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psa1011
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UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 5:03 pm

Currently UA has one flight to ITO, several days a week, from LAX. Is there a chance that SFO would return given all of the connection opportunities? Even from and O&D perspective, the Bay Area could probably support at least a weekly flight.
 
roseflyer
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 5:54 pm

Quoting psa1011 (Thread starter):
Even from and O&D perspective, the Bay Area could probably support at least a weekly flight.

I don't know how much O/D there is. There are a few hotels on the Hilo side and some people enjoy the rain forest side of the island. Unfortunately Hilo itself is a bit of a dumpy city in my opinion. None of the hotels on the Hilo side of the island are going to bring in high yielding tourists. Hilo is a relatively small city to sustain flights to the mainland with its own demand. Connecting via HNL opens up a lot more options. There is a small market which is why UA opened up flights to Hilo, but I think the less than daily service to LAX is about all they will get.
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drerx7
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 6:53 pm

Yea, I've been to Hilo a couple of times...not exactly paradise. Rainforest and the volcanoes are closer...but no nice hotels at all over there.
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BN727227Ultra
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 7:07 pm

Quoting drerx7 (Reply 2):
Yea, I've been to Hilo a couple of times...not exactly paradise.

Hilo has Ken's Pancakes! Try to find that in Kona!  
 
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LAXintl
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 7:09 pm

Flight has primarily Hilo point of sale, so its more geared to get locals off the island to mainland nonstop.

Where do Hilo locals want to go?? LA or SF bay area more?
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doug_or
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 7:11 pm

Is ITO-mainland traffic more heavily driven by islanders visiting the mainland?

Quoting psa1011 (Thread starter):
Even from and O&D perspective, the Bay Area could probably support at least a weekly flight.

I strongly doubt it. There might be enough people in the bay area whose final destination is the east side of Hawai'i to fill a weekly 737, but I can't imagine you'd be able to profitably capture them.
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jaybird
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 7:27 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 4):
Where do Hilo locals want to go?? LA or SF bay area more?

I'm not sure about Hilo specifically - but I believe Las Vegas is the biggest destination for residents of the State of Hawaii.
 
bjorn14
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 7:37 pm

Flying to ITO to go to KOA is practically worthless its at least a 4 hr. drive in a 4X4. Better to fly to HNL and cx.
"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
 
roseflyer
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 7:37 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 4):
Flight has primarily Hilo point of sale, so its more geared to get locals off the island to mainland nonstop.

Where do Hilo locals want to go?? LA or SF bay area more?

Hilo has a population of about 50,000. That's not going to sustain both LAX and SFO, especially when Hawaiian has a ton of connection opportunities via HNL.
If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
 
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ua2162
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 7:52 pm

I'll actually be very surprised if ITO sustains the LAX flight.

This is a very popular flight for non revs who can't get on in KOA since there are always open seats. Take what you will from that.

As far as hotels, there isn't much to draw people there. I know Hilton DoubleTree recently bought the Naniloa Hotel and said they're going to put $16 million into it but personally I think it'll need more work. The Hilo Hawaiian is a dump and they're finally going to close Uncle Billy's Hilo Hotel after years of it falling apart. Because of this, ITO is now a day trip with people basing themselves in Waikoloa or Kailua.

Furthermore, since the completion of the new Saddle Road, it seems many Hilo residents are making the trek to KOA (the travel time is now about 1 1/2 hours) as there are more choices.

Quoting BN727227Ultra (Reply 3):
Hilo has Ken's Pancakes! Try to find that in Kona!

You are 100% correct, my friend!
 
doug_or
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 7:54 pm

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 7):
Flying to ITO to go to KOA is practically worthless its at least a 4 hr. drive in a 4X4. Better to fly to HNL and cx.

when was the last time you visited? There is a paved highway. I don't remeber what it took me, but goggle says 1:37 from KOA-ITO

[Edited 2016-01-15 12:00:44]
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Flaps
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 8:03 pm

My how times have changed. I can remember flying HNL-ITO-ORD on a UA 747 back in the late 70's.
 
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RyanairGuru
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 8:20 pm

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 7):

You haven't been anytime recently have you? It's a 90 minute drive down a beautifully paved highway.
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codc10
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 8:54 pm

The service has been dwindling over the years, as it initially was daily service to LAX and once-weekly to SFO. SFO went away after a year or so, and LAX has been culled a bit too.

Fortunately, cheap fuel keeps marginal routes like this possible. There just isn't nearly the tourist volume to the Hilo side.

Quoting Flaps (Reply 11):
My how times have changed. I can remember flying HNL-ITO-ORD on a UA 747 back in the late 70's.

There was a time when PA, WA, CO, NW, UA all had ITO service, as it had the only other runway in Hawaii long enough for longhaul jet service and was designated as Hawaii's second overseas airport. UA left in 1986, I believe, with DC-8 and DC-10 service toward the end.
 
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 9:01 pm

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 7):
Flying to ITO to go to KOA is practically worthless its at least a 4 hr. drive in a 4X4. Better to fly to HNL and cx.

What on earth are you talking about? Is there a botched bank robbery along the way?
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BoeingGuy
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 9:05 pm

Quoting codc10 (Reply 13):
There was a time when PA, WA, CO, NW, UA all had ITO service, as it had the only other runway in Hawaii long enough for longhaul jet service and was designated as Hawaii's second overseas airport.

PA only served ITO for a very short time, AFAIK. Braniff also served ITO.
 
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jsnww81
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 9:15 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 15):
PA only served ITO for a very short time, AFAIK. Braniff also served ITO.

United and Pan Am were the first overseas carriers to launch Hilo service after the runway was extended in 1967. ITO was to be the "second gateway" to Hawaii. Continental, Northwest, Braniff and Western launched Hilo two years later when they were awarded Hawaii routes in the transpacific route case.

Pan Am bailed on ITO pretty quickly - pretty sure they were gone by 1971 or so. Braniff left around the same time. CO, NW, UA and WA all soldiered on through the opening of the new (and current) terminal in 1976. After Deregulation everyone except United left in a hurry. UA kept service up until 1986 and even served both KOA and ITO for a few years.

Anyone who's flown to ITO can clearly see the terminal was designed for a MUCH larger volume of traffic than it presently handles - seven jetbridges (only two of which get used with any regularity) and an entire ticket lobby and baggage claim hall that are gathering dust.

Had KOA or OGG been chosen as the second gateway, things might look much different today - but when those decisions were made fifty years ago, KOA was still limping along with its old airport and a too-short runway, and tourism on Maui hadn't really geared up yet. Hilo was the second biggest city in the state and had room for expansion, so it got picked.
 
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jaybird
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 9:29 pm

Quoting codc10 (Reply 13):
There was a time when PA, WA, CO, NW, UA all had ITO service, as it had the only other runway in Hawaii long enough for longhaul jet service and was designated as Hawaii's second overseas airport. UA left in 1986, I believe, with DC-8 and DC-10 service toward the end.

I don't remember the exact timing - late 60s/early 70s - but the Hilo service for a time was part of an interisland fare agreement. It had to something to do with a $10 interisland airfare. You could fly from the mainland and enter either via Honolulu or Hilo - and had to exit from the other - and interisland segments on (then) Aloha and Hawaiian were $10 each. I can "see" the ad in the OAG Air Travel magazine from the 60s/70s. So if someone flew, for example, in and out of Honolulu - the $10 didn't apply - you had to pay a higher airfare for an interisland segment. Back then - just getting people to come to Hawaii was a big deal. But the $10 interisland segments filled seats for Aloha and Hawaiian - and it helped fill those Hilo-mainland flights, too.
 
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 9:55 pm

Quoting jsnww81 (Reply 16):
Pan Am bailed on ITO pretty quickly - pretty sure they were gone by 1971 or so.

I actually think Pan Am was out of ITO by 1969. I thought they only served ITO for like 6 months. I thought Braniff did DAL-ITO with a 707 for longer than 1971, but I could be mistaken.

IIRC, UA's last ITO serve in 1986 was a triangle route LAX-KOA-ITO-LAX with a DC-10.
 
dlflynhayn
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 10:15 pm

Quoting BN727227Ultra (Reply 3):
Hilo has Ken's Pancakes! Try to find that in Kona!  

Kona has Costco Hilo nada  .
 
hiloboy1
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 10:59 pm

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 7):


I have no idea how you've taken 4 hours to get to Kona let alone needing a 4x4, but it only takes 1.2 hours to drive on the "new" Saddle Road.

The Hilo flight is a hit or miss with loads, this is why it will go to 3 days a week only during low times throughout the year. We had the SFO flight and they're talking of bringing it back but again not enough load to make it 7 days. Most of the Loads are Hilo folks going/returning.

Most times it's way cheaper to drive to KOA and catch a flight.
 
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 11:05 pm

Quoting roseflyer (Reply 1):
Unfortunately Hilo itself is a bit of a dumpy city in my opinion. None of the hotels on the Hilo side of the island are going to bring in high yielding tourists.

Too bad as well, the local flavor of Hawaii is far more evident in Hilo vs Kona, but the Hotels suck & there is little to do other than the volcano & botanical gardens.

Quoting drerx7 (Reply 2):
Yea, I've been to Hilo a couple of times...not exactly paradise. Rainforest and the volcanoes are closer...but no nice hotels at all over there.

Certainly nothing 4 or 5 star, The only place I'll stay is the Hilo Hawaiian & only because I know the renovated rooms are better than the lobby & public areas.

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 7):
Flying to ITO to go to KOA is practically worthless its at least a 4 hr. drive in a 4X4. Better to fly to HNL and cx

Our Lincoln MKZ made it in just under 90 minutes with a newly paved surface in December 2013. When the original Saddle road was closed due to the volcano flows, the drive was a circle Island route & took 4 hours, with the new road open it's a quick drive. We flew into KOA n/s from the mainland & drove vs flying into ITO & have to connect via LAX.

Quoting ua2162 (Reply 9):
The Hilo Hawaiian is a dump

Agreed the main lobby & public areas are in desperate need of an overhaul, however, our then recently upgraded suite on the top floor & on the corner of the hotel closest to the bay, was a nice room, not spectacular, but comfortable for 2 nights.

Quoting ua2162 (Reply 9):

Furthermore, since the completion of the new Saddle Road, it seems many Hilo residents are making the trek to KOA (the travel time is now about 1 1/2 hours) as there are more choices.

That is exactly what we did, when we went to visit Hilo last time in 2013, flying n/s from PDX to KOA & driving, was way better than flying UA via LAX & about half the elapsed time. Plus for locals heading out, you can get to many more places n/s from KOA than ITO & likely get a better rate, with the increased number of choices, I'd drive over as well.

Quoting doug_or (Reply 10):
when was the last time you visited? There is a paved highway. I don't remeber what it took me, but goggle says 1:37 from KOA-ITO

Super nice road, very smooth & quick from one side to the other, best way between two places is a straight line, well the new saddle road is about as close as one could get, given topography.

Quoting dlflynhayn (Reply 19):

Kona has Costco Hilo nada

That place is bat crap crazy busy, except for first thing in the morning, right when they open & the best place to get gas on the Island.
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jpetekyxmd80
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 11:13 pm

I think HA will open up Hilo mainland service with the A321 and ultimately drive United off the route. This could be the exact setup where success is possible. Their existing operations mean they could efficiently have less than weekly service, but I suspect an A321 based there with 3x LAX 2x OAK and 2x LAS would work very well.
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jayunited
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 11:22 pm

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 7):
Flying to ITO to go to KOA is practically worthless its at least a 4 hr. drive in a 4X4. Better to fly to HNL and cx.

What??? You do know there is a highway that runs the entire circumference of the island. I've been to Kona plenty of times and some times I drive to Hilo it only takes me 1 hour 30 minutes. .

I like the rainforest and how beautiful the Hilo side is but aside from that there is nothing on the Hilo side of the island I think most tourist who do venture to Hilo are probably doing a one day trip from another Hawaiian island or they drove over to Hilo from Kona but their hotel is located in Kona.
 
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exFWAOONW
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 11:33 pm

Quoting BN727227Ultra (Reply 3):
Hilo has Ken's Pancakes!

Love that place. I went there every time I was in town.

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 7):
Flying to ITO to go to KOA is practically worthless its at least a 4 hr. drive in a 4X4

If you need a 4x4, it's going to take you a lot longer than 4 hours. As others have already said, any car can do the circle trip in about 4 hours or less on the short cut.

It's sad to think I rode DC10s ORD-ITO non-stop several times back in the late 70s and can't do that today.
Is just me, or is flying not as much fun anymore?
 
jpetekyxmd80
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RE: UA And ITO

Fri Jan 15, 2016 11:37 pm

Hilo is great. I wish them well economically, but if everyone wants to stay in the resorts on the other side of the island, that is fine with me. It's lovely just how it is. Some wonderful bed and breakfasts too. And there is high potential for Doubletree Naniloa to be a fine property.

[Edited 2016-01-15 15:51:12]
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DolphinAir747
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 12:52 am

Quoting jaybird (Reply 6):
not sure about Hilo specifically - but I believe Las Vegas is the biggest destination for residents of the State of Hawaii.

I believe so yes. LAS has the largest Hawaiian population outside Hawaii.
 
N1120A
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 1:29 am

Quoting BN727227Ultra (Reply 3):

Hilo has Ken's Pancakes! Try to find that in Kona!  

That place is awful

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 4):
Where do Hilo locals want to go?? LA or SF bay area more?


L.A., plus better connections to LAS

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 7):
Flying to ITO to go to KOA is practically worthless its at least a 4 hr. drive in a 4X4. Better to fly to HNL and cx.

Where on earth did you get any of those ideas?

Quoting jpetekyxmd80 (Reply 14):
What on earth are you talking about? Is there a botched bank robbery along the way?

Maybe a side trip up to Keck?
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jsnww81
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 2:16 am

Quoting jpetekyxmd80 (Reply 25):

Hilo is great. I wish them well economically, but if everyone wants to stay in the resorts on the other side of the island, that is fine with me. It's lovely just how it is. Some wonderful bed and breakfasts too. And there is high potential for Doubletree Naniloa to be a fine property.

Exactly! Hilo is "old Hawaii" at its finest. My mom grew up on Maui in the 1950s and 1960s and loves going to Hilo because it reminds her of what the island used to be like. These days you leave OGG and immediately pass Cotsco, Walmart, Target... it's changed dramatically just in my lifetime. And now the Puunene sugar mill is closing, too... to me there's nothing that says "Hawaii" like fields of sugar cane waving in the tradewinds...  
Quoting hiloboy1 (Reply 20):
I have no idea how you've taken 4 hours to get to Kona let alone needing a 4x4, but it only takes 1.2 hours to drive on the "new" Saddle Road.

The Saddle Road rebuild has totally changed the experience of driving across the Big Island. It used to be a big deal going south behind the volcano or braving the (very) rugged old Saddle Road. Now it's a piece of cake.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 18):
I actually think Pan Am was out of ITO by 1969. I thought they only served ITO for like 6 months. I thought Braniff did DAL-ITO with a 707 for longer than 1971, but I could be mistaken.

That could be. It's hard to figure out ITO routings using old timetables, especially Braniff ones that don't always list non-stop service.

Quoting jaybird (Reply 17):
I don't remember the exact timing - late 60s/early 70s - but the Hilo service for a time was part of an interisland fare agreement.

Yup. The Hilo routes suffered almost from the get-go and the airlines did everything they could to try and get people on those flights. There was also a CAB rule for a time called the "Maui Fence" that required passengers who went beyond Maui to leave via Hilo, or something to that effect; I don't know the particulars. It was lifted around the time the new terminal was built at ITO and played a part in lowering the passenger counts.

My mom used to take the ITO flights going to and from college in the early 1970s. She had a friend whose father was an agent for United in Hilo who used to get her upgraded to first class on 747s she said were "mostly empty."
 
washingtonflyer
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 2:30 am

God ITO. My one and only DC8 flight was an ITO-LAX flight. It was supposed to be a DC-10 but AA 191 happened a couple weeks prior...
 
mwh787
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 2:49 am

Quoting BN727227Ultra (Reply 3):
Hilo has Ken's Pancakes! Try to find that in Kona!  
Quoting exFWAOONW (Reply 24):

Quoting BN727227Ultra (Reply 3):
Hilo has Ken's Pancakes!

Love that place. I went there every time I was in town.
Quoting N1120A (Reply 27):

Hilo has Ken's Pancakes! Try to find that in Kona!  

That place is awful

Ken's Pancakes may not be the best but it is an institution I've been going there since the 70's Never miss it every time in Hilo

Hilo is a great city maybe not the best tourist destination. But it is the last place left for TRUE Hawaiana (sp)
 
DualQual
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 2:52 am

Fresh poke at Suisan    Last time I was there though Baker Toms malasadas were no longer available at the cafe at Uncle Billy's.  
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jpetekyxmd80
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 4:02 am

Suisan is just fantasic, for poke and more. Very reasonable and great fish. Baker Tom has retired.
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bjorn14
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 11:44 am

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 12):

I have not beem there since the rebuild of the road so my bad. I remember the car rental agency telling us if we had an accident on a certain part of the road that insurance would not cover it. I love the Big Island.
"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
 
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RyanairGuru
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 1:08 pm

Just reading this thread has made me whistful for Hilo. I fell in love with the place. I went for only one reason, it being closed to the volcanoes than Kona, but certainly don't regret not staying on the other side. If you want the full resort experience then Hilo isn't for you, but for what we were looking for it was perfect. We had three days there, and then flew to Kauai for a week for a resort. It was a perfect combination, and that's what I'll do again when I return to Hawaii. On our middle day we drove across the island to Kona, and I have to say that I was very underwhelmed. If you like your resort to be perched on a lava flow then by all means, but I much prefer the more low key tropical theme of Hilo. I wouldn't stay there for a week of "relaxing", for that Kauai was perfect, but for a place with real charm and character within easy driving distance of the volcanoes I'd recommend it to anyone.
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roseflyer
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 2:20 pm

Quoting jpetekyxmd80 (Reply 22):

I think HA will open up Hilo mainland service with the A321 and ultimately drive United off the route. This could be the exact setup where success is possible. Their existing operations mean they could efficiently have less than weekly service, but I suspect an A321 based there with 3x LAX 2x OAK and 2x LAS would work very well.


I think UA is in a better position since they can offer connections. Hawaiian can only offer O/D service and connections to other islands. The 737 to Hilo must have some connections since the market is not big enough.
If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
 
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BN727227Ultra
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 3:09 pm

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 34):
Just reading this thread has made me whistful for Hilo. I fell in love with the place. I went for only one reason, it being closed to the volcanoes than Kona, but certainly don't regret not staying on the other side.

I've been twice, first to ITO, then stayed at the Volcano House. That was just my wife and me, I had no reason to go to Kona and indeed I was only parenthetically aware of any infrastructure on that side of the island! (I was a volcano geek, all right!)

Nineteen years later, with two kids added and able to get Marriott associate rates, KOA was a no-brainer. We did make two trips over to Kilauea, and the geek in me enjoyed the drive from Kona south then back north on HI-11. All the huge Mauna Loa lava flows--I was a happy amateur volcanologist  
 
Q
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 3:13 pm

I remember that United timetables that I read United flew on Boeing 747-200 from LAX or ORD to ITO nonstop. How could passengers book hotels so few so how that can be 747 carry 400ish everyday flight to ITO? How they handle staying in place in the past? LOL!

Q
 
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jaybird
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 5:41 pm

Quoting Q (Reply 37):

Back then - when there were multiple airlines/widebodies serving Hilo - there were a lot more hotel choices than there are now. There was the Sheraton Waiakea Village, and the Hilo Hawaiian and the Hilo Naniloa were not deluxe, but were in much better condition than they are now. Tour companies offered GIT/group tours - that moved tourists from Honolulu, Lihue, Kahului, Kona and the last night - was 1 night Hilo. There was enough hotel rooms for the air service at that time.

Now, as someone has mentioned - United's Hilo service is really for the outbound market - not inbound. It's to service the Hilo side of the Big Island going out to the West Coast and beyond. And that's the important part - United can offer connections beyond LAX for the residents in the Hilo area.
 
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psa1011
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RE: UA And ITO

Sat Jan 16, 2016 6:28 pm

Quoting washingtonflyer (Reply 29):

Do you remember which airline flew OAK-ITO in 1979?

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 21):

The authentic Hawaiian feel is one draw for me (and others). I also want lush greenery and waterfalls when I visit Hawaii, so both times I've scheduled trips to the Big Island I've purposefully avoided Kona. South of Hilo there's Pahoa and a variety of awesome small places to stay (B&B's, yoga retreats, etc.). If I wanted a more arid climate in Hawaii I suppose I can see booking Kona, however all the islands have a dry side.

[Edited 2016-01-16 10:55:44]
 
N1120A
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RE: UA And ITO

Sun Jan 17, 2016 5:42 am

Quoting DualQual (Reply 31):

Fresh poke at Suisan

Dapokeshack has the best poke on earth.

Quoting mwh787 (Reply 30):
Ken's Pancakes may not be the best but it is an institution I've been going there since the 70's Never miss it every time in Hilo

The only place I've ever been in Hawai'i where I was served canned pineapple. Awful.

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 33):

I have not beem there since the rebuild of the road so my bad.

Even before the most recent part was built, the Saddle Road had been fine for at least a decade.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
Viscount724
Posts: 19316
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: UA And ITO

Sun Jan 17, 2016 6:37 am

Quoting jaybird (Reply 17):
I don't remember the exact timing - late 60s/early 70s - but the Hilo service for a time was part of an interisland fare agreement. It had to something to do with a $10 interisland airfare. You could fly from the mainland and enter either via Honolulu or Hilo - and had to exit from the other - and interisland segments on (then) Aloha and Hawaiian were $10 each. I can "see" the ad in the OAG Air Travel magazine from the 60s/70s. So if someone flew, for example, in and out of Honolulu - the $10 didn't apply - you had to pay a higher airfare for an interisland segment. Back then - just getting people to come to Hawaii was a big deal. But the $10 interisland segments filled seats for Aloha and Hawaiian - and it helped fill those Hilo-mainland flights, too.

I think you're referring to what was known as the "Hawaii Common Fare". The way I remember it, the scheduled airlines operating from the mainland U.S. and Canada to Hawaii and both Hawaiian and Aloha Airlines had an agreement that permitted you to fly to any of the islands at the same fare as to HNL (or ITO which was probably the same as HNL) provided you only connected at the gateway and didn't stop over. If you stopped over you paid $10 for each stopover (I think that amount increased later). It didn't matter what gateway you used. You could visit 3 or 4 points in Hawaii that way, only paying the fare to HNL plus $10 for each stopover other than the final destination. The inter-island carriers of course got more than $10 per sector for carrying the passenger and the difference was subsidized by the mainland-Hawaii carriers.

I issued many tickets at those fares during my 3 years as a ticket agent for CP Air in their city ticket office in downtown YYC from 1969 to 1972, my first job in the airline industry..
 
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RWA380
Posts: 5759
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

RE: UA And ITO

Sun Jan 17, 2016 7:38 am

Quoting jaybird (Reply 38):
Now, as someone has mentioned - United's Hilo service is really for the outbound market - not inbound. It's to service the Hilo side of the Big Island going out to the West Coast and beyond. And that's the important part - United can offer connections beyond LAX for the residents in the Hilo area.

UA can offer many, many more connections via SFO, although the local traffic is bigger to LAX vs SFO, the SFO hub is a much better connecting point for UA & their entire network. So I'm guessing the bulk of the travel is O/D to LAX, then the connecting traffic to LAS.

Quoting psa1011 (Reply 39):
Do you remember which airline flew OAK-ITO in 1979?

In this Nov 1979 OAG, UA has a DC-8 HNL-OAK n/s, I'd imagine if ITO-OAK was flown, then it would have been UA in 1979.

http://www.departedflights.com/OAK79p1.html

By 1982 WO was flying OAK-HNL - http://www.departedflights.com/WO090182p6.html
707 717 720 727-1/2 737-1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 747-1/2/3/4 757-2/3 767-2/3/4 777-2/3 DC8 DC9 MD80/2/7/8 D10-1/3/4 M11 L10-1/2/5 A300/310/320
AA AC AQ AS BA BD BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WC WN WP YS 8M
 
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MKE22
Posts: 204
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2007 4:58 am

RE: UA And ITO

Sun Jan 17, 2016 10:55 pm

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 7):

Flying to ITO to go to KOA is practically worthless its at least a 4 hr. drive in a 4X4.

I've done it in a Hyundai compact in 3, you just have to be careful.
 
BoeingGuy
Posts: 6476
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:01 pm

RE: UA And ITO

Mon Jan 18, 2016 4:37 am

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 42):
Quoting psa1011 (Reply 39):
Do you remember which airline flew OAK-ITO in 1979?

In this Nov 1979 OAG, UA has a DC-8 HNL-OAK n/s, I'd imagine if ITO-OAK was flown, then it would have been UA in 1979.

This one stumps me. Was it something like Braniff or World? I don't recall UA ever serving OAK-ITO. They did have SJC-HNL and OAK-HNL flights for a few years around 1979, as noted. They were DC-80-50s for awhile, and then DC-10s at one point.

Western flew OAK-HNL and SJC-HNL for many years with 720Bs, but again, I don't recall WA ever doing OAK-ITO.

Quoting psa1011 (Reply 39):
The authentic Hawaiian feel is one draw for me (and others). I also want lush greenery and waterfalls when I visit Hawaii, so both times I've scheduled trips to the Big Island I've purposefully avoided Kona.

I agree. I toured around Hawaii about 10 years ago and far preferred Hilo. It was much more authentic and beautiful. I even went to one of the local microbreweries there.

In 1973 I visited Hawaii with my grandparents and we spent a few days at Hilo. I remember the hotel being fairly nice and the area had more tourism back then. Best thing is that it's close to Volcanoes National Park.

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