First Delta A321 Delivery?

FlyASAGuy2005 · Sat Jan 23, 2016 1:13 am

Here's the old threadhttps://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/6554299/ which is now archived. I would like to continue the conversation.

-Has a semi-firm delivery date been set?
-How many frames per month?
-How many total frames?

e38 · Sat Jan 23, 2016 1:59 am

Andrew:

- yes, beginning late February 2016.
- not linear; 15 each in 2016, 2017, 2018.
- 45

e38

questions · Sat Jan 23, 2016 3:32 am

1. Has the stamp been released?
2. On which routes will the A321s be deployed?

BDL757 · Sat Jan 23, 2016 4:42 am

Quoting questions (Reply 2):

The first route is supposed to be ATL-MCO. The A321s are going to be used on NYC/ATL-Florida routes.

flyboy80 · Sat Jan 23, 2016 8:08 am

I can't wait to see the new A350 style interior. I know Delta is supposedly the launch customer for this interior; this surprises me because I would think this interior would also be on the A320 NEOs being delivered to both LH and Qatar.

bluefltspecial · Sat Jan 23, 2016 5:56 pm

anyone know the config of F/Y?

FlyASAGuy2005 · Sat Jan 23, 2016 6:10 pm

Quoting bluefltspecial (Reply 5):

Last I read was 20/169?

e38 · Sat Jan 23, 2016 7:50 pm

configuration will be:

First/Business: 20
Comfort + : 29
Economy: 143

total 192.

e38

audidudi · Sat Jan 23, 2016 8:01 pm

Quoting flyboy80 (Reply 4):

Are you saying that these non-NEO A321s are going to have the new A350 style interior? I'm surprised that it wouldn't be introduced on the NEOs instead!

DTWPurserBoy · Sat Jan 23, 2016 8:08 pm

I am waiting anxiously for someone to post the first photo of the new A321 in DL colors. If the first is to arrive in late February, it should be just about done in final assembly and undergoing engine installation and test flights. I am sure one of our intrepid French a.netters will provide a great picture shortly.

SXDFC · Sat Jan 23, 2016 8:42 pm

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 9):

There is a picture of it around somewhere with the tail and sharklets painted, no engines though.. That was a few weeks ago, I'd hope its painted and assembled by now.. I am also looking forward to seeing the new bins too..

skymiler · Sat Jan 23, 2016 8:51 pm

Any chance of an L2 door for boarding, as used on the 757? Or will it be a jam and cram process, as has been noted on the 737-900ER equipment (horrible experience).

larshjort · Sat Jan 23, 2016 8:59 pm

Quoting audidudi (Reply 8):

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 9):
am waiting anxiously for someone to post the first photo of the new A321 in DL colors. If the first is to arrive in late February, it should be just about done in final assembly and undergoing engine installation and test flights. I am sure one of our intrepid French a.netters will provide a great picture shortly.

I think you are going to wait a long time to get a picture from a french spotter, unless he goes to XFW or BFM

. Airbus Toulouse only produces A320s, not 319 and 321s.

Here is a picture taken December 3rd at XFW.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/xfwspotter/22868042554

/Lars

747d10 · Sat Jan 23, 2016 9:27 pm

Quoting larshjort (Reply 12):

Here is a picture taken December 3rd at XFW.

It's interesting to see the German flag on the tail.

DTWPurserBoy · Sat Jan 23, 2016 10:25 pm

Quoting larshjort (Reply 12):
I think you are going to wait a long time to get a picture from a french spotter, unless he goes to XFW or BFM . Airbus Toulouse only produces A320s, not 319 and 321s.

Oooops--my bad. I know that but I guess I am revealing my secret desire to tour the Airbus facilities in Toulouse. I hear they give a great tour but it must be booked in advance.

Enjoyed seeing the picture, though. Now for the finished product!

Quoting skymiler (Reply 11):
Any chance of an L2 door for boarding, as used on the 757? Or will it be a jam and cram process, as has been noted on the 737-900ER equipment (horrible experience).

I could not agree more. It was always so easy to board the 757 through 2L--I hope DL will do the same with the A321.

Transpac787 · Sun Jan 24, 2016 1:38 am

I brought it up in the fleet refurbishment thread, but does anyone know which A321 ships will be Mobile-built?? At least those planned as yet??

Quoting skymiler (Reply 11):
Any chance of an L2 door for boarding

No. Given the configuration of the plane, seating around doors 2LR will be almost as if they're window exits - pretty tight in my estimation. I'd imagine boarding will be done only through 1L.

FlyASAGuy2005 · Sun Jan 24, 2016 3:19 am

Quoting Transpac787 (Reply 15):

That's the case with the 75Xs. The seats are right there by L2. I'd suspect there would be other reasons as to not use L2 like proximity to the #1 which is the main reason for most carriers.

DL_Mech · Sun Jan 24, 2016 3:33 am

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 16):
That's the case with the 75Xs. The seats are right there by L2.

Actually, there are no seats in front of L2 but there are two seats in front of R2. The LOPA of the A321 on the Deltanet shows seats in front of L2 and R2.

Quoting skymiler (Reply 11):
Any chance of an L2 door for boarding, as used on the 757?

I don't think that is possible with the configuration that DL chose.

lightsaber · Sun Jan 24, 2016 3:33 am

Quoting larshjort (Reply 12):
Airbus Toulouse only produces A320s, not 319 and 321s.

If the A321 does as well as I believe, Toulouse will have to adapt to the longer model.

Lightsaber

atlflyer · Sun Jan 24, 2016 2:50 pm

Quoting flyboy80 (Reply 4):

I think the new Airbus pivot bins are an option on the A320s just as they are on the A380. So possibly LH or QR might just continue using the current style.

mjoelnir · Sun Jan 24, 2016 3:19 pm

Quoting audidudi (Reply 8):
Are you saying that these non-NEO A321s are going to have the new A350 style interior? I'm surprised that it wouldn't be introduced on the NEOs instead!

That seems to be the Airbus style of evolution. The jump from A321ceo to neo are the engines, the other stuff is available for both when it gets available.

mjoelnir · Sun Jan 24, 2016 3:38 pm

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 18):
If the A321 does as well as I believe, Toulouse will have to adapt to the longer model.

AFAIK there are size constrains in the A320 FAL in TLS excluding the A321.
Anyway with XFW and BFM, the capacity for A321 should reach 28 per month this year and that is more than half of the 46 frames capacity for all lines reached after BFM is up to speed end of this year.

FlyASAGuy2005 · Sun Jan 24, 2016 6:10 pm

Quoting DL_Mech (Reply 17):
Actually, there are no seats in front of L2 but there are two seats in front of R2. The LOPA of the A321 on the Deltanet shows seats in front of L2 and R2.

Okay I see what you're saying. I thought the OP was saying because there are seats near the L2 they wouldn't use it for boarding. Row 20ABC on the 75X is in fact very close but there is some space. Are you saying they are pretty much directly in front the door on the A321 like row 19DE on the 75X? There is now seat 19F because it would basically be blocking the door completely.

flyboy80 · Sun Jan 24, 2016 6:13 pm

Obviously the Airbus floor plan doesn't tapper as much in certain areas, as does the 737s, but this airplane with 192 seats including 20F, is going to be quite tight I imagine.

FlyASAGuy2005 · Sun Jan 24, 2016 6:23 pm

Quoting flyboy80 (Reply 23):
Obviously the Airbus floor plan doesn't tapper as much in certain areas, as does the 737s, but this airplane with 192 seats including 20F, is going to be quite tight I imagine.

I thought so too but actually, not really. Those big exit doors makes a difference. US Airway's config. is 187 pax and I always find their Y to be quite comfy/roomy.

cschleic · Sun Jan 24, 2016 6:29 pm

Quoting DL_Mech (Reply 17):
Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 16):
That's the case with the 75Xs. The seats are right there by L2.

Actually, there are no seats in front of L2 but there are two seats in front of R2. The LOPA of the A321 on the Deltanet shows seats in front of L2 and R2.

AA has seats more or less in front of L2 on the 757, but they use it for boarding anyway. I believe they use L2 for boarding for their 321 transcon planes, but that was a requirement they had for their customer base on those planes.

For the DL 321, here's a link to a French article, with what's clearly a photoshop image. Aside from the L2 being an R2, and the baggage compartment doors on the wrong side (looks like a reversed image), it's probably a good representation.

http://www.aeroweb-fr.net/actualites...6/delta-commande-15-airbus-a321ceo

BDL757 · Sun Jan 24, 2016 8:30 pm

Quoting flyboy80 (Reply 23):
but this airplane with 192 seats including 20F, is going to be quite tight I imagine.

I believe the plan is for the A321 to hold 189 pax due to the removal of three seats from the back of main cabin to enlarge (somewhat) the galley space.

MIflyer12 · Sun Jan 24, 2016 8:40 pm

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 24):
Quoting flyboy80 (Reply 23):
Obviously the Airbus floor plan doesn't tapper as much in certain areas, as does the 737s, but this airplane with 192 seats including 20F, is going to be quite tight I imagine.

I thought so too but actually, not really. Those big exit doors makes a difference. US Airway's config. is 187 pax and I always find their Y to be quite comfy/roomy.

The US Airways origin A321s have 16F, not 20F, and don't have Comfort+ at the front of the cabin. 'Regular coach' passengers on DL will have a squeeze.

lightsaber · Sun Jan 24, 2016 11:28 pm

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 21):
Anyway with XFW and BFM, the capacity for A321 should reach 28 per month this year and that is more than half of the 46 frames capacity for all lines reached after BFM is up to speed end of this year.

Well if production goes to the rumored 63/month and the A321 breaks half the demand (I believe it will approach 60 percent), then Airbus will need to look.

I am curious if Toulouse could make A321s. If not, what is needed...

Lightsaber

DL_Mech · Sun Jan 24, 2016 11:38 pm

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 22):
Are you saying they are pretty much directly in front the door on the A321 like row 19DE on the 75X?

That is what the LOPA showed that was on the TechOps DeltaNet. Someone else pointed out that the L2 door is shorter than the L1 door anyway, so I don't think it will be used for boarding.

intotheair · Sun Jan 24, 2016 11:55 pm

Quoting cschleic (Reply 25):
For the DL 321, here's a link to a French article, with what's clearly a photoshop image. Aside from the L2 being an R2, and the baggage compartment doors on the wrong side (looks like a reversed image), it's probably a good representation.

http://www.aeroweb-fr.net/actualites...6/delta-commande-15-airbus-a321ceo

It's also missing the navy paint on the belly.

mjoelnir · Mon Jan 25, 2016 12:16 am

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 28):
Well if production goes to the rumored 63/month and the A321 breaks half the demand (I believe it will approach 60 percent), then Airbus will need to look.

XFW is supposed to get the next new FAL. That would bring XFW to 32 frames a month, with BFM at four or upped to 8, that would make 36 to 40 frames possible capacity for A321.

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 28):
I am curious if Toulouse could make A321s. If not, what is needed..

AFAIK the FAL in TLS is size constrained and can not do the A321.

smi0006 · Mon Jan 25, 2016 3:39 am

Quoting flyboy80 (Reply 4):

I can't wait to see the new A350 style interior. I know Delta is supposedly the launch customer for this interior

What are the expected differences? New lighting? Lockers and ceiling panels?

b727fa · Mon Jan 25, 2016 3:46 am

The 2L door will not be used for boarding or deplaning.

Alitalia744 · Mon Jan 25, 2016 4:00 am

Anyone have the LOPA or seat map that can be posted?

LAX772LR · Mon Jan 25, 2016 4:44 am

Which engines did they select?

Vctony · Mon Jan 25, 2016 4:56 am

Quoting LAX772LR (Reply 35):
Which engines did they select?

CFM56.

r2rho · Mon Jan 25, 2016 2:20 pm

Quoting flyboy80 (Reply 4):
I know Delta is supposedly the launch customer for this interior

Yes, DL is getting the pivoting bins as well as the SpaceFlex v2 rear galley.

Quoting audidudi (Reply 8):
these non-NEO A321s are going to have the new A350 style interior? I'm surprised that it wouldn't be introduced on the NEOs instead!

Airbus wanted to keep NEO introduction separated from any other upgrades - just engines and no more. I'm sure the NEO's will be getting it soon enough.

Quoting mjoelnir (Reply 31):
XFW is supposed to get the next new FAL. That would bring XFW to 32 frames a month, with BFM at four or upped to 8, that would make 36 to 40 frames possible capacity for A321.

I think there is ample A321 capacity for the time being, as theoretically XFW and BFM could switch to all-A321 (and the occasional A319CJ) if really needed, with TLS pumping out only A320's as today.
What about TSN? It is modeled after XFW so should be able to make all 3 models?

FSDan · Mon Jan 25, 2016 3:27 pm

If they are really going to be in by late February, it's interesting that there aren't any showing up in the schedules yet. I just looked as far out as April and didn't see any between ATL-MCO or ATL-TPA.

Jetmarc · Mon Jan 25, 2016 4:23 pm

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 34):
Anyone have the LOPA or seat map that can be posted?

I wanted to ask the same! If they are using space-flex galley, no mid cabin lavs at all? Maybe one fwd of 2L/R? Are they going to mirror the 739ER layout as much as possible?

FlyASAGuy2005 · Mon Jan 25, 2016 5:41 pm

Quoting FSDan (Reply 38):

I don't think you will see them until the very last minute for the forseeable future. With such a small fleet to start, I will bet the SKDs will all default to A320 or A319 until 3 days out. Fleet planning dont assign ship numbers more than 72 hours in advance so don't plan on seeing them posted on a SKD far out for quite a while.

DTWPurserBoy · Mon Jan 25, 2016 7:28 pm

The aircraft will need a few days in Tech Ops in ATL for the mechanics to familiarize themselves and their procedures and to install some company specific items like emergency medical kits, first aid kits, AED's (defibrillators), various placards, fire extinguishers, O2 bottles, inflight magazines and emergency cards. After that it will most likely be slipped in as an equipment substitution on an ATL-MCO or ATL-MSP flight. They won't want it too far from maintenance in case there are some teething issues.

I would look for them to start appearing in the schedules in May-June.

[Edited 2016-01-25 11:31:40]

e38 · Tue Jan 26, 2016 1:32 am

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 44), "The aircraft will need a few day in Tech Ops in ATL for the mechanics to familiarize themselves and their procedures and to install some company specific items . . ."

This is going to occur at MSP.

e38

[Edited 2016-01-25 17:37:29]

LTU932 · Tue Jan 26, 2016 8:29 am

Quoting 747d10 (Reply 13):
It's interesting to see the German flag on the tail.

That's because of the test registration. Every aircraft registered in Germany, including test registrations, must bear the German flag as well. Once the aircraft receives its final registration, the flag will be removed.

FlyASAGuy2005 · Tue Jan 26, 2016 7:13 pm

What power plant did DL select for their 321s?

audidudi · Tue Jan 26, 2016 7:27 pm

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 44):

See replies 35/36 above!

sspontak · Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:53 am

Quoting BDL757 (Reply 3):

The A321 will be a welcome add to NYC. Nice.

e38 · Wed Jan 27, 2016 3:32 am

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 44), "What power plant did DL select for their 321s?"

and reply by Vctony (Reply 36), "CFM56."

more specifically, CFM56-5B-3 rated at 32,000 lbs of thrust.

e38

jb1087xna · Wed Jan 27, 2016 11:36 pm

Quoting jetmarc (Reply 39):
I wanted to ask the same! If they are using space-flex galley, no mid cabin lavs at all? Maybe one fwd of 2L/R? Are they going to mirror the 739ER layout as much as possible?

Someone posted in a previous thread that DL's layout will be similar to AA's as far as having a mid-cabin lav a little more than half of the way back on one side in Y.

dank · Thu Jan 28, 2016 12:37 am

Quoting cschleic (Reply 25):
AA has seats more or less in front of L2 on the 757, but they use it for boarding anyway. I believe they use L2 for boarding for their 321 transcon planes, but that was a requirement they had for their customer base on those planes.

I've flown a number of legs on the 321T and never boarded or deplaned from L2.

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