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KarelXWB
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What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Tue Dec 01, 2015 10:06 am

Please post your updates here.

What's Going In CLE - Part 11 (by American 767 Jun 20 2015 in Civil Aviation)
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Thu Dec 03, 2015 5:24 am

Ultimate is running a Sunday Special, LUK-BKL-LUK for the Bengals-Browns game on Dec 6th.

I'd sure like to hear how they're doing with the route. The PD never follows up on anything.  
 
izbtmnhd
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Thu Dec 03, 2015 2:37 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 1):

The PD follow up on a business story? It's almost all NEOMG click-bait at cleveland.com.

Maybe Crain's will do something.

-- iz
 
chrisjake
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Thu Dec 03, 2015 6:04 pm

Quoting izbtmnhd (Reply 2):
I'd sure like to hear how they're doing with the route

My mom and her lady-friends took Ultimate to spend a day in Cincinnati on Nov 13. She loved it! Said the service was incredible. She told me it was about 1/2 full on the way down and mostly full on the way back to BKL.

All she talked about for the next week was "this is how flying should be".
 
masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Thu Dec 03, 2015 6:51 pm

Quoting chrisjake (Reply 3):
All she talked about for the next week was "this is how flying should be".

Thanks for the report. Glad to hear it!
 
greenair727
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:26 pm

There's a story in today's paper that Ultimate Air wants to add either "NY" or Chicago to BKL:

"Pawlak said he expects to decide by January whether New York or Chicago will be added next, and that flights would likely begin in March. The city that isn't selected will be added later in 2016, he said."

Re NY, I'd love to see a LGA shuttle from Burke. However, their "New York" is somewhere in Jersey---and not EWR.

In any event, for them to expand must mean their new BKL-LUK service is doing well. I'm happy they're expanding at BKL and I hope other airlines begin to see the value that is Burke.

http://www.cleveland.com/travel/inde...ltimate_air_shuttle_plans_new.html

UPDATE: I just noticed this from the article:

"Ultimate's New York flights use Morristown Municipal Airport in New Jersey, about a 50-minute drive to Manhattan. Cost of the New York flight hasn't been set, but would be similar to the cost from Cincinnati, which is $749 round-trip."

At that rate, they may only get people going to central Jersey. For $800 you can get to LaGuardia on one of the majors (though not from BKL), and it will be faster and cheaper to get to Manhattan than paying $750 for Morristown Airport.

[Edited 2015-12-04 05:30:00]
 
masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 04, 2015 4:26 pm

Ultimate is selling time. Morristown is a bit out of the way for Manhattan flying, but it's fine for lots New Jersey corporate locations. Same with Chicago Executive - it's convenient to northside business addresses, minus the ORD hassle. I'm a little disappointed they aren't going after routes left vacant by UA, but if they're doing well to LUK, Morristown and ChiEx will be guaranteed moneymakers and maybe more can come later.

Ultimate says: "arrive 15 minutes before the flight and take off". Avoiding the extra hour imposed by TSA at major airports is a huge convenience and worth money to a business traveler. Ultimate seems to be an improved model of OneJet. A reliable source from another board said Ultimate has just acquired an E-145, so they must filling the 328Jets often enought to want 50 seats.

[Edited 2015-12-04 08:28:14]
 
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mbm3
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 04, 2015 4:38 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 6):
Ultimate says: "arrive 15 minutes before the flight and take off". Avoiding the extra hour imposed by TSA at major airports is a huge convenience and worth money to a business traveler. Ultimate seems to be an improved model of OneJet

You nailed it. Slicing off the hassle on both ends of the trip, enjoying a pleasurable travel experience and predictable pricing with cost savings over the legacy carriers? That trip in/out of Manhattan becomes a trivial concern when you can use a car service.

I tried the helicopter service from Midtown to EWR as part of a carefully crafted ticket. That low hassle / no stress check-in was awesome, though the aerogeek in me kicked in as we departed.  
Let Me Tell You, Landing A 772ER Is Harder Than It Looks!
 
masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 04, 2015 4:54 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 6):
Ultimate has just acquired an E-145, so they must filling the 328Jets often enough to want 50 seats.

Correction: E-135, as stated in Susan Glaser's article.

The E-135 trip costs are slightly better than the E-145. although not at the seat-mile level. Their used-aircraft price, however, may make them better bargains as long as fuel stays relatively cheap.

Aren't the 135's 40-seaters? I wonder if Ultimate will remove 10 seats ... That would make them *super* premium economy.
 
chrisjake
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 04, 2015 4:56 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 6):
arrive 15 minutes before the flight and take off

Referring to my mom's flight again....all personal info was taken when making the reservation, so everyone gets checked out beforehand. She told me the convenience made things so much more stress free than she is used to when flying. The waiting/boarding areas at LUK and BKL were comfy and plush, the Ultimate employees where more than friendly, I believe she said there was free parking at BKL - but don't hold me to that. There was free van service from LUK to downtown Cincinnati. The food and drink both at the boarding areas and on the plane were complimentary too.

I'm guessing that if/when Ultimate expands at BKL that my mom and her lady-friends will be taking day trips everywhere they fly. She has done nothing but rave about Ultimate and she can pretty much find something to do anywhere.
 
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mbm3
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 04, 2015 5:18 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 8):
Aren't the 135's 40-seaters? I wonder if Ultimate will remove 10 seats ... That would make them *super* premium economy.

Yes, I believe they are 40 seaters and Ultimate is limited to carrying like 30/35 passengers, so out will come several rows of seats to make VERY nice pitch.

Quoting chrisjake (Reply 9):
I believe she said there was free parking at BKL - but don't hold me to that.

Yes, it is free. For now. Until Mayor Jackson sniffs a nickle to be made.
Let Me Tell You, Landing A 772ER Is Harder Than It Looks!
 
fun2fly
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 04, 2015 5:44 pm

Quoting mbm3 (Reply 10):
Yes, it is free. For now. Until Mayor Jackson sniffs a nickle to be made.

He doesn't even know where it's at, don't worry.

Free parking is surely a factor when making the trip too. Save $10/day at BKL. Nice.

So, if they do CHI and NYC next year, that would leave CLT as the only un-served station in their network from CLE.

Nice promotion also:


Cleveland: Buy One Get One Free!


Buy one flight from Cincinnati (Lunken Airport) to Cleveland (Burke Lakefront Airport)—or Cleveland to Cincinnati—and get one FREE – now through December 22, 2015, Monday through Friday!

$379 Round Trip

Flights begin October 26, 2015. Click here for the full schedule.
 
masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Sat Dec 05, 2015 3:16 pm

Quoting greenair727 (Reply 5):
Ultimate Air wants to add either "NY" or Chicago to BKL:

As I read it, the only question is which city will come first.   What I'd like to know is which city will come fourth. It's reasonable to expect Charlotte, but that may not be Cleveland business's choice. With UA reducing flights, MKE might work (or is Chicago Executive close enough?).

[Edited 2015-12-05 07:43:40]
 
greenair727
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Sat Dec 05, 2015 4:59 pm

^That's how I read it as well. So for fourth, what about Providence, Albany, or Kansas City? My first choice, though, would be Montreal. YUL has pre-clearance (though BKL has capabilities as well). But it being Canada, I'm not sure what regulatory approvals Ultimate would need to serve it. YUL is one of the markets I was very disappointed Cleveland lost with the UA dehubbing. If its not in Ultimate's plans, I'd be happy to see Porter serve YUL-BKL (or AC on YUL-CLE).
 
fun2fly
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Sat Dec 05, 2015 5:32 pm

Quoting greenair727 (Reply 13):

^That's how I read it as well. So for fourth, what about Providence, Albany, or Kansas City? My first choice, though, would be Montreal. YUL has pre-clearance (though BKL has capabilities as well). But it being Canada, I'm not sure what regulatory approvals Ultimate would need to serve it. YUL is one of the markets I was very disappointed Cleveland lost with the UA dehubbing. If its not in Ultimate's plans, I'd be happy to see Porter serve YUL-BKL (or AC on YUL-CLE).

It's an interesting choice that had high fares and 3x daily ERJ145 service. I know that CO fed IAH connections to YUL through CLE.

Any confirmation of the AA move to C? You'd hope that JetBlue would take at least one more gate.
 
masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Sat Dec 05, 2015 6:17 pm

Quoting greenair727 (Reply 13):
I'd be happy to see Porter serve YUL-BKL (or AC on YUL-CLE).

I had a chance to talk to AC right after UA pulled the plug and I asked them about Montreal. They said CO ran CLE-YUL on connecting traffic; they couldn't fill a single plane of economical size with O&D (about 50 pax/day). I said why not promote CLE-YUL-xxx (in Europe); they said no, we like doing that through Toronto. I said, but you offer only old clapped-out Dash8-100's to YYZ. They said we're gonna upgrade those some day. That day finally came in November: Dash8-300s.

So I don't see AC doing much about YUL. Apparently the route needs to be YUL-CLE-xxx to make it work. Canada puts a big tax burden on aviation, so Cleveland's ULCC's aren't interested. That leaves ... ???

Quoting fun2fly (Reply 14):
AA move to C

I'd like Delta to move to C. Then CLE could offer Southwest *all* of B at a bargain price. (airliners.net needs a smiley of somebody smoking a hash pipe to insert here)
 
greenair727
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Sun Dec 06, 2015 4:40 pm

Quote:
hey said CO ran CLE-YUL on connecting traffic; they couldn't fill a single plane of economical size with O&D (about 50 pax/day).

If that AC claim is accurate, I'm surprised how low demand is. Remember, CO even operated CLE-Ottawa--I can't image such a venture would be viable if YUL wasn't.
 
lakeeffect
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Sun Dec 06, 2015 10:04 pm

Quoting greenair727 (Reply 16):
If that AC claim is accurate, I'm surprised how low demand is. Remember, CO even operated CLE-Ottawa--I can't image such a venture would be viable if YUL wasn't.

CO even operated YQB from CLE briefly a few years before the UA merger. CLE is in an ideal spot for connecting Canadian traffic in Ontario and Quebec to US destinations. CO capitalized on that in CLE with frequent RJ service for relatively short flights. US pre clearance also meant that those passengers on YOW, YUL, and YYZ flights into CLE could easily make 45 minute connections versus the mess of connecting in delay prone EWR (and later ORD after the merger).

From personal experience CLE-YUL did rely heavily on connections. CLE-BTV also carried a lot of Canadian traffic that crossed into Vermont to catch a cheaper US flight.

Now AC is using CLE-YYZ primarily for international travel beyond Canada. Every time I fly this route I'm amazed how much of the plane is connecting onward to Europe. I'd be interested to know what percent of CLE's TATL bound traffic is funneled through YYZ on AC. The exchange rate situation is definitely working in AC's favor right now. It'd be nice to see some of these flights get upgauged from a turbo prop, but these flights are so short as it is that it's still a relatively comfortable ride.
 
GSP psgr
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Sun Dec 06, 2015 11:03 pm

Over on the PIT thread we had a similar discussion about the viability of Montreal service; there are some business links on both ends (Bombardier and Alcoa come to mind); I think the consensus was that AC's better off feeding their international connections over YYZ because it's a shorter stage length and a wider range of connections. PIT/CLE-YUL is probably too far for a Dash, and I'm less sure you could fill enough seats on either to make a once daily CRJ run profitable. That said, AC's showing interest in expanding transborder ops out of YUL again; Philadelphia, Houston, and Denver are all returning after being axed back when the loonie was higher.
 
masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Mon Dec 07, 2015 4:49 am

Quoting lakeeffect (Reply 17):
CLE is in an ideal spot for connecting Canadian traffic in Ontario and Quebec to US destinations.

CO planned that CLE would serve as a hub for smaller Canadian points the way IAH serves Mexican traffic. They even scheduled, but never operated CLE-YHM; and then along came 9/11 and plans changed.
 
lakeeffect
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Tue Dec 08, 2015 12:13 pm

WN is finally resuming STL from CLE with this extension. I guess the dots are slowly being connected from CLE. HOU now seems like the next logical add.

Here's the schedule for Monday July 11:

7x MDW
4x BWI
3x BNA
1x DEN
1x LAS
1x PHX
1x STL

That's 18 departures for WN. I was expecting MCI to be added, especially after Ricky Smith's comment before he left.
 
greenair727
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Tue Dec 08, 2015 1:44 pm

Quoting lakeeffect:
WN is finally resuming STL from CLE with this extension......1x STL

A nice alternative to UA's ERJ service, though UA is 2x/day. Any addition to CLE is good!


When will see schedule adds from all carriers to accommodate the RNC this coming summer?
 
masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Tue Dec 08, 2015 3:01 pm

Quoting lakeeffect (Reply 20):
That's 18 departures for WN.

Was it 15 last summer? 18 is not bad.

Quoting greenair727 (Reply 21):
When will see schedule adds from all carriers to accommodate the RNC this coming summer?

I wouldn't expect much: a few extra sections or equipment upgrades on hub routes in the week or two around the convention dates. The biggest number of people will probably come from the DC area and the worker-bee attendees will drive.

I'm interested to see if CommutAir comes back to CLE with the addition of E-145's to their fleet in the spring. It will make life easier for their crews who may still live in the area.

[Edited 2015-12-08 07:21:28]
 
lakeeffect
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Tue Dec 08, 2015 3:27 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 22):
Was it 15 last summer? 18 is not bad.

It's certainly an improvement over the past two summers. I want to say last summer was about 15-16 departures per day and summer 2014 was closer to 13 departures/day. However I think summer 2007 was around 19-20 departures per day. WN certainly has the most amount of destinations from CLE than they've had before, but frequencies are low. Load factors were much lower when WN ran close to 20 daily departures from CLE, so I would expect next year have more pax than the mid 2000s if they can sustain LFs in the 80s.
 
highflier92660
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:57 pm

Regarding Air Canada CLE-YYZ: In only four decades the Canadian carrier has progressed from a pure jet DC-9-30 to a DHC8-300 regional turboprop. In those days they were located at the end of B Concourse.

Cleveland Hopkins concourses: In my last few trips through CLE aboard Delta Air Lines the front desk and gate agents have made a few comments of "possibly" moving from B to C Concourse. They may be low on the corporate food chain to be credible but I thought I'd pass it along. Since I usually arrive via ATL in an MD-88 and depart to JFK in an ERJ regional jet I've yet to see any passenger congestion at the Delta gates.

As for UAL keeping the gates at the end of the banjo wing of C Concourse, wasn't that area the only portion of the concourse modernized and enlarged sometime in the late 1980s? Even today a walk through C out to gate 14 is still Cleveland's equivalent of a windowless trek through the dark tunnel within the Great Pyramid of Cheops. I can see why United would want to keep those gates despite the walking distance.
 
ATLFlyer323
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:29 am

Quoting Highflier92660 (Reply 24):
As for UAL keeping the gates at the end of the banjo wing of C Concourse, wasn't that area the only portion of the concourse modernized and enlarged sometime in the late 1980s?

I will say last time I flew through CLE the the Banjo part of the C concourse was definitely the nicest part of the airport still in use. And to be honest the walk to the end of C is not all that bad...

-ATLFlyer323
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masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Wed Dec 09, 2015 4:23 pm

Quoting Highflier92660 (Reply 24):
Delta Air Lines the front desk and gate agents have made a few comments of "possibly" moving from B to C Concourse.

I have heard this also from a non-Delta source. Still very much in the discussion stage, apparently, but one of those things that make you go hmmmm.

The selection of the next head of the airport should be interesting, although the real problem at the airport may be more with middle managers than the boss.
 
ncflyer
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:32 pm

Quoting lakeeffect (Reply 17):
Now AC is using CLE-YYZ primarily for international travel beyond Canada. Every time I fly this route I'm amazed how much of the plane is connecting onward to Europe. I'd be interested to know what percent of CLE's TATL bound traffic is funneled through YYZ on AC. The exchange rate situation is definitely working in AC's favor right now. It'd be nice to see some of these flights get upgauged from a turbo prop, but these flights are so short as it is that it's still a relatively comfortable ride.

Round trips airfares to YYZ from CLE are positively ridiculous, even over weekends, whether that's due to taxes or the AC monopoly or whatever reason. Those fares aren't getting anyone out of their car and it's no wonder you're seeing such a high % of international connecting traffic.

Interestingly, YYZ to Europe fares are so cheap on some routes-- as cheap as any North American gateway, the measly CLE-YYZ prop leg is 35-40% of the fare on a couple routes I checked. I know Clevelanders who drive to YYZ to save $$ on international flying, for instance I met someone who flew to Warsaw and saved $2000 over flying out of CLE. That's some dough worth driving for.
 
masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Thu Dec 10, 2015 4:53 pm

DoT posted CLE's September numbers and the news continues to be good.

Boardings (no intl or charter) were 326.7K up 19.5% from 273.4 in 9/14 and down only 5.9% (347.2K) from 9/13, before the dehubbing. Load factor for 9/15 was 80.4% up from 78.0% in 9/14.

What's amazing to me: 9/15 RPM beat 9/14 *and* 9/13. 9/15 was 251.6MM; 9/14 was 182.0MM; and 9/13 was 220.1MM.
 
lakeeffect
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Thu Dec 10, 2015 5:57 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 28):

DoT posted CLE's September numbers and the news continues to be good.

Boardings (no intl or charter) were 326.7K up 19.5% from 273.4 in 9/14 and down only 5.9% (347.2K) from 9/13, before the dehubbing. Load factor for 9/15 was 80.4% up from 78.0% in 9/14.

What's amazing to me: 9/15 RPM beat 9/14 *and* 9/13. 9/15 was 251.6MM; 9/14 was 182.0MM; and 9/13 was 220.1MM.



That's much better than I was expecting. While boardings were up 19.5%, deplanements were up 26.3%. Overall scheduled domestic traffic was up 22.8% from 541,147 to 664,795 this September. To see this kind of O&D growth really shows what a strangle UA had on CLE with high fares.

I'm curious to see the full year CLE total including international and charter. It may come quite close to hitting 8 million.
 
chrisjake
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 11, 2015 3:15 pm

American news.....

new DCA-CLE while CLE-PHX gets eliminated

http://www.cleveland.com/travel/inde...dds_clevela.html#incart_river_home
 
lakeeffect
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 11, 2015 3:24 pm

CLE-DCA on AA is great news. That seemed like such an obvious add since the de-hub. So now UA is really being squeezed on their remaining point to point RJ routes: DCA, BOS, STL.
 
commavia
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 11, 2015 3:25 pm

Quoting chrisjake (Reply 30):
American news.....

new DCA-CLE

Awesome - yet another logical add (reintroduction) for AA's DCA network, and should further bolster AA's overall offering in CLE as well with nonstop flights to three of the largest northeast business markets (NYC, PHL, WAS) plus of course CHI, DFW, CLT, MIA, etc. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see an AA A319 or 737 to LAX at some point in the future.

[Edited 2015-12-11 07:27:02]
 
chrisjake
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 11, 2015 3:35 pm

Quoting commavia (Reply 32):
I wouldn't be at all surprised to see an AA A319 or 737 to LAX at some point in the future.

This would be a welcome sight.
 
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mbm3
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 11, 2015 4:16 pm

Quoting commavia (Reply 32):
I wouldn't be at all surprised to see an AA A319 or 737 to LAX at some point in the future.

Heard rumors about this as well, along with a flight from the Bay Area.
Let Me Tell You, Landing A 772ER Is Harder Than It Looks!
 
ncflyer
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 11, 2015 4:39 pm

I'm sorry but why oh why would AA enter in to the CLE-LAX market with Spirit on the route and seemingly plenty of capacity.

Great news on DCA.

While the news on PHX isn't new, I'm very surprised that AA is able to make two trips a day from PIT and CMH work, but none from CLE. Both PIT and CMH have a single daily on WN also. I guess it's their legacy USAirways and America West status, who knows.
 
commavia
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 11, 2015 5:02 pm

Quoting ncflyer (Reply 35):
I'm sorry but why oh why would AA enter in to the CLE-LAX market with Spirit on the route and seemingly plenty of capacity.

As AA continues to expand and develop its LAX operation, I would not be surprised to see CLE support a daily A319 or 737 following AA's "standard" LAX schedule pattern of a morning eastbound and evening westbound. DTW, too.
 
chrisjake
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 11, 2015 7:14 pm

Quoting ncflyer (Reply 35):
I'm sorry but why oh why would AA enter in to the CLE-LAX market with Spirit on the route and seemingly plenty of capacity.

I think there is plenty of room. 1 Spirit nonstop and 2 UAL nonstops is it. Take into account that a lot of people don't care to fly Spirit and you're stuck with paying more than you should to fly UAL. The more competition in UAL markets, the better. Plus, even though its been awhile, AA did fine on this route before before they moved their CLE-LAX nonstops to their traditional hubs. I think they were at 2-3 flights per day.
 
masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Fri Dec 11, 2015 8:52 pm

Quoting ncflyer (Reply 35):
I'm sorry but why oh why would AA enter in to the CLE-LAX market with Spirit on the route and seemingly plenty of capacity.

LAX is AA's TPAC hub and is only slightly more circuitous from CLE than SFO or ORD.

I'm sorry that PHX didn't last, especially with Frontier discontinuing their flight in January. I figured that AA could make it work with their hub connections despite the competition. I recently flew DCA-PHX-SFO and it was a nicer connection than DFW or ORD.
 
LifetimeGS
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Sat Dec 12, 2015 3:51 am

Flew Ultimate Air to LUK Dec 11 one way from BKL. I have not flown out of BKL since Wright Airlines. Ultimate Air has a great terminal all to itself. The waiting area was great, flight crew customer focused, snacks very good and price was reasonable. I know they are looking at CHI and NYC but I wish they would consider places like MCI, PVD, RIC, I could go on but I know there is a large demand for CHI and NYC so that's the push. Departed late and arrived late they should post a longer ground time or extend published flight times. If you go by the fifteen minute rule we were not late. I can not say enough about how wonderful it was to fly the airline and BKL. I wish Ultimate continued success and hope for additional service to many more cities.
 
LifetimeGS
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Sat Dec 12, 2015 3:54 am

 
LifetimeGS
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Sat Dec 12, 2015 4:30 am

PS I think Ultimate spent more on Christmas decorations for its gate area than F9 spent on the entire ticket counter space decor at CLE.
 
masseybrown
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Mon Dec 14, 2015 6:30 am

There are enough gate rumors on FT to keep everybody guessing. Delta's moving to C; American's moving to C; Southwest is moving to C; JetBlue wants another gate in C. Any others? One poster says after AA moves to C, Frontier is setting up a mini-hub in A. And, of course, there's my theory that after DL moves to C, WN is taking over all of B.

Where there's that much smoke, there has got to be a little fire at least. Now it makes sense that CLE hired a contractor to do their gate lease negotiations.
 
swacle
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RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Mon Dec 14, 2015 10:35 am

WN just took B7 so I don't see a move to C in the near future. As far as JetBlue looking for an additional gate on C, someone just installed a new jetbridge on C6. That would give them C4 and C6 if it is them. No work in the gate area though so not sure if it is JetBlue or not yet.
Aircraft Flown: SF3 DH8 DH4 328 ERJ CRJ CR7 CR9 E70 E75 D9S M80 712 72S 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 739ER 752 318 319 32
 
lakeeffect
Posts: 502
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 3:41 pm

RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Mon Dec 14, 2015 5:49 pm

CLE passenger totals updated through October are 6,769,693. That's up 5.2% from last year which was at 6,433,187. CLE should come close to hitting 8 million passengers this year. As comparison, CLE hit a little over 9 million in 2013 as a United hub.
 
ncflyer
Posts: 1198
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2000 7:03 pm

RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Mon Dec 14, 2015 6:44 pm

Is there any chances that all these gate shuffling rumors could really be about closing a concourse after rebuilding A or B. If properly renovated, the airport could have a state of the art modern concourse and an updated FIS facility. The new concourse could easily have enough gates to replace A and B, assuming the land can be pulled together.

I'd really like to see the rental car facility move back to the land that D sits on, but I'm afraid there's no money for a bold improvement like that one.
 
masseybrown
Posts: 5378
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Mon Dec 14, 2015 6:50 pm

Quoting swacle (Reply 43):
As far as JetBlue looking for an additional gate on C, someone just installed a new jetbridge on C6. That would give them C4 and C6 if it is them. No work in the gate area though so not sure if it is JetBlue or not yet.

Interesting. Even if JetBlue added a couple of JFK flights, I wouldn't think they'd need another gate.  
 
greenair727
Posts: 1293
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 6:27 am

RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Tue Dec 15, 2015 1:52 pm

Quoting LifetimeGS:
Flew Ultimate Air to LUK Dec 11 one way from BKL.

That shot of BKL looks great. I look forward to their expansion at the airport and hope other airlines offer service at Burke. Would love to see an hourly BKL-LGA shuttle.

Quoting lakeeffect:
CLE passenger totals updated through October are 6,769,693. That's up 5.2% from last year which was at 6,433,187. CLE should come close to hitting 8 million passengers this year. As comparison, CLE hit a little over 9 million in 2013 as a United hub.

I think we'll cross the 8m mark. My estimates are 1.34M pax in Nov and Dec, for an annual total of 8.1M, even though Oct is traditionally higher than Dec which is higher than Nov.

Quoting ncflyer:
Is there any chances that all these gate shuffling rumors could really be about closing a concourse after rebuilding A or B. If properly renovated, the airport could have a state of the art modern concourse and an updated FIS facility. The new concourse could easily have enough gates to replace A and B, assuming the land can be pulled together.

This would be great. But if a new FIS and terminal were in the works, wouldn't there be some RFP documents out there for design/construction?
 
masseybrown
Posts: 5378
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Tue Dec 15, 2015 2:50 pm

Quoting greenair727 (Reply 47):
I think we'll cross the 8m mark. My estimates are 1.34M pax in Nov and Dec, for an annual total of 8.1M, even though Oct is traditionally higher than Dec which is higher than Nov.

It'll be close, which says to me that the CLE economy is much better than people think.

I got a reliable tip that UA is retaining Gates C-10 and 14-29, which they calculate should support up to 130 flights, should that ever be required. The service desk will be moved close to C-17. Interesting number. I believe about 120 a day was UA's peak number in the days of the 1970-80 hub. It's hard to envision UA cranking up the operation again; but it probably won't cost them much to retain the potential. It's ok for CLE, too, since at the moment there is no shortage of gates for the other airlines and D could always be reopened if the need arose.

Supposedly UA gave up the low numbered gates partly because they can't handle RJs. That would seem to rule out Delta or American taking over, since both have a significant number of RJ flights still in their schedules. Spirit and Frontier, on the other hand, would become possibilities.

[Edited 2015-12-15 07:02:18]
 
LifetimeGS
Posts: 98
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:29 am

RE: What's Going In CLE - Part 12

Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:00 pm

I do not understand why they keep the service center open. I often walk by and see four agents working with no customers. Strangest de-hubbing I've ever seen.

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