Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
User avatar
KarelXWB
Topic Author
Posts: 26968
Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:13 pm

The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Mon Jan 18, 2016 2:28 pm

Please continue posting your updates here.

The Rest Of Ohio, Part 3 (by DeltaRules Aug 23 2015 in Civil Aviation)
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Mon Jan 18, 2016 4:04 pm

Thanks to everybody for participating and keeping the last thread moving in the vein of the other regional ones on here.

Summary of recent changes and news:

CMH- F9 returns in June. DEN & LAS daily, MCO & PHL 3x/week. BA/LHR still rumored, Columbus media saying it possibly happens in early 2017?

DAY- WN adds MDW, but drops all else. G4 wastes no time adding new service to PIE and SFB, replacing WN's Florida routes. G4 had said DAY was on their radar for a while.

CVG- F9 adds LAX, IAH, PHL 4x/week, SFO 3x/week, restores services which were supposed to be cut. G4 adds VPS and BWI, makes SAV year-round.

ILN- Aerosmith, aka Amazon. Hub/base of operations for Amazon's cargo airline if it happens?

TOL- G4 TOL-MYR coming?

CAK- Loses all WN service except 3x/daily to ATL.

YNG/PKB?
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
toltommy
Posts: 2790
Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2003 9:04 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Mon Jan 18, 2016 4:47 pm

With NK up the road at DTW, I doubt you'll ever see TOL-MYR. In fact, it's probabaly safe to say that new service at all from Allegiant is unlikely. There are plenty of markets that they can see a better return in.
A300/A310/A319/A320/A321/A332/A333 / 707/712/727/732/733/734/735/738/739/752/753
/762/763/764/772/788/789/DC8/DC9-10/30/40/50/MD81/83/87/88/90/L1011-/250/500/CRJ200/440 /700/900/EMB135/140/145/170/175/190/328Jet/F70/SF3/BE1/J31
 
flyinryan99
Posts: 1504
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2001 6:54 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Mon Jan 18, 2016 4:50 pm

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 1):
TOL- G4 TOL-MYR coming?

Negative. Well, at least not at this moment. American did write a letter in support of extending the SCASD grant one more year and it did get extended till next year. Nothing definite though.
 
masseybrown
Posts: 5545
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Mon Jan 18, 2016 6:36 pm

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 1):
BA/LHR still rumored, Columbus media saying it possibly happens in early 2017?

The TATL summer route conference is usually in November; and nothing is secret after that, although an earlier announcement is always possible. Whether CMH will be OneWorld's choice is a different matter. Good luck.
 
brooklynchris13
Posts: 297
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:11 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Tue Jan 19, 2016 2:50 pm

Couple of Items:

First, just wanted to suggest we include HTS in this thread as well, especially given they include the Ironton and Portsmouth areas, among other parts of Southern/Southeast Ohio.

Second, just a couple of Items from an "exploration" of B at CMH yesterday.

Gates B17 and B33 have been eliminated. B17 by the new Eddie George Restaurant and modifications to create full gates for B19 & B21. B33 is the location of new Men's & Women's restrooms.

Gate B34 is being used by United for at least one flight a day. Gate B36 is still missing it's jetbridge.

To summarize gate assignments in B:

American: B19; B20; B21; B22; B23: B24; B25; B26; B28 (there is no B27)
United: B29; B30; B31: B32; B34* (Don't know if this is all the time)
Open: B35; B36

B looks pretty nice, with a great deal of natural light. (have to say I enjoyed the new Bob Evans as well. )
"Be the change you want to see in the world" (mg)
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Jan 20, 2016 2:30 am

Yeah, we can include HTS. Forgot about it down there. So CMH/LCK/CVG/DAY/TOL/CAK/YNG/PKB/HTS/ILN are fair game here!

The updated ticketing area at CMH is amazing. Feels like a new terminal. Haven't been down B since they finished the update, but I figure it's in line with the ticket lobby.

Bringing up the rest of the airport, A2, 3, 4, 5, 6 are WN's, with A1 and A7 empty. C46-49 are all empty (though 47 saw an arriving SY casino charter from GPT when I was there last week and had a Sunwing size-wise), with C48 having no jetway. C50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56 are Delta land. So A1, A7, B36, C46-49 would be where any new airlines would have to set up shop.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
flyinryan99
Posts: 1504
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2001 6:54 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Jan 20, 2016 3:04 pm

For TOL...Year end 2015 ended really on a sour not as both November and December were both down causing the recent gains to really lose steam. Allegiant was up just over 1% over December 2015 and American operated by Envoy was down 20% over December 2015. Overall, 179,911 flew through TOL in 2015 which is a 1.9% increase over last year. 2016 capacity is looking down about 8% so far through summer and if the current trends continue, pax traffic will drop around double digits for 2016. But hey...the airport was in the black last year by $400k so it's a thriving airport right?
 
CMHMarc787
Posts: 95
Joined: Sat Nov 23, 2013 9:09 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Jan 20, 2016 6:11 pm

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 6):

Yeah, we can include HTS. Forgot about it down there. So CMH/LCK/CVG/DAY/TOL/CAK/YNG/PKB/HTS/ILN are fair game here!

The updated ticketing area at CMH is amazing. Feels like a new terminal. Haven't been down B since they finished the update, but I figure it's in line with the ticket lobby.

Bringing up the rest of the airport, A2, 3, 4, 5, 6 are WN's, with A1 and A7 empty. C46-49 are all empty (though 47 saw an arriving SY casino charter from GPT when I was there last week and had a Sunwing size-wise), with C48 having no jetway. C50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56 are Delta land. So A1, A7, B36, C46-49 would be where any new airlines would have to set up shop.

There are no jetways at A1, A7 or B36, so they couldn't be utilized until they could be installed (why the took the one out of B36 is anyone's guess).

With WN steadily growing, it would make sense to get A1 & A7 up to speed so that either, a) WN could take over both and seal their claim to A or, b) WN keep 5 gates (A1-A5, or A3-A7) and open up the other two, perhaps for F9.

Reinstall the jetway at B36 and, coupled with B35, you have a nice place for a new tenant.

Put a jetway in at C48 and, coupled with C47, have the perfect place for, say AS to park.
 
User avatar
AirportRival
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:24 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Jan 21, 2016 1:32 am

Allegiant is already adding another weekly flight to its seasonal Destin, FL flight from CVG. It goes from twice weekly to three times weekly because the pre-bookings are doing so well. It was just announced on Jan. 12th.

http://www.wcpo.com/news/insider/all...ping-ante-on-cvg-service-to-destin

The article is behind a paywall.

[Edited 2016-01-20 17:33:23]
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Jan 21, 2016 3:01 am

Quoting CMHMarc787 (Reply 8):
With WN steadily growing, it would make sense to get A1 & A7 up to speed so that either, a) WN could take over both and seal their claim to A or, b) WN keep 5 gates (A1-A5, or A3-A7) and open up the other two, perhaps for F9.

The irony in this is that the only gate on A WN currently doesn't use which had a jetway, A1, was their first gate at CMH. They've got a line there for parking, as they do between A2 and A3 and in the area of A7.

I'm not sure there'd be space for one at A7, but there's a parking position between 7 and Lane as well, so maybe they could swing it. (I wonder if they currently swing the jetway at A6 over there and bring it back to its normal position after an early departure off that position. NW did that at B35.)

Interesting stuff to look at on a satellite image and see what's there you might otherwise miss!
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Sat Jan 23, 2016 4:20 pm

Looks like Ohio might be the place to go if you're still interested in flying for a regional carrier. PSA and Envoy just launched cadet programs, with four of the handful of schools PSA's partnered with (Kent State, OSU, OU, UC) being here. Wouldn't surprise me to see Sinclair join the list someday being in DAY. Envoy is also working with KSU and OSU, as well as American Flyers, which used to have training in Cleveland.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
User avatar
AirportRival
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:24 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Sun Jan 24, 2016 8:57 pm

DL CVG-EWR MAY 3>4 JUN 3>4 AUG 3>4 SEP 1.8>3
DL CVG-MKE APR 1.2>0.8
DL CVG-DTW APR 5>6
DL CVG-JFK JUN 1.0>2 JUL 1.0>1.8 AUG 1.0>2 SEP 1.0>2

It's nice to see Delta making some increases at CVG.
 
brooklynchris13
Posts: 297
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:11 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Jan 28, 2016 3:04 pm

The numbers are in for CMH for 2015 (or at least some of them). According to a Columbus Dispatch Article, 2015 traffic hit 6.79 Million passengers, which was a nearly 7% increase over 2014. This continues the resurgence and is a good indication of where numbers may go in 2016. Especially with the entry of a ULCC and the economic growth in the area, I would expect at least 7% in 2016, perhaps as high as 8% or 9%- depending on whether or not Frontier makes a big splash in the CMH market. As for the month of December, even with the first day of the holiday travel season being in November, CMH posted an 8.5% increase over the December of 2014 numbers.

http://www.dispatch.com/content/stor...fic-continued-rebound-in-2015.html
"Be the change you want to see in the world" (mg)
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Sat Jan 30, 2016 5:15 pm

I'm kind of amazed at the size of the mainline metal DL has RONed at CMH each night lately. I was on a 757 (ex-Song, so a few extra seats) ATL-CMH last night sandwiched between an A320 and 739. The 757 and 739 are both at around 180 seats, and are the biggest narrowbodies CMH has gotten since the DC-8, with the A320 checking in at 160.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
brooklynchris13
Posts: 297
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:11 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Sat Jan 30, 2016 6:56 pm

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 14):
I'm kind of amazed at the size of the mainline metal DL has RONed at CMH each night lately. I was on a 757 (ex-Song, so a few extra seats) ATL-CMH last night sandwiched between an A320 and 739. The 757 and 739 are both at around 180 seats, and are the biggest narrowbodies CMH has gotten since the DC-8, with the A320 checking in at 160.

And with UA 739/320s & WN 738s you can certainly see the overall trend. With passenger traffic growing but not too much in the way of new flights/destinations from UA, DL, and AA, the only way for them to really handle growth at CMH is larger sized aircraft on the flights to hubs. WN can, and has, added new destinations but even there you see a respectable number of 738s. I still say that the canary in the coal mine for CMH will be constant Mainline on UA to DEN and/or SFO service; at least one 319 to CLT on US; replacement of the S80 on DFW by the 738, and larger aircraft on the flights to DTW by DL. That does not even speak to F9, who just may end up with multiple 321s at some point into CMH. We shall have to see but this year could be a tipping point for CMH into more of an IND/AUS market from "just one of the bigger spokes".

Couple of random questions for my fellow CMH enthusiasts...
1) will the arrival of F9 freeze out NK, AS, or Virgin America from the CMH market or does it make it more likely one or more of them (or perhaps B6) will try to enter?
2) How would WN closing DAY and/or CAK impact their operations at CMH? Could you see any increase in traffic at CMH as a result?
"Be the change you want to see in the world" (mg)
 
User avatar
AirportRival
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:24 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Sun Jan 31, 2016 3:17 pm

DL CVG-LAS MAY 0.9>0.6

I'm guessing Allegiant and Frontier are making it hard for Delta to keep this flight full.
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Tue Feb 02, 2016 11:30 pm

DAY saw north of 1 million enplanements last year. Drop of 6%, but the decline is slowing per http://www.bizjournals.com/dayton/ne...egional-carrier-offer.html?ana=fbk

Were WN's Florida flights weekend only? At 2x/week, G4 service might actually be an uptick in frequencies.

Quoting brooklynchris13 (Reply 15):
1) will the arrival of F9 freeze out NK, AS, or Virgin America from the CMH market or does it make it more likely one or more of them (or perhaps B6) will try to enter?

I would've thought WN to OAK and BOS might've put the skids on VX/UA to SFO and B6 to BOS moreso than F9 showing up. Looking at CLE, NK overlaps on some of the same routes F9 also operates (as do some combination of the Big 4), so it didn't seem to deter them much.

CLE:
-RSW (F9, NK, UA)
-LAS (F9, NK, UA, WN)
-LAX (F9, NK, UA)
-MCO (F9, NK, UA, WN)
-TPA (F9, NK)

Virtually all of the routes the two run from CLE have some sort of competition (if not with each other), with only MYR, RDU, and PUJ being unique.

Unless F9 or DL starts SEA, I'd think AS would still be in the mix. I still think NK is next.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
User avatar
AirportRival
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:24 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:16 am

An article from the Cincinnati Business Journal that the next likely expansion for Ultimate Air Shuttle from Cincinnati will probably be Atlanta by way of PDK. It did not say whether the flights will be from CVG or LUK. The article also stated that Ultimate has long term plans of adding Nashville and that they will be expanding their offering of Chicago flights.

Here is the article.

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnat...ng-cincinnati-expansion-could.html
 
toltommy
Posts: 2790
Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2003 9:04 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:40 am

Quoting AirportRival (Reply 18):
An article from the Cincinnati Business Journal that the next likely expansion for Ultimate Air Shuttle from Cincinnati will probably be Atlanta by way of PDK.

The approach to PDK oughta be renamed NIMBY, its that bad. There's a group that seems to live to permanently close that airport. There's no way they'll aloow any commercial service there, no matter the size of the aircraft.
A300/A310/A319/A320/A321/A332/A333 / 707/712/727/732/733/734/735/738/739/752/753
/762/763/764/772/788/789/DC8/DC9-10/30/40/50/MD81/83/87/88/90/L1011-/250/500/CRJ200/440 /700/900/EMB135/140/145/170/175/190/328Jet/F70/SF3/BE1/J31
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:03 am

With the PDEW on CMH-SFO being 318 in the second quarter of 2015 (glad someone on the forums helped me finally find out how to find the stats...Google doesn't find everything!), how is it that UA hasn't jumped on that yet? 159 seats more than fills an A319 or 737-700.

I used Table 1A here: https://www.transportation.gov/policy/aviation-policy/domestic-airline-consumer-airfare-report

Quoting toltommy (Reply 19):
The approach to PDK oughta be renamed NIMBY, its that bad. There's a group that seems to live to permanently close that airport. There's no way they'll aloow any commercial service there, no matter the size of the aircraft.


Tangentially related, MGY (Dayton-Wright Brothers) was dealing with this problem a few years ago until the airport authority told the head of the NIMBYs "Do you REALLY want to get the lawyers involved?", at which point the whining ended.

The neighborhoods affected were about a mile east of the airport, only being directly affected by planes in the pattern.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
masseybrown
Posts: 5545
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 03, 2016 4:50 pm

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 20):
With the PDEW on CMH-SFO being 318 in the second quarter of 2015

I believe this number is both ways, not PDEW (Per Day Each Way).

[Edited 2016-02-03 08:51:26]
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Sat Feb 06, 2016 2:16 am

LCK winds up 2015 with a $1.67M surplus: http://workplace.dispatch.com/conten...201-big-step-for-rickenbacker.html

Another Dispatch article from January 27th reports G4 will be expanding there this year, with details to be announced.

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 21):
I believe this number is both ways, not PDEW (Per Day Each Way).


If it is, it's even more impressive, especially since CMH-OAK was in the 70s and WN took a chance on it.

[Edited 2016-02-05 18:30:25]
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
User avatar
AirportRival
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:24 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Sun Feb 07, 2016 8:04 pm

DL CVG-BWI MAR 1.6>1.2
DL CVG-IAH MAR 0.9>0.6
DL CVG-YYZ MAR 0.9>0.5

And here I was just saying that it was nice to see DL adding some frequency at CVG. Of course, that was before the layoff announcement.
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 10, 2016 1:47 am

What's the deal with the Sun Country charters to/from GPT from CMH? Obviously it's some sort of casino junket, but how often do they run?
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
flyCMH
Posts: 2320
Joined: Fri Jul 09, 1999 12:15 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 10, 2016 1:55 am

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 24):
What's the deal with the Sun Country charters to/from GPT from CMH? Obviously it's some sort of casino junket, but how often do they run?

I recall seeing a schedule of flights by some large casino operator (Harrah's, Bally's...something like that). I think it boiled down to flights once a month, more or less.

Also, in the PIT and CLE threads, it's been noted that AC Express is going or has gone all-CRJ in their respective markets. CMH-YYZ will see the same treatment in June with 4x daily CR2s:

06:00 07:09 7338 CRJ
10:25 11:34 7340 CRJ
14:25 15:34 7342 CRJ
18:55 20:04 7344 CRJ
 
CMHSRQ
Posts: 848
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 1:49 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 10, 2016 4:40 pm

Does anyone know what gate Frontier will be operating out of at CMH starting in May?
The voice of moderation
 
User avatar
AirportRival
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:24 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Mon Feb 15, 2016 3:06 am

A round-up of Ohio changes from enrilia's latest OAG thread

DL CVG-LAS APR 0.8>0.6
UA EWR-CMH JUL 7>6
UA IAD-DAY JUL 3>1.8
UA ORD-CMH JUL 7>6
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Tue Feb 16, 2016 2:31 am

Quoting flyCMH (Reply 25):
I recall seeing a schedule of flights by some large casino operator (Harrah's, Bally's...something like that). I think it boiled down to flights once a month, more or less.

I left CMH on a Friday night in January and a 73G parked at C47, offloaded, and ferried back to MSP empty. The night of that post, they had an outbound flight to GPT.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
brooklynchris13
Posts: 297
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:11 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Tue Feb 16, 2016 3:21 pm

Quoting CMHSRQ (Reply 26):
Does anyone know what gate Frontier will be operating out of at CMH starting in May?

Nope. Reached out to the airport and they have not figured it out yet. I think we are running a poll on it and the consensus choice has trended towards B35/B36 with the second choice of C47/C48. Will be interesting to see though where it ends up.
"Be the change you want to see in the world" (mg)
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 17, 2016 3:48 pm

Rumors in the WN schedule release thread have DAY closing later this year, with CVG finally feeling the LUV June 5th.

Quoting brooklynchris13 (Reply 29):
Nope. Reached out to the airport and they have not figured it out yet. I think we are running a poll on it and the consensus choice has trended towards B35/B36 with the second choice of C47/C48. Will be interesting to see though where it ends up.

If I can ask, who's "we"? Is there another Ohio travel group somewhere?

And what factors into that decision for an airline? B has more amenities, but has more flights/tenants and, thus, is busier. PreCheck is worth having if you go through B's checkpoint at rush hour, but not terrible other times. B35/B36 are literally about as far as you can walk on the concourse.

On the other side, C is less busy and C47/C48 are a shorter walk, but there seems to be less going on in terms of food (including Johnny Rockets, which has been closed the last couple times I've gone through.)
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
flyguy89
Posts: 3042
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 6:43 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 17, 2016 4:54 pm

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 30):

Rumors in the WN schedule release thread have DAY closing later this year, with CVG finally feeling the LUV June 5th.

Well, they better hurry up. They are very late at this point to the LCC game at CVG and will now face fairly entrenched competition on all of their usual core routes (MCO, LAS, PHX, BWI...etc).
 
CMHMarc787
Posts: 95
Joined: Sat Nov 23, 2013 9:09 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 17, 2016 6:58 pm

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 30):
Nope. Reached out to the airport and they have not figured it out yet. I think we are running a poll on it and the consensus choice has trended towards B35/B36 with the second choice of C47/C48. Will be interesting to see though where it ends up.
Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 30):
B35/B36 are literally about as far as you can walk on the concourse.

The problem with B35/36 is that there is no-longer a B36; they removed the jetway a while back. While it's really not a major issue if they want to put a new one back in there, it would probably make more sense to just use the old FL gates (C47-48).
 
CMHSRQ
Posts: 848
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 1:49 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 17, 2016 7:49 pm

Quoting CMHMarc787 (Reply 32):
Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 30):
Nope. Reached out to the airport and they have not figured it out yet. I think we are running a poll on it and the consensus choice has trended towards B35/B36 with the second choice of C47/C48. Will be interesting to see though where it ends up.
Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 30):
B35/B36 are literally about as far as you can walk on the concourse.

The problem with B35/36 is that there is no-longer a B36; they removed the jetway a while back. While it's really not a major issue if they want to put a new one back in there, it would probably make more sense to just use the old FL gates (C47-48).

I agree with you and hope they do use the C gates. Sounds nuts but 4 of the last 5 times I have gone through security at C pre check has been closed. I would think the additional traffic would justify them to open it more consistently. It would be nice to see people in that end of C concourse as well.
The voice of moderation
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Feb 18, 2016 1:29 am

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 31):
They are very late at this point to the LCC game at CVG and will now face fairly entrenched competition on all of their usual core routes (MCO, LAS, PHX, BWI...etc).

You're not kidding. G4 even has CVG-BWI, which strikes me as odd for an Allegiant route (i.e., flight which doesn't touch AZA/LAS/LAX/SFB/PIE/PGD/FLL/MYR/vacation spot). I wonder if that was a pre-emptive strike against a likely WN route.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
flyCMH
Posts: 2320
Joined: Fri Jul 09, 1999 12:15 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Feb 18, 2016 5:29 am

Count me in as one that would like to see F9 in Concourse C. Agreed that the former FL gates would make a nice home for Frontier, though it might depend on who does the ground handling for them. If Jetstream or ATS gets the work, they'll likely be in Concourse B. If Delta or another firm gets the contract, then C is more likely. Though if Jetstream or ATS gets the work it doesn't necessarily negate them from using C, it's just it'd be more convenient for the ground ops.

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 34):

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 31):They are very late at this point to the LCC game at CVG and will now face fairly entrenched competition on all of their usual core routes (MCO, LAS, PHX, BWI...etc).
You're not kidding. G4 even has CVG-BWI, which strikes me as odd for an Allegiant route (i.e., flight which doesn't touch AZA/LAS/LAX/SFB/PIE/PGD/FLL/MYR/vacation spot). I wonder if that was a pre-emptive strike against a likely WN route.

Totally agreed, though WN's arrival in the market won't quite herald the low fares like they used to, or the way G4, NK, or F9 do now. Yes, they'd likely spur the Big 3 to reduce airfares in whichever markets WN would start from CVG, but you can't get much lower than what F9 and G4 offer from CVG. WN's arrival in CVG would primarily give Tri-State travelers more choice. Though again, this is still merely a long-standing rumor. We'll see tomorrow if there's (finally) any truth to it.
 
brooklynchris13
Posts: 297
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:11 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Feb 18, 2016 3:38 pm

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 30):
If I can ask, who's "we"? Is there another Ohio travel group somewhere?

You would be amazed how many airline interested people there are in and around Central Ohio.   That comment also reflected the earlier discussion when the announcement was made. I didn't want to sound like a jerk and just say "scroll up"  

As for updates on where they will end up, I have to wonder how other (not yet announced) entrants into the CMH market may impact where F9 ends up. If someone like an AS, NK, B6 (?!), or VX (??!!) has expressed interest in starting I would think that may play into gate assignments and locations as well.

Chris
"Be the change you want to see in the world" (mg)
 
CMHMarc787
Posts: 95
Joined: Sat Nov 23, 2013 9:09 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Feb 18, 2016 6:10 pm

Quoting brooklynchris13 (Reply 36):
As for updates on where they will end up, I have to wonder how other (not yet announced) entrants into the CMH market may impact where F9 ends up. If someone like an AS, NK, B6 (?!), or VX (??!!) has expressed interest in starting I would think that may play into gate assignments and locations as well.

Don't forget that there are a few jetway-less gates that could easily have them re-installed and made available for use; A1 (also A7 - it has aircraft boundaries painted on the ramp, but they'd have to build a door in order to install a jetway)...B36 (plus B30 with the same needs as a possible A7)...and C48.

By all accounts, WN appears to be doing exceptionally well and could use the added gate capacity by adding A1 and A7 to possibly introduce LAX and/or HOU, plus increase frequencies of their other routes.

Reopening B36, along with adding a jetway to B30 would free up B35 and allow for UA to main in the northern part of the concourse, making it more compatible for either F9 to up their capacity, or allow for another carrier to enter the market.

Adding a jetway to C48 would also make for an attractive set up for possible new entrants as it would be a third gate in that part of the concourse (sitting immediately next to C46 and 47.

Just my 2 cents...
 
flyinryan99
Posts: 1504
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2001 6:54 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Feb 18, 2016 6:29 pm

I wonder if there is a cost difference between gates? That may be a deciding factor too....
 
User avatar
Frontier14
Posts: 673
Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 4:14 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Feb 18, 2016 7:38 pm

Quoting flyinryan99 (Reply 38):

I wonder if there is a cost difference between gates? That may be a deciding factor too....

For Frontier you have hit one of the nails on the head. {checkmark

Frontier 14
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Sun Feb 21, 2016 2:13 am

Apparently WN at CVG didn't happen.

In terms of WN at CMH, I mentioned in the last thread the interesting tidbit that A1 was WN's original gate at CMH. They could stick a jetway there and bring things full-circle.

Quoting brooklynchris13 (Reply 36):
You would be amazed how many airline interested people there are in and around Central Ohio. That comment also reflected the earlier discussion when the announcement was made. I didn't want to sound like a jerk and just say "scroll up"

Thanks- didn't know if there was another group on the internet having the same discussion! I've been glad these threads have moved along as well as they have.

Quoting brooklynchris13 (Reply 36):
As for updates on where they will end up, I have to wonder how other (not yet announced) entrants into the CMH market may impact where F9 ends up. If someone like an AS, NK, B6 (?!), or VX (??!!) has expressed interest in starting I would think that may play into gate assignments and locations as well.


There's another name to think about: OneJet. I'm figuring they do ramp boarding & they've said on their page CMH is "on the list". With BDL just added to their network, it could set up an opportunity to restart the old DL Connection CMH-BDL insurance shuttle. They've also mentioned more routes to be announced soon.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
User avatar
AirportRival
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:24 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Sun Feb 21, 2016 9:45 pm

Latest summary of Ohio changes from enilria's OAG thread.

DL DTW-CVG MAY 5>6
WN ATL-CAK AUG 2>3 SEP 1.9>3 OCT 1.8>3
WN ATL-CMH OCT 1.8>3
WN BWI-CLE SEP 4>3 OCT 4>3
WN BWI-CMH OCT 5>4
WN BWI-DAY AUG 1.9>0 SEP 2.0>0 OCT 2.0>0
WN CAK-TPA AUG 1.1>0 SEP 1.0>0 OCT 1.0>0
WN CLE-STL AUG 0>1.0 SEP 0>1.0 OCT 0>1.0
WN CMH-DCA AUG 1.0>1.9 SEP 1.0>1.9 OCT 1.0>1.8
WN DEN-CLE AUG 0>1.0 SEP 0>1.0 OCT 0>1.0
WN DEN-DAY AUG 1.0>0 SEP 1.0>0 OCT 1.0>0
WN MCO-CAK AUG 1.0>0.1 SEP 1.0>0.1 OCT 1.0>0.2
WN MCO-DAY AUG 1.1>0 SEP 1.0>0 OCT 1.0>0
WN MDW-DAY AUG 0>3 SEP 0>3 OCT 0>3
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 24, 2016 3:01 pm

G4's CAK-FLL was cut before it had the chance to start. That and other interesting Ohio/Midwest-related "slow season" G4 stats (Post 23) here: G4 Discreetly Ends FLL-CAK/PSM/GRR/SAT (by ROCDLFAN Feb 22 2016 in Civil Aviation)

[Edited 2016-02-24 07:02:04]
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
brooklynchris13
Posts: 297
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:11 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 24, 2016 4:55 pm

Quoting AirportRival (Reply 41):
WN CMH-DCA AUG 1.0>1.9 SEP 1.0>1.9 OCT 1.0>1.8

Nice to see the continued evolution of WN at CMH with the increase of service to DCA. Departures for DCA on the days with two flights will be 08:15 and 15:10. Departures from DCA are 10:00 and 20:15. Not the best ever for business travel but not too bad. My own employer has staff who do this trip often and those who use WN will now will be able to do same day out and back from Columbus. Not quite as easy going the other way, but its a start. Wondering when HOU will happen, imagine it shouldn't be too far in the future.
"Be the change you want to see in the world" (mg)
 
flyguy89
Posts: 3042
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 6:43 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Wed Feb 24, 2016 5:55 pm

Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 42):
G4's CAK-FLL was cut before it had the chance to start. That and other interesting Ohio/Midwest-related "slow season" G4 stats (Post 23) here: G4 Discreetly Ends FLL-CAK/PSM/GRR/SAT (by

  

CAK-FLL has been operating for a few months now. Most likely returns after the early fall hiatus.
 
NoTime
Posts: 624
Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2015 2:21 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Feb 25, 2016 1:15 am

The numbers at CMH continue to look good.

Quote:
Port Columbus handled 6 percent more passengers in January than a year earlier, according to the Columbus Regional Airport Authority.
...
The airport served 497,087 passengers in January, up from 468,868 in January 2015. The growth continues the momentum from 2015, a year in which passenger traffic increased 6.9 percent from 2014. Last year's passenger total of 6.79 million was the fourth-highest in the history of the airport.

From: The Columbus Dispatch


6% growth for the year would put CMH at ~7.2 mil... that's certainly going in the right direction.
 
StuckinCMHland
Posts: 232
Joined: Sat Mar 07, 2015 10:59 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Feb 25, 2016 1:40 am

Quoting CMHSRQ (Reply 33):
Quoting CMHMarc787 (Reply 32):
Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 30):
Nope. Reached out to the airport and they have not figured it out yet. I think we are running a poll on it and the consensus choice has trended towards B35/B36 with the second choice of C47/C48. Will be interesting to see though where it ends up.
Quoting DeltaRules (Reply 30):
B35/B36 are literally about as far as you can walk on the concourse.

The problem with B35/36 is that there is no-longer a B36; they removed the jetway a while back. While it's really not a major issue if they want to put a new one back in there, it would probably make more sense to just use the old FL gates (C47-48).

I agree with you and hope they do use the C gates. Sounds nuts but 4 of the last 5 times I have gone through security at C pre check has been closed. I would think the additional traffic would justify them to open it more consistently. It would be nice to see people in that end of C concourse as well.

Excuse me for my ignorance, but aren't those C gates your are talking about the old international gates? I guess I would like to save something in the hope that someone would put some TATL flights at CMH.

If I am wrong about this please let me know.
 
flyCMH
Posts: 2320
Joined: Fri Jul 09, 1999 12:15 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Feb 25, 2016 2:40 am

Quoting StuckinCMHland (Reply 46):
aren't those C gates your are talking about the old international gates?

C46 is the international gate. It is still used for international arrivals from CUN and PUJ.

Quoting NoTime (Reply 45):
6% growth for the year would put CMH at ~7.2 mil... that's certainly going in the right direction.

It sounds plausible, especially with the introduction of F9.

UA might see a decline since they don't seem to be bringing in the larger metal they brought during this time last year. Though there's still a lot left in the year for that to change.

AA is pretty stagnant as well. I really wish they would add back mainline to CLT or upgauge MIA to E75, but no signs are pointing to that happening anytime soon.

DL might see a modest uptick with slightly larger aircraft to MSP.

AC will likely see a pretty decent bump in traffic with upgauges to DH3s and then all-CR2s in June.

WN continues to be the market share leader, though they might level off this year with no new service. The hope is for the introduction of HOU and MCI service, though.

Vacation Express is slated to return with FPO, CUN, and PUJ service. Hopefully the rumored Jamaica service comes to fruition.
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5195
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Mon Feb 29, 2016 5:13 am

A statistical look at how connections play a factor in WN's ops at CMH (among others):

WN % Locals By Route At Top Connecting Airports (by knope2001 Feb 25 2016 in Civil Aviation)
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
flyguy89
Posts: 3042
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 6:43 pm

RE: The Rest Of Ohio, Part 4

Thu Mar 03, 2016 5:12 am

Pax traffic at CVG was up 9.35% in January. Here's to, hopefully, another record year! CMH is up 6.8%, DAY and CAK haven't posted theirs yet, but I couldn't find CLE or TOL numbers.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos