hurting some of that demand too.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 11:44 am

I've noticed a lot of online advertising for BNE-SEA via HNL on HA with some attractive pricing too, around $1100 in Y. That would prompt punters to see where else they could fly on HA in the US with a stopover in HNL.
 
IndianicWorld
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 12:05 pm

^^ It's their competitive advantage really so good to see.

It reduces the need for LAX connections and offers a different option on their vacation itineraries.
 
Flyingsottsman
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 12:12 pm

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 42):
Rumours now confirmed the HA BNE- HNL flight is not doing well now... Flight affected by JQ competition, a lower AUD, and QLD mining downturn transit traffic.

How long have HA been on the BNE-HNL for what just over or just under a year? I am sure this route would go up and down PAX wise at times. Hope it works for them I would love to see HA herein MEL , but I don't think that will happen.
 
IndianicWorld
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 12:21 pm

^^ Since 2012 I think it was.

MEL has been on HA's radar for quite a while but the market peak on Australia-Hawaii has well and truly gone.

The best we can hope for is JQ maintaining its flights on MEL-HNL, which was previously started, stopped and then restarted after going through a challenging operating environment on that sector.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 6:58 pm

Here's a very interesting article in CAPA about Qantas and Asia. I'll just give the bullet points:

http://centreforaviation.com/analysi...ite-no-european-connections-255082

"Qantas shifts widebodies to international, restoring Asian presence despite no European connections

Qantas' seat capacity to Asia remains down but this figure is distorted by European connections

Qantas' Asian frequencies are surpassing past years

Qantas has shrunk Southeast Asia but grown in Northeast Asia

Qantas' Asian frequencies up across the region, except to Singapore

Perth incurs the biggest decrease in Qantas' Asian network, Brisbane the largest increase

Widebody redeployment from the domestic market is enabling international growth"


And the last one - with a question:

"Qantas' Asian growth a demonstration of its successful restructuring. Next: Virgin into Asia?"

I'm just the messenger.  

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
aryonoco
Posts: 681
Joined: Fri May 11, 2012 1:51 am

RE: Australian Aviation Thread Part 133

Wed Dec 02, 2015 8:07 pm

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 47):
MEL has been on HA's radar for quite a while but the market peak on Australia-Hawaii has well and truly gone.

HA needs better marketing and better connections. It is virtually impossible for me to buy a ticket with them from MEL than then goes to continental US.

Outside of aviation circles, virtually no one I speak to in Melbourne has ever heard of Hawaiian. Everyone is surprised when I tell them that it's actually a really nice airline.

The Aus-HNL peak has come and gone for sure, but there is still a lot that can be done to stimulate the market. They have virtually no presence and no marketing anywhere. If you want a route such as BNE-HNL to work, you need connections from the rest of Australia. That needs marketing.

I've always thought of HNL as a very unique entry point to the US, and HA as the best way to go there. HA flies to most major US markets that Australians travel to, from JFK to LAX. When you think about a route such as SYD-JFK, HNL is pretty much smack bang in the middle of the route. This should bring huge advantages to HA, as we always say, the best kind of 1-stop is one where the stop is as close to the middle as possible, as you can do the route with the least amount of fuel. This should be a natural advantage for HA. As well as the fact their airport and immigration and customs are a hell of a lot more pleasant to deal with than somewhere like LAX. HA should be a viable and significant player in a market such as SYD-JFK, and yet they are not, mostly due to timing of their flights. I wish I understood why they are not exploiting these possibilities.

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